I say that Vermiel should "unleash" Dante on KR / PR.

[Kylo Ren]

Dante has had his best KRs and PRs late in the game. I've heard Dante talk about this on his radio show. As any coach would, Vermiel has given Dante strict guidelines that he must follow when he fields punts and kicks. He's not supposed to field a punt inside the 10 yd line and he's not supposed to return a kick from the endzone and etc. However, late in the game when the Chiefs are behind and need a score, Vermiel removes these rules from Dante and lets him freelance. That's where Dante can use his skills more and can be more aggressive. Right now, it seems like more than 1/2 of the punts and kickoffs are unreturnable for Dante. The opposition is not kicking / punting to him. He's getting less and less opportunities to make a contribution. I think he should start returning more kicks and punts that aren't traditionally returned. This will give him more opportunities for a good return. He's shown that he does his best work when he is allowed to freelance. Opponents have nuetralized Dante. That is a big blow to our offensive production. Vermiel needs to pull out all of the stops. We are 1-3. It's a similar situation as being down late in a game. Our backs are against the wall. We need to take more risks. This is high risk but it's also a high reward situation. What do you think? :hmmm:

[teedubya]

yep. totally. Last year, he ran some unorthodox kicks back for TD's.

Very astute, young skywalker.

[donkhater]

Nope. If people are bearing down on him or if he is backtracking into the endzone, I'd rather he not risk it. He'll get his chances. Not every team is going to kick every kick into the endzone, escpecially as it gets cooler.

[Mr. Laz]

and how do you know about this supposed rules?



you attending meetings??? cause i have never heard anything about Dante Hall being on any kind of leash.



more like Dante is a little tired from playing receiver so much


also our special teams have been less than speciall all year long


terrible coverage, penalties,baker's punts,bad tackling



ganzs jr. needs to get his @ss kicked and bring on some motivation

[jspchief]

and how do you know about this supposed rules?


I've heard Dante talk about this on his radio show


It's still hearsay, but it sounds like he isn't just pulling it out of his ass.

[ChiefJustice]

and how do you know about this supposed rules?



you attending meetings??? cause i have never heard anything about Dante Hall being on any kind of leash.



more like Dante is a little tired from playing receiver so much


also our special teams have been less than speciall all year long


terrible coverage, penalties,baker's punts,bad tackling



ganzs jr. needs to get his @ss kicked and bring on some motivation


yep.

[jcroft]

I dunno. I think you can let Dante go a bit more than most KR/PR, but I still don't want to see him catching a punt inside the 10 or running kicks out of the back of the endzone. There's a fine line...

[Kylo Ren]

and how do you know about this supposed rules?



you attending meetings??? cause i have never heard anything about Dante Hall being on any kind of leash.



more like Dante is a little tired from playing receiver so much


also our special teams have been less than speciall all year long


terrible coverage, penalties,baker's punts,bad tackling



ganzs jr. needs to get his @ss kicked and bring on some motivation

How do I know that there are rules from Vermiel? You didn't read my post did you? I said that I heard Dante himself talking about this on the radio. Vermiel has rules that Dante is to follow as any team would have. But when things get desperate Vermiel tells Dante to forget about the rules and do whatever he thinks he can do. That's from Dante's own mouth. And yes, he attended the meetings. That's how I know.

[ChiefJustice]

If ever we needed razzle-dazzle anywhere it's on returns.

Remember that toss to Boe last year in the opener?
Put LJ back there with Dante to keep the opposition guessing.

[jcroft]

If ever we needed razzle-dazzle anywhere it's on returns.

Remember that toss to Boe last year in the opener?
Put LJ back there with Dante to keep the opposition guessing.

That was a reverse, not a toss, and it wasn't in the opener, was it? It was after Dante became such a feared returner, so we used him as a decoy.

Unless we're not talking about the same play?

[ChiefJustice]

That was a reverse, not a toss, and it wasn't in the opener, was it? It was after Dante became such a feared returner, so we used him as a decoy.

Unless we're not talking about the same play?

It may have been a reverse...i am pretty sure it was on our first return of the season though.

[Kylo Ren]

If ever we needed razzle-dazzle anywhere it's on returns.

Remember that toss to Boe last year in the opener?
Put LJ back there with Dante to keep the opposition guessing. I was thinking the same thing. We need a reverse or a toss back or something.

[thurman murman]

It may have been a reverse...i am pretty sure it was on our first return of the season though.

It was against Denver in KC last year. First kick of that game though.

[Kylo Ren]

I dunno. I think you can let Dante go a bit more than most KR/PR, but I still don't want to see him catching a punt inside the 10 or running kicks out of the back of the endzone. There's a fine line...

I agree. I think the rules should be modified rather than abandoned. Dante should return punts inside the 5 yd line instead of the 10 yd line. He should return kicks if they are only 3 yards deep in the endzone. Any kick deeper than 3 yds should not be returned. Right now any kick that is even 1 yd in the endzone is a kneel down. We should give Dante a little more decision making ability and let him freelance more. He can give us a spark that we need.

[Rain Man]

First off, I can't imagine that Dante is too worn down from being a receiver to run back kicks. That's just ludicrous. Warfield and Morton and other guys are running the field all day. There's no reason that Dante can't.

Second, it seems like there should be a statistical rationale for running it out or not. Simplistically, one could just say that if Dante averages five yards more per return, he can return a ball five yards further back (at least on kickoffs). I imagine it's a lot more complicated than that, but still, a decision tree can be calculated without a lot of trouble.

[ChiefJustice]

It was against Denver in KC last year. First kick of that game though.

Thank you for clearing that up.I had forgotten when it took place.

[Kylo Ren]

First off, I can't imagine that Dante is too worn down from being a receiver to run back kicks. That's just ludicrous. Warfield and Morton and other guys are running the field all day. There's no reason that Dante can't.

Second, it seems like there should be a statistical rationale for running it out or not. Simplistically, one could just say that if Dante averages five yards more per return, he can return a ball five yards further back (at least on kickoffs). I imagine it's a lot more complicated than that, but still, a decision tree can be calculated without a lot of trouble. I concur. :clap:

[morphius]

How do I know that there are rules from Vermiel? You didn't read my post did you? I said that I heard Dante himself talking about this on the radio. Vermiel has rules that Dante is to follow as any team would have. But when things get desperate Vermiel tells Dante to forget about the rules and do whatever he thinks he can do. That's from Dante's own mouth. And yes, he attended the meetings. That's how I know.
I heard him talking about it after the Denver game I think. Just so they know you were not hearing things, LOL!

I'm not to worried about Dante yet, he has had some great returns, sure he hasn't taken one to the house yet, but he has got near mid field a few times.

[go bo]

I heard him talking about it after the Denver game I think. Just so they know you were not hearing things, LOL!

I'm not to worried about Dante yet, he has had some great returns, sure he hasn't taken one to the house yet, but he has got near mid field a few times.mid field is a good return...

we've just been spoiled by his string of td's last year...

[morphius]

mid field is a good return...

we've just been spoiled by his string of td's last year...
And if people remember, it was on his returns to mid field last year that we never did anything, but when he was stuck near the 20, long, quick drive for a TD. Never did understand that.

[Kylo Ren]

I heard him talking about it after the Denver game I think. Just so they know you were not hearing things, LOL!

I'm not to worried about Dante yet, he has had some great returns, sure he hasn't taken one to the house yet, but he has got near mid field a few times. Thanks for confirming what I heard on the radio. However, I do disagree with one thing. I think Dante's average returns are down, way down. I'll have to go look up some stats. I could be wrong.

[tk13]

I don't think our coverage teams are doing as well. Dante's a smart fellow... I think he sees whether or not he's not going to be able to do something with a punt based on how he sees his blocking setting up. At least it seemed to me the other night that there was always much more purple than white closing in on the ball... he might have gotten wiped out a couple times had he tried to make a return. I think he should be able to make that judgement. I don't want him trying to return more punts if it's just going to lead to somebody flying down the field and destroying him because Dante's trying to do too much...

[mcan]

I don't think we should be setting up returns at ALL against good punters from midfield... We need to get heat on the punters in those situations. Otherwise, the good punter just hits it as high as he can and it's either a fair catch, touchback, or a great "pin us down there inside the 10" play for them... That said, I think Dante should return everything that is on the goalline or one to two yards deep on kickoffs. Typically, those kicks in the endzone didn't have a lot of hangtime, and the reason most people get caught inside the 20 is because they hesitated to think about coming out of the end zone. Just get the ball and fly into your wedge.

Dante is good for 25 yards/return... Easy. That means that if he's partly back, he needs to sprint out of there.

[Kylo Ren]

It may be hard for him to return more punts, but I agree that he should return more kickoffs from the endzone. I know he can get to the 20 at least.

[Bowser]

It's hard to unleash him on punts when the punters are either skying them up for a fair catch and a net gain of 34 yards, or just kicking them out of bounds. And on kickoffs, he's just not getting any blocking at all. THAT's where we really miss Boerigter - he is a stud special teamer. Beisel, as well.

[Kylo Ren]

It's hard to unleash him on punts when the punters are either skying them up for a fair catch and a net gain of 34 yards, or just kicking them out of bounds. And on kickoffs, he's just not getting any blocking at all. THAT's where we really miss Boerigter - he is a stud special teamer. Beisel, as well. I can agree with that.

[T-post Tom]

Those "rules" are pretty much standard fare throughout the NFL. I think several posters addressed the real issues aptly: poor blocking (Bo is sorely missed.), lack of pressure on the punter, and lack of creativity in the runback schemes. Just to mix things up, I'd love to see a reverse to Blaylock or one of the other speed merchants. It would surely throw the first victims off balance, while giving upcoming opponents something else to think about and gameplan for.

DV and Al Saunders need to start having some input on S/T's, since the S/Ts coache(s) obviously aren't getting it done. JMHO

[Fairplay]

How do I know that there are rules from Vermiel? You didn't read my post did you? I said that I heard Dante himself talking about this on the radio. Vermiel has rules that Dante is to follow as any team would have. But when things get desperate Vermiel tells Dante to forget about the rules and do whatever he thinks he can do. That's from Dante's own mouth. And yes, he attended the meetings. That's how I know.




Don't fuk with this guy. He will pwned you with facts and all. Its just not worth it. You can worship him in suppose,

[Kylo Ren]

Don't fuk with this guy. He will pwned you with facts and all. Its just not worth it. You can worship him in suppose, :p