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SNR
10-11-2004, 10:22 PM
You must decide between two fates. In both cases you are a passionate artist whose life is his work. Therefore, the trick to understanding the character is to symbolize your passion as the artist's work or art.

In the fate, you finish making your masterpiece. A mysterious man gives you $5000 and burns the art in front of your face.

In the other fate, you finish making your masterpiece. As you go find someone to sell it to, a mysterious man steals your work of art. The man shows it to art critics. It appreciates. The masterpiece is sold for millions. People are amazed at the sheer genius of the creator. Sadly, no one knows it is you.

Which fate would you choose?

Count Zarth
10-11-2004, 10:23 PM
The first one. In both situations you are left without your artwork. Better to be up five grand.

Ultra Peanut
10-11-2004, 10:26 PM
GIVA ME DA MOHNEY!!!!!

Frazod
10-11-2004, 10:30 PM
Money. Anything that would be construed as good modern art should be burned anyway.

Raiderhader
10-11-2004, 10:32 PM
There is no choice here, you go with the first option.

In the second one you have insult added to injury by way of your work not only being stolen and sold for millions (which you don't get a dime of) AND, no one knows that you are responsible for this much admired and adored masterpiece. Not being an artist I cannot say for sure, but the lack of recognition might actually be more horrible than not getting paid for it....

Jenson71
10-11-2004, 10:32 PM
The 2nd, of course.

Raiderhader
10-11-2004, 10:33 PM
Money. Anything that would be construed as good modern art should be burned anyway.



The man has a stellar point.

Jenson71
10-11-2004, 10:34 PM
You people just aren't thinking. It's your masterpiece.

Rausch
10-11-2004, 10:34 PM
I'd take the money. The hardest part of being an artist is having enough money to keep the electricity on...

PastorMikH
10-11-2004, 10:34 PM
First off, how many artist are there that don't sign their work? And how many artists nowdays don't take a couple of snap-shots of their work?


The second option couldn't be an issue because I would have signed it in the lower-righthand corner in the same styling as my other paintings - and I would have a pic of me standing next to it.


I'll take the money though and use it to buy canvas, paints, and brushes then start over.

Count Zarth
10-11-2004, 10:35 PM
The man has a stellar point.

I like how if you read this thread without user names, avatars, sigs, titles or post counts, you could easily pick our frazod's post. ROFL

Frazod
10-11-2004, 10:35 PM
You people just aren't thinking. It's your masterpiece.

Take the money and paint another one.

Jenson71
10-11-2004, 10:38 PM
I'd take the money. The hardest part of being an artist is having enough money to keep the electricity on...

Why would you even be an artist if your paintings weren't that important to you? You wouldn't.

stevieray
10-11-2004, 10:47 PM
Second Option.

Earthling
10-11-2004, 10:49 PM
Have to go with the 2nd option...Knowing that you could/did create a masterpiece would be the biggest reward...Anyone can get money, not just anyone can create a work of art....

Count Zarth
10-11-2004, 10:51 PM
not just anyone can create a work of art....

I don't know. I'm fairly sure I can take a dump on some canvas and call it art. Wasn't there some guy that sealed a cross in a jar of urine and called it art and got famous?

Phobia
10-11-2004, 10:54 PM
The point of this exercise is to seperate the artists from the wannabes.

Artists answer #2 - wannabes = 1

Ultra Peanut
10-11-2004, 10:55 PM
Money. Anything that would be construed as good modern art should be burned anyway.ROFL

Which brings me to my next point:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/tv_and_radio/3701484.stm

|Zach|
10-11-2004, 10:55 PM
Sorry, we have had a run on cake lately you will have to choose death.

Count Zarth
10-11-2004, 10:57 PM
ROFL

Which brings me to my next point:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/tv_and_radio/3701484.stm

What a load of horseshit.

wazu
10-11-2004, 10:57 PM
Gotta take the low road -- 1st option. I hate injustice.

Ultra Peanut
10-11-2004, 10:57 PM
But I don't want death.

SNR
10-11-2004, 11:06 PM
I don't know. I'm fairly sure I can take a dump on some canvas and call it art. Wasn't there some guy that sealed a cross in a jar of urine and called it art and got famous?Take your passion in life. Take something you do that grabs you by the balls and messes with your mind. Now imagine that something is a painting you just made.

Now try the exercise.

Ultra Peanut
10-11-2004, 11:08 PM
Take your passion in life. Take something you do that grabs you by the balls and messes with your mind. Now imagine that something is a painting you just made.

Now try the exercise.But I can't paint.

Count Zarth
10-11-2004, 11:08 PM
Take your passion in life. Take something you do that grabs you by the balls and messes with your mind. Now imagine that something is a painting you just made.

Now try the exercise.

That doesn't really work in my case. I don't create anything that I give a shit about.

Count Zarth
10-11-2004, 11:09 PM
But I can't paint.

ROFL

Frazod
10-11-2004, 11:10 PM
I can remember seeing A BLANK CANVAS hanging in an art museum. Seriously. A BLANK, RECTANGULAR CANVAS. I shit you not.

:shake:

Apparently it was the artist's interpretation of the nothingness of the universe. But you can see all kinds of nothingness just like it at any art supply shop.

el borracho
10-11-2004, 11:11 PM
Option #2. In the first option my "masterpiece" is valued at only $5,000. In the second option my work is valued in the millions. In either option I am parting with the piece but in option #2 my piece is intact and appreciated. This isn't a hard decision.

Earthling
10-11-2004, 11:14 PM
I don't know. I'm fairly sure I can take a dump on some canvas and call it art. Wasn't there some guy that sealed a cross in a jar of urine and called it art and got famous?
Yes...I believe that he was famous for less than 15 minutes...Sensationalized but not regarded as a great artist by anyone that I know...What was his name again?? (I rest my case)

Count Zarth
10-11-2004, 11:15 PM
I can remember seeing A BLANK CANVAS hanging in an art museum. Seriously. A BLANK, RECTANGULAR CANVAS. I shit you not.

:shake:

Apparently it was the artist's interpretation of the nothingness of the universe. But you can see all kinds of nothingness just like it at any art supply shop.

My sister is an artist. She actually has talent. She sculpts shit. She doesn't make crap from selling her art, so she's going to be a teacher. But it saddens me when no-talent hacks like you described are making money off stupid shit like the above.

Wasn't there some guy who smeared poop on a painting of jesus or something and got famous? :shake:

el borracho
10-11-2004, 11:15 PM
Yes...I believe that he was famous for less than 15 minutes...Sensationalized but not regarded as a great artist by anyone that I know...What was his name again?? (I rest my case)
Andres Serrano

Earthling
10-11-2004, 11:16 PM
I can remember seeing A BLANK CANVAS hanging in an art museum. Seriously. A BLANK, RECTANGULAR CANVAS. I shit you not.

:shake:

Apparently it was the artist's interpretation of the nothingness of the universe. But you can see all kinds of nothingness just like it at any art supply shop.
I could'a done that..

Count Zarth
10-11-2004, 11:16 PM
Yes...I believe that he was famous for less than 15 minutes...Sensationalized but not regarded as a great artist by anyone that I know...What was his name again?? (I rest my case)

I bet he made some cash though.

el borracho
10-11-2004, 11:18 PM
Apparently it was the artist's interpretation of the nothingness of the universe. But you can see all kinds of nothingness just like it at any art supply shop.
Maybe I should frame my savings account statement. Who knows what that treasure is worth?

Earthling
10-11-2004, 11:18 PM
Andres Serrano
I'm impressed... :clap: I would guess that you are in that field..Artist perhaps?

Earthling
10-11-2004, 11:21 PM
I bet he made some cash though.
I'd bet you are right...Whatever puts food on the table, huh?

el borracho
10-11-2004, 11:24 PM
I'm impressed... :clap: I would guess that you are in that field..Artist perhaps?
I somewhat cheated. I remembered the name of the piece ("piss christ") and googled the artist.

Phobia
10-11-2004, 11:27 PM
My sister is an artist. She actually has talent. She sculpts shit.

Yeah. From what I've heard about her (from you), she molds soft, limp flesh into statues of granite.

I'll bet she's talented.

SNR
10-11-2004, 11:29 PM
I can remember seeing A BLANK CANVAS hanging in an art museum. Seriously. A BLANK, RECTANGULAR CANVAS. I shit you not.

:shake:

Apparently it was the artist's interpretation of the nothingness of the universe. But you can see all kinds of nothingness just like it at any art supply shop.Perhaps the greatest man I've ever talked to is John Cage, the greatest developer of aleatoric music, which is music involving randomness and chance. He wrote a radio symphony once, which involves 12 radios tuned to different stations chosen by tossing a coin.

Anyway, he took aleatoric music a step farther. He wrote a piece called 4'33". The first performance was for solo piano, but it can be done with any instrument or ensemble. The performer(s) merely sit in silence for four minutes and 33 seconds.

His belief was that the integration of silence as an essential element is the only "new idea since Beethoven." Cage wrote an essay on it saying that silence can never be total... there's always somebody breathing, appliances running, people coughing, coats rustling, etc, during a performance. Also, silence was an important part of music before in deceptive cadences. Cage wanted to use that same energy to write his "music."

You know what's odd? He almost makes sense.

Count Zarth
10-11-2004, 11:29 PM
Yeah. From what I've heard about her (from you), she molds soft, limp flesh into statues of granite.

I'll bet she's talented.

You've completely lost me.

Oh.

No, I was talking about my OTHER sister. :D

Raiderhader
10-11-2004, 11:29 PM
My sister is an artist. She actually has talent. She sculpts shit. She doesn't make crap from selling her art, so she's going to be a teacher. But it saddens me when no-talent hacks like you described are making money off stupid shit like the above.

Wasn't there some guy who smeared poop on a painting of jesus or something and got famous? :shake:


Elephant crap flung on a picture of the Virgin Mary. If memory serves me correctly, Rudy had, or tried to have, the musuem's funding pulled for that.

Raiderhader
10-11-2004, 11:32 PM
Perhaps the greatest man I've ever talked to is John Cage, the greatest developer of aleatoric music, which is music involving randomness and chance. He wrote a radio symphony once, which involves 12 radios tuned to different stations chosen by tossing a coin.

Anyway, he took aleatoric music a step farther. He wrote a piece called 4'33". The first performance was for solo piano, but it can be done with any instrument or ensemble. The performer(s) merely sit in silence for four minutes and 33 seconds.

His belief was that the integration of silence as an essential element is the only "new idea since Beethoven." Cage wrote an essay on it saying that silence can never be total... there's always somebody breathing, appliances running, people coughing, coats rustling, etc, during a performance. Also, silence was an important part of music before in deceptive cadences. Cage wanted to use that same energy to write his "music."

You know what's odd? He almost makes sense.


If you say so....

Frazod
10-11-2004, 11:32 PM
I also like the guy who dissects human corpses and then clearcoats the chunks in various poses. If DaVinci were alive, he'd be quaking in his boots over that visionary genious.... :shake:

Frazod
10-11-2004, 11:34 PM
Perhaps the greatest man I've ever talked to is John Cage, the greatest developer of aleatoric music, which is music involving randomness and chance. He wrote a radio symphony once, which involves 12 radios tuned to different stations chosen by tossing a coin.

Anyway, he took aleatoric music a step farther. He wrote a piece called 4'33". The first performance was for solo piano, but it can be done with any instrument or ensemble. The performer(s) merely sit in silence for four minutes and 33 seconds.

His belief was that the integration of silence as an essential element is the only "new idea since Beethoven." Cage wrote an essay on it saying that silence can never be total... there's always somebody breathing, appliances running, people coughing, coats rustling, etc, during a performance. Also, silence was an important part of music before in deceptive cadences. Cage wanted to use that same energy to write his "music."

You know what's odd? He almost makes sense.

Sounds better than rap.... ROFL

Raiderhader
10-11-2004, 11:36 PM
I also like the guy who dissects human corpses and then clearcoats the chunks in various poses. If DaVinci were alive, he'd be quaking in his boots over that visionary genious.... :shake:


I had not heard about that one. There are some real whackos out there, and they are allowed to roam free through society because they call themselves "artists". If not for that, we would have locked away in some nut house.


If I ever go crazy, I now know how to remain out side of the funny farm.

Raiderhader
10-11-2004, 11:37 PM
Sounds better than rap.... ROFL



ROFL Yet another stellar point.

SNR
10-11-2004, 11:38 PM
If you say so....It does... just like writing a mathematical proof and ending up with 2+2 not equaling 4.

Frazod
10-11-2004, 11:39 PM
I had not heard about that one. There are some real whackos out there, and they are allowed to roam free through society because they call themselves "artists". If not for that, we would have locked away in some nut house.


If I ever go crazy, I now know how to remain out side of the funny farm.

I saw a piece on this on TV not too long ago. The guy has a process for preserving the bodies, which end up looking like pale rubber. Operates out of China, IIRC, although I don't think he's Chinese.

It's really disturbing.

SNR
10-11-2004, 11:41 PM
Sounds better than rap.... ROFLI've seen both pieces "performed" and you are correct, they are MUCH better than rap.

No, seriously.

Raiderhader
10-11-2004, 11:44 PM
It does... just like writing a mathematical proof and ending up with 2+2 not equaling 4.


You have lost me, math has never been my forté. Two plus two not equaling four?

The whole silence thing is even more alien to me now.....

Raiderhader
10-11-2004, 11:45 PM
I saw a piece on this on TV not too long ago. The guy has a process for preserving the bodies, which end up looking like pale rubber. Operates out of China, IIRC, although I don't think he's Chinese.

It's really disturbing.



Let the Chinese have him, I don't want him running around my country. Sick f#ck.

Earthling
10-11-2004, 11:55 PM
Perhaps the greatest man I've ever talked to is John Cage, the greatest developer of aleatoric music, which is music involving randomness and chance. He wrote a radio symphony once, which involves 12 radios tuned to different stations chosen by tossing a coin.

You know what's odd? He almost makes sense.

Yeah, is he still alive? I remember listening to some of his stuff at least 30 years ago...or longer. While I found his music 'interesting' I never really cared for it. I had a professor who taught music composition and he considered a bridge crumpling down to be music. He would have gotten along well with Cage...

|Zach|
10-12-2004, 12:02 AM
Cool thread SNR.

|Zach|
10-12-2004, 12:02 AM
Cool thread SNR.
I wasn't being sarcastic...thought I should add that.

SNR
10-12-2004, 05:32 AM
Yeah, is he still alive? I remember listening to some of his stuff at least 30 years ago...or longer. While I found his music 'interesting' I never really cared for it. I had a professor who taught music composition and he considered a bridge crumpling down to be music. He would have gotten along well with Cage...He died in the early 90s... 91 I think.

Crush
10-12-2004, 06:31 AM
First one. I mean the "art" was just a circle anyways.

CosmicPal
10-12-2004, 07:00 AM
Perhaps the greatest man I've ever talked to is John Cage, the greatest developer of aleatoric music, which is music involving randomness and chance. He wrote a radio symphony once, which involves 12 radios tuned to different stations chosen by tossing a coin.

Anyway, he took aleatoric music a step farther. He wrote a piece called 4'33". The first performance was for solo piano, but it can be done with any instrument or ensemble. The performer(s) merely sit in silence for four minutes and 33 seconds.

His belief was that the integration of silence as an essential element is the only "new idea since Beethoven." Cage wrote an essay on it saying that silence can never be total... there's always somebody breathing, appliances running, people coughing, coats rustling, etc, during a performance. Also, silence was an important part of music before in deceptive cadences. Cage wanted to use that same energy to write his "music."

You know what's odd? He almost makes sense.

Wow....

You're referring to John Cage's CD: Three2, Twenty-Three, Six, Twenty-Six. :thumb:

Very nice.

I've always loved music, and for that reason alone- I've been a consmmate fan of improvisational music such as the Grateful Dead as well as free jazz.

I've read this quantitative analysis on the Dead's music once; and was quite surprised to discover the multi-layering of various music, tones, beats, and sounds deployed in their music. The band will permit the music to take it's own course, rise or fall to it's own level, and develop it's own non-traditional canvas. But, what I've learned is that one of the band members will stike the D chord during an improvisational jam-thus signaling the others to return to the original song. Having read this-I started listening, and it truly blows you away.

But, of course, if you don't "get it" it all sounds like a complete mess....

Earthling
10-12-2004, 07:02 AM
First one. I mean the "art" was just a circle anyways.
Yeah, utilitarian art..Making the hunters of the tribe more successful..

Skip Towne
10-12-2004, 08:38 AM
Yeah. From what I've heard about her (from you), she molds soft, limp flesh into statues of granite.

I'll bet she's talented.
Yeah, in various colors I hear.

The Pedestrian
10-12-2004, 02:32 PM
Neither, because in each fate, I'd end up on trial for the murder of the mysterious one.

JohnnyV13
10-12-2004, 03:06 PM
Oh this is easy,


MOST DEFINITELY NO. 2!!!!!!!!!!!

And, it doesn't require any sensitivity or agonizing or really any choice. All you need to do is apply simple logic.

You see...if the painting has become famous and worth millions in auction the thief now has a terrible dilemma. He has an international art reputation and an opportunity to make even more millions, but he doesn't have the talent to satisfy this suddenly hungry market.

You too have a problem. You have talent but no reputation. Simple economic analysis suggests there is a common solution to both your dilemmas.

You then offer to paint more works for this guy to sell as his own, if you get 50% of the profits.

And, you make it a limited contract. You force him to take you on as his "protege" so you now develop a reputation in the art world. At a certain point he "retires" and you are left to paint on your own, now firmly established in art circles.

SNR
10-12-2004, 05:05 PM
What is interesting is that there are people on both sides saying it is obvious that their choice is correct. I suppose it is a kind of decision we make that really defines us as one or the other.... no in between.

stevieray
10-12-2004, 05:12 PM
What is interesting is that there are people on both sides saying it is obvious that their choice is correct. I suppose it is a kind of decision we make that really defines us as one or the other.... no in between.

Art has no bounds or borders, whether spectator or participant. Good or bad Art is in a way like the board. A matter of "opinion".

KC Dan
10-12-2004, 05:14 PM
Art has no bounds or borders, whether spectator or participant. Good or bad Art is in a way like the board. A matter of "opinion".
I was patiently awaiting your response. But, my opinion happens to always be correct! Just ask me.

KcMizzou
10-12-2004, 05:25 PM
Art has no bounds or borders, whether spectator or participant. Good or bad Art is in a way like the board. A matter of "opinion". Does this apply to music?

:D

bogie
10-12-2004, 05:50 PM
#1. The fact that I sold the piece in the first place means that I am creating Art for others, not for myself. Therefore I got out of the artwork what I intended to get which was the money.

#2. I don't care that I missed out on the money or the fame. If it's my finest master piece, it makes me happy that I was able to create it. I'm sad that it was stolen because I did not create it for others, I created it for me.

Therefore I choose #1 because I got out of my Art what I intended.

David.
10-12-2004, 06:19 PM
Art has no bounds or borders, whether spectator or participant. Good or bad Art is in a way like the board. A matter of "opinion".

exactly, art isn't made to impress the masses. So whether or not people think something is "art" doesn't matter at all..

Count Zarth
10-12-2004, 06:21 PM
exactly, art isn't made to impress the masses. So whether or not people think something is "art" doesn't matter at all..

Then why is it on exhibition for everyone to see?

Ebolapox
10-12-2004, 06:48 PM
Take your passion in life. Take something you do that grabs you by the balls and messes with your mind. Now imagine that something is a painting you just made.

Now try the exercise.

he has no balls. he's gochiefs

-EB-

Raiderhader
10-12-2004, 06:53 PM
What is interesting is that there are people on both sides saying it is obvious that their choice is correct. I suppose it is a kind of decision we make that really defines us as one or the other.... no in between.


Naturally there are those who's answer differs from mine. And just as naturally they think that it is the right answer. However, logic speaks against their explinations.

My response of the first scenario is the correct one. :D

Count Zarth
10-12-2004, 06:54 PM
he has no balls. he's gochiefs

-EB-

I got balls....they are just sort of useless.

Ebolapox
10-12-2004, 07:08 PM
I got balls....they are just sort of useless.

no you don't--you can't--this link proves it

http://www.hallucinaut.com/yoda/

-EB-...:) (damn, first post shoulda been smilied up)

David.
10-12-2004, 07:19 PM
Then why is it on exhibition for everyone to see?

they have to eat.

Raiderhader
10-12-2004, 07:25 PM
they have to eat.


Which takes you to scenario number one.....

Cntrygal
10-12-2004, 07:25 PM
WTH didn't anyone say #2 and when the artwork surfaces you trace down the SOB and beat his ass. Then have him arrested for theft?