PDA

View Full Version : It will cost $20 to drive from KC to StL....


shaneo69
10-15-2004, 09:05 AM
if MoDOT gets this proposal passed. That would suck for me because I take I-70 from StL to KC for all Chiefs home games.

Toll on I-70 to KC and back would run $20
By Shane Graber
2004, St. Louis Post-Dispatch
10/14/2004

Interstate 70 would become a toll road between St. Louis and Kansas City under a proposal by Missouri highway officials, who are considering tolls of as high as $20 round-trip for passenger vehicles and $45 round-trip for commercial trucks.

The 250 miles of interstate from eastern Missouri to the western edge would be dotted by two or three toll booths between St. Louis and Columbia, and two or three more between Columbia and Kansas City. Money raised from the tolls would pay to rebuild the interstate and expand it to six lanes statewide. I-70 is currently four lanes through most of Missouri.

The Missouri Department of Transportation said a more detailed study of an I-70 toll system should be completed in two weeks.

"Toll roads are used successfully in many other parts of the country, but in Missouri we don't even have that as an option," said Linda Wilson, a department spokeswoman. "We just want this as a tool in our toolbox. We have no intention of tolling roads all over Missouri."

The job of getting tolling authority - which is becoming an annual tradition in Missouri - won't be easy. The state's voters would have to approve any toll plan because it would require a constitutional amendment. It also would need legislative approval.

Highway officials say a toll might be the best, if not the only, way to pay for a new six-lane I-70. The interstate now is clogged with traffic, infamous for decay and, according to many, the black eye of the highway department.

MoDOT asked voters for approval for toll roads in 1970 and 1992. Both times, voters shot the agency down. That's as far as highway officials have gotten. They've asked for tolling authority for the past three years, but lawmakers have never let it advance to a ballot.

"So now we're going for just one road," said Jay Wunderlich, MoDOT's governmental affairs director.

MoDOT is considering an "open toll" system in which motorists would only have to pay when they go through the booth, and not every time they get on and off the highway.

"The idea is to get the traffic that's going all the way across the state," not the local traffic, Wilson said.

The full report later this month will include estimates on how much money the tolls would generate, locations for the toll booths and how much traffic likely would move to alternate east-to-west highways. It's not known whether the toll system would affect people commuting between St. Louis and Illinois.

The most recent figures, from 2002, showed that nearly 241,000 vehicles a day traveled between St. Louis and Kansas City. Experts predict that congestion on I-70 will double by 2020, and rebuilding the interstate will cost taxpayers about $3 billion.

Illinois and six other states neighboring Missouri already have authority to charge tolls. Parts of I-70 in Kansas already are tolled.

Federal law restricts tolls on U.S. interstates, but a state can ask the Federal Highway Administration for permission to toll as a pilot project. Congress could eliminate the restriction entirely in a new transportation spending bill.

Sen. John Loudon, R-Ballwin, introduced a version of the toll bill last session. He said he'd push for it again this year.

Sen. Jon Dolan, R-Lake Saint Louis, who chairs the Senate Transportation Committee, said last year that MoDOT needed to do more homework on the subject.

Dolan guaranteed the issue will get a hearing in his committee this session.

"I think this new attention toward one signature project is essential," he said. "Missourians won't allow for toll roads to go up willy-nilly."

Dolan said that even if voters let I-70 become a toll road, it would be phased in and could take years before a motorist ever drops a nickel into a chute.


Toll road idea details


Proposal so far:

Make Interstate 70 a toll road between St. Louis and Kansas City.

Set up between four and six toll booths.

Charge as much as $20 round-trip for passenger vehicles.

Charge as much as $45 round-trip for commercial trucks.

Use the money to rebuild I-70 into a six-lane interstate across the state.

What's next:

Full study to be released later this month.

Any toll roads would need voter approval of a constitutional amendment.

Any toll roads would need legislative approval.


Reporter Shane Graber
E-mail: sgraber@post-dispatch.com
Phone: 314-340-8207

Baby Lee
10-15-2004, 09:10 AM
This is such bullshit. Twelve years ago, they passed a gas tax to do this very thing. And they wasted every f@cking cent of it. This is a prime example of why you don't trust a word the government when they promise to use the money they're taking from you wisely.

Brock
10-15-2004, 09:11 AM
Move.

Skip Towne
10-15-2004, 09:15 AM
This is a great idea. It fits well with my "Tax everybody but me" philosophy.

Saulbadguy
10-15-2004, 09:18 AM
Coming from an impartial observer: Why would ANYONE trust MoDot to do something right?

KCN
10-15-2004, 09:23 AM
I just did the drive from KC to STL last weekend. My drive up to KC from Texas was fine, no problems, but that I-70 drive is every bit as hellacious as I remember it being when I lived in MO. Kid you not, I saw five accidents or near-accidents on that 250 mile drive alone. It is tradition that I arrived in St. Louis with my hands stuck to the wheel, tense as hell and my heart racing after nearly escaping death God-knows-how-many times. They need to do something.

But do we really need a toll road to fix that? When I was in Columbia I did the drive to KC and STL all the time, I would have dropped hundreds if I-70 were a toll road. At least KU students have an alternate rte to I-70, there is no such alternative to Mizzou students.

Soupnazi
10-15-2004, 09:25 AM
This is such bullshit. Twelve years ago, they passed a gas tax to do this very thing. And they wasted every f@cking cent of it. This is a prime example of why you don't trust a word the government when they promise to use the money they're taking from you wisely.

Precisely. These a-holes are still collecting the tax that was supposed to have been retired now. And for what? Maintainence they say. Try incompetence.

shaneo69
10-15-2004, 09:27 AM
...do we really need a toll road to fix that? When I was in Columbia I did the drive to KC and STL all the time, I would have dropped hundreds if I-70 were a toll road. At least KU students have an alternate rte to I-70, there is no such alternative to Mizzou students.

I didn't even think of that. I would guess that Mizzou students would find this to be quite oppressive.

KCN
10-15-2004, 09:31 AM
I didn't catch that the $20 was round trip, and would only be $10 each way. That's not so bad I guess, considering the KS turnpike is $16 for the same distance. But still, thumbs down. And for the love of God do not stick any tollbooths east of Wentzville or west of Grain Valley.

dirk digler
10-15-2004, 09:33 AM
I am all for tolling roads but no way would I pay $20 dollars for a round trip.
If you look at a state like Florida where they have tolls, their main highways are great way better than any in MO but they don't charge $20.
I think I paid like $3 dollars to go the toll road from Miami to Orlando.

Lzen
10-15-2004, 09:36 AM
Don't do it, MO. Kansas started their toll on I-70 and I-335/35 many years ago. It was supposed to have been over a while ago but you know they can't give it up. Bastards. :cuss: You give this to them and they'll never give it up. My gosh, when we drive up to Peoria,IL to visit the wife's relatives, it could cost an extra 20 bucks. Gimme a friggin' break. :shake:

KCN
10-15-2004, 09:37 AM
If they were to do this, I hope they follow Kansas and have two tollbooths at each end of the turnpike, first one you get a ticket and second you pay, and tollbooths at each exit if you enter/leave the turnpike in the middle. That is so nice and easy. Unlike Oklahoma where you pay the toll for the entire turnpike in the middle of the turnpike, and if you exit before the turnpike ends you have to get your money back, and if you exit before the tollbooth, there is no attendant to take your money. Hope you have some change. Although I do like the 75 mph speed limit on toll roads in OK.

Baby Lee
10-15-2004, 09:38 AM
I just did the drive from KC to STL last weekend. My drive up to KC from Texas was fine, no problems, but that I-70 drive is every bit as hellacious as I remember it being when I lived in MO. Kid you not, I saw five accidents or near-accidents on that 250 mile drive alone. It is tradition that I arrived in St. Louis with my hands stuck to the wheel, tense as hell and my heart racing after nearly escaping death God-knows-how-many times. They need to do something.

But do we really need a toll road to fix that? When I was in Columbia I did the drive to KC and STL all the time, I would have dropped hundreds if I-70 were a toll road. At least KU students have an alternate rte to I-70, there is no such alternative to Mizzou students.
Drop down to Jeff city and take HWY50.

Saulbadguy
10-15-2004, 09:38 AM
Don't do it, MO. Kansas started their toll on I-70 and I-335/35 many years ago. It was supposed to have been over a while ago but you know they can't give it up. Bastards. :cuss: You give this to them and they'll never give it up. My gosh, when we drive up to Peoria,IL to visit the wife's relatives, it could cost an extra 20 bucks. Gimme a friggin' break. :shake:
Yeah. Stupid KDOT.

KCTitus
10-15-2004, 09:40 AM
Once a toll goes up...it never goes down.

There were tolls put up in Richmond to build a downtown expressway...the tolling authority has more debt now than when they originally built the expressway and the tolls have doubled in price since inception.

KCN
10-15-2004, 09:43 AM
Drop down to Jeff city and take HWY50.

If you are talking to KC, I did that once, and it added over an hour to my trip. If you are talking to STL, helllllll no :shake:

Crush
10-15-2004, 09:58 AM
What happened to the good old days when you payed a troll under a bridge and that was it? Tolls are so f****** stupid!!! :cuss:

TheNextStep
10-15-2004, 10:21 AM
If they were to do this, I hope they follow Kansas and have two tollbooths at each end of the turnpike, first one you get a ticket and second you pay, and tollbooths at each exit if you enter/leave the turnpike in the middle. That is so nice and easy. Unlike Oklahoma where you pay the toll for the entire turnpike in the middle of the turnpike, and if you exit before the turnpike ends you have to get your money back, and if you exit before the tollbooth, there is no attendant to take your money. Hope you have some change. Although I do like the 75 mph speed limit on toll roads in OK.
Yeah... but a toll road in Oklahoma charges you like $2.75 if you drive the ENTIRE LENGTH of it.

Lzen
10-15-2004, 10:35 AM
Yeah. Stupid KDOT.

Eh, try KTA. Different entity.

KCN
10-15-2004, 10:51 AM
Yeah... but a toll road in Oklahoma charges you like $2.75 if you drive the ENTIRE LENGTH of it.

IIRC correctly, I-44 from Wichita Falls to Joplin cost me just under $10

Braincase
10-15-2004, 10:52 AM
I wonder when they'll figure out that the whole reason for the Kansas Turnpike was to expedite the transfer of Mssourians OUT of Kansas.

The Pedestrian
10-15-2004, 03:33 PM
No way in hell I'd pay to go to St. Louis...just having to go there is payment enough.

ChiefsCountry
10-15-2004, 04:19 PM
Why don't they just make Highway 50 a four lane from Kansas City to St. Louis. KC to Sedalia is already done and around Jefferson City it is.

philfree
10-15-2004, 04:23 PM
If this were to go through it wouldn't be long till I-44 was turned into a toll road. I say noway Jose!

KCN
10-15-2004, 04:35 PM
Why don't they just make Highway 50 a four lane from Kansas City to St. Louis. KC to Sedalia is already done and around Jefferson City it is.

From what I heard they were deciding to do that or turn I-70 into 6 lanes, and they opted for the latter.

I saw a rough time table for this project, and I'll be long gone before this is finished, if it even happens.

ENDelt260
10-15-2004, 04:35 PM
Aren't you already long gone?

Hydrae
10-15-2004, 06:07 PM
They are getting ready to start putting tolls on local highways here in the Austin area. I don't mind too much when they want to put a toll on a road they are building. What drives me nuts is when they want to toll roads that were built years ago!

Deberg_1990
10-15-2004, 06:08 PM
What the hell do they use the Casino revenues on in Missouri?? Schools?? thats it?

ChiefsCountry
10-15-2004, 06:19 PM
What the hell do they use the Casino revenues on in Missouri?? Schools?? thats it?

The schools don't get all the money from that either.

ENDelt260
10-15-2004, 06:20 PM
What the hell do they use the Casino revenues on in Missouri?? Schools?? thats it?
I wasn't aware the casinos were state run.

Deberg_1990
10-15-2004, 06:33 PM
The schools don't get all the money from that either.

Then if they are not going to use the money generated from them on something useful...they need to close them. What good are they then? Besides giving people a reason to go into debt?

go bowe
10-15-2004, 06:44 PM
Then if they are not going to use the money generated from them on something useful...they need to close them. What good are they then? Besides giving people a reason to go into debt?some people just enjoy playing the slots or some other game of chance and view going to the casino as another form of entertainment...

they budget a certain amount, and when that's gone, they go home...

these people are a bit scarce though...

imo, the vast majority of gamblers are addicted to some extent and spend way more than they should at the casino...

and all those dollars that used to go into theaters, or shows, or other forms of entertainment locally now go into the casino, which is usually owned by some out-of-state company so the profits leave the state...

i guess i'm ambivalent about casinos, but since they're here in missouri now, it's too late to worry about it any more...

ENDelt260
10-15-2004, 06:44 PM
Then if they are not going to use the money generated from them on something useful...they need to close them. What good are they then? Besides giving people a reason to go into debt?
Gambling is an enjoyable way for me to spend my entertainment dollar. You don't like it, don't go. But, there's no reason to make it illegal for those that do.

Deberg_1990
10-15-2004, 06:47 PM
Gambling is an enjoyable way for me to spend my entertainment dollar. You don't like it, don't go. But, there's no reason to make it illegal for those that do.

OK..i agree with you man....and thats fine, Ive been to casinos and thown away my fair share of cash as well....its just that everytime i go i see all these lowlife trailer trash types who go there straight from cashing their payroll checks.....its makes me kinda sad.....

Miles
10-15-2004, 07:23 PM
Just curious...are there any other states that have tolls on their interstates other than Kansas this potential I-70 thing? I have just never seen this sort of thing anywhere else.

Seems like a toll on the interstate kind of defeats the basic concept of the interstate system it in the first place. Screws with interstate commerce too...

ENDelt260
10-15-2004, 10:30 PM
Seems like a toll on the interstate kind of defeats the basic concept of the interstate system it in the first place.

Nah.. I bet they don't charge military vehicles.

keg in kc
10-15-2004, 10:49 PM
Just curious...are there any other states that have tolls on their interstates other than Kansas this potential I-70 thing? I have just never seen this sort of thing anywhere else.

Seems like a toll on the interstate kind of defeats the basic concept of the interstate system it in the first place. Screws with interstate commerce too...West Virginia. I was born there in '74, and they've had tolls on I77 for as long as I can remember.

As for this...well, just another reason not to go to St. Loser.

Like I needed another.

KCWolfman
10-15-2004, 11:54 PM
I drove on the toll from KC to Lawrence two weeks ago. It was the nicest road I have been on in years.

If that's what it takes to straighten them up, I have no problem with it.

However, I believe some serious re-allocation needs to occur at the State level for programs and sources first.

KCWolfman
10-15-2004, 11:55 PM
What the hell do they use the Casino revenues on in Missouri?? Schools?? thats it?
Not just schools. However, they looped the funds that were previously allocated to schools and roads elsewhere while taking in record profits from the casinos. If they ever go down the tubes, then our schools and roads will be even worse.

Deberg_1990
10-15-2004, 11:59 PM
Not just schools. However, they looped the funds that were previously allocated to schools and roads elsewhere while taking in record profits from the casinos. If they ever go down the tubes, then our schools and roads will be even worse.

Oh god..Missouri will turn into Alabama and Mississippi...