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View Full Version : Is it better to try and be 8-8 and out of the playoffs, or


Valiant
12-05-2004, 06:17 PM
Go for draft position???

Do you want a shot at a impact player or do you want to be around .500 and another mid to low round pick with our strength of schedule...

no flaming here.. just post yes or no...

David.
12-05-2004, 06:19 PM
yes or no...

Deberg_1990
12-05-2004, 06:21 PM
The worst thing that could happen to this is team is for us to get hot and win 4 or 5 more games. It would mislead the powers that be into thinking that this team is better than it really is. I want at least a top 10 pick.

suds79
12-05-2004, 06:23 PM
The worst thing that could happen to this is team is for us to get hot and win 4 or 5 more games. It would mislead the powers that be into thinking that this team is better than it really is. I want at least a top 10 pick.

Deberg, I think we see eye to eye.

But I feel that Carl will just mess up the pick if there's debate on who's the player to take.

We need one of those for sure picks. (a top 5). Rolle or Johnson. I don't want for Carl to even think about the pick.

I'm hoping for a knee-jerk reaction pick. #5?, Rolle still on the board? Oh take em.

Deberg_1990
12-05-2004, 06:25 PM
Deberg, I think we see eye to eye.

But I feel that Carl will just mess up the pick if there's debate on who's the player to take.

We need one of those for sure picks. (a top 5). Rolle or Johnson. I don't want for Carl to even think about the pick.

I'm hoping for a knee-jerk reaction pick. #5?, Rolle still on the board? Oh take em.

I couldnt agree more. Thats why deep down i wanted to lose today or i want to lose out. It serves no purpose for us to end up 8-8 or 7-9

FloridaChief
12-05-2004, 06:28 PM
The worst thing that could happen to this is team is for us to get hot and win 4 or 5 more games.

Yep. Worst thing that could happen would be the Chiefs players getting a winning attitude going into next season. I'd much rather have them enveloped in a losing spiral. Better to be psychologically destroyed and get the low draft pic, right? It worked in San Diego with Ryan Leaf, didn't it? And in New Orleans with Ricky Williams?

David.
12-05-2004, 06:32 PM
Yep. Worst thing that could happen would be the Chiefs players getting a winning attitude going into next season. I'd much rather have them enveloped in a losing spiral. Better to be psychologically destroyed and get the low draft pic, right? It worked in San Diego with Ryan Leaf, didn't it? And in New Orleans with Ricky Williams?

yeah and indianapolis with manning? And in Philly with McNabb.

Valiant
12-05-2004, 06:35 PM
Yep. Worst thing that could happen would be the Chiefs players getting a winning attitude going into next season. I'd much rather have them enveloped in a losing spiral. Better to be psychologically destroyed and get the low draft pic, right? It worked in San Diego with Ryan Leaf, didn't it? And in New Orleans with Ricky Williams?


It worked with SD didnt it.. it has worked Baltimore didnt it.. how many other teams went from worst to first to win the championship??? How many times have the Chiefs been by being average each year...How many different teams have been in the championship except the Chiefs in the last 15years under Carl using our previous philosophey???

Why settle for status quo??? We have one of the best Offenses in the NFL and one of the worst D's, why should we not improve that with a higher draft pick??? What happend last time we had a top 5 pick.. We got DT...

FloridaChief
12-05-2004, 06:36 PM
yeah and indianapolis with manning? And in Philly with McNabb.

Yeah. You're proving my point: It's a crapshoot. A coin toss. I won't ever root for the Chiefs to lose just for a *chance* to get a *maybe* good pick...

|Zach|
12-05-2004, 06:36 PM
It worked with SD didnt it.. it has worked Baltimore didnt it.. how many other teams went from worst to first to win the championship??? How many times have the Chiefs been by being average each year...How many different teams have been in the championship except the Chiefs in the last 15years under Carl using our previous philosophey???

Why settle for status quo??? We have one of the best Offenses in the NFL and one of the worst D's, why should we not improve that with a higher draft pick??? What happend last time we had a top 5 pick.. We got DT...
How much of SD's good season this year has to do with thier draft pick?

ROFL

|Zach|
12-05-2004, 06:37 PM
If drafting was a science i MIGHT agreee but prob not.

FloridaChief
12-05-2004, 06:37 PM
What happend last time we had a top 5 pick.. We got DT...

Do you know how many teams have had a top-five pick and NOT gotten a Derrick Thomas?

Valiant
12-05-2004, 06:38 PM
How much of SD's good season this year has to do with thier draft pick?

ROFL


LT and drew brees... Antonio Gates...

What else you need???

suds79
12-05-2004, 06:38 PM
Yep. Worst thing that could happen would be the Chiefs players getting a winning attitude going into next season. I'd much rather have them enveloped in a losing spiral. Better to be psychologically destroyed and get the low draft pic, right? It worked in San Diego with Ryan Leaf, didn't it? And in New Orleans with Ricky Williams?

Yeah that's our problem. We need guys like William Bartee, Vonnie Holliday & Kawika Mitchell to have a winning attitude.

That's why they stuggle. Certainly it isn't because they're a bunch of no talent pu$$ies.

I don't want those guys coming back next year with any attitude. I don't want them coming back at all.

David.
12-05-2004, 06:38 PM
Yeah. You're proving my point: It's a crapshoot. A coin toss. I won't ever root for the Chiefs to lose just for a *chance* to get a *maybe* good pick...

And it's even more of a crapshoot the farther down you go. I'm by no means hoping the chiefs lose. But I won't be too broken up about a top 8 pick.

Valiant
12-05-2004, 06:39 PM
Do you know how many teams have had a top-five pick and NOT gotten a Derrick Thomas?


The majority of the top 5 picks have become all-stars...Sure you get your leafs every now and then at QB's... but the majority have become stars... A better shot then a 19-25th pick at becoming all-stars...

|Zach|
12-05-2004, 06:39 PM
LT and drew brees... Antonio Gates...

What else you need???
Oh so you want us to lose for multiple seasons to get that picks of that nature?

Chiefnj
12-05-2004, 06:39 PM
I don't think it makes much of a difference.

If they win some games here at the end I hope it's because of input from a LOT of the younger guys - Allen, Siavii, Caver, Sapp, Battle, etc. If the young guys are the reason for the defensive turnaround then I think - okay they are building on something. If they are close wins against other bad teams with the "old starters" then I'd almost rather have them lose and send a message to pick up some free agents and draft better, but I'm not sure the message would be received or anything done about it.

SNR
12-05-2004, 06:40 PM
I want the Chiefs to lose. But I sure as hell hope the players don't get that attitude.

This win was good. Show some pride.

dirk digler
12-05-2004, 06:40 PM
I want an impact player and since we were coming off of a 13-3 season I don't see how winning the last 4 games really helps us.

Michael Michigan
12-05-2004, 06:40 PM
The key question:

Who will be making the draft pick?

Valiant
12-05-2004, 06:43 PM
Oh so you want us to lose for multiple seasons to get that picks of that nature?



One season to get LT and Brees... And wasnt Gates in that draft also???


Would losing one season maybe two.. be worth it to get a championship???

|Zach|
12-05-2004, 06:44 PM
One season to get LT and Brees... And wasnt Gates in that draft also???


Would losing one season maybe two.. be worth it to get a championship???
Hey you are interested in our team to have back to back awful seasons...more power to you brother.

dirk digler
12-05-2004, 06:45 PM
One season to get LT and Brees... And wasnt Gates in that draft also???


Would losing one season maybe two.. be worth it to get a championship???


We need D impact players and maybe 1 impact WR.

FloridaChief
12-05-2004, 06:45 PM
Okay. You guys go on hoping for your favorite (?) team to lose. I'm gonna enjoy the win, myself...

Valiant
12-05-2004, 06:45 PM
I want the Chiefs to lose. But I sure as hell hope the players don't get that attitude.

This win was good. Show some pride.


The Chiefs have never quit once this season.. Our defensive ability is just that bad...that is why we need some serious upgrades.. And a higher draft spot gives us a better ability to do it... There is no way to go to the playoffs this season so look for the future... To many people like the status quo...

suds79
12-05-2004, 06:46 PM
The key question:

Who will be making the draft pick?

Answer: Carl Peterson.

We're in trouble huh.

So I guess we'd better get into a position where we're one of those teams to take the guy slotted for that spot.

You know how the 1st 5 picks go. Those are the easiest to pick. Now would you rather Carl take the guy who's scheduled to go next (ex: if we were to pick #4) or the guy Carl "thinks" is the player to go (ex: if we were to pick #9)?

I rest my case.

ChiefsCountry
12-05-2004, 06:47 PM
One season to get LT and Brees... And wasnt Gates in that draft also???


Would losing one season maybe two.. be worth it to get a championship???

LT was a first rounder
Brees was a second rounder

Both of them were in 2001 draft.

Gates was an undrafted free agent from Kent State where he played hoops instead of fb.

Valiant
12-05-2004, 06:47 PM
Hey you are interested in our team to have back to back awful seasons...more power to you brother.

Hey if you are interested in our team never having a chance at the championship.. more power to you...


This team cannot compete with the D we have.. Agian answer the question... would you sacrifice one season, this one hopefully for us to go the superbowl... dont evade.. yes or no...

dirk digler
12-05-2004, 06:47 PM
Okay. You guys go on hoping for your favorite (?) team to lose. I'm gonna enjoy the win, myself...


IMO, it is a real dilemma for me. I don't want them to lose but I don't want them to win either. I want a defensive impact player like we had with DT. We won't get that picking in the middle of the draft. The season is lost so why win when you can get a high draft pick that can start for you Day 1?

dirk digler
12-05-2004, 06:49 PM
Hey if you are interested in our team never having a chance at the championship.. more power to you...


This team cannot compete with the D we have.. Agian answer the question... would you sacrifice one season, this one hopefully for us to go the superbowl... dont evade.. yes or no...


HELL YES! and anyone who answers no is a complete idiot.

Valiant
12-05-2004, 06:49 PM
LT was a first rounder
Brees was a second rounder

Both of them were in 2001 draft.

Gates was an undrafted free agent from Kent State where he played hoops instead of fb.


And they got both of them from the vick pick... So both for one pick...

|Zach|
12-05-2004, 06:49 PM
Hey if you are interested in our team never having a chance at the championship.. more power to you...


This team cannot compete with the D we have.. Agian answer the question... would you sacrifice one season, this one hopefully for us to go the superbowl... dont evade.. yes or no...
Nope...if the NFL was a science then I would agree with you...

I see the draft as a craps shoot...I also think having a single impact player does not guarentee us shit.

I would rather go down this year with a ltitle pride and do the best we can in the offseason to make this team better for next year. Like I said in another thread...my condolences to you for our win today.

2bikemike
12-05-2004, 06:52 PM
Nope...if the NFL was a science then I would agree with you...

I see the draft as a craps shoot...I also think having a single impact player does not guarentee us shit.

I would rather go down this year with a ltitle pride and the best we can in the offseason to make this team better for next year. Like I said in another thread...my condolences to you for our win today.

I agree Zach also we need a damn leader on defense. No rookie is going to be a leader. We need a couple vets.

IMHO if we could get an impact player at the 3 levels of defense and get one or 2 of those guys be a leader we would start to be respectable.

papasmurf
12-05-2004, 06:54 PM
If We end up with a high draft pick we are screwed. He will hold out to get impact player money and report late to camp.

dirk digler
12-05-2004, 06:55 PM
Nope...if the NFL was a science then I would agree with you...

I see the draft as a craps shoot...I also think having a single impact player does not guarentee us shit.

I would rather go down this year with a ltitle pride and the best we can in the offseason to make this team better for next year. Like I said in another thread...my condolences to you for our win today.


I definitely don't think 1 impact player would get us to the SB but we have 9 picks in the draft and all of them should be on D. We need a huge influx of talent on our D and the difference between picking in the 15-20 the range and picking in the top 5 is huge. Most of the pick in the low 1st rds are crap shoots and if you pick in the top 5 it is almost a guarantee lock. Now I know there are exceptions to this but I would rather take my chance with a top 5 pick then a lower 1st rd pick.

dirk digler
12-05-2004, 06:56 PM
I agree Zach also we need a damn leader on defense. No rookie is going to be a leader. We need a couple vets.

IMHO if we could get an impact player at the 3 levels of defense and get one or 2 of those guys be a leader we would start to be respectable.


Yep draft all D players and sign some D FA's. We need talent now. The offense only has 1 to 2 yrs left.

Valiant
12-05-2004, 06:58 PM
Nope...if the NFL was a science then I would agree with you...

I see the draft as a craps shoot...I also think having a single impact player does not guarentee us shit.

I would rather go down this year with a ltitle pride and the best we can in the offseason to make this team better for next year. Like I said in another thread...my condolences to you for our win today.


Another evasive answer...If the draft is such a crap shoot why is our normal 19-25th picks never pan out, but the normal top five picks do well on more then the average???

Agian besides the enigma of the patriots no other team has done well in FA?? Everything is thru the draft, and having higher draft order gets you in a better positition to get playmakers...

Are you happy with the status quo for the last ten years??? How have our draft picks done in the 19th and below order compared to when we got neil smith and derrick thomas???

And building teams thru FA's is even more of a crap shoot then the draft so i dont understand your reasoning for that...


Agian i am happy the Chiefs won, Just hurts us next year... Some people just dont like looking towards the future...

Valiant
12-05-2004, 06:59 PM
I agree Zach also we need a damn leader on defense. No rookie is going to be a leader. We need a couple vets.

IMHO if we could get an impact player at the 3 levels of defense and get one or 2 of those guys be a leader we would start to be respectable.


Dt was our leader in his rookie year... So it is very likely to happen...

|Zach|
12-05-2004, 07:09 PM
Another evasive answer...If the draft is such a crap shoot why is our normal 19-25th picks never pan out, but the normal top five picks do well on more then the average???

Agian besides the enigma of the patriots no other team has done well in FA?? Everything is thru the draft, and having higher draft order gets you in a better positition to get playmakers...

Are you happy with the status quo for the last ten years??? How have our draft picks done in the 19th and below order compared to when we got neil smith and derrick thomas???

And building teams thru FA's is even more of a crap shoot then the draft so i dont understand your reasoning for that...


Agian i am happy the Chiefs won, Just hurts us next year... Some people just dont like looking towards the future...
I answered your question. I am not evading anything. You just dont agree with the answer...no problem...

Sorry about the win today. I have explained myself. You think we automatically go to the SB if we suck for 2 seasons...I disagree...

Valiant
12-05-2004, 07:20 PM
I answered your question. I am not evading anything. You just dont agree with the answer...no problem...

Sorry about the win today. I have explained myself. You think we automatically go to the SB if we suck for 2 seasons...I disagree...


No, i wrote we have a much better chance then playing status quo, you thinking has us our current D magically getting better.... Agian i wrote one season maybe two.... Drafting is how you pick teams, having a higher draft pick helps.. You think being .500 is respectable, how is being out of the playoffs and a shittier draft position respectable???

What award or championship do we get for being respectable???

Logical
12-05-2004, 07:24 PM
Deberg, I think we see eye to eye.

But I feel that Carl will just mess up the pick if there's debate on who's the player to take.

We need one of those for sure picks. (a top 5). Rolle or Johnson. I don't want for Carl to even think about the pick.

I'm hoping for a knee-jerk reaction pick. #5?, Rolle still on the board? Oh take em.

Agree completely.:thumb: