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Wile_E_Coyote
02-04-2005, 08:17 AM
By Jody Foldesy
THE WASHINGTON TIMES

http://www.washtimes.com/sports/20050204-012524-9724r.htm

JACKSONVILLE, Fla. -- The unprecedented size of the franchise tag for cornerbacks, announced yesterday at the NFL Players Association's annual news conference, ensures the Washington Redskins won't place the tag on cornerback Fred Smoot.

It wasn't clear in recent weeks how seriously the Redskins considered the option as team officials played coy and coach Joe Gibbs repeatedly said such discussions were yet to be held. However, vice president of football operations Vinny Cerrato said last night Smoot definitely won't get the tag at a record $8.816 million.

"It doesn't make sense," Cerrato said.

The franchise tag permits a club to control one of its unrestricted free agents by making a one-year tender offer equivalent to the average of the position's five highest-paid players. Although the tag wasn't intended to extract trade value, it often is used in such fashion, as Washington did last year with cornerback Champ Bailey.

Bailey's tag was for $6.801 million. The highest-priced tag historically has been reserved for quarterbacks. But this year cornerbacks made an unprecedented jump into the top slot. If Washington were to use the tag on Smoot, he simply could sign it, ensuring an $8.8 million payday, then wait for free agency in 2005.

"He'd sign that in a minute," Cerrato acknowledged.

At lower levels, the tag can give a team leverage over the player, who can't secure major guaranteed money and must negotiate on the club's terms or seek a trade.

Manila-Chief
02-04-2005, 08:23 AM
I get another message from this post. If the average for the top 5 CB's is over $8mil ... no way will we get one of them. Kingless certainly will not pay that much for a defensive position.

jiveturkey
02-04-2005, 08:24 AM
It sounds like CB salaries might be on their way down in the next couple of years.

This is a good year for teams that are in the market for a corner.

Chiefnj
02-04-2005, 08:41 AM
This helps put into perspective the money that guys like Law, Baxter, Lucas and Surtain want and expect.

I can't necessarily blame a GM for not wanting to fork over that kind of cash, on a position that is often handcuffed by the luck of whichever officiating crew you get in a particular week.

Hoover
02-04-2005, 08:54 AM
Great News, the more on the market the better for us

the Talking Can
02-04-2005, 08:56 AM
sweet....sign Smoot, sign Hartwell, draft a CB/DE in round 1...that's a good start

Hoover
02-04-2005, 08:58 AM
I think Smoot would be my first choice, a play on the up.

Cochise
02-04-2005, 09:03 AM
I think I might pick him over Law, Surtain, etc., just because it would leave more money available to us to spend at other positions on D.

Of course, that would have to mean they actually go out and spend it... not take the cap room into the season... :rolleyes:

If we got him and drafted Carlos Rogers, then a LB in the 2nd, I could live with that. It's a start.

Hoover
02-04-2005, 09:06 AM
I don't know how much cheraper Smoot is going to be.

the Talking Can
02-04-2005, 09:06 AM
I think Smoot would be my first choice, a play on the up.

yeah, if we don't have to trade...Smoot is younger and cheaper (than Law), but still damn good....of course, if CP has his heart set on Law I won't complain ROFL

Hoover
02-04-2005, 09:09 AM
yeah, if we don't have to trade...Smoot is younger and cheaper (than Law), but still damn good....of course, if CP has his heart set on Law I won't complain ROFL
Smoot, Surtain, Law any of the three in R&G would really help this D

Fat Elvis
02-04-2005, 09:24 AM
Put the money in LBs and folks who can pressure the QB. The rules now have completely castrated the CBs in the NFL.

Cochise
02-04-2005, 09:27 AM
Put the money in LBs and folks who can pressure the QB. The rules now have completely castrated the CBs in the NFL.

I'll remember that we don't need a corner the next time I see one of ours 2 steps behind a receiver giving up a TD.

Or the next time a team runs all the way down the field on us with slants and hooks.

Or the next time a team rolls up 150 rushing yards on us because we have to play 2 deep on every down.

BigChiefFan
02-04-2005, 09:29 AM
Smoot has already turned down a huge signing bonus. I think he wants to break the bank.

the Talking Can
02-04-2005, 09:30 AM
Smoot has already turned down a huge signing bonus. I think he wants to break the bank.

all FA's do

Hoover
02-04-2005, 09:34 AM
We must have a CB and a LB in Free Agency

Otherwise itrs a gamble on next season.

Then we draft a CB and LB

If there is anyway to do more than that in FAs great, but he have to get a CB and LB

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 09:37 AM
I'll remember that we don't need a corner the next time I see one of ours 2 steps behind a receiver giving up a TD.

Or the next time a team runs all the way down the field on us with slants and hooks.

Or the next time a team rolls up 150 rushing yards on us because we have to play 2 deep on every down.

Nobody is saying we don't need a corner.

We just need LB's worse, in a lot of people's opinions...

Hoover
02-04-2005, 09:39 AM
Nobody is saying we don't need a corner.

We just need LB's worse, in a lot of people's opinions...
I think its about equal. We really need both.

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 09:41 AM
I think its about equal. We really need both.

I think it's a value proposition.

We do need both, but at which position do we need PREMIERE talent? IMO, that's LB.

Cochise
02-04-2005, 09:41 AM
Nobody is saying we don't need a corner.

We just need LB's worse, in a lot of people's opinions...

Mine included, I want a LB too, maybe first. I just dont want to see us fill in one hole and not upgrade the other position because we need to get better at both or improving at one may not matter that much.

Hoover
02-04-2005, 09:42 AM
I think its about equal. We really need both.
Plus there is no reason we can't have both

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 09:43 AM
Mine included, I want a LB too, maybe first. I just dont want to see us fill in one hole and not upgrade the other position because we need to get better at both or improving at one may not matter that much.

Exactly.

And that's what conerns me about this "Ty Law or bust" campaign. They're opening the door for Carl to sign Ty Law and then say "there, I did what you want".

We need MORE.

Hoover
02-04-2005, 09:44 AM
Exactly.

And that's what conerns me about this "Ty Law or bust" campaign. They're opening the door for Carl to sign Ty Law and then say "there, I did what you want".

We need MORE.
Good point, we have to get more than a CB. We must have a CB and a LB

BigChiefFan
02-04-2005, 09:46 AM
I would go after Hartwell or Bell in FA and draft Kevin Burnett in the 2nd round (trade up) and Daryl Blackstock in the third round to help sure up our LBing woes. Add Mitchell, Beisel, and Fox to that list and we should have a pretty good LBing core for years to come.

Hoover
02-04-2005, 09:50 AM
I think Mitchell would be nice depth, along with Fox.

D Line
Hicks, Sims, Jr. Allen
LB
Fujita, Hartwell, D. Johnson
DBs
Warfield, Smoot, Wesley, Woods

Cochise
02-04-2005, 09:51 AM
Exactly.

And that's what conerns me about this "Ty Law or bust" campaign. They're opening the door for Carl to sign Ty Law and then say "there, I did what you want".

We need MORE.

I think he's probably the best of the available corners, but if he's going to make it so we can't make a run at anyone else then forget him... Law himself isn't going to drag this D up from the bowels of the league rankings.

BigChiefFan
02-04-2005, 09:53 AM
I think Mitchell would be nice depth, along with Fox.

D Line
Hicks, Sims, Jr. Allen
LB
Fujita, Hartwell, D. Johnson
DBs
Warfield, Smoot, Wesley, Woods
I prefer to get Hicks replacement this year. I would target a DE in the first round if we land a corner and LBer in FA. David Pollack comes to mind.

Hoover
02-04-2005, 09:55 AM
I prefer to get Hicks replacement this year. I would target a DE in the first round if we land a corner and LBer in FA. David Pollack comes to mind.
Me too, but we are not goign to be able to get 4 new starters on D. You have to pick your spots

BigChiefFan
02-04-2005, 09:56 AM
Me too, but we are not goign to be able to get 4 new starters on D. You have to pick your spots
That's only picking up TWO FAs and the draft. We can easily do this.

Hoover
02-04-2005, 10:00 AM
That's only picking up TWO FAs and the draft. We can easily do this.
I think its CB and LB in the 1st and 2nd rounds. Wihile I would love to upgrade Hicks, I think we have to bite the bullet and hopre that Wilkenson can step it up

BigChiefFan
02-04-2005, 10:06 AM
I think its CB and LB in the 1st and 2nd rounds. Wihile I would love to upgrade Hicks, I think we have to bite the bullet and hopre that Wilkenson can step it upNO, I think Carl is feeling some major heat and KNOWS he has to go after some FAs this off-season. There's alot of pissed off fans and he knows it. He HAS to make some moves just to save face. Landing a LBer and Corner in FA, opens the draft up for us. We can go in many directions, but I think if we shore up those two psitions in FA, then we should take a shot at a STUD DE in the draft, I like David Pollack in the first round and Like I said earlier, we can then try and draft OLBer Kevin Burnett and then Daryl Blackstock in the 2nd and 3rd. I think our team would be greatly improved and it's just making TWO FA pick-ups in the off-season, that should be a cakewalk for a 16 year veteran GM to work his magic, right?

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 10:08 AM
That's only picking up TWO FAs and the draft. We can easily do this.

Unless we get an absolute stud like DJ in the draft, NONE of our rooks will be starting. I think in the last 4 years Crybaby has made the perfectly clear...

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 10:08 AM
And FYI, Crybaby isn't about to bench Hicks, either.

Hoover
02-04-2005, 10:11 AM
NO, I think Carl is feeling some major heat and KNOWS he has to go after some FAs this off-season. There's alot of pissed off fans and he knows it. He HAS to make some moves just to save face. Landing a LBer and Corner in FA, opens the draft up for us. We can go in many directions, but I think if we shore up those two psitions in FA, then we should take a shot at a STUD DE in the draft, I like David Pollack in the first round and Like I said earlier, we can then try and draft OLBer Kevin Burnett and then Daryl Blackstock in the 2nd and 3rd. I think our team would be greatly improved and it's just making TWO FA pick-ups in the off-season, that should be a cakewalk for a 16 year veteran GM to work his magic, right?
I understand where you are coming from but if we get a LB and CB in Free Agency I would like to see us grab Johnson or the Best CB. Because you don't get the oppoirtunity to draft guys like that often.

Hoover
02-04-2005, 10:11 AM
And FYI, Crybaby isn't about to bench Hicks, either.
I know, sad but true

Chiefnj
02-04-2005, 10:23 AM
Unless we get an absolute stud like DJ in the draft, NONE of our rooks will be starting. I think in the last 4 years Crybaby has made the perfectly clear...

I think Pollack could rotate in and play half the snaps at either end position.

I think Rolle could start also.

Hoover
02-04-2005, 10:23 AM
What about Johnson in the first and see if Roth slips to us in the 2nd?

The Bad Guy
02-04-2005, 10:31 AM
Smoot has already turned down a huge signing bonus. I think he wants to break the bank.

What reason does he have to thin otherwise?

Corners are a premium position, he's a top player at his position, he's young, and he wants to get paid.

Put him in with the 98% of other NFL athletes that want to be paid.

Hoover
02-04-2005, 10:32 AM
What reason does he have to thin otherwise?

Corners are a premium position, he's a top player at his position, he's young, and he wants to get paid.

Put him in with the 98% of other NFL athletes that want to be paid.
I think it would be 100% of NFL athletes

chiefz
02-04-2005, 10:48 AM
It sounds like CB salaries might be on their way down in the next couple of years.

This is a good year for teams that are in the market for a corner.

Definitely, like Gaz has mentioned several times the worth of even the best cornerbacks has been hurt by the recent PI rule emphasis.

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 10:55 AM
I think Pollack could rotate in and play half the snaps at either end position.

I think Rolle could start also.

I think Key Fox could play. I thought Larry Johnson could play.

I don't think it's about ability, it's about our head coach being inexplicably petty at times.

bricks
02-04-2005, 11:06 AM
I think Key Fox could play. I thought Larry Johnson could play.

I don't think it's about ability, it's about our head coach being inexplicably petty at times.

yeah that's true. Well said. :clap: :thumb:

Chiefnj
02-04-2005, 11:28 AM
I think Key Fox could play. I thought Larry Johnson could play.

I don't think it's about ability, it's about our head coach being inexplicably petty at times.

If you take Key's scouting report from last year and compare it to many of the likely 2nd and 3rd round linebackers in this years draft, Key looks like a sure fire player.

I'm really at a loss on the Chiefs defense. I realized that Gunther would have a limited impact on the team and he wasn't going to single handedly turn every player at every position around. However, I did think that the one area that the Chiefs were going to see some improvement was with the linebackers. They didn't really improve, but I honestly don't know if it was talent or injuries and players switching positions, etc. I'm still not completely ready to write off all of last years starters.

When you look at some teams with good linebackers now, and you go back and see how those players did their first year or so in the league, it isn't always impressive. For instance:

Vrabel (NE) 1st 3 years in the league he had 30 tackles total.
Bruschi (NE) 1st 2 years he had 69 tackles total.
Foote (steelers) first two years 26 tackles.
Porter (steelers) 25 tackles his first year.
Haggans (steelers) 20 tackles his first two years.
Hartwell (Ravens) had 6 tackles his first year.
Thomas (Ravens) had 37 tackles in his first two years.

Unfortunately, sometimes it just takes time for a cohesive unit to develop.

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 11:36 AM
If you take Key's scouting report from last year and compare it to many of the likely 2nd and 3rd round linebackers in this years draft, Key looks like a sure fire player.

That's quickly becoming THE point for me.

I've wanted a new OLB since the end of the season, but the more I read Fox' scouting reports and the more I read those of guys like Boley, Burnett, etc., the more I think we've already got a quality OLB on our roster.

This could all change, but right now, I'd like to see a starting lineup of:

DRAFT
Sims
Siavii
Allen

Fox
Hartwell
Fujita

Law/Surtain/Smoot
Warfield
Nickelback DRAFT

Pile
Wesley

Chief Faithful
02-04-2005, 11:38 AM
I get another message from this post. If the average for the top 5 CB's is over $8mil ... no way will we get one of them. Kingless certainly will not pay that much for a defensive position.

Another reason I want the Chiefs to go CB in the first round because no way they can significantly upgrade that position through free agency.

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 11:41 AM
I get another message from this post. If the average for the top 5 CB's is over $8mil ... no way will we get one of them. Kingless certainly will not pay that much for a defensive position.

He paid for Shawn Barber and Vonnie Holliday.

Criticize King Carl all you want, but at least have your facts straight.

beavis
02-04-2005, 11:42 AM
I don't think it's about ability, it's about our head coach being inexplicably petty at times.
What do you mean? The rest of us just don't have the balls to get paid millions of dollars to suck. :rolleyes:

beavis
02-04-2005, 11:43 AM
DRAFT
Sims
Siavii
Allen

Fox
Hartwell
Fujita

Law/Surtain/Smoot
Warfield
Nickelback DRAFT

Pile
Wesley
I could live with that. But as little of Fox as we saw last year, I doubt he's going to be starting.

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 11:43 AM
What do you mean? The rest of us just don't have the balls to get paid millions of dollars to suck. :rolleyes:

Yeah, Larry Johnson sure turned out to suck.

There's a few guys on this team that don't suck, they just have the great fortune of not being one of Vermeil's love children...

StcChief
02-04-2005, 11:44 AM
Put the money in LBs and folks who can pressure the QB. The rules now have completely castrated the CBs in the NFL.

Agreed. CB Stock is dropping fast.
Get LB DE for pressure and run stopping.

Don't overpay for a CB.

philfree
02-04-2005, 11:45 AM
Unless we get an absolute stud like DJ in the draft, NONE of our rooks will be starting. I think in the last 4 years Crybaby has made the perfectly clear...

Sims was starting as a rookie and so was Allen. FWIW.


PhilFree :arrow:

beavis
02-04-2005, 11:48 AM
Yeah, Larry Johnson sure turned out to suck.

There's a few guys on this team that don't suck, they just have the great fortune of not being one of Vermeil's love children...
I was refering to your post about Vermeil being petty. It conjured up memories of when Knobinson resigned and he felt the need to tell everyone they weren't men because we wouldn't quit our jobs if we sucked at it.

It wasn't intended to be a knock on LJ. But now that you mention it, you think one player redeems him for what otherwise has been 3 bad drafts in a row?

dtebbe
02-04-2005, 11:49 AM
I like Smoot because his name would be ALMOST as fun to yell as SNOOOOOP.

SMOOOOOT.

DT

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 11:50 AM
Sims was starting as a rookie and so was Allen. FWIW.


PhilFree :arrow:

Sims started because he had to. They traded up to the 6th pick in the draft to get him.

Allen started because we had no one else to line up there.

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 11:51 AM
I was refering to your post about Vermeil being petty. It conjured up memories of when Knobinson resigned and he felt the need to tell everyone they weren't men because we wouldn't quit our jobs if we sucked at it.

It wasn't intended to be a knock on LJ. But now that you mention it, you think one player redeems him for what otherwise has been 3 bad drafts in a row?

ROFL

I completely missed your meaning and you completely missed mine.

LJ was intended to be an example of the coaches pettiness, not an example that he knows how to draft. FWIW, Vermeil made it known that Johnson was Peterson's pick -- ironic that it's one of the few that has panned out since Vermeil got here.

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 11:53 AM
I could live with that. But as little of Fox as we saw last year, I doubt he's going to be starting.

My point was that, if you read all the scouting reports, Fox has just as good a chance of being a full-time starter as Kevin Burnett or any other OLB we could draft (except for Derrick Johnson of course)...

Chiefnj
02-04-2005, 11:56 AM
The Cards have a CB who was their nickle back, but he started at times due to injury. His name escapes me at the moment, but he could be a really good value pick, sort of like Dalton was last year.

It's Renaldo Hill.
His stats for the last two years: Games, total tackles, solo, assist, sacks, INT and PD's.


2003 Arizona Cardinals 14 58 47.0 11 2 5 10
2004 Arizona Cardinals 13 44 37.0 7 1 1 9

Spicy McHaggis
02-04-2005, 11:56 AM
What about Johnson in the first and see if Roth slips to us in the 2nd?

Wow, talk about my dreams coming true. That would be an excellent draft IMO. If we get Johnson in the first and Roth is available in the 2nd I would hope we'd make a move up to get him.

philfree
02-04-2005, 12:00 PM
Sims started because he had to. They traded up to the 6th pick in the draft to get him.

Allen started because we had no one else to line up there.

Sims was drafted to be a starter by DV so I don't think your DV won't start rookies is accurate. DV could have also started Wilkerson instead of Allen if he didn't want to start a rookie. AS far as LJ goes Blaylock had worked hard for three years a backup an let's not forget that he was tearing it up pretty good when played. He rushed for 186 yard or something like in the one game so putting LJ ahead of him prolly wouldn't have been fair. IMO there was more to LJ not getting playing time then just DV being petty.


PhilFree :arrow:

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 12:05 PM
Sims was drafted to be a starter by DV so I don't think your DV won't start rookies is accurate. DV could have also started Wilkerson instead of Allen if he didn't want to start a rookie. AS far as LJ goes Blaylock had worked hard for three years a backup an let's not forget that he was tearing it up pretty good when played. He rushed for 186 yard or something like in the one game so putting LJ ahead of him prolly wouldn't have been fair. IMO there was more to LJ not getting playing time then just DV being petty.


PhilFree :arrow:

Sims was drafted #6 overall. The natives would have TORCHED Arrowhead if he started the season on the bench.

He couldn't have started Wilkerson, Allen and Wilkerson play on opposite ends of the line.

I hate Vermeil, almost as much now as I hate Marty. I want him gone - yesterday.

I don't care what his reasons are at this point. He's shown on multiple occasions that he's not ABOVE being petty, and to me, that's more than enough justification to assume that there's nothing more to it than that.

philfree
02-04-2005, 12:22 PM
Sims was drafted #6 overall. The natives would have TORCHED Arrowhead if he started the season on the bench.

He couldn't have started Wilkerson, Allen and Wilkerson play on opposite ends of the line.

I hate Vermeil, almost as much now as I hate Marty. I want him gone - yesterday.

I don't care what his reasons are at this point. He's shown on multiple occasions that he's not ABOVE being petty, and to me, that's more than enough justification to assume that there's nothing more to it than that.

Multiple occasions huh? :hmmm: You ain't gotta tell me you hate DV I can read ROFL Tour intitled to your opinion but at this point that seems based more on emotion then fact. I don't think DV is perfect and I do think he was a little petty with LJ but LJ was a little bit of a whine gut to so :shrug: It was a tough situation DV got an insurance policy he didn't need and the other two RBs were pretty much kicking butt so putting LJ ahead of them when he was being immature wouldn't have been the right thing to do IMO. I'm not so sure that DV didn't do a better job with LJ then most think. He was being the prema donna (sp?) so he needed to be brought down a hair and he was. Something else about that situation is that Blaylock is such a good reciever and the way this O utilizes the RBs helped him stay head of LJ on the depth chart.

PhilFree :arrow:

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 12:36 PM
Multiple occasions huh? :hmmm: You ain't gotta tell me you hate DV I can read ROFL Tour intitled to your opinion but at this point that seems based more on emotion then fact. I don't think DV is perfect and I do think he was a little petty with LJ but LJ was a little bit of a whine gut to so :shrug: It was a tough situation DV got an insurance policy he didn't need and the other two RBs were pretty much kicking butt so putting LJ ahead of them when he was being immature wouldn't have been the right thing to do IMO. I'm not so sure that DV didn't do a better job with LJ then most think. He was being the prema donna (sp?) so he needed to be brought down a hair and he was. Something else about that situation is that Blaylock is such a good reciever and the way this O utilizes the RBs helped him stay head of LJ on the depth chart.

PhilFree :arrow:

How about the way he treats punters? This, despite the fact that guys leave here and go to the Pro Bowl. The common denominator is HIM, not bad punters.

There's always the Engledork comments.

I'm done giving him the benefit of the doubt...

philfree
02-04-2005, 12:49 PM
How about the way he treats punters? This, despite the fact that guys leave here and go to the Pro Bowl. The common denominator is HIM, not bad punters.

There's always the Engledork comments.

I'm done giving him the benefit of the doubt...


Guys? Or do you me Sourbrun? He didn't punt his way to the pro bowl while he ws in KC. It might have been a mistake to let him go but since then our punters have sucked so I can blame DV for being hard on them.

PhilFree :arrow:

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 12:52 PM
Guys? Or do you me Sourbrun? He didn't punt his way to the pro bowl while he ws in KC. It might have been a mistake to let him go but since then our punters have sucked so I can blame DV for being hard on them.

PhilFree :arrow:

Sauerbrunn went to the Pro Bowl AFTER he left KC, and was a premiere punter before he came here. Only under DV was he a failure.

And the guy we cut last year - Cheek - his average was like almost 10 yards higher before he came here.

I'm saying our punters suck BECAUSE of DV. He even said something about it a few weeks ago, that they're problem was working for him or something like that...

philfree
02-04-2005, 12:58 PM
Sauerbrunn went to the Pro Bowl AFTER he left KC, and was a premiere punter before he came here. Only under DV was he a failure.

And the guy we cut last year - Cheek - his average was like almost 10 yards higher before he came here.

I'm saying our punters suck BECAUSE of DV. He even said something about it a few weeks ago, that they're problem was working for him or something like that...

I missed that remark by DV but he usually lays blame at his own feet.


PhilFree :arrow:

Chiefnj
02-04-2005, 01:23 PM
And the guy we cut last year - Cheek - his average was like almost 10 yards higher before he came here.

...

Wasn't that average based on 3 preseason games?

htismaqe
02-04-2005, 01:24 PM
Wasn't that average based on 3 preseason games?

I don't know. I'm just getting sick of listening to Vermeil defend guys like Hicks and Greg Robinson until he's blue in the face but then go all out on a fuggin kicker...

philfree
02-04-2005, 01:26 PM
Wasn't that average based on 3 preseason games?


That sounds about right and some of that was in a dome like atmosphere.

PhilFree :arrow:

The Bad Guy
02-04-2005, 01:28 PM
To be fair, Sauerbuns never punted for Vermeil. Vermeil cut him before he got here.

Stryzinski is the one who sucked, but he punted for years in domes.

But Vermeil has some weird thing about punters. He praises guys like Hicks who suck shit, but won't bat an eyelash about freaking out about the punter.

BigChiefFan
02-04-2005, 03:46 PM
I understand where you are coming from but if we get a LB and CB in Free Agency I would like to see us grab Johnson or the Best CB. Because you don't get the oppoirtunity to draft guys like that often.
I think we both know DJ most likely won't be there when we pick. He's a TOP 10 player in the nation. As far as BA CB, I like that idea, but I think if we pick one up in FA, then a stud pass-rusher would help our team alot more. I take some solice in knowing that Gunther covets a pass-rush and he already has Allen on one side, Pollack on the other side and we could be MUCHED improved. Add to that, the two OLBers I mentioned (Burnett and Blackstock) in the draft and we are leaps and bounds better.

eazyb81
02-04-2005, 04:02 PM
That's quickly becoming THE point for me.

I've wanted a new OLB since the end of the season, but the more I read Fox' scouting reports and the more I read those of guys like Boley, Burnett, etc., the more I think we've already got a quality OLB on our roster.

This could all change, but right now, I'd like to see a starting lineup of:

DRAFT
Sims
Siavii
Allen

Fox
Hartwell
Fujita

Law/Surtain/Smoot
Warfield
Nickelback DRAFT

Pile
Wesley


This is exactly what I have in mind too. Everyone is saying we should draft Burnett, Blackstock, Morrison, etc. in the 2nd or 3rd round, but their scouting reports are IDENTICAL to Fox's last year. His injury in training camp hurt his chances to compete for a starting job last year, but if he is healthy and works hard in the weight room I truly believe he could be a starter next year. If we can sign a premier CB and a run-stuffing MLB like Hartwell, along with a DE and CB in the 1st and 2nd round, I think our defense could drastically improve.

Digital Takawira
02-04-2005, 05:51 PM
DRAFT
Sims
Siavii
Allen

Fox
Hartwell
Fujita

Law/Surtain/Smoot
Warfield
Nickelback DRAFT

Pile
Wesley

i love all of that except for pile. we still need another playmaking safety. draft brimmer or shazor.

eazyb81
02-04-2005, 08:41 PM
i love all of that except for pile. we still need another playmaking safety. draft brimmer or shazor.

Instead of drafting a safety, I think we could find one player already on the roster to fill in for Woods (assuming he continues to slide in performance). Besides Harts and Pile, I think a couple of our CB castoffs such as Bartee (don't laugh) and Battle could be effective safeties. Bartee's main weakness was that he wouldn't turn his head around to look at the ball, but he can lay a hit like no other. Battle played safety some in college and I think he could transfer back to the position. Basically what I'm trying to say is that between Woods, Pile, Harts, Bartee, and Battle I think we could find an adequate starter.

htismaqe
02-05-2005, 07:26 AM
i love all of that except for pile. we still need another playmaking safety. draft brimmer or shazor.

I've advocated drafting a safety, which gets me yelled at.

I don't like Shazor...I haven't seen Brimmer play.

The knock on Pile coming out of college was that he occasionally got burned (as does every DB) but that he let it affect him for several plays afterwards -- IOW, he could go a whole game shutting everybody down, but if he got burned once, he usually then got burned repeatedly for the rest of the game.

That can be coached out of him, especially by Gunther. Other than that, his scouting reports all say "ideal size, ideal speed" and remember - he was a VERY productive college safety. He started over 30 games and in his senior season had over 100 tackles with 4 INTs.