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Baby Lee
02-07-2005, 04:24 PM
I'm trying to set up a new computer for my father and am having a dickens of a time with the OS install.

Here are the particulars.

Motherboard - Soyo SY-P4RC350
Processor - Intel Celeron D 320, 2.4 GHz, 533 FSB, 265Kb L2 Cache
Hard Drive - Western Digital 200Gb, 7200 RPM, 8 Mb Cache
DVD-RW Drive - Digital Max 16x DVD Dual Drive
Video Card - ATI Radeon 9100 Pro [on board]
------------ATI All in Wonder Radeon 8500DV [AGP] - this is the one I'm using.

OS - Windows 2000 CD boot, CD install [later tried XP Pro to similar luck]

I should also mention that he bought a cheapie case with an Austin 300W ATX power supply. I initially thought that might be the problem, so I swapped in my own Q-Max 350W power supply. No better luck there either.

-----

Anyways to the problem.

I use the WD bootable CD to partition the HD to the 137 GB limit the OS has until you install SP3-4.
I then restart with the Win2K bootable CD. It goes through it's initial file xfer and goes to "starting windows 2000." I get the initial pages about accepting the EULA and what partition I want to install the OS on just fine. Then it starts installing files [the blue DOS screen with the yellow progress meter]. Then around the time it's copying 'digimon.dll" it starts saying the read failed. Then the read failures come hot and heavy, until I get a different blue screen with a 'DRIVER_IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL' error, a bunch of reference #s and an instruction to check bios, disable new hardware, etc.
I've tried;
changing power supply
unplugging chassis fans and taking case sides off instead [to lessen power supply load]
changing from AGP card video to onboard video
changing IDE cables [several times]
putting both DVD and HD on the same primary IDE cable.
futtering with master/slave and cable select in most all iterations.
swapping out my dad's DVD writer for my own Liteon 811S.
Letting W2k format/partition the drive instead of the WD software.

Each time, I get the same problem.

Also, I used my own XP Pro installation CD instead. It would either [at around the same point in the installation process], restart the system right in the middle of file xfer, or come up with a 'xxxx file corrupt' message screen.

Also, on the off chance the CDs actually both crapped out at the same time, I successfully installed both OSes on a clean HD I have in my own ASUS P4-2.4G system.

I'm usually pretty good at applying the scientific method to diagnosing computer problems, but I'm out of ideas. Anyone have a direction I should go?

As I write, I came up with another avenue. Perhaps I shouldn't designate that the OS will be W2K SP3-4 when the WD software partitions. Since I'm installing W2K pre-SP4, then adding on with SP4 afterwards. I'll reassemble the other PC and let you know if that works. Otherwise, I welcome all input.

Thanks in advance.

Phobia
02-07-2005, 04:43 PM
Have you tried putting the "clean HD" from your 2.4G system into the 'puter in question? There might be a write problem on the WD HD.

Baby Lee
02-07-2005, 05:02 PM
Have you tried putting the "clean HD" from your 2.4G system into the 'puter in question? There might be a write problem on the WD HD.
No I haven't. Had thought about it, but haven't done it yet.

Baby Lee
02-07-2005, 05:07 PM
Tried partitioning without the SP3-4 box ticked, and got shut down even faster. After the 'ENTER' to setup W2K, it immediately goes to

** STOP" 0x00000050 (0xE105E1A0,0x00000001, 0x80469E1B,0x00000001) PAGE_DEFAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA

** Address 80469E1B base at 80400000, DateStamp 3975dfdf - ntoskrnl.exe

Baby Lee
02-07-2005, 05:09 PM
No I haven't. Had thought about it, but haven't done it yet.
Also;
This HD is holding the OS I'm posting from right now.
I'm asceer't that putting my good HD into that devil system will kill it too.

Saulbadguy
02-07-2005, 05:22 PM
Try swapping out your memory.

Phobia
02-07-2005, 06:16 PM
Try swapping out your memory.

Yup. Something is really goofy. Memory could be the culprit.

Have you been through the bios with a fine toothed comb? Restored bios defaults for grins?

nmt1
02-08-2005, 11:07 AM
Don't know if you're still having problems but it sounds like a hard drive problem to me. As Phobia suggested, try another hard drive in the PC. If it works, make sure you get a warranty replacement from WD.

Baby Lee
02-08-2005, 01:16 PM
Don't know if you're still having problems but it sounds like a hard drive problem to me. As Phobia suggested, try another hard drive in the PC. If it works, make sure you get a warranty replacement from WD.
Switched HDs last night. My working HD didn't take an OS in Dad'd system and his HD did take one in my system.
So it's down to the the MOBO, IDE interface or the memory.
I've changed everything but the MOBO and memory. I've changed the power supply, HD, IDE cables, video card, CD/DVD drive.
I've gone through the Bios with a fine toothed comb and everything appears kosher. I haven't done a Bios clear and reset yet, but will when I get a little more energy.
One thing that was strange. First off, there is no place in the Bios to disable onboard video, but I assume that happens automatically when the AGP slot is filled. Second, when I went to the onboard video [Radeon 9200], when the errors started showing up, the video when wonky too. Just a plain blue screen with random blacked out squares.
The MOBO is brand new. The memory is a brand new pair of 512MB PC-3200 DIMMs.

Phobia
02-08-2005, 01:18 PM
I've seen bios incompatibility with OS's. You may wish to check with the mobo manufacturer to see if they've had any other issues reported.

Saulbadguy
02-08-2005, 01:20 PM
Make sure the timings for your memory are set correctly. Also, try flashing the BIOS with the latest firmware. I'd alsy try switching out the memory with some known good memory. Just being brand new doesn't necessarily mean its good.

morphius
02-08-2005, 01:53 PM
Also, if you have more then one DIMM, try one and then the other.

HW issues are such a pain.

Personally I would unplug everything not needed, take out the new video card and everything else, make sure the settings are right in the BIOS for your RAM and the HD and try again. It sounds like you tried switching cables, so that doesn't appear to be the issue.

yuck!

nmt1
02-09-2005, 08:29 AM
Switched HDs last night. My working HD didn't take an OS in Dad'd system and his HD did take one in my system.
So it's down to the the MOBO, IDE interface or the memory.
I've changed everything but the MOBO and memory. I've changed the power supply, HD, IDE cables, video card, CD/DVD drive.
I've gone through the Bios with a fine toothed comb and everything appears kosher. I haven't done a Bios clear and reset yet, but will when I get a little more energy.
One thing that was strange. First off, there is no place in the Bios to disable onboard video, but I assume that happens automatically when the AGP slot is filled. Second, when I went to the onboard video [Radeon 9200], when the errors started showing up, the video when wonky too. Just a plain blue screen with random blacked out squares.
The MOBO is brand new. The memory is a brand new pair of 512MB PC-3200 DIMMs.

Sounds like MOBO to me. If it's brand new, you should be able to get the manufacturer to replace it under warranty. You could try taking it back to the store, unless of course you bought it online.
Try what Morphius said regarding the memory but I'd be surprised if the memory is the problem.

HC_Chief
02-09-2005, 09:46 AM
Ensure your CPU and memory clock multipliers are properly set. If set too high (overclocked), you'll get funky results like the ones you've listed.

Baby Lee
02-09-2005, 12:19 PM
Try swapping out your memory.
Saul wins. The second DIMM slot on the MOBO was FUBAR in it's alignment. The retainers snapped into place and the DIMM felt seated, but it wasn't seated completely. Interestingly enough, the BIOS registered 1024MB OK, but the OS recognized that the memory wasn't properly seated.
In course of discovering this, I took out the second DIMM, to run with just 512MB. OS installed fine. Then I put the second DIMM back in. The system kept restarting. Took both out, and put the DIMM from the second seat into the primary seat alone. OS started fine. Went to put the DIMM [originally from the primary seat] back into the secondary seat and the retaining clip popped off the MOBO into my hand. Gingerly, I replaced the retaining clip and shoved the DIMM into the seat [with authority!!!]. Now things look kosher.

Saulbadguy
02-09-2005, 12:23 PM
Saul wins. The second DIMM slot on the MOBO was FUBAR in it's alignment. The retainers snapped into place and the DIMM felt seated, but it wasn't seated completely. Interestingly enough, the BIOS registered 1024MB OK, but the OS recognized that the memory wasn't properly seated.
In course of discovering this, I took out the second DIMM, to run with just 512MB. OS installed fine. Then I put the second DIMM back in. The system kept restarting. Took both out, and put the DIMM from the second seat into the primary seat alone. OS started fine. Went to put the DIMM [originally from the primary seat] back into the secondary seat and the retaining clip popped off the MOBO into my hand. Gingerly, I replaced the retaining clip and shoved the DIMM into the seat [with authority!!!]. Now things look kosher.
Sweet. Kosher. Mmmm...hydrox.

Glad you got it resolved, those problems are frustrating.

Baby Lee
02-09-2005, 02:15 PM
Sweet. Kosher. Mmmm...hydrox.

Glad you got it resolved, those problems are frustrating.
Might have spoken too soon. Now I have a situation where, if either DIMM is in the primary slot alone, the system is stable. But if both slots are filled, regardless of which DIMM is in which slot, it's highly unstable. Half the time it soft restarts before the OS is opened. The other half, it gives you a memory error as soon as you try to do anything. And the BIOS still keeps saying 1024MB OK.

Saulbadguy
02-09-2005, 02:24 PM
Is it a dual channel board? Are both DIMM's the same speed?

If so, are they the same speed/make/model/brand/etc? Identical DIMMS are the best in a dual channel application.

chiefz
02-09-2005, 02:27 PM
Might have spoken too soon. Now I have a situation where, if either DIMM is in the primary slot alone, the system is stable. But if both slots are filled, regardless of which DIMM is in which slot, it's highly unstable. Half the time it soft restarts before the OS is opened. The other half, it gives you a memory error as soon as you try to do anything. And the BIOS still keeps saying 1024MB OK.

Take a look in the book, sometimes main boards will take odd sizes depending on the chips you are putting in.

Sometimes if they have 4 slots you will need to populate slot 1 and slot 3 leaving 2 and 4 open.

Outside of that I would say send back the mainboard, you have a bad memory slot.

Saulbadguy
02-09-2005, 02:27 PM
Sometimes if they have 4 slots you will need to populate slot 1 and slot 3 leaving 2 and 4 open.

Yeah, I forgot to mention that. Usually though when I filled 1 and 2, the machine wouldn't even boot up.

chiefz
02-09-2005, 02:32 PM
Sometimes if they have 4 slots you will need to populate slot 1 and slot 3 leaving 2 and 4 open.

Yeah, I forgot to mention that. Usually though when I filled 1 and 2, the machine wouldn't even boot up.

Just throwing things out there, it has been a while since I have worked on PC related issues.

I have seen times when it wouldn't boot, times when it would boot to an error and times when it would boot, count up the right memory size and then blow its wad a few minutes after startup.

I suppose that depends on numerous things. :hmmm:

Baby Lee
02-09-2005, 02:38 PM
Only 2 slots. Only 2 DIMMS. Both Wintec 512 MB PC 3200 DDR. Bought at same time from Newegg.

chiefz
02-09-2005, 02:46 PM
Only 2 slots. Only 2 DIMMS. Both Wintec 512 MB PC 3200 DDR. Bought at same time from Newegg.

Will it support 2 512MB DIMMS?

I know that sounds silly but perhaps the max per slot is 256MB?

If not it seems the obvious problem is the second slot in the mainboard.

Baby Lee
02-09-2005, 03:01 PM
Will it support 2 512MB DIMMS?

I know that sounds silly but perhaps the max per slot is 256MB?

If not it seems the obvious problem is the second slot in the mainboard.
2 slots, up to 1G per.

Phobia
02-09-2005, 03:03 PM
I'll bet you bent some contacts with your misaligned 2nd slot. Look closely with a magnifying glass. See if you can bend them back with tweezers or needlenose. If not, you'll need a new mobo.

Baby Lee
03-03-2005, 07:44 PM
I'll bet you bent some contacts with your misaligned 2nd slot. Look closely with a magnifying glass. See if you can bend them back with tweezers or needlenose. If not, you'll need a new mobo.
All right, here's the deal now. I sent the unit back to Soyo on an RMA. They got it on the 22 of February and said the replacement would be mailed and get to me 5-7 business days later. No movement as of yesterday on the RMA status page so I called them. Said, they were backordered, but just got some in, mine would mail first thing this morning. Then, an hour after their business hours closed they send an e-mail saying the slot was damaged and I owed another $35 for a replacement. The sent the picture below

I do not doubt that it was physically damaged, but I know I didn't do it. That was the reason I returned it in the first place. I've built dozens of computers and taken out and installed hundreds of DIMM chips. I know how to be careful. And like I said earlier, I did the slide and snap procedure, only their retaining bracket was misaligned too.
This is a cheapo MOBO that was bundled with a 2.4 Celeron processor ($69 for the both) during the day after X-mas supersales. So it's not even worth the 35 in the first place, let alone again, PLUS the 7.00 to ship it, and the 5.00 to ship it back. Dad could've gotten a much better [and non-Soyo] board with an additional $50 invested. I think they are just trying to recoup their rebate expenditures, or strong arm me.
So what are my recourses? Anyone done battle with these shitwits before? Can I expect them to be receptive to a reasoned rebuttal to their position? Can I expect to be told to blow it out my azz?

Saulbadguy
03-03-2005, 07:50 PM
Cut your losses. Shop at newegg. I've RMA'd equipment i've fried (overclocked) to them, and they replaced it, no questions asked. Unless this is where you bought it from...


As for brands, Abit, Asus, Intel.

unlurking
03-03-2005, 10:31 PM
Cut your losses. Shop at newegg. I've RMA'd equipment i've fried (overclocked) to them, and they replaced it, no questions asked. Unless this is where you bought it from...


As for brands, Abit, Asus, Intel.
As for your loss, sorry, but I agre with Saul. Newegg has a good rep for a reason, they take care of their customers.

As for brand recommendations, I'd add Epox and Iwill.

I have never (out of close to 100) had an Epox fail, and the Iwill's just seem to have the best "bang for the buck" IMO.

Baby Lee
03-04-2005, 02:37 PM
Whatta bunch of fuquetards.

Called this morned 10:45 CST. Went through automation to RMA department, got VM. Called back to operator, she said no one was back there as they didn't open until 8:30 PST. Last I looked 10:45 CST was AFTER 8:30 PST. So I asked if there was anyone I could talk to. What do you mean? Are there any managers or anyone with authority to speak on behalf of the company. No, call back in 10 min or so and the RMA people should be in.

Called back 11:05. Got the RMA person. Recited the e-mail back to me verbatim. Put me on hold twice, then told me that the tech people weren't there, could I call back in an hour. I asked if there was anyone in the entire company who had authority I could talk to with authority to act. You mean like a manager? Yeah that'd do, if they have authority. Well call the operator and see if she knows anyone. Can you connect me? No.

Called the operator again. Asked for a manager, she forwarded me BACK to the RMA department, who now wasn't answering the phone, back to the operator. Hemmed and hawed until she said she'd send me to the manager [what I'd asked for so much earlier]. I told her I didn't want VM. Of course that's where I ended up.

Back to the operator, now she's automatically dumping me into VM, but by now I'd figured out how to escape VM so I'd so back and she'd dump, I'd go back and she'd dump. Then she took to lifting the cradle and putting it back down, hanging up on me without answering.

Went around like this 'til noon. Gave up and left a strongly worded message with the manager's VM and request to call back promptly.

Come 3:00 and nothing. So I call back again. Operator is still dumping me into VM. RMA is still dumping me into VM. SO I go online and find another number of the RMA department. Finally get an answer, finally get the manager on the phone. Lay into him, and viola, they're sending me a replacement unit, mailing today.

unlurking
03-04-2005, 02:44 PM
Gratz!

What was the name of the company?

Baby Lee
03-04-2005, 02:48 PM
Gratz!

What was the name of the company?
SOYO

Saulbadguy
03-04-2005, 03:07 PM
You can buy from SOYO Direct? Hmm.

I had a similar experience with a bad motherboard. It was fubar, so I called to get an RMA. The "Guy who does RMA's" was on Jury duty, so I had to wait. Kept calling over a 3 week period, and when I finally get a hold of the "guy who does RMA's", he tells me "Sorry, 30 day period is over. Contact the manufacturer."

:cuss:

I did contact the manufacturer though. ASUS sent cross shipped with me, and everything worked out.

Baby Lee
03-04-2005, 03:14 PM
You can buy from SOYO Direct? Hmm.

I had a similar experience with a bad motherboard. It was fubar, so I called to get an RMA. The "Guy who does RMA's" was on Jury duty, so I had to wait. Kept calling over a 3 week period, and when I finally get a hold of the "guy who does RMA's", he tells me "Sorry, 30 day period is over. Contact the manufacturer."

:cuss:

I did contact the manufacturer though. ASUS sent cross shipped with me, and everything worked out.
No, dealing with Soyo was on me. Pops bought the MOBO, Case and Chip during the day after X-mas sales at Microcenter. He wanted to put it together, but mom and I showed him the closet of unfinished projects [also, I was trading out my video card to him and putting in one I got that day too in mine], so I took it back with me to St. Louis, only I didn't get around to assembling it until Feb. Took me a week to find out what was wrong. By that time, Microcenter's 30 policy was up, and besides they were still all the way across the state.

Baby Lee
03-04-2005, 03:16 PM
I did contact the manufacturer though. ASUS sent cross shipped with me, and everything worked out.
What ASUS do you have? I use the P4PE and, aside from the 4x AGP bus, I LOVE it. Onboard gigabit LAN. Onboard 5.1. Onboard firewire, 6 USB 2.0 slots, onboard Raid. SATA. 4 PC-2700 slots. Kickass seabass.

Saulbadguy
03-04-2005, 04:02 PM
What ASUS do you have? I use the P4PE and, aside from the 4x AGP bus, I LOVE it. Onboard gigabit LAN. Onboard 5.1. Onboard firewire, 6 USB 2.0 slots, onboard Raid. SATA. 4 PC-2700 slots. Kickass seabass.
The P4PE is what I had before I upgraded to the Abit IC7-G.

Baby Lee
03-11-2005, 09:29 AM
OK, I got the MoBo back, put everything back together. When I boot into Win2K the CPU is constantly at 100% load. Everything is mega slow as a result. If I boot to WinPE [by CD-Rom], CPU usage is just 4% or so. I thought maybe things were just set up wrong, so I wiped the HD and reinstalled. Still at 100% CPU usage. Also, the install took 10% as long.
Four observations, I'll let you judge the relevance.
First, the CPU/Cooler interface had paste between them. I didn't disturb, but also didn't replace the paste on reinstallation.
Second, the ZIF slot was not totally zero insertion force. I had to jiggle the latch a little to get the CPU to fall into the pin holes.
Third, while in WinPE some of the system checking programs gave info on AGP. A couple said the AGP bus was not enabled. But I don't see anything in the Bios to disable/enagle the bus, and in Win2K, the AIW 8500 is shown to be working properly.
Finally, the system hangs on a CD Rom boot if a program calls up the Atapi driver.

Baby Lee
03-11-2005, 11:25 AM
'System Idle Process' seems to be the culprit, using up to 99% of the CPU, while using only 16K of memory.

EDIT: OK I see that SIP is just a placeholder, and it's normal for it to be high when the PC is doing much, but still the CPU utilization is always up around 100%. And it's certainly sluggish, especially considering it's just the bare OS on the HD right now.

DenverChief
03-17-2005, 12:09 AM
Problem solved.......


















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