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View Full Version : Denny Thum will be on Grunhard's show


keg in kc
03-02-2005, 08:01 AM
No time given, sometime between now and 11.

Bob Dole
03-02-2005, 08:04 AM
This thread is worthless without pics.

http://www.kcchiefs.com/media/staff/denny_thum.jpg

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 08:06 AM
It's worthless with pics, too.

BigChiefFan
03-02-2005, 08:07 AM
Said there will be more information on Surtain in a little while.

BigChiefFan
03-02-2005, 08:09 AM
Grunhard is making it sound like we don't want to give up the 2nd rounder, but we really want Surtain. Great reporting, Grunny.

nmt1
03-02-2005, 08:09 AM
He shouldn't be going on radio shows, he should be signing players. Doesn't he realize that the fans will be upset if they don't sign someone on the first day of free agency? It's obvious Thum doesn't care about improving the team.

tomahawk kid
03-02-2005, 08:11 AM
He shouldn't be going on radio shows, he should be signing players. Doesn't he realize that the fans will be upset if they don't sign someone on the first day of free agency? It's obvious Thum doesn't care about improving the team.

ROFL

Bob Dole
03-02-2005, 08:18 AM
He shouldn't be going on radio shows, he should be signing players. Doesn't he realize that the fans will be upset if they don't sign someone on the first day of free agency? It's obvious Thum doesn't care about improving the team.

http://www.kcchiefs.com/media/staff/denny_thum.jpg

No shit! Look at him.

He's not even moving. Just sitting there completely immobile with a shit-eating grin.

Our front office is full of puppets.

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 08:19 AM
Grunhard is making it sound like we don't want to give up the 2nd rounder, but we really want Surtain. Great reporting, Grunny.And not 10 minutes after Teicher says that Surtain isn't the #1 guy on our radar, that we really want Rolle.

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 08:20 AM
Jay Glazer is on 810 right now.

jspchief
03-02-2005, 08:25 AM
What station is Grunhard on? I can get one of them streaming.

Cochise
03-02-2005, 08:27 AM
So grunny says that we'd like to have one of the best corners in the league but are reluctant to lose draft picks.

That's some hard-hitting insight you can't get just anywhere.

BigChiefFan
03-02-2005, 08:29 AM
So grunny says that we'd like to have one of the best corners in the league but are reluctant to lose draft picks.

That's some hard-hitting insight you can't get just anywhere.
He's on the fast track to a 60 minutes gig. :p

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 08:30 AM
What station is Grunhard on? I can get one of them streaming.

610 KCSP. 610 doesn't stream but 810 does.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:10 AM
Thum: Rolle is coming here. Trotter and Hartwell are coming today. They were called at 12:01 am

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 09:10 AM
Breaking news: Hartwell and Trotter will BOTH be here today.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:11 AM
Thum: Trotter is a leader. They spoke with him last night. He wants to come to KC to be with Gun and likes the defenses that he runs.

Stinger
03-02-2005, 09:13 AM
For someone who can't get 610 could you clarify

Thum: Rolle is coming here

He is not coming today?

Trotter and Hartwell are coming today. They were called at 12:01 am

Sweet :thumb:

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:14 AM
Thum: Really focused on a Gunther type of player.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:14 AM
For someone who can't get 610 could you clarify



He is not coming today?



Sweet :thumb:

Rolle is coming today with his wife.

Stinger
03-02-2005, 09:15 AM
Rolle is coming today with his wife.

Thanks :thumb:

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:16 AM
Thum: CP and Thum met with the Dolphins GM and Surtains agent at the combine. Dolphins asking for 2nd round choice plus they want to extend Surtain's contract. They are in the discussion stage right now but are looking at all of the options.

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 09:16 AM
Rolle is coming today with his wife.I found that to be quite interesting. Facing the recent character problem head on.

Stinger
03-02-2005, 09:17 AM
Thum: Really focused on a Gunther type of player.

Well if he means it that is great news

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:17 AM
Thum: Alot of depth at CB in the draft that is what is being discussed right now on whether to trade for Surtain or not.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:18 AM
Thum: Focusing on LB's and CB's and also WR's.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:19 AM
Very good interview and he gave us alot of great info. I hope when CP goes he will become our GM. Very likable guy.

The Bad Guy
03-02-2005, 09:22 AM
I also hope Thum is the GM when CP leaves. When he is put in charge of deals, he gets them done.

I hope that is the case today. I absolutely want Trotter as a Chief.

Trotter and Rolle would be amazing to start off with.

BigChiefFan
03-02-2005, 09:39 AM
That was one of the most encouraging interviews I've heard in along time. Sounds like they are motivated to get Gunther his guys.

Woodrow Call
03-02-2005, 09:40 AM
I am very excited about Trotter and Hartwell. I believe that the LBs are a bigger concern than CBs. Could you imagine Fujita, Trotter, Gold as our LBs? That would be great. :thumb:

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:40 AM
That was one of the most encouraging interviews I've heard in along time. Sounds like they are motivated to get Gunther his guys.

Yep I am officially pumped for the start of the NFL season.

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 09:41 AM
I think I'd take Hartwell over Trotter, but we don't lose either way regardless of who we sign. I still think, though, that we desperately need a LB who has the capability to play on all 3 downs. We definitely don't get that with Trotter, and maybe not with Hartwell, either. I'm really starting to think Ian Gold might be a guy we need (in addition to Hartwell/Trotter), but I don't know how we could afford a high priced corner, a high priced LB and a second mid- to high-priced LB.

milkman
03-02-2005, 09:42 AM
I also hope Thum is the GM when CP leaves. When he is put in charge of deals, he gets them done.

I hope that is the case today. I absolutely want Trotter as a Chief.

Trotter and Rolle would be amazing to start off with.

It would be amazing, but I wouldn't get my hopes up.
It's only the 1st day of FA, and the Chiefs would have to put together an incredible offer to get anyone signed before they visit other cities.

I know I'm stating the obvious, but I'm just to keep it all in perspective.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:43 AM
I think I'd take Hartwell over Trotter, but we don't lose either way regardless of who we sign. I still think, though, that we desperately need a LB who has the capability to play on all 3 downs. We definitely don't get that with Trotter, and maybe not with Hartwell, either. I'm really starting to think Ian Gold might be a guy we need (in addition to Hartwell/Trotter), but I don't know how we could afford a high priced corner, a high priced LB and a second mid- to high-priced LB.

Great point. I am starting also to lean in favor of signing Gold. Of course Gold is an OLB while Trotter/Hartwell are MLB's.

Wile_E_Coyote
03-02-2005, 09:44 AM
Philadelphia Inquirer (registration required): "A league source said last night that Sexton has informed Trotter that he is probably going to have to go elsewhere if he wants to sign the kind of deal he is looking for. Two league sources have said that the Kansas City Chiefs are prepared to make an offer to Trotter."

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:44 AM
It would be amazing, but I wouldn't get my hopes up.
It's only the 1st day of FA, and the Chiefs would have to put together an incredible offer to get anyone signed before they visit other cities.

I know I'm stating the obvious, but I'm just to keep it all in perspective.

I think they will have at least 1 signed by today and I think it will be Hartwell or Rolle.

Bob Dole
03-02-2005, 09:46 AM
Thum: Trotter is a leader. They spoke with him last night. He wants to come to KC to be with Gun and likes the defenses that he runs.

JT has Bob Dole's seal of approval. That should be enough for them to pull the trigger.

milkman
03-02-2005, 09:46 AM
I think I'd take Hartwell over Trotter, but we don't lose either way regardless of who we sign. I still think, though, that we desperately need a LB who has the capability to play on all 3 downs. We definitely don't get that with Trotter, and maybe not with Hartwell, either. I'm really starting to think Ian Gold might be a guy we need (in addition to Hartwell/Trotter), but I don't know how we could afford a high priced corner, a high priced LB and a second mid- to high-priced LB.

The Redskins Pierce would be a better choice than Gold, since Gold is an OLB, and Pierce is MLB.

But I'd take any of these guys.

But if Gold were the only LB we signed, we'd need a MLB in the draft.

petegz28
03-02-2005, 09:47 AM
Trotter over Hartwell. Trotter has experience in the 4-3. Hartwell doesn't. Not to say Hartwell would be bad. But between the 2 give me Trotter.

milkman
03-02-2005, 09:47 AM
I think they will have at least 1 signed by today and I think it will be Hartwell or Rolle.

That would be awesome, and a freakin' great start, if it happens!

Mr. Kotter
03-02-2005, 09:47 AM
The Redskins Pierce would be a better choice than Gold, since Gold is an OLB, and Pierce is MLB.

But I'd take any of these guys.

But if Gold were the only LB we signed, we'd need a MLB in the draft.

Sounds like the Redskins are gonna resign Pierce, come hell or high water....

SideWinder--who did you USE to be? :hmmm:

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:47 AM
The Redskins Pierce would be a better choice than Gold, since Gold is an OLB, and Pierce is MLB.

But I'd take any of these guys.

But if Gold were the only LB we signed, we'd need a MLB in the draft.

I like the idea of signing Gold and it appears he wants to come here. This would be a good signing since Barber will be out at least half the season.

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 09:49 AM
The Redskins Pierce would be a better choice than Gold, since Gold is an OLB, and Pierce is MLB.You misunderstand me, I think we need an OLB at least as much as we need a MLB. Right now we have Beisel, Caver, Fox and Fujita (Barber won't be ready). I don't see anyone other than Fujita as starting material in that group. While there's no doubt we need an improvement in play at MLB, I think we need a weakside backer in the worst way, not only for base defense, but for both nickel and dime packages. And I think Gold is that guy.

milkman
03-02-2005, 09:51 AM
Sounds like the Redskins are gonna resign Pierce, come hell or high water....

SideWinder--who did you USE to be? :hmmm:.

Read my sig

Kclee
03-02-2005, 09:51 AM
I like the idea of signing Gold and it appears he wants to come here.



Where did you hear that?

Coogs
03-02-2005, 09:51 AM
I like the idea of signing Gold and it appears he wants to come here. This would be a good signing since Barber will be out at least half the season.


Doesn't Gold play the same spot as Fujita. That is what the Tampa Bay and Chiefs depth charts at nfl.com show. A LB corp of Gold SLB, Trotter MLB, and rookie Johnson from Texas at WLB would be nice.

Kclee
03-02-2005, 09:52 AM
You misunderstand me, I think we need an OLB at least as much as we need a MLB. Right now we have Beisel, Caver, Fox and Fujita (Barber won't be ready). I don't see anyone other than Fujita as starting material in that group. While there's no doubt we need an improvement in play at MLB, I think we need a weakside backer in the worst way, not only for base defense, but for both nickel and dime packages. And I think Gold is that guy.



Totally agree.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:52 AM
Where did you hear that?

During the interview with Adam Teicher. Apparently last year he wanted to come here but the Chiefs were reluctant to sign him because of his injury but now they are going to take a strong look at him.

Kclee
03-02-2005, 09:54 AM
During the interview with Adam Teicher. Apparently last year he wanted to come here but the Chiefs were reluctant to sign him because of his injury but now they are going to take a strong look at him.


Nice. Thanks.

Chiefnj
03-02-2005, 09:54 AM
I don't know why, but I've got a feeling Trotter would really prefer to stay with the Eagles and might be using KC like many other have in recent years. It's part of the game.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 09:54 AM
Doesn't Gold play the same spot as Fujita. That is what the Tampa Bay and Chiefs depth charts at nfl.com show. A LB corp of Gold SLB, Trotter MLB, and rookie Johnson from Texas at WLB would be nice.

Your probably right. Now that starting LB core gets me pumped but I would like Hartwell first instead of Trotter.

Woodrow Call
03-02-2005, 09:55 AM
Doesn't Gold play the same spot as Fujita. That is what the Tampa Bay and Chiefs depth charts at nfl.com show. A LB corp of Gold SLB, Trotter MLB, and rookie Johnson from Texas at WLB would be nice.

Your probably right on that. Your LB corp would cure a lot of problems. :thumb: I am getting excited.

milkman
03-02-2005, 09:55 AM
You misunderstand me, I think we need an OLB at least as much as we need a MLB. Right now we have Beisel, Caver, Fox and Fujita (Barber won't be ready). I don't see anyone other than Fujita as starting material in that group. While there's no doubt we need an improvement in play at MLB, I think we need a weakside backer in the worst way, not only for base defense, but for both nickel and dime packages. And I think Gold is that guy.

I agree, we do need OLB help.
But I'd rather spend the big bucks at MLB, who is, or should be, the defensive leader.

I'd get the OLB in the draft, or go for a less expensive alternative like Coaksly.

htismaqe
03-02-2005, 09:59 AM
WTF are these clowns waiting for?!?!?

Hartwell and Trotter will be in KC later today and they don't already have them signed to contracts!?!>?1

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 09:59 AM
Doesn't Gold play the same spot as Fujita. That is what the Tampa Bay and Chiefs depth charts at nfl.com show. A LB corp of Gold SLB, Trotter MLB, and rookie Johnson from Texas at WLB would be nice.Gold's an undersized athletic will-type backer. The reason he played strongside in Tampa is because they already have an all-world weakside guy in Brooks.

Chiefnj
03-02-2005, 10:00 AM
I think it will be more important for the Chiefs to impress Mrs. Rolle than it is Samari. She's ruling the roost with that assault charge hanging over his head.

htismaqe
03-02-2005, 10:01 AM
Doesn't Gold play the same spot as Fujita. That is what the Tampa Bay and Chiefs depth charts at nfl.com show. A LB corp of Gold SLB, Trotter MLB, and rookie Johnson from Texas at WLB would be nice.

No, Fujita is a Sam.

Gold is a Will. And FYI, drafting Johnson and getting Gold would be a waste...THEY play the same position.

I think if we get Gold we can pretty much rule out drafting Johnson, even if he is there...

Mr. Kotter
03-02-2005, 10:01 AM
.

Read my sig

Duh. :banghead:

Thanks.

nmt1
03-02-2005, 10:02 AM
WTF are these clowns waiting for?!?!?

Hartwell and Trotter will be in KC later today and they don't already have them signed to contracts!?!>?1

Carl's obviously lowballing them.

jspchief
03-02-2005, 10:05 AM
WTF are these clowns waiting for?!?!?

Hartwell and Trotter will be in KC later today and they don't already have them signed to contracts!?!>?1

Wow, these sarcastic posts aren't getting played out at all. They are especially valuable in threads that are going along nicely.

Frosty
03-02-2005, 10:06 AM
Right now we have Beisel, Caver, Fox and Fujita (Barber won't be ready).

Actually, I think Fox is the only one we have right now. I think the rest of them are free agents (though some are restricted).

Coach
03-02-2005, 10:07 AM
Actually, I think Fox is the only one we have right now. I think the rest of them are free agents (though some are restricted).

IIRC, I think we gave Beisel and Fujita one-year tenders.

htismaqe
03-02-2005, 10:09 AM
Wow, these sarcastic posts aren't getting played out at all. They are especially valuable in threads that are going along nicely.

Yeah, like I've never seen a thread of mine that was going along nicely hijacked by the very post I've made...

:rolleyes:

the Talking Can
03-02-2005, 10:10 AM
Breaking news: Hartwell and Trotter will BOTH be here today.

some wierd white fluid just leaked into my drawers....

Bob Dole
03-02-2005, 10:10 AM
Wow, these sarcastic posts aren't getting played out at all. They are especially valuable in threads that are going along nicely.

http://www.kcchiefs.com/media/staff/denny_thum.jpg

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 10:12 AM
Actually, I think Fox is the only one we have right now. I think the rest of them are free agents (though some are restricted).They tendered Fujita, he's not going anywhere. Beisel and Caver are unrestricted.

Either way, the point I was making is that we need an OLB...

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 10:13 AM
some wierd white fluid just leaked into my drawers....Spill some milk?

I hope.

jspchief
03-02-2005, 10:16 AM
Yeah, like I've never seen a thread of mine that was going along nicely hijacked by the very post I've made...

:rolleyes: Oh. Well in that case it's funny instead of tired.

DaWolf
03-02-2005, 10:16 AM
I agree, we do need OLB help.
But I'd rather spend the big bucks at MLB, who is, or should be, the defensive leader.

And we need leadership on that defense almost as much as we need talent. That's why I'd be all for signing the guy...

milkman
03-02-2005, 10:18 AM
And we need leadership on that defense almost as much as we need talent. That's why I'd be all for signing the guy...

Exactly!

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 10:20 AM
...which is exactly why I listed MLB as the priority.

What I'm saying is that I don't think just a MLB and CB will solve the problem. We need an OLB, and I don't think we're going to resolve that in the draft. But I don't know how we can afford to get one in FA after we spend what will be huge bucks on CB and MLB.

htismaqe
03-02-2005, 10:21 AM
Oh. Well in that case it's funny instead of tired.

It's not intended to be funny.

It's intended to be repetitive.

As are the million posts about how Carl Peterson never does anything in free agency.

Frosty
03-02-2005, 10:22 AM
They tendered Fujita, he's not going anywhere. Beisel and Caver are unrestricted.

Either way, the point I was making is that we need an OLB...

Oh, I agree. I think it's pretty dire, since all the Chiefs have is an untested second year player, a restricted (unsigned) free agent and a guy that won't play much next year.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 10:22 AM
...which is exactly why I listed MLB as the priority.

What I'm saying is that I don't think just a MLB and CB will solve the problem. We need an OLB, and I don't think we're going to resolve that in the draft. But I don't know how we can afford to get one in FA after we spend what will be huge bucks on CB and MLB.

It makes me wonder how much cash Lamar is willing to spend this season and if he is saying to CP spend all you want and go for broke. It is all about the cash signing bonus (guaranteed money).

Bob Dole
03-02-2005, 10:22 AM
It's not intended to be funny.

It's intended to be repetitive.

As are the million posts about how Carl Peterson never does anything in free agency.

http://www.kcchiefs.com/media/staff/denny_thum.jpg

milkman
03-02-2005, 10:24 AM
...which is exactly why I listed MLB as the priority.

What I'm saying is that I don't think just a MLB and CB will solve the problem. We need an OLB, and I don't think we're going to resolve that in the draft. But I don't know how we can afford to get one in FA after we spend what will be huge bucks on CB and MLB.

I think for this D to make any real strides, we need to get at least 3 FA signings, 1 of which will have to be a 2nd tier type player.

Since it's pretty evident that the Chiefs are going to go all out for a top CB, and a top LB, I'd like to see the 3rd guy be a 2nd tier CB, and the OLB help to come from the draft.

nmt1
03-02-2005, 10:25 AM
http://www.kcchiefs.com/media/staff/denny_thum.jpg

htismaqe
03-02-2005, 10:25 AM
http://www.kcchiefs.com/media/staff/denny_thum.jpg

Great new name!!! ROFL

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 10:25 AM
It's not intended to be funny.

It's intended to be repetitive.

As are the million posts about how Carl Peterson never does anything in free agency.

CP didn't do anything via FA last year so maybe that is why people are skeptical. :shrug: Actions speak louder than words.

htismaqe
03-02-2005, 10:26 AM
CP didn't do anything via FA last year so maybe that is why people are skeptical. :shrug: Actions speak louder than words.

I realize they didn't do anything LAST YEAR. That doesn't make it a trend, which is what people want to make it.

nmt1
03-02-2005, 10:27 AM
CP didn't do anything via FA last year so maybe that is why people are skeptical. :shrug: Actions speak louder than words.

Wrong, all the players we signed last offseason with the exception of our draftees were free agents or potential free agents.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 10:28 AM
I realize they didn't do anything LAST YEAR. That doesn't make it a trend, which is what people want to make it.

It is the What have you done for me lately mentality. It is a trend because he did that after the 95 13-3 season as well as the 97 13-3 season.

WilliamTheIrish
03-02-2005, 10:29 AM
I hope we draft this guy. He's certain to break our 2nd round "bust" jinx.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 10:30 AM
Wrong, all the players we signed last offseason with the exception of our draftees were free agents or potential free agents.

If you count your own FA's yes. IIRC the only one that was someone's else FA was Dalton.

Coach
03-02-2005, 10:31 AM
WTI ROFL

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 10:31 AM
Since it's pretty evident that the Chiefs are going to go all out for a top CB, and a top LB, I'd like to see the 3rd guy be a 2nd tier CB, and the OLB help to come from the draft.My approach would be top CB, top LB and second tier LB, then go corner in the draft, because I think the available top-level CB talent is so deep that I think it would be a mistake to go another way in the first round.

And I'm not sure what kind of money Gold would demand, he might still be do-able after signing Rolle and Hartwell/Trotter. :shrug:

Coogs
03-02-2005, 10:32 AM
No, Fujita is a Sam.

Gold is a Will. And FYI, drafting Johnson and getting Gold would be a waste...THEY play the same position.

I think if we get Gold we can pretty much rule out drafting Johnson, even if he is there...

OK, I didn't know. The depth charts for both the Buccs and Chiefs have Gold and Fujita playing LOLB. I just figured that must be the same position.

htismaqe
03-02-2005, 10:32 AM
It is the What have you done for me lately mentality. It is a trend because he did that after the 95 13-3 season as well as the 97 13-3 season.

After the 1997 13-3 season, he GAVE UP PICKS to get Chester McGlockton.

See, this is EXACTLY what I'm talking about.

nmt1
03-02-2005, 10:34 AM
If you count your own FA's yes. IIRC the only one that was someone's else FA was Dalton.

I do count our own players as free agents when their contracts have or will expire during that offseason. If we didn't re-sign the ones we did, they would've been available for any team to sign.
Dalton, Bober, Huard, and Tynes were FA's. That doesn't include the guys we signed right after the draft like Scanlon and Richard Smith.

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 10:34 AM
It is the What have you done for me lately mentality. It is a trend because he did that after the 95 13-3 season as well as the 97 13-3 season.Uhm, correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't we go on a spending spree before the '98 season? Wasn't that the McGlockton year?

And we've spent a crapload on free agents the last few years, it just happens that many of them were our own, i.e. Holmes, Green, Gonzalez and Warfield, as well as Wesley and Woods (both signed last year). We also dished out a hearty bonus for Sims.

The idea that we don't do anything or that we don't spend money is a fallacy. We do spend money, we don't always spend it the way people want.

nmt1
03-02-2005, 10:37 AM
...we don't always spend it the way people want.

Exactly.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 10:37 AM
After the 1997 13-3 season, he GAVE UP PICKS to get Chester McGlockton.

See, this is EXACTLY what I'm talking about.

Wow 1 player on a D that was ranked #1 the year, that held 10 straignt opponents to no TD's in the 2nd half which set an NFL record when he should have tried to improve the O.

What did he do after the 95 season? Oh yeah he signed Pete Stoyanvich. WOW!

milkman
03-02-2005, 10:38 AM
My approach would be top CB, top LB and second tier LB, then go corner in the draft, because I think the available top-level CB talent is so deep that I think it would be a mistake to go another way in the first round.

And I'm not sure what kind of money Gold would demand, he might still be do-able after signing Rolle and Hartwell/Trotter. :shrug:

The fact is, our D is so pathetic in so many areas, I'm not sure ther is any wrong way to approach it.

Sign whoever you can, and draft the best D players available.
Almost anyone will be an upgade at whatever position you choose.

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 10:39 AM
The fact is, our D is so pathetic in so many areas, I'm not sure ther is any wrong way to approach it.Oh, god, don't say that. Somebody will prove you wrong.

htismaqe
03-02-2005, 10:39 AM
Wow 1 player on a D that was ranked #1 the year, that held 10 straignt opponents to no TD's in the 2nd half which set an NFL record when he should have tried to improve the O.

What did he do after the 95 season? Oh yeah he signed Pete Stoyanvich. WOW!

I love it.

The argument went from "he stood pat after 1997" to "Wow, just one player?"

Want to bring up further proof that you're wrong, just so you can change the argument again?

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 10:40 AM
Uhm, correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't we go on a spending spree before the '98 season? Wasn't that the McGlockton year?

And we've spent a crapload on free agents the last few years, it just happens that many of them were our own, i.e. Holmes, Green, Gonzalez and Warfield, as well as Wesley and Woods (both signed last year). We also dished out a hearty bonus for Sims.

The idea that we don't do anything or that we don't spend money is a fallacy. We do spend money, we don't always spend it the way people want.

I am not saying Carl doesnt sign FA's I am just saying he has a history of standing pat after successfull seasons and then goes out and spends alot of money after unsuccessull seasons. I call that a trend.

I totally agree with your last statement. He doesn't always make the best decisions but who does we are all imperfect.

nmt1
03-02-2005, 10:42 AM
I am not saying Carl doesnt sign FA's I am just saying he has a history of standing pat after successfull seasons and then goes out and spends alot of money after unsuccessull seasons. I call that a trend.

I totally agree with your last statement. He doesn't always make the best decisions but who does we are all imperfect.

So he tries to keep a successful team together and tries to retool an unsuccessful team...and that's a bad thing?

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 10:44 AM
I love it.

The argument went from "he stood pat after 1997" to "Wow, just one player?"

Want to bring up further proof that you're wrong, just so you can change the argument again?

I am in a lose-lose situation because if CP just signed Bartee last year you would point and say well he signed a FA.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 10:45 AM
So he tries to keep a successful team together and tries to retool an unsuccessful team...and that's a bad thing?

Why do you think the Patriots are so successfull? Have you not learned anything by watching them? They retool every year. If you stand pat you lose period.

htismaqe
03-02-2005, 10:46 AM
I am in a lose-lose situation because if CP just signed Bartee last year you would point and say well he signed a FA.

No, unlike NMT1, I don't consider signing your own players as being active in free agency.

What Carl did last offseason WAS sitting on his hands. My only point is that it was last offseason, not EVERY offseason.

htismaqe
03-02-2005, 10:47 AM
Why do you think the Patriots are so successfull? Have you not learned anything by watching them? They retool every year. If you stand pat you lose period.

The Patriots re-tool every year?

I'd like to hear what Amnorix or cadmonkey have to say about that...

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 10:48 AM
I am not saying Carl doesnt sign FA's I am just saying he has a history of standing pat after successfull seasons and then goes out and spends alot of money after unsuccessull seasons. I call that a trend.I think that's a matter of perception. Last year we signed several players, they just happened to be re-signings rather than new players. And they made a statement that they thought the issue was the coordinator rather than the personnel, which has been proven wrong; was clearly a combination of both.

I also think it's also difficult to justify your statement in that we've only had one successful season in the last 7 years, that being the 13-3 season (I don't care about Gunther's 9-7 year). You're going back 8 and 10 years to prove a point, talking about a different staff and a different philosophical approach for the entire football team. The Chiefs of the 90s and the Chiefs of today are drastically different, both in coaching and, I think, in front office approach. Carl is different with Vermeil than he was with Schottenheimer, I think, although the end result is the same.

I happen to think our real problem, overshadowed by all this free agent and spending talk, is that we draft horribly. We have all these holes to fill because guys we drafted to play those positions aren't getting the job done. We wouldn't be so desperate right now if we had drafted anyone who could do anything. How many years has it been since we drafted a solid starter, much less a pro bowler like Gonzalez. That to me is what's really kille dus.

nmt1
03-02-2005, 10:51 AM
Why do you think the Patriots are so successfull? Have you not learned anything by watching them? They retool every year. If you stand pat you lose period.

They don't retool every year. They let go of older guys and find younger guys who fit their system in free agency. They also draft very well. The Chiefs are as close to using the Patriot's model of building a team as any other team in the league. They haven't had the same success evaluating players in free agency and the draft as the Patriots have.

Chief Henry
03-02-2005, 10:53 AM
Now this is a CHIEFS thread worth reading and finally enjoying (maybe). I'm in the wait and see
group. Lets see what the Chiefs do during this free agency period.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 10:55 AM
The Patriots re-tool every year?

I'd like to hear what Amnorix or cadmonkey have to say about that...

What I mean by re-tool is that they don't stand pat with their roster they are always changing it some by injury and some by just making tough decisions. The Chiefs don't like to make tough decisions IMO. Maybe that goes to DV and his loyalty. :shrug:
I would like to know what percentage of their roster gets turned over I bet that it is higher than ours.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 10:57 AM
They don't retool every year. They let go of older guys and find younger guys who fit their system in free agency. They also draft very well. The Chiefs are as close to using the Patriot's model of building a team as any other team in the league. They haven't had the same success evaluating players in free agency and the draft as the Patriots have.

I totally agree with that. I think I used the wrong word, I didn't mean re-tool as rebuild which they do not do. They just don't stand pat like we did last year.

Coogs
03-02-2005, 10:57 AM
htismaqe,

You are correct. I found this a cbssportsline.com....

Gold signed with Bucs last spring after spending the first four seasons with Denver. He started 14 games at strong-side linebacker, but prefers to play on the weakside -- a spot occupied in Tampa Bay by eight-time Pro Bowl selection Derrick Brooks.

"Ian came into a situation where we didn't have a position for him. We love his talent, and he made a nice contribution playing out of position for himself," Allen said

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 11:01 AM
htismaqe,

You are correct. I found this a cbssportsline.com....

Gold signed with Bucs last spring after spending the first four seasons with Denver. He started 14 games at strong-side linebacker, but prefers to play on the weakside -- a spot occupied in Tampa Bay by eight-time Pro Bowl selection Derrick Brooks.

"Ian came into a situation where we didn't have a position for him. We love his talent, and he made a nice contribution playing out of position for himself," Allen said

So if we sign Gold he would replace Barber is that correct?

nmt1
03-02-2005, 11:01 AM
I totally agree with that. I think I used the wrong word, I didn't mean re-tool as rebuild which they do not do. They just don't stand pat like we did last year.

Well, IMO, we didn't stand pat last year. They made a decision to re-sign the players they signed. We hired a new defensive coordinator, which everyone here thought was great, and signed Dalton. They didn't go out there and pay $16 million for Jevon Kearse. That's what most around here would consider not standing pat.

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 11:02 AM
So if we sign Gold he would replace Barber is that correct?Yeps.

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 11:04 AM
Well, IMO, we didn't stand pat last year. They made a decision to re-sign the players they signed. We hired a new defensive coordinator, which everyone here thought was great, and signed Dalton. They didn't go out there and pay $16 million for Jevon Kearse. That's what most around here would consider not standing pat.

We will have to agree to disagree on this. I loved bringing Gun in but as I said last offseason we needed to upgrade the talent as well. We also needed to replace some coaches just like we need to do this year but it looks like that won't happen as well.

Chris Meck
03-02-2005, 11:17 AM
I think Keg's right.

IF Sims, Mitchell, Bartee, or even Freeman had developed to the point that they justified their draft position, we'd be in FAR less trouble right now than we are. The only high draft pick that's worked out in the last few years is Larry Johnson-and up until mid-season last year, everyone had chalked him up as a loss as well.

The Patriots, meanwhile, find all-world quarterbacks in the fifth round, and starting corners in undrafted free agents. All of their early picks pan out like they were supposed to, and then they find aging vets that will sign cheap and have just a couple of years left in the tank, ala Harrison.

The Patriots' talent evaluation is truly astounding. Their systems (on all sides of the ball) ask for specific skills in players, and they do a great job of going out and getting players that fit those roles perfectly.

The Chiefs, meanwhile, have not-and it's important to note that Robinson tried to force square pegs into round holes; he would've needed very fast, very smart players in the back seven and a dominant front four for his scheme to work. He didn't have that, but insisted on playing that way anyway. Players that the Chiefs drafted to fit THAT scheme didn't pan out. So we hired Gun, and the players he inherited can't run his scheme either. Now we'll try and patch guys in as quick as we can, but unless we do a better job of talent evaluation, nothing is going to work.

I think we need ONE starting corner, another young corner with upside to man the nickel spot (and Warfield's spot for his suspension) and an aggressive veteran leader at MLB. In all likelihood, we shall be able to afford only a Surtain/Smoot/Rolle type AND a Hartwell/Trotter type. SOMEONE from the bunch of corner projects is going to have to step up (or a draftee from this year) and SOMEONE from the bunch of LB projects (or a draftee from this year) is going to have to get it done.

Chris

keg in kc
03-02-2005, 11:19 AM
I think Keg's right.Definitely the most intelligent statement I've heard all day. Almost rep-worthy!

DaWolf
03-02-2005, 11:24 AM
Uhm, correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't we go on a spending spree before the '98 season? Wasn't that the McGlockton year?

I think it was also the year we got in a pissing match with Dan Williams. Which as it turned out, wasn't a bad move. Too bad it ended the next year...

dirk digler
03-02-2005, 11:34 AM
I think Keg's right.

IF Sims, Mitchell, Bartee, or even Freeman had developed to the point that they justified their draft position, we'd be in FAR less trouble right now than we are. The only high draft pick that's worked out in the last few years is Larry Johnson-and up until mid-season last year, everyone had chalked him up as a loss as well.

The Patriots, meanwhile, find all-world quarterbacks in the fifth round, and starting corners in undrafted free agents. All of their early picks pan out like they were supposed to, and then they find aging vets that will sign cheap and have just a couple of years left in the tank, ala Harrison.

The Patriots' talent evaluation is truly astounding. Their systems (on all sides of the ball) ask for specific skills in players, and they do a great job of going out and getting players that fit those roles perfectly.

The Chiefs, meanwhile, have not-and it's important to note that Robinson tried to force square pegs into round holes; he would've needed very fast, very smart players in the back seven and a dominant front four for his scheme to work. He didn't have that, but insisted on playing that way anyway. Players that the Chiefs drafted to fit THAT scheme didn't pan out. So we hired Gun, and the players he inherited can't run his scheme either. Now we'll try and patch guys in as quick as we can, but unless we do a better job of talent evaluation, nothing is going to work.

I think we need ONE starting corner, another young corner with upside to man the nickel spot (and Warfield's spot for his suspension) and an aggressive veteran leader at MLB. In all likelihood, we shall be able to afford only a Surtain/Smoot/Rolle type AND a Hartwell/Trotter type. SOMEONE from the bunch of corner projects is going to have to step up (or a draftee from this year) and SOMEONE from the bunch of LB projects (or a draftee from this year) is going to have to get it done.

Chris


Great post. :thumb:

Wallcrawler
03-02-2005, 11:55 AM
I hope they go for a starting CB, and MLB first and foremost.

As for OLB, Id love to see them draft Derrick Johnson out of Texas, but Ive been watching his performances in the combine, and this guy is most likely top 10 material right here. He's done well in every drill he has participated in, and looked very good.

I doubt that he is there at 15 when the Chiefs pick.

If they could get Ian Gold without breaking the bank on him, it would be good, especially considering Barber's injury status right now. If he starts the season on the PUP list, thats 6 weeks right there.

Warfields suspension is for the first month, so already we're out one of our starting CBs, and a starting linebacker for a month solid before we get Warfield back.

Getting Gold would take some of the sting out of Warfield's suspension, and Barber's injury.

But they talk like Barber is still in the plans for the defense this season, so who knows if they will bring someone in at his spot.

Idahored
03-02-2005, 02:12 PM
SOMEONE from the bunch of corner projects is going to have to step up (or a draftee from this year) and SOMEONE from the bunch of LB projects (or a draftee from this year) is going to have to get it done.


I'm hoping that could be Benny Sapp. I think with another year under his belt he can be our nickle back.