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VonneMarie
03-08-2005, 11:07 PM
Chiefs | Still Discussing Surtain Trade With Miami - from www.KFFL.com
Tue, 8 Mar 2005 20:31:08 -0800

Kansas City Chiefs president Carl Peterson hinted the Chiefs are still working on a deal with the Miami Dolphins to acquire CB Patrick Surtain, reports KCChiefs.com. "That door is certainly open," Peterson said. "It is as much with Miami as it is with his agent, if we can get to some kind of contract that makes sense. I think that is a difficult thing to do, but it is something we still have on the table. They are still talking to us and want to continue to talk to us because I think Patrick would like to leave Miami."

Maybe they are not worried about the second rd pick but about the contract #'s. :clap: :clap: :clap:

Valiant
03-08-2005, 11:10 PM
Only if it is for a second or lower..or even a second and bartee... anything else and no....

Chiefs Pantalones
03-08-2005, 11:13 PM
I would trade that 2nd rounder right now.

People need to wake the freak up, we can't draft worth a crap. Stop living in Chiefs denial.

VonneMarie
03-08-2005, 11:15 PM
I would trade that 2nd rounder right now.

People need to wake the freak up, we can't draft worth a crap. Stop living in Chiefs denial.
I agree. Please Carl... :grovel:

Chiefs Pantalones
03-08-2005, 11:19 PM
I really don't think they have a choice but to trade for Surtain. That is if they want to improve the secondary.

Redcoats58
03-08-2005, 11:20 PM
I'll take a proven player over a crap shoot any day of the week.

Mr. Kotter
03-08-2005, 11:26 PM
Only if it is for a second or lower..or even a second and bartee... anything else and no....

Hell, if we send them Bartee....they'd ask us for a first or money, to take him off our hands....with that contract he signed. :banghead:

VonneMarie
03-08-2005, 11:29 PM
I'll take a proven pro bowler over a future piece of crap. I betya a dollar we won't get him.

Wallcrawler
03-08-2005, 11:35 PM
Theres no way.


It makes too much sense. Carl would rather draft another reject in the second round than trade for a guy who is already established and can help the team now.

Either that, or he will lowball Ty Law because of his injury situation, and just hope that it pans out and he makes a full recovery.

Surtain is healthy, and damn good, and he knows it. He's going to be expecting compensation for his high level of play, and Carl isnt willing to give up that kind of bank.

He will say that we have too many holes on D to fill.


Personally Id rather have 1 awesome player, and then one more pretty good player and that be the end of it in FA, rather than trying to squeeze the money into 3 average players.

Rausch
03-08-2005, 11:37 PM
I'll take a proven player over a crap shoot any day of the week. :thumb:

Mr. Kotter
03-08-2005, 11:37 PM
I'll take a proven pro bowler over a future piece of crap. I betya a dollar we won't get him.

Make it a sixpack, winner's choice (< $25)....and you are on. :hmmm:

Chiefs Pantalones
03-08-2005, 11:40 PM
If Surtain played offense, he'd be a Chief yesterday.

keg in kc
03-08-2005, 11:41 PM
Yes, we've certainly had the full court press going on offensive talent this year.

Chiefs Pantalones
03-08-2005, 11:44 PM
Yes, we've certainly had the full court press going on offensive talent this year.

Oh come on, you don't think if Surtain were a skilled offensive player, like WR, prime of career, and even with holes in defense DV wouldn't go after him? DV thinks the NFL is a fantasy league.

Chiefs Pantalones
03-08-2005, 11:46 PM
Carl would do anything for his Dick, no pun.

keg in kc
03-08-2005, 11:46 PM
No.

VonneMarie
03-08-2005, 11:46 PM
Make it a sixpack, winner's choice (< $25)....and you are on. :hmmm:
If you can get all that for a dollar, it's on! :)

KILLER_CLOWN
03-08-2005, 11:47 PM
I'll take Law and keep the 2nd rounder and pray like hell that carl doesn't fuggitup!

Mr. Kotter
03-08-2005, 11:47 PM
If you can get all that for a dollar, it's on! :)

Wuss. :harumph:

;)

Mr. Kotter
03-08-2005, 11:48 PM
If Surtain played offense, he'd be a Chief yesterday.

:spock:

I'm missing something here....

Chiefs Pantalones
03-08-2005, 11:49 PM
No.

Looks like a case of Chiefs denial.

"We'll be ok, I know it!!!"


:p

Woodrow Call
03-08-2005, 11:50 PM
Oh come on, you don't think if Surtain were a skilled offensive player, like WR, prime of career, and even with holes in defense DV wouldn't go after him? DV thinks the NFL is a fantasy league.

I would have agreed with you last year but the Chiefs are focused on defense this year. They have let Mason, Burress, Brown and even Moss go by without even a sniff.

You might see them take a WR like Clayton in the 1st round which I wouldnt be happy about but hopefully the defensive holes would be filled first.

VonneMarie
03-08-2005, 11:50 PM
:spock:

I'm missing something here....
Vermiel is senile only likes offensive players? :hmmm:

keg in kc
03-08-2005, 11:53 PM
Vermiel is senile only likes offensive players? :hmmm:It's either that, or Cody's PMSing and out of Midol.

Chiefs Pantalones
03-08-2005, 11:56 PM
I would have agreed with you last year but the Chiefs are focused on defense this year. They have let Mason, Burress, Brown and even Moss go by without even a sniff.

You might see them take a WR like Clayton in the 1st round which I wouldnt be happy about but hopefully the defensive holes would be filled first.

So focused they let Rolle, Smith, Smoot, Trotter (I don't mind this one, he was loyal) slip away. They got an injury riddled Bell. I don't like the sound of that (hehe ba doom...ching!! be here all week).

Reeeeaaallll focused are them Chiefs. Yep. As far as CBs go, they are down to Law (combat veteran in a wheelchair) Dyson (who?) and Patrick Surtain, who is a true shutdown CB but they won't get him because it's the Chiefs, get real.

We won't make a serious run at a Super Bowl until the front office, etc, is wiped clean.

Chiefs Pantalones
03-08-2005, 11:59 PM
It's either that, or Cody's PMSing and out of Midol.

We have one of the best offenses in the league, and one of the worst defenses in the league. We are half a team and it's been groundhogs day for 4 years. Dick is old and senile, yes, and no, I'm not, lol.

Stinger
03-09-2005, 12:00 AM
Oh come on, you don't think if Surtain were a skilled offensive player, like WR, prime of career, and even with holes in defense DV wouldn't go after him? DV thinks the NFL is a fantasy league.


We made an offer to Plaxico??

:spock:

VonneMarie
03-09-2005, 12:05 AM
If I'm CP I make this trade in a heartbeat. No if's ands or buts. :banghead:

Chris Meck
03-09-2005, 01:41 AM
There is no such thing, under the new enforcement of contact rules, as a shut down corner in the NFL. See Champ Bailey.

Repeat as neccessary.

chris

Wile_E_Coyote
03-09-2005, 05:17 AM
the only WR I have seen the Chiefs linked to have interest in is Kevin Johnson...

milkman
03-09-2005, 06:03 AM
There is no such thing, under the new enforcement of contact rules, as a shut down corner in the NFL. See Champ Bailey.

Repeat as neccessary.

chris

It does no good.
No one wants to believe.

HemiEd
03-09-2005, 06:16 AM
Yes, we've certainly had the full court press going on offensive talent this year.


Very Very nice

htismaqe
03-09-2005, 06:41 AM
So focused they let Rolle, Smith, Smoot, Trotter (I don't mind this one, he was loyal) slip away. They got an injury riddled Bell. I don't like the sound of that (hehe ba doom...ching!! be here all week).

Reeeeaaallll focused are them Chiefs. Yep. As far as CBs go, they are down to Law (combat veteran in a wheelchair) Dyson (who?) and Patrick Surtain, who is a true shutdown CB but they won't get him because it's the Chiefs, get real.

We won't make a serious run at a Super Bowl until the front office, etc, is wiped clean.

Wow, get a Kotex man.

Gaz
03-09-2005, 06:44 AM
There is no such thing, under the new enforcement of contact rules, as a shut down corner in the NFL. See Champ Bailey.

Repeat as neccessary.

chris

Read it and weep, folks.

This is how it is.

xoxo~
Gaz
Amazed at the number of people who ignore reality on a daily basis.

old_geezer
03-09-2005, 06:55 AM
The reality that there is no longer a "shut down corner" in the NFL does not change that fact that the Chiefs desperately need to upgrade at that position. Having Bartee on the field is actually worse than letting a pile of dog crap in the middle of the field to play cornerback. At least the WR might actually bother to go around the pile of crap instead of acting like it's not even there.

Surtain or Law are the two most obvious candidates left to upgrade our greatest weakness. Most other CB's available aren't worth the effort or cash it would take to sign them.

Gaz
03-09-2005, 07:36 AM
Yes, the Chiefs need an upgrade at Cornerback. They need a Cornerback instead of a Safety masquerading as a CB. They do not, however, need to pay “shutdown CB” money for a guy who is targeted by the NFL for extinction.

One more time, I draw your attention to the hilarious spectacle of Champ Bailey [heh].

Personally, I would be happy with Dyson, rather than broken old Law or expensive young Surtain.

xoxo~
Gaz
Taking the anti-Cornerback NFL into account.

InChiefsHell
03-09-2005, 07:51 AM
Yes, the Chiefs need an upgrade at Cornerback. They need a Cornerback instead of a Safety masquerading as a CB. They do not, however, need to pay “shutdown CB” money for a guy who is targeted by the NFL for extinction.

One more time, I draw your attention to the hilarious spectacle of Champ Bailey [heh].

Personally, I would be happy with Dyson, rather than broken old Law or expensive young Surtain.

xoxo~
Gaz
Taking the anti-Cornerback NFL into account.


THis is so true. Look at last season, something like 56% more defensive PI or IC penalties. They are taking the "shut down" cb and making it a thing of the past. Now, you need a guy who can run with a reciever and tackle him when he makes the catch. Sad but true. Needing to pay top dollar for a CB is pretty much not what we need. I'd rather see Hartwell come in, maybe get Dyson. I'm not getting my panties in a bunch over not signing a "Shut Down" corner... :rolleyes:

ROYC75
03-09-2005, 08:00 AM
Plus with the new contact rules, scoring is up. We need playmakers on defense , period. Guys who not only tackle the ball carrier, but hits and causes fumbles, pulls in many INT's, etc.

We need playmakers to help stop those drives fueled by the rules.

htismaqe
03-09-2005, 08:42 AM
There may be no such thing as a shutdown corner, but there's also no such thing as a GOOD Carl Peterson 2nd-round pick.

Go get Surtain and be done with this.

InChiefsHell
03-09-2005, 08:50 AM
There may be no such thing as a shutdown corner, but there's also no such thing as a GOOD Carl Peterson 2nd-round pick.

Go get Surtain and be done with this.

Jury is still out on Kris Wilson, IMO...

Gaz
03-09-2005, 08:59 AM
Jury is still out on Kris Wilson, IMO...

Well, we know he is injury-prone…

xoxo~
Gaz
Just being obnoxious now.

Dr. Van Halen
03-09-2005, 09:03 AM
So focused they let Rolle, Smith, Smoot, Trotter (I don't mind this one, he was loyal) slip away. They got an injury riddled Bell. I don't like the sound of that (hehe ba doom...ching!! be here all week).

Reeeeaaallll focused are them Chiefs. Yep. As far as CBs go, they are down to Law (combat veteran in a wheelchair) Dyson (who?) and Patrick Surtain, who is a true shutdown CB but they won't get him because it's the Chiefs, get real.

We won't make a serious run at a Super Bowl until the front office, etc, is wiped clean.

So, Bell is injury-riddled, but Trotter and Rolle have no injury concerns?

Dyson gets a "who?" but you have dozens of Smith posters up on your wall?

They are DOWN to Law and Surtain? You mean they're down to the two best CB's in FA? That is scary.

You're the best!

CosmicPal
03-09-2005, 09:07 AM
All this clamoring about Surtain just might be a waste: I heard on NFL Radio this morning that Minnesota may consider trading Michael Bennett to Miami for Surtain.

Dr. Van Halen
03-09-2005, 09:18 AM
Please stop with the crap about the Chiefs and how horrible they are at the draft. NO ONE IS GOOD AT THE DRAFT! It's a crap-shoot, luck-out festival of fortunate mistakes most of the time.

Patriots 2000-2004
2nd round:
04 - Marquise Hill
03 - Bethal Johnson, Eugene Wilson
02 - Deion Branch
01 - Matt Light
00 - Adrian Klemm

Are any of those guys better than average? They were picking at the end of the rounds? So were the Chiefs during most of the 90's!

But let's look at a team with worse records/better picks:

Bengals 2000-2004
2nd Round:
04 - Keiwan Ratliff, Madieu Williams
03 - Eric Steinbach
02 - Lamont Thompson
01 - Chad Johnson (he's good)
00 - Mark Roman

See? Not so hot! NO ONE DRAFTS WELL!

So, hell yes, we should trade for Surtain. But not because we suck at the draft, but because the draft sucks.

eazyb81
03-09-2005, 09:20 AM
All this clamoring about Surtain just might be a waste: I heard on NFL Radio this morning that Minnesota may consider trading Michael Bennett to Miami for Surtain.

That is all but dead since they signed Smoot last night. They already have Winfield, so one of the three would have to sit on the bench....not likely.

Surtain, a perennial Pro Bowl CB, is sitting there waiting for us to want him bad enough. We could have him for a measly 2nd round pick (or a 4th this year and 2nd/3rd next year), yet we continue to sit on our hands. I can't say i'm surprised... :banghead:

Gaz
03-09-2005, 09:23 AM
Which other teams are chomping at the bit to trade that pick for Surtain?

Why the unseemly [and financially foolish] rush?

xoxo~
Gaz
Putting Surtain on the back burner.

eazyb81
03-09-2005, 09:30 AM
Which other teams are chomping at the bit to trade that pick for Surtain?

Why the unseemly [and financially foolish] rush?

xoxo~
Gaz
Putting Surtain on the back burner.

I would guess the other teams looking for a corner are the ones that needed a CB at the start of free agency or lost one in free agency. The Redskins, Seahawks, Jets, Steelers, and Giants are all serious contenders. More then one team is going to get left out in the cold.

Gaz
03-09-2005, 09:32 AM
Which of those teams you listed has indicated they are willing to cough up a 2nd Rounder for Surtain?

xoxo~
Gaz
Coming up empty.

htismaqe
03-09-2005, 09:47 AM
All this clamoring about Surtain just might be a waste: I heard on NFL Radio this morning that Minnesota may consider trading Michael Bennett to Miami for Surtain.

They're a day late.

There's no way, after giving a huge bonus to Winfield last year and signing Smoot yesterday, that the Vikings give up anything to get Surtain.

Count Alex's Losses
03-09-2005, 09:52 AM
Patriots 2000-2004
2nd round:
04 - Marquise Hill
03 - Bethal Johnson, Eugene Wilson
02 - Deion Branch
01 - Matt Light
00 - Adrian Klemm

Are any of those guys better than average?

Uh, YES. Eugene Wilson's a pretty good safety, Bethel Johnson has TONS of potential at WR and is already a great return man. Deion Branch is a VERY good wideout. Matt Light is one of the most underrated left tackles in the league and Klemm's a pretty good backup.

Both the Patriots and Ravens have drafted very well in recent years, particularly on defense.

Meanwhile the Chiefs are farting around picking players like Eddie Freeman.

eazyb81
03-09-2005, 09:54 AM
Which of those teams you listed has indicated they are willing to cough up a 2nd Rounder for Surtain?

xoxo~
Gaz
Coming up empty.


I know Seattle has expressed interest, but I don't think we can really afford to wait until other teams express interest before we get seriously involved.

Hoover
03-09-2005, 09:59 AM
I think it would be huge to get him.

We would have a leader at LB - Bell, and Leader in the secondary - Surtain, and then we need a leader of the D Line who I think could be Sims or Allen.

Chiefnj
03-09-2005, 10:10 AM
I just don't see how the Chiefs could get Surtain. Not only do they have to negotiate with the player to get an agreed upon salary, they have to fit that salary under the Dolphins cap space and then agree on compensation with Miami. Miami should not trade him for less than a 3rd. He'll be a productive corner in Saban's first year. There is also always a chance they could resign him next year. Surtain would have been the best FA this year if he was available. He knows that, and he knows that next year there are always a few teams around willing to overspend on positions of need. Plus he knows that every year the free agent market price goes up. Why accept a KC offer with an 11 mil bonus this year when you can get 14+ next year?

Gaz
03-09-2005, 10:18 AM
“expressed interest” is not even close to giving up a 2nd Round pick.

We have to wait. Anything less would be fiscally irresponsible.

xoxo~
Gaz
Not that eager to throw picks away.

Otter
03-09-2005, 10:23 AM
Surtain still being discussed

But can you be certain?!??!

http://blogs.sun.com/roller/resources/gerrys/dr.evil.jpg

A homonym?!?!?!

eazyb81
03-09-2005, 10:29 AM
“expressed interest” is not even close to giving up a 2nd Round pick.

We have to wait. Anything less would be fiscally irresponsible.

xoxo~
Gaz
Not that eager to throw picks away.


Well, since Miami's current asking price for Surtain is a 2nd round pick, I think "expressing interest" means that they are at least slightly interested in giving up a 2nd for Surtain.

Gaz
03-09-2005, 10:34 AM
Well, since Miami's current asking price for Surtain is a 2nd round pick, I think "expressing interest" means that they are at least slightly interested in giving up a 2nd for Surtain.

I have heard nothing to that effect. Have you heard something or is this speculation?

Not that there is anything wrong with speculation. I am just trying to determine where “expressed interest” comes from with regard to the 2nd Rounder demanded by Miami.

xoxo~
Gaz
Groping for common ground.

eazyb81
03-09-2005, 10:36 AM
I have heard nothing to that effect. Have you heard something or is this speculation?

Not that there is anything wrong with speculation. I am just trying to determine where “expressed interest” comes from with regard to the 2nd Rounder demanded by Miami.

xoxo~
Gaz
Groping for common ground.


I saw a report from KFFL a few days ago saying Seattle was interested in trading for Surtain. I could try and look it up for you if you want to see it.

Mr. Kotter
03-09-2005, 10:40 AM
I saw a report from KFFL a few days ago saying Seattle was interested in trading for Surtain. I could try and look it up for you if you want to see it.

Yeah, I think Joe may have even posted somethin' here about it.

Gaz
03-09-2005, 10:49 AM
Yah, I would like to see that, thanks.

xoxo~
Gaz
Always up to increase his knowledge base.

eazyb81
03-09-2005, 10:55 AM
Yah, I would like to see that, thanks.

xoxo~
Gaz
Always up to increase his knowledge base.


I can't search KFFL, but I found an article from today's Tacoma News Tribune that says that Seattle has talked to Miami about Surtain.

http://www.thenewstribune.com/sports/seahawks/story/4664397p-4322890c.html

Surtain info is at the bottom.