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View Full Version : Are KC's starting linebackers appreciably better as they stand today?


raypec85
03-10-2005, 07:11 AM
Assuming Barber will either not be available or not up to full speed, is Fujita, Bell, and Mitchell / Fox appreciably better than Fujita, Mitchell, and Barber? KC would improve alot in the middle but would lose some ground on the weak side, at least for the period of time it would take Mitchell or Fox to develop, if they ever do. I think Bell was a good signing but unless Barber makes it back to full speed it will take 2 new linebackers to really have the desired effect imo. If Fujita leaves then the picture becomes even grimmer.

cookster50
03-10-2005, 07:25 AM
Yes

Gaz
03-10-2005, 07:27 AM
Beisel/Caver, Bell, Fujita > Barber, Mitchell, Fujita.

xoxo~
Gaz
Doing the math.

raypec85
03-10-2005, 07:32 AM
Gaz, I don't share your enthusiasm for Caver. Beisel / Bell / Fujita is better than what KC had last year, I agree. However, the question is are they APPRECIABLY better? I'm not so sure there's a significant difference there, and a significant difference is what KC needs, not moderate improvement.

the Talking Can
03-10-2005, 07:36 AM
we now have 1 good LB

Gaz
03-10-2005, 07:37 AM
Despite the howls of outrage about the secondary [and I concede that beaucoup howling was justified], the weakest point of our Defense was MLB. Although I wanted Hartwell [and still harbor the secret hope that he will sign with KC], Bell is a tremendous upgrade .

So, with the injury [i]caveat in place, the answer is: yes, they are appreciably better.

xoxo~
Gaz
Had really high hopes for Mitchell, but finally had to get off that wagon.

chiefsfolife
03-10-2005, 07:38 AM
lets see well theres 3 line backers and we have one good one so......33 percent better is pretty good for march

SCTrojan
03-10-2005, 07:46 AM
So, with the injury caveat in place, the answer is: yes, they are appreciably better.



I'm with Gaz on this one. And, at the risk of encroaching upon his domain, I think the improvement with the addition of Bell is more geometric than arithmetic. Bell not only upgrades one linebacker position, but has the ability to make the others better in the process.

We heard a lot of "everyone's trying to do too much" hyperbole in the locker room last year. My hope is that Bell's presence will help the other LBs focus solely on their job and not try to do everything themselves.

crossbow
03-10-2005, 07:52 AM
The strength they have in the middle will effect the the whole defense. The two outside LB positions don't have to worry about the inside and can concentrate on sweeps, screens, and bootlegs. The safeties don't have support the run as much and can help the corners like they are supposed to. Corners now can trust that the safties will be there to help them on the inside so they can defend the outside and deep routes with more confidence like they need to.

If they give Fox a chance he has the physical talent to succeed. He could be a solid will backer. Fujita and Mitchell have the size and speed to be effective srtong side linebackers that can cover tight ends. Caver was a 2nd round pick because of his athletic abilities. He played very well last year when they needed him.

All of these guys should play better because they have less ground to cover now.

Gaz
03-10-2005, 07:55 AM
I have no hard evidence to support it, but my suspicion is that "everyone's trying to do too much" was a major factor in the awesome lameness of our Safety play.

xoxo~
Gaz
Thinks guys do one job better than three.

chiefsfolife
03-10-2005, 07:58 AM
The strength they have in the middle will effect the the whole defense. The two outside LB positions don't have to worry about the inside and can concentrate on sweeps, screens, and bootlegs. The safeties don't have support the run as much and can help the corners like they are supposed to. Corners now can trust that the safties will be there to help them on the inside so they can defend the outside and deep routes with more confidence like they need to.

If they give Fox a chance he has the physical talent to succeed. He could be a solid will backer. Fujita and Mitchell have the size and speed to be effective srtong side linebackers that can cover tight ends. Caver was a 2nd round pick because of his athletic abilities. He played very well last year when they needed him.

All of these guys should play better because they have less ground to cover now.

I agree all the way

crossbow
03-10-2005, 08:01 AM
I have no hard evidence to support it, but my suspicion is that "everyone's trying to do too much" was a major factor in the awesome lameness of our Safety play.

xoxo~
Gaz
Thinks guys do one job better than three.


I see that too. They were trying to defend half of a football field most of the time. A bad spot to be in. Now as far as tackleling goes, well we need improvement there for sure but hopefully Gun will work on that.

edit: Gaurding the middle is the key to successful defenses in all sports. The middle of the field is where the other guy has the most room to advance. Take it way from him and the outside is easier to defend becuase if he goes out of bounds the play doesn't count.

bricks
03-10-2005, 08:40 AM
we now have 1 good LB

I agree. I'll say this, the signing of Bell can make our LBing corps better. Mitchell was starting to come on late last season, his inconsistent play the entire year hurt him. I was thinking he would be a good long-term project for this team, but, the signing of Bell throws that out the window. Mitchell, imo, would make a good backup. Fujita is adequate(average linebacker), I have no problems with him being our 3rd best LB, last year he was our best. It doesn't sit well with me to see he is our 2nd best LB. I hope the Chiefs draft a stud OLB in the first round. We can still use help at LB.

whoman69
03-10-2005, 09:15 AM
The strength they have in the middle will effect the the whole defense. The two outside LB positions don't have to worry about the inside and can concentrate on sweeps, screens, and bootlegs. The safeties don't have support the run as much and can help the corners like they are supposed to. Corners now can trust that the safties will be there to help them on the inside so they can defend the outside and deep routes with more confidence like they need to.

If they give Fox a chance he has the physical talent to succeed. He could be a solid will backer. Fujita and Mitchell have the size and speed to be effective srtong side linebackers that can cover tight ends. Caver was a 2nd round pick because of his athletic abilities. He played very well last year when they needed him.

All of these guys should play better because they have less ground to cover now.
I don't know what information anyone on this board has to make a statement about Fox. He was injured most of the season and played sparingly when healthy. You want to talk about athletic ability, Bartee has alot of athletic ability. It doesn't always translate.

htismaqe
03-10-2005, 09:37 AM
I don't know what information anyone on this board has to make a statement about Fox. He was injured most of the season and played sparingly when healthy. You want to talk about athletic ability, Bartee has alot of athletic ability. It doesn't always translate.

I think it comes down to this:

If our only chance to upgrade at WLB becomes drafting Kevin Burnett or a similar player, we might as well play Fox because you're getting roughly the same things.

HC_Chief
03-10-2005, 09:38 AM
No. Bell is an upgrade over Barber, but the rest of the LB corps is still pathetic. (well, Fujita's not "pathetic" - he shows a lot of potential and sometimes "flashes" of being a good LB; he just needs to lern how to complete a tackle more consistently)

Mitchell = suck
Fox = complete no-show
Caver = suck
Jones = suck
Beisel = suck (good on ST tho')
Scanlon = suck (AND constantly blocks in the back on ST)

htismaqe
03-10-2005, 09:40 AM
No. Bell is an upgrade over Barber, but the rest of the LB corps is still pathetic.

Bell and Barber don't play the same position.

HC_Chief
03-10-2005, 09:42 AM
Bell and Barber don't play the same position.

They both play OLB.

Chiefnj
03-10-2005, 09:44 AM
They both play OLB.

When is the last time Bell played the WILL?

bricks
03-10-2005, 09:44 AM
I'd love for the Chiefs to draft an OLB in the first round. Are Johnson, Burnett, and Crowder the top Lbing prospects this upcoming draft? We gotta get another Lber, imo.

HC_Chief
03-10-2005, 10:56 AM
When is the last time Bell played the WILL?

Well, SOMEONE has to play it. Again, KC and Barber are working on terms for an injury settlement, or they have already come to terms on said settlement. It's been mentioned several times on 810 and 610. I assume then, that he's gone.

We signed Bell - a guy who has played Sam and Mike. Statements have been made that he's not necessarily going to be playing MLB - so that puts him at Sam or WIll. Considering the fact that he's a better LB than Fujita, I would assume we'd put him at his natural position and move Fujita over to Will. (bug assumption, I know - but it makes sense: take advantage of Bell's strengths and move Fujita to a position that, IMO, he can play due to his size/spedd ratio)

LiL stumppy
03-10-2005, 11:11 AM
Despite the howls of outrage about the secondary [and I concede that beaucoup howling was justified], the weakest point of our Defense was MLB. Although I wanted Hartwell [and still harbor the secret hope that he will sign with KC], Bell is a tremendous upgrade .

So, with the injury [i]caveat in place, the answer is: yes, they are appreciably better.

xoxo~
Gaz
Had really high hopes for Mitchell, but finally had to get off that wagon.



Mitchell is younge,I till like him and thinks he has a chance.He had the second most tackles last year.Many people thought he was getting better,and I do too.I think time behind Bell would improve him and I do think he will be a good MLB.

WilliamTheIrish
03-10-2005, 11:15 AM
We have one good LB now. That's it.

Hoiw anybody can believe that appearance of Bell will magically make Fujita wrap up better or make Mitchell useful in any way is beyond me.

Hartwell, Hartwell, Hartwell.

HC_Chief
03-10-2005, 11:19 AM
We have one good LB now. That's it.

Hoiw anybody can believe that appearance of Bell will magically make Fujita wrap up better or make Mitchell useful in any way is beyond me.

Hartwell, Hartwell, Hartwell.

Nodding in agreement

Chris Meck
03-10-2005, 01:45 PM
I would think that as it stands right now, Bell would be our MLB, and probably stay on in nickel and dime packages, as he's instantly our best and most versatile LB.

I agree that Fujita has promise and has shown at times that he's got some ability, but that perhaps he's guilty of that 'trying to do too much' thing.

Mitchell was maddenly inconsistent, Fox played preciously little, and Beisel was awful raw. Barber is likely to not play at all for the Chiefs this season (injury settlement?).

All of that being said, Hartwell signing would likely move Bell to OLB, and a Hartwell/Bell/Fujita starting lineup would be fierce indeed. I like that idea-although it leaves us with no $$ to grab a corner. There's certainly something to forming ONE dominant unit on the team, and this would likely make our LB corps one to be feared.

I agree with Gaz that somewhere in our safety to corner prospects, we should be able to find a good safety, be it Bartee, Battle, or Harts. No more safeties, at least not this year, and let's put those guys back in their natural positions and fight it out.

I really wish Fox hadn't basically missed the whole season so we knew what we had there...if he's a player, it sure would be nice to just add Bell and a corner and look to the draft for BAA.

Just my .02

Chris

whoman69
03-10-2005, 02:57 PM
When is the last time Bell played the WILL?
Who would play WILL if we get Hartwell?