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View Full Version : Julian Peterson - worth two 1st round picks?


Chiefnj
03-16-2005, 10:10 AM
People seem very willing to give up a 2nd round pick for Surtain. What about two first round picks for Peterson? Prior to his injury last year he was regarded as one of the best OLB's in the NFL, if not THE best. Is Peterson worth two first round picks? A lot of people seem to think that KC is a Super Bowl contender. If that's the case, then giving up the 15th pick this year and an end of the first round pick in 2006 doesn't seem excessively steep for a player who will likely make the Pro Bowl the next 4 or 5 years.

Who would have had the bigger impact - Siavii and Johnson, or Peterson? Johnson and Sims, or Peterson? Morris and Tait, or Peterson? Tait and Riley, or Peterson?

the Talking Can
03-16-2005, 10:11 AM
hell no

he's coming off an achilles injury

Cochise
03-16-2005, 10:12 AM
One first round pick.

Chiefnj
03-16-2005, 10:13 AM
One first round pick.

He's the franchise player, it has to be two.

KCFalcon59
03-16-2005, 10:13 AM
He will never be the same as he was before the injury.

So what Talking can said. hell no

King_Chief_Fan
03-16-2005, 10:13 AM
One first round pick.

maybe next years first

Brock
03-16-2005, 10:15 AM
Here's an idea, just use your first round pick and draft your own.

milkman
03-16-2005, 10:16 AM
Hell, since Carl can't draft anyway, we should just sign Franchise players every other year and save the heartache. :cuss:

Cochise
03-16-2005, 10:17 AM
He's the franchise player, it has to be two.

It does?

At any rate, the question was, is he "worth" two, I said no, but I would give one.

Hoover
03-16-2005, 10:19 AM
Not since he is coming off an injury

jcroft
03-16-2005, 10:21 AM
Hell no. Almost no player in the NFL is worth two first round picks. Peterson is a very good player that I'd love to have, but no way in hell is he worth two first round picks.

Gaz
03-16-2005, 10:21 AM
No.

xoxo~
Gaz
Does not hanker to trade a 2nd for a CB, either.

jspchief
03-16-2005, 10:22 AM
He's barely worth one. F*ck no.

vckcchiefs04
03-16-2005, 10:25 AM
ummm... no :shake:

Bwana
03-16-2005, 10:27 AM
No chance

siberian khatru
03-16-2005, 10:32 AM
Way too much for the guy even when he hasn't suffered a major injury. And I love him when he's healthy.

beavis
03-16-2005, 10:32 AM
He's the franchise player, it has to be two.
No it doesn't. 99% of the time when a franchise player is traded, lesser compensation is given. (eg one first rounder)

I don't know that anyone is worth two first rounders. Anyone that would be available anyway.

siberian khatru
03-16-2005, 10:34 AM
No it doesn't. 99% of the time when a franchise player is traded, lesser compensation is given. (eg one first rounder)

I don't know that anyone is worth two first rounders. Anyone that would be available anyway.

I was thinking the same thing. No one who is available, that's fer sure. How about hypothetically: If you were a QB-starved franchise and had your choice, maybe you'd trade 2 No. 1s for Culpepper or Manning or whatnot. But's it's a really, really short list.

Chiefnj
03-16-2005, 10:35 AM
No it doesn't. 99% of the time when a franchise player is traded, lesser compensation is given. (eg one first rounder)

I don't know that anyone is worth two first rounders. Anyone that would be available anyway.

"A franchise player must be offered a minimum of the average of the top five players at his postion, or a 20 percent raise from his salary the season before. If a team makes a player this tender offer, he becomes a non-exclusive franchise player and other teams are allowed to sign him. If another team makes an offer to a franchise player, the original club has the right of first refusal and they would receive two first-round draft picks as compensation if the player signed with the new team."

Otter
03-16-2005, 10:36 AM
Considering the fact the within the next 2 years the Chiefs are going to have to replace 1/2 their offensive line, a FB, starting RB, 2 starting WR and possibly up to 3 QBs I wouldn't be too quick be giving away any draft picks at this point in the game.

The window may be closing but their not putting in a wall where the window used to be.

siberian khatru
03-16-2005, 10:37 AM
"A franchise player must be offered a minimum of the average of the top five players at his postion, or a 20 percent raise from his salary the season before. If a team makes a player this tender offer, he becomes a non-exclusive franchise player and other teams are allowed to sign him. If another team makes an offer to a franchise player, the original club has the right of first refusal and they would receive two first-round draft picks as compensation if the player signed with the new team."

I'm almost certain teams are free to negotiate a lesser compensation. I just can't come up with an example of it happening at the moment. Surely someone here can.

chiefsfolife
03-16-2005, 10:38 AM
in my opionion nobody is worth 2

chiefsfolife
03-16-2005, 10:39 AM
unless both picks are in the upper 20's then maybee i would use them on ray lewis

Mr. Laz
03-16-2005, 10:40 AM
"A franchise player must be offered a minimum of the average of the top five players at his postion, or a 20 percent raise from his salary the season before. If a team makes a player this tender offer, he becomes a non-exclusive franchise player and other teams are allowed to sign him. If another team makes an offer to a franchise player, the original club has the right of first refusal and they would receive two first-round draft picks as compensation if the player signed with the new team."
i can not even began to count the number of times this has had to be explained....


the 2 first round picks is the MAXIMUM set by the league.... teams almost always negotiate a lower price in compensation.

i can only remember 1 player actually going for the 2 first round picks and that was Joey Galloway going to Dallas.


it's usually a 1st and 3rd

Chan93lx50
03-16-2005, 10:41 AM
Are you fugging kidding me, ahhhhhhhhhhhhh HELLL NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

beavis
03-16-2005, 10:42 AM
"A franchise player must be offered a minimum of the average of the top five players at his postion, or a 20 percent raise from his salary the season before. If a team makes a player this tender offer, he becomes a non-exclusive franchise player and other teams are allowed to sign him. If another team makes an offer to a franchise player, the original club has the right of first refusal and they would receive two first-round draft picks as compensation if the player signed with the new team."
The last player I can even think of that a team got 2 1sts for was Sean Jones. Every other one has been negotiated for less. I realize that's what the CBA says, but it doesn't prohibit a team from working out a trade.

beavis
03-16-2005, 10:43 AM
I was thinking the same thing. No one who is available, that's fer sure. How about hypothetically: If you were a QB-starved franchise and had your choice, maybe you'd trade 2 No. 1s for Culpepper or Manning or whatnot. But's it's a really, really short list.
Manning was the only one I could think of that I would even consider giving up 2 first rounders for. I wouldn't do it for Butterfingers.

Cormac
03-16-2005, 10:44 AM
To back up Laz, there are rumours that Indianapolis may trade Edgerrin James to Miami for just a 2nd rounder. James is franchised.

I'm not saying it will happen, but it is possible. The team holding the franchised player can negotiate for whatever it wants, up to 2 1st round picks.

beavis
03-16-2005, 10:44 AM
i can not even began to count the number of times this has had to be explained....


the 2 first round picks is the MAXIMUM set by the league.... teams almost always negotiate a lower price in compensation.

i can only remember 1 player actually going for the 2 first round picks and that was Joey Galloway going to Dallas.


it's usually a 1st and 3rd
Did they get 2 for Galloway? I don't remember that. What a rip off. Just further proves that point that no one is worth 2.

Chiefnj
03-16-2005, 10:45 AM
i can not even began to count the number of times this has had to be explained....


the 2 first round picks is the MAXIMUM set by the league.... teams almost always negotiate a lower price in compensation.

i can only remember 1 player actually going for the 2 first round picks and that was Joey Galloway going to Dallas.


it's usually a 1st and 3rd

If a team doesn't want to part with the player, they get two first round picks. I'm not saying a team can't agree to lower compensation. The 49ers obviously have him as the top priority because they tagged him again, even coming off his injury making him the highest paid LB this year (base salary). I think he is scheduled to earn 7.2 million.

If he was NOT coming off the injury, and looking at recent Chiefs drafts, I wouldn't be opposed to the deal. With the injury, I wouldn't do it, at least not at this point.

Mr. Laz
03-16-2005, 10:47 AM
maybe we need to a sticky FAQ on this board with some of the more questioned topics.


1. The Salary Cap And You: how to pro-rate the signing bonus.


2. TagsRus: what's the difference between the tags and how to use them.




:)

beavis
03-16-2005, 10:48 AM
If a team doesn't want to part with the player, they get two first round picks. I'm not saying a team can't agree to lower compensation. The 49ers obviously have him as the top priority because they tagged him again, even coming off his injury making him the highest paid LB this year (base salary). I think he is scheduled to earn 7.2 million.

If he was NOT coming off the injury, and looking at recent Chiefs drafts, I wouldn't be opposed to the deal. With the injury, I wouldn't do it, at least not at this point.
You could be the Chiefs GM if the job wasn't already taken.

Mr. Laz
03-16-2005, 10:48 AM
Did they get 2 for Galloway? I don't remember that. What a rip off. Just further proves that point that no one is worth 2.
yea... dallas got screwed ROFL ROFL



i enjoyed it :clap:

beavis
03-16-2005, 10:49 AM
maybe we need to a sticky FAQ on this board with some of the more questioned topics.


1. The Salary Cap And You: how to pro-rate the signing bonus.


2. TagsRus: what's the difference between the tags and how to use them.




:)
People still wouldn't read it.

That and the obligatory weekly, "what is rep?" thread.

chiefsfolife
03-16-2005, 10:49 AM
If a team doesn't want to part with the player, they get two first round picks. I'm not saying a team can't agree to lower compensation. The 49ers obviously have him as the top priority because they tagged him again, even coming off his injury making him the highest paid LB this year (base salary). I think he is scheduled to earn 7.2 million.

If he was NOT coming off the injury, and looking at recent Chiefs drafts, I wouldn't be opposed to the deal. With the injury, I wouldn't do it, at least not at this point.

I keep hearing this bs bout how since the chiefs draft so bad we need to do this and that...thats not the answer, the answer is to draft better and thats it.

beavis
03-16-2005, 10:54 AM
I keep hearing this bs bout how since the chiefs draft so bad we need to do this and that...thats not the answer, the answer is to draft better and thats it.
Do you sell magic beans too?

Mr. Laz
03-16-2005, 10:59 AM
People still wouldn't read it.

That and the obligatory weekly, "what is rep?" thread.
heh .. ROFL

or "how do you use Work Mode?"

HC_Chief
03-16-2005, 11:01 AM
Peterson is too big a health risk.

milkman
03-16-2005, 11:03 AM
Do you sell magic beans too?
:clap:

milkman
03-16-2005, 11:04 AM
Peterson is too big a health risk.

Are you talking about Julian, or Carl because of the unhappy masses? :hmmm:

HC_Chief
03-16-2005, 11:05 AM
Are you talking about Julian, or Carl because of the unhappy masses? :hmmm:

hehehe... both, if CP doesn't sign a corner soon. ;)

chiefsfolife
03-16-2005, 11:08 AM
Do you sell magic beans too?


:spock:

:loser:

chiefsfolife
03-16-2005, 11:11 AM
I keep hearing this bs bout how since the chiefs draft so bad we need to do this and that...thats not the answer, the answer is to draft better and thats it.

some of you basically saying its ok to draft bad

chiefsfolife
03-16-2005, 11:12 AM
so if thats how you would run a franchise....well ok then

milkman
03-16-2005, 11:17 AM
some of you basically saying its ok to draft bad

This is the dumbest question I've ever heard.

It's not ok to draft poorly.
Expecting Carl to suddenly get a clue and actually have a productive draft is wishful thinking.

It could happen.
The possibility exists.
But it's highly improbable.

Ebolapox
03-16-2005, 11:17 AM
quick, someone come up with ONE franchise player who's netted the team two first round picks when changing teams...


wait... I can't come up with one, though I'm sure some team's been dumb enough to do it... carl pickens, maybe??

point is, though that IS the rule, usually the team negotiates it down to one first round pick... I'd be COMPLETELY happy with peterson and surtain

-EB-

Chiefnj
03-16-2005, 11:22 AM
quick, someone come up with ONE franchise player who's netted the team two first round picks when changing teams...


wait... I can't come up with one, though I'm sure some team's been dumb enough to do it... carl pickens, maybe??

point is, though that IS the rule, usually the team negotiates it down to one first round pick... I'd be COMPLETELY happy with peterson and surtain

-EB-

Sean Gilbert from the Skins to the Panthers. I think maybe Galloway.

ct
03-16-2005, 11:48 AM
maybe we need to a sticky FAQ on this board with some of the more questioned topics.


1. The Salary Cap And You: how to pro-rate the signing bonus.


2. TagsRus: what's the difference between the tags and how to use them.




:)
ROFL :thumb:

oldandslow
03-16-2005, 12:19 PM
OK, I really don't get this...

Our first round picks since 90...(I know - I am counting Savii and Wilson as 1 pick)

Jr. Savaii
K. Wilson
S. Morris
R. Sims
L. Johnson
G. Hill
D. Carter
H. Williams
P. Snow
T. Jenkins
J. Woods
Tony G.
V. Riley
J. Tait

Other than Tony G., which two of these players would you NOT trade for a Ray Lewis or a healthy J. Peterson. (I am counting Tony as an anomoly since he represents only 7% of our first round picks).

I simply do NOT understand this love for first round picks in the Peterson era. The man CANNOT draft.

Logical
03-16-2005, 12:33 PM
I would easily give up this years 1st and next year 2nd for Petersen, but both firsts is a lot but almost worth it.

BigMeatballDave
03-16-2005, 12:34 PM
Julian Peterson - worth two 1st round picks? No Dice!

philfree
03-16-2005, 12:41 PM
OK, I really don't get this...

Our first round picks since 90...(I know - I am counting Savii and Wilson as 1 pick)

Jr. Savaii
K. Wilson
S. Morris
R. Sims
L. Johnson
G. Hill
D. Carter
H. Williams
P. Snow
T. Jenkins
J. Woods
Tony G.
V. Riley
J. Tait

Other than Tony G., which two of these players would you NOT trade for a Ray Lewis or a healthy J. Peterson. (I am counting Tony as an anomoly since he represents only 7% of our first round picks).

I simply do NOT understand this love for first round picks in the Peterson era. The man CANNOT draft.

There's alot to be desired when it comes to our drafts of the Peterson Era however how many of those picks were in the top 15? Four?

PhilFree :arrow:

Wallcrawler
03-16-2005, 12:42 PM
No player is worth two first rounders.

Especially not one that is coming off a season ending ruptured achilles tendon injury.


Teams have the two first round pick stipulation for their franchise tagged players, but it isnt a requirement.

Edgerrin James wont command 2 first rounders, the Colts have said that they would take considerably less.

Same thing with Seattle's Sean Alexander.


Nowadays, the franchise tag just pisses players off, because they want a long term deal. When they threaten to hold out, and not sign the deal, it forces the organization's hand to either sit them out all year, or just take what they can get in a trade for them.

Since most teams arent stupid enough to surrender 2 first rounders for a player, they will settle for what they can get.

StcChief
03-16-2005, 12:46 PM
NFW

Mr. Kotter
03-16-2005, 12:52 PM
Heh....I think not. :shake:

The dude just got sentenced to the death penalty.

Logical
03-16-2005, 02:37 PM
I'm almost certain teams are free to negotiate a lesser compensation. I just can't come up with an example of it happening at the moment. Surely someone here can.

You are both right, I used to have the same opinion as Chiefnj, and it is true that if you sign the player first it is two first rounders. But if you negotiate the deal with the club that has the franchise tag first and then sign him the compensation can be less. Example Kevin Carter Rams to Tennessee a few years ago.

Der Flöprer
03-16-2005, 03:24 PM
No.

xoxo~
Gaz
Does not hanker to trade a 2nd for a CB, either.




Not a normal CB sure, but how about the leading CB over the last 5 years.....cough..cough...surtain....cough...cough