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Mr. Flopnuts
03-16-2005, 03:31 PM
What cornerback in this years draft do you want to see wearing a Chiefs uniform?

Big Chief Homer
03-16-2005, 03:41 PM
none,bring on derrick johnson or shawn merriman.

el borracho
03-16-2005, 03:42 PM
Rolle>Rogers>Jackson>Green>Browner

Mr. Flopnuts
03-16-2005, 04:00 PM
I am surprised that there are not more votes for the Pac man.

ct
03-16-2005, 04:18 PM
Carlos Rogers, immediate starting CB potential, supports the run as well as he covers WRs.

ct
03-16-2005, 04:19 PM
none,bring on derrick johnson or shawn merriman.

Merriman we should have a shot at, but DJ will be long gone, top 5 most likely, top 10 definitely! We don't have the ammo to move up even 5 picks, let alone 10+ picks. Never happen.

Gravedigger
03-16-2005, 04:21 PM
I don't trust a guy who has a nick name that is the same as a game I used to play on my atari system... other then that I say rolle. We missed one rolle but we'll get another.

Chiefnj
03-16-2005, 04:25 PM
My wishlist in preference order:

1. DJ
2. Rolle
3. Pollack
4. Rogers
5. M. Jackson.
6. Merriman.

I think Pac Man is vastly over-rated and will be a better cover 2 guy.

ChiefsCountry
03-16-2005, 04:42 PM
I want a DE. Spears or Pollack. Its cheaper to get DE's in the draft than it is to get one on the open market compared to corners.

matts22
03-16-2005, 04:49 PM
Rogers. Guy is a stud. Period.

kc rush
03-16-2005, 04:53 PM
Don't care. Get the best non-safety/DT defensive player available. They would be an automatic upgrade.

Mr. Flopnuts
03-16-2005, 05:22 PM
Don't care. Get the best non-safety/DT defensive player available. They would be an automatic upgrade.

You a rush fan? I don't know why but your avatar looks like artwork for the band Rush. If so, good for you, my fav band of all time.

Rain Man
03-16-2005, 05:28 PM
I voted for Rolle because he was worshipped on this board during football season, when it really counts. After the season is over, the combine warriors' stock starts rising. I don't want athletes - I want football players.

eazyb81
03-16-2005, 05:30 PM
Rolle is a flat out stud, but the other two could be great as well. However, I will go with Rolle for now because of his versatility and for the simple fact that he is from The U....how many 1st rounders have actually failed coming out of Miami?

nascher
03-16-2005, 05:47 PM
Please Rolle !!!

Calcountry
03-16-2005, 05:53 PM
What cornerback in this years draft do you want to see wearing a Chiefs uniform?I think we should just wait four years and sigh the top FA CB that is picked this year. That way we would be sure not to waste a pick.

Rausch
03-16-2005, 05:57 PM
WHat? No Safety?

Cochise
03-16-2005, 05:59 PM
Rogers.

But where is Justin Miller on the radar screen?

Saggysack
03-16-2005, 06:02 PM
I would take Rolle.

Saggysack
03-16-2005, 06:04 PM
I want a DE. Spears or Pollack. Its cheaper to get DE's in the draft than it is to get one on the open market compared to corners.

Aren't the experts saying the Pollack isn't suited for a 3-4? I thought the the consensus was that he is best suited as a OLB in a 3-4 defense.

milkman
03-16-2005, 06:09 PM
I don't think this poll has enough options.

I am hoping we move down about 10 spots for a 3rd round pick, trade for Surtain with our 2nd, and take Marlin Jackson in 1, the best DE or OLB available in 3.

eazyb81
03-16-2005, 06:11 PM
I don't think this poll has enough options.

I am hoping we move down about 10 spots for a 3rd round pick, trade for Surtain with our 2nd, and take Marlin Jackson in 1, the best DE or OLB available in 3.

If we move down 10 places in the 1st, I would hope Carl could get an extra 2nd instead of a 3rd. Last year, the Browns gave up a 2nd to move up just one spot (granted, they are the Browns, but still...).

Kris Kringle
03-16-2005, 06:11 PM
None. I want a OLB, DE or WR.

milkman
03-16-2005, 06:15 PM
If we move down 10 places in the 1st, I would hope Carl could get an extra 2nd instead of a 3rd. Last year, the Browns gave up a 2nd to move up just one spot (granted, they are the Browns, but still...).

I need to check that value chart.
How high was that Browns pick?

If we could get a 2nd, even better, although I don't suppose any of it matters, since Carl and the scouts can't evaluate talent.

eazyb81
03-16-2005, 06:18 PM
I need to check that value chart.
How high was that Browns pick?

If we could get a 2nd, even better, although I don't suppose any of it matters, since Carl and the scouts can't evaluate talent.

I think it was a 6 or 7, they traded with the Lions to move up and grab Kellen Winslow Jr.

kc rush
03-16-2005, 10:28 PM
You a rush fan? I don't know why but your avatar looks like artwork for the band Rush. If so, good for you, my fav band of all time.


Yup. Its from the Show of Hands album.

Nightfyre
03-16-2005, 10:37 PM
I saw one mock where DJ fell to 14. If that happened I hope we would move up and take him. Other than that I hope we move down and draft DE in the first, a CB in the second, a OLB or S or WR in the second (gained pick), and one of whatever we didnt draft in the second with our Tait pick in the third.

keg in kc
03-16-2005, 10:39 PM
Marlin Jackson.

Mr. Flopnuts
03-17-2005, 10:53 AM
Yup. Its from the Show of Hands album.


sweet, I thought it looked familiar, greetings fellow rushian

Woodrow Call
03-17-2005, 11:31 AM
Marlin Jackson.

I like him a lot too. I would be happy with him or Rodgers.

whoman69
03-17-2005, 12:00 PM
I think Rolle or Rogers would do well for us. But Rogers is agressive and a run stopper, something sorely lacking on this defense.

Gaz
03-17-2005, 12:23 PM
Of course, all bets are off should Johnson fall within our grasp.

Otherwise, gimme Rogers.

xoxo~
Gaz
Not expecting to do a Johnson happy dance.

milkman
03-17-2005, 12:32 PM
xoxo~
Gaz
Not expecting to do a Johnson happy dance.


I'm pretty sure we are thankful for that.

Coogs
03-17-2005, 12:39 PM
I think Rolle or Rogers would do well for us. But Rogers is agressive and a run stopper, something sorely lacking on this defense.

I have a question on Rogers. I saw the hit Rogers made during the Sugar Bowl near the goal line. It was a very impressive stop. I have also read a bunch of draft "experts" takes on Rogers, and they all seem to say Rogers is not a run stopper at all. And since I didn't see Auburn play many games at all, my question is this...

Is everybody on the Planet assuming Rogers is a run stopper because of that one hit, or does everybody here know something the draft "experts" seemed to have missed?

nmt1
03-17-2005, 12:42 PM
Best available player regardless of position.

Woodrow Call
03-17-2005, 12:46 PM
I have a question on Rogers. I saw the hit Rogers made during the Sugar Bowl near the goal line. It was a very impressive stop. I have also read a bunch of draft "experts" takes on Rogers, and they all seem to say Rogers is not a run stopper at all. And since I didn't see Auburn play many games at all, my question is this...

Is everybody on the Planet assuming Rogers is a run stopper because of that one hit, or does everybody here know something the draft "experts" seemed to have missed?

This is my opinion only. I would rather have a CB that can cover than a CB that is great is run support. Deion wasn't anything more than terrible at run support but he was very important to a few Super Bowl teams.

Rodgers can tackle. He might not be able to hit like a converted safety but he will do.

Chiefnj
03-17-2005, 12:57 PM
Scouting reports are funny because they always appear to contain conflicting information.

Here is an excerpt for Green (CB):

Positives: "Will not hesitate to come up and plug holes in run support"

Negatives: "Because of size issues, he is slow to get off blocks and is not physical in his run support, but will tackle"

So one one hand he won't hesitate to come up and plug holes in run support. On the other hand he's not physical in run support, but will tackle. Hmmm.

milkman
03-17-2005, 01:01 PM
Scouting reports are funny because they always appear to contain conflicting information.

Here is an excerpt for Green (CB):

Positives: "Will not hesitate to come up and plug holes in run support"

Negatives: "Because of size issues, he is slow to get off blocks and is not physical in his run support, but will tackle"

So one one hand he won't hesitate to come up and plug holes in run support. On the other hand he's not physical in run support, but will tackle. Hmmm.

I don't find this conflicting.

His size makes him slow to get off of blocks, and he's not physical, but he won't hesitate to plug holes in run support, and will tackle.

Coogs
03-17-2005, 01:06 PM
nj,

Here is one of the takes I have seen on Rogers. I have seen more like this, and none that I can recall of where Rogers has been good against the run. From nfldraftcountdown.com...

Carlos Rogers

Official Bio College: Auburn Height: 6-03/8
Position: Cornerback Weight: 196
Class: Senior 40-Yard: 4.35
SCOUTING REPORT
Strengths: Excellent size and speed for the position...Tough player who will fight through injuries...Great athleticism...Good ball skills and has become a a playmaker as a senior...Has a lot of experience and made an impact early on as a freshman.
Weaknesses: Doesn't always play up to his physical tools...Isn't a great tackler...Not very stout against the run...Has a lot of work to do in terms of his technique...Needs to master the nuances of the position rather than relying on his physical gifts so much.

Coogs
03-17-2005, 01:11 PM
And The Draft Exchange...

Pros:Great athlete, is a playmaker. Good size and speed, natural talent.
Cons:Needs to refine his techniques, be more stout against the run.

Gaz
03-17-2005, 01:11 PM
From http://www.footballsfuture.com/2005/prospects/carlos_rogers.html
Carlos Rogers has always been a solid football player, but he truly emerged his senior season. He took home the Thorpe Award for the nations top defensive back, after totaling 47 tackles, 5 for loss, with 2 interceptions. For his career, he had 181 tackles, 7 interceptions, and 45 pass breakups.
Rogers is a great all around corner prospect. He has good size, speed, and athleticism. What makes him a great player however is his attitude. He’s tough, will get in your face, and never give up. He’s just a great football player. He can turn and run with most receivers, make plays on the ball, but will also make a hit in the running game. He has very good instincts and can play bump, man up, or in zone coverage.

Rogers has a lot of experience, but he still relies on talent too much. He needs to get with a coach to teach him the corner spot, and to help him reach his full potential. He could get stronger too, which will help him keep the jam on receivers at the line and help him finish off more tackles.

You can find someone to say whatever you want to hear about any player.

The internet makes it so.

xoxo~
Gaz
Taking it all with a rim of salt.

Coogs
03-17-2005, 01:13 PM
I could find more, but see what I mean. Most on this board think Rogers is a tackling machine. The "experts" seem to think not. Just curious if everyone here is basing their opinion on that one hit in the Sugar Bowl?

kc rush
03-17-2005, 01:15 PM
[QUOTE=Gaz]

Rogers has a lot of experience, but he still relies on talent too much. He needs to get with a coach to teach him the corner spot, and to help him reach his full potential. He could get stronger too, which will help him keep the jam on receivers at the line and help him finish off more tackles.
QUOTE]


That scares me considering who our DB coach is.

Coogs
03-17-2005, 01:15 PM
Gaz,

I saw "The Hit". It was darn impressive. Given the right curcimstances, I would imagine everyone in the NFL could "make a hit in the running game".

I have not seen one single take that says Rogers is "strong" against the run though.

Gaz
03-17-2005, 01:19 PM
Coogs-

I am not trying to pick a fight. I am just pointing out that the “experts” seldom agree on anything and you can always find someone willing to say whatever you want him to say.

Personally, I am more interested in how he is against the pass than how he is against the run. Not that I want my CB to flee contact, but that is not my primary criterion.

xoxo~
Gaz
Bound to run out of salt before football season starts.

Chiefnj
03-17-2005, 01:23 PM
I don't find this conflicting.

His size makes him slow to get off of blocks, and he's not physical, but he won't hesitate to plug holes in run support, and will tackle.


So he's not physical against the run, but he won't hesitate to come up and plug holes and tackle? Sounds physical to me.

You have a bunch of scouts and scout-wannabe's who don't want to be wrong. So they write up reports to cover their rumps.

Chiefnj
03-17-2005, 01:29 PM
I have not seen one single take that says Rogers is "strong" against the run though.

Coogs,

I can't help you. I only really saw Rogers in his Bowl game. Bowl games this year tended to focus on potential high draft picks. They showed Rogers covering some receivers like a shadow, when ordinarily such plays aren't aired. During the regular season it is extremely difficult to gauge a corner, especially the better ones because teams rarely throw their way. If they aren't being thrown at, they don't get air time.

It wouldn't surprise me if most top college corners aren't that good against the run. I would tend to think that most coaches would put the corner on the oppositions best receiver and tell him his #1 priority is covering the guy by himself.

milkman
03-17-2005, 01:35 PM
So he's not physical against the run, but he won't hesitate to come up and plug holes and tackle? Sounds physical to me.

You have a bunch of scouts and scout-wannabe's who don't want to be wrong. So they write up reports to cover their rumps.

I don't think you necessarily have to be phsical to make a tackle.

Physical implies hard hitter.

I think Scott Fujita is a good example.

He's not really physical, but he's willing to tackle.

May not have to be good at, but at least he's willing, unlike some wusses (Deion).

Chiefnj
03-17-2005, 02:02 PM
I don't think you necessarily have to be phsical to make a tackle.

Physical implies hard hitter.

I think Scott Fujita is a good example.

He's not really physical, but he's willing to tackle.

May not have to be good at, but at least he's willing, unlike some wusses (Deion).

I have a different interpretation of a corner being physical. I don't expect many corners to be hard hitters. That's the job of the safeties and LBs. To me, a corner who comes up and actively supports the run D - is a physical corner (for run support purposes).

milkman
03-17-2005, 02:12 PM
I have a different interpretation of a corner being physical. I don't expect many corners to be hard hitters. That's the job of the safeties and LBs. To me, a corner who comes up and actively supports the run D - is a physical corner (for run support purposes).

I would suggest that the writer of the draft report has the same interpretation of physical that I have.

Either that, or he's an idiot.

Both are distinct possibilties.

Coogs
03-17-2005, 02:25 PM
Gaz,

I'm not wanting an arguement either. I have just read so many takes from Planeteers saying that Rogers is "all that and a bag of chips". All anyone here seems to have to support their case about Rogers is that one hit during the Sugar Bowl. Yet everything I read on him basically says he needs to improve his technique in pass defense, and that he does not do well against the run.

I haven't seen enough of Rogers to know. I have not seen that much of Jackson from Michigan either. But the pro Michigan bunch here has me very interested in their guy.

I would like to see some of the Rogers homers state a good case for their guy like the Jackson bunch have.

the Talking Can
03-17-2005, 02:27 PM
What cornerback in this years draft do you want to see wearing a Chiefs uniform?

the best one

Coogs
03-17-2005, 02:29 PM
Coogs,

I can't help you. I only really saw Rogers in his Bowl game. Bowl games this year tended to focus on potential high draft picks. They showed Rogers covering some receivers like a shadow, when ordinarily such plays aren't aired. During the regular season it is extremely difficult to gauge a corner, especially the better ones because teams rarely throw their way. If they aren't being thrown at, they don't get air time.

It wouldn't surprise me if most top college corners aren't that good against the run. I would tend to think that most coaches would put the corner on the oppositions best receiver and tell him his #1 priority is covering the guy by himself.

nj,

That makes sense. I have also done some reading on Marlin Jackson since the Michigan homers have been pimping him, and it appears he is strong against the run as well as a good pass defender.

Myself, I kind of want a CB who can do both things well.

milkman
03-17-2005, 02:31 PM
the best one

Yeah, I want that guy too! :thumb:

Mr. Flopnuts
11-29-2007, 10:52 PM
Of course, all bets are off should Johnson fall within our grasp.

Otherwise, gimme Rogers.

xoxo~
Gaz
Not expecting to do a Johnson happy dance.




I miss this guy. I hope you did a big happy Johnson dance Gaz, where ever you are. Who's been the best of these CB's so far? Rolle, no?

'Hamas' Jenkins
11-29-2007, 11:11 PM
As far as a big play CB, I'd probably say Pacman, but he may never play another down.

I'm still thinking Rolle. Rogers has been blah.

Mecca
11-30-2007, 02:45 AM
Rolle would be an awesome FS, but that is another debate.

Tribal Warfare
11-30-2007, 05:54 AM
I miss this guy. I hope you did a big happy Johnson dance Gaz, where ever you are. Who's been the best of these CB's so far? Rolle, no?


he's around, he checked out the BB at 5:13 PM if you look at his profile link.