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Bootlegged
03-18-2005, 06:11 AM
GRETZ: The Forgotten
Mar 18, 2005, 5:32:58 AM by Bob Gretz



All the attention, all the words, all the discussion surrounding the Chiefs since the end of the 2004 season has been about the teamís defense.



Rightfully so. The difference between the Chiefs making the playoffs and the Chiefs sitting at home with their 7-9 record was the defense. Thereís no doubt about that, no argument, no discussion needed.

And, as the weeks have flown off the calendar since the final game in San Diego, all the focus has been on free agency. Soon, the attention will turn to the NFL Draft, which is just five weeks from Saturday.

Forgotten, overlooked and just plain ignored in all this discussion is the one area that will make the biggest difference in the Chiefs defense in the 2005 season. It will not be free agents signed, or players drafted.

It will be improvement from within. It will come from players already on the roster lifting their game to another level.

Letís face it: the Chiefs have too many holes on their defense to fill them all through free agency, which is a giant crapshoot anyway. Only less so is the draft, which is unlikely to provide much help this season.

No, if the defense is going to make strides to lift itself from the bottom of the league to even mediocrity, itís going to need players already wearing the red and gold to make the biggest difference. In almost every case, these players are younger guys, given the fact that veterans have pretty much established their level of ability and production. Who might these players be? Letís talk about a few of them.

Although the defensive line was the most solid position group in the unit last season, there is a lot of room for improvement and that must come from three young men: Ryan Sims, Junior Siavii and Jimmy Wilkerson.

Last year, Jared Allen showed great promise in his rookie season and the Chiefs need him to continue to improve. But for the defense to be better, they need Sims, Siavii and Wilkerson to take some giant steps.

By the definition of both Carl Peterson and Dick Vermeil, Sims has yet to live up to the status as the sixth pick in the NFL Draft. A player taken at that level challenges for a trip to the Pro Bowl. Players taken that high can at times dominate the line of scrimmage and shut down an opponentís ability to run the middle of the defense. So far Sims has shown none of that. This is the year he proves his worth, or proves the Chiefs over-evaluated his potential.

What would help Sims is if Siavii takes the experiences of his rookie season, comes back in the off-season program and works his tail off and takes a giant step towards being the dominant player the Chiefs think he can become.

Wilkerson enters his third NFL season at just 24 years old. Remember, he was drafted after his junior season at Oklahoma. At times, this young man has shown flashes of being a solid contributor. At other times, he disappears. Thatís not unusual for a young man getting his feet wet. However, those days are over. The Chiefs need Wilkerson to become a major player at end, a guy they can count on to be a regular part of the rotation with Allen and Hicks.

At linebacker, the Chiefs used a third-round choice last year on Keyaron Fox. Thatís an indication they believe he can become a starter and contributor; thatís what first day players taken in the NFL Draft are supposed to do. Right now, the Chiefs can only talk about Foxís potential, because last season he got the fewest snaps of anybody on the defensive roster. He was on the active roster for all 16 games and made the game-day roster 12 times, getting defensive action just once: against Denver at Arrowhead. Heís the only defensive player active for that much time that wasnít credited with a single tackle, although he had nine on special teams.

The Chiefs have made their desire to upgrade their linebacker play obvious; thatís why Kendrell Bell was signed. If given the opportunity, Fox can help if he pushes his game to the next level.

In the secondary, the focus has to be on Benny Sapp. By the end of last season, the rookie free agent had passed both Julian Battle and William Bartee as the extra DB that Gunther Cunningham trusted most. To go from Northern Iowa, to being a contributor on any defense in the NFL is a huge jump. To go from a surprising rookie season to a contributing position on a defense in the top half of the league is an even bigger jump.

But thatís what Sapp must do this season. Two other one-time rookie free agents on the defense Ė Eric Hicks and Lional Dalton Ė played in just five games combined during their first years in the league. Sapp played in 15. In their second seasons, both Hicks and Dalton played in all 16 games and Hicks started 16 games at defensive end for the Chiefs. The Chiefs need the same kind of improvement from Sapp.

Kendrell Bell will help. So will Sammy Knight and whatever veteran cornerback the Chiefs decide to acquire (Ty Law, Patrick Surtain or someone else.) But for the effort thatís needed to lift this defense, there must be improvement from within.

The opinions offered in this column do not necessarily reflect those of the Kansas City Chiefs.

Chan93lx50
03-18-2005, 06:22 AM
What a dumb fugging HOMER :shake:

Soon he will say we dont need FA we have the players we need already, what a dumbass

Andoverer
03-18-2005, 06:25 AM
What a dumb fugging HOMER :shake:

Soon he will say we dont need FA we have the players we need already, what a dumbass

I don't think that was his point at all. He said we can't get ALL of our improvement from free agency. Some of the young guys just need to step up to the plate.

HemiEd
03-18-2005, 06:25 AM
Very good article and a lot of truth to it in my opinion. :hmmm:

htismaqe
03-18-2005, 06:30 AM
He's right...if the defense is REALLY going to improve, it' going to be with the improvement of guys like Sims, Fujita, Wesley, Warfield, Sapp and others.

However, even I can admit it's not bloody likely.

milkman
03-18-2005, 06:33 AM
Very good article and a lot of truth to it in my opinion. :hmmm:

Yeah, but it was like "duh, ya think?"

HemiEd
03-18-2005, 06:40 AM
Yeah, but it was like "duh, ya think?"


Yep, this time of year these writers have to do that to find something to write about. It would be nice to see some of these guys step up. I have read on here that Sims has actually been working out in the off season? I think it is his contract year.

ChiefGator
03-18-2005, 08:02 AM
It will be improvement from within. It will come from players already on the roster lifting their game to another level.

We're DOOOOMMMEEEDDD!!!

I actually do think that every time I hear something about improvement from within our roster. How sad, I have completely lost faith in our abillity to draft or groom players.

htismaqe
03-18-2005, 08:06 AM
Yep, this time of year these writers have to do that to find something to write about. It would be nice to see some of these guys step up. I have read on here that Sims has actually been working out in the off season? I think it is his contract year.

Yeah, someone here (Phobia?) said they heard Sims was staying in town this offseason to workout, instead of heading to Atlanta.

If it's his contract year, at least we could possibly get one good season out of him.

HemiEd
03-18-2005, 08:11 AM
Yeah, someone here (Phobia?) said they heard Sims was staying in town this offseason to workout, instead of heading to Atlanta.

If it's his contract year, at least we could possibly get one good season out of him.


Considering he held out and got injured he really has not had an inordinate amount of snaps, he should show a lot of improvement IMO.
The guy certainly has the stature to be a force, he is huge.

jAZ
03-18-2005, 08:15 AM
Very good article and a lot of truth to it in my opinion. :hmmm:
Yup.

milkman
03-18-2005, 08:20 AM
Considering he held out and got injured he really has not had an inordinate amount of snaps, he should show a lot of improvement IMO.
The guy certainly has the stature to be a force, he is huge.

Gun said that some players don't get it until their 3rd year, and with his injury as a rookie, this is effectively his 3rd year.

But Jimmy Wilkerson is the guy that I really hope finally steps it up and becomes the player that the Chiefs envisioned.
We need somebody that can really give the Cfinally push Eric Hicks to the bench, in spite of the Chiefs love affair with him.

Frankie
03-18-2005, 08:24 AM
Can someone tell me why Keyron Fox is not in Europe this year?

HemiEd
03-18-2005, 08:32 AM
Gun said that some players don't get it until their 3rd year, and with his injury as a rookie, this is effectively his 3rd year.

But Jimmy Wilkerson is the guy that I really hope finally steps it up and becomes the player that the Chiefs envisioned.
We need somebody that can really give the Cfinally push Eric Hicks to the bench, in spite of the Chiefs love affair with him.


My view of Hicks is that he is more like Maz than Simms. Hicks has the work ethic and desire but not the tools. It would be nice to see someone, anyone, with better tools force him out of the lineup IMO.

MOhillbilly
03-18-2005, 08:34 AM
that article literaly made my skin crawl.
WTF is that guy thinking........PUKE!

J Diddy
03-18-2005, 08:36 AM
Can someone tell me why Keyron Fox is not in Europe this year?

First day pick.
Big egos.

milkman
03-18-2005, 08:43 AM
My view of Hicks is that he is more like Maz than Simms. Hicks has the work ethic and desire but not the tools. It would be nice to see someone, anyone, with better tools force him out of the lineup IMO.

My feelings exactly.

I respect his desire and effort, but it simply doesn't add up to production.

Put him on the bench, rotate him into the lineup, but give me a producer on the field as a starter.

kc rush
03-18-2005, 08:58 AM
Did anyone else get the feeling that the front office is floating this column out there to signal they are done with free agency?

CosmicPal
03-18-2005, 09:02 AM
What a dumb fugging HOMER :shake:

Soon he will say we dont need FA we have the players we need already, what a dumbass

Before you start calling other people "dumb" I think you need to read the article again.

All of the players he mentioned in the article, with the exception of Bartee and Hicks SHOULD improve. Gretz is absolutely correct- the younger players in our system must step it up NOW. They've had the year or two under their belt, they've learned the plays, the formations, the techniques, and everything that goes to improving your play on the field.

If these young guys on our defense don't make improvements- no matter how many free agents you acquire- it won't matter- you will still have a bad defense.

milkman
03-18-2005, 09:04 AM
Did anyone else get the feeling that the front office is floating this column out there to signal they are done with free agency?

Really?

But.....but......but.......He says his opinions don't reflect those of the Chiefs! :harumph:

ROYC75
03-18-2005, 09:05 AM
Blah Blah Blah .......... let's not forget, Carl drafted or made this team.....


Improvement from within...... blah blah blah ....... it should have started a long time ago.

kc rush
03-18-2005, 09:06 AM
Really?

But.....but......but.......He says his opinions don't reflect those of the Chiefs! :harumph:


They don't "necessarily" reflect those of the Chiefs, yet somehow they always do. :hmmm:

milkman
03-18-2005, 09:09 AM
They don't "necessarily" reflect those of the Chiefs, yet somehow they always do. :hmmm:

Oh no!

My faith in the media is completely shattered! :deevee:

whoman69
03-18-2005, 09:10 AM
Secretary: Mr Gretz, Carl Pederson is on the line
Gretz: Oh goody, send it thru
CP: Bob, I need you to write a story today on how the most improvement we can make is by our own players getting better
Gretz: Didn't we use that piece last year
CP: Yeah, just change it around a little. When I say jump, you say how high.
Gretz: Yes master. Say can I get over there, get some quotes? My nose is getting cold, I need to nestle it amongst your asscheeks.
CP: Bah, just get the piece done before I get angry.



What a load of caca. What this article does is actually takes expectations down. We have all these underachieving draft picks from the past few seasons and now the only way for us to get better is for them to step up? But if they can step up we will be great, so there's no need for us to get free agents. Hate to spill the news on you Gretzy, but Pederson's track record in the draft is atrocious. More than likely, these guys are going to prove to be the bust they have shown up to this date.

Cochise
03-18-2005, 09:23 AM
What's the big deal? A lot of truth there I think. We can't bring in 11 free agents. If the D is going to improve most of the existing players will need to improve.

beavis
03-18-2005, 09:37 AM
Before you start calling other people "dumb" I think you need to read the article again.

All of the players he mentioned in the article, with the exception of Bartee and Hicks SHOULD improve. Gretz is absolutely correct- the younger players in our system must step it up NOW. They've had the year or two under their belt, they've learned the plays, the formations, the techniques, and everything that goes to improving your play on the field.

If these young guys on our defense don't make improvements- no matter how many free agents you acquire- it won't matter- you will still have a bad defense.
The only one that has any real chance of improving is Allen. Once you've been in the league for 5+ years the chances of you getting any better are slim to none.

milkman
03-18-2005, 09:39 AM
The only one that has any real chance of improving is Allen. Once you've been in the league for 5+ years the chances of you getting any better are slim to none.

Sims, Wilkerson, Fox and Sapp, all players with less than 5 years.

CosmicPal
03-18-2005, 09:44 AM
The only one that has any real chance of improving is Allen. Once you've been in the league for 5+ years the chances of you getting any better are slim to none.

Uhhhhh, that is correct.

Wilkerson hasn't been here five years plus. Sims hasn't been here five years plus. Siavii hasn't been here five years plus. Fox hasn't been here five years plus. Mitchell hasn't been here five years plus. Battle hasn't been here five years plus. Sapp hasn't been here five years plus. Improvement can only can from within. All of these young players in addition to the free agents.

Chiefnj
03-18-2005, 09:51 AM
I made a similar post months ago. The most important thing isn't free agency, or the draft - it is improvement from within.

The Chiefs desperately need players already on the roster to step up.

If you go back and look at Fox's scouting report coming out of college, it is just as good as any of the OLBs in this years draft, with the exception of DJ. Wilkerson was one of those kids who left school early and all the draft guru's said it was a mistake because had he stayed the extra year, he would have likely been a first day draft pick. Now after a few years in the NFL he needs to step up to that potential, the same with Siavii.

beavis
03-18-2005, 09:53 AM
Uhhhhh, that is correct.

Wilkerson hasn't been here five years plus. Sims hasn't been here five years plus. Siavii hasn't been here five years plus. Fox hasn't been here five years plus. Mitchell hasn't been here five years plus. Battle hasn't been here five years plus. Sapp hasn't been here five years plus. Improvement can only can from within. All of these young players in addition to the free agents.
You named one guy that will start, and this will be his fourth year, do you really expect him to substantially improve? The other ones will be riding pine.

Mark M
03-18-2005, 09:59 AM
It would be much easier for the Chiefs to improve from within if their assistant coaches on defense didn't suck so much ass.

And if Kc won't get any help from the draft ("Only less so is the draft, which is unlikely to provide much help this season") then why not trade the 2nd for Surtain and then move down in the 1st to pick up a 2nd or 3rd?

MM
~~:banghead:

Coogs
03-18-2005, 10:25 AM
Can someone tell me why Keyron Fox is not in Europe this year?

My guess is that they wanted to keep him here so he can practice and learn our systems.

CosmicPal
03-18-2005, 10:25 AM
You named one guy that will start, and this will be his fourth year, do you really expect him to substantially improve? The other ones will be riding pine.

beavis- I am merely pointing out the number of players that have the potential to improve, and that were under YOUR five year window.

Sims is essentially on his third year of football- fourth year in the organization maybe, but his third year on the field. Wilkerson was a project that has shown flashes- Siavii is a project that is ONLY in his second year and Mitchell improved his play toward the end of last season.

You said, the ONLY one who has a chance for improving is Allen- and I'm saying BS! All of the guys I mentioned above have a chance for improving- 'cause they are all under your five year window of decline. Until they all reach your five year window of decline- you can't say these kids don't have the potential to improve....

Manila-Chief
03-18-2005, 10:49 AM
We're DOOOOMMMEEEDDD!!!

I actually do think that every time I hear something about improvement from within our roster. How sad, I have completely lost faith in our abillity to draft or groom players.

Didn't he write the same stuff last year????

Therefore your .... "We're DOOOOMMMEEEDDD!!!" is right on target!!!

Logical
03-18-2005, 10:56 AM
It would be much easier for the Chiefs to improve from within if their assistant coaches on defense didn't suck so much ass.

And if Kc won't get any help from the draft ("Only less so is the draft, which is unlikely to provide much help this season") then why not trade the 2nd for Surtain and then move down in the 1st to pick up a 2nd or 3rd?

MM
~~:banghead:Agree wih you on crap ass assistants, agree with you on Surtain. Definitely disagree on moving down in the first round 15 allows for players with the potential of a Tony Gonzalez late 20 to 32 pretty much guarantee at best average career players all to allow Carl to pick an almost guaranteed bust in the 2nd or 3rd round.

TEX
03-18-2005, 10:56 AM
I was waiting for "improvement from within" last year and they got WORSE. So, last year PROVED that this is a BAD plan. :shake:

IMO, Saivii and Allen have huge upside. Sims will never live up to expactations, but might be effective if he becomes more consistent. Mitchell was not worth a # 2 and will be nothing more than a back up anD special teamer. Battle can't play CB he might help at Safety. Sapp can play but not at a # 2 CB - maybe he can be a band aid for awhile, but the most we can hope for is to him to become a solid #3. Maybe I'm wrong with Sapp - we'll see...

Course the best way to improve from within would be to have BETTER defensive coaches... :hmmm:

Mr. Laz
03-18-2005, 11:16 AM
It will be improvement from within. It will come from players already on the roster lifting their game to another level.

only problem is that this was the plan for improvement last year as well.


and the players were unable/unwilling to to what it took to lift their game to another level.


gretz is a bonehead

beavis
03-18-2005, 11:42 AM
beavis- I am merely pointing out the number of players that have the potential to improve, and that were under YOUR five year window.

Sims is essentially on his third year of football- fourth year in the organization maybe, but his third year on the field. Wilkerson was a project that has shown flashes- Siavii is a project that is ONLY in his second year and Mitchell improved his play toward the end of last season.

You said, the ONLY one who has a chance for improving is Allen- and I'm saying BS! All of the guys I mentioned above have a chance for improving- 'cause they are all under your five year window of decline. Until they all reach your five year window of decline- you can't say these kids don't have the potential to improve....
Ok, you're right. I'll restate what I said. The only one who has a chance of making a significant contribution this year is Allen, and I'm not convinced that he's legit yet either.

I get your point man, I just don't think any of the players you listed will make a noticable difference in the way the D plays this year.

whoman69
03-18-2005, 12:00 PM
What's the big deal? A lot of truth there I think. We can't bring in 11 free agents. If the D is going to improve most of the existing players will need to improve.
The problem is that its an excuse. Sorry we couldn't get the free agents we need, but all these guys should get better. We said the same thing last year when it was decided not to go after free agents. Nobody expects us to relace 11 starters in one offseason, but this article is creating excuses and lowered expectations, and if it doesn't happen to turn out badly, then CP is a genious. If it does, then blame these guys for not getting better, the Chiefs did nothing wrong. One of these players we are counting on, according to the article, is a 2nd year undrafted FA. Another declared for the draft too soon, and there's no we he can sit on the bench and learn more than he had playing a full season in college. Another has had 3 seasons to prove himself and come up short. Another coming off most of the season injured. Why is there any expectation that they will get better.
We haven't made sufficient improvement in the FA, our recent draft history is poor leading to a lack of confidence that this draft will improve us.

Rausch
03-18-2005, 12:08 PM
It would be much easier for the Chiefs to improve from within if their assistant coaches on defense didn't suck so much ass.


MM
~~:banghead:

BINGO! Most of Gun's assistant and position coaches should be drug out behind the stadium and given buss money...

CosmicPal
03-18-2005, 12:24 PM
I get your point man, I just don't think any of the players you listed will make a noticable difference in the way the D plays this year.

It's all good. :thumb:

I think our defense will be improved, but how much that is we won't know until the latter parts of the season when it counts the most. Let us all pray- they are better than we all expected.

Chan93lx50
03-18-2005, 12:32 PM
BINGO! Most of Gun's assistant and position coaches should be drug out behind the stadium and given buss money...

Funny thing is they are not Gun's they are Dicks.

The thing that pisses me off about this article its the same damn crap we heard last year, and personally I do not want to relive last years Defensive experience

tk13
03-18-2005, 12:37 PM
I think it's foolish to expect 7-8 guys to step up. However, having 2 or 3 guys really improve their play would really, really help the defense. I don't think that is a real absurd idea, hopefully guys like Bell and Knight can be leaders for the others.

htismaqe
03-18-2005, 12:59 PM
The problem is that its an excuse. Sorry we couldn't get the free agents we need, but all these guys should get better. We said the same thing last year when it was decided not to go after free agents. Nobody expects us to relace 11 starters in one offseason, but this article is creating excuses and lowered expectations, and if it doesn't happen to turn out badly, then CP is a genious. If it does, then blame these guys for not getting better, the Chiefs did nothing wrong. One of these players we are counting on, according to the article, is a 2nd year undrafted FA. Another declared for the draft too soon, and there's no we he can sit on the bench and learn more than he had playing a full season in college. Another has had 3 seasons to prove himself and come up short. Another coming off most of the season injured. Why is there any expectation that they will get better.
We haven't made sufficient improvement in the FA, our recent draft history is poor leading to a lack of confidence that this draft will improve us.

Please point out for those of us that don't try to find hidden meaning where there isn't any:

Where exactly did Gretz say anything resembling an excuse?

TEX
03-18-2005, 01:04 PM
Please point out for those of us that don't try to find hidden meaning where there isn't any:

Where exactly did Gretz say anything resembling an excuse?

It's the whole "improvement from within" theme. IF we signed more FA we wouldn't have to rely so heavily on improving from within... :hmmm:

BigChiefFan
03-18-2005, 01:10 PM
We've tried the improvement from within for 4 years and it's not getting much better.The Chiefs FO needs to wake up and realize some of the players that they picked are busts. Time to move on and quit making excuses for them. Patience is one thing, stupidity is another. Retaining Bartee is teetering on stupidity.

Woodrow Call
03-18-2005, 01:13 PM
I think it's foolish to expect 7-8 guys to step up. However, having 2 or 3 guys really improve their play would really, really help the defense. I don't think that is a real absurd idea, hopefully guys like Bell and Knight can be leaders for the others.

I think the biggest improvement will come from these 3 guys.

Sims-contract year
Fujita-2nd year in scheme(if he resigns)
Wesley/Woods-both of these guys want to start. which one wants it worse?

Will it be enough to overcome the CB problem I doubt it but anything would help.

BigChiefFan
03-18-2005, 01:13 PM
You don't see how relying on Benny Sapp to elevate his game is a bad plan of action to improving the defense? That's the biggest EXCUSE I've ever seen for being content with the players we have.

Woodrow Call
03-18-2005, 01:18 PM
You don't see how relying on Benny Sapp to elevate his game is a bad plan of action to improving the defense? That's the biggest EXCUSE I've ever seen for being content with the players we have.

The 4 games without Warfield sends shutters down my spine. Bartee, McCleon, Battle and Sapp; 2 of them would be starting if the season started today. :cuss:

tk13
03-18-2005, 01:20 PM
You don't see how relying on Benny Sapp to elevate his game is a bad plan of action to improving the defense? That's the biggest EXCUSE I've ever seen for being content with the players we have.
I don't think there's a single person on this board who's looking to rely on Benny Sapp to be the leader of the defense, that's absurd. But if you get a couple guys like Sims or Wilkerson or Kawika Mitchell to take it to improve their play, it could really help make this a more complete defense. That's all, don't read too much into it.

BigChiefFan
03-18-2005, 01:24 PM
The 4 games without Warfield sends shutters down my spine. Bartee, McCleon, Battle and Sapp; 2 of them would be starting if the season started today. :cuss:
I know. It's absurd to rely on that group. Sure, we will get a rookie, but I'd feel ALOT better knowing we had a Surtain AND a ROOKIE. As it is now, the approach of improvement from within that group is laughable. Yea, Bartee after 5 years is going to turn into an INTerception machine. Sure, Battle is finally going to elevate his game enough to stop teams number one WRs. Sure, Sapp is the next Ty Law. Who the **** do they think they are fooling? I'm all for the players improving, but asking that group or my like, DEPENDING on that to happen is a recipe for disaster revision 17.

BigChiefFan
03-18-2005, 01:28 PM
I don't think there's a single person on this board who's looking to rely on Benny Sapp to be the leader of the defense, that's absurd. But if you get a couple guys like Sims or Wilkerson or Kawika Mitchell to take it to improve their play, it could really help make this a more complete defense. That's all, don't read too much into it.

Gretz: "In the secondary, the focus has to be on Benny Sapp."

At this point, I might be reading too much into it, but if they go into next season depnding on that group with some rookies, I think we can honestly say that isn't the coarse of action most would deem the best approach to improving the defense, myself included.

Mr. Laz
03-18-2005, 01:29 PM
I don't think there's a single person on this board who's looking to rely on Benny Sapp to be the leader of the defense, that's absurd. But if you get a couple guys like Sims or Wilkerson or Kawika Mitchell to take it to improve their play, it could really help make this a more complete defense. That's all, don't read too much into it.

still doesn't change the fact that, as of right now, our starting cornerbacks opening day are Bartee and warfield.

and more likely to be Bartee and McCleon when/if Warfield gets his likely suspension.


but hey ... maybe Bartee with show improvement

tk13
03-18-2005, 01:31 PM
still doesn't change the fact that, as of right now, our starting cornerbacks opening day are Bartee and warfield.

and more likely to be Bartee and McCleon when/if Warfield gets his likely suspension.


but hey ... maybe Bartee with show improvement
No way Carl goes into training camp with those guys as our starters...

Mr. Laz
03-18-2005, 01:43 PM
No way Carl goes into training camp with those guys as our starters...
:titus:

Mr. Flopnuts
03-18-2005, 01:45 PM
I think it's foolish to expect 7-8 guys to step up. However, having 2 or 3 guys really improve their play would really, really help the defense. I don't think that is a real absurd idea, hopefully guys like Bell and Knight can be leaders for the others.


I don't know about the rest of you because I am new to this board, but allow me to state that I felt the same way in previous years about Shawn Barber, Dexter McCleon (It was a stretch but I hoped), and Vonnie Holliday. So far none of that has happened. There is positively no excuse whatsoever for the Chiefs to have not signed a big name FA that has established himself as a perennial force on the defensive side of the ball. While I entirely support the signing of Sammy Knight, why did we go and fill a position that was not on the top of our priority list? The safety position will always suffer when the rest of your defense is not capable of taking care of their own individual responsibilities, as the safties are basically out there for support anyway. Good job, light a fire under the arses of Woods, and Wesley, but goddammit do it after you've made the neccessary adjustments to put those guys in a real position to succeed. Until we get a true force on our defensive line, a monster LB that can stuff the gap, and a shutdown corner that will entirely remove a teams best WR you're only hanging Sammy Knight out to dry next season. I know everyone is absolutely thrilled with the potential of Bell to come in next year and be the savior of our LB core, but I said the same thing about Shawn Barber and he had no where near the injury history that Bell does. We're in trouble folks, the plane is out of gas and we only just took off. Until this front office actually addresses the needs of this team, we are not going to have the team that will end our 34 years of misery. Further more, while everyone took the time to bash Wesley last night over his comments, and I in no way can condone them, the guy does have a point when it comes to why would you make a change in the area that needs it the least? Surtain should've been acquired long before now, because I would go out on a limb and wager a lot of money that we could've signed him to a similar deal that we gave to Bell. While some would say that a LB is "worth" more, that isn't the case when you have NO ONE that can keep up with the speed other teams produce at WR. When your number 1 option at CB is Warfield, you're in trouble. That guy CANNOT defend against the long ball, he's proven it over and over again. What can I say, free agency is over and I would guess that we're in store for a season very similar to the last one we endured, because I am a firm believer that the 13-3 season a couple of years ago was against the grain if you will, because that team only believed in itself through October and we all watched what happened after that. Here's to what appears to be another dissapointing season of Chiefs football.

htismaqe
03-18-2005, 01:53 PM
Gretz: "In the secondary, the focus has to be on Benny Sapp."

At this point, I might be reading too much into it, but if they go into next season depnding on that group with some rookies, I think we can honestly say that isn't the coarse of action most would deem the best approach to improving the defense, myself included.

You are reading too much into it.

kc rush
03-18-2005, 02:28 PM
chiefman - put some breaks in there. It was hard to read.

Mr. Flopnuts
03-18-2005, 02:44 PM
chiefman - put some breaks in there. It was hard to read.


sorry, i was ranting

Logical
03-18-2005, 03:25 PM
I don't know about the rest of you because I am new to this board, but allow me to state that I felt the same way in previous years about Shawn Barber, Dexter McCleon (It was a stretch but I hoped), and Vonnie Holliday. So far none of that has happened. There is positively no excuse whatsoever for the Chiefs to have not signed a big name FA that has established himself as a perennial force on the defensive side of the ball. While I entirely support the signing of Sammy Knight, why did we go and fill a position that was not on the top of our priority list? The safety position will always suffer when the rest of your defense is not capable of taking care of their own individual responsibilities, as the safties are basically out there for support anyway. Good job, light a fire under the arses of Woods, and Wesley, but goddammit do it after you've made the neccessary adjustments to put those guys in a real position to succeed. Until we get a true force on our defensive line, a monster LB that can stuff the gap, and a shutdown corner that will entirely remove a teams best WR you're only hanging Sammy Knight out to dry next season. I know everyone is absolutely thrilled with the potential of Bell to come in next year and be the savior of our LB core, but I said the same thing about Shawn Barber and he had no where near the injury history that Bell does. We're in trouble folks, the plane is out of gas and we only just took off. Until this front office actually addresses the needs of this team, we are not going to have the team that will end our 34 years of misery. Further more, while everyone took the time to bash Wesley last night over his comments, and I in no way can condone them, the guy does have a point when it comes to why would you make a change in the area that needs it the least? Surtain should've been acquired long before now, because I would go out on a limb and wager a lot of money that we could've signed him to a similar deal that we gave to Bell. While some would say that a LB is "worth" more, that isn't the case when you have NO ONE that can keep up with the speed other teams produce at WR. When your number 1 option at CB is Warfield, you're in trouble. That guy CANNOT defend against the long ball, he's proven it over and over again. What can I say, free agency is over and I would guess that we're in store for a season very similar to the last one we endured, because I am a firm believer that the 13-3 season a couple of years ago was against the grain if you will, because that team only believed in itself through October and we all watched what happened after that. Here's to what appears to be another dissapointing season of Chiefs football.

Given the situation right now I agree with you. Sign Surtain and I might start to waiver. Sign Surtain and an OLB of 2nd tier quality and I will start to believe in the Chiefs chances.

whoman69
03-18-2005, 04:18 PM
Please point out for those of us that don't try to find hidden meaning where there isn't any:

Where exactly did Gretz say anything resembling an excuse?
Its an excuse Gretz says the biggest thing we can do is to expect improvement from guys already on the defense now. Carl doesn't need to sign another player if we can just somehow get these players to live up to the potential that genious CP has seen in them. Click in Sims/Bartee/Mitchell/Freeman/Battle from last year and you could write exactly the same article. I don't see how you can just assume people that have never shown us anything are going to suddenly become better. IMO you have to go into camp expecting the same thing out of them and work to improve those areas. The only starter he mentioned is Sims. What has he shown to say he's going to improve his game to the Pro Bowl level we drafted him at #6 overall for. Does anyone truly expect Fox to be able to step up and become a starter when he couldn't even get thru camp last year and was out with injuries? Does Wilkerson merit any consideration at all to proclaim that he didn't make a huge mistake coming out early? Is it just as possible that Allen slips instead of improving? Depends on if he has gained some bulk and can work with it. Is Hicks going to get any better? No talk of him.