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shaneo69
03-29-2005, 08:09 AM
RAND: No need for panic in cornerback search
Mar 29, 2005, 2:36:02 AM by Jonathan Rand

When it comes to their much-ballyhooed cornerback search, the best-case scenario for the Chiefs is to have Ty Law or Patrick Surtain signed before the NFL draft April 23-24. That would free them up to draft for other key personnel needs, especially at outside linebacker.

But there’s no need for the Chiefs to get frantic before the draft. Between now and then, they might as well do their homework on first-round cornerback prospects and sit chilly. Who knows? The answer to their cornerback prayers just might lie in the draft.

Law, the lone big-time cornerback left in free agency but who’s recovering from foot surgery, won’t have screws removed from his foot until May. There’s no point signing him before seeing the progress in his rehabilitation, especially since, according to the Boston Globe, Law’s agent is asking for a deal that includes $16 million guaranteed.

The other available Pro Bowl cornerback, Patrick Surtain, is under contract with the Miami Dolphins and the Chiefs would have to part with a draft choice to obtain the right to sign him. The Chiefs have balked at yielding a second-round pick for Surtain but are in a better position to deal after picking up a compensatory third-round pick.

But if the Chiefs can’t make a deal they can stomach, why not see what cornerbacks the first round provides?

Cornerback ranks among the deepest positions in this year’s draft. ESPN.com projects a dozen cornerbacks going in the first two rounds, compared to nine in 2004 and eight in 2003. Antrel Rolle of Miami, top rated at the position, appears the only cornerback nearly certain to be taken before the Chiefs are on the clock with the 15th pick.

Adam Jones of West Virginia, noted for his speed and ability to close on the ball, is the second-rated cornerback and could fall to the Chiefs. He’s an underclassman, though, and Carlos Rogers of Auburn may be better suited to contributing right away.

The Chiefs’ chances to draft a top-notch cornerback would be enhanced if there’s credence to a popular suggestion that enforcement of the illegal contact rule has diminished the demand for top cornerbacks. According to this notion, the increase in illegal contact penalties last year has made press coverage obsolete and encouraged teams to play more zone coverages and concede the short stuff.

But the bull market on blue-chip cornerbacks in free agency strongly suggested that teams still put a premium on shutdown cornerbacks. Law is the only marquee free-agent cornerback left and if he were healthy, he’d have been signed by now, too.

Counting on a rookie cornerback wouldn’t be the ideal scenario for the Chiefs. But what if they can’t work out a deal with Law or Surtain that makes financial sense? Winning organizations don’t just hand over blank checks to agents with talented clients. The Patriots haven’t won three Super Bowls in four years by following that policy.

Rookie cornerbacks generally don’t get on the field a lot and when they do, they routinely get picked on. And the Chiefs don’t have a good recent track record in developing young cornerbacks. Since the 2000 draft, Pat Dennis, Julian Battle and William Bartee have been unable to grab or hold a starting job.

But that doesn’t mean the Chiefs should give up trying to draft a gem at cornerback, or any other position. And the idea of starting a rookie opposite Eric Warfield doesn’t seem as crazy as it did before the Chiefs’ two defensive additions in free agency.

If Warfield keeps building on his strong 2004 season and Jerome Woods or Greg Wesley bounces back to form a good safety tandem with free-agent signee Sammy Knight, the Chiefs secondary won’t be in nearly the disarray it was last season. A talented rookie cornerback could fit in, especially if the Chiefs continue to upgrade their front seven. A stronger pass rush would take heat off the cornerbacks.

Certainly, Law or Surtain provide the best answer for the Chiefs’ cornerback needs. But there may be another answer that fills the bill, too.


http://www.kcchiefs.com/news/2005/03/29/rand_no_need_for_panic_in_cornerback_search/

Gaz
03-29-2005, 08:12 AM
Oh, this is gonna be fun to watch.

xoxo~
Gaz
Settling in for the show.

ChiTown
03-29-2005, 08:22 AM
Completely agree with this article.

Sincerely,

Rufus Dawes

Baby Lee
03-29-2005, 08:31 AM
Rand: No Need for Panic
Absolutely. Just assume the suck and let signs of life come as a pleasant surprise.

Warrior5
03-29-2005, 08:47 AM
Oh, this is gonna be fun to watch.

xoxo~
Gaz
Settling in for the show.


You don't fool me Gazrand...you wrote this article.

Chiefnj
03-29-2005, 08:47 AM
The Chiefs should make it a priority to bring back Patrick Dennis to help the corners. He's an old Gunther player. He'll step it up and improve the play of Bartee, Battle and McLeon and help bring along Eric Crouch to replace Woods and Wesley.

tomahawk kid
03-29-2005, 09:00 AM
The Chiefs should make it a priority to bring back Patrick Dennis to help the corners. He's an old Gunther player. He'll step it up and improve the play of Bartee, Battle and McLeon and help bring along Eric Crouch to replace Woods and Wesley.

That's exactly what I thought. Alot of "if's" and "but's" in this article.

Mike Grose
03-29-2005, 09:14 AM
This is the same kind of head-in-the-sand thinking that had us hire Gunther and keep all of the old guard players that couldn't cut it for three years.

It's the same thinking that won't let Gunther go out and hire the coaches he wants, to coach the way he wants. Dammit! Are they Gunther's assistants or are they Vermeil's assistants? :banghead:

How many CBs are we going to have to draft and watch do nothing, before we get RID of Giunta? (I guess the answer is, all of them until Vermeil retires) :deevee:

It's past time to blow up what doesn't work.

the Talking Can
03-29-2005, 09:26 AM
Jonathan Rand is a ****ing idiot.

Let's start McCleon and a rookie for the first 4 games.

Yeah...

Brock
03-29-2005, 09:33 AM
http://www.welovetheiraqiinformationminister.com/images/07-minister.jpg

keg in kc
03-29-2005, 09:43 AM
I agree with the "No need for panic" part, but when he starts talking about starting a rookie corner across from Warfield I start to have trouble breathing.

kc rush
03-29-2005, 09:57 AM
http://www.welovetheiraqiinformationminister.com/images/07-minister.jpg

I laughed out loud on that one. I'm sure the people in the cubes next to me think I'm insane.

Rep to you :thumb:

siberian khatru
03-29-2005, 10:52 AM
Winning organizations don’t just hand over blank checks to agents with talented clients. The Patriots haven’t won three Super Bowls in four years by following that policy.

That's because they haven't had to BECAUSE THEY'VE DRAFTED SO WELL!!!

Mr. Laz
03-29-2005, 10:55 AM
http://www.welovetheiraqiinformationminister.com/images/07-minister.jpg

nicely done ROFL

Mr. Laz
03-29-2005, 10:57 AM
I agree with the "No need for panic" part, but when he starts talking about starting a rookie corner across from Warfield I start to have trouble breathing.

that's a panic attack

keg in kc
03-29-2005, 11:00 AM
that's a panic attackI see nothing gets by you. :p

BigChiefFan
03-29-2005, 11:01 AM
We shouldn't give up the farm, but there is no denying how imperative it is to get a veteran corner worth a shit on our team. It's not time to panic, but that time is quickly approaching.

Mr. Laz
03-29-2005, 11:03 AM
I see nothing gets by you. :p
glad i could assist


i'm always willing the be the funny fodder

whoman69
03-29-2005, 11:08 AM
What completely bypasses Rand is that we are in need to replace 2 CBs both McCleon and Bartee. A nickle back these days can play anywhere from 40-60% of downs. If we simply draft a CB, we will have Battle or Sapp playing nickle. I don't think either are up to it. I also don't believe you can assume a rookie is good enough to step into the starting role even if they are a 1st rounder.

keg in kc
03-29-2005, 11:18 AM
glad i could assist


i'm always willing the be the funny fodderYou did well as my straight man. Was that hard for you, by the way? Acting like a straight man?

*rim shot*

BigChiefFan
03-29-2005, 11:18 AM
And another thing... After 4 years of having one of the worst defenses in the league, and we still have the same CBs, when exactly is it time to panic? I'm all for having some patience, but the CB position is glaring a problem, starting a rookie and Bartee or McCleon isn't going to fix the problem.

whoman69
03-29-2005, 11:19 AM
That's because they haven't had to BECAUSE THEY'VE DRAFTED SO WELL!!!
I think that's the one thing you can't explain to Rufus and Rand.

Mr. Laz
03-29-2005, 11:24 AM
You did well as my straight man. Was that hard for you, by the way? Acting like a straight man?

*rim shot*
bastige... ROFL



but your the one talking about "rim shots" ... are you a fan of elton john perhaps as well?


i imagine a mod could change your name to "rocket man" if you'd like

beer bacon
03-29-2005, 11:28 AM
I want to think Rand. I never knew that trading a 2nd round pick for a three time ProBowl corner and paying him what he was worth was writing a blank check. I have seen the light. Now lets go get Marlin Jackson and ride his ass to the SuperBowl!

keg in kc
03-29-2005, 11:29 AM
but your the one talking about "rim shots" ... are you a fan of elton john perhaps as well?


i imagine a mod could change your name to "rocket man" if you'd likeActually, I can't stand Elton John. But it's not because he's gay, it's because his songs are slow torture. I think I'd almost rather hear a voyager mock draft set to reggae music. Almost.

shaneo69
03-29-2005, 11:32 AM
You know, if they would go out and sign a Kevin Johnson or David Terrell for our hole at WR, and then sign Warrick Holdman or trade for Jamie Sharper for our hole at OLB, then I'd say fine, take CB's in the first 2 rounds and don't waste your money on Law or Surtain. In fact, I would be fine with that. But right now, assuming no more free agent signings, we've got too many holes to use our 1st and 2nd rounders on CB's. And there's no doubt that we still need to acquire two starter-quality guys at that position, so if we sign no FA CB's, we'll need to draft them.

Mr. Laz
03-29-2005, 11:33 AM
Actually, I can't stand Elton John. But it's not because he's gay, it's because his songs are slow torture. I think I'd almost rather hear a voyager mock draft set to reggae music. Almost.
hey ... thanks for playing along :spock:

TRR
03-29-2005, 11:39 AM
My worries lay squarely with Vermeil and his insistance on not playing rookies. It's common knowledge that Vermeil does not like to start rookies. I can honestly see us drafting Pac Man at #15, and then William Bartee starting over him opening day.

Couple that with our inability to draft, and the draft being very weak this year, and I say let's pony up the 2nd for a 3 time PB CB.

htismaqe
03-29-2005, 11:44 AM
This is the same kind of head-in-the-sand thinking that had us hire Gunther and keep all of the old guard players that couldn't cut it for three years.

It's the same thinking that won't let Gunther go out and hire the coaches he wants, to coach the way he wants. Dammit! Are they Gunther's assistants or are they Vermeil's assistants? :banghead:

How many CBs are we going to have to draft and watch do nothing, before we get RID of Giunta? (I guess the answer is, all of them until Vermeil retires) :deevee:

It's past time to blow up what doesn't work.

The idea of hiring Gunther was VERY popular around here... :hmmm:

Mr. Laz
03-29-2005, 11:46 AM
The idea of hiring Gunther was VERY popular around here... :hmmm:

not for everyone

htismaqe
03-29-2005, 11:47 AM
What completely bypasses Rand is that we are in need to replace 2 CBs both McCleon and Bartee. A nickle back these days can play anywhere from 40-60% of downs. If we simply draft a CB, we will have Battle or Sapp playing nickle. I don't think either are up to it. I also don't believe you can assume a rookie is good enough to step into the starting role even if they are a 1st rounder.

Pretty much exactly how I thought about the subject.

We need to get Surtain in here AND draft a CB.

htismaqe
03-29-2005, 11:49 AM
not for everyone

Oh believe me, I know.

I took a ton of grief for suggesting that adding TALENT instead of Gunther was our best course of action...

Mr. Laz
03-29-2005, 11:53 AM
Oh believe me, I know.

I took a ton of grief for suggesting that adding TALENT instead of Gunther was our best course of action...

i wanted both...

a talent upgrade and a changed of coordinator. i wasn't against Gunther, but i thought we could of done better. Especially considering history of cunningham being such a yes man to carl.

we needed a coordinator to come in a shake things up ... tell Vermeil and Carl "no" about some issues. If we had a new coordinator, without all the history, i don't think we re-sign Woods,Hicks etc to new contracts like year.

KCTitus
03-29-2005, 12:15 PM
And another thing... After 4 years of having one of the worst defenses in the league, and we still have the same CBs, when exactly is it time to panic?

I'd say in September, August at the earliest.

keg in kc
03-29-2005, 12:17 PM
I'd say in September, August at the earliest.2003 or 2004?

htismaqe
03-29-2005, 12:22 PM
i wanted both...

a talent upgrade and a changed of coordinator. i wasn't against Gunther, but i thought we could of done better. Especially considering history of cunningham being such a yes man to carl.

we needed a coordinator to come in a shake things up ... tell Vermeil and Carl "no" about some issues. If we had a new coordinator, without all the history, i don't think we re-sign Woods,Hicks etc to new contracts like year.

Those are pretty much the EXACT reasons I was 100% against bringing back Gunther.

KCTitus
03-29-2005, 12:23 PM
2003 or 2004?

2005, silly. No need to 'panic' over yesterday, cant change that.

keg in kc
03-29-2005, 12:26 PM
2005, silly. No need to 'panic' over yesterday, cant change that.Wait a second. I thought we started the panic for the 2006 season now. Have we changed something? I get so confused.

KCTitus
03-29-2005, 12:27 PM
Wait a second. I thought we started the panic for the 2006 season now. Have we changed something? I get so confused.

:D

Chiefnj
03-29-2005, 12:42 PM
i wanted both...

a talent upgrade and a changed of coordinator. i wasn't against Gunther, but i thought we could of done better. Especially considering history of cunningham being such a yes man to carl.

we needed a coordinator to come in a shake things up ... tell Vermeil and Carl "no" about some issues. If we had a new coordinator, without all the history, i don't think we re-sign Woods,Hicks etc to new contracts like year.

The general approach used by the Chiefs to fix the D is not unusual. IMO, the approach was a 2 year plan to throw in a bunch of low expense bodies the first year that you hope can adapt to the new system. The second year you plug the holes with top notch free agents. Del Rio has taken this approach with Jax and it looks like Romeo is doing it with Cleveland.

htismaqe
03-29-2005, 12:54 PM
The general approach used by the Chiefs to fix the D is not unusual. IMO, the approach was a 2 year plan to throw in a bunch of low expense bodies the first year that you hope can adapt to the new system. The second year you plug the holes with top notch free agents. Del Rio has taken this approach with Jax and it looks like Romeo is doing it with Cleveland.

Yep.

Most teams in the NFL subscribe to the "every other year" method of free agency.

However, winning franchises often step "outside the box" to fix glaring problems.

Chiefnj
03-29-2005, 01:00 PM
Yep.

Most teams in the NFL subscribe to the "every other year" method of free agency.

However, winning franchises often step "outside the box" to fix glaring problems.

They often have to step outside the box to get the guys they want. With the Chiefs though, the guys who were signed were Gunther's old players - Hicks, Bartee, Woods, Wesley. If Gun liked them then, it isn't a big surprise that he might retain them.

BigChiefFan
03-29-2005, 02:05 PM
I'd say in September, August at the earliest.
I'd say if the Chiefs don't land Surtain, it significantly decreases our chances of winning. No way I feel warm and fuzzy about a rookie and either Bartee or McCleon as the starters on opening day. That's a recipe for disaster.

carlos3652
03-29-2005, 02:16 PM
RAND: No need for panic in cornerback search
Mar 29, 2005, 2:36:02 AM by Jonathan Rand

Since the 2000 draft, Pat Dennis, Julian Battle and William Bartee have been unable to grab or hold a starting job.

http://www.kcchiefs.com/news/2005/03/29/rand_no_need_for_panic_in_cornerback_search/

Starting Job???? Burntee cant hold on to anything but the receiver. Our CB's in the draft have been horrible. Hopefully this year we get a #2-#4 CB (#1 Rolle would be taken) late 1st round, pick up another 2nd or 3rd and give that to Miami for Surtain, and with our 2nd take either a CB or DE (best player on the board).

I dont want to see Mcleon and Burntee on the Field come day 1 unless Warfield is suspended...

bringbackmarty
03-29-2005, 02:34 PM
I have a feeling we'll pony up a second or third for surtain before it's all done. Don't think they want to draft a cb. Rand makes a good point about sitting tight for the moment since we are the only surtain suitors, and if we lose him there might be law. What worries me is the talk of mazlowski being back. We don't need slow and smart on this defense. I don't care how much film a player watches. It's useless if the guy is slow. We need fearless, fast, explosive players in all areas of the d. I bet we pick up surtain or law, and draft a defensive end, or right tackle in the first.

htismaqe
03-29-2005, 03:21 PM
They often have to step outside the box to get the guys they want. With the Chiefs though, the guys who were signed were Gunther's old players - Hicks, Bartee, Woods, Wesley. If Gun liked them then, it isn't a big surprise that he might retain them.

That's the other reason I didn't want Gunther. I'm 100% convinced that Gunther not only endorsed the re-signing of Hicks and Woods but actually REQUESTED IT as part of his hire.

buddha
03-29-2005, 03:33 PM
Gun wasn't the answer, and anybody who really thought he would be just doesn't know much about football. Lombardi couldn't have turned last year's collection of defensive players into a quality defense. What bothers me about Gun is that he has believed for some time that William Bartee was going to develop into a legit NFL cornerback when EVERY shred of evidence on game day screamed otherwise! That, combined with the fact that he thinks highly of Hicks and some of the other hacks on this unit tells me that Gun may know defensive strategy, but he really can't be trusted to make rational player decisions!