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View Full Version : ***FFToday Mock Draft: Chiefs 2nd round selection***


cmh6476
04-01-2005, 12:40 PM
please vote

HolmeZz
04-01-2005, 12:41 PM
Patrick Surtain.

JamSec128
04-01-2005, 12:42 PM
Patrick Surtain

cmh6476
04-01-2005, 12:44 PM
use the trade down option for surtain.

We can't actually trade draft picks for players in this.

But what I'm thinking is that if we trade down for an extra 3rd we can just simulate it. We'll give our 3rd we pickup to miami and possibly anohter pick next year, right?

So we'd just draft like we got Surtain from Miami for that thrid, and I'd make a deal to draft a guy Miami wanted with that 3rd :thumb:

cmh6476
04-01-2005, 12:45 PM
also, for some unknown reason I like Tuck over these other guys. See ya Hicks!

htismaqe
04-01-2005, 12:46 PM
In this hypothetical draft, there is NO Surtain. You can't trade picks for anything other than picks.

Sorry.

Since this draft assumes there is no trade for Surtain, I take McFadden in the 2nd.

Justin Tuck is a Jared Allen clone and would not replace Hicks but would rather take time away from Allen...

buddha
04-01-2005, 12:47 PM
What the Tuck...go with Justin!

HolmeZz
04-01-2005, 12:47 PM
Who did we draft in the 1st?

htismaqe
04-01-2005, 12:48 PM
Who did we draft in the 1st?

Carlos Rogers I believe...

HolmeZz
04-01-2005, 12:49 PM
I'll take Canty, though it's still a tiny bit of a reach. I'm a Notre Dame fan and I'm not high on Tuck much. Thurman would be my 2nd choice.

cmh6476
04-01-2005, 12:50 PM
yep, rogers!

Here's the full draft:

http://www.fftodayforums.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=116112

cmh6476
04-01-2005, 12:55 PM
I'll take Canty, though it's still a tiny bit of a reach. I'm a Notre Dame fan and I'm not high on Tuck much. Thurman would be my 2nd choice.
what about trading down, grabbing an extra 3rd, and then taking canty with the pick we got for trading down? :shrug:

HolmeZz
04-01-2005, 12:56 PM
That sounds better.

philfree
04-01-2005, 01:00 PM
That's a pretty good bunch of prospects. I really want to say Corey Webster but he seems to have an issue with a linguring injury. I believe the injury slowed him alot his SR season and also at the SR Bowl. If I knew he would return to his preinjury form I'd pick him. If we didn't need another CB so bad I go with Mike Patterson.....McFadden :hmmm:

Haven't voted yet.......


PhilFree :arrow:

Coogs
04-01-2005, 01:11 PM
Weren't several people here touting Browner for our 1st round pick a while back? Not sure if we need another OSU product since Oregon schools don't dismiss until mid-summer, but he might be a good corner to match up against Moss.

cmh6476
04-01-2005, 01:11 PM
what about seeing if the vikes want to trade up? Give them our 2nd rounder for 2.63 & 3.80

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/NFLDraft/Draft+Insider/2004/TradeValue.htm

kchero
04-01-2005, 01:22 PM
Surtain.....we know were our 2nd round picks go.....straight into the dumpster

philfree
04-01-2005, 01:22 PM
Fabian Washington, CB Nebraska might not be good against Moss but he'd be a really good $.05 covering the slot. Fastest guy in the draft.......

PhilFree :arrow:

Coogs
04-01-2005, 01:33 PM
Fabian Washington, CB Nebraska might not be good against Moss but he'd be a really good $.05 covering the slot. Fastest guy in the draft.......

PhilFree :arrow:

He already went to the Colts though. :(

When the real draft comes around, I wouldn't mind Washington as our pick. (provided the Surtain deal doesn't take this pick)

philfree
04-01-2005, 01:36 PM
He already went to the Colts though. :(

When the real draft comes around, I wouldn't mind Washington as our pick. (provided the Surtain deal doesn't take this pick)

Damn! I missed that........guess I keep studying. To me this is fun :)


PhilFree :arrow:

Kyle401
04-01-2005, 01:42 PM
Without Law or Surtain under contract, I'm looking for a CB here.

I think Webster would be a bit of a reach here although, if he hadn't been injured his senior year, he might already be gone. Browner, Green, and McFadden are all pretty good values at this pick.

Brandon Browner:
Positives: Browner is a physically strong athlete with a tall, muscular frame, long arms, V-shaped torso, good bubble, thick thighs and calves Reads the quarterback's release well and shows good desire to get to the ball as the play develops Gets to the ball in a hurry, showing a sudden burst when driving on the ball Shows the catch-up speed and range to get into pursuit Displays good vertical-jump ability, timing his leaps to get to the ball at its high point (15 deflections, six interceptions) Strong wrap-up tackler who will hit and finish with authority Stays tight on the hip of the receivers to gain position, using his long arms effectively to get a strong push at the line of scrimmage to reroute his man He has good short area quickness and looks fluid getting depth in his backpedal Better as a press corner in the zone than when playing deep, as he shows his physical side more to strike and jolt at the line of scrimmage Punishing hitter in run support who fills the rush lanes aggressively Takes good angles to the ball in pursuit and is not the type that will shy away from contact Natural hands catcher who will extend in a crowd and sacrifice his body to make the tough interception (see 2003 Arizona State game) Shows explosion as a downhill run support player and has the burst to turn and run on the ball. Negatives: Has a good short-area burst, but is a bit of a long strider in the open Fluid in his backpedal, but is a little stiff on the turn and may lose a step in deep coverage Will hit and wrap with authority, but will revert to arm tackling on occasion Better as a press-coverage defender than as a trail type, as he is still a little inconsistent with his footwork His hip stiffness is evident when he tries to change direction, as he has trouble sometimes playing off-coverage situations. INJURY REPORT

2003 -- Sat out the New Mexico State game (undisclosed injury). AGILITY

4.54 in the 40-yard dash 345-pound bench press 480-pound squat 308-pound power clean 34-inch vertical jump 32 7/8-inch arm length 9-inch hands.

Eric Green:
Positives: Has a long, lean build with adequate muscle definition, but does have room for additional growth Has very good short-area quickness with an explosive break on the ball Has no problems retaining plays and is rarely caught out of position due to his ability to quickly make reads and keys Has above-average change-of-direction agility, balance and body control, doing a nice job of keeping plays in front of him Gets a sharp break on the ball and has more than enough range to recover when beaten, but is rarely caught out of position Stays tight on the hip of receivers on deep routes and cannot be beaten by double moves His drive to the ball and feel for the pass allow him to get an early jump on the ball Will not hesitate to come up and plug holes in run support Has the hand strength to handle his assignments in press coverage, but his speed is also good for man and Cover 2 assignments Does a very good job of shadowing and trailing in press coverage, and has the ability to plant and drive back to the ball Effective in turning and flipping his hips when coming out of breaks and showed marked improvement in 2004 to run with the receivers on deep routes Attacks the ball and shows good timing and proper hand extension competing for the pigskin in tight quarters. Negatives: Has added strength to his frame, but still lacks ideal size Has the strength, but needs to get more physical in coverage, as he sometimes gets pushed around by the bigger receivers when trying to dictate route progression Will get turned around some in man coverage when he peeks into the backfield too long Quick out of his backpedal, but could be even faster if he would not get so high in his stance Adequate to read the quarterback in zone coverage, but has good ball skills Has good hands, but likes to catch the ball with his body Because of size issues, he is slow to get off blocks and is not physical in his run support, but will tackle He sometimes takes bad angles and will miss in space, especially when he goes low and tries to trip the runner up. INJURY REPORT

2001 -- Missed the Pittsburgh game due to tonsillitis. 2002 -- Missed the entire season after he suffered a torn anterior cruciate ligament in his left knee while working out in July Underwent reconstructive surgery. AGILITY

4.38 in the 40-yard dash 300-pound bench press 450-pound squat 275-pound power clean 40-inch vertical jump 32 -inch arm length 9 1/8-inch hands.

Bryant McFadden:
Positives Has a muscular, athletic build with well-developed and long arms, good upper-body muscle definition, lean waist, developed bubble and good hamstrings and calves Does a good job of locating the receivers and shows very good foot quickness and agility in his backpedal to stay on the hip of his man Comes out of his breaks quickly and shows above-average agility in transition Has the strength to fight off blocks and takes on the lead blocker at a low pad level, driving hard with his legs to push the fullback back into the rushing lane Can plant and drive out of his transition cleanly and displays the body control needed to compete for the ball down field Times his leaps and makes good adjustments on the move to get to the ball Has the foot quickness and hip snap to turn and trail the receivers in man coverage Adequate at locating and attacking the receivers in front of him in zone coverage Is able to turn easily and maintains balance through his backpedal Very effective tackler, especially on the edge, where he can fit into the open lane and show his strength while demonstrating proper wrap-up tackle technique Has the strength and hand usage to play off blocks and comes up with a good burst to plug the rush lanes His range in run support is helped by his ability to take proper angles to the ball Plays with a good motor and has no fear of contact Solid worker in the weight room and has no character issues (actively involved in the FCA). Negatives Can locate the receivers in their routes, but sometimes fails to anticipate the play, showing only adequate field awareness. He struggles to feel routes in man coverage Needs to do a better job of anticipating where the ball is going, as he gets a bit of a late jump on the ball in zone coverage Has good foot speed, but does not possess a sudden burst to close Not smooth in his plant and drive and his backpedal looks a bit choppy breaking downhill Not regarded as a natural hands catcher, as he does not extend away from his frame in attempts to catch the ball and several possible interceptions resulted in pass deflections because he let the ball absorb into his body. INJURY REPORT

2000 -- Sat out the season with a lower back disc fracture (L-5, pars). 2001 -- Missed the Gator Bowl when he suffered a broken bone in his right foot in practices prior to the game Underwent surgery on Jan. 11, 2002. 2002 -- Fractured a finger (fifth metacarpal) on his right hand during summer workouts (June 24). 2003 -- Sat out the North Carolina State game (Nov. 15) and saw limited action vs. Florida and Miami in the Orange Bowl after suffering a groin strain vs. Clemson. AGILITY

4.47 in the 40-yard dash 365-pound bench press 432-pound squat 281-pound power clean 40-inch vertical jump 4.15 20-yard shuttle 32 -inch arm length 9 1/8-inch hands Right-handed

Out of the three, I like Browner the best. His size and strength in press coverage should fit well in Gunther's scheme. Plus he matches up well with bigger recievers. Green looks like more of a cover 2 guy. Despite being a "profile" guy, McFadden has had a lot of injuries and doesn't catch the ball well.

htismaqe
04-01-2005, 01:47 PM
Surtain.....we know were our 2nd round picks go.....straight into the dumpster

For the 50th time, you can't trade for Surtain. It's not allowed in this particular mock scenario.

htismaqe
04-01-2005, 01:48 PM
Without Law or Surtain under contract, I'm looking for a CB here.

I think Webster would be a bit of a reach here although, if he hadn't been injured his senior year, he might already be gone. Browner, Green, and McFadden are all pretty good values at this pick.

Brandon Browner:


Eric Green:


Bryant McFadden:


Out of the three, I like Browner the best. His size and strength in press coverage should fit well in Gunther's scheme. Plus he matches up well with bigger recievers. Green looks like more of a cover 2 guy. Despite being a "profile" guy, McFadden has had a lot of injuries and doesn't catch the ball well.

Browner is EXTREMELY raw. He, like Junior Siavii this season, would spend more time on the bench than we need out of this pick.

cmh6476
04-01-2005, 02:01 PM
Cards just took:

Ciatrick Fason, RB Florida

cmh6476
04-01-2005, 02:04 PM
we need more votes. We are on deck with no one distancing themselves from any of the others :(

Don't make me draft a FB :mad:

Woodrow Call
04-01-2005, 02:09 PM
Take Frye :thumb: Best QB in the draft IMO.

Coogs
04-01-2005, 02:12 PM
Damn! I missed that........guess I keep studying. To me this is fun :)


PhilFree :arrow:

:thumb:

Coogs
04-01-2005, 02:14 PM
I think I will wait until Carolina picks to cast my vote. Don't want to waste it on a guy they take.

Kyle401
04-01-2005, 02:21 PM
Browner is EXTREMELY raw. He, like Junior Siavii this season, would spend more time on the bench than we need out of this pick.

With Warfield and Rogers as the starters, he would play the nickel (unless Warfield is suspended). I think he has the ability to step in and contribute at the nickel even though he's not as polished as the other two.

Kyle401
04-01-2005, 02:22 PM
Carolina took Ernest Shazor

cmh6476
04-01-2005, 02:22 PM
Carolina takes:

S/OLB Ernest Shazor, Michigan

we are on the clock with any of these guys available...

cmh6476
04-01-2005, 02:26 PM
whatcha think kyle?

Kyle401
04-01-2005, 02:46 PM
whatcha think kyle?

I think that the further we go into the draft the less of a clear cut winner there will be, because everyone knows less about the players and there is less of a drop off between them. I say wait until 4:15 and then make the pick... as long as there's not a tie.

Coogs
04-01-2005, 02:47 PM
The highest rated defenders let are Tuck, Thurman, and Browner by using the GBN and nfldraftcountdown sites. I could live with any one of the three. Thurman at MLB might move Bell to the outside.

cmh6476
04-01-2005, 02:48 PM
I think that the further we go into the draft the less of a clear cut winner there will be, because everyone knows less about the players and there is less of a drop off between them. I say wait until 4:15 and then make the pick... as long as there's not a tie.
sounds good to me. :thumb:

Mark M
04-01-2005, 02:52 PM
Trade down for an extra 3rd and a 5th.

Use the first 3rd for BAA, the second for Mathis.

You all now know why I have no business as a GM.

MM
~~:D

cmh6476
04-01-2005, 02:56 PM
let's go with browner. Go ahead and pick it, I've got to head out :thumb:

Kyle401
04-01-2005, 02:58 PM
let's go with browner. Go ahead and pick it, I've got to head out :thumb:

Sounds good. :)

philfree
04-01-2005, 03:27 PM
Browner doesn't have much experience and he's not that fast. To me he's more of a FS the a CB. I finally voted for Webster gambling that his injury heals and he returns to pre 2004 form where he had 14 INTs in two years.

PhilFree :arrow:

htismaqe
04-01-2005, 03:31 PM
Browner doesn't have much experience and he's not that fast. To me he's more of a FS the a CB. I finally voted for Webster gambling that his injury heals and he returns to pre 2004 form where he had 14 INTs in two years.

PhilFree :arrow:

They already picked Browner.

Too bad we couldn't have traded that pick for Surtain, because I feat Browner is the next William Bartee.

philfree
04-01-2005, 03:38 PM
They already picked Browner.

Too bad we couldn't have traded that pick for Surtain, because I feat Browner is the next William Bartee.

Seeing hows he won't be at the mini camps just like Parker and Siavii and that he's as raw as sushi he won't make much of an impact in 2005. Damit Carl :banghead: No wait the shoes on the other foot now. What a bunch of incompetents :p


PhilFree :arrow:

Kyle401
04-01-2005, 03:50 PM
Seeing hows he won't be at the mini camps just like Parker and Siavii and that he's as raw as sushi he won't make much of an impact in 2005. Damit Carl :banghead: No wait the shoes on the other foot now. What a bunch of incompetents :p


PhilFree :arrow:

Sorry guys, the minority has spoken. Maybe you'll get your guy next time. :)

Kyle401
04-01-2005, 03:52 PM
They already picked Browner.

Too bad we couldn't have traded that pick for Surtain, because I feat Browner is the next William Bartee.

cmh and I both wanted to be allowed to make the trade for Surtain since it has been widely reported that the Phins would give him up for a 2nd. The Phins owner was all for it also, but the draft commissioner wouldn't allow it. :(

philfree
04-01-2005, 04:48 PM
Sorry guys, the minority has spoken. Maybe you'll get your guy next time. :)

Here's your boy.

Brandon Browner
DC | (6'3", 221, 4.63) | OREGON STATE

Scouts Grade: 88

Flags: (S: SPEED) Player lacks ideal speed at position
View by: Round | Player | NCAA School | Position | NFL Team | Flag | All Ranked Players | NFL Draft History
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Strengths: Is a big, strong, physical cornerback with upside. At his best in press man-to-man coverage. Has good overall athleticism for a big DC. Does a great job of getting a shove in at the LOS. Can matchup extremely well versus bigger receivers. Is tough and physical. Has long arms and good leaping ability. Wins jump-ball battles on a consistent basis. Will fill hard in run support and has good size/strength in that facet of the game.

Weaknesses: Is still a bit raw. Is a bit inconsistent with his footwork and hand-placement. Has marginal top-end speed. Lacks ideal COD skills and hip fluidity to stay with the double move versus quicker WR's. Also is better in tight man coverage than when giving a cushion. Lacks ideal ball skills. Needs to improve his consistency as an open-field tackler. May need to move to FS in the NFL.

Overall: Browner redshirted in 2002 before stepping in as a fulltime starter at cornerback in 2003, when he finished with 44 total tackles, six interceptions and another six passes broken up. As a redshirt sophomore in 2004, teams started to throw away from him more. Browner started all 12 games and finished with 46 tackles, one sack, zero interceptions and nine passes broken up. Browner, who elected to leave school early for the 2005 NFL draft, is still somewhat unpolished, he needs to improve his tackling skills and he also has poor top-end speed. However, Browner is worth taking a chance on in the second round because he has exceptional size, is a decent athlete for his size, and has the strength and confidence to hold up on an island. Some think his best fit in the NFL will be at FS but we think it would be a mistake not to at least give him a couple of years of experience at cornerback before making a move. Browner would be an ideal fit in a press-man scheme like the one the Eagles' employ, but he also could be a good fit in a cover-2 zone scheme if he is given time to learn and is coached well. Regardless, we think he can develop into a starting cornerback in the NFL.


* Player biographies are provided by Scouts Inc.


PhilFree :arrow: