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WarPaint
09-14-2000, 06:59 PM
Jimmy Raye is an excellent OC but that his hands are tied with what he is allowed to do.<P>

Woodrow
09-14-2000, 07:06 PM
Where did you get that quote?

B^2

WarPaint
09-14-2000, 07:08 PM
According to a member of the old board, a KMBZ radio interview.

Horn also thought he was cut by KC because of his alleged involvement in the drug scandal.

alanm
09-15-2000, 07:29 AM
I guess that means Raye’s hands were tied during his previous failures as OC.

I smell a conspiracy…

xoxo~
gaz
demands to know why the NFL is holding down Jimmy Raye.<BR>

Raiderhader
09-15-2000, 07:39 AM
Gaz: If there is a conspiracy, Im sure Carl is involved somehow. http://www.ChiefsPlanet.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif

scooter
09-15-2000, 09:08 AM
Greg, I'm sure it a combination of CP and EG. AFter all those two are the focus of all known evil in the world. *L*

redbrian
09-15-2000, 09:13 AM
No, I think you guys are right. Every problem the offense has right now is due to Jimmy Raye's lack of ability! Jeez!!

Raye is to the Chiefs what "Suddenly Susan" is to NBC's programming...just one part of a much larger problem!

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This is my signature!! There are many like it but this one is mine!!

The Blessed Virgin Larry
09-15-2000, 09:20 AM
Were Raye's hands tied in New England, Tampa Bay and L. A.? Nope. I'm sure others contribute to the problems on offense, but make no mistake - Raye is the biggest mistake!

redbrian
09-15-2000, 09:22 AM
I'm not saying Raye is the man for the job, but yes, his hands were tied in New England, Tampa Bay, and L.A., even more so than they ever could be with KC.

By a TOTAL LACK OF TALENT.

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This is my signature!! There are many like it but this one is mine!!

WarPaint
09-15-2000, 09:28 AM
If we could get rid of Raye we'd be 15-1.

I just can't get over all of the horrible things that Raye has done in the past year and two games: Elvis' gaining confidence, having a career year and improving even more this year, Gonzo emerging as one of the best TE's in the game, highest red zone socring percentage in the league, 4th leading rushing team in the NFL with Morris and Bennett at HB, getting Slymo involved in the offense as a major player even though he missed most of camp and preseason, working under a system where he is instructed to never run the ball when the Chiefs are within their own 20 and that we should run in passing situations. God, Raye just sucks. Damn him to hell for spreading the ball out to all of our receivers this year. Doesn't he know we are much more effective when Elvis locks onto Gonzo and ignores the WR's.

If we had another OC I'm sure our OL would be opening big holes and that our receivers wouldn't have dropped those 8 passes in the Indy game.

alanm
09-15-2000, 09:50 AM
Clint-

Nonsense. We have the talent in KC to have a good Offense. What we have is an OC who is predictable to a fault. I can predict most of our plays, can't you?

Rayepologists wail that "Gunther wants to run, so it's not Raye's fault." That is crap. There are plenty of ways to run the ball without sending a Committee member up Grunhard's butt.

We failed to run the ball against the Titans. Then we finally threw the ball and marched downfield. Did we continue the air attack and force the Titans to drop out of the box? No we did not. We went back to the failed up the middle attack. Vintage Raye: if it works, don't try it again.

I don't know of anyone who said that Raye is the ONLY problem with the Chiefs Offense. He is the WORST problem we have, though. No other change would improve our Offense as much as a good OC. This team will not improve significantly until the Skybox Stooge is someone else's problem. At that time, the lack of a featured HB will move up to the #1 problem.

xoxo~
gaz
suspects he has found the heart of the Raye conspiracy.<BR>

The Blessed Virgin Larry
09-15-2000, 10:44 AM
Clint,
Your point is valid - to a point. But when you examine things closley, all fingers do in fact point Raye's way. You could take the position that his failures in Tampa, New England and LA were because of a lack of talent. But if you dig a bit deeper you will find out that in each case, the team he served as OC put up it's worst offensive numbers in each club's history. Also, in each case, all 3 teams'offensive numbers improved the very next year after Raye left. This happened 3 out of 3 times! Far to perfect to be a coincidence. Now, add to that that KC has talent and look what Raye has done here. I might also point out that the ONLY reason the Chiefs scored points last year was because of the 9 TD's the defensive scores. Take away those scores Raye's pwttern is true to form in KC. IMHO ALL fingers point to Jimmy Raye...and rightfully so.

redbrian
09-15-2000, 10:46 AM
Raye does suck, but what about the man that retained his services? I wouldn't expect Raye to decline such a job offer.

alanm
09-15-2000, 11:00 AM
The decision to retain the Stooges was the beginning of my disenchantment with Gunther. Raye is an incompetent OC, but as Clint points out, the final responsibility lies with Gunther.

If I had my way, I would fire the Three Stooges. I would keep Gunther as HC and DC. He would have no say whatsoever in the Offensive play calling. We could bring in a good OC or take a chance on a rookie like DeBerg.

Since that is not going to happen, Gunther will have to go along with the Three Stooges.

xoxo~
gaz
plumb out of hope for his coaching staff.<BR>

redbrian
09-15-2000, 11:02 AM
IMO the promising new guys should be on the field. I want experienced, PROVEN men in charge of the team.

alanm
09-15-2000, 11:14 AM
Clint-

I can't fault that thinking. I am a shameless DeBerg Homer and would like to see him at OC. However, there are some veteran OCs whom I would also take.

I hesitate to say this, because I thought the same about Hackett, but I am willing to take just about anyone if it means that the Stooge is out of the Skybox.

xoxo~
gaz
still foolishly pulling for DeBerg as OC.<BR>

Dr. Red
09-15-2000, 11:17 AM
Gaz - is DeBerg still with the Falcons?

DoktorSmith
09-15-2000, 11:22 AM
the question to ask is who designs the plays?...not so much as who calls them...

As Gaz said, to paraphrase, it's not so much that Raye calls a running play it's the type of running play he calls...he has no imagination, no creativity...maybe Gun has the ultimate say in what we run...but it's Raye's job to make it unpredictable and creative...not much imagination in three runs up the middle and one around end...

Now I need some prozac



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joe

"The word "genius" isn't applicable in football. A genius is a guy like Norman Einstein."
-Joe Theisman, NFL football quarterback and sports analyst

The Blessed Virgin Larry
09-15-2000, 12:20 PM
gaz,
I'm also in favor of retaining Gun ONLY if he keeps his hands off the offense and concentrates on the defense. That's where he can do the most good. I'd like to bring Al Saundars back from the Rams and make him Offensive Coordinator. To my knowledge he left KC on good terms. I read an article the other day where he was "pro Peterson" - it could be that he is keeping the doors open.(cross your fingers) I'm also a HUGE DeBERG fan, but not as OC. I'd like to see Steve as Grbac's QB coach! IMHO, that's where he can do the most good at this point. Now that's an idea! How about letting Grbac learn from the "master of playaction" himself, not to mention it would be the 1st QB coach that Grabc has ever had, while in KC, that actually PLAYED the position in the NFL! What a novel idea - actually hire a coach that has played the position himself.

alanm
09-15-2000, 02:42 PM
ChiTown-

DeBerg was released by the Falcons back in January. I'm not sure where he is now.

KC-CHIEFS-FAN-TX-

Yes, Saunders would be a very good choice if I were being reasonable about the whole thing...

xoxo~
gaz
self-confessed DeBerg Homer.<BR>