PDA

View Full Version : Brownco's have 3 of top six busts per Cris Carter


TNTEICHER
04-08-2005, 05:08 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylc=X3oDMTBqdGgyMXV0BF9TAzI1NjY0ODI1BHNlYwNlY2w-?slug=cc-sixpoints040705&prov=yhoo&type=lgns
Teams hope to find their future stars in the NFL draft, but as we have seen with this decade, first-round picks never are a sure thing.

Why is that? First of all, there's no test to determine a person's heart. You also don't know how much potential actually is left, or which stage the player is at, as far as overall development. He could be totally tapped out by the time he gets to the NFL. But every person is different and that's what makes the NFL draft so interesting.

You actually can get a player like Terrell Davis, who didn't play a lot in college but turned out to be a phenomenal pro, as a sixth-round pick. Or you can end up with a supposedly can't-miss prospect like Ryan Leaf or Todd Marinovich who doesn't pan out. The draft is not an exact science, and it never will be.

Let's take a look at six former first-round selections who have yet to make their mark and their chances at finally living up to their pre-draft hype.

1. Joey Harrington
Wide receiver Charles Rogers has been hurt the last two years, and the Lions didn't have a running game until last season with Kevin Jones. There also have been some bad moves involving other parts of the offense, including an offensive line that's not that great.

ADVERTISEMENT


With Steve Mariucci's West Coast system, the Detroit Lions are doing the right thing as far as trying to help Harrington succeed. I believe he still has a huge upside, so I wouldn't give up on him quite yet. Five or six years from now, the Lions don't want to be saying they should've kept him.

The 2005 season will be huge for Harrington, the No. 3 overall pick in 2002. He doesn't want the organization to lose confidence in him, but there will be a lot of internal pressure for him to do well.

2. Gerard Warren
A change of scenery will be good for Warren, the third pick in 2001. Things really never panned out for him with the Cleveland Browns, although he did show glimpses of greatness. As a coach, that can be frustrating.

I hope he's able to live up to that potential with the Denver Broncos. He just has to make up his mind about being a professional and decide whether he wants to work hard at it day in and day out. If he does do that, he probably won't be an elite player, but the results will be a lot better than his time in Cleveland.

3. Ron Dayne
I think expectations were too high for Dayne, who was a great college back at Wisconsin. Drafted 11th overall by the New York Giants in 2000, Dayne was limited to backup status partly because he played behind one of the NFL's best all-around backs in Tiki Barber.

Losing weight last season helped Dayne's acceleration, and I loved what I saw from him early in training camp. He finally understands that the NFL is a different game and that, to be successful, you have to be nifty and make people miss. In that instance, I thought he made great strides last year.

With Denver's blocking scheme and the way running backs have excelled behind the Broncos' offensive line Dayne has a great opportunity.

4. Travis Taylor
Taylor, the 10th selection in 2000, just has been inconsistent. Part of it could be blamed on the Baltimore Ravens' offensive system and the lack of accuracy from the quarterback. However, expectations for him with his new team, the Minnesota Vikings, are high.

The coaching there is phenomenal and the system there is phenomenal. I look for Taylor to improve in Minnesota, and I don't necessarily mean in numbers. It's a better system, even though Brian Billick, the Ravens' head coach, created it when he was the Vikings' offensive coordinator. With the players they have around him and what they can do offensively on a weekly basis, Taylor will be far more explosive than he ever was in Baltimore.

5. David Terrell
Terrell, taken eighth overall by the Chicago Bears in 2001, is in a good situation with the New England Patriots. He won't have a lot of pressure on him, and he'll be playing with the best quarterback he's ever played with in the pros in Tom Brady. He also will have at least two or three receivers who are better than him. The way the Patriots practice and the way they go about things will really help him.

It'll be time for Terrell to develop. He'll be around receivers who have had some success but also are unselfish. That's one thing he may have to work on the most: being a team guy instead of a me-first guy. If he's able to do that, he'll reach his potential. The Patriots have done pretty well resurrecting rejects from other teams.

6. Courtney Brown
Injuries have played a big role in his lack of development. The No. 1 overall pick in 2000, Brown missed a lot of time in Cleveland, and those repetitions in practice and games always are crucial to a young player's maturation. There's no substitute for live game experience.

Brown might've been great at the scouting combine in showing how big, strong and fast he is, but he's not very agile. He doesn't have the best skill in changing directions, and that has hurt him in the NFL.

I don't think being in Denver will make much difference. The Broncos are in dire need of a pass rusher, but a change of scenery won't change him a bit.


Cris Carter is Yahoo! Sports' NFL analyst. Send him a question or comment for potential use in a future

BIG_DADDY
04-08-2005, 05:12 PM
I still think Harrington will be a good QB in this league.

Taco John
04-08-2005, 05:13 PM
I still think Harrington will be a good QB in this league.



So do I... I'd love to bring him in...

CoMoChief
04-08-2005, 05:14 PM
So why isnt Ryan Sims on this list ???

Taco John
04-08-2005, 05:17 PM
Great evaluation by Carter... I think he nails it for the most part... Though, if Trevor can play up to his level, I disagree that a change of scenery won't improve Brown. Trevor commands a double team when he's playing at top speed. That's going to be the key to our defensive success this year.

And I personally think we'll get better production out of Warren than Cleveland did. It is Cleveland, afterall...

Taco John
04-08-2005, 05:17 PM
So why isnt Ryan Sims on this list ???


Carter probably forgot that the Chiefs even existed...

Thig Lyfe
04-08-2005, 05:24 PM
Denver Bustcos, maybe?

HemiEd
04-08-2005, 05:35 PM
Carter probably forgot that the Chiefs even existed...


When it comes to busts, the Chiefs are not on the front page with the Donks! :D

Cochise
04-08-2005, 05:37 PM
3. Ron Dayne

...

Losing weight last season helped Dayne's acceleration, and I loved what I saw from him early in training camp. He finally understands that the NFL is a different game and that, to be successful, you have to be nifty and make people miss. In that instance, I thought he made great strides last year.

With Denver's blocking scheme and the way running backs have excelled behind the Broncos' offensive line Dayne has a great opportunity.


This is dead on, I think that this is part of why the true power back has somewhat disappeared in the NFL but they can still flourish in college. At the NFL level the defensive front 7 is a lot bigger and tackles much better, thus less broken tackles, thus power backs' forte, shaking off tacklers, is diminished. When you factor in the punishment a back takes when they try to run people over every down instead of avoiding contact altogether, you end up with them being ineffective at the NFL level, or having their careers shortened because of the bodily punishment they absorb.

I don't know how much the blocking scheme is going to help him but it probably can't hurt. The Giants' offensive line was pretty bad for most of Dayne's tenure. Losing weight and gaining agility in the process will probably help make him more effective, especially against less adept tacklers like, well, the ones we have put on the field for the past few years.

Baby Lee
04-08-2005, 06:26 PM
I seemed to remember an NFL game where Dayne looked AMAZING!!! When was that??? :hmmm:

whoman69
04-08-2005, 06:30 PM
I seemed to remember an NFL game where Dayne looked AMAZING!!! When was that??? :hmmm:
Never happened. It was preseason, so it wasn't really an NFL game.

Sure-Oz
04-08-2005, 06:32 PM
Dayne hasn't looked amazing since his Wisconsin days and the pre-season don't mean shit.

Baby Lee
04-08-2005, 06:33 PM
Never happened. It was against the Chief's _efense, so it wasn't really an NFL game.
Fixed your post.

Mile High Mania
04-08-2005, 08:14 PM
Eh, this would only look bad on Denver had they counted the likes of Marcus Nash... or, had they drafted a guy like Todd Blackledge.

Denver acquired 3 of the top busts (per Carter) in the last 10 days... so, it ain't that big of a deal. Dayne doesn't even register on the depth chart at this point. Warren and Brown are expected to step it up and play big roles, if they don't, then they'll never be heard from again. The $ spent on the collection of underachievers recently is less than $5M on the cap for next year for all of them. So, the risk/reward factor is high. One of them plays at a high level and it's worth the money... two of them step up and it's gravy.

If all of them suck... then it's $5M lost and that's it. I think it's safe to say the expectation level for them all is rather low at this point, so we'll see what happens with a change of scenery.

stevieray
04-08-2005, 08:18 PM
, so we'll see what happens.


Never heard this before.

HemiEd
04-08-2005, 08:19 PM
Eh, this would only look bad on Denver had they counted the likes of Marcus Nash... or, had they drafted a guy like Todd Blackledge.

Denver acquired 3 of the top busts (per Carter) in the last 10 days... so, it ain't that big of a deal. Dayne doesn't even register on the depth chart at this point. Warren and Brown are expected to step it up and play big roles, if they don't, then they'll never be heard from again. The $ spent on the collection of underachievers recently is less than $5M on the cap for next year for all of them. So, the risk/reward factor is high. One of them plays at a high level and it's worth the money... two of them step up and it's gravy.

If all of them suck... then it's $5M lost and that's it. I think it's safe to say the expectation level for them all is rather low at this point, so we'll see what happens with a change of scenery.



Spin, Spin Spin ROFL

Mile High Mania
04-08-2005, 08:20 PM
Never heard this before.

Heh and you've never typed it either, I suppose. The jump suit might be a bit tight there, Stevie... but when it comes to free agency we all say "we'll see what happens".

Count Alex's Losses
04-08-2005, 08:21 PM
I don't see anything wrong with what Denver did. There weren't really any blue chip D-line free agents out there besides Jason Ferguson and Pat Williams this offseason. Of course they blew that which was funny but bringing in these guys is the same thing we did with Lional Dalton last year. Oh of course Lional Dalton was actually GOOD at one point in his NFL career, silly me. ROFL

Mile High Mania
04-08-2005, 08:22 PM
Spin, Spin Spin ROFL

Oh my... well, I'm surprised you didn't highlight the Blackledge comment and say "stop deflecting". Fact of the matter is, I am not a fan of raiding the Browns' defensive line... but the only saving grace is they spent little money in doing so.

Mile High Mania
04-08-2005, 08:23 PM
I don't see anything wrong with what Denver did. There weren't really any blue chip D-line free agents out there besides Jason Ferguson and Pat Williams this offseason. Of course they blew that which was funny but bringing in these guys is the same thing we did with Lional Dalton last year. Oh of course Lional Dalton was actually GOOD at one point in his NFL career, silly me. ROFL

Enh, it depends on your definition of 'good'. He failed at his first attempt to be a starter in Denver, then moved to KC where just about any player with a hearbeat and the ability to stand on two feet is considered an upgrade.

Count Alex's Losses
04-08-2005, 08:24 PM
Enh, it depends on your definition of 'good'. He failed at his first attempt to be a starter in Denver, then moved to KC where just about any player with a hearbeat and the ability to stand on two feet is considered an upgrade.

He was good in Baltimore. Hence the big contract Denver wasted on him.

Mile High Mania
04-08-2005, 08:26 PM
He was good in Baltimore. Hence the big contract Denver wasted on him.

IIRC, he was more of a rotation and Denver gave him big money with the notion he was ready to be a productive starter. I don't believe he was a full time starter in Baltimore.

Count Alex's Losses
04-08-2005, 08:28 PM
IIRC, he was more of a rotation and Denver gave him big money with the notion he was ready to be a productive starter. I don't believe he was a full time starter in Baltimore.

OK he APPEARED to be good. Whatever. :rolleyes:

I guess you are all counting on the Brownie imports APPEARING to be bad in Cleveland.

Mile High Mania
04-08-2005, 08:31 PM
OK he APPEARED to be good. Whatever. :rolleyes:

I guess you are all counting on the Brownie imports APPEARING to be bad in Cleveland.

Go back to your battle with Rocky. The lesson learned here is they didn't dump money on a guy who hasn't proved anything yet. They dumped money on 4 guys who haven't proved anything yet... :deevee:

But, it's less than what they spent on Dalton the last time around.

Count Alex's Losses
04-08-2005, 08:31 PM
Go back to your battle with Rocky. The lesson learned here is they didn't dump money on a guy who hasn't proved anything yet. They dumped money on 4 guys who haven't proved anything yet... :deevee:

But, it's less than what they spent on Dalton the last time around.

Yeah I know, that was in my original post.

stevieray
04-08-2005, 08:45 PM
Heh and you've never typed it either, I suppose. The jump suit might be a bit tight there, Stevie... but when it comes to free agency we all say "we'll see what happens".

what does a jumpsuit have to do with it?

If you can't see the humor of you saying this every year nine out ten times, I guess you never will.

stevieray
04-08-2005, 08:48 PM
Enh, it depends on your definition of 'good'. He failed at his first attempt to be a starter in Denver, then moved to KC where just about any player with a hearbeat and the ability to stand on two feet is considered an upgrade.

and yet you could only score 17 points against them at the end of the season.

Mile High Mania
04-08-2005, 08:53 PM
C'mon... I was just clownin' with ya, big guy.

Logical
04-08-2005, 08:53 PM
Carter probably forgot that the Chiefs even existed...
How could he forget the Chiefs they have several of the all time greatest draft busts ever.

Most of them occuring in the 80s like Blackledge, but lets not forget the 90s with multiple first round busts of note the most terrifyingly bad being Trezelle Jenkins. Yeah they were mid to late round busts but they were horrifyingly bad.

HemiEd
04-08-2005, 08:56 PM
Oh my... well, I'm surprised you didn't highlight the Blackledge comment and say "stop deflecting". Fact of the matter is, I am not a fan of raiding the Browns' defensive line... but the only saving grace is they spent little money in doing so.


Nice! I hope someday I can forget about Todd Blackledge, :cuss:

stevieray
04-08-2005, 08:56 PM
C'mon... I was just clownin' with ya, big guy.

:thumb:

Taco John
04-08-2005, 10:45 PM
. Oh of course Lional Dalton was actually GOOD at one point in his NFL career, silly me. ROFL



This is news to me...

Taco John
04-08-2005, 10:46 PM
what does a jumpsuit have to do with it?

If you can't see the humor of you saying this every year nine out ten times, I guess you never will.



Is that anything like the humor of the Chiefs saying "we're on the upswing" for the 30th year in a row?

Count Alex's Losses
04-08-2005, 11:00 PM
This is news to me...

Baltimore. And of course he was pretty good last year.

Taco John
04-08-2005, 11:02 PM
Baltimore. And of course he was pretty good last year.



Did you see him play in Baltimore or something? He wasn't able to break the starting line-up there. The Chiefs and the Broncos inflated his value based merely on potential. You guys lucked out though, and drafted Simms instead.

Count Alex's Losses
04-08-2005, 11:04 PM
Did you see him play in Baltimore or something? He wasn't able to break the starting line-up there. The Chiefs and the Broncos inflated his value based merely on potential. You guys lucked out though, and drafted Simms instead.

For the 800th time...it's SIMS.

Taco John
04-08-2005, 11:09 PM
Brandon Hunt; Aurora, Colo.
I was little surprised with the signing of Ron Dayne. Was that move maybe made to try him at fullback and push the other backs since he's not a typical Broncos back?

Gary Kubiak
Well, I wouldn't say he's not a typical Broncos back. I don't think any of us know right now. What we saw in Ron Dayne, is a kid that when he came out of college was the type of back that we like. We weren't able to draft him, he went to another team. Ron Dayne is a one-cut, zone runner. That's what he was in college and it's kind of what we do. We think he fits what we do and we're going to give him the opportunity to play the tailback position. What's going to happen? I don't know. That's going to be up to Ron Dayne and how hard he works and the price he pays to be a part of this football team, but we kind of like his chances with what we do, so we'll see. We like the kid a lot. It's a fresh start for him, sometimes that's good for a lot of players in this league so hopefully it will be good for Ron Dayne.

Taco John
04-08-2005, 11:10 PM
For the 800th time...it's SIMS.

Who GAF?

Count Alex's Losses
04-08-2005, 11:11 PM
Brandon Hunt; Aurora, Colo.
I was little surprised with the signing of Ron Dayne. Was that move maybe made to try him at fullback and push the other backs since he's not a typical Broncos back?

Gary Kubiak
Well, I wouldn't say he's not a typical Broncos back. I don't think any of us know right now. What we saw in Ron Dayne, is a kid that when he came out of college was the type of back that we like. We weren't able to draft him, he went to another team. Ron Dayne is a one-cut, zone runner. That's what he was in college and it's kind of what we do. We think he fits what we do and we're going to give him the opportunity to play the tailback position. What's going to happen? I don't know. That's going to be up to Ron Dayne and how hard he works and the price he pays to be a part of this football team, but we kind of like his chances with what we do, so we'll see. We like the kid a lot. It's a fresh start for him, sometimes that's good for a lot of players in this league so hopefully it will be good for Ron Dayne.

Shocking. I was expecting Kubiak to launch into a paragraph or two on the many reasons why Ron Dayne sucks.