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BigChiefFan
04-08-2005, 04:22 PM
GRETZ: Waiting for Patrick
Apr 08, 2005, 4:31:03 PM by Bob Gretz



Letís start with the most important question that surrounds this whole situation:



Is it Patrick Sur-tane, as in octane, or is it Patrick Sur-tan, as in fan?

Iíve heard local hairdos and tin throats use both versions in the same sentence. Luckily, those of us pounding away with our fingers on a keyboard only have to worry about Patrick Surtain Ė thatís how you spell the name of the Miami Dolphins cornerback who may soon be wearing the red and gold.

For the record, according to the 2004 Miami Dolphins media guideís pronunciation chart itís Patrick Sir-tan, as in ďThe Man.Ē

Also for the record, understand this: as of Thursday evening, the Chiefs did not, I repeat, did not have an agreement with Surtain for a contract extension. Despite what youíve read and heard elsewhere, there is no deal. Negotiations continue, however between the team and Surtainís representative.

Make no mistake, the Chiefs are very interested in the 28-year old corner out of New Orleans and Southern Mississippi University. Almost from the moment when new Dolphins head coach Nick Saban assessed his salary cap situation and gave Surtain permission to find a new team, the Chiefs have looked upon him as one of the top options to improving their secondary in 2005.

Among all the cornerbacks available through free agency or salary cap casualties during this off-season, Surtain might be the most attractive. Heís a two-time Pro Bowler (2002 and 2003.) Heís played seven seasons, the last five as a starter and missed only four games in his career. Last season, Surtain had 71 tackles, a sack and four interceptions for the Dolphins. Those 71 tackles are noteworthy; there arenít many cornerbacks with that many tackles in the league.

Surtainís numbers are better than Samari Rolle, Fred Smoot, Ken Lucas, Ty Law and Gary Baxter. The Chiefs were serious about Rolle, who left Tennessee, danced for a few days with the Chiefs, before signing with Baltimore. That would have cost them only money. They also did due diligence with Law, but his health concerns and age make him a chancy option.

Surtain is going to cost not only a lot of money in a contract extension (his deal with the Dolphins expires after the 2005 season,) but a draft choice as well. In this case the Dolphins supposedly will not settle for anything less than a second-round pick. Thereís a reason for that: Miami does not have a second rounder, having traded it away to Philadelphia in a questionable deal last year for quarterback A.J. Feeley.

Various parties have reported that the Chiefs offered a fourth-round pick for Surtain. Four years ago, the Chiefs dealt a third-round pick, the 78th choice, to New Orleans for T Willie Roaf. This was a left tackle coming off a major knee injury, but he had already been in seven Pro Bowls. The fact that Carl Peterson wants to give up pick No.116 for Surtain is not something out of the ordinary.

However, that does not mean the deal gets done. Since they canít compromise on a third-round pick (the Chiefs selection in that round is a compensatory choice and by NFL rules cannot be dealt) somebody is going to have to give, or sweeten the pot.

Thereís a body of opinion among Chiefs fans that says, ďGive up the second rounder, we never get anything out of that round anyway.Ē Thereís some truth to that. The second round has produced names in recent drafts like DT Eddie Freeman, LB Kawika Mitchell, CB William Bartee, RB Mike Cloud and WR Kevin Lockett: none of them has or had much of a career with the Chiefs. Plus, there was that 1995 trade of a second-round pick to Philadelphia for wide receiver Victor Bailey. That deal will go down as one of the worst in Chiefs history, as Bailey played in just two games in Ď96, catching one pass for 12 yards before quietly disappearing from Arrowhead and the NFL.

That deal alone should have the Chiefs approaching any trade for a second-rounder in a careful manner. But, Patrick Surtain is not Victor Bailey. Heís a young man who turns 29 in June and figures to have another four or five years of top football ahead of him. His presence will make everyone on the Chiefs defense better.

Nobody asked me, but if the Chiefs and Dolphins reach a standoff, I have a suggestion: the Chiefs give up their second and fourth round picks. In return, they get Surtain and the Dolphins fourth-round pick. That sweetens the pot for the Chiefs, allowing them to move up in the round from the 116th pick to the 104th choice. Thatís the third selection in the second day of the draft, a prime spot. Once those first three rounds are completed, every team in the league sits down with their draft board and pinpoints players who have slipped into the second day. That earlier fourth would give the Chiefs some options: another trade to move up or down, or one of the best spots in Day No. 2.

With no other deals, the Chiefs would close out the draft with these additions:

A first-round pick, the 15th in the draft, giving them a shot at one of the top defensive players in this yearís draft class.
A Pro Bowl corner in Surtain.
A late third-round pick, along with that early fourth rounder and then two picks in the fifth round.
Thatís seven players that should help, including two: the first rounder and Surtain, who should help in 2005. Combine them with Kendrell Bell, Sammy Knight and Carlos Hall and the defense has been transformed.

The opinions offered in this column do not necessarily reflect those of the Kansas City Chiefs.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A former beat reporter who covered the Pittsburgh Steelers during their glory years, Gretz covered the Chiefs for the Kansas City Star for nine years before heading up KCFX-FM's sports department. He is a member of the Pro Football Hall of Fame's Board of Selectors. His column appears three times a week during the season.

Thig Lyfe
04-08-2005, 04:27 PM
Not a bad plan, really.

Big Chief Homer
04-08-2005, 04:40 PM
Finally,something i can say i agree with him about.

Nice option,but would saban go for it?

SNR
04-08-2005, 05:32 PM
It sucks that he makes sense in this article. Because I find it hilarious when people call him "Blob Gretz"

whoman69
04-08-2005, 05:41 PM
I've seen guys that said that Saban doesn't need to pull a deal for Surtain for our 4th because they would get a 3rd for him next year when they lose him. I've been thinking about that. It wouldn't be next year they would get the pick, it would be 2007. That also goes upon the assumption that next year they don't sign any high price FAs and that Surtain gets top dollar. That's alot of assumptions and quite a long time away for a team that needs young players to get developed now. They have only 5 picks in this draft. Holding onto Surtain also cuts down on the developement of Will Poole. They have signed Surtain's replacement, so what's the point for them. Surtain is not going to be a part of future Dolphin successes so why keep him around now to stifle those who will be? Offer them the 4th and a conditional pick next year up to a 3rd. For the first time in forever, we have extra picks but we are short on the 1st day. Why do we want to give up one of the few high picks we have?

Manila-Chief
04-08-2005, 05:43 PM
Yep!!! It's scary but I agree as well. That is an excellent proposal.

It is strange for him to admit that our 2nd. round picks have not turned up very much....

I would feel better if Carl will just get this deal done.

Hey, my baby bro. may have coached him. He was DB's coach at Miss. So. a couple of times... That makes more interested in him!!!

carlos3652
04-08-2005, 06:04 PM
Surtain deal on hold
By Harvey Fialkov
Staff writer
Posted April 8 2005

The Dolphins are apparently waiting for the Chiefs to sweeten the pot with a draft pick in at least the first three rounds before agreeing to deal Surtain to chop $8.4 million of their salary cap figure.

Woodrow Call
04-08-2005, 07:19 PM
Surtain deal on hold
By Harvey Fialkov
Staff writer
Posted April 8 2005

The Dolphins are apparently waiting for the Chiefs to sweeten the pot with a draft pick in at least the first three rounds before agreeing to deal Surtain to chop $8.4 million of their salary cap figure.

This is gonna be one hell of a pissing contest.

Chiefnj
04-08-2005, 08:32 PM
"Also for the record, understand this: as of Thursday evening, the Chiefs did not, I repeat, did not have an agreement with Surtain for a contract extension. Despite what youíve read and heard elsewhere, there is no deal. "


- Well that puts everything back to square one. :mad:

beer bacon
04-08-2005, 08:54 PM
"Also for the record, understand this: as of Thursday evening, the Chiefs did not, I repeat, did not have an agreement with Surtain for a contract extension. Despite what youíve read and heard elsewhere, there is no deal. "


- Well that puts everything back to square one. :mad:

You really believe Gretz about this? What reason do you have to believe him?

Logical
04-08-2005, 09:00 PM
"Also for the record, understand this: as of Thursday evening, the Chiefs did not, I repeat, did not have an agreement with Surtain for a contract extension. Despite what youíve read and heard elsewhere, there is no deal. "


- Well that puts everything back to square one. :mad:

You do not really believe Gretz, Carl's personal knobshiner, do you?

I certainly am not going to take Carl's mouthpiece word over multiple national media sources when it comes to accuracy. Hell if the Chiefs owned Gretz as a slave he could not be more of a suck up.

Logical
04-08-2005, 09:03 PM
Having said all that I do like the trade idea Gretz proposed.

KCJake
04-08-2005, 09:17 PM
"DT Eddie Freeman, LB Kawika Mitchell, CB William Bartee, RB Mike Cloud and WR Kevin Lockett"

That's a reality check. You just never know :hmmm:

the Talking Can
04-08-2005, 09:21 PM
oh my god...a KC writer with a constructive idea...

Logical
04-08-2005, 09:22 PM
"DT Eddie Freeman, LB Kawika Mitchell, CB William Bartee, RB Mike Cloud and WR Kevin Lockett"

That's a reality check. You just never know :hmmm:LOL for the Chiefs and Carl it is much tougher to find a 2nd round success, that it is to find failures. Failure is the standard.

the Talking Can
04-08-2005, 09:22 PM
Hell if the Chiefs owned Gretz as a slave he could not be more of a suck up.

ROFL

C-Mac
04-08-2005, 11:28 PM
"DT Eddie Freeman, LB Kawika Mitchell, CB William Bartee, RB Mike Cloud and WR Kevin Lockett"

That's a reality check. You just never know :hmmm:

Of coarse the jury is out on Kris Wilson........but Victor Bailey, wow I had totally forgotten about him.

Ninjaman
04-09-2005, 12:02 AM
Why trade now.

Wait and take a look at Ty Law.

Count Zarth
04-09-2005, 12:09 AM
Why trade now.

Wait and take a look at Ty Law.

Ty Law can barely walk.

penchief
04-09-2005, 12:19 AM
IMO, it's becoming more and more obvious that Peterson has plans for that second round pick. The question is, what is he thinking?

bringbackmarty
04-09-2005, 01:01 AM
prolly trade it for a te\fb\ss\cb\de\lb, who can punt.

Frankie
04-09-2005, 02:01 AM
Having said all that I do like the trade idea Gretz proposed.

It comes close but no cigar, in my book. I'd like to see this (and I think it's doable):

Our 2nd and one of our 5ths for Surtain and their 4th

Logical
04-09-2005, 02:28 AM
It comes close but no cigar, in my book. I'd like to see this (and I think it's doable):

Our 2nd and one of our 5ths for Surtain and their 4th

That sounds nice but I don't believe it works out on the trade value chart. Course a lot of people believe a 2nd rounder is worth way more than I do, because I believe a 2nd rounder for a 3 time pro bowl CB is a steal.

htismaqe
04-09-2005, 05:21 AM
IMO, it's becoming more and more obvious that Peterson has plans for that second round pick. The question is, what is he thinking?

I don't think Peterson has any solid plans for that pick. He's trying to stonewall the Dolphins into lowering their demands, which really isn't a bad idea.

I still say that Surtain will be Chief, sometime in the 24 hours leading up to the draft.

Gaz
04-09-2005, 05:54 AM
...I still say that Surtain will be Chief, sometime in the 24 hours leading up to the draft.

Yep.

xoxo~
Gaz
Doubts it will be for a 2nd, either.

Chief Chief
04-09-2005, 06:05 AM
Who pays this guy? Everything re-Gretz writes in this column I've already read elsewhere.

wazu
04-09-2005, 07:49 AM
Who pays this guy? Everything re-Gretz writes in this column I've already read elsewhere.

Where did you read about the "trading fourth round picks" plan? I think it sounds pretty damn good. (Although I'd settle for just parting with our second-rounder straight-up.)

Chief Henry
04-09-2005, 08:26 AM
Bob, u r a jenee us...

Wile_E_Coyote
04-09-2005, 08:33 AM
"Also for the record, understand this: as of Thursday evening, the Chiefs did not, I repeat, did not have an agreement with Surtain for a contract extension. Despite what youíve read and heard elsewhere, there is no deal. Negotiations continue, however between the team and Surtainís representative."

you decide to share this after the Chiefs went on a small spending spree this week...:shrug:

htismaqe
04-09-2005, 09:55 AM
"Also for the record, understand this: as of Thursday evening, the Chiefs did not, I repeat, did not have an agreement with Surtain for a contract extension. Despite what youíve read and heard elsewhere, there is no deal. Negotiations continue, however between the team and Surtainís representative."

you decide to share this after the Chiefs went on a small spending spree this week...:shrug:

The Chiefs DO have a deal done for Surtain, I'm certain of it.

There's ZERO chance the Chiefs or their public mouthpiece Bob Gretz are going to come out and say so. They're going to deny it every step of the way.