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tk13
04-12-2005, 02:22 AM
http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/sports/11369564.htm

Chiefs entertain options

List of players visiting Arrowhead says much about the team's plans for the NFL draft

By ADAM TEICHER The Kansas City Star


The Chiefs are putting the final touches on preparations for the upcoming NFL draft by doing some entertaining.

They planned to meet this week at Arrowhead Stadium with 19 prospects for the April 23-24 draft. Not surprisingly, given their desperate need for talented prospects who can pose problems for the opposing offense, 15 are defensive players.

Seven of the defenders are considered certain first-round picks by one team or another: defensive end Erasmus James of Wisconsin, linebackers Derrick Johnson of Texas and Demarcus Ware of Troy, cornerbacks Carlos Rogers of Auburn and Fabian Washington of Nebraska, and safeties Thomas Davis of Georgia and Brodney Pool of Oklahoma.

The others are later-round choices or after-draft free agents.

The visits aren't necessarily a sign the Chiefs are interested in drafting these players. They may believe they have enough information on certain draft prospects while wanting a closer look at others.

But the list of visiting draft prospects can show what the Chiefs are thinking. In many years, they spent time at Arrowhead before the draft with several players they wound up selecting.

Johnson, generally regarded as the top linebacker in the draft, doesn't figure to last until the Chiefs make their first selection with the 15th pick. His visit raises the question of whether they plan to trade up to a favorable spot.

Many of the other potential first-round visitors could be available after the 15th pick, which could mean the Chiefs are hoping to move down while also acquiring an additional later choice or two.

Linebacker is the position of most obvious need for the Chiefs. They signed Pittsburgh free agent Kendrell Bell, but three top starting candidates, Scott Fujita, Shawn Barber and Mike Maslowski, have injury issues that may prevent them from being ready when the season begins.

Monty Beisel, who would have been a starting candidate, signed instead last week as a free agent with the Patriots.

The Chiefs have a third linebacking prospect, Jordan Beck of Cal Poly, visiting this week.

The Chiefs may draft a cornerback in an early round whether or not they make the trade with Miami for veteran Patrick Surtain. They planned to meet this week with five cornerbacks, including Rogers and Washington.

The others are LSU's Corey Webster, Virginia Tech's Eric Green and Oklahoma State's Darrent Williams. These three are generally considered to be second- or third-round choices.

The Chiefs are heavy with veteran safeties after signing Sammy Knight to join incumbent starters Greg Wesley and Jerome Woods. That makes their visits with Pool and Davis the most intriguing. The Chiefs will also meet with two other later-round safeties: Nebraska's Josh Bullocks and Fresno State's James Sanders.

At defensive end, the Chiefs appear set after trading for Tennessee's Carlos Hall, who will join starters Jared Allen and Eric Hicks in the playing rotation. But they planned to meet with not only James, but two other later-round or free-agent ends: Arkansas' Jeb Huckeba and Stanford's Will Svitek.

The four offensive visitors are running back Damien Nash of Missouri, wide receivers Mark Bradley of Oklahoma and Roydell Williams of Tulane and tackle Todd Herremans of Saginaw Valley State.

• FUJITA FINE: Coach Dick Vermeil said the Chiefs were pleased with the recent arthroscopic surgery on Fujita's ankle.

“They just cleaned the ankle out,” Vermeil said. “He had some soft tissue problem in there and floating particles. He'll be fine.”

• MISSING MONTY: The loss of Beisel hit Vermeil hard on a number of levels. Not only was Beisel a possible starter and top special-teams player, but his consistent effort made him Vermeil's type of player.

“That just crushed me,” Vermeil said. “I understand his decision. They told him he might be a starter. But we invested four years with the kid and converted him (from defensive end) and made him into a player at another position or else he's probably not even in the league. Then, all of a sudden, we get him to the point where maybe you can get even more miles out of him and he's gone. I miss him already.”

the Talking Can
04-12-2005, 04:17 AM
• MISSING MONTY: The loss of Beisel hit Vermeil hard on a number of levels. Not only was Beisel a possible starter and top special-teams player, but his consistent effort made him Vermeil's type of player.

“That just crushed me,” Vermeil said. “I understand his decision. They told him he might be a starter. But we invested four years with the kid and converted him (from defensive end) and made him into a player at another position or else he's probably not even in the league. Then, all of a sudden, we get him to the point where maybe you can get even more miles out of him and he's gone. I miss him already.”


maybe he got tired of playing for someone who doesn't give a rats ass about defense...

Bob Dole
04-12-2005, 05:37 AM
Does the scheduled visit of 2 college safeties scare the crap out of anyone else?

Big Chief Homer
04-12-2005, 06:42 AM
Does the scheduled visit of 2 college safeties scare the crap out of anyone else?
Not 2,but 4 WTF :cuss:

If they draft a safety im gonna flip.Unless one of these guys is our new CB :banghead: :cuss: :deevee:

It also disturbs me they are only bringing in 1 high quality LBer. :(

Big Chief Homer
04-12-2005, 06:48 AM
Dvs right about Beisel though.if he wouldnt have invested the time on him,he probably wouldnt be i the league anymore.

Maybe that will teach DV a lesson about projects.

yoswif
04-12-2005, 07:00 AM
Beck, LB-Cal Poly, followed Jared Allen as Buck Buchanon award winner. Was a playmaker at MLB and then posted top cornerback #s for speed and agility at his workout. Would be a good late third pick, imo.

Svitek, DE-Stanford, looks like a good candidate to make the switch from Dline to Oline. Good size, strength, and agility for an offensive tackle. Good value in the sixth or seventh round, I think.

Alphaman
04-12-2005, 07:20 AM
Not 2,but 4 WTF :cuss:

If they draft a safety im gonna flip.Unless one of these guys is our new CB :banghead: :cuss: :deevee:

It also disturbs me they are only bringing in 1 high quality LBer. :(

Maybe you and I see it differently, but I think DeMarcus Ware is a high quality LBer. I think his speed, quickness, agility and athleticism off the edge compare to DT who Gun knew how to use.

In fact I would prefer Ware at 15 and keep our 2nd than Johnson.

patteeu
04-12-2005, 07:20 AM
Not 2,but 4 WTF :cuss:

If they draft a safety im gonna flip.Unless one of these guys is our new CB :banghead: :cuss: :deevee:

It also disturbs me they are only bringing in 1 high quality LBer. :(

What if one of them is our new OLB?

KChiefs1
04-12-2005, 07:53 AM
“That just crushed me,” Vermeil said. “I understand his decision. They told him he might be a starter. But we invested four years with the kid and converted him (from defensive end) and made him into a player at another position or else he's probably not even in the league. Then, all of a sudden, we get him to the point where maybe you can get even more miles out of him and he's gone. I miss him already.”

I wonder if there was a tear in his eye when he said it? :deevee:

nmt1
04-12-2005, 07:57 AM
When is the last time the Chiefs drafted someone who visited them before the draft?

Cochise
04-12-2005, 08:01 AM
Come on, they aren't going to draft a friggin safety.

Coogs
04-12-2005, 08:09 AM
Does the scheduled visit of 2 college safeties scare the crap out of anyone else?

No. Davis could be a great draft pick. He could be moved to OLB just as easy as playing saftey too.

Gaz
04-12-2005, 08:13 AM
Please, PLEASE, no more converted Safeties.

I am begging you.

xoxo~
Gaz
On bended knee, with clasped hands and tear-filled eyes.

donkhater
04-12-2005, 08:13 AM
What if one of them is our new OLB?
yeah, A lot of experts have Davis converting to OLB in the pros

DeepSouth
04-12-2005, 08:37 AM
No. Davis could be a great draft pick. He could be moved to OLB just as easy as playing saftey too.
Remember Larry Atkins?

Rukdafaidas
04-12-2005, 08:38 AM
Please, PLEASE, no more converted Safeties.

I am begging you.

xoxo~
Gaz
On bended knee, with clasped hands and tear-filled eyes.

Yes, and please, PLEASE, no more Big 12 Def. backs.

Chiefnj
04-12-2005, 08:43 AM
Moving Davis to OLB is a possibility for a team that doesn't have immediate needs. Converting a player to a different position is a 2-3 year process. The Chiefs can't use their first round pick on another damn developmental player if they expect to make a run this year.


The Prospects:

DE:
Erasmus James - I hope not. Too many injury problems to take at 15. Plus, if you want a pass rusher take Pollack.
Jeb Huckeba - ??
Will Svitek - ??


LB:
Derrick Johnson - The Chiefs would have to move up to grab him.
Demarcus Ware - Decent second day prospect, but is a developmental player. A 250 lb DE in college he'll be moved to LB in the NFL. Probably better suited for a 3-4.
Jordan Beck - This year's Jared Allen. Very productive small school prospect. Played MLB in college, but is only 233 lbs so he'd have to move outside in the NFL. A developmental WILL which the Chiefs could use.


CB:
Rogers - Good prospect at 15.
Washington - If he didn't run an exceptionally fast 40 he wouldn't be considered a 1st round pick. That 40 time shouldn't change things.
Webster - Would IMO be a great 2nd round pickup. Good size and is used to playing man on man in a pro sytle defense. Could contribute his first year.
Green - Decent 2nd round prospect.
Williams - Don't know anything about him.


S: I'm not even going to comment on safeties because IMO there is no need to draft one - Woods, Wesley, Knight, Pile, Harts, Battle, Bartee. The Chiefs have enough to work with on the roster.

Thomas Davis
Brodney Pool
Josh Bullocks
James Sanders

Chiefnj
04-12-2005, 08:45 AM
When is the last time the Chiefs drafted someone who visited them before the draft?

Off the top of my head, IIRC, they usually don't sign a first round pick who visited. But there is a good chance that the later picks (3-7) make their way onto the roster.

Frosty
04-12-2005, 09:33 AM
Demarcus Ware - Decent second day prospect, but is a developmental player. A 250 lb DE in college he'll be moved to LB in the NFL. Probably better suited for a 3-4.

NFL Network last night said Ware will probably be a top 15 pick. Supposedly the Cowboys are very interested and the Chargers want him if he makes it past the Cowboys.

It seems like these guys that shoot up out of nowhere and are tweeners are almost always busts. If so, I hope the Chargers take him at #12.
:)

nascher
04-12-2005, 09:37 AM
Sampson visited last year !!!

Kyle401
04-12-2005, 09:38 AM
Damien Nash in the 6th or 7th would be an excellent depth selection to fill Blaylock's shoes.

I like Webster in the 2nd if we end up with a LB in the 1st. I think if he hadn't been injured, he would be going in the top 20 this year.

Carl and Gunther were also at the Maryland pro day, so I wouldn't be suprised if they are looking at DE/LB Shawne Merriman (1st), CB Domonique Foxworth (4th or later), or maybe FB Sam Monaldo (1st). :p

On Davis; there was early speculation that he could move back to LB, but after running a 4.43 and a 4.44 at his pro day, he will likely remain at safety.

nmt1
04-12-2005, 09:41 AM
S: I'm not even going to comment on safeties because IMO there is no need to draft one - Woods, Wesley, Knight, Pile, Harts, Battle, Bartee. The Chiefs have enough to work with on the roster.

C'mon, you know that Bartee and Battle are both CB's according to the Chiefs and whether we like that or not doesn't matter one bit to the Chiefs. Woods and Knight are not spring chickens so I could see them taking someone in the late rounds or after the draft for development purposes. Don't tell me you wouldn't like to have a player like Sean Taylor on the Chiefs. I would.

Chiefnj
04-12-2005, 09:48 AM
C'mon, you know that Bartee and Battle are both CB's according to the Chiefs and whether we like that or not doesn't matter one bit to the Chiefs. Woods and Knight are not spring chickens so I could see them taking someone in the late rounds or after the draft for development purposes. Don't tell me you wouldn't like to have a player like Sean Taylor on the Chiefs. I would.

Vermeil is gone next year. I expect the new head coach to either get rid of guys like Bartee or Battle or move them to safety where they might belong. I wouldn't mind having a Sean Taylor on the team as long as I have an Arrington and other impact positions. At this point safety is the deepest spot on the roster.

nmt1
04-12-2005, 10:09 AM
Vermeil is gone next year. I expect the new head coach to either get rid of guys like Bartee or Battle or move them to safety where they might belong. I wouldn't mind having a Sean Taylor on the team as long as I have an Arrington and other impact positions. At this point safety is the deepest spot on the roster.

You can have Arrington.
Vermiel may or may not be gone next season. Even if he is, our next coach might very well think the same thing and keep those guys right where they are. Oh, and BTW, the converting safeties to CB's thing started before Vermiel arrived in KC.
Safety may be deep but look what we've gotten out of them over the past several years. If I were looking to draft a player for the defense, I'd want to find the most talented guy I could and draft him. There is no position on the defense that should be sacred, good depth or otherwise.
I hate to think of the Chiefs drafting for current needs and not future needs. The chances of us getting a guy who will start right away are slim, IMO.

Chiefnj
04-12-2005, 10:18 AM
The chances of us getting a guy who will start right away are slim, IMO.

There is no excuse for that when you have a team that has been a bottom feeder on D for the last 3 years.

Coogs
04-12-2005, 10:22 AM
Remember Larry Atkins?

Remember Brian Urlacher?

CHIEF4EVER
04-12-2005, 10:24 AM
For goodness sakes....NO...MORE...FRIGGIN...SAFETIES!!!!!!

nmt1
04-12-2005, 10:28 AM
There is no excuse for that when you have a team that has been a bottom feeder on D for the last 3 years.

You have a point but there's more to getting a guy ready to play than him being more athletic or faster. The guy has to learn the defense for one thing. You've got to make sure the guy isn't going to be completely overwhelmed when you put him in the game. I've never played college or pro football but I've heard many say the the difference between the two is large.
I'd love it if our rookies could come in and start right away but, realistically, they can't and won't.

Coogs
04-12-2005, 10:28 AM
FWIW, I am not promoting Davis with our #15 pick. The question was if it bothered anybody that he was here. No it does not bother me, because he is one of the best defensive "PLAYMAKERS" in the draft. We are a bit short on those. Safety or not. How many of you would like to have Ed Reed or the dude Washington drafted last year, Sean Taylor, from Miami on our roster? I know I would.

nmt1
04-12-2005, 10:30 AM
Safety or not. How many of you would like to have Ed Reed or the dude Washington drafted last year from Miami on our roster? I know I would.

Sean Taylor is the guy. Either he or Ed Reed would start over anything we've got right now, including Sammy Knight.

ChiTown
04-12-2005, 10:30 AM
• MISSING MONTY: The loss of Beisel hit Vermeil hard on a number of levels. Not only was Beisel a possible starter and top special-teams player, but his consistent effort made him Vermeil's type of player.

“That just crushed me,” Vermeil said. “I understand his decision. They told him he might be a starter. But we invested four years with the kid and converted him (from defensive end) and made him into a player at another position or else he's probably not even in the league. Then, all of a sudden, we get him to the point where maybe you can get even more miles out of him and he's gone. I miss him already.”


maybe he got tired of playing for someone who doesn't give a rats ass about defense...

ROFL That's very true :shake:

Coogs
04-12-2005, 10:31 AM
Sean Taylor is the guy.


Thanks! :thumb:

eazyb81
04-12-2005, 10:34 AM
Thomas Davis played OLB for a few seasons at Georgia, then converted to safety last season because of an injury to a starting safety. He could easily convert back to OLB, so it's not like it will take him a season or two to learn how to play the position....he already knows how.

That being said, I am still pimping Carlos Rogers in the 1st and Darryl Blackstock in the 2nd. :thumb:

nmt1
04-12-2005, 10:36 AM
ROFL That's very true :shake:

No it's really not true, it's hyperbole. One only need look at our drafts since Vermiel became coach. Only one of our first picks was not a defensive player.

Coogs
04-12-2005, 10:37 AM
Thomas Davis played OLB for a few seasons at Georgia, then converted to safety last season because of an injury to a starting safety. He could easily convert back to OLB, so it's not like it will take him a season or two to learn how to play the position....he already knows how.

That being said, I am still pimping Carlos Rogers in the 1st and Darryl Blackstock in the 2nd. :thumb:

Since you want to "Free Key Fox", are you going Fox, Bell, and Blackstock as your LB's?

eazyb81
04-12-2005, 10:40 AM
Since you want to "Free Key Fox", are you going Fox, Bell, and Blackstock as your LB's?

ROFL I don't think Fox should definately be a starter, but he should certainly get a realistic look this year. I kind of doubt that we can get Blackstock in the 2nd, and all other good OLBs will be gone by then. Personally, I would like to see Fujita, Bell, and the best of the rest (Fox, Mitchell, Blackstock?, Caver?) in our LB corps.

shaneo69
04-12-2005, 10:41 AM
I'd love it if our rookies could come in and start right away but, realistically, they can't and won't.

This is just B.S. Derrick Thomas, Percy Snow, and Dale Carter all came in and started their rookie seasons. Fourth rounders Donnie Edwards and Greg Favors were starting by the end of their rookie seasons. Jeez, even 5th rounders Pat Dennis and Fujita were starters by mid-season. Wasn't Sims already starting his rookie season when he got hurt?

There's no reason 1st rounders shouldn't be starting by opening day, unless you've drafted a friggin tweener/project.

nmt1
04-12-2005, 10:42 AM
There's no reason 1st rounders shouldn't be starting by opening day, unless you've drafted a friggin tweener/project.

According to many all we draft is tweeners and projects so I'm being realistic when I say they won't start from day one.

Coogs
04-12-2005, 10:44 AM
ROFL I don't think Fox should definately be a starter, but he should certainly get a realistic look this year. I kind of doubt that we can get Blackstock in the 2nd, and all other good OLBs will be gone by then. Personally, I would like to see Fujita, Bell, and the best of the rest (Fox, Mitchell, Blackstock?, Caver?) in our LB corps.

I really wouldn't mind Fox, Bell, and Blackstock as our future LB corp. I think it would rock. While I see Fujita as our opening day starter, I also see him being replaced soon.

eazyb81
04-12-2005, 10:46 AM
I really wouldn't mind Fox, Bell, and Blackstock as our future LB corp. I think it would rock. While I see Fujita as our opening day starter, I also see him being replaced soon.

Yes, Fooj could easily be replaced by a more talented player. Fox has the ability and graded out comparably to Kevin Burnett, a guy everybody on here was pimping earlier. Fox, Bell, and Blackstock would be the shizznit.

Coogs
04-12-2005, 10:48 AM
Yes, Fooj could easily be replaced by a more talented player. Fox has the ability and graded out comparably to Kevin Burnett, a guy everybody on here was pimping earlier. Fox, Bell, and Blackstock would be the shizznit.

Going one further, you throw in Mitchell with that group, and I think you have the makings of a nice 3-4 LB group.

patteeu
04-12-2005, 10:50 AM
No it's really not true, it's hyperbole. One only need look at our drafts since Vermiel became coach. Only one of our first picks was not a defensive player.

And even in that case, Vermeil wasn't behind that choice.

StcChief
04-12-2005, 10:51 AM
Gun is making case for D players you can bet on it.

shaneo69
04-12-2005, 10:52 AM
And even in that case, Vermeil wasn't behind that choice.

Yeah, that year, DV's first choice was project/tweener Tyler Brayton.

eazyb81
04-12-2005, 10:53 AM
Going one further, you throw in Mitchell with that group, and I think you have the makings of a nice 3-4 LB group.

I definately agree, if Siavii has progressed enough from last year. We could do a situational 3-4 scheme using Browning, Siavii, and Hicks on the Dline and Fox, Mitchell, Bell, and Blackstock at LBs. That would be sweet.

Spicy McHaggis
04-12-2005, 10:58 AM
Yes, Fooj could easily be replaced by a more talented player. Fox has the ability and graded out comparably to Kevin Burnett, a guy everybody on here was pimping earlier. Fox, Bell, and Blackstock would be the shizznit.

Fox should get more looks on passing downs at least. He got to the QB well at GT. I'm not sold on Blackstock though. I have to admit I wasn't nearly as focused on him when I watched Virginia as I was Ahmad Brooks.

eazyb81
04-12-2005, 11:03 AM
Fox should get more looks on passing downs at least. He got to the QB well at GT. I'm not sold on Blackstock though. I have to admit I wasn't nearly as focused on him when I watched Virginia as I was Ahmad Brooks.

Understandably, Brooks would have challenged DJ as the first LB taken if he came out early this year. I don't view Blackstock as an immediate stud, but I think he could be a great player for us and would be a steal if we could get him with our 2nd round pick.

philfree
04-12-2005, 11:09 AM
Damien Nash in the 6th or 7th would be an excellent depth selection to fill Blaylock's shoes.

I like Webster in the 2nd if we end up with a LB in the 1st. I think if he hadn't been injured, he would be going in the top 20 this year.

Carl and Gunther were also at the Maryland pro day, so I wouldn't be suprised if they are looking at DE/LB Shawne Merriman (1st), CB Domonique Foxworth (4th or later), or maybe FB Sam Monaldo (1st). :p

On Davis; there was early speculation that he could move back to LB, but after running a 4.43 and a 4.44 at his pro day, he will likely remain at safety.

Davis ran more like a 4.52 at his pro day and a 4.60 at the combine. That's still fast for a guy his size though. If we can get Surtain on board I wouldn't mind Thomas Davis in the 1st at all. He'd be our WLB and he is a playmaker.

PhilFree:arrow:

CosmicPal
04-12-2005, 11:11 AM
Wow.....this looks very promising, and the best thing is- there's nobody from Oregon St. or Idaho Automotive Technical School or Pacific College for the Mentally Deranged. Peterson is actually looking at prospects from sound football programs.

AND- I love nearly all of the peeps they're looking at with the exception of Thomas Davis and Brodney Pool Actually, I'd be excited to have either one of these safeties, but I don't understand why we NEED a safety- unless Peterson has something up his sleeve with Woods and/or Wesley (maybe a trade?) But, I'd be disappointed in getting a safety in the first round- and both of these guys are certain first rounders.

I don't like the prospect of trading up for Johnson, but I'd be all for trading down a few slots to pick up either Eramus James or Demarcus Ware I am very high on both of these guys, and would love to see either one in a Chiefs uniform. I honestly believe Ware can be as good, if not better than DJ.

If they don't pick James or Ware, then I'd be happy with either Carlos Rogers or Fabian Washington, both of whom will be plugged in as an immediate starter and will help solidify that backfield for a few years. This is a deep draft for corners and I would almost have to believe they will pick Rogers, particularly since they just picked up Carlos Hall at DE.

I love the receivers they are looking at as well: Mark Bradley and Roydell Williams. Both of these kids will be remarkable and won't have to learn the system like Sammie Parker...geez- give that kid a break- he was making all kinds of nice catches the last four games. I can see them maybe getting Williams in the third.

Or I also like the DB's they are looking at in the later rounds, particularly Corey Webster or Eric Green, both of whom would be better than either Bartee or Battle. I expect us to pick up one of these two guys in the third or fourth round to replace our ever-present Bartee once and for all.

I'm excited about our draft possibility now that I see these guy's names mentioned as visitors to Arrowhead. This is looking very promising....

Spicy McHaggis
04-12-2005, 11:16 AM
AND- I love nearly all of the peeps they're looking at with the exception of Thomas Davis and Brodney Pool Actually, I'd be excited to have either one of these safeties, but I don't understand why we NEED a safety- unless Peterson has something up his sleeve with Woods and/or Wesley (maybe a trade?) But, I'd be disappointed in getting a safety in the first round- and both of these guys are certain first rounders.

I don't like the prospect of trading up for Johnson, but I'd be all for trading down a few slots to pick up either Eramus James or Demarcus Ware I am very high on both of these guys, and would love to see either one in a Chiefs uniform. I honestly believe Ware can be as good, if not better than DJ.

I'm excited about our draft possibility now that I see these guy's names mentioned as visitors to Arrowhead. This is looking very promising....

As was mentioned before, I imagine that we're looking at Davis as a prospective OLB. Pool I can't explain b/c there's no way he's big enough to convert to LB and as you said we don't need to draft at possibly our deepest position on D. I'm not high on James at all and I believe he is at best, the third DE in the draft.

CosmicPal
04-12-2005, 11:25 AM
As was mentioned before, I imagine that we're looking at Davis as a prospective OLB.

Yes, I do understand that. BUT, here's my beef with getting Davis and converting him to LB. That is precisely what Peterson loves to do- fuggen draft guys and have them convert.

I love Davis, don't get me wrong- but, I don't want our first round draft pick to be someone we convert to another position other than their natural position. Somebody's gone in that current backfield- whether it be Bartee, Woods, and/or Wesley. Not sure who, but the fact they are looking at so many safeties hints at the fact the Chiefs are looking to move some players.

If they picked up Davis, I wouldn't be disappointed for we would be getting a sound football player, but I would just rather we get someone who's a stud in their own natural position.

eazyb81
04-12-2005, 11:33 AM
Yes, I do understand that. BUT, here's my beef with getting Davis and converting him to LB. That is precisely what Peterson loves to do- fuggen draft guys and have them convert.

I love Davis, don't get me wrong- but, I don't want our first round draft pick to be someone we convert to another position other than their natural position. Somebody's gone in that current backfield- whether it be Bartee, Woods, and/or Wesley. Not sure who, but the fact they are looking at so many safeties hints at the fact the Chiefs are looking to move some players.

If they picked up Davis, I wouldn't be disappointed for we would be getting a sound football player, but I would just rather we get someone who's a stud in their own natural position.

Thomas Davis originally played OLB in college. He switched to safety when the starting safety became injured. Switching back to OLB shouldn't be a problem.

htismaqe
04-12-2005, 11:35 AM
Thomas Davis originally played OLB in college. He switched to safety when the starting safety became injured. Switching back to OLB shouldn't be a problem.

Sorry to cross-thread post, but I don't get this.

You're ok with Davis moving around because his team needed him to, but it's a problem for Marlin Jackson?

Jackson played safety because his team needed him to, not because he couldn't cut it at corner.

Coogs
04-12-2005, 11:36 AM
Thomas Davis originally played OLB in college. He switched to safety when the starting safety became injured. Switching back to OLB shouldn't be a problem.

That seems to be a point that most here have missed.

Tribal Warfare
04-12-2005, 12:51 PM
The Derrick Johnson train still keeps moving ! :D :thumb:

eazyb81
04-12-2005, 12:56 PM
Sorry to cross-thread post, but I don't get this.

You're ok with Davis moving around because his team needed him to, but it's a problem for Marlin Jackson?

Jackson played safety because his team needed him to, not because he couldn't cut it at corner.

I figured you would see this ROFL.

I think it is a bigger risk to draft a CB that last played free safety, then it is to draft an OLB that last played strong safety. I would prefer to draft a CB in the 1st round that has played CB his entire career, because it is a big jump from college to the pros. Also, I simply think Rogers will be a better fit in our system and will be the better pro.

Mr. Laz
04-12-2005, 01:02 PM
“That just crushed me,” Vermeil said. “I understand his decision. They told him he might be a starter. But we invested four years with the kid and converted him (from defensive end) and made him into a player at another position or else he's probably not even in the league. Then, all of a sudden, we get him to the point where maybe you can get even more miles out of him and he's gone. I miss him already.”
Vermeil is such a senile,manipulative b!tch

yes ... the chiefs converted Beisel BUT they also kept moving him around and never made any commitment to him.

he was drafted as a DE .... then moved to SSLB ... then moved to MLB ... then moved back outside.

at each turn they had a guy they perferred to play ahead of beisel

Barber,Mitchell,fujita....

you developed a utility linebacker and special teamer ... beisel knew it.

He went to the patriots because he hopes for more.

no wonder Vermeil and peterson are such good friends ... they are both completely full of chit.


but keep playing that victim card you punk lil bitch, Vermeil :rolleyes:

Chiefnj
04-12-2005, 01:02 PM
I figured you would see this ROFL.

I think it is a bigger risk to draft a CB that last played free safety, then it is to draft an OLB that last played strong safety. I would prefer to draft a CB in the 1st round that has played CB his entire career, because it is a big jump from college to the pros. Also, I simply think Rogers will be a better fit in our system and will be the better pro.

Much ado about nothing.
Jackson played corner for three years. The same as any junior who declared and the same as a guy who played sparingly his frosh or even sophomore year.

Jackson didn't "last play" at safety. He was a corner his entire senior year.

Chiefnj
04-12-2005, 01:04 PM
I need to add that the Chiefs need to draft a DT at some point before round 6.

This is Sims' contract year and Dalton's last year under contract. Browning is getting a bit long in the tooth as well. Siavii is the only young DT who will be under contract next year.

eazyb81
04-12-2005, 01:06 PM
Much ado about nothing.
Jackson played corner for three years. The same as any junior who declared and the same as a guy who played sparingly his frosh or even sophomore year.

Jackson didn't "last play" at safety. He was a corner his entire senior year.

Jackson has played every position in the seconday, and played at safety in 2003. That is great that he is so versatile, but I want a CB that is excellent at what he does, not a jack of all trades type of guy.

htismaqe
04-12-2005, 01:50 PM
Jackson has played every position in the seconday, and played at safety in 2003. That is great that he is so versatile, but I want a CB that is excellent at what he does, not a jack of all trades type of guy.

See, that's what I strongly disagree with you on. You're assuming, because he played safety, that he's not an excellent CB.

You couldn't be more wrong.

Frosty
04-12-2005, 01:51 PM
Wow.....this looks very promising, and the best thing is- there's nobody from Oregon St. ...


:rolleyes: Yeah, we wouldn't want anyone like Reggie Tongue, Chad Johnson, T.J. Houshmanzadeh, or Nick Barnett on the Chiefs.

This year, both Brandon Browner (CB) and Bill Swancutt (DE) would make good first day picks. Excellent second day value would be Derek Anderson (QB), Aric Williams (CB) and Jonathan Pollard (LB). Pollard had a lot of preseason hype but ended up fighting an ankle injury for half of the season, which dropped his value. He would be a great pickup in the 4th or 5th round.

eazyb81
04-12-2005, 01:55 PM
See, that's what I strongly disagree with you on. You're assuming, because he played safety, that he's not an excellent CB.

You couldn't be more wrong.

I'm sure he will be a good CB in the league, but I think Rogers is a much better fit for Gun's man-to-man scheme and will be a better pro player overall.

whoman69
04-12-2005, 01:56 PM
When is the last time the Chiefs drafted someone who visited them before the draft?
boo-yah

htismaqe
04-12-2005, 03:07 PM
I'm sure he will be a good CB in the league, but I think Rogers is a much better fit for Gun's man-to-man scheme and will be a better pro player overall.

I don't think either one of them will be much more than a nickel back this year, at least they better not be...

Edubs
04-12-2005, 03:38 PM
When do we start thinking about drafting a QB? I know we need to beef up the defense but we can't forget about the future as well. Trent is getting old and I don't think ol Collins is the future of the Chiefs. I think a later round QB to develop under Trent is a must in the near future.

I would be a lot happier trading for Surtain and drafting a LB in the first round. Carl will probably draft a running back in the first round because he will be the best player available with the 15th pick in the draft. You know we need some insurance for Priest and Johnson. HA! :p

Coogs
04-12-2005, 03:55 PM
When do we start thinking about drafting a QB? I know we need to beef up the defense but we can't forget about the future as well. Trent is getting old and I don't think ol Collins is the future of the Chiefs. I think a later round QB to develop under Trent is a must in the near future.

I would in either late round three at 99 or early round four at 116. Ex-FSU QB Adrian McPherson would be a good choice IMO at either pick.

Kyle401
04-12-2005, 04:16 PM
Davis ran more like a 4.52 at his pro day and a 4.60 at the combine. That's still fast for a guy his size though. If we can get Surtain on board I wouldn't mind Thomas Davis in the 1st at all. He'd be our WLB and he is a playmaker.

PhilFree:arrow:

Davis (6-0¾, 227) ran his 40s in 4.43 and 4.44. He had a 9-foot-10 long jump and 12 reps. Scouts worked him at safety and at linebacker, and the consensus is that he will remain at safety in the NFL.

Link (http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/individual_workouts#uga)

:thumb:

go bowe
04-12-2005, 04:23 PM
Link (http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/individual_workouts#uga)

:thumb:eh, those pesky facts again... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Coogs
04-12-2005, 04:26 PM
eh, those pesky facts again... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

You know, we could do a whole lot worse than drafting Davis and having Davis actually play safety.

philfree
04-12-2005, 04:36 PM
Link (http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/individual_workouts#uga)

:thumb:

I can't link my source becuase it's a premium site. I'll stand buy it none the less. NFL Draft Scout is the site I got those times from. It list combine and pro day numbers both as well as a bunch of other stuff. It's amazing at how many different times are postd on various draft sites for the same player. I really like Thomas Davis from what I saw of him and it wouldn't hurt my feelings at all if we draft him but I still doubt those 40 times.


PhilFree:arrow:

buddha
04-12-2005, 05:06 PM
Remember Larry Atkins?

Yeah, and I still have problems giving up those carbs!

At any rate, Biesel won't be another Bruschi for New England. He was a servicable special teams guy. I don't care what Dick says. No great loss there.

Kyle401
04-12-2005, 05:08 PM
I can't link my source becuase it's a premium site. I'll stand buy it none the less. NFL Draft Scout is the site I got those times from. It list combine and pro day numbers both as well as a bunch of other stuff. It's amazing at how many different times are postd on various draft sites for the same player. I really like Thomas Davis from waht I saw of him and it wouldn't hurt my feelings at all if we draft him but I still those 40 times.


PhilFree:arrow:
Yeah 40 times vary quite a bit from site to site, but I tend to trust the official NFL site more than the rest. The most interesting part of that quote to me, was that the consensus among the scouts at his pro day was that he would play S in the NFL. I would think that this opinion was based more on the positional drills he performed at LB and S, than his 40 time.

buddha
04-12-2005, 05:11 PM
I definately agree, if Siavii has progressed enough from last year. We could do a situational 3-4 scheme using Browning, Siavii, and Hicks on the Dline and Fox, Mitchell, Bell, and Blackstock at LBs. That would be sweet.

Allow me to disagree. Neither Browning, nor Hicks is an adequate DE for a 3-4 defense, or a 4-3 for that matter. You don't get better on defense by making poor DEs do more than they COULDN'T do in a 4-3 in prior years!

Three of the four LBs you mentioned haven't shown the ability to play at the NFL level yet.

What is sweet about that scenario? :hmmm:

Dayze
04-12-2005, 05:13 PM
....bringing in to 'entertain ' prospects...

Let the annual CP smokescreen begin.
:clap:

buddha
04-12-2005, 05:16 PM
[QUOTE=arc]:rolleyes: Yeah, we wouldn't want anyone like Reggie Tongue, Chad Johnson, T.J. Houshmanzadeh, or Nick Barnett on the Chiefs.

QUOTE]

Right on. The Beavers don't get the respect they deserve. They have sent some very good players into the league and he's right, I would love to have any of those players in KC.