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View Full Version : David Glass Needs to Sell Royals To Someone Who Wants to Win


petegz28
04-18-2005, 10:15 PM
Well let's see we managed to score our 3rd run in 3 games. We spent 11 million dollars less than last year which coincidentaly was the worst Royals team ever. Witht the exception of one fluke season the Royals are arguable the worst team in baseball and have been for sometime.

Mr. Wal-Mart has ruined this baseball team.

Cochise
04-18-2005, 10:24 PM
:rolleyes:

Simplex3
04-18-2005, 10:25 PM
Please. Nobody who wants to win would buy this team because of how bad baseball is right now.

Deberg_1990
04-18-2005, 10:54 PM
Well let's see we managed to score our 3rd run in 3 games. We spent 11 million dollars less than last year which coincidentaly was the worst Royals team ever. Witht the exception of one fluke season the Royals are arguable the worst team in baseball and have been for sometime.

Mr. Wal-Mart has ruined this baseball team.

Amen brother. We wont win a damn thing with Mr. Wal (my teams are as cheap as my store products) Mart.

Valiant
04-18-2005, 10:54 PM
Well let's see we managed to score our 3rd run in 3 games. We spent 11 million dollars less than last year which coincidentaly was the worst Royals team ever. Witht the exception of one fluke season the Royals are arguable the worst team in baseball and have been for sometime.

Mr. Wal-Mart has ruined this baseball team.


Why should we overspend on aging veterans just to lose the same amount of games... Heres a new thought, we play our rookies and younger players and get them better at the big league level... Do you want to triple everybody salaries just to say we have spent money...


I will type slowly for you....The only reason the payroll is low, is because of our younger players... Less experiance equals less money... Just think how pissed you will be when we trade sweeney in a couple of months... You can bitch about us having a 20 million dollar payroll...

Dave Lane
04-18-2005, 11:00 PM
This is what I have been waiting for and most other fans. Tear the team apart put in all the rookies let them play a year and see what you got. This is doing it the Minnesota Oakland and other small market way.

I'm not happy they keep losing but I have no comment on the season till its over. IF they improve and play well late then next year we blend in a few more good prospects and in 2-3 years you have a solid team.

Its the right way to do it and I hope they don't go stupid and spend more money of washed up idiots.

Dave

KevB
04-18-2005, 11:04 PM
This is what I have been waiting for and most other fans. Tear the team apart put in all the rookies let them play a year and see what you got. This is doing it the Minnesota Oakland and other small market way.

I'm not happy they keep losing but I have no comment on the season till its over. IF they improve and play well late then next year we blend in a few more good prospects and in 2-3 years you have a solid team.

Its the right way to do it and I hope they don't go stupid and spend more money of washed up idiots.

Dave

I would agree if we had any young offensive players that have promise. DeJesus, Gotay, and Berroa are nice complementary players. The jury is still out on Teahen, although he has a long way to go. Buck is miles away from being a productive offensive player. Who else? We don't have squat above A ball. Our most recent brilliant find is Emil Brown, who is 31 and suprisingly stinking up the joint.

keg in kc
04-18-2005, 11:04 PM
Yeah, let's sell the team now that they're finally doing the right thing.

beavis
04-18-2005, 11:04 PM
OMG GLASS RUNIED THE ROYLAZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111111111111111

Deberg_1990
04-18-2005, 11:06 PM
I wonder if Glass will ever charge Triple AAA prices to come out and see his Triple AAA ballclub???

Valiant
04-18-2005, 11:10 PM
This is what I have been waiting for and most other fans. Tear the team apart put in all the rookies let them play a year and see what you got. This is doing it the Minnesota Oakland and other small market way.

I'm not happy they keep losing but I have no comment on the season till its over. IF they improve and play well late then next year we blend in a few more good prospects and in 2-3 years you have a solid team.

Its the right way to do it and I hope they don't go stupid and spend more money of washed up idiots.

Dave

Most of our loses unfortunatly are because of pena... We are swinging at the first pitch in almost all the loses, you have to run up a pitch count... If the pitcher knows you are going to swing, he owns you...

Pena has no control over this team... We need a new coach, that can get the players to listen...Hell this past friday we made detroit pitch to us and guess what.... We came back and won.. Pena is the reason why we are losing....I say, fire his ass and use the pitching coach as interm(sp?)


But they will pull it around...

tk13
04-18-2005, 11:15 PM
I would agree if we had any young offensive players that have promise. DeJesus, Gotay, and Berroa are nice complementary players. The jury is still out on Teahen, although he has a long way to go. Buck is miles away from being a productive offensive player. Who else? We don't have squat above A ball. Our most recent brilliant find is Emil Brown, who is 31 and suprisingly stinking up the joint.
I would really, really like to see us make a run at Wily Mo Pena or one of the Reds extra OF's. Other than that, you'd have to look down in the system at Justin Huber at 1B and Billy Butler, who'll probably be moved to the OF I imagine. Both of those guys can swing it.

Deberg_1990
04-18-2005, 11:20 PM
Other than that, you'd have to look down in the system at Justin Huber at 1B and Billy Butler, who'll probably be moved to the OF I imagine. Both of those guys can swing it.

I hope your right, otherwise we are just wasting out time with this organization. Nothing seems to go right for this franchise. One year they go with youth, the next year they go for veteran help and nothing ever seems to pan out. The Red Sox had nothing on this cursed team.

keg in kc
04-18-2005, 11:29 PM
One year they go with youth, the next year they go for veteran help and nothing ever seems to pan out.The problem before now has been than they say they're going with youth, and then they don't follow through. This is really the first time they've done it, at least recently.

And it's gonna suck some of the time. Maybe a lot of the time. Like I said before the season, though, how they finish is what's going to matter, not how they start. The rotation and bullpen has talent, but it will take some time for them to click (we could be wicked there by the end of the year and start of next year). But they've got to be aggressive around the trading deadline, swapping any and all veterans they can for bats. Sweeney, Anderson, anybody they can deal they need to deal.

And most importantly, they've got to follow through with it. No changing the course midstream and plugging in over-the-hill guys they got on the cheap like in the past in the hopes they can eek out a few extra (meaningless) wins. We're more playing to develop than playing to win right now (although you always play to win), that's where we're at. What we're suffering through right now is what will hopefully help us win in the 2006-2007 range.

tk13
04-18-2005, 11:32 PM
Do you think Butler can be more than a DH? I love his bat either way but I heard he had 4 errors at 3rd in a game this weekend.

Just wanting your opinion on him position wise.
All I've seen of him is one AB he had against the Astros on the last day of preseason, and he struck out. I haven't heard a whole lot of negatives about him though, he certainly appears to be a very good natural hitter. He was pretty much the only player drafted last year to make Baseball America's weekly "Top 20 Hot Prospect" list for most of the season. I don't think we'll keep him at 3B though, not with Teahen there. He might end up being a DH. I know I've heard some talk of him being moved to the OF, we'll see. If he keeps hitting, he'll find a place somewhere.

SCTrojan
04-18-2005, 11:43 PM
I think my problem with the "we're developing the young players" mantra, as it relates to the position players, is that I see a whole lot of Matt Stairs, Terrence Long, Emil Brown and Tony Graffanino playing. If you're developing youth, then you have to play Pickering or whoever the latest flavor of the month is.

I have no problem with mixing in experience with the youth - but I think we could probably sign some higher-quality experienced players. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe no one wants to come to KC, but I think the $11 mill or whatever it is that we're not spending this year could make this place a whole lot more attractive.

We have no quality bats right now other than Sweeney. I would bet he's getting nothing to hit and teams are just going straight to whoever is hitting fourth.

FWIW, I think they're on the right track with the pitchers. But you can't expect/depend on them to throw lights out every time to get you wins.

Dave Lane
04-18-2005, 11:48 PM
Most of our loses unfortunatly are because of pena... We are swinging at the first pitch in almost all the loses, you have to run up a pitch count... If the pitcher knows you are going to swing, he owns you...

Pena has no control over this team... We need a new coach, that can get the players to listen...Hell this past friday we made detroit pitch to us and guess what.... We came back and won.. Pena is the reason why we are losing....I say, fire his ass and use the pitching coach as interm(sp?)


But they will pull it around...

Bingo

Dave

keg in kc
04-18-2005, 11:56 PM
I think my problem with the "we're developing the young players" mantra, as it relates to the position players, is that I see a whole lot of Matt Stairs, Terrence Long, Emil Brown and Tony Graffanino playing. If you're developing youth, then you have to play Pickering or whoever the latest flavor of the month is. Pickering's 28 or 29, himself. He wallowed in the minors for a looong time. I've got no problem with trying a guy like him or Long, hoping you'll have a repeat of Raul Ibanez, but I'd agree we're seeing a lot of the older guys and sometimes I wonder why. I don't mind seeing that if they're playing well. I think Long, for instance, needs to be in the lineup, he's playing well on the field and at the plate and we really don't have young quality outfielders, but Graffanino, for instance, has played in as many games as Gotay. Why are we resting Gotay so much? And why is Marrero playing so much? Stairs is in as a left handed power bat, so that doesn't surprise me.

Not going to worry about it now, we're only a dozen or so games into the season, I just hope it's not a trend that will continue all year.

CoMoChief
04-19-2005, 12:02 AM
Why should we overspend on aging veterans just to lose the same amount of games... Heres a new thought, we play our rookies and younger players and get them better at the big league level... Do you want to triple everybody salaries just to say we have spent money...


I will type slowly for you....The only reason the payroll is low, is because of our younger players... Less experiance equals less money... Just think how pissed you will be when we trade sweeney in a couple of months... You can bitch about us having a 20 million dollar payroll...

Are you kidding me?!?!?! Thats what we always do, we rebulid i guess youd call it this year and then when they get good we dont want to pay them and we trade them away for more rookie prosepcts. Thats what we did to Damon, Beltran, and Dye. Were never gonna be good again unless we have a fan of baseball as an owner instead of a tight ass businessman. When Paul Byrd got good we traded him away to Atlanta. This will be by far the WORST season for the Royals in the teams history.

Sure-Oz
04-19-2005, 12:05 AM
I would really, really like to see us make a run at Wily Mo Pena or one of the Reds extra OF's. Other than that, you'd have to look down in the system at Justin Huber at 1B and Billy Butler, who'll probably be moved to the OF I imagine. Both of those guys can swing it.
Pena is a beast, I would love to get him on our roster, but it likely wont happen, we'll settle for more scrubs, like another Marrero to bat cleanup.

CoMoChief
04-19-2005, 12:05 AM
I bet the Royals would lose a 7 game series to one of the best minor league AAA teams.

Demonpenz
04-19-2005, 12:06 AM
it's topic like these i wish we had a "beating a dead horse" smiley face

CoMoChief
04-19-2005, 12:09 AM
Im so sick n tired of Glass and Biard putting together a team of no namers trying to reduce the cost of the team as much as possible to make the most profit to put in his god damn pocket. Get some players, spend some cash, lets win the AL central, THE WEAKEST DIVISION IN MLB!!!

Valiant
04-19-2005, 12:15 AM
Are you kidding me?!?!?! Thats what we always do, we rebulid i guess youd call it this year and then when they get good we dont want to pay them and we trade them away for more rookie prosepcts. Thats what we did to Damon, Beltran, and Dye. Were never gonna be good again unless we have a fan of baseball as an owner instead of a tight ass businessman. When Paul Byrd got good we traded him away to Atlanta. This will be by far the WORST season for the Royals in the teams history.



No, last year we tried to add FA to our youth and it failed miserably.. This year they are all going youth... We had damon, beltran and dye what five six years ago... that is not year in year out... And even then we did not go with a all youth movement...


We have the majority of this team under contract till 2008 and beyond.. If we cannot pull it around by then.. Yes we trade them...Any competent owner would do it...

Its funny the royals pay FA tons of money to play, and people bitch we are not giving our drafted players a chance and follow other small market teams to success(A's,twins)... We finally follow the other small markets and people bitch we are not spending millions on FA....

We are not NY's, La's or boston we do not have 150 million to spend...

tk13
04-19-2005, 12:16 AM
Are you kidding me?!?!?! Thats what we always do, we rebulid i guess youd call it this year and then when they get good we dont want to pay them and we trade them away for more rookie prosepcts. Thats what we did to Damon, Beltran, and Dye. Were never gonna be good again unless we have a fan of baseball as an owner instead of a tight ass businessman. When Paul Byrd got good we traded him away to Atlanta. This will be by far the WORST season for the Royals in the teams history.
For the record, we let Byrd walk as a free agent... he turned down our contract offers. He really hasn't been as good since either.

keg in kc
04-19-2005, 12:18 AM
For the record, we let Byrd walk as a free agent... he turned down our contract offers. He really hasn't been as good since either.We tried to re-sign him this year, too, but the Angels doubled our offer. Hence Jose Lima.

Valiant
04-19-2005, 12:18 AM
Im so sick n tired of Glass and Biard putting together a team of no namers trying to reduce the cost of the team as much as possible to make the most profit to put in his god damn pocket. Get some players, spend some cash, lets win the AL central, THE WEAKEST DIVISION IN MLB!!!


I'm sorry your are clueless.... We have a small payroll do to players having rookie-2 years in experiance... You want more Juan Gones on our team.... Lets just waste money....

Glass had the largest payroll ever in royals history last year... What other insight to you have...

Demonpenz
04-19-2005, 12:18 AM
i think we got a draft pick out of the byrd situation

Valiant
04-19-2005, 12:19 AM
For the record, we let Byrd walk as a free agent... he turned down our contract offers. He really hasn't been as good since either.



That was a blessing in disquise he has been shit since he left us...

Logical
04-19-2005, 12:27 AM
I hate to tell you this, but the Royals were horrible before David Glass bought them. He may have not done anything to make them better but he did not make them bad. If you really like MLB in KC you should be happy anyone was willing to buy into the losing proposition that is MLB in a city like KC.

tk13
04-19-2005, 01:14 AM
And just for the record, I don't know what this means to anybody, but Forbes did their 2004 team values finally last week or so, and they said the Royals were the 27th most valuable team in baseball. The total value of the franchise was like $187 million dollars. As far as the bottom line, according to Forbes study (same group we use to determine that Lamar made $24 mil), last year the Royals made $3 million in profit. I guess that is $3 million before taxes. How much would get taken out in taxes, I honestly have no idea, but there you go...

Logical
04-19-2005, 01:20 AM
And just for the record, I don't know what this means to anybody, but Forbes did their 2004 team values finally last week or so, and they said the Royals were the 27th most valuable team in baseball. The total value of the franchise was like $187 million dollars. As far as the bottom line, according to Forbes study (same group we use to determine that Lamar made $24 mil), last year the Royals made $3 million in profit. I guess that is $3 million before taxes. How much would get taken out in taxes, I honestly have no idea, but there you go...

Lets just put it this way, Glass would have made a hell of a lot more money by simply opening one more Walmart. Dude is not in it for the money, otherwise he would not be in it at all.

Ninjaman
04-19-2005, 01:40 AM
What would happen if David Glass opened a Walmart in Royals Stadium ?

Increased attendance ?

petegz28
04-19-2005, 07:14 AM
I hate to tell you this, but the Royals were horrible before David Glass bought them. He may have not done anything to make them better but he did not make them bad. If you really like MLB in KC you should be happy anyone was willing to buy into the losing proposition that is MLB in a city like KC.


Well we did not have an owner then. And did better than we have since Glass took over.

petegz28
04-19-2005, 07:18 AM
And just for the record, I don't know what this means to anybody, but Forbes did their 2004 team values finally last week or so, and they said the Royals were the 27th most valuable team in baseball. The total value of the franchise was like $187 million dollars. As far as the bottom line, according to Forbes study (same group we use to determine that Lamar made $24 mil), last year the Royals made $3 million in profit. I guess that is $3 million before taxes. How much would get taken out in taxes, I honestly have no idea, but there you go...


With Revenue Sharing, The Central Fund and I believe Season Tickets, the Roylas made $74 million before one non-season ticket, hot dog, beer, or parking fee was paid.

$3 million isn't worth it from an ownership standpoint. How much would we had made last year do you think if we actually put some players on the field and garnered better attendance, concessions, merchandise sales, etc., etc.?

the Talking Can
04-19-2005, 07:32 AM
The next time the Royals are sold it won't be to someone in KC.

Valiant
04-19-2005, 07:55 AM
How much would we had made last year do you think if we actually put some players on the field and garnered better attendance, concessions, merchandise sales, etc., etc.?



Thats the problem you all are not understanding... Glass raised the payroll to the highest ever last year to win it... we brought in a couple FA that flopped... You all act like we didnt try... We failed last year at it and lost Beltran because of it...IF we would have won the division we had a better chance to retain him... We lost 104 games by blowing our money on a power hitting outfielder and a streaky catcher, oh and our ace pitcher was having baby problems with the wife...


this is our first youth movement with a owner... The players will get better by being out there... And hopefully we get a new coach next year that knows what he is doing..

1adam1238
04-19-2005, 08:00 AM
The problem with playing younger players and them getting better is that when they get better they leave for more money. So this situation doesn't work either.

ChiTown
04-19-2005, 08:23 AM
We tried to re-sign him this year, too, but the Angels doubled our offer. Hence Jose Lima.

Starting pitching would be a luxury for this team, and quite frankly, our future looks bright from a pitching standpoint. Our problem right now is an absolute lack of power, combined with no speed, an an inability to manufacture runs.

Again, I ask, what was the line of thinking when Baird put this merry band of misfits together? I'm pretty sure I understand the answer to that already...........

petegz28
04-19-2005, 08:55 AM
Thats the problem you all are not understanding... Glass raised the payroll to the highest ever last year to win it... we brought in a couple FA that flopped... You all act like we didnt try... We failed last year at it and lost Beltran because of it...IF we would have won the division we had a better chance to retain him... We lost 104 games by blowing our money on a power hitting outfielder and a streaky catcher, oh and our ace pitcher was having baby problems with the wife...


this is our first youth movement with a owner... The players will get better by being out there... And hopefully we get a new coach next year that knows what he is doing..


I totaly disagree. We signed has beens. Didn't even try to keep Rondell White and setteled for Juan somebody and Benito somebody. So using your logic, Baird flopped and Glass keeps him around. But I don't buy your argument anyway becuase it takes more than spending money for 1 season.

beavis
04-19-2005, 09:17 AM
Lets just put it this way, Glass would have made a hell of a lot more money by simply opening one more Walmart. Dude is not in it for the money, otherwise he would not be in it at all.
Yep. If he were in it for the money, they'd be the DC Royals right now.

beavis
04-19-2005, 09:18 AM
I totaly disagree. We signed has beens. Didn't even try to keep Rondell White and setteled for Juan somebody and Benito somebody. So using your logic, Baird flopped and Glass keeps him around. But I don't buy your argument anyway becuase it takes more than spending money for 1 season.
Hey, I got an idea. How about you go to work today, but instead of them paying you, you have to pay them. That's a great idea.*

*This is essentially what you are asking Glass to do.

petegz28
04-19-2005, 09:24 AM
Hey, I got an idea. How about you go to work today, but instead of them paying you, you have to pay them. That's a great idea.*

*This is essentially what you are asking Glass to do.

That is totally ignorant. I am asking Glass to put a decent team on the field. And most businesses traditionally do not show a profit for almost 5 years. So asking him to take a loss in the short term while he builds up the team is in every aspect of business more than reasonable. And as I said, if you pay up front for some good personel and win some games people will buy tickets and spend money. But no one is going to go watch a loser. Look at the attendance we had the one fluke year! Now imagine if we could repeat that for a few years in a row. Mr. Wal-Mart might actually make some decent coin.

Bottom line ...you get what you pay for. Now go do your monkey boy and be happy.

eazyb81
04-19-2005, 09:27 AM
Yep. If he were in it for the money, they'd be the DC Royals right now.

Huh? The Royals have a signed lease with Jackson County for at least a few more years (I don't remember the exact number). Glass couldn't move the team even if he wanted to right now. Honestly, I don't think anyone in KC would even care if he did, the product on the field is just embarrassing.

penguinz
04-19-2005, 09:38 AM
Why are people so dense? Baseball is not a normal Business. Just because you spend money to improve your product it does not mean you will bring in the $ to compensate for the investment $'s.

petegz28
04-19-2005, 09:54 AM
Why are people so dense? Baseball is not a normal Business. Just because you spend money to improve your product it does not mean you will bring in the $ to compensate for the investment $'s.


Yeah well spending less money seems to be so productive huh? Baseball is very much a business like it or not.

You may not do better spending more money but your chances will improve ..You will however almost guarantee a worse performance spending less.

beavis
04-19-2005, 10:02 AM
That is totally ignorant. I am asking Glass to put a decent team on the field. And most businesses traditionally do not show a profit for almost 5 years. So asking him to take a loss in the short term while he builds up the team is in every aspect of business more than reasonable. And as I said, if you pay up front for some good personel and win some games people will buy tickets and spend money. But no one is going to go watch a loser. Look at the attendance we had the one fluke year! Now imagine if we could repeat that for a few years in a row. Mr. Wal-Mart might actually make some decent coin.

Bottom line ...you get what you pay for. Now go do your monkey boy and be happy.
You work at McDonalds, don't you?

beavis
04-19-2005, 10:03 AM
Huh? The Royals have a signed lease with Jackson County for at least a few more years (I don't remember the exact number). Glass couldn't move the team even if he wanted to right now. Honestly, I don't think anyone in KC would even care if he did, the product on the field is just embarrassing.
Leases can be broken, but my point was that he's doing us a favor by weathering the storm until things get better. It just kind of upsets me when people slam the dude, when all he is doing is helping us out.

And I wholeheartedly disagree. There are a lot of people that would be very upset if the Royals left town. Quite a few on this board.

petegz28
04-19-2005, 10:04 AM
You work at McDonalds, don't you?


AWWW no need to get upset there Professor. :deevee:

petegz28
04-19-2005, 10:06 AM
Leases can be broken, but my point was that he's doing us a favor by weathering the storm until things get better. It just kind of upsets me when people slam the dude, when all he is doing is helping us out.

And I wholeheartedly disagree. There are a lot of people that would be very upset if the Royals left town. Quite a few on this board.


No one is advocating them leaving. Everyone is advocating putting a decent team on the field. Funny that Oakland and Minnesota cna do it year in and out pretty much but yet we seem to get worse and worse.

But I know, he is helping us. Helping us get worse.

phisherman
04-19-2005, 10:08 AM
beavis, just cuz petegz28 is smarter than you are, don't get your panties in a wad!

:LOL:

bp

KevB
04-19-2005, 10:22 AM
For those saying, "we're finally going with the full fledge youth movement".....what team are you watching, and exactly which young offensive player do you see excites you?

I have hope for our pitching staff. Offensively, we're a black hole and there's not one player on the horizon I'm excited about. Butler is two years away, Huber could be a major league average first baseman at best, Maier seems to have flamed out.....

As to spending more money.....I don't mind that they aren't spending money if they use the money they do spend wisely. But Marerro and Long for roughly 3 mil a piece? While you're developing the young players, you could at least sign a couple of vets for 4M that may entice me to go to the ballpark. I took the family out on Saturday, and I don't see myself paying another dime to watch that crap. Not to mention the players they do put on the field already look like they're playing out the string....and it's fricken' April.

ChiTown
04-19-2005, 10:27 AM
Leases can be broken, but my point was that he's doing us a favor by weathering the storm until things get better. It just kind of upsets me when people slam the dude, when all he is doing is helping us out.

And I wholeheartedly disagree. There are a lot of people that would be very upset if the Royals left town. Quite a few on this board.

Helping us out?

Please explain. I must be one of those McDonalds employees you were alluding to earlier..............

If keeping a team in KC means putting triple A talent on the field, then it might be best to sell the team. Now, before you go attacking my fandom, I'd like you to know a few things first:

1. I was a season ticket holder to the Royals with my family from the time they started the Franchise until the early 90's, when most of my family moved out of town.

2. You aren't going to find much of a bigger Royals fan than me - debatable for sure, but I've followed them religiously since they got to KC.

3. I'm not a fair-weathered fan, but I don't accept losing with the same shoulder shrugging that goes on inside of this forum. I'm sickened by our Management Team's blatant acceptance of our "small market fate". Giving up is not an option

Therefore, if their solution is to spend wisely, develop talent and put a good management team in place - I'm completely on board. If their solution is to mindlessly place together young players and no talent vet's that have no power, no speed, and marginal bats; combined with lackluster coaching and less than stellar managers and general mangers - then get the F out of town or sell the club to someone else who can get it done.

That is just my honest opinion, like it or not.

SCTrojan
04-19-2005, 10:35 AM
For those saying, "we're finally going with the full fledge youth movement".....what team are you watching, and exactly which young offensive player do you see excites you?

I have hope for our pitching staff. Offensively, we're a black hole and there's not one player on the horizon I'm excited about. Butler is two years away, Huber could be a major league average first baseman at best, Maier seems to have flamed out.....

As to spending more money.....I don't mind that they aren't spending money if they use the money they do spend wisely. But Marerro and Long for roughly 3 mil a piece? While you're developing the young players, you could at least sign a couple of vets for 4M that may entice me to go to the ballpark. I took the family out on Saturday, and I don't see myself paying another dime to watch that crap. Not to mention the players they do put on the field already look like they're playing out the string....and it's fricken' April.

Agree with you Kev. They did try the FA thing last year, but their big efforts involved Benito Santiago at 39 and Juan Gone with an incentive-laden contract.

The 11 mill difference comes mostly from not having to pay Beltran. I'm sure there were a couple of solid players available this year at 5-6 mil apiece. Hell, Joe Randa was available for 2.1 mil, but Baird didn't pull that trigger because he didn't want some sort of obstacle to Teahen getting to the majors.

Bottom line is that developing young players and playing decent baseball are not mutually exclusive goals. If Marrero and Long pan out, fine, I'll have been proven wrong. But surely there were better players available for just a little bit more money. Players who could help us score more than a run a game.

Coogs
04-19-2005, 10:36 AM
Not to mention the players they do put on the field already look like they're playing out the string....and it's fricken' April.

I watched the local sports news a couple of nights ago. Long was being interviewed, and made the comment that it already feels like September.
Kind of gives you the warm fuzzies doesn't it? :shake:

KevB
04-19-2005, 10:41 AM
Helping us out?

Please explain. I must be one of those McDonalds employees you were alluding to earlier..............

If keeping a team in KC means putting triple A talent on the field, then it might be best to sell the team. Now, before you go attacking my fandom, I'd like you to know a few things first:

1. I was a season ticket holder to the Royals with my family from the time they started the Franchise until the early 90's, when most of my family moved out of town.

2. You aren't going to find much of a bigger Royals fan than me - debatable for sure, but I've followed them religiously since they got to KC.

3. I'm not a fair-weathered fan, but I don't accept losing with the same shoulder shrugging that goes on inside of this forum. I'm sickened by our Management Team's blatant acceptance of our "small market fate". Giving up is not an option

Therefore, if their solution is to spend wisely, develop talent and put a good management team in place - I'm completely on board. If their solution is to mindlessly place together young players and no talent vet's that have no power, no speed, and marginal bats; combined with lackluster coaching and less than stellar managers and general mangers - then get the F out of town or sell the club to someone else who can get it done.

That is just my honest opinion, like it or not.

Here, here. It starts at the top when an organization is as bad as KC is right now. The major league team is arguably the worst in baseball, and the minor league system is bereft of talent (Baseball America has us in the bottom five I believe). That starts with Glass, and carries down to Allard. I really like Baird....he's a very standup guy and I like what he has to say about the type of player he looks for (although the talk the last several years about pitchers inducing contact instead of striking batters out is disturbing). Having said that, Baird's had time to get the minor league system turned around, and it's not happening. At some point, you have to s**t or get off the pot.

KevB
04-19-2005, 10:44 AM
But surely there were better players available for just a little bit more money. Players who could help us score more than a run a game.

And players that would have signed for 1 or 2 years, not long-term, which is important to this front office. One example of a player we could made a run at, albeit with some baggage, was Jose Guillen. He has more home runs in DC than our entire team, it seems.

beavis
04-19-2005, 10:46 AM
beavis, just cuz petegz28 is smarter than you are, don't get your panties in a wad!

:LOL:

bp
Yes, he has obviously bested me with his GLASS NEEDS TO SPEND MONEY!!!!!!!!!! arguement.

SCTrojan
04-19-2005, 10:49 AM
Guillen might have provided some protection for Sweeney at the cleanup spot. Went to the ball game on Sunday and couldn't believe Emil Brown at cleanup.

I'll root for them no matter what, but they have looked just awful during this homestand. Like I said in an earlier post, I'm hoping it's just a slump. I fear that it might not be.

beavis
04-19-2005, 10:49 AM
Helping us out?

Please explain. I must be one of those McDonalds employees you were alluding to earlier..............

If keeping a team in KC means putting triple A talent on the field, then it might be best to sell the team. Now, before you go attacking my fandom, I'd like you to know a few things first:

1. I was a season ticket holder to the Royals with my family from the time they started the Franchise until the early 90's, when most of my family moved out of town.

2. You aren't going to find much of a bigger Royals fan than me - debatable for sure, but I've followed them religiously since they got to KC.

3. I'm not a fair-weathered fan, but I don't accept losing with the same shoulder shrugging that goes on inside of this forum. I'm sickened by our Management Team's blatant acceptance of our "small market fate". Giving up is not an option

Therefore, if their solution is to spend wisely, develop talent and put a good management team in place - I'm completely on board. If their solution is to mindlessly place together young players and no talent vet's that have no power, no speed, and marginal bats; combined with lackluster coaching and less than stellar managers and general mangers - then get the F out of town or sell the club to someone else who can get it done.

That is just my honest opinion, like it or not.
By no means am I justifying an inferior team being put on the field. But the best we could ever hope to do is what the A's or Twins have done, and even then, that's just winning a weak division. What makes me angry are these morons that think Glass should go out and spend half of his net worth on the chance that a team might be competitive, and no chance of ever being profitable. The notion that he's raking millions off the backs of KC fans is ludicrous. If you want to find that, just look across the parking lot.

phisherman
04-19-2005, 10:50 AM
Yes, he has obviously bested me with his GLASS NEEDS TO SPEND MONEY!!!!!!!!!! arguement.
yes, yes he has...

it makes more sense to me than someone squarely talking out of their ass!

:harumph:

:deevee:

bp

petegz28
04-19-2005, 10:54 AM
By no means am I justifying an inferior team being put on the field. But the best we could ever hope to do is what the A's or Twins have done, and even then, that's just winning a weak division. What makes me angry are these morons that think Glass should go out and spend half of his net worth on the chance that a team might be competitive, and no chance of ever being profitable. The notion that he's raking millions off the backs of KC fans is ludicrous. If you want to find that, just look across the parking lot.


You are smoking crack! The Chiefs are at least competitive. How many games did we lose by 1 score last year? When will you understand that you get what you pay for?

We paid for crap on defense with the Chiefs and got just that. So why don't YOU look across the parking lot and learn something?

Coogs
04-19-2005, 10:55 AM
But the best we could ever hope to do is what the A's or Twins have done, and even then, that's just winning a weak division.

You know, I would be happy with that.

ChiTown
04-19-2005, 11:01 AM
You know, I would be happy with that.

Me too.

Sincerely,

The Florida Marlins;)

Dr. Van Halen
04-19-2005, 11:29 AM
By no means am I justifying an inferior team being put on the field. But the best we could ever hope to do is what the A's or Twins have done, and even then, that's just winning a weak division. What makes me angry are these morons that think Glass should go out and spend half of his net worth on the chance that a team might be competitive, and no chance of ever being profitable. The notion that he's raking millions off the backs of KC fans is ludicrous. If you want to find that, just look across the parking lot.

Why is it that you baseball people are always so quick to attack the Chiefs when the heat gets turned up?

I think what makes me angry are those morons who that think Glass is doing just fine when he decides to not even make the team competitive every year.

If a team in this market is unable to turn a profit and be competitive in the MLB, then it should fold. It is that simple.

beavis
04-19-2005, 11:35 AM
You are smoking crack! The Chiefs are at least competitive. How many games did we lose by 1 score last year? When will you understand that you get what you pay for?

We paid for crap on defense with the Chiefs and got just that. So why don't YOU look across the parking lot and learn something?
I guess I have higher standards than 0 playoff wins in 11 years. I don't get this arguement that the Chiefs are all that competitive. I mean, most NFL games are decided by 1 score or less.

So did we get what we paid for last year? 7-9 is worth another $40 million profit for Lamar, while Glass probably almost broke even? Thanks for the course in economics professor.

beavis
04-19-2005, 11:36 AM
yes, yes he has...

it makes more sense to me than someone squarely talking out of their ass!

:harumph:

:deevee:

bp
Thanks for your contribution to the conversation. :rolleyes:

beavis
04-19-2005, 11:43 AM
Me too.

Sincerely,

The Florida Marlins;)
An abberition. Even so, their payroll was about $10 million more (not that I am making excuses) than the Royals that year. By the way, what'd they do last year? They sure held that team together didn't they. Point out to me another small market team that's gotten that far.

You people are mistaking me for someone who is defending what the Royals have done in recent years. I think Baird has botched a lot of things. I'm about a week away from officially jumping off the Pena bandwagon. And yeah, I kind of think that a lot of the people in charge at the K come from the Vermeil school of management (unable to make tough decisions and get rid of deadweight). But I'm a lot more forgiving of them considering they are going into the fight with one hand tied behind their backs.

petegz28
04-19-2005, 11:53 AM
I guess I have higher standards than 0 playoff wins in 11 years. I don't get this arguement that the Chiefs are all that competitive. I mean, most NFL games are decided by 1 score or less.

So did we get what we paid for last year? 7-9 is worth another $40 million profit for Lamar, while Glass probably almost broke even? Thanks for the course in economics professor.


Again we paid for a crap defense and got just that. but we also have an offense that keeps us in every game. You can't say that about the Royals. Someday you will learn YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.

ChiTown
04-19-2005, 11:58 AM
An abberition. Even so, their payroll was about $10 million more (not that I am making excuses) than the Royals that year. By the way, what'd they do last year? They sure held that team together didn't they. Point out to me another small market team that's gotten that far.

You people are mistaking me for someone who is defending what the Royals have done in recent years. I think Baird has botched a lot of things. I'm about a week away from officially jumping off the Pena bandwagon. And yeah, I kind of think that a lot of the people in charge at the K come from the Vermeil school of management (unable to make tough decisions and get rid of deadweight). But I'm a lot more forgiving of them considering they are going into the fight with one hand tied behind their backs.

Be competitive, be in the game, be a factor, be alive after May 15th..........I'm not asking for the Moon, but I am asking that we witness some life at the K. For the past couple of years (including this one), and before 2003 (that was an abberation), we've been a hapless organization. Throwing Bennie Santiago and Juan Gone on your team doesn't mean your trying. That, IMO, means you are grasping at straws. Likewise, the additions of Terrence Long, Eli Marrero and Chris Truby don't really spell contender. It says, we've given up on 2005.

I can't imagine the thought process that went into that whole dynamic of the 2003-04 offseason. Baird to Pena: "By gawd, we're only two malcontents from taking the Central crown....." Pena to Baird: "Si, Meester Baird, Si!"

Boyceofsummer
04-19-2005, 12:06 PM
I can't imagine the thought process that went into that whole dynamic of the 2003-04 offseason. Baird to Pena: "By gawd, we're only two malcontents from taking the Central crown....." Pena to Baird: "Si, Meester Baird, Si!"

How may quality items are available at WAL-MART? Like the Royals, not very many.

SCTrojan
04-19-2005, 01:24 PM
We actually just scored two runs in an inning. Miracles never cease.

Ninjaman
04-19-2005, 02:34 PM
Lubanski and Billy Butler seem to be doing well in the minors and so is pitcher Bourgous Ambroux(spelling,check Double A league).

Whats killed the Royals is total s*** from their picks for pitching. They have NO power pitchers that can throw strikes. Pathetic.

Dave Lane
04-19-2005, 03:44 PM
Why are people so dense? Baseball is not a normal Business. Just because you spend money to improve your product it does not mean you will bring in the $ to compensate for the investment $'s.

I agree, yes its been what 2 weeks now into the youth movement. By all means lets scrap that and bring in some major retreads yeah that will work.

Dave

beavis
04-19-2005, 04:10 PM
Whats killed the Royals is total s*** from their picks for pitching. They have NO power pitchers that can throw strikes. Pathetic.
I sometimes wonder if the people who constantly bitch about the Royals have even watched a game this year. Ever hear of a kid named Greinke? Hernandez? Bautista?

Pitching is the only thing that has won us games this year.

KevB
04-19-2005, 04:21 PM
I sometimes wonder if the people who constantly bitch about the Royals have even watched a game this year. Ever hear of a kid named Greinke? Hernandez? Bautista?

Pitching is the only thing that has won us games this year.

2 things:

1) Batista wasn't drafted, he was acquired in trade.

2) While we were busy selecting pitchers galore, in some cases taking pitchers with our first several picks of the draft, we were NOT selecting impact bats. Now, if more than a couple of pitchers had panned out and become useful at the major league level or in trade for a bat, great. But they haven't. So we hit on 5-10 percent on the pitchers selected very high in the draft, and didn't get any impact offensive players to speak of.

beavis
04-19-2005, 04:32 PM
2 things:

1) Batista wasn't drafted, he was acquired in trade.

2) While we were busy selecting pitchers galore, in some cases taking pitchers with our first several picks of the draft, we were NOT selecting impact bats. Now, if more than a couple of pitchers had panned out and become useful at the major league level or in trade for a bat, great. But they haven't. So we hit on 5-10 percent on the pitchers selected very high in the draft, and didn't get any impact offensive players to speak of.
What do you think the percentage is for other teams in the league? The young bats are there, they just aren't ready yet.

Look at all the homegrown talent the Red Sox and Yankees have.... oh, wait second...

tk13
04-19-2005, 04:44 PM
I think our last few drafts have been much better. And I'm excited to see what we do this year, since we have the #2 pick. I think Baird and the scouts have done a lot better job, and now we've added the guy who helped build the Angels farm system to the front office. We've got some decent baseball minds I think. This is still early in the process, you just can't flip a switch and become the Twins. All of this frustration doesn't surprise me though, I can understand where it comes from.

ChiTown
04-19-2005, 05:04 PM
I think our last few drafts have been much better. And I'm excited to see what we do this year, since we have the #2 pick. I think Baird and the scouts have done a lot better job, and now we've added the guy who helped build the Angels farm system to the front office. We've got some decent baseball minds I think. This is still early in the process, you just can't flip a switch and become the Twins. All of this frustration doesn't surprise me though, I can understand where it comes from.

If this is flipping a switch, I want a new electrician;)

I see where you are coming from, but the Royals have been a crappy organization for a while. That includes the likes of Herk Robinson, Muzzy Jackson and Allard Baird. To not see how badly they've fallen alseep at the wheel with their offense is like ignoring the 8000# elephant in your living room........

Valiant
04-19-2005, 05:05 PM
This years problems are PENA'S fault... ALmost all of the games we have lost and scored 1 run is because we are swinging at the first pitches... Hell even Sweeney is doing it... This team is not well coached.... IF pena cannot get this thru, then he needs to go.... Our recent drafting has been average...

This past fridays game with Lima pitching... All of our players were building the count up... This is how you beat pitchers....

LAst night, The pitcher even said they were getting themselves out by swinging at every damn first pitch...Teams have this on their notes... We are a bad coached team...I will hold judgement until the end of next year to see how glass is doing.. but he has only had the team two years now maybe three.... This is not football there is not parody, it takes years to turnaround teams...

Valiant
04-19-2005, 05:09 PM
If this is flipping a switch, I want a new electrician;)

I see where you are coming from, but the Royals have been a crappy organization for a while. That includes the likes of Herk Robinson, Muzzy Jackson and Allard Baird. To not see how badly they've fallen alseep at the wheel with their offense is like ignoring the 8000# elephant in your living room........


We were not great, but this team just got the horrific label in 1997....

ChiTown
04-19-2005, 05:12 PM
This years problems are PENA'S fault... ALmost all of the games we have lost and scored 1 run is because we are swinging at the first pitches... Hell even Sweeney is doing it... This team is not well coached.... IF pena cannot get this thru, then he needs to go.... Our recent drafting has been average...

This past fridays game with Lima pitching... All of our players were building the count up... This is how you beat pitchers....

LAst night, The pitcher even said they were getting themselves out by swinging at every damn first pitch...Teams have this on their notes... We are a bad coached team...I will hold judgement until the end of next year to see how glass is doing.. but he has only had the team two years now maybe three.... This is not football there is not parody, it takes years to turnaround teams...

Glass has had this team since May of 2000 .................

Valiant
04-19-2005, 05:20 PM
Glass has had this team since May of 2000 .................



Didnt think he owned it till 2002...

Looks like it was june of 2000 my bad....

KevB
04-19-2005, 05:26 PM
What do you think the percentage is for other teams in the league? The young bats are there, they just aren't ready yet.

Look at all the homegrown talent the Red Sox and Yankees have.... oh, wait second...

Jeter, Posada, Soriano before he was traded, and Bernie were all homegrown. The remaining good players in the minors were all traded to get veterans.

You can't compare us to the Yankees and Red Sox anyway. That's a seperate argument that any Royal fan understands. Put us with the Twins, A's, Reds, etc. Compare our drafts and farm systems to those teams and see how we look.