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crossbow
04-20-2005, 03:24 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050420/ap_en_ot/fonda_spitter

TIM CURRAN, Associated Press Writer

KANSAS CITY, Mo. - A man spit tobacco juice into the face of actress Jane Fonda after waiting in line to have her sign her new book, police said.

The man ran off but was quickly caught by police Tuesday night and charged with disorderly conduct.


Fonda has been on tour and doing interviews to promote her just-published memoir, "My Life So Far." The thrice-married, two-time Academy Award winner covers a wide array of topics, including her 1972 visit to Hanoi to protest the Vietnam War, during which she was photographed on a North Vietnamese anti-aircraft gun. She has apologized for that photo, but not for opposing the war.


Capt. Rich Lockhart of the Kansas City Police Department said that although Fonda did not want to press charges against Michael A. Smith, 54, of Kansas City, he was arrested on a municipal charge of disorderly conduct after off-duty officers caught him just outside Unity Temple, where Fonda was signing books.


Lockhart said Smith was released on bond late Tuesday night and is due to appear in municipal court on May 27.


Smith, a Vietnam veteran, told The Kansas City Star on Wednesday that Fonda was a "traitor" and that her protests against the war were unforgivable. He said he normally does not chew tobacco but did so Tuesday solely to spit juice on the actress.


"I consider it a debt of honor," he told The Star for a story on its Web site, www.kansascity.com. "She spit in our faces for 37 years. It was absolutely worth it. There are a lot of veterans who would love to do what I did."

Rain Man
04-20-2005, 03:26 PM
I applaud him, but wish he hadn't used tobacco. That's not exactly presenting a progressive spitting image.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:26 PM
Great, another story to make our area look stupid to the rest of the world. Right along with "gay marriage bans," not teaching evolution, and serial killers.

Pants
04-20-2005, 03:27 PM
I don't care how much you hate her, have some class...

crossbow
04-20-2005, 03:27 PM
That war was totaly wrong but I don't agree with what she did to protest it. I know a guy that was in a VC prison camp at the time. He said it was much worse for them after she did that.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:29 PM
That war was totaly wrong but I don't agree with what she did to protest it. I know a guy that was in a VC prison camp at the time. He said it was much worse for them after she did that.

I obviously don't remember that (I was born in '76), but it does sound kinda messed up. Either way, spitting in someone's face is just classless.

Cochise
04-20-2005, 03:30 PM
What a waste of perfectly good tobacco juice.

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 03:30 PM
You can buy her apology for $29.95 at your local bookstore.

She's a worthless sack of shit. She apologies while she's pitching her piece of shit book. What a treasonous twat.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:31 PM
You can buy her apology for $29.95 at your local bookstore.

She's a worthless sack of shit. She apologies while she's pitching her piece of shit book. What a treasonous twat.

Okay, but would you spit on her?

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 03:31 PM
Great, another story to make our area look stupid to the rest of the world. Right along with "gay marriage bans," not teaching evolution, and serial killers.
You kidding me? KC stock is on the rise.

Dartgod
04-20-2005, 03:32 PM
Great, another story to make our area look stupid to the rest of the world. Right along with "gay marriage bans," not teaching evolution, and serial killers.
Exactly. What in the f*** were we thinking, allowing Hanoi Jane anywhere near our city?

I'd like to buy the man a beer and shake his hand.

Radar Chief
04-20-2005, 03:32 PM
I obviously don't remember that (I was born in '76), but it does sound kinda messed up. Either way, spitting in someone's face is just classless.

I guess itís a good thing I didnít go there and crap on her table then, huh?

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 03:33 PM
Okay, but would you spit on her?
Probably not, but she shouldn't jay-walk in my neighborhood either.

The Supreme court has recognized that there are words and actions so offensive that justify a violent reaction. So this guy was just saving it up until he had the opportunity. Can't blame him either.

crossbow
04-20-2005, 03:33 PM
I agree that spitting in someone's face is too Bill Romo but I am glad he was able to finaly get some closure after all of these years. He did risk his life when asked to.

Jenson71
04-20-2005, 03:34 PM
What a waste of perfectly good tobacco juice.

What else would you do with it?

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:34 PM
You kidding me? KC stock is on the rise.

I've got a lot of friends in other more sane parts of the world, and I'm tired of getting teased about this shit by them. Half the time they don't have the story right (like, the "gay marriage ban" thing -- that wasn't a gay marriage ban at all), but either way, I'd like to see this area stay out of the news for a while.

Gravedigger
04-20-2005, 03:34 PM
When did the war happen.... umm Oh yea more then 30 years ago. God I hate how people who can't let go of history. I suppose this guy had a klu klux klan hood on and a bible in his hand shouting George Bush is god. There is a thing called maturity and doing the right thing. I bet if the roles had been reversed not only would he not want to be spit with chew liquid that's just ****ing nasty but also Jane Fonda would'nt show such disrespect. I'm suprised he is outside a book signing personally. And also my dad is a Vietnam Vet and I know for a fact that he would never spit into anybody's face.

Rain Man
04-20-2005, 03:35 PM
I obviously don't remember that (I was born in '76), but it does sound kinda messed up. Either way, spitting in someone's face is just classless.

She visited a country in which the U.S. was at war, gave them her own personal USO tour, and then posed sitting at an anti-aircraft gun pretending that she was aiming it at American planes. She did this while American prisoners were being held in the same city. I think that outweighs the spitting.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:35 PM
Exactly. What in the f*** were we thinking, allowing Hanoi Jane anywhere near our city?


Can't argue with that part.


I'd like to buy the man a beer and shake his hand.

You can do that if you want, just please don't spit on someone yourself, especially if it's going to get you in the national news.

Bootlegged
04-20-2005, 03:35 PM
She's lucky if that's the worst she gets.

New nickname, Kodiak Jane.

jarjar
04-20-2005, 03:35 PM
She apologized for that a long while ago actually. She was a complete nutjob though, from video I've seen at the time she seemed to be almost gleeful about US soldiers getting killed in 'nam. Still, spitting tobacco juice in her face? That's just pure redneck idiocy.

Bwana
04-20-2005, 03:35 PM
Good.

Simplex3
04-20-2005, 03:35 PM
Dude was put in harm's way by this f**king broad who, to this day, continues to profit from some of the noteriety generated by those acts. He can do whatever the hell he wants to her as far as I'm concerned. Anything short of being shot at the traitor she is is too good for her.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:35 PM
I guess itís a good thing I didnít go there and crap on her table then, huh?

At least that would have made me laugh.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:37 PM
Probably not, but she shouldn't jay-walk in my neighborhood either.

The Supreme court has recognized that there are words and actions so offensive that justify a violent reaction. So this guy was just saving it up until he had the opportunity. Can't blame him either.

I don't know a lot about the law, but I would guess those words or actions have to be directed at you before you are legally allowed to respond.

And, apparently the police that arrested him agree with me.

Cochise
04-20-2005, 03:37 PM
I'd like to buy the man a beer and shake his hand.

Me too.

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 03:37 PM
She visited a country in which the U.S. was at war, gave them her own personal USO tour, and then posed sitting at an anti-aircraft gun pretending that she was aiming it at American planes. She did this while American prisoners were being held in the same city. I think that outweighs the spitting.
She went beyond protesting to working on behalf of an enemy of the US. I wonder if she is selling her book in North Vietnam? They must not have bought so she's shilling the thing here.

Dartgod
04-20-2005, 03:37 PM
just please don't spit on someone yourself, especially if it's going to get you in the national news.
I wouldn't spit on her, but then again, I didn't serve in the Vietnam War. If I had, I might consider it... :hmmm:

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:38 PM
I agree that spitting in someone's face is too Bill Romo but I am glad he was able to finaly get some closure after all of these years. He did risk his life when asked to.

That's a good point. Any vetran deserves respect for what they did for our country. Still, I don't think you should be spitting in someone's face.

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 03:38 PM
Dude was put in harm's way by this f**king broad who, to this day, continues to profit from some of the noteriety generated by those acts. He can do whatever the hell he wants to her as far as I'm concerned. Anything short of being shot at the traitor she is is too good for her.
This man has already EARNED his right to free expression which is a damn sight more than I can say for that silver spooned opportunistic twat.

Cochise
04-20-2005, 03:39 PM
I don't know a lot about the law, but I would guess those words or actions have to be directed at you before you are legally allowed to respond.

And, apparently the police that arrested him agree with me.

I guess if you want to be intentionally obtuse, and ignore whether or not she did any harm to servicemen in those days, then you could say he had no right to respond.

Sounds like a business transaction to me. He paid a hundred bucks or whatever a disorderly conduct citation costs, and got to spit on Jane Fonda.

Hell, for that price, people would line up around the block for their turn.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:39 PM
She visited a country in which the U.S. was at war, gave them her own personal USO tour, and then posed sitting at an anti-aircraft gun pretending that she was aiming it at American planes. She did this while American prisoners were being held in the same city. I think that outweighs the spitting.

That definitely sounds ****ed up, and I wouldn't blame anyone for disliking her for it. I just think spitting in people's faces, even those you dislike, is pretty classless. That's all.

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 03:41 PM
I don't know a lot about the law, but I would guess those words or actions have to be directed at you before you are legally allowed to respond.

And, apparently the police that arrested him agree with me.
This thing goes to trial the prosecution better make god damned sure there isn't a single vietnam vet on that jury or this fella walks. And can you imagine the public outcry against her should she choose to see this taken to trial? Book sales would tank and she would have to pretend to fly a plane into the World Trade Center to get enough notoriety to write another book to apologize for her bullshit actions.

Amnorix
04-20-2005, 03:41 PM
That definitely sounds ****ed up, and I wouldn't blame anyone for disliking her for it. I just think spitting in people's faces, even those you dislike, is pretty classless. That's all.

Precisely.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:41 PM
This man has already EARNED his right to free expression which is a damn sight more than I can say for that silver spooned opportunistic twat.

We all have a right to free expression, but we all would also get arrested if we spit on someone's face in public and got caught. He did what he wanted, and he'll pay the consequences. I'm sure he's okay with that -- he's surely weighed the pros and cons of doing this as he's stewed over it for 30 years.

Rain Man
04-20-2005, 03:42 PM
That definitely sounds ****ed up, and I wouldn't blame anyone for disliking her for it. I just think spitting in people's faces, even those you dislike, is pretty classless. That's all.


In 99.999 percent of cases, I would agree. In this case, I think it's the best that can be done since they can't torture her in a Hanoi prison.

Cochise
04-20-2005, 03:42 PM
This place never ceases to amaze me. You can find someone on the planet who will go to bat for anyone or anything.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:43 PM
I guess if you want to be intentionally obtuse, and ignore whether or not she did any harm to servicemen in those days, then you could say he had no right to respond.

Sounds like a business transaction to me. He paid a hundred bucks or whatever a disorderly conduct citation costs, and got to spit on Jane Fonda.

Hell, for that price, people would line up around the block for their turn.

Like I said, I don't know much about what she did. I wasn't even born. I admit to being out of my element. I still think that anyone who holds a grudge for 30 years has some issues.

I agree with you on the business transaction thing, though. I'm sure he's prefectly willing to pay his fine.

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 03:43 PM
"I consider it a debt of honor," he told The Star for a story on its Web site, www.kansascity.com. "She spit in our faces for 37 years. It was absolutely worth it. There are a lot of veterans who would love to do what I did."

He Earned his right, she was given hers by virtue of men like him.....she's a twat.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:44 PM
This place never ceases to amaze me. You can find someone on the planet who will go to bat for anyone or anything.

I assume you're talking about me, but I'm unsure who I'm going to bat for. It's not the guy who spit (I said that was f'd up), and it's not Jane Fonda (I said what she did was f'd up), so I'm confused. Care to enlighten me?

Skip Towne
04-20-2005, 03:49 PM
That slut deserves whatever she gets.

Amnorix
04-20-2005, 03:51 PM
This man has already EARNED his right to free expression which is a damn sight more than I can say for that silver spooned opportunistic twat.

I don't believe the 1st amendment is generally understood as including spitting on people. If so, I definitely missed that day in law school...

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:51 PM
That slut deserves whatever she gets.

There are a lot of people that deserve to be spit on (and worse), but that doesn't usually make it right for you to spit on them.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:53 PM
I don't believe the 1st amendment is generally understood as including spitting on people. If so, I definitely missed that day in law school...

I didn't go to law school, but I don't imagine there was a day in which you learned that the 1st amendment rights were "earned," either -- was there?

I have the utmost respect for any veteran -- but what they didn't for our country, no matter have amazing and brave, doesn't give them the right to do whatever they want.

Skip Towne
04-20-2005, 03:53 PM
There are a lot of people that deserve to be spit on (and worse), but that doesn't usually make it right for you to spit on them.
I'd forgive the guy if he had shot her.

Amnorix
04-20-2005, 03:54 PM
This place never ceases to amaze me. You can find someone on the planet who will go to bat for anyone or anything.

I'm no fan of Jane Fonda, neither her acting nor her politics in the 60's. Although speaking out against the Vietnam War was hardly the act of treason many paint it to be, she went above and beyond the threshold of merely exercising free speech rights, and instead became a very active propaganda tool for the enemy that was shooting at our soldiers.

Nevertheless, there's a very limited number of circumstances where I would consider one person spitting in another person's face as anything but classless, disgusting and uncalled for. Getting back at someone for whatever they did 35 years ago isn't likely to qualify unless they ran over your brother or child or something...

Valiant
04-20-2005, 03:54 PM
There are a lot of people that deserve to be spit on (and worse), but that doesn't usually make it right for you to spit on them.



Right or wrong... The bitch got what she deserved... You can whine all about if not being fair... But she deserved what she got...

Karma is such a sweet thing...

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:54 PM
I'd forgive the guy if he had shot her.

Sure, but that's not the point. The question is: would you have shot her yourself (or spit on her)?

It's easy to say, "good job, man" to someone else who does something f'd up in the name of a good cause, but most of us have the decency not to do it ourselves.

Amnorix
04-20-2005, 03:56 PM
Right or wrong... The bitch got what she deserved... You can whine all about if not being fair... But she deserved what she got...

Karma is such a sweet thing...

OTOH, as usual this kind fo stuff may be self-defeating. If this gets widespread publicity, then book sales may go up, and he'll pay $100 or whatever and she'll make thousands more.

Karma acts in strange ways. Tempt it not.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 03:56 PM
Right or wrong... The bitch got what she deserved... You can whine all about if not being fair... But she deserved what she got...

Karma is such a sweet thing...

First of all, I think it does sound like she got what she deserved. Second, I haven't said a word about it not being fair.

Just because it was what she deserved doesn't negate the fact that the guy who gave it to her comes off as a classless loser.

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 03:57 PM
I don't believe the 1st amendment is generally understood as including spitting on people. If so, I definitely missed that day in law school...
It's what libbies call "Performance Art"

BIG_DADDY
04-20-2005, 03:58 PM
I'd forgive the guy if he had shot her.

Shit I would have thrown a party and donated some money to his defense.

Taco John
04-20-2005, 03:59 PM
"I may not like what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it. Unless I *really* don't like what you say, in which case I'll spit on you."

Jenson71
04-20-2005, 04:01 PM
Let's pause and remember how cool of a guy Henry Fonda was. Oh, he was so good in Once Upon a Time in the West. All his westerns, really. And 12 Angry Men, definitely. It's too bad his daughter grew up to be like that. I think he blamed himself.

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 04:02 PM
I didn't go to law school, but I don't imagine there was a day in which you learned that the 1st amendment rights were "earned," either -- was there?

I have the utmost respect for any veteran -- but what they didn't for our country, no matter have amazing and brave, doesn't give them the right to do whatever they want.
No, the right to free speech is granted to citizens of this country. However, men and women who fight on behalf of our rights do so to ensure that the rest of us don't have to EARN the right ourselves. This ungrateful twat went beyond protest to advocacy of the enemy. She did PR spots for the North Vietnamese condemning our soldiers for war crimes that were not committed. She felt the ends justified the means and be damned all those who were in captivity and made to listen to her bullshit. So f!ck her right in her treasonous ass, is her book selling in North Vietnam?

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:02 PM
"I may not like what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it. Unless I *really* don't like what you say, in which case I'll spit on you."

Haha. :D

Logical
04-20-2005, 04:02 PM
Right or wrong... The bitch got what she deserved... You can whine all about if not being fair... But she deserved what she got...

Karma is such a sweet thing...The guy only did what millions would like to have done. Big props to him.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:03 PM
No, the right to free speech is granted to citizens of this country. However, men and women who fight on behalf of our rights do so to ensure that the rest of us don't have to EARN the right ourselves. This ungrateful twat went beyond protest to advocacy of the enemy. She did PR spots for the North Vietnamese condemning our soldiers for war crimes that were not committed. She felt the ends justified the means and be damned all those who were in captivity and made to listen to her bullshit. So f!ck her right in her treasonous ass, is her book selling in North Vietnam?

Okay, but you're still missing my point. You keep trying to convince me that she was an evildoer. I believe it. I wasn't there to see it, but I'm convinced now. There is no need to further pontificate on the sins she committed 35 years ago. I'm a believer.

But I still think it was classless to spit on her.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:05 PM
The guy only did what millions would like to have done. Big props to him.

But most of those millions wouldn't go through with it, because while it might be a very enticing fantasy, it's a classless thing to do.

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 04:05 PM
Okay, but you're still missing my point. You keep trying to convince me that she was an evildoer. I believe it. I wasn't there to see it, but I'm convinced now. There is no need to further pontificate on the sins she committed 35 years ago. I'm a believer.

But I still think it was classless to spit on her.
Well the flaming bag of dog shit on the front steps is always a classic... :thumb:

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:06 PM
Well the flaming bag of dog shit on the front steps is always a classic... :thumb:

Yeah, that I could've gotten down with. Or even ****ing her right in her treasonous ass sounds pretty good to me. :D

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 04:07 PM
Yeah, that I could've gotten down with. Or even ****ing her right in her treasonous ass sounds pretty good to me. :D
Volume 8 of Jane Fonda's workout: ****ing her right in her treasonous ass.

memyselfI
04-20-2005, 04:08 PM
"I may not like what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it. Unless I *really* don't like what you say, in which case I'll spit on you."

:thumb: :clap: ROFL

KC Kings
04-20-2005, 04:11 PM
Like I said, I don't know much about what she did. I wasn't even born. I admit to being out of my element. I still think that anyone who holds a grudge for 30 years has some issues.

I agree with you on the business transaction thing, though. I'm sure he's prefectly willing to pay his fine.

She not only protested the war, she went to Vietnam and blew three regiments of Viet Cong to get their spirits up. She posed for pictures on anti-aircraft guns, smiling and grab assing with the VC.

If you were getting shot at or had friends or family that had been killed in Viet Nam, wouldn't you hold a grudge if some dumb Hollywood twat posed for pictures smiling and laughing with the same men that murdered Americans, while sitting on a gun that was used to murder Americans?

People die in wars, and people have a right to protest wars, but what she did was above and beyond disloyal and unpatriotic. She went from Barbarella to Hanoi Jane, and ended her opportunity of being one of the biggest actresses of that time.

Speaking of no brains and big mouths ruining your career, I haven't heard much from the Dixie Chicks lately.

Mr. Laz
04-20-2005, 04:12 PM
i wasn't alive when she did what she did ... so i reserve judgement on fonda and the spitting guy.

you can't believe her side of the story because she's prolly just covering her butt.


and i see first hand, how rightwingers twist and turn stuff. They do the same thing right now. Anyone who disagrees with the war is a traitorous, soldier hating piece.... you don't like bush then you hate the troops ... you don't like the administration, your a commie.

so you can't believe what the repugants say either...


:shrug:

vailpass
04-20-2005, 04:14 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by Taco John
"I may not like what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it. Unless I *really* don't like what you say, in which case I'll spit on you."


:thumb: :clap: ROFL


Nice neighborhood you're in there Taco. Forgive me if I don't come to visit
:)

Skip Towne
04-20-2005, 04:16 PM
I don't believe the 1st amendment is generally understood as including spitting on people. If so, I definitely missed that day in law school...
After reading two years of your posts, I'd say you missed quite a bit of school. :p

BIG_DADDY
04-20-2005, 04:17 PM
:thumb: :clap: ROFL

Now look what you made me do, spit on my screen.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:19 PM
If you were getting shot at or had friends or family that had been killed in Viet Nam, wouldn't you hold a grudge if some dumb Hollywood twat posed for pictures smiling and laughing with the same men that murdered Americans, while sitting on a gun that was used to murder Americans?


I doubt I'd hold a grude for 35 years, but I certainly would have been pissed. Still, I wouldn't have spit inher face.


Speaking of no brains and big mouths ruining your career, I haven't heard much from the Dixie Chicks lately.

Don't get me started on that one. Natalie Maines was completly idiotic to say what she said, from a PR standpoint. For being so dumb, she deserves the drop in populatlirty the Chicks have received. Still, why ANYONE would choose what music they buy based on the political views of the artist is beyond me. If I'm buying music, I'm buying it based on one thing: how good the music is. I couldn't care less about an artist's political beliefs. A musician is only good to me for one thing: music.

Similarly, wheter you agree with Tim Robbins' political beliefs or not, I should think that your opinion on him would be based on his ability to act, since that is what he is. He's an actor, and I couldn't really give a damn what he thinks about politics. I'll look to politicans for political takes. An actor is only good to me for one thing: acting.

For the record, I completly stand by your right to boycott the Chicks or Tim Robbins -- I just think it's kinda of silly, and I wouldn't do it myself. But if you want to, more power to ya.

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 04:23 PM
The Dixie Chicks sucked for years before that whole "we're embarassed of Bush" thing.

Sydd
04-20-2005, 04:24 PM
http://www.americanhonor.net/vietna1.gif


As seen at many local VFW's.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:25 PM
The Dixie Chicks sucked for years before that whole "we're embarassed of Bush" thing.

Well, that depends on what you mean by "sucks." Those girls are actually all pretty talented musicians, especially by the standards of today's pop music.

But, I'm not a country/bluegrass fan in general, so I'm not a huge fan. But I wouldn't say they "suck," either.

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 04:26 PM
The Dixie Chicks sucked for years before that whole "we're embarassed of Bush" thing.
Good news for Natalie Maine with that whole "Obesity not as deadly as previously thought" thing. So she has that going for her....

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 04:27 PM
Well, that depends on what you mean by "sucks."

Now you're just being difficult.

Bwana
04-20-2005, 04:29 PM
The Dixie Chicks sucked for years before that whole "we're embarassed of Bush" thing.

No doubt, but that little move stuck a fork in them.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:31 PM
No doubt, but that little move stuck a fork in them.

Really, I think that remains to be seen. It'll be interesting to see how their new album does when it comes out. I would guess most of the country stations that "banned" them will jump back on the bandwagon pretty fast if people want to hear the record...

Certainly, they took a popularity hit for a while. But they also haven't had a new album since that happened, I don't think. People in the USA are fickle -- my guess is most of them have forgotten about it by now and the Chicks still seel a ton of records. But time will tell...

stevieray
04-20-2005, 04:33 PM
"I may not like what you say, but I'll defend to the death my right to say it. Unless I *really* don't like what you say, in which case I'll just call you a pussy."

Rain Man
04-20-2005, 04:33 PM
Um, I actually like the Dixie Chicks. I can set aside political stuff for music.

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 04:34 PM
Um, I actually like the Dixie Chicks.

Fag.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:35 PM
Um, I actually like the Dixie Chicks. I can set aside political stuff for music.

Country music makes up about 2% of the songs on my iPod. The Dixie Chicks account for around 80% of that 2%.

In other words, I'm not a big country fan, but if I'm going to listen to country, the Chicks will be near the top of my list.

CosmicPal
04-20-2005, 04:35 PM
This just might come back to haunt you.

stevieray
04-20-2005, 04:36 PM
:thumb: :clap: ROFLStop pretending you don't wallow in the mud of the pig pen like most of us here..

Bwana
04-20-2005, 04:39 PM
Really, I think that remains to be seen. It'll be interesting to see how their new album does when it comes out. I would guess most of the country stations that "banned" them will jump back on the bandwagon pretty fast if people want to hear the record...

Certainly, they took a popularity hit for a while. But they also haven't had a new album since that happened, I don't think. People in the USA are fickle -- my guess is most of them have forgotten about it by now and the Chicks still seel a ton of records. But time will tell...

Don't bet the farm on that.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:41 PM
Don't bet the farm on that.

I wouldn't BET a dime on it. But, it's still my hunch that they'll do pretty well. I could certainly be wrong. They've got enough very loyal fans to make plenty of money even if they did lose a lot of the more casual fans.

But we'll see -- like I said, it's just a hunch -- I wouldn't put any money on it.

Donger
04-20-2005, 04:42 PM
I don't care how much you hate her, have some class...

Shoot, we used to execute traitors.

She got off easily, IMO.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:44 PM
Shoot, we used to execute traitors.


Right. We used to call black people ******s and make them ride in the back of the bus, too. And then we grew up into a (more) civilized world.

Donger
04-20-2005, 04:47 PM
Right. We used to call black people ******s and make them ride in the back of the bus, too. And then we grew up into a (more) civilized world.

Apples and oranges.

Just in case some here haven't seen it, here's one of the infamous pictures:

Archie F. Swin
04-20-2005, 04:47 PM
"KC Man spits on Jane Fonda "

Damnit Gaz, I told you to stay away from KC yesterday!

RaiderH8r
04-20-2005, 04:47 PM
Right. We used to call black people ******s And then we grew up into a (more) civilized world.
I guess rappers haven't been so quick to catch on and grow up????

Rain Man
04-20-2005, 04:48 PM
Fag.

Hey, it was one time, and I thought it was a woman. Damn those transvestite hookers! Damn them!

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:48 PM
Apples and oranges.

Just in case some here haven't seen it, here's one of the infamous pictures:

It is Apples and Oranges, you're right. But still -- just because we USED to execute people doesn't mean we still should do anything of the sort.

That picture is ****ed up. This chick definitely comes off as a traitor. I certainly don't blame anyone who feels a hatred towards her.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:51 PM
I guess rappers haven't been so quick to catch on and grow up????

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0375713719/qid=1114037356/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/002-3193072-4688015?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

Read it. It's the most interesting book I've ever read in my life.

I don't really defend hip-hop artists or any black folks for using that word, but you and I both know they are using it to take the power away from us white people, so them using it is totally different than us using it. Not saying it's right, but it's, again, apples and oranges.

Similarly, the n-word is so far beyond almost every other racial slur out there. Comparing it to most others is completly absurd.

Read the book, it's interesting.

Donger
04-20-2005, 04:51 PM
It is Apples and Oranges, you're right. But still -- just because we USED to execute people doesn't mean we still should do anything of the sort.

That picture is ****ed up. This chick definitely comes off as a traitor. I certainly don't blame anyone who feels a hatred towards her.

Oh, I don't know. I think that giving aid and comfort to the enemy during time of war is one of the better justifications of executing someone.

That and not washing one's legs with any relative frequency.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:52 PM
Oh, I don't know. I think that giving aid and comfort to the enemy during time of war is one of the better justifications of executing someone.

That and not washing one's legs with any relative frequency.

Well, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree, then. I'm personally not a fan of execution except in very, very rare circumstances (which at least have to include breaking the law).

Baby Lee
04-20-2005, 04:54 PM
Shoot, we used to execute traitors.

She got off easily, IMO.
Right. We used to call black people ******s and make them ride in the back of the bus, too. And then we grew up into a (more) civilized world.
Wow, in a sea of generally benign regurgitation of old gripes, we get this exchange. Leaving aside the argument whether or not Jane IS a traitor, please tell me, jcroft, that you don't feel that our outlook on traitors should evolve as our collective outlook on blacks have over the past century. Traitors are condemned for good reason due to actions completely at their own agency. Completely the opposite of blacks, who were condemned without good reason for an inborn distinction completely out of their control, and completely irrelevant to boot.
A call to evolve into a more 'civilized' metrosexual outlook on traitors is not called for at all, IMO. They purposely, and of their own free will, act at odds to our basic societal safety and security, and for that they deserve to die.

Donger
04-20-2005, 04:54 PM
Well, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree, then. I'm personally not a fan of execution except in very, very rare circumstances.

Whew. Donger dodges the noose yet again.

But, I would like to add to the list those that insist on using repeating commas in their posts; AKA, a commatard.

Donger
04-20-2005, 04:56 PM
Wow, in a sea of generally benign regurgitation of old gripes, we get this exchange. Leaving aside the argument whether or not Jane IS a traitor, please tell me, jcroft, that you don't feel that our outlook on traitors should evolve as our collective outlook on blacks have over the past century. Traitors are condemned for good reason due to actions completely at their own agency. Completely the opposite of blacks, who were condemned without good reason for an inborn distinction completely out of their control, and completely irrelevant to boot.
A call to evolve into a more 'civilized' metrosexual outlook on traitors is not called for at all, IMO. They purposely, and of their own free will, act at odds to our basic societal safety and security, and for that they deserve to die.

That has got to be the longest definition of 'apples and oranges' that I've ever seen.

CosmicPal
04-20-2005, 04:56 PM
After spending a few hours watching On Golden Pond I wanted to spit chew on her as well.

Baby Lee
04-20-2005, 04:56 PM
Well, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree, then. I'm personally not a fan of execution except in very, very rare circumstances (which at least have to include breaking the law).
Are you under some kind of notion that there are no laws against treason?

Baby Lee
04-20-2005, 04:58 PM
After spending a few hours watching On Golden Pond I wanted to spit chew on her as well.
Weren't there Jane bewbies somewhere in there?
Haven't seen it since it was at the. . . would you believe, . . drive-in. But I thought the mentioned bewbies in 'I Love the 80's.'

jcroft
04-20-2005, 04:59 PM
Wow, in a sea of generally benign regurgitation of old gripes, we get this exchange. Leaving aside the argument whether or not Jane IS a traitor, please tell me, jcroft, that you don't feel that our outlook on traitors should evolve as our collective outlook on blacks have over the past century.


No, I definitely don't feel our outlook on traitors should evolve. However, I do feel that our outlook on execution should.


Traitors are condemned for good reason due to actions completely at their own agency. Completely the opposite of blacks, who were condemned without good reason for an inborn distinction completely out of their control, and completely irrelevant to boot.


You are 100% correct here. No argument from me.


A call to evolve into a more 'civilized' metrosexual outlook on traitors is not called for at all, IMO. They purposely, and of their own free will, act at odds to our basic societal safety and security, and for that they deserve to die.

I believe almost no one deserves to die for a crime. I'm generally opposed to the death penalty, although I do hold out a few exceptions to that. In any case, I am in no way suggesting our feelings for traitors should evolve, and the comparrison to racisim was probably uncalled for. I am, though, suggeting that our feelings towards the death penalty should evolve.

That, however, is another thread and I don't really feel like fighting over it here. :)

And, as someone who can probably be considered "metrosexual," I'd just say that I don't think political beliefs have anything to do with that term. "Metrosexuality," if you wish to call it that, has only to do with style and vanity.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 05:00 PM
Are you under some kind of notion that there are no laws against treason?

No, but I am under the notion that Jane Fonda was never convicted or even charged with such a thing. Am I incorrect (it's quite possible -- this is the first I've ever really heard of what she did)?

Skip Towne
04-20-2005, 05:00 PM
Wow, in a sea of generally benign regurgitation of old gripes, we get this exchange. Leaving aside the argument whether or not Jane IS a traitor, please tell me, jcroft, that you don't feel that our outlook on traitors should evolve as our collective outlook on blacks have over the past century. Traitors are condemned for good reason due to actions completely at their own agency. Completely the opposite of blacks, who were condemned without good reason for an inborn distinction completely out of their control, and completely irrelevant to boot.
A call to evolve into a more 'civilized' metrosexual outlook on traitors is not called for at all, IMO. They purposely, and of their own free will, act at odds to our basic societal safety and security, and for that they deserve to die.
Exactly right. I still can't believe the gubment didn't prosecute her for that.

Jenson71
04-20-2005, 05:02 PM
Weren't there Jane bewbies somewhere in there?
Haven't seen it since it was at the. . . would you believe, . . drive-in. But I thought the mentioned bewbies in 'I Love the 80's.'

No!

Donger
04-20-2005, 05:03 PM
No, but I am under the notion that Jane Fonda was never convicted or even charged with such a thing. Am I incorrect (it's quite possible -- this is the first I've ever really heard of what she did)?

Nope. Of course, it was 'hip' to be part of the anti-war movement back then. There was no way that even our government would have been stupid enough to try to prosecute her.

As to her being guilty of treason, read this:

The Wall Street Journal (August 3, 1995) published an interview with Bui Tin who served on the General Staff of the North Vietnam Army and received the unconditional surrender of South Vietnam on April 30, 1975. During the interview Mr. Tin was asked if the American antiwar movement was important to Hanoi's victory. Mr. Tin responded "It was essential to our strategy" referring to the war being fought on two fronts, the Vietnam battlefield and back home in America through the antiwar movement on college campuses and in the city streets. He further stated the North Vietnamese leadership listened to the American evening news broadcasts "to follow the growth of the American antiwar movement."

Baby Lee
04-20-2005, 05:04 PM
No, but I am under the notion that Jane Fonda was never convicted or even charged with such a thing. Am I incorrect (it's quite possible -- this is the first I've ever really heard of what she did)?
I'm still operating under the "[l]eaving aside the argument whether or not Jane IS a traitor" assumption. . .

jcroft
04-20-2005, 05:06 PM
Nope. Of course, it was 'hip' to be part of the anti-war movement back then. There was no way that even our government would have been stupid enough to try to prosecute her.

As to her being guilty of treason, read this:

The Wall Street Journal (August 3, 1995) published an interview with Bui Tin who served on the General Staff of the North Vietnam Army and received the unconditional surrender of South Vietnam on April 30, 1975. During the interview Mr. Tin was asked if the American antiwar movement was important to Hanoi's victory. Mr. Tin responded "It was essential to our strategy" referring to the war being fought on two fronts, the Vietnam battlefield and back home in America through the antiwar movement on college campuses and in the city streets. He further stated the North Vietnamese leadership listened to the American evening news broadcasts "to follow the growth of the American antiwar movement."

Well, no matter what anyone believes, if she wasn't convicted of treason, then she wouldn't have even been executed back in the times you remember so fondly.

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 05:06 PM
That has got to be the longest definition of 'apples and oranges' that I've ever seen.
He gets paid by the hour. You owe him a few hundy now.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 05:07 PM
I'm still operating under the "[l]eaving aside the argument whether or not Jane IS a traitor" assumption. . .

Alright. But I told you my feelings on that -- a convicted traitor should definitely get a very harsh punishment. However, I personally don't believe it should be death.

In the case of Jane specifically, if she wasn't convicted of a crime, I don't see how anyone could expect her to get a punishment (other than being spit on, I guess).

jcroft
04-20-2005, 05:08 PM
He gets paid by the hour. You owe him a few hundy now.

Haha. :D

Donger
04-20-2005, 05:09 PM
Well, no matter what anyone believes, if she wasn't convicted of treason, then she wouldn't have even been executed back in the times you remember so fondly.

That's precisely my point. Back in the good ole days, we would have charged her, tried her, found her guilty and whacked her.

She directly gave aid and comfort to the enemy during time of war.

You may call that she wasn't "progressive;" I call it weakness on the part of the US government.

Horseshit, too.

Donger
04-20-2005, 05:11 PM
He gets paid by the hour. You owe him a few hundy now.

Heh. Is BL a lawyer? Most lawyers I know will always use 100 words when three will suffice.

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 05:12 PM
Is BL a lawyer?

Of course. It's in the newbie handguide. Didn't you get one when you joined?

jcroft
04-20-2005, 05:13 PM
You may call that she wasn't "progressive;" I call it weakness on the part of the US government.


No, I wouldn't call that progressive at all. I'm in agreement with you here. Sounds like she definitely should have been tried, if what you all are saying is true.

The only place we disagree is in what should have happened to her after she was tried and found guilty.

Donger
04-20-2005, 05:17 PM
Of course. It's in the newbie handguide. Didn't you get one when you joined?

I was supposed to read it? Shit.

First the cop tells me that those "speed limit signs" are NOT suggestions, and now this.

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 05:18 PM
I was supposed to read it? Shit.

First the cop tells me that those "speed limit signs" are NOT suggestions, and now this.
Those stop signs w/ the white borders? Really are optional. Don't believe those lying pigs.

Donger
04-20-2005, 05:19 PM
No, I wouldn't call that progressive at all. I'm in agreement with you here. Sounds like she definitely should have been tried, if what you all are saying is true.

The only place we disagree is in what should have happened to her after she was tried and found guilty.

So, with this new information, do you think that getting spat upon is rather lenient punishment? Hell, she was part of the group (FTA) that routinely spat upon our soldiers returning home from Vietnam.

Again, she got off easy, IMO.

Donger
04-20-2005, 05:20 PM
Those stop signs w/ the white borders? Really are optional. Don't believe those lying pigs.

You remember that?

jcroft
04-20-2005, 05:21 PM
So, with this new information, do you think that getting spat upon is rather lenient punishment?

I think it's a pretty damn harsh punishment for someone who wasn't charged with a crime. Besides, even if she had been charged with a crime and found guilty, was it this guy's job to punish her?

But that was never my point. I said long ago in this thread it sounds like she deserved it. My point was that the guy who did it showed no class, whether she deserved it or not, and I don't like like seeing national stories that make the KC area look like a place full of classless people.

Donger
04-20-2005, 05:25 PM
I think it's a pretty damn harsh punishment for someone who wasn't charged with a crime.

But that was never my point. I said long ago in this thread it sounds like she deserved it. My point was that the guy who did it showed no class, whether she deserved it or not, and I don't like like seeing national stories that make the KC area look like a place full of classless people.

The fact that she wasn't charged doesn't mean she didn't commit treason.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 05:28 PM
The fact that she wasn't charged doesn't mean she didn't commit treason.

Yes, but the fact that a few rightwingers say she committed treason doesn't mean she did, either.

I'm not doubting what you say, though. I'm just saying that this guy (the spitter) wasn't within his rights to try her himself (in his head) and punish her himself (by spitting on her). But my original point didn't even go that far -- I was just saying it was classless, and that's all.

Valiant
04-20-2005, 05:30 PM
But I still think it was classless to spit on her.


Is it classless if you use another form of male fluid on her face... There are thousands of female porn stars that would disagree with you...

jcroft
04-20-2005, 05:32 PM
Is it classless if you use another form of male fluid on her face... There are thousands of female porn stars that would disagree with you...

Those female porn stars (and your girlfriend) WANT me to cum on their face. Apples and oranges.

:D

Donger
04-20-2005, 05:33 PM
Yes, but the fact that a few rightwingers say she committed treason doesn't mean she did, either.

I'm not doubting what you say, though. I'm just saying that this guy (the spitter) wasn't within his rights to try her himself (in his head) and punish her himself (by spitting on her). But my original point didn't even go that far -- I was just saying it was classless, and that's all.

Rightwingers didn't create the picture of her on a North Vietnamese AA gun during a time of war when that same gun was being used to shot at our aircraft.

Nor did rightwingers make up this:

This is Jane Fonda. During my two week visit in the Democratic Republic of Vietnam, I've had the opportunity to visit a great many places and speak to a large number of people from all walks of life- workers, peasants, students, artists and dancers, historians, journalists, film actresses, soldiers, militia girls, members of the women's union, writers.

I visited the (Dam Xuac) agricultural coop, where the silk worms are also raised and thread is made. I visited a textile factory, a kindergarten in Hanoi. The beautiful Temple of Literature was where I saw traditional dances and heard songs of resistance. I also saw unforgettable ballet about the guerrillas training bees in the south to attack enemy soldiers. The bees were danced by women, and they did their job well.

In the shadow of the Temple of Literature I saw Vietnamese actors and actresses perform the second act of Arthur Miller's play All My Sons, and this was very moving to me- the fact that artists here are translating and performing American plays while US imperialists are bombing their country.

I cherish the memory of the blushing militia girls on the roof of their factory, encouraging one of their sisters as she sang a song praising the blue sky of Vietnam- these women, who are so gentle and poetic, whose voices are so beautiful, but who, when American planes are bombing their city, become such good fighters.

I cherish the way a farmer evacuated from Hanoi, without hesitation, offered me, an American, their best individual bomb shelter while US bombs fell near by. The daughter and I, in fact, shared the shelter wrapped in each others arms, cheek against cheek. It was on the road back from Nam Dinh, where I had witnessed the systematic destruction of civilian targets- schools, hospitals, pagodas, the factories, houses, and the dike system.

As I left the United States two weeks ago, Nixon was again telling the American people that he was winding down the war, but in the rubble- strewn streets of Nam Dinh, his words echoed with sinister (words indistinct) of a true killer. And like the young Vietnamese woman I held in my arms clinging to me tightly- and I pressed my cheek against hers- I thought, this is a war against Vietnam perhaps, but the tragedy is America's.

One thing that I have learned beyond a shadow of a doubt since I've been in this country is that Nixon will never be able to break the spirit of these people; he'll never be able to turn Vietnam, north and south, into a neo- colony of the United States by bombing, by invading, by attacking in any way. One has only to go into the countryside and listen to the peasants describe the lives they led before the revolution to understand why every bomb that is dropped only strengthens their determination to resist. I've spoken to many peasants who talked about the days when their parents had to sell themselves to landlords as virtually slaves, when there were very few schools and much illiteracy, inadequate medical care, when they were not masters of their own lives.

But now, despite the bombs, despite the crimes being created- being committed against them by Richard Nixon, these people own their own land, build their own schools- the children learning, literacy- illiteracy is being wiped out, there is no more prostitution as there was during the time when this was a French colony. In other words, the people have taken power into their own hands, and they are controlling their own lives.

And after 4,000 years of struggling against nature and foreign invaders- and the last 25 years, prior to the revolution, of struggling against French colonialism- I don't think that the people of Vietnam are about to compromise in any way, shape or form about the freedom and independence of their country, and I think Richard Nixon would do well to read Vietnamese history, particularly their poetry, and particularly the poetry written by Ho Chi Minh.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 05:36 PM
Well, I haven't read all that yet, but I can see you missed the point. I BELIEVE you that she was a traitor. I've been convinced of that since the first page of this thread.

But, even so, I still think it was classless of some random guy to spit on her. Perhaps a judge should have sentenced her to being spit on (or worse), but it wasn't this guy's job to take it under his own control.

Plus, it was classless (have I mentioned that?).

jcroft
04-20-2005, 05:39 PM
Okay, I have no read all of that, and I didn't find anything in it that would make her a traitor. I'm not saying she wasn't a traitor -- just that nothing in that post says so.

Everything she said there would be protected by her freedom of speech, I would think. Just like Natalie Maines had a right to speak out aganist the war, so did Jane.

Now, if she did something to aid the enemy, that could be a different story. I'm not sure what the definition of treason is, exactly (as far as the law is concerned), but I know just visiting a country we are fighting with and speaking out aganist a war wouldn't qualify.

What else did she do?

Donger
04-20-2005, 05:40 PM
Well, I haven't read all that yet, but I can see you missed the point. I BELIEVE you that she was a traitor. I've been convinced of that since the first page of this thread.

But, even so, I still think it was classless of some random guy to spit on her. Perhaps a judge should have sentenced her to being spit on (or worse), but it wasn't this guy's job to take it under his own control.

Plus, it was classless (have I mentioned that?).

Oh no. I heard you. I was just trying to give you some context of what the spitter went through thanks to the actions of this silly gash.

Coach
04-20-2005, 05:42 PM
What a waste of perfectly good tobacco juice.

Heh. I wonder what kind of brand he used.

Donger
04-20-2005, 05:42 PM
Okay, I have no read all of that, and I didn't find anything in it that would make her a traitor. I'm not saying she wasn't a traitor -- just that nothing in that post says so.

Everything she said there would be protected by her freedom of speech, I would think. Just like Natalie Maines had a right to speak out aganist the war, so did Jane.

Now, if she did something to aid the enemy, that could be a different story. I'm not sure what the definition of treason is, exactly (as far as the law is concerned), but I know just visiting a country we are fighting with and speaking out aganist a war wouldn't qualify.

What else did she do?

Article 3 of the Constitution thus provides that treason shall consist only in levying war against the United States or in giving aid and comfort to its enemies.

Considering that a large part of the NV strategy was to fight a tw-front war (one in Vietnam and one with the anti-war folks in the USA), I'd argue that she met the second criteria.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 05:44 PM
Article 3 of the Constitution thus provides that treason shall consist only in levying war against the United States or in giving aid and comfort to its enemies.

Considering that a large part of the NV strategy was to fight a tw-front war (one in Vietnam and one with the anti-war folks in the USA), I'd argue that she met the second criteria.

Hmm, perhaps you are right. I guess it just depends how "comfort" is defined.

Anyway, I'm out -- got shit to do. Been a good discussion. As always, I respect all of you guys opinions and any disagreement is in no way personal!

Thanks for the good debate. :)

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 05:45 PM
You remember that?
What did I remember?

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 05:46 PM
Is it classless if you use another form of male fluid on her face...

Of course not. That's the physical expression of love.

Donger
04-20-2005, 05:47 PM
What did I remember?

This has the makings of a "Who's on first?" parody.

I once convinced a really hot, but unbelievably stupid, gal in HS that the stop signs with the white borders around them were optional/yield signs. She figured it out after the second ticket.

"They ALL have white borders!!!"

IIRC, I mentioned this story on CP once. Hence, my question.

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 05:55 PM
This has the makings of a "Who's on first?" parody.

I once convinced a really hot, but unbelievably stupid, gal in HS that the stop signs with the white borders around them were optional/yield signs. She figured it out after the second ticket.

"They ALL have white borders!!!"

IIRC, I mentioned this story on CP once. Hence, my question.
I think you have told that story before... but, no, I didn't remember it.

I like the second ticket part. You'd think the conversation with the cop while receiving the first ticket would've tipped her off. I gotta think it included an exchange similar to this..

"You know why I pulled you over?"
"No."
"You ran that stop sign back there."
"I thought it was optional."

I suppose you also had to convince her the first cop was lying to her when he told her they weren't optional?

Donger
04-20-2005, 06:03 PM
I think you have told that story before... but, no, I didn't remember it.

I like the second ticket part. You'd think the conversation with the cop while receiving the first ticket would've tipped her off. I gotta think it included an exchange similar to this..

"You know why I pulled you over?"
"No."
"You ran that stop sign back there."
"I thought it was optional."

I suppose you also had to convince her the first cop was lying to her when he told her they weren't optional?

Like I said, she was (and almost certainly still is) unbelievably stupid. I'm talking about a level of stupidity bordering on not being able to walk and breathe at the same time.

Valiant
04-20-2005, 06:14 PM
Heh. I wonder what kind of brand he used.



Man if he said.. That will be a great ad for some tobacco company...

crossbow
04-20-2005, 06:21 PM
Alright. But I told you my feelings on that -- a convicted traitor should definitely get a very harsh punishment. However, I personally don't believe it should be death.

In the case of Jane specifically, if she wasn't convicted of a crime, I don't see how anyone could expect her to get a punishment (other than being spit on, I guess).

The guy that spat on her was no doubt outraged by the governments lack of action on this issue so he used as violent of a deed as he could perform without sacrificing years of his life in prison to do so. Given this understanding of how the man feels do you condone what he did?

jcroft
04-20-2005, 06:28 PM
The guy that spat on her was no doubt outraged by the governments lack of action on this issue so he used as violent of a deed as he could perform without sacrificing years of his life in prison to do so. Given this understanding of how the man feels do you condone what he did?

No. I hope this question is a joke, and you don't really think it's okay for any man to take the law into his own hands and serve up whatever punishment he thinks is fair. That's called a lack of control in my mind.

If I'm pissed that OJ was aquitted does that give me a right to knock the dude out if I see him? If I think Natalie Maine should have been reprimaned by the government for her comments, do I get to shoot a blowdart at her from my fourth row seats? If I'm annoyed that the Kansas marriage ammendement passed, does it give me to spit on those who voted for it and call them ignorant homophobes? If I don't think Bush should have been going after Saddamm, does it give me the right to murder him? If I'm pissed that a registered sex offender is living in the house behind me, do I have the right to cut his dick off?

Sorry, but you don't have the right to take the law into your own hands, no matter how much you'd like to. Please don't tell me you agree with vigilante justice by anyone who deems it necessary.

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 06:32 PM
Like I said, she was (and almost certainly still is) unbelievably stupid. I'm talking about a level of stupidity bordering on not being able to walk and breathe at the same time.
So, getting her into bed wasn't much of a challenge, huh?

1punkyQB
04-20-2005, 06:34 PM
If I'm annoyed that the Kansas marriage ammendement passed, does it give me to spit on those who voted for it and call them ignorant homophobes? If I don't think Bush should have been going after Saddamm, does it give me the right to murder him? If I'm pissed that a registered sex offender is living in the house behind me, do I have the right to cut his dick off?
Not much of a parallel between those situations and a Vietnam vet spitting tobacco juice on a communist sympathizer. It's not murder or castration, and not letting Bob and Earl enjoy marital privileges isn't exactly committing treason.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 06:42 PM
Not much of a parallel between those situations and a Vietnam vet spitting tobacco juice on a communist sympathizer. It's not murder or castration, and not letting Bob and Earl enjoy marital privileges isn't exactly committing treason.

First of all, we all know the Kansas marraige ammendment will affect a lot more hetrosexual couples than gay ones. But that's another thread, too.

You picked two of my examples, took them out of context, and totally ignored the point. The point is, it's not okay for someone to take the law into their own hands just because they think the justice system didn't do it's job.

Are ya with me, or not?

Baby Lee
04-20-2005, 06:44 PM
Are ya with me, or not?
I think the rub is in two different ideas of the term 'condone.'
If you do not absolve the man for spitting, do you at least empathize?

I too, do not absolve, but I have to admit I empathize.

tommykat
04-20-2005, 06:46 PM
Exactly. What in the f*** were we thinking, allowing Hanoi Jane anywhere near our city?

I'd like to buy the man a beer and shake his hand.

I refuse to read all of this, thought about it and decided nada..........Dartgod I didn't mean to pick you but after a few of what I read I just stopped and hit your response.

My question/questions.........As a born again Christian ( Jane Fonda ) is forgiven by whom I count is the only one that matters.....Again, Dartgod it is not you that I am pointing out, please understand.

What she did was wrong........hurtful............you name it. It happened. She knows that now, but she stands by what she feels is right at this time. Haven't we all done things and said things we wish we could take back? (Here)? :shake::shake: Give the lady a break.........Finally we as a Nation USA are finally giving our vets what they should have gotten during and after the war. To hold bitterness that many years and not see what finally is coming to them finally is wrong.

You have to have forgiveness to move on, I see from this articale this man has not reached that point. I stand behind all vets!!! I am finally thankful that the vietnam vets are getting what they deserved~

Sorry for the rant........but all people.......the Vietman vets deserve their rights and finally it happened.:thumb: But so does Jane Fonda.< Forgivness

jcroft
04-20-2005, 06:47 PM
I think the rub is in two different ideas of the term 'condone.'
If you do not absolve the man for spitting, do you at least empathize?

I too, do not absolve, but I have to admit I empathize.

Yeah, I empathize. I lived in Topeka for 10 years. Every time I saw that **** Fred Phelps on my street corners I had fantasies of running his bigoted ass right over. But, I know better -- it's not my job to punish him for what I think are crimes.

So sure, I empathize. I understand why he wanted to do it. But still, he shouldn't have.

1punkyQB
04-20-2005, 06:51 PM
I'll respect the social compact or whatever you choose to call it. The parallel between the situations you mentioned is what got my skirt up.

Ninjaman
04-20-2005, 06:51 PM
Jane Fonda was in Barbarella and agreed to 3 way sex with her husband.

She's awesome !

Baby Lee
04-20-2005, 06:51 PM
Yeah, I empathize. I lived in Topeka for 10 years. Every time I saw that **** Fred Phelps on my street corners I had fantasies of running his bigoted ass right over. But, I know better -- it's not my job to punish him for what I think are crimes.

So sure, I empathize. I understand why he wanted to do it. But still, he shouldn't have.
How 'bout it folks? Does this keep the hounds at bay? :thumb:

jcroft
04-20-2005, 06:54 PM
I'll respect the social compact or whatever you choose to call it. The parallel between the situations you mentioned is what got my skirt up.

I intentionaly tried to include some that paralleled well, and some that showed the extremes that could happen if we were to allow people to take the law into their own hands at will.

stevieray
04-20-2005, 06:55 PM
Sorry, but you don't have the right to take the law into your own hands, no matter how much you'd like to. Please don't tell me you agree with vigilante justice by anyone who deems it necessary.

since when is spitting impersonating an officer? vigilante justice? Guy was charged with disorderly conduct. CONDUCT. That's the core of your point. His conduct offends you. He was arrested and will be fined, as he should be. That's why they have laws.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 06:57 PM
Jane Fonda was in Barbarella and agreed to 3 way sex with her husband.

She's awesome !

As bad as it sounds, I sort of tend to agree that this is the way we ought to judge our feelings towards actors. We don't know them personally. They're mostly not smart enough to provide worthwhile takes on solical issues and politics. If I'm deciding if I like an actress or not, there are only a few factors at play:

1. Does she act well?
2. Do I like the movies she's been in?
3. Would I hit it?

"What are her political, social, and economic values?" is NOT on the list.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 06:59 PM
since when is spitting impersonating an officer? vigilante justice? Guy was charged with disorderly conduct. CONDUCT. That's the core of your point. His conduct offends you. He was arrested and will be fined, as he should be. That's why they have laws.

Yeah, you're right. His conduct offends me. But, as has been well established in this thread, his conduct was almost certainly a response to the fact that he felt she committed crimes and she was not prosecuted for them. He chose to prosecute her himself. That's taking the law into your own hands, any way you look at it.

stevieray
04-20-2005, 07:09 PM
Yeah, you're right. His conduct offends me. But, as has been well established in this thread, his conduct was almost certainly a response to the fact that he felt she committed crimes and she was not prosecuted for them. He chose to prosecute her himself. That's taking the law into your own hands, any way you look at it.

BS, he chose to SPIT on her. That's it. He knew the consequences, and glady ACCEPTS HIS punishment. He is the one who is accountable, no matter how much you try to take the law into your own hands, acting like he isn't.

Next thing you'll tell me is someone needs to persecuted for giving a dirty look.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 07:10 PM
BS, he chose to SPIT on her. That's it. He knew the consequences, and glady ACCEPTS HIS punishment. He is the one who ia accountable, no matter how much you think you own his actions.

Next thing you'll tell me is someone needs to persecuted for giving adirty look.

So what you are saying now is that it's okay to do anything we want, as long as we accept the punishment? Is that right?

And second, if someone spits in your face, do you expect them to receive no punishment in return?

stevieray
04-20-2005, 07:25 PM
So what you are saying now is that it's okay to do anything we want, as long as we accept the punishment? Is that right?

And second, if someone spits in your face, do you expect them to receive no punishment in return?

1) Don't be so dramatic, I said HE accepts HIS punishment. Of course it's not ok to do whatever we want, but that doesn't stop people, now does it?

2)Is the guy not being punished for his actions? i think your problem is that you think the law isn't being enforced to your liking.

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 07:28 PM
[size=3]Haven't we all done things and said things we wish we could take back?

Of course not. I'm infallible.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 07:35 PM
1) Don't be so dramatic, I said HE accepts HIS punishment. Of course it's not ok to do whatever we want, but that doesn't stop people, now does it?

2)Is the guy not being punished for his actions? i think your problem is that you think the law isn't being enforced to your liking.

Have you read this thread? You have missed my point completly.

1. No, it doesn't stop people. But it should.
2. Yeah, he's being punished. I think the small fine he'll get is a totally appropriate punishment and I have no objection to the way the police handled it at all.

My ONLY point when I started discussing this is that this guy is CLASSLESS and that bugs me because he's now created a national news story that shows off how we have classless people in KC. I have NO problem with the law's handling of the situation whatsoever, and I've never said anything in this thread that would suggest otherwise.

Donger
04-20-2005, 07:43 PM
So, getting her into bed wasn't much of a challenge, huh?

Bed? No. Behind the QT at 103rd and Whatever? Yes.

stevieray
04-20-2005, 07:47 PM
Have you read this thread? You have missed my point completly.

1. No, it doesn't stop people. But it should.
2. Yeah, he's being punished. I think the small fine he'll get is a totally appropriate punishment and I have no objection to the way the police handled it at all.

My ONLY point when I started discussing this is that this guy is CLASSLESS and that bugs me because he's now created a national news story that shows off how we have classless people in KC. I have NO problem with the law's handling of the situation whatsoever, and I've never said anything in this thread that would suggest otherwise.

I see. You're claiming his actions. Good luck with that.

I guess Al queda represents all Muslims.

jcroft
04-20-2005, 07:53 PM
I guess Al queda represents all Muslims.

Dude, you are again, missing my point. Listen carefully while I make it very clear for you.

Of course Al Queda doesn't represent all Muslims. But plenty of Americans think it does. Why? Because they're stupid. Most of the rest of the world thinks Kansas is a crazy place because we "don't teach evoloution." Of course, that's not really accurate -- but that's what they hear. The rest of the country thinks Kansas just "banned gay marraige." Of course, we know that's not even close to being accurate -- but that's what they hear (either because of bad reporting or selective listening".

I read the article above as someone who knew NOTHING about Fonda's actions in Vietnam. The article above told me some dud spit in her face because of her protest. It didn't tell me a damn thing about what she did in protest. I assumed she held up some signs or something. Why should I have believed otherwise if the article doesn't tell me?

Now that I know more of the story, I understand why the guy spit on her. And I still think it was a classless thing to do. Nothing you can say will change my mind. Sorry.

Skip Towne
04-20-2005, 07:53 PM
Have you read this thread? You have missed my point completly.

1. No, it doesn't stop people. But it should.
2. Yeah, he's being punished. I think the small fine he'll get is a totally appropriate punishment and I have no objection to the way the police handled it at all.

My ONLY point when I started discussing this is that this guy is CLASSLESS and that bugs me because he's now created a national news story that shows off how we have classless people in KC. I have NO problem with the law's handling of the situation whatsoever, and I've never said anything in this thread that would suggest otherwise.
Man, do you EVER run down?

jcroft
04-20-2005, 08:01 PM
Man, do you EVER run down?

Yeah. I'm definitely tired of this thread. Nice discussion, everyone. :)

BIG_DADDY
04-20-2005, 08:02 PM
Have you read this thread? You have missed my point completly.

1. No, it doesn't stop people. But it should.
2. Yeah, he's being punished. I think the small fine he'll get is a totally appropriate punishment and I have no objection to the way the police handled it at all.

My ONLY point when I started discussing this is that this guy is CLASSLESS and that bugs me because he's now created a national news story that shows off how we have classless people in KC. I have NO problem with the law's handling of the situation whatsoever, and I've never said anything in this thread that would suggest otherwise.

If he had any class he would have wacked her is that what your saying?

stevieray
04-20-2005, 08:04 PM
Dude, you are again, missing my point. Listen carefully while I make it very clear for you.



Now that I know more of the story, I understand why the guy spit on her. And I still think it was a classless thing to do. Nothing you can say will change my mind. Sorry.

lnobody is trying to change you're mind, you're being anal about it.

Go watch Jerry Springer, I'm sure there are plenty of people there who you can freak out over.

I'd understand your obssession if nothing happened to the guy. authorities took care of the situation, sorry that's not good enough for you, if it was, you wouldn't have wasted most of your night to proclaim over and over how much this bothers you.

BIG_DADDY
04-20-2005, 08:12 PM
lnobody is trying to change you're mind, you're being anal about it.

Go watch Jerry Springer, I'm sure there are plenty of people there who you can freak out over.

I'd understand your obssession if nothing happened to the guy. authorities took care of the situation, sorry that's not good enough for you, if it was, you wouldn't have wasted most of your night to proclaim over and over how much this bothers you.

I think he should have pissed in a Gatoraid cup and thrown that on her. Then again I am a pretty classless guy. :)

Boyceofsummer
04-20-2005, 08:42 PM
No, the right to free speech is granted to citizens of this country. However, men and women who fight on behalf of our rights do so to ensure that the rest of us don't have to EARN the right ourselves. This ungrateful twat went beyond protest to advocacy of the enemy. She did PR spots for the North Vietnamese condemning our soldiers for war crimes that were not committed. She felt the ends justified the means and be damned all those who were in captivity and made to listen to her bullshit. So f!ck her right in her treasonous ass, is her book selling in North Vietnam?

The war in Vietnam was not about defending any American interests or rights. It was about paranoia and an inability to accept the fact we were wrong. 100,000 American and French lives washed away. This is the same reasoning used by our government to stockpile over 28,000 nuclear weapons from 1959 to 1962. Vietnam and the cold war was a complete and total waste of economic and human resources. Donít ask for a link, Iíve posted it before on this site.

ENDelt260
04-20-2005, 08:50 PM
Yeah. I'm definitely tired of this thread. Nice discussion, everyone. :)
royrcroft is leaving this thread for real this time guys. He means it.

Frazod
04-20-2005, 08:52 PM
I'm not reading through the whole thread, but as far as I'm concerned, the only thing the guy did wrong was to try to run after he did it (should have known one of her security nazis would nail him).

That f#cking c#nt should have been executed as a traitor decades ago. Nothing that ever happens to her can be bad enough.

DIE YOU EVIL TRAITOROUS F#CKING BITCH! :cuss:

HemiEd
04-20-2005, 09:02 PM
I'm not reading through the whole thread, but as far as I'm concerned, the only thing the guy did wrong was to try to run after he did it (should have known one of her security nazis would nail him).

That f#cking c#nt should have been executed as a traitor decades ago. Nothing that ever happens to her can be bad enough.

DIE YOU EVIL TRAITOROUS F#CKING BITCH! :cuss:

Yep, she is a commy!

Mr. Kotter
04-20-2005, 09:06 PM
I'm not reading through the whole thread, but as far as I'm concerned, the only thing the guy did wrong was to try to run after he did it (should have known one of her security nazis would nail him).

That f#cking c#nt should have been executed as a traitor decades ago. Nothing that ever happens to her can be bad enough.

DIE YOU EVIL TRAITOROUS F#CKING BITCH! :cuss:

Perfect. :thumb:

Although, I'd have preferred a long prison sentence so the prison dykes could have reamed her a few times with large objects...

Logical
04-20-2005, 09:09 PM
Dude, you are again, missing my point. Listen carefully while I make it very clear for you.

Of course Al Queda doesn't represent all Muslims. But plenty of Americans think it does. Why? Because they're stupid. Most of the rest of the world thinks Kansas is a crazy place because we "don't teach evoloution." Of course, that's not really accurate -- but that's what they hear. The rest of the country thinks Kansas just "banned gay marraige." Of course, we know that's not even close to being accurate -- but that's what they hear (either because of bad reporting or selective listening".

I read the article above as someone who knew NOTHING about Fonda's actions in Vietnam. The article above told me some dud spit in her face because of her protest. It didn't tell me a damn thing about what she did in protest. I assumed she held up some signs or something. Why should I have believed otherwise if the article doesn't tell me?

Now that I know more of the story, I understand why the guy spit on her. And I still think it was a classless thing to do. Nothing you can say will change my mind. Sorry.

So we have the arbiter of Class right here in our midst. I will seek you out whenever I value your advice on being classy. Thanks

jcroft
04-20-2005, 09:13 PM
So we have the arbiter of Class right here in our midst. I will seek you out whenever I value your advice on being classy. Thanks

Hah. Rep. That was good. :D

Simplex3
04-20-2005, 09:21 PM
The war in Vietnam was not about defending any American interests or rights. It was about paranoia and an inability to accept the fact we were wrong. 100,000 American and French lives washed away. This is the same reasoning used by our government to stockpile over 28,000 nuclear weapons from 1959 to 1962. Vietnam and the cold war was a complete and total waste of economic and human resources. Donít ask for a link, Iíve posted it before on this site.
As if we needed any further proof that you're a stupid f**king communist.

Vietnam was about keeping one country from taking over another. Pu**ies like you back here in the states putting pressure on the spineless politicians is why a war against a pissant country like North Vietnam cost 100,000 lives. We could have torched the North to the point where feeding themselves was as much work as they could do, then they wouldn't have been so anxious to fight.

As for the nukes, let's say we didn't build any while the Russians built their 30,000+. When they stepped up and said "surreneder or die", what would you have done there smart guy?

ChiTown
04-20-2005, 09:31 PM
He should have taken a crap in one of her books...what a fuggin hole

melbar
04-20-2005, 11:44 PM
Great, another story to make our area look stupid to the rest of the world. Right along with "gay marriage bans," not teaching evolution, and serial killers.
She was the direct cause of death for a few US soldiers being held in captivity , she turned a note pleading for help over to the Vietcong so dont talk to me or anyone else here about class. Good for him and F--- jane fonda.

Boyceofsummer
04-20-2005, 11:58 PM
As if we needed any further proof that you're a stupid f**king communist.

Vietnam was about keeping one country from taking over another. Pu**ies like you back here in the states putting pressure on the spineless politicians is why a war against a pissant country like North Vietnam cost 100,000 lives. We could have torched the North to the point where feeding themselves was as much work as they could do, then they wouldn't have been so anxious to fight.

As for the nukes, let's say we didn't build any while the Russians built their 30,000+. When they stepped up and said "surreneder or die", what would you have done there smart guy?

Mojo Rising
04-21-2005, 12:06 AM
The war in Vietnam was not about defending any American interests or rights. It was about paranoia and an inability to accept the fact we were wrong. 100,000 American and French lives washed away. This is the same reasoning used by our government to stockpile over 28,000 nuclear weapons from 1959 to 1962. Vietnam and the cold war was a complete and total waste of economic and human resources. Donít ask for a link, Iíve posted it before on this site.

Tell that to my daughter whose biological grandpa was shot down by one of the anti-aircraft guns that Fonda planted herself on. He is not with us anymore.

When I was a kid my Dad wouldn't allow Fonda in our house and I didn't understand it. Now I can't believe so many every day people treat her with respect.

I live in SF and always second guess the values of my neighbors (including those 30 minutes south in San Mateo) and I still can't believe in good old Kansas where I grew up with BBQ and football there are this many pinko-commies (that's what my Dad (Red Foreman) called them are in KC.

Go Chiefs! Black Labs Rule! Pit Bulls drool

jcroft
04-21-2005, 01:08 AM
pinko-commies

What does that even MEAN? Am I one? Right now I'm just really drunk. But WTF is a pinko-commie? I'm sincerly curious.

StcChief
04-21-2005, 07:21 AM
I'm no fan of Jane Fonda, neither her acting nor her politics in the 60's. Although speaking out against the Vietnam War was hardly the act of treason many paint it to be, she went above and beyond the threshold of merely exercising free speech rights, and instead became a very active propaganda tool for the enemy that was shooting at our soldiers.

Nevertheless, there's a very limited number of circumstances where I would consider one person spitting in another person's face as anything but classless, disgusting and uncalled for. Getting back at someone for whatever they did 35 years ago isn't likely to qualify unless they ran over your brother or child or something...

So I guess the prisoners who gave her notes about being beaten, starved etc by VC and in turn she gave those note to the VC is doesn't qualify as treason, abading and helping the enemy?

The news like to bury those acts. Being anti-war is one thing.
Helping the enemy is another.

Bring up the treason charges. Let the silver spoon witch rot in prison.

StcChief
04-21-2005, 07:22 AM
I see Jane at future book signings behind a glass screen.

Cntrygal
04-21-2005, 08:58 AM
God forgives the bitch. I'm not required to, I admit I'm a sinner.

HemiEd
04-21-2005, 09:21 AM
What does that even MEAN? Am I one? Right now I'm just really drunk. But WTF is a pinko-commie? I'm sincerly curious.

I think it goes back to the political witch hunts in Washington. Nixon was one of the leaders and built quite a rep for seeking out communists and discrediting them, true or not.

RaiderH8r
04-21-2005, 09:38 AM
The war in Vietnam was not about defending any American interests or rights. It was about paranoia and an inability to accept the fact we were wrong. 100,000 American and French lives washed away. This is the same reasoning used by our government to stockpile over 28,000 nuclear weapons from 1959 to 1962. Vietnam and the cold war was a complete and total waste of economic and human resources. Donít ask for a link, Iíve posted it before on this site.
http://tonova.typepad.com/thesuddencurve/images/kinnison.jpg

"I know that's the popular version of what went on there. I wish I could agree with you but I was there. I wasn't back here in a classroom hoping I was right, thinking about it. I was up to my knees in rice paddies with guns and ammo, slugging it out with Charlie. While pussies like you were back here partying, putting headbands on, doing drugs, and listening to the God damned Beatles albums....Aahhhh AHHHHH!"

-Couldn't find a picture of him in Back to School

BIG_DADDY
04-21-2005, 10:11 AM
Go Chiefs! Black Labs Rule! Pit Bulls drool

Well if you wouldn't walk your lab so close to the pit bull he wouldn't drool. They get hungry you know. ROFL

Calcountry
04-21-2005, 10:42 AM
As if we needed any further proof that you're a stupid f**king communist.

Vietnam was about keeping one country from taking over another. Pu**ies like you back here in the states putting pressure on the spineless politicians is why a war against a pissant country like North Vietnam cost 100,000 lives. We could have torched the North to the point where feeding themselves was as much work as they could do, then they wouldn't have been so anxious to fight.

As for the nukes, let's say we didn't build any while the Russians built their 30,000+. When they stepped up and said "surreneder or die", what would you have done there smart guy?Similar pussies are keeping our boys from doing the job they are trained to do in Iraq.

For instance, I could really give a chit if that inbred chick with the:thumb: leash and collar smoked a cig off of those terrorists ass. No really, she should've had a pinch collar instead.

Mojo Rising
04-21-2005, 10:26 PM
What does that even MEAN? Am I one? Right now I'm just really drunk. But WTF is a pinko-commie? I'm sincerly curious.

It is used to refer to a person sympathetic to the Communist Party and Russia during the Cold War but not an outright Communist. Often used by people on the right to describe leftists. Similar in meaning to "Fellow Traveller". The identification of Communism with "Socialist" red (and with red being the primary color of the flag of the Soviet Union) led to such Cold War phrases as "the Red Menace" and "Red China".

Hence "Pinko," pink being a light red. Also "pinko commie."

BD - Don't get too cocky about Taz. Tank is tough. I have a feeling he would put a beating on Taz similiar to what the Dodgers have done to the over-the-hill gang (aka Barroid & 'da boys; aka the Giants...how'd they get so big anyway?)

Inspector
04-21-2005, 10:44 PM
I guess if you want to be intentionally obtuse, and ignore whether or not she did any harm to servicemen in those days, then you could say he had no right to respond.

Sounds like a business transaction to me. He paid a hundred bucks or whatever a disorderly conduct citation costs, and got to spit on Jane Fonda.

Hell, for that price, people would line up around the block for their turn.

$100???

Heck, where do we sign up?

I might be tempted to blow a few hundred and treat some friends....

BIG_DADDY
04-21-2005, 11:27 PM
BD - Don't get too cocky about Taz. Tank is tough. I have a feeling he would put a beating on Taz similiar to what the Dodgers have done to the over-the-hill gang (aka Barroid & 'da boys; aka the Giants...how'd they get so big anyway?)

I'll give you 10/1 odds.

Mojo Rising
04-21-2005, 11:37 PM
I'll give you 10/1 odds.

Are you sure? Taz has won as many fights as the SF Giants have won Worl Series. Tank took the Blue Ribbon in dock diving at the San Mateo County Outdoor show this Spring. The ribbon is Dodger Blue for first place. It is a clear demonstration of the power in his legs.

Rausch
04-22-2005, 12:09 AM
I'll give you 10/1 odds.

You been watching any of the latest Pride tournaments? Lately they've been twice as competitive and entertaining as UFC...

keg in kc
04-22-2005, 12:12 AM
Similar pussies are keeping our boys from doing the job they are trained to do in Iraq. Swap out "Similar pussies" for "Idiots in Washington who didn't listen to their generals" and you might have a point.

BIG_DADDY
04-22-2005, 01:20 AM
You been watching any of the latest Pride tournaments? Lately they've been twice as competitive and entertaining as UFC...

I like the rules to Pride better as well. I will be ordering the next one this Saturday.

Pants
04-22-2005, 01:25 AM
I like the rules to Pride better as well. I will be ordering the next one this Saturday.

Pride > UFC

I've been downloading a lot of both and I have to say Pride is much, much better. I'm currently at 95% of Fists of Fury. Can't wait to watch that.

Sparhawk
04-22-2005, 06:13 AM
I'm very strongly opinionated. My father, among many other Vietnam Veterans who saw combat hated her for good reason. In fact one friend of mine told me a most interesting story about firing their guns at her ship as it passed them by on the coast. Too bad a bullet didn't hit her. Traitors should be shot!

Wichita Lineman
04-22-2005, 07:28 AM
I'm so glad that this guy did what I'd sooo want to do and probably wouldn't have the balls to do. They should have shot this bitch for a traitor years ago,like they used to. If she hadn't been Henry Fondas daughter it probably wouldn't have been so easy for her. I'd like to see what people would say if someone did that now. This country has a whole different perspective of it's vets today than it did then. Whew I'm glad that's over I was starting to foam at the mouth.