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View Full Version : Sheffield should of been punished


Mr. Laz
04-21-2005, 03:59 PM
after seeing the replays of the Sheffield/beer thing several times ... i think baseball is trying to downplay the issue.


1st point - the fan didn't really even grab for the ball. he kinda swipe out there, but looked more interested in laughing at the guy next to him.

2nd point - Sheffield took a (half) swipe at the fan BEFORE the beer ever hit him.

3rd point - the guy that Sheffield took a swipe at wasn't even the beer guy.... the beer didn't even look like it hit Sheffield either.

4th point - the beer throw looked to me to be a reaction to the swipe.


baseball people tried to portray that as being a fan incident, when really it was Sheffield that started it.




i know, i know .. it's baseball who cares. but its another reason why baseball has problems.

ChiefsCountry
04-21-2005, 04:01 PM
If it was any other team than the Yankees or Red Sox, he would have been suspened. If it was a Royals player who did that at the Metrodome, he would have been suspened.

Pants
04-21-2005, 04:01 PM
WTF does "should of been punished" mean?

|Zach|
04-21-2005, 04:03 PM
I don't think he should have been punished...the guy interfered with the play...made contact with Sheffields face in the middle of it. The idea that he was going for the ball is laughable.

With the adreniline associated with palying sport esp in a big rival game in a stadium like that. Someone making ontact with your face while you are concentrating on something is gonna set you off. I thought he handled it pretty well.

wutamess
04-21-2005, 04:04 PM
Dude Sheffield bent down and the dude took a swipe at his face. What more do you want?

Mr. Laz
04-21-2005, 04:08 PM
Dude Sheffield bent down and the dude took a swipe at his face. What more do you want?

i don't see any swipe at sheffield face ... the baseball was kicking down the wall and the 2 guys were laughing and looking at each other.

if your taking a shot at a guys face your not looking at the guy next to ya. he was goofing around and made a half assed attempt at the ball and WASN'T even looking at sheffield when this supposed shot too place.


sheffield started it and should of been suspended

jspchief
04-21-2005, 04:08 PM
Yea, nevermind that it all happened in the blink of an eye. I'm sure if you were sitting at you desk and an arm swiped just past your face, you'd react in a completely calm manner, making sure of exactly what was going on, all while typing away at your computer.

The guy had a gut reaction in a split second, dealing with something that's completely out of the scope of his everyday job, and still kept his composure and made the play.

HolmeZz
04-21-2005, 04:09 PM
You 'should have' been punished for bad grammar.

vckcchiefs04
04-21-2005, 04:09 PM
after seeing the replays of the Sheffield/beer thing several times ... i think baseball is trying to downplay the issue.


1st point - the fan didn't really even grab for the ball. he kinda swipe out there, but looked more interested in laughing at the guy next to him.

2nd point - Sheffield took a (half) swipe at the fan BEFORE the beer ever hit him.

3rd point - the guy that Sheffield took a swipe at wasn't even the beer guy.... the beer didn't even look like it hit Sheffield either.

4th point - the beer throw looked to me to be a reaction to the swipe.


baseball people tried to portray that as being a fan incident, when really it was Sheffield that started it.




i know, i know .. it's baseball who cares. but its another reason why baseball has problems.
Dude I'm as big a Yankee hater as anyone, but your rather obvious here. Sheffield did nothing wrong.... the guy took a swipe at his head, and the chicken sh!t with the beer threw it at him and then pretended to fall back like he was scared...... come on now, even Boston fans are not pissed off like this.

Pants
04-21-2005, 04:10 PM
You 'should have' been punished for bad grammar.

LOL, look at my post.

|Zach|
04-21-2005, 04:10 PM
i don't see any swipe at sheffield face
:eek:

Saulbadguy
04-21-2005, 04:12 PM
Its baseball. There are 162 games. Suspend him for a couple, and ban the fan from Fenway for life. (I'm pretty sure they already did that.)

wutamess
04-21-2005, 04:14 PM
i don't see any swipe at sheffield face ... the baseball was kicking down the wall and the 2 guys were laughing and looking at each other.

if your taking a shot at a guys face your not looking at the guy next to ya. he was goofing around and made a half assed attempt at the ball and WASN'T even looking at sheffield when this supposed shot too place.


sheffield started it and should of been suspended

I've only seen it once and that looked like he took a swipe at his face instead of the ball. If I've only seen it once, and Gary was involved in the altercation and wasn't even looking at the shot to his face, then I'm glad he handled it the way he did and I totally agree with Sheffield.

Plus you DO have bad grammar.

Chest Rockwell
04-21-2005, 04:15 PM
Its baseball. There are 162 games. Suspend him for a couple, and ban the fan from Fenway for life. (I'm pretty sure they already did that.)

What he said.

But tack on a couple games for being a Yankee, and a couple more because he's Gary Sheffield, and probably deserves it for something else anyway.

jspchief
04-21-2005, 04:15 PM
Its baseball. There are 162 games. Suspend him for a couple, and ban the fan from Fenway for life. (I'm pretty sure they already did that.)

:spock: Suspend him for what?

Mr. Laz
04-21-2005, 04:16 PM
Its baseball. There are 162 games. Suspend him for a couple, and ban the fan from Fenway for life. (I'm pretty sure they already did that.)
they didn't do either

the fan can come back next year and sheffield didn't get any penalty

Digital Takawira
04-21-2005, 04:16 PM
hold on,...

is this about the chiefs?

or the nfl draft?

or football in general?

no?

then who cares? its f'ing baseball.

Saulbadguy
04-21-2005, 04:16 PM
:spock: Suspend him for what?
Swiping at a fan.

Mr. Laz
04-21-2005, 04:17 PM
I've only seen it once
then maybe you should see it a couple more times before you argue about it

Saggysack
04-21-2005, 04:18 PM
There is no excuse for fan interference. None whatsoever.

Saulbadguy
04-21-2005, 04:18 PM
they didn't do either

the fan can come back next year and sheffield didn't get any penalty
I must have misheard something yesterday on the radio. I heard the fan was banned from Fenway. Maybe he was just ejected from that game.

ANY fan who interferes with the field of play in any manner should be automatically banned for life, not only from that stadium, but from all MLB stadiums.

Pants
04-21-2005, 04:19 PM
I must have misheard something yesterday on the radio. I heard the fan was banned from Fenway. Maybe he was just ejected from that game.

ANY fan who interferes with the field of play in any manner should be automatically banned for life, not only from that stadium, but from all MLB stadiums.

BANNED FRO LIFE FORM EVRYTHING!!!!!oneone``1

Saulbadguy
04-21-2005, 04:21 PM
BANNED FRO LIFE FORM EVRYTHING!!!!!oneone``1
IP B4N! ROFLZZL!!ERR111

wutamess
04-21-2005, 04:23 PM
then maybe you should see it a couple more times before you argue about it

Look dumbass (In a nice kinda way sir).:thumb:
If I seen it once and it looked like a swipe at the face, what do you think Sheffield is going to think and he didn't even see it coming?

Think about it and let it marinate if you still have questions, I can probably draw you a map or diagram a ply by play for you or something.

jspchief
04-21-2005, 04:23 PM
Swiping at a fan. For a reflex respnse to a fan taking a swing at him?

For the record, I don't think the fan had any malice in his actions. I think it was some drunk fool that was going to grab a foul, then realized what he was doing and "pulled out".

Unfortunately, for a player in the heat of the game, in the opposing stadium of a bitter rival, there is no slow motion replay. It's just him running hard to make a play, and an arm swinging past his face. It's a natural reaction to swing back. As soon as he got a handle on the situation, he restrained himself.

Considering what happened in that Royals vs White Sox game a few years back, I don't think it's that far fetched for a defense mechanism to kick in for a split second.

Saulbadguy
04-21-2005, 04:24 PM
Also, Gary has a history of this sort of behavior in Fenway. Its simply unacceptable.

Valiant
04-21-2005, 04:32 PM
I don't think he should have been punished...the guy interfered with the play...made contact with Sheffields face in the middle of it. The idea that he was going for the ball is laughable.

With the adreniline associated with palying sport esp in a big rival game in a stadium like that. Someone making ontact with your face while you are concentrating on something is gonna set you off. I thought he handled it pretty well.


100% agree...

tk13
04-21-2005, 04:43 PM
I don't think the fan was going for the ball. Certainly didn't look like it... the Boston Sports Guy, Bill Simmons, even defended Sheffield. He said those right field bleachers are a war zone out there during Yankee games, people getting drunk, going nuts, yelling things at the Yankee RF. If you went into that corner and got hit in the face, I think most of us would not react kindly or think it was friendly. I don't think most people would consider it an accident to begin with, then you consider who was playing and the rivalry between them, I think it's amazing something worse didn't happen.

penchief
04-21-2005, 05:27 PM
after seeing the replays of the Sheffield/beer thing several times ... i think baseball is trying to downplay the issue.

I'm going to preface this by saying that I have been a Yankee fan since 1968. I will also say that I was not thrilled by their signing of Sheffield. I will admit that I had a bias for the class exhibited by players like Bernie, Jeter, Mariano Rivera, Andy Pettitte, Paul O'Neill, Jorge Posada, Tino, etc. My impression of Sheffield was that he was a selfish player. I was wrong. Since being with the Yankees, he has proven to me that he is not only a team player but a true gamer.


1st point - the fan didn't really even grab for the ball. he kinda swipe out there, but looked more interested in laughing at the guy next to him.

I agree that he was not going for the ball. I disagree with the rest. If he wasn't going for the ball what was he trying to do? The only reasonable explanation is that he was trying to intentionally interfere with the play. I'm not prepared to say that he intentionally smacked Sheffield in the face but he did hit him in the face. Intentionally swiping at Sheffield in order to interfere with the play was a bad move all the way around. Sheffield was in the heat of the moment, concentrating on fielding the ball, and had no way of knowing if the smack was intentional or not. Even if it wasn't, he had every reason to be shocked.


2nd point - Sheffield took a (half) swipe at the fan BEFORE the beer ever hit him.

That's right...he took a half swipe.... out of impulse, without thinking. He didn't know what the situation was until he looked up. He used both hands to swipe while holding on to the ball with glove and hand (i.e. to defend himself, retaliate, create a buffer, etc.). Once he realized that there was no serious threat he turned, threw the ball in, and then expressed his anger.


3rd point - the guy that Sheffield took a swipe at wasn't even the beer guy.... the beer didn't even look like it hit Sheffield either.

Sheffield didn't even know that a beer was thrown at him. He was only aware of the dude that hit him in the face. Only after watching the replay himself did he realize that another dude threw a beer. Upon closer review, it does appear that the dude that threw the beer fiegned clumsiness in an intentional effort to escalate.


4th point - the beer throw looked to me to be a reaction to the swipe.

I absolutely agree. But it was still an intentional escalation and totally uncalled for.


baseball people tried to portray that as being a fan incident, when really it was Sheffield that started it.

Bullshit.

Normally I find your posts to be very reasonable and well thought out. I don't know what to think about this one other than the possibility that you are a Yankee-hater, which is perfectly understandable.

It WAS a fan incident. The fan intentionally interfered with a play and unintentionally hit a player in the face, with the only reason being that it is a heated rivalry in which fans act stupid (especially after a few beers). Boston is probably second only to Philadelphia when it comes to abusive fans. Even though Philly fans are more abusive to their own teams. The league did the right thing by revoking the swipers season tickets and by not allowing the beer-thrower to purchase any more tickets (even though he'll just have a friend do it).


i know, i know .. it's baseball who cares. but its another reason why baseball has problems.

I agree. Between beanballs, inflammatory rhetoric, and intrusive/abusive fans, something has to be done about the conduct of the Red Sox Nation.

Deberg_1990
04-21-2005, 05:28 PM
I still havent seen the video....anybody got a link to it?

jcroft
04-21-2005, 05:39 PM
I don't think he should have been suspended. Whether the guy meant to go after Sheffield or not is irrlelvant. He DID interfere with the play, intentional or not. All Shef did was push him with a "get out my way, dude" attitude and then say a few words. Shef would have had no right to punch the guy, but pushing him wasn't out of line. Fans know they can't interfere with the play.

Question -- if the Cubs player had pushed Steve Bartman, would that have been okay?

ChiefsCountry
04-21-2005, 05:42 PM
I know the guy did interfere with the play but Shefield should have been professional about it and not went into stands after him.

Chest Rockwell
04-21-2005, 05:43 PM
Question -- if the Cubs player had pushed Steve Bartman, would that have been okay?

I know what you're getting at, but it's apples to oranges: The Sox fan interferred with a ball in the field of play; The Bartman play was out of the field of play (i.e., in the stands), he just didn't do the smart home fan thing and get as far out of the way as he could have.

In these cases, Sheffield has a MUCH larger beef than Alou.

Mr. Laz
04-21-2005, 05:46 PM
Question -- if the Cubs player had pushed Steve Bartman, would that have been okay?

absolutely not

jcroft
04-21-2005, 05:52 PM
I know what you're getting at, but it's apples to oranges: The Sox fan interferred with a ball in the field of play; The Bartman play was out of the field of play (i.e., in the stands), he just didn't do the smart home fan thing and get as far out of the way as he could have.

In these cases, Sheffield has a MUCH larger beef than Alou.

Good point.

jcroft
04-21-2005, 05:53 PM
absolutely not

Well, at least you are consistent. :)

jcroft
04-21-2005, 05:53 PM
I know the guy did interfere with the play but Shefield should have been professional about it and not went into stands after him.

I don't think I'd say he "went into the stands." He just gave the guy a little shove. He never left the field. He reached into the stands, I guess, but then again -- the guy reached into the field of play (fans do it all the time).

Sure-Oz
04-21-2005, 06:02 PM
The dude smacked him in the face, intentional or not, doesn't matter, Sheff. gave a shove back and composed himself, natural reaction, i think he is fine. I don't know about the fan losing ALL of his tickets for the season but anyway.

whoman69
04-21-2005, 07:31 PM
Let me state first off that I hate the Yankees as much as I hate the Raiders. That said I don't think you can suspend a player for human nature. You're minding your own business and somebody smacks you in the face, any man would retaliate. He should be commended for keeping it as far as he did. The beer didn't have anything to do it. I'm sure that every player that has made a run towards the stands has had a beer spilled on them. I don't think the guy in the stands was trying to hit Sheffield, but he deserves getting his tickets taken because he knows when you get into the field of play, you're wrong.

Chest Rockwell
04-22-2005, 10:59 AM
Not that anyone really probably cares, but here's my take.

It's a difficult situation, I think Sheffield did a commendable job regaining his composure before he did anything too wrong. I understand the reaction. That said, I love MLB, always have, and I don't want to see it turn into the joke the NBA has become.

There's a couple of elements that go into this, and I'm not sure that MLB currently has the sack to step up and do what I feel is right in this situation. You could tell the intial reaction of Shef was to go into the stands (or at least go after the fan), even though he didn't. That has to be changed. I'm not saying he was wrong or right, I'm just saying that MLB has to create an atmosphere where the player's first reaction is not to go after the fan, or better yet, where fans don't even harbor the notion of doing what that jackass did. The only way to get to either of those points is punishment for everyone involved.

Like I said, I think Shef did a good job of reigning in his emotions, but any time the first reaction is to go after the fan, some punishment should be enacted. A suspension and a fine that is deemed appropriate for the event. For this, I'd think a game or two and say 5-10k. Not much at all, just a little "No, no! Bad!".

MLB needs to create an atmosphere where the players are comfortable, feel safe, and know the fan(s) will be taken care of. Any instance of interference with a live ball in the field of play should result in the fan being banned in the same way a player is suspended/fined, that is depending on the severity of the interaction. Sounds harsh...it is, and that's the way it has to be to eliminate these instances. I was watching the Cards/Cubs the other night, guy grabs a fair ball down the left field line, making it a "fan interference double." That guy should be done watching games in MLB parks for a year. Sure, no players were around, but he interferred with a ball in the field of play. That's a no-no, and it should be enforced, and probably over enforced (I'm sure someone will play Devil's Advocate here and say "but what if it's a kid?" First offense I'd be inclined to have club or MLB officials have a nice heart-to-heart (read: come to Jesus meeting) with kids under 12 so they understand the seriousness of what they've done. 12 and over or repeat offenders and tough luck Junior, see you next year. Granted I'm a crotchety old asshole, so YMMV.) Any instances of fan interferrence involving a player that could be construed as an "attack" on the player, such as the Sheffield incident, the fan should be banned for life.

IMO, the key here is to eliminate the first reaction of the player being going after the fan. Even though nothing happend, that was Shef's first reaction, and that HAS to be changed. I think the only way you do that is for players to know they'll be punished for it AND, more importantly, the fan will be taken care of. The whole key is to let fans know MLB is serious about this, and have them to err WAAAAAAY on the side of caution.