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ArrowheadHawk
05-16-2005, 04:38 PM
GRETZ: Time for Options

May 16, 2005, 4:18:10 PM by Bob Gretz (http://www.kcchiefs.com/news/bob_gretz/)




How about the Kansas Chiefs?


Whatís that you say, Iíve left out a word when talking about Lamar Huntís football team? Shouldnít it be Kansas City Chiefs?
Well yes, it has been, at least since 1963. But after the actions last week of the Missouri House of Representatives, it might be time for the Hunt family to consider other options when it comes to the stadium of the future for its team.
Like, across the state line in Kansas, maybe some place like Wyandotte County where theyíve built a track for auto racing, a minor-league baseball stadium and a major shopping area. On top of that, they are in the running for the NASCAR Hall of Fame. It seems these folks in the Sunflower State are the ones who can get things done.
The Missouri Legislature cannot, at least when it comes to helping the stadium situations with the Royals and Chiefs. They showed that again when Senate Bill 269 died on the legislative vine on Friday without reaching the floor of the House for a vote.
Known as the Athletes and Entertainers Tax, the proposal would have been a giant step in helping Jackson County with the leases for the Chiefs and Royals. But after much lobbying and discussion, a vote was never taken, as House leaders killed the idea.
The bill made sense. Here are the basics: Athletes and entertainers who perform in Missouri pay tax on the income they make for that game or appearance. When the Indianapolis Colts played at Arrowhead Stadium last year, Peyton Manning had to pay the state a portion of whatever his game check was for that week. So did his teammates, and the other NFL teams that played at Arrowhead. And, the other major league baseball teams that played at Kaufman Stadium. When this tax was original enacted, the revenue went towards cultural activities in the state. But three years ago, former Governor Bob Holden diverted the money into the stateís general fund to cover revenue shortages. This newest proposal would have returned the funds to cultural activities, while earmarking increases in the tax revenue towards stadium issues in Kansas City and St. Louis. This would have provided as much as $10 million to Jackson County to pay for improvements required under the leases for the Royals and Chiefs. I would have also provided more state money towards paying off the debt that went into building the dome in St. Louis.Letís recap: itís not a new tax, it doesnít affect the average taxpayer in Missouri as it falls on visitors. Athletes would help pay for the buildings they play in. It provided funds for both sides of the state and it returns tax revenue to where it was originally intended, helping cultural activities like the Negro Leagues Hall of Fame. Why would any legislator be against that?
For some reason, not even the entire Jackson County contingent in the House was behind this bill. There was lobbying done by downtown stadium interests in Kansas City against the bill. Some House members in northwest Missouri, especially Rep. Brad Lager R-Maryville worked against the bill, even though the Chiefs dangled moving training camp to St. Joseph.
They say that watching the political process is a lot like watching sausage made; itís better that you donít know how itís done. Thatís certainly the case with the antics of Missouri legislators.
What remains is this: the stadiums are falling apart. Infrastructure repairs must be made; improvements and additions are necessary for both buildings to reach ďstate of the artĒ status, as the leases read. Thereís about 20 months or so before the teams could be free of any commitment to the Sports Complex. Thatís a simple fact of life.
The opponents of this proposal donít take seriously the threat that they may lose the Royals and Chiefs. Neither franchise has thrown that trump card on the table.
Soon it may be time. Normally, the state line that divides Kansas and Missouri is a hindrance to getting things done. In this case, it may be time for the teams to use it to their advantage. Both are in the unique situation that they could leave the state of Missouri, while not leaving their market. The National Football League and Major League Baseball wouldnít blink twice if the address moved from one state to another. Thereís no indication that things would be better in dealing with the folks in Topeka. But somehow, some way, the folks in Wyandotte County get things done.
And thatís whatís necessary here; people who get things done, not a Legislature that waits until there is a crisis, before making a move.
Itís time to consider the Kansas Chiefs.
The opinions offered in this column do not necessarily reflect those of the Kansas City Chiefs.
<HR>
A former beat reporter who covered the Pittsburgh Steelers during their glory years, Gretz covered the Chiefs for the Kansas City Star for nine years before heading up KCFX-FM's sports department. He is a member of the Pro Football Hall of Fame's Board of Selectors. His column appears three times a week during the season.



http://www.kcchiefs.com/news/2005/05/16/gretz_time_for_options/

tomahawk kid
05-16-2005, 04:48 PM
Shit.

JackCo is going to f#ck around and lose the gaddamed team to KS.

What a bunch of idiots. You can thank Kevin Keitzman for the downtown baseball bullshit. Just another reason to revile that loser.

ArrowheadHawk
05-16-2005, 04:49 PM
who is JackCo?

tomahawk kid
05-16-2005, 04:50 PM
who is JackCo?

Jackson County

ArrowheadHawk
05-16-2005, 04:50 PM
Jackson Countyoic

|Zach|
05-16-2005, 04:50 PM
:Lin:

tomahawk kid
05-16-2005, 04:51 PM
:Lin:

Exactly.

Count Zarth
05-16-2005, 04:52 PM
Kansas City one way or the other is fine with me.

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 04:54 PM
:Lin:

But Zach, you could make a weekend out of it and catch a Jayhawk, Wildcat or Shocker game and drive on good roads. :)

ArrowheadHawk
05-16-2005, 04:55 PM
But Zach, you could make a weekend out of it and catch a Jayhawk, Wilcat or Shocker game and drive on good roads. :):thumb:

SNR
05-16-2005, 05:02 PM
If I lived in Missouri, I'd count my blessings. Obviously I would want the Chiefs to stay in my state, but I would also be thankful that it's the possibility of moving it across one state line, not several state lines.

Meaning better Kansas than California.

beer bacon
05-16-2005, 05:19 PM
If I lived in Missouri, I'd count my blessings. Obviously I would want the Chiefs to stay in my state, but I would also be thankful that it's the possibility of moving it across one state line, not several state lines.

Meaning better Kansas than California.

The only problem is that for many people the two states are gigantic rivals. Geographically it would be better, but it would be worse in many other ways.

It would alienate a large portion of the Chief's fanbase. Zach's puking smiley describes my feelings on this matter quite succinctly.

Skip Towne
05-16-2005, 05:20 PM
The Kansas Chiefs sounds good. And best of all it would force Frazod to go to Kansas to attend Chiefs games. Heh

Count Zarth
05-16-2005, 05:25 PM
The Kansas Chiefs sounds good. And best of all it would force Frazod to go to Kansas to attend Chiefs games. Heh

Hilarious! Rep!

SNR
05-16-2005, 05:26 PM
The only problem is that for many people the two states are gigantic rivals. Geographically it would be better, but it would be worse in many other ways.

It would alienate a large portion of the Chief's fanbase. Zach's puking smiley describes my feelings on this matter quite succinctly.Obviously people who live in Kansas don't have a problem going over to your smelly state to watch the Chiefs :p

beer bacon
05-16-2005, 05:28 PM
Obviously people who live in Kansas don't have a problem going over to your smelly state to watch the Chiefs :p

They would if Kansas decided to play all their games in Columbia. There is a difference between having your hometown team being transplanted to being your rival's hometown team, and never having that team being your hometown team at all.

Count Zarth
05-16-2005, 05:30 PM
What the hell does Missouri have that makes it so much better than Kansas?

beer bacon
05-16-2005, 05:31 PM
What the hell does Missouri have that makes it so much better than Kansas?

Missourians.

|Zach|
05-16-2005, 05:31 PM
What the hell does Missouri have that makes it so much better than Kansas?

Trees.

4th and Long
05-16-2005, 05:32 PM
Hills.

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 05:33 PM
The only problem is that for many people the two states aregigantic rivals. Geographically it would be better, but it would be worse in many other ways.

It would alienate a large portion of the Chief's fanbase. Zach's puking smiley describes my feelings on this matter quite succinctly.


But I do not understand? :doh!: I lived in Kansas for forty years. How could they possibly be rivals. They do not compete in anything. Kansas has College teams and Missouri has Pro Teams. ROFL

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 05:35 PM
Trees.


But you can go inside to take a leak in Kansas.

Count Zarth
05-16-2005, 05:37 PM
Hills, Trees and People. Got it.

beer bacon
05-16-2005, 05:38 PM
Hills, Trees and People. Got it.

It is much more impressive in person. It doesn't translate well to type.

|Zach|
05-16-2005, 05:39 PM
It is much more impressive in person. It doesn't translate well to type.

Ha, indeed.

Count Zarth
05-16-2005, 05:40 PM
It is much more impressive in person. It doesn't translate well to type.

Seriously, I've been to Missouri many times and liked it. I've been to Kansas a couple times and...well, I can't really remember anything about it.

Edit: Oh, I DID pick up a friend of my dad's to go to a Chiefs game. He lived in the Kansas part of Kansas City. It didn't seem all that bad.

beer bacon
05-16-2005, 05:41 PM
Seriously, I've been to Missouri many times and liked it. I've been to Kansas a couple times and...well, I can't really remember anything about it.

Edit: Oh, I DID pick up a friend of my dad's to go to a Chiefs game. He lived in the Kansas part of Kansas City. It didn't seem all that bad.

Kansas has the world's biggest ball of yarn.

beer bacon
05-16-2005, 05:42 PM
The Kansas Chiefs sounds good. And best of all it would force Frazod to go to Kansas to attend Chiefs games. Heh

We need a repairman or something. Skip is stuck on repeat.

Count Zarth
05-16-2005, 05:43 PM
The Kansas Chiefs sounds good. And best of all it would force Frazod to go to Kansas to attend Chiefs games. Heh

Replarious!

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 05:44 PM
Kansas has the world's biggest ball of yarn.

don't forget the deepest hand dug well, the barbed wire museum and Wizard of Oz joint in Liberal. Oh and Brutus, that big ass crane.

ENDelt260
05-16-2005, 05:44 PM
F*ck Kansas.

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 05:46 PM
F*ck Kansas.

ROFL I wondered when you would show up. ROFL

chiefs4me
05-16-2005, 05:46 PM
The Kansas Chiefs sounds good. And best of all it would force Frazod to go to Kansas to attend Chiefs games. Heh





go wash out your mouth...and yes, how about those KC Chiefs...PBJ

Count Zarth
05-16-2005, 05:53 PM
I guess I just don't understand all this Kansas hate. I wish I was a real missourian.

4th and Long
05-16-2005, 05:55 PM
Kansas has the world's biggest ball of yarn.
And Prairie Dogs ... until the Pastor comes along and blows them to smithereens that is.

dtebbe
05-16-2005, 05:56 PM
F*ck Kansas.

I double that sentiment!

KUCK FANSAS!

DT

beer bacon
05-16-2005, 05:56 PM
I guess I just don't understand all this Kansas hate. I wish I was a real missourian.

Mizzou and Kansas are huge rivals. Picture the Chiefs and Broncos, except Kansas and Missouri actually went to war and killed each other during the Civil War.

ENDelt260
05-16-2005, 05:59 PM
I always heard there were three kinds of suns in Kansas, sunshine, sunflowers, and sons-of-bitches.

gblowfish
05-16-2005, 05:59 PM
If the Chiefs move, it won't be to Kansas, it'll be to LA or another city.

Look, the vast majority of rich pukes in Metro KC live in Johnson County, KS. They live there because they're tight with a dime. They don't want to pay squat to help the community, they just want to live close by and weasel in to use stuff that OTHER taxpayers have paid for. Then they want to bitch about the condition of the roads and stadium.

Jackson County has the sports complex, Nelson Art Gallery, UMKC, Kemper Arena, the new Sprint Arena, Municipal Auditorium;
Platte County has the airport;
Clay County has Worlds of Fun;
Wyandotte County has the Speedway and Verizon Theater
Johnson County: BUPKUS for the rest of the community.

They like letting regular working stiffs pay the freight, then bitch. And what really cheezes me off is the JoCo fatcats have the majority of season tickets between the 20's and in the gold section.

I live, work and pay taxes in Jackson County. I'm proud to live here, I'm proud to have built the Sports Complex here, for the good of the whole Metro. We put our money where our mouth is. We'll get it done, just like we always get it done. And Johnson County will put the money in their trust funds and green fees and bitch about the roads in Missouri...as usual.

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 06:00 PM
Mizzou and Kansas are huge rivals. Picture the Chiefs and Broncos, except Kansas and Missouri actually went to war and killed each other during the Civil War.


But, But that was almost 150 years ago for Christ sake. I have never felt any more comtempt for Missouri than I have for Arkansas or Oklahoma. Just good natured ribbing, hell I am planning on retiring in Missiouri. I will probably be tired of College sports by then anyway. :)

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 06:03 PM
I always heard there were three kinds of suns in Kansas, sunshine, sunflowers, and sons-of-bitches.


I can personally vouch for that, I have witnessed each one of them there.

beer bacon
05-16-2005, 06:03 PM
But, But that was almost 250 years ago for Christ sake. I have never felt any more comtempt for Missouri than I have for Arkansas or Oklahoma. Just good natured ribbing, hell I am planning on retiring in Missiouri. I will probably be tired of College sports by then anyway. :)

150 years thank you very much. You won't fool me with your silver tongue you wretched son of Kansas! I am on to yoU!

gblowfish
05-16-2005, 06:06 PM
But, But that was almost 250 years ago for Christ sake. Not quite, Sparky. Lawrence burned 148 years ago. August 21, 1863 to be exact. Kansas was called "Bloody Kansas" because of guerilla warfare between the Missouri and Kansas side for ten years prior to that. Jayhawkers attacked innocent Missouri Farmers (see movie "Outlaw Josie Wales") pro-slavery Missourians massacred Kansans (see Marias Des Cynes Massacre) and the high point of the violence was Quantrill's raid on Lawrence in 1863, killing mostly women and children. Both sides were equally culpable in war atrocities. It was a bad bad time to live in this area.

Here's a quick brief on Quantrill:
http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/HNS/Kansas/quantril.html

Count Zarth
05-16-2005, 06:07 PM
Mizzou and Kansas are huge rivals. Picture the Chiefs and Broncos, except Kansas and Missouri actually went to war and killed each other during the Civil War.

I'll have to ask my uncle and/or cousin sometime.

Ari Chi3fs
05-16-2005, 06:07 PM
If the Chiefs go anywhere... i would like them to go to Kansas City Kansas, and keep them as the Kansas City Chiefs.

OP doesnt need the CHiefs. There are a lot of stuck up bastards here in this city, Gblowfish hit it on the head with his post.

The team should stay where it is, Arrowhead needs love. I would HATE to see Arrowhead demolished for another stadium over by the NAscar track... But I would rather Arrowhead2 and the CHiefs be by the NASCAR track in KCK than with the cock gobblers in Los ANgeles

Skip Towne
05-16-2005, 06:07 PM
If the Chiefs move, it won't be to Kansas, it'll be to LA or another city.

Look, the vast majority of rich pukes in Metro KC live in Johnson County, KS. They live there because they're tight with a dime. They don't want to pay squat to help the community, they just want to live close by and weasel in to use stuff that OTHER taxpayers have paid for. Then they want to bitch about the condition of the roads and stadium.

Jackson County has the sports complex, Nelson Art Gallery, UMKC, Kemper Arena, the new Sprint Arena, Municipal Auditorium;
Platte County has the airport;
Clay County has Worlds of Fun;
Wyandotte County has the Speedway and Verizon Theater
Johnson County: BUPKUS for the rest of the community.

They like letting regular working stiffs pay the freight, then bitch. And what really cheezes me off is the JoCo fatcats have the majority of season tickets between the 20's and in the gold section.

I live, work and pay taxes in Jackson County. I'm proud to live here, I'm proud to have built the Sports Complex here, for the good of the whole Metro. We put our money where our mouth is. We'll get it done, just like we always get it done. And Johnson County will put the money in their trust funds and green fees and bitch about the roads in Missouri...as usual.
Why not let the riff raff do the heavy lifting? If He didn't want 'em sheared, He wouldn't have made 'em sheep.

beer bacon
05-16-2005, 06:09 PM
Not quite, Sparky. Lawrence burned 148 years ago. August 21, 1863 to be exact. Kansas was called "Bloody Kansas" because of guerilla warfare between the Missouri and Kansas side for ten years prior to that. Jayhawkers attacked innocent Missouri Farmers (see movie "Outlaw Josie Wales") pro-slavery Missourians massacred Kansans (see Marias Des Cynes Massacre) and the high point of the violence was Quantrill's raid on Lawrence in 1863, killing mostly women and children. Both sides were equally culpable in war atrocities. It was a bad bad time to live in this area.

Here's a quick brief on Quantrill:
http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/HNS/Kansas/quantril.html

To say that Quantill was an asshole would be a monumental understatement. I have a friend that did his senior thesis on him.

gblowfish
05-16-2005, 06:09 PM
Why not let the riff raff do the heavy lifting? If He didn't want 'em sheared, He wouldn't have made 'em sheep.Skip, I think I'm gonna start calling you "Thurston Howell III".

4th and Long
05-16-2005, 06:10 PM
Jayhawkers attacked innocent Missouri Farmers (see movie "Outlaw Josie Wales"
Well ... that was just wrong of them. And you wonder why we hate Kansas? :p
pro-slavery Missourians massacred Kansans (see Marias Des Cynes Massacre)
I think it was payback for killing the innocent farmers myself. :)
and the high point of the violence was Quantrill's raid on Lawrence in 1863, killing mostly women and children.
i.e., Kansas got it's ass kicked again.

:D

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 06:11 PM
150 years thank you very much. You won't fool me with your silver tongue you wretched son of Kansas! I am on to yoU!


Oops I hate it when I lose a 100 years. ROFL

4th and Long
05-16-2005, 06:14 PM
Oops I hate it when I lose a 100 years. ROFL
You'll have to excuse Ed. He either had alzheimers or amnesia ... he just can't remember which one.

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 06:15 PM
If the Chiefs go anywhere... i would like them to go to Kansas City Kansas, and keep them as the Kansas City Chiefs.

OP doesnt need the CHiefs. There are a lot of stuck up bastards here in this city, Gblowfish hit it on the head with his post.

The team should stay where it is, Arrowhead needs love. I would HATE to see Arrowhead demolished for another stadium over by the NAscar track... But I would rather Arrowhead2 and the CHiefs be by the NASCAR track in KCK than with the cock gobblers in Los ANgeles


Honestly, me too. It sickens me to think of Arrowhead not being the home of the Chiefs. It is part of the lore. I wish Jackson County would just pony up and do the right thing.

beer bacon
05-16-2005, 06:19 PM
Honestly, me too. It sickens me to think of Arrowhead not being the home of the Chiefs. It is part of the lore. I wish Jackson County would just pony up and do the right thing.

Our government officials over here pretty are inefficient. With our luck we will pass a bill to renovate Arrowhead, but our officials will find a way to **** it up.

Maybe if they can do well on the downtown renovation it can be a turning point. There was a time not too long ago when KC, MO had a reputation opposite to the one it has today.

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 06:20 PM
Not quite, Sparky. Lawrence burned 148 years ago. August 21, 1863 to be exact. http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/HNS/Kansas/quantril.html

So that would make this year 2011? I really am losing track of time.
1863
148
-----
2011

gblowfish
05-16-2005, 06:24 PM
So that would make this year 2011? I really am losing track of time.
1863
148
-----
2011OK, touchť. 142 years ago. Hey, I was a liberal arts major...

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 06:27 PM
OK, touchť. 142 years ago. Hey, I was a liberal arts major...

Well at least it was only a six year deal and not a hundred! :)

KcMizzou
05-16-2005, 06:36 PM
If I lived in Missouri, I'd count my blessings. Obviously I would want the Chiefs to stay in my state, but I would also be thankful that it's the possibility of moving it across one state line, not several state lines.

Meaning better Kansas than California. That's how I feel about it. I wouldn't be thrilled... but I'd deal with it as long as they were still local.

beer bacon
05-16-2005, 06:37 PM
That's how I feel about it. I wouldn't be thrilled... but I'd deal with it as long as they were still local.

Traitor.

KcMizzou
05-16-2005, 06:39 PM
Traitor.Meh... the Chiefs are #1 on my list. Don't worry.. I wont be attending any Gayhawk games any time soon.

gblowfish
05-16-2005, 06:40 PM
Follow up on Quantrill's raid of Lawrence: Some historians say people were killed regardless, men, women & children. Other say the Bushwhackers just killed men, and that the women & children were spared. It was basically pillage and plunder, and I guess what really happened depended on who was writing the history book. Good example of potential "revisionist history". The story depends on who's side of the state line you supported...

Skip Towne
05-16-2005, 06:43 PM
Skip, I think I'm gonna start calling you "Thurston Howell III".
Sounds good :thumb:

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 07:31 PM
Well ... that was just wrong of them. And you wonder why we hate Kansas? :p

I think it was payback for killing the innocent farmers myself. :)

i.e., Kansas got it's ass kicked again.

:D


4th, are you from Missouri? :rolleyes:

Brock
05-16-2005, 07:40 PM
That would be friggin awesome.

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 07:42 PM
That would be friggin awesome.


Where were you earlier, I was being ganged up on!

Brock
05-16-2005, 07:43 PM
Where were you earlier, I was being ganged up on!

By a bunch of Missourians. That's a mismatch in your favor.

HemiEd
05-16-2005, 07:48 PM
By a bunch of Missourians. That's a mismatch in your favor.

Yep, it was a lot of fun. Good times. :D

JimNasium
05-16-2005, 07:49 PM
Kansas has the world's biggest ball of yarn.
I'm pretty sure that is now in Branson so Missouri has that going for it, which is nice.

|Zach|
05-16-2005, 07:51 PM
I'm pretty sure that is now in Branson so Missouri has that going for it, which is nice.
http://www.yakov.com/

Count Zarth
05-16-2005, 07:54 PM
Branson is the shiznit. I saw Ray Stevens there when I was a small child. I have a bunch of his music now and I know several tunes by heart, including "Mississipi Squirrel Revival," "Bridget the Midget" and "The Streak." In fact, on occasion, if you are very, very nice to me, I might entertain with my flawless Ray Stevens lip syncing.

ENDelt260
05-17-2005, 12:07 AM
I would HATE to see Arrowhead demolished

Agreed. I hope folks can get their shit together and get a good renovation for it. It's a beautiful stadium, with sentimental value for a lot people. Good natured Kansas ribbing aside, if the Chiefs were playing in a complete shithole, and the best option was on the other side of the border, I could get over it. I just think Arrowhead (and the K as well) are too nice to just throw away.

ENDelt260
05-17-2005, 12:10 AM
OK, touchť. 142 years ago. Hey, I was a liberal arts major...
At Mizzou no less. Heck, you're lucky to be able to tie your shoes.

Oh, shit... I forgot, I'm supposed to be showing Missouri solidarity on this thread. No time for pointing out that most columbia graduates couldn't shine the shoes of Rolla dropouts.

ENDelt260
05-17-2005, 12:13 AM
I guess what really happened depended on who was writing the history book.

As with most wars. Or, history in general, I guess.

tk13
05-17-2005, 12:16 AM
As with most wars. Or, history in general, I guess.
That is generally true. Either way, I hope we can get this stadium deal done so we can focus on winning our 10th straight Super Bowl.

ENDelt260
05-17-2005, 12:23 AM
BTW, I stopped my Tivo fast forwarding the other day to watch the Creepy King vs. Darth staredown and was disappointed. You oversold it. I'm never watching a commercial again.

OTOH, that gal you mentioned as being cute on Jeopardy is in the semis. I hope she makes it to the Ken round. She's the only gal left.

chappy
05-17-2005, 12:28 AM
i would be upset if the chiefs moved from arrowhead but i would rather them move to kansas then move to LA so all the gays can watch my team.

tk13
05-17-2005, 12:30 AM
BTW, I stopped my Tivo fast forwarding the other day to watch the Creepy King vs. Darth staredown and was disappointed. You oversold it. I'm never watching a commercial again.

OTOH, that gal you mentioned as being cute on Jeopardy is in the semis. I hope she makes it to the Ken round. She's the only gal left.
I didn't oversell it! Maybe since the surprise was gone it wasn't as good. That's my fault.

Yeah I know she's in the semi's, I started a Jeopardy thread about it since it starts tomorrow. I'm not sure she has a chance in hell though, the two people she's playing against might be two of the best players in the game's history.

ENDelt260
05-17-2005, 12:42 AM
I didn't oversell it!

Your posts had me believing Darth would buckle at the end. They just stared at each other for 20 seconds and it was over. You definitely over sold it.

Rausch
05-17-2005, 12:45 AM
Don't kid yourself, Lamar is tired of playing the red-headed-stepchild to the Cards.

He will NOT put his kids in a financial bind as far as the Chiefs are concerned. And I don't blame him...

tk13
05-17-2005, 12:59 AM
Your posts had me believing Darth would buckle at the end. They just stared at each other for 20 seconds and it was over. You definitely over sold it.
That's because the commercial didn't last 5 extra seconds! Darth was about to cower.

Logical
05-17-2005, 01:04 AM
i would be upset if the chiefs moved from arrowhead but i would rather them move to kansas then move to LA so all the gays can watch my team.

I am having trouble deciding which is worse, this post or the username. I would say the post wins by a red c*nt hair.

Logical
05-17-2005, 01:07 AM
Agreed. I hope folks can get their shit together and get a good renovation for it. It's a beautiful stadium, with sentimental value for a lot people. Good natured Kansas ribbing aside, if the Chiefs were playing in a complete shithole, and the best option was on the other side of the border, I could get over it. I just think Arrowhead (and the K as well) are too nice to just throw away.

I agree with you. I would think that the 2nd level could be converted to entirely luxury boxes (to make two stories of boxes) doubling the number to just under 200 to make it more financially viable.

Logical
05-17-2005, 01:25 AM
... and bitch about the roads in Missouri...as usual.
ROFL and LMAO, both Kansas and Missouri have pitiful roads. The fact that either side bitches about it is absurd.

Chiefs_Fan_n_64081
05-17-2005, 02:05 AM
Lawrence burning and Cole Younger learning.

...yep.


We Lee's Summitians used to cellebrate the outlaw freebooter turned Christian farmer until conservative wignuts decided that it was socially inappropriate.

Funny how the religious right seems to forget the man settled in L.S. after he converted and put his days of infamy behind him.

...but then, sadly, I guess some people figure that a man can not really be redeemed.

DeepSouth
05-17-2005, 06:27 AM
I guess I just don't understand all this Kansas hate. I wish I was a real missourian.
Just ask Josey Wales.

Pants
05-17-2005, 06:41 AM
It is much more impressive in person. It doesn't translate well to type.

ROFL, I hate driving through Missouri. The whole state just seems somehow dirty. The roads suck major ass, between major cities - it's hickland (no offense to anybody here, it was a genarilzation). And 4th, you've obviously never been to Kansas it you think there are no hills, not that it's a good thing.

Saulbadguy
05-17-2005, 06:45 AM
Hills.
Obviously you have not been far enough west to view the beautiful Flint Hills. :)

Saulbadguy
05-17-2005, 06:49 AM
Branson is the shiznit. I saw Ray Stevens there when I was a small child. I have a bunch of his music now and I know several tunes by heart, including "Mississipi Squirrel Revival," "Bridget the Midget" and "The Streak." In fact, on occasion, if you are very, very nice to me, I might entertain with my flawless Ray Stevens lip syncing.
Branson is a hillbilly tourist trap.

Saulbadguy
05-17-2005, 06:51 AM
Agreed. I hope folks can get their shit together and get a good renovation for it. It's a beautiful stadium, with sentimental value for a lot people. Good natured Kansas ribbing aside, if the Chiefs were playing in a complete shithole, and the best option was on the other side of the border, I could get over it. I just think Arrowhead (and the K as well) are too nice to just throw away.
Pretty much my sentiment as well. I'd love to see them in Wyandotte (NOT JoCo), but i'd rather have em stay where they are..because its Arrowhead.

HemiEd
05-17-2005, 06:54 AM
ROFL and LMAO, both Kansas and Missouri have pitiful roads. The fact that either side bitches about it is absurd.


Now Vlad, there is no comparison.

Saulbadguy
05-17-2005, 06:56 AM
Now Vlad, there is no comparison.
There really isn't. Well, I wouldn't know about Western Kansas.

Pants
05-17-2005, 07:00 AM
There really isn't. Well, I wouldn't know about Western Kansas.

The roads in Lawrence are shitty as hell, but that's because it's a tiny, poor town. I'm sure there are shitty roads everywhere, but the Kansas highways are a full order above the Missouri highways in general.

ROYC75
05-17-2005, 07:06 AM
Figured this story would piss off the 23 MUrons in the state.:D

Missouri can't even field and keep college teams, now it doesn't want to help it's only claim to fame pro teams ?

HA HA ......That's some smart elected officials you have in Missouri.

Rest assure, when the time comes for me to move back home,it will be the KS side ...you know, the good side of the metropolitan area.

ROYC75
05-17-2005, 07:10 AM
In reality....... The Chiefs & Royals in KS just seems odd, probally because it has always been on the MO side.

You Mo. people should get off your ass's and call your elected officials.

RedNFeisty
05-17-2005, 07:48 AM
Thatís absurd you can not move the Chief's. People in Missouri need to get up off their duffs and start lobbing. Contact the elected officials, go to the meetings, and stand up for what you want. If you don't, the politician that vetoed the bill is going to pocket a lot of money it seems, why else would he be so against it. I donít think the Chiefís would be the same if not in Arrowhead. Hell, they wonít be the Chiefís if they are not in Arrowhead.

Archie F. Swin
05-17-2005, 07:51 AM
Kansas? Hmmm..ok.

Wait A Minute!!!!

What's Lamar's take on Intelligent Design? :hmmm:

Mr. Kotter
05-17-2005, 07:57 AM
Thatís absurd you can not move the Chief's. People in Missouri need to get up off their duffs and start lobbing. Contact the elected officials, go to the meetings, and stand up for what you want. If you don't, the politician that vetoed the bill is going to pocket a lot of money it seems, why else would he be so against it. I donít think the Chiefís would be the same if not in Arrowhead. Hell, they wonít be the Chiefís if they are not in Arrowhead.

So if they moved 30 miles to a state that wants them, and a new stadium they deserve....they wouldn't be the Chiefs anymore? :shrug:

HemiEd
05-17-2005, 08:02 AM
There really isn't. Well, I wouldn't know about Western Kansas.

The roads and hiways in western Kansas are excellent. They do not put those darn curves in them either like they do in Missouri. It is very hard to read while driving in Missouri. :shake:

RedNFeisty
05-17-2005, 08:06 AM
So if they moved 30 miles to a state that wants them, and a new stadium they deserve....they wouldn't be the Chiefs anymore? :shrug:

Just like any team that moves, the traditions are broken. I am sure they will still be loved.

Brock
05-17-2005, 08:12 AM
I'm sure a lot of people thought tradition meant staying in that crappy old Municipal stadium as well.

That said,there isn't a damn thing wrong with Arrowhead. In fact, it's still one of the best stadiums in the league. Add more bathrooms, give Lamar some more luxury suites, and let's move on.

HC_Chief
05-17-2005, 08:22 AM
I'm sure a lot of people thought tradition meant staying in that crappy old Municipal stadium as well.

That said,there isn't a damn thing wrong with Arrowhead. In fact, it's still one of the best stadiums in the league. Add more bathrooms, give Lamar some more luxury suites, and let's move on.

Other than the plumbing, electrical, and 30-yr old concrete....

ArrowheadHawk
05-17-2005, 08:23 AM
As someone who doesn't live in Kansas City. Aren't they both the same GD town. Kansas City, KS & Kansas City, MO.....exactly how much of the state line between them in unpopulated?

Brock
05-17-2005, 08:26 AM
Other than the plumbing, electrical, and 30-yr old concrete....

You're going to have to elaborate.

ChiTown
05-17-2005, 08:31 AM
It's hard to beat the Truman Sports Complex and Arrowhead Stadium. That said, I'm in favor of keeping the team in KC, and if that means a change of venue within the KC metro area (Wyandotte/Johnson County), then so be it.

HC_Chief
05-17-2005, 08:32 AM
You're going to have to elaborate.

The electrical system is phucked. The stadium needs to be re-wired... I bet it's not even up to code any more but can "get by" on a granny clause.

The plumbing is also completely hosed. The basement floods every year. Sewage handling is a disaster... ever been to a game where they shut down a bathroom or two? I have... and it sucks.

The structure is made primarily of concrete... that was mixed and poured 30 years ago. Structural repair is necessitated if Arrowhead is to remain the home of the Chiefs.

ALL of these items have been addressed ad nauseum by Lamar and the Kansas City Chiefs, yet JackCo has decided not to address them. Phucktards. Can you say "violation of lease"? Thought so.

Brock
05-17-2005, 08:36 AM
The electrical system is phucked. The stadium needs to be re-wired... I bet it's not even up to code any more but can "get by" on a granny clause.

The plumbing is also completely hosed. The basement floods every year. Sewage handling is a disaster... ever been to a game where they shut down a bathroom or two? I have... and it sucks.

The structure is made primarily of concrete... that was mixed and poured 30 years ago. Structural repair is necessitated if Arrowhead is to remain the home of the Chiefs.

ALL of these items have been addressed ad nauseum by Lamar and the Kansas City Chiefs, yet JackCo has decided not to address them. Phucktards. Can you say "violation of lease"? Thought so.

Hmm. I've never noticed any of these things, but I probably haven't been paying attention.

ROYC75
05-17-2005, 08:41 AM
For some reason, I never make to the basement when I'm there ?

Saulbadguy
05-17-2005, 08:43 AM
The video boards/scoreboards need replaced.

ArrowheadHawk
05-17-2005, 08:44 AM
they need a dome

Brock
05-17-2005, 08:46 AM
they need a dome

:shake:

HC_Chief
05-17-2005, 08:46 AM
Hmm. I've never noticed any of these things, but I probably haven't been paying attention.

That's why nothing seems to ever get done in regards to JackCo and the TSC - if it's not readily apparent (i.e. the house is not burning the *@&$ down in front of them), they take no action. Fact of the matter is Arrowhead is one of the oldest NFL stadiums now. Over time, infrastructure decays. Thanks to years of patchwork "band aids", rather than spending the time to actually fix/renovate, we're left with a stadium that needs several million dollars worth of infrastructure repairs.

On top of that, the concourses are a joke. That much is visilbly apparent. That will take MAJOR construction to update.

JackCo needs to figure out how to get the funding soon, or they will be in violation. It will REALLY piss me off if KC loses the Chiefs because some dumbf*ck local politicians can't pull their heads out of their asses.

KUalum
05-17-2005, 09:03 AM
I for one am all for the team moving over to WyCo to keep the Chiefs in Kansas City. Although, as a homeowner in WyCo with property taxes higher than both JoCo and JackCo I would not vote for an increase to build them a new stadium. If the state can find the $ without raising taxes - go for it.

Saulbadguy
05-17-2005, 09:05 AM
If the state can find the $ without raising taxes - go for it.
:rolleyes:

Oh, come on.

HemiEd
05-17-2005, 09:57 AM
I for one am all for the team moving over to WyCo to keep the Chiefs in Kansas City. Although, as a homeowner in WyCo with property taxes higher than both JoCo and JackCo I would not vote for an increase to build them a new stadium. If the state can find the $ without raising taxes - go for it.

But, by my guess a new stadium should only cost about 1 Billion when considering that they spent 700 million upgrading Soldier Field. Surely that would not cause a tax increase. :)

Archie F. Swin
05-17-2005, 09:58 AM
Screw the stadium...its the fans that matter!

They could doze the damn place and play in the parking lot for all I care. How many times have we brought a 'Bardi trophy back to Arrowhead any-damn-way?!

Plop that bitch down in the dump where the Land of Oz was going.

HC_Chief
05-17-2005, 10:01 AM
But, by my guess a new stadium should only cost about 1 Billion when considering that they spent 700 million upgrading Soldier Field. Surely that would not cause a tax increase. :)

Heh, land along Lakeshore Blvd is worth just a bit more than some empty field in JackCo or WyCo. :D

Skip Towne
05-17-2005, 10:12 AM
Other than the plumbing, electrical, and 30-yr old concrete....
Uh......the Rose Bowl has 80 year old concrete.

HC_Chief
05-17-2005, 10:21 AM
Uh......the Rose Bowl has 80 year old concrete.

Uhhh, and I'm sure the university has undertaken several efforts to preserve, update, and repair the structure.

chiefs4me
05-17-2005, 10:28 AM
Figured this story would piss off the 23 MUrons in the state.:D

Missouri can't even field and keep college teams, now it doesn't want to help it's only claim to fame pro teams ?

HA HA ......That's some smart elected officials you have in Missouri.

Rest assure, when the time comes for me to move back home,it will be the KS side ...you know, the good side of the metropolitan area.



Now I haven't lived in Mo for 11 years...but that is still my home that you are bitching about.:harumph: I am sure we all are feeling a sense of relief at you goning to live on the KS side when you move back home.:)

kchero
05-17-2005, 10:28 AM
I dont care if the Chiefs are in Missouri or Kansas. But I will tell you this I think Arrowhead is great where it is now and I would never want a new stadium. Lets just remodel Arrowhead and get it over with. I dont want an Invesco type stadium with wine and cheese fans...this will ruin our homefield advantage and the pride that we have for our team. Also, the chiefs would always be called the kansas CITY chiefs because how would our helmet logo look with a giant K on it. The KC on the arrowhead will always be there. I look at it this way...Even though the Chiefs are in KC, Missouri they are the KC Metropolatian Chiefs. If it wasnt for the fans in Jackson County, Johnson County KS, Wyandotte County, and the other counties in this region our team wouldnt exist.

chiefs4me
05-17-2005, 10:31 AM
Thatís absurd you can not move the Chief's. People in Missouri need to get up off their duffs and start lobbing. Contact the elected officials, go to the meetings, and stand up for what you want. If you don't, the politician that vetoed the bill is going to pocket a lot of money it seems, why else would he be so against it. I donít think the Chiefís would be the same if not in Arrowhead. Hell, they wonít be the Chiefís if they are not in Arrowhead.


EXACTLY....if you take the City out of Kansas City Chiefs or move them from Arrowhead...they will just be another team. They won't be my beloved KC Chiefs. oh god somebody has to do something...don't make me root for the boys or texans........:deevee:

HemiEd
05-17-2005, 10:34 AM
Heh, land along Lakeshore Blvd is worth just a bit more than some empty field in JackCo or WyCo. :D


I am not aware of them having to buy any land for Soldier field, maybe they did. Construction costs would have been much higher of course do to the area they had to deal with. Just curious, has there been any figures thrown around about the renovation costs at Arrowhead and the cost of a new place? If so I missed them. :hmmm:

HC_Chief
05-17-2005, 10:40 AM
I am not aware of them having to buy any land for Soldier field, maybe they did. Construction costs would have been much higher of course do to the area they had to deal with. Just curious, has there been any figures thrown around about the renovation costs at Arrowhead and the cost of a new place? If so I missed them. :hmmm:

The numbers I've seen were thrown in with the $ allocated to the Royals. They have a shared lease, meaning any $ allocated to TSC has to be split between the franchises. IIRC it was in the $200m range.

IMO the optimal solution would be to move the Royals downtown or just N of the river, and give the entire TSC for Arrowhead2. Knock down Royals stadium and build a brand new state-of-the-art NFL stadium that's simplay a bigger, better Arrowhead. The bowl design that exists now is perfect. Just make the concourses 2x, add more mens rooms (having equal # of mens/womens rooms is braindead), and more luxury boxes. A rolling/retractable roof would also be cool (be able to bring the SB to KC).

Brock
05-17-2005, 10:59 AM
The numbers I've seen were thrown in with the $ allocated to the Royals. They have a shared lease, meaning any $ allocated to TSC has to be split between the franchises. IIRC it was in the $200m range.

IMO the optimal solution would be to move the Royals downtown or just N of the river, and give the entire TSC for Arrowhead2. Knock down Royals stadium and build a brand new state-of-the-art NFL stadium that's simplay a bigger, better Arrowhead. The bowl design that exists now is perfect. Just make the concourses 2x, add more mens rooms (having equal # of mens/womens rooms is braindead), and more luxury boxes. A rolling/retractable roof would also be cool (be able to bring the SB to KC).


If they do build a new stadium, you can be sure PSLs will be part of the plan.

HC_Chief
05-17-2005, 12:19 PM
If they do build a new stadium, you can be sure PSLs will be part of the plan.

That's a definite possibility, although Lamar Hunt has, on several occassions, made statements to the fact that he was proud that KC was in the bottom-third of the NFL when it comes to ticket prices. PSLs defeat that. Of course, intelligent design would be to utilize PSLs in the "gold" section and choice seating (between 40s, lower level and first 20-25 rows of upper level(s))

HemiEd
05-17-2005, 12:21 PM
The numbers I've seen were thrown in with the $ allocated to the Royals. They have a shared lease, meaning any $ allocated to TSC has to be split between the franchises. IIRC it was in the $200m range.

IMO the optimal solution would be to move the Royals downtown or just N of the river, and give the entire TSC for Arrowhead2. Knock down Royals stadium and build a brand new state-of-the-art NFL stadium that's simplay a bigger, better Arrowhead. The bowl design that exists now is perfect. Just make the concourses 2x, add more mens rooms (having equal # of mens/womens rooms is braindead), and more luxury boxes. A rolling/retractable roof would also be cool (be able to bring the SB to KC).


Thanks for the info, does not sound like too much money. I just hope the politicians get it done before it becomes too late..

Edubs
05-17-2005, 01:01 PM
I think having the Chiefs in Kansas would be sweet as hell. Missouri only seems to care about the damn St. Louis sports anyway. The Kansas side would build the Chiefs a sweet a$$ stadium and it would be surrounded by tons of restaurants, bars, and shopping. Sounds like a better deal than being surrounded by a bunch of $hitty ass land with nothing on it. It would be good for some of you Missouri folks.......you would understand what it's like to drive on smooth roads. It would make KC, MO realize that theres more there than the f-ing Plaza.

If they were by the race track they still could be the KC Chiefs.

I like it alot.

beer bacon
05-17-2005, 01:40 PM
What a surprise. Most people from Kansas think it would be better for the stadium to be in Kansas.

We should just all list our home state before we post so people can already know what the gist of our posts will be.

htismaqe
05-17-2005, 01:43 PM
EXACTLY....if you take the City out of Kansas City Chiefs or move them from Arrowhead...they will just be another team. They won't be my beloved KC Chiefs. oh god somebody has to do something...don't make me root for the boys or texans........:deevee:

So you're saying that, if the Chiefs moved 30 minutes to the West yet STILL inside the KC metro area and were still called the Kansas City Chiefs, you'd find another team?

Why wait? Find another team now.

beer bacon
05-17-2005, 01:45 PM
So you're saying that, if the Chiefs moved 30 minutes to the West yet STILL inside the KC metro area and were still called the Kansas City Chiefs, you'd find another team?

Why wait? Find another team now.

If they moved to Kansas, they would be a different team to many people that have lived in Missouri their whole lives.

Brock
05-17-2005, 01:47 PM
What a surprise. Most people from Kansas think it would be better for the stadium to be in Kansas.

We should just all list our home state before we post so people can already know what the gist of our posts will be.

I don't think it would necessarily be BETTER. It would be great. It looks to me like a few Missourians view the notion as an affront, but if it keeps the Chiefs within a few minutes of KC, what's to bitch about?

beer bacon
05-17-2005, 01:48 PM
I don't think it would necessarily be BETTER. It would be great. It looks to me like a few Missourians view the notion as an affront, but if it keeps the Chiefs within a few minutes of KC, what's to bitch about?

It will be in Kansas. The Chiefs will no longer call Missouri their home. It is as simple as that.

Brock
05-17-2005, 01:54 PM
It will be in Kansas. The Chiefs will no longer call Missouri their home. It is as simple as that.

You are right, that is simple.

Saulbadguy
05-17-2005, 01:59 PM
It will be in Kansas. The Chiefs will no longer call Missouri their home. It is as simple as that.
It would make sense. Heck, most of the Chiefs players reside in Kansas.

Skip Towne
05-17-2005, 02:09 PM
So you're saying that, if the Chiefs moved 30 minutes to the West yet STILL inside the KC metro area and were still called the Kansas City Chiefs, you'd find another team?

Why wait? Find another team now.
I'll bet she could sway a few votes if she promised to find another message board as well.

Saulbadguy
05-17-2005, 02:11 PM
I'll bet she could sway a few votes if she promised to find another message board as well.
Perhaps we could work out a package deal if we sent her to Orangemane. Taco John..want to work something out?

HemiEd
05-17-2005, 02:20 PM
EXACTLY....if you take the City out of Kansas City Chiefs or move them from Arrowhead...they will just be another team. They won't be my beloved KC Chiefs. oh god somebody has to do something...don't make me root for the boys or texans........:deevee:

I think you upped your own personal bar with this post. :rolleyes:

You do understand that Kansas City, Kansas does exist, correct? How would that be taking the City out of the Kansas City Chiefs? :doh!:

I understand the Arrowhead sentiment, I have it myself. But taking the City out of the Kansas City Chiefs. Huh?

HemiEd
05-17-2005, 02:22 PM
You are right, that is simple.

ROFL ROFL

ENDelt260
05-17-2005, 02:37 PM
Aren't they both the same GD town.

No.

ENDelt260
05-17-2005, 02:38 PM
they need a dome
B&

ENDelt260
05-17-2005, 02:40 PM
A rolling/retractable roof would also be cool (be able to bring the SB to KC).

Booooooo!!!!

TEX
05-17-2005, 03:37 PM
The numbers I've seen were thrown in with the $ allocated to the Royals. They have a shared lease, meaning any $ allocated to TSC has to be split between the franchises. IIRC it was in the $200m range.

IMO the optimal solution would be to move the Royals downtown or just N of the river, and give the entire TSC for Arrowhead2. Knock down Royals stadium and build a brand new state-of-the-art NFL stadium that's simplay a bigger, better Arrowhead. The bowl design that exists now is perfect. Just make the concourses 2x, add more mens rooms (having equal # of mens/womens rooms is braindead), and more luxury boxes. A rolling/retractable roof would also be cool (be able to bring the SB to KC).

Well that's kind of what happened here in Houston with the Astros and Texans. They did build a new Downtown stadium for the Stros (Minute Made Park formerly known as Enron Field). They left the Astrodome standing and built Reliant Stadium right next to it. Course, the Oilers leaving had something to do with the TEXANS getting their brand new stadium... :hmmm:

Big Slick
05-17-2005, 04:59 PM
I can't believe that I went through this whole thread and nobody has touched on what the real travesty of this move would mean:

NO MORE GOVERNOR'S CUP GAMES!!!!!

:rolleyes: ROFL :p

dtebbe
05-17-2005, 06:02 PM
they need a dome

Why? So all you Kansas cheezers won't get thier tootsies cold? Just stay your ass at home if you don't want to get cold, and leave live football to the real men!

DT

dtebbe
05-17-2005, 06:07 PM
The roads and hiways in western Kansas are excellent. They do not put those darn curves in them either like they do in Missouri. It is very hard to read while driving in Missouri. :shake:

I suppose the next thing you are going to tell me is that the reason there are no trees is so that you don't hit a tree when you fall asleep driving across the boring ass state... right?

DT

idontwantgrobback
05-17-2005, 06:17 PM
They can play in Memorial Stadium :)

eff the donkeys
05-17-2005, 06:37 PM
I don't understand why the KS and MO people are arguing about perhaps the only thing we agree on. Aren't we all going to be equally pissed if the team goes to another market? I'd hate to see Arrowhead go, but I'd hate to see the Chiefs go more.

HemiEd
05-17-2005, 06:55 PM
I suppose the next thing you are going to tell me is that the reason there are no trees is so that you don't hit a tree when you fall asleep driving across the boring ass state... right?

DT

Who said there are no trees? Have you been there? There are plenty of trees, they all lean north though due to the wind coming out of the south during the spring and summer. Seriously though you might want to visit it. It is a custom to wear shoes though so I would highly recommend that you get some. ROFL

Pants
05-17-2005, 07:00 PM
Seriously though you might want to visit it. It is a custom to wear shoes though so I would highly recommend that you get some. ROFL

ROFL

Skip Towne
05-17-2005, 07:04 PM
Who said there are no trees? Have you been there? There are plenty of trees, they all lean north though due to the wind coming out of the south during the spring and summer. Seriously though you might want to visit it. It is a custom to wear shoes though so I would highly recommend that you get some. ROFL
Nyuk Nyuk Nyuk

HC_Chief
05-17-2005, 07:05 PM
There are trees...they simply lean due to the high winds.... you know, from mizery sucking so much. ;)

Pants
05-17-2005, 07:10 PM
I suppose the next thing you are going to tell me is that the reason there are no trees is so that you don't hit a tree when you fall asleep driving across the boring ass state... right?

DT

Boring ass state? So driving through Georgia is fun? There's my new vacation plans. "Let's go kids! We are driving through Georgia for fun! Are you excited?" I've been through the whole U.S. from east to west and guess what - driving is boring no matter what state you're in. Actually, driving through the black desolate desert called Utah was one of the better experiences because of that feeling you get after seeing the "No services for the next 500 miles" sign, the feeling that might be f*cked if your car breaks down.

Logical
05-17-2005, 09:09 PM
There really isn't. Well, I wouldn't know about Western Kansas.Drive on some side streets sometime and you will get a better idea. Better yet come to San Diego and see what good roads are really like.

Logical
05-17-2005, 09:10 PM
Kansas? Hmmm..ok.

Wait A Minute!!!!

What's Lamar's take on Intelligent Design? :hmmm:ROFL Wonderful use of cross thread, cross forum humor.

Logical
05-17-2005, 09:16 PM
The electrical system is phucked. The stadium needs to be re-wired... I bet it's not even up to code any more but can "get by" on a granny clause.

The plumbing is also completely hosed. The basement floods every year. Sewage handling is a disaster... ever been to a game where they shut down a bathroom or two? I have... and it sucks.

The structure is made primarily of concrete... that was mixed and poured 30 years ago. Structural repair is necessitated if Arrowhead is to remain the home of the Chiefs.

ALL of these items have been addressed ad nauseum by Lamar and the Kansas City Chiefs, yet JackCo has decided not to address them. Phucktards. Can you say "violation of lease"? Thought so.

Kansas City's City Hall building is concrete poured 70 years ago. The Coliseum in LA is over 100 years old. Concrete has an incredible lifespan. The rest of your post is relevant.

Logical
05-17-2005, 09:18 PM
The video boards/scoreboards need replaced.
OK, why is that important? Not being a smartass but they seem more than adequate.

Logical
05-17-2005, 09:22 PM
I am not aware of them having to buy any land for Soldier field, maybe they did. Construction costs would have been much higher of course do to the area they had to deal with. Just curious, has there been any figures thrown around about the renovation costs at Arrowhead and the cost of a new place? If so I missed them. :hmmm:In the neighborhood of 300 million to renovate it with wider concourses, additional luxury boxes and restrooms, as well as some sort of lobby Hall of Fame thing like they did at Lambeau.

Skip Towne
05-17-2005, 09:24 PM
Kansas City's City Hall building is concrete poured 70 years ago. The Coliseum in LA is over 100 years old. Concrete has an incredible lifespan. The rest of your post is relevant.
I used the Rose Bowl in an earlier post. It's concrete is 83 years old.

Logical
05-17-2005, 09:25 PM
I used the Rose Bowl in an earlier post. It's concrete is 83 years old.
Another good example.

Makes me wonder something how did they hold the Coliseum in Rome together, is it a form of concrete?

Pants
05-17-2005, 09:27 PM
Another good example.

Makes me wonder something how did they hold the Coliseum in Rome together, is it a form of concrete?

I think it was constructed before concrete was invented.

TEX
05-17-2005, 09:29 PM
OK, why is that important? Not being a smartass but they seem more than adequate.

IMHO, you're correct. I remember when Reliant Stadium was being built and they boasted about having the "largest scoreboard in the NFL." Well I was expecting this majestic scoreboard and simply laughed at the finished product. There is no doubt that it is the "largest" in the NFL, but it's mostly dedicated to corporate sponsorship and the actual viewing area is a joke. It's a wide screan and all but it's anything but great as the picture is stretched kind of like a normal TV showing a wide screen picture. :shake: The one at ARROWHEAD is better and more than adequate.

CosmicPal
05-17-2005, 09:30 PM
I wouldn't care either way, just as long as they remain in the general KC metropolitan area.

Skip Towne
05-17-2005, 09:30 PM
Another good example.

Makes me wonder something how did they hold the Coliseum in Rome together, is it a form of concrete?
Probably some kind of adobe. A good question for me to Google tomorrow.

chiefs4me
05-17-2005, 09:41 PM
So you're saying that, if the Chiefs moved 30 minutes to the West yet STILL inside the KC metro area and were still called the Kansas City Chiefs, you'd find another team?

Why wait? Find another team now.



:shrug: I guess I wasn't clear on it...but to late now. My heart knows the Chiefs from KC MIssouri...can't really say what I would do if they moved 30 min away to ks..:shake:

CosmicPal
05-17-2005, 09:45 PM
So, I'm just curious. I understand owners want to make more money with luxury boxes and stuff like that, but Arrowhead is not outdated, and it won't be outdated in two years. Why is it that you don't hear about Fenway park and Wrigley's field being demolished in order to meet the demands of luxury boxes and to add another 30,000 seats. You know they could easily fill another 30,000 seats for games in Chicago and Boston, but they don't need to tear down their stadiums.

Arrowhead is quickly becoming one of the last of the finest stadiums still remaining- keep it that way. Let the others tear down their stadiums- I'd give anything to see Arrowhead become the next Fenway or the next Wrigley's field- particularly in football. There's no need to build a new stadium in KC or move the Chiefs to make more money, it's all BS.

KC still has the most dedicated and one of the highest attendence in football- screw the luxury boxes and keep it real- football is about blood and guts, not martini's and sushi.

Skip Towne
05-17-2005, 09:47 PM
:shrug: I guess I wasn't clear on it...but to late now. My heart knows the Chiefs from KC MIssouri...can't really say what I would do if they moved 30 min away to ks..:shake:
Oh, Horrors!!! I can't wait for your decision.

Logical
05-17-2005, 09:50 PM
So, I'm just curious. I understand owners want to make more money with luxury boxes and stuff like that, but Arrowhead is not outdated, and it won't be outdated in two years. Why is it that you don't hear about Fenway park and Wrigley's field being demolished in order to meet the demands of luxury boxes and to add another 30,000 seats. You know they could easily fill another 30,000 seats for games in Chicago and Boston, but they don't need to tear down their stadiums.

Arrowhead is quickly becoming one of the last of the finest stadiums still remaining- keep it that way. Let the others tear down their stadiums- I'd give anything to see Arrowhead become the next Fenway or the next Wrigley's field- particularly in football. There's no need to build a new stadium in KC or move the Chiefs to make more money, it's all BS.

KC still has the most dedicated and one of the highest attendence in football- screw the luxury boxes and keep it real- football is about blood and guts, not martini's and sushi.

The answer is Revenue, luxury box revenue is not shared with other teams. In the end that is all it really amounts to. Your examples are from baseball where no revenue is shared thus quite a few stadiums as old or far older than Truman Sports Complex exist.

Chiefs_Fan_n_64081
05-18-2005, 12:49 AM
I think it was constructed before concrete was invented.
Don't know if someone else has mentioned this, but they did use a crude form of concrete.

http://www.designcommunity.com/discussion/2808.html

The Romans were quite advanced.

Logical
05-18-2005, 12:56 AM
Don't know if someone else has mentioned this, but they did use a crude form of concrete.

http://www.designcommunity.com/discussion/2808.html

The Romans were quite advanced.

Very interesting, thanks.

The fundamental reason Roman concrete has lasted for over two thousand years, as witnessed in the Pantheon and the Collesium, has to do with their use of materials, placement, and design. These issues are discussed on our web site www.romanconcrete.com. Research of the known Roman writings by my father, a civil engineer, has revealed that the Romans likely used a very low slump (ie low water content) concrete. Less water means more strength. They did not "pour" the concrete into moulds the way we do now, instead they pounded it in layers into forms. They layed down a layer of hand sized rock first, then placed a layer of mortar down, and then pounded the two together using a tool called a "beetle". Modern concrete has a higher water content, to make it econmical to work and place - ie it can be poured rather than tamped. However, higher water content has deliterious effects in the long run. The excess water creates micropores in the concrete, contributing to cracking and attacks by freezing. Less water = more strength is the byword in concrete construction.

tk13
05-18-2005, 12:58 AM
The answer is Revenue, luxury box revenue is not shared with other teams. In the end that is all it really amounts to. Your examples are from baseball where no revenue is shared thus quite a few stadiums as old or far older than Truman Sports Complex exist.
I really think Lamar and everybody involved needs to somehow try harder and get this message out there. I know he has to some extent but there's still a giant lack of communication out there. Even some of the most fanatical fans probably don't even understand why we'd need a new stadium, and that luxury box revenue isn't shared, etc... some effort needs to be made to educate fans, and more important, voters, as to why these things need to be done, aside from all the plumbing/electrical problems. It's a pretty big deal.