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Mile High Mania
08-02-2005, 10:21 AM
Ok, I'm curious to hear the thoughts from the massess...

One of my leagues is a keeper league. We can keep 2 players (not 2 at the same position) and we lose the pick in the round that the player was drafted in LAST season.

Also, once our keepers are declared, we can do predraft trades for picks and/or players and walk into the draft with 2 RBs or 2 WRs, whatever we can create.

Points are standard ... TDs are the same for all offensive positions. 1 pt for 10 yards rushing/receiving and 1 point for 25 yards passing. 5 point bonus for 100 yards rushing or receiving and 300 yards passing.

Now to my trade offer that I'm debating....

I am keeping Manning (losing R1 pick) and Steven Jackson (losing R8 pick). This other owner is keeping McGahee (losing R8 pick) and Andre Johnson (losing R5 pick).

This guy picks 7th overall in R1. I have the 2nd pick in R2 and he has the 4th pick in R2. It's a 10 team league... so that would be 12th and 14th overall in R2 for each of us.

It's insanity to even think about trading Peyton, but I'm considering it only if I can really stock up on top RBs and knowing I can get a Green or Brady, Hasselbeck, Bulger ... another top producing QB in R4 or 5.

My offer is Manning and my R2 pick (12th overall) for McGahee and his R1 pick (7th overall). This would allow me to have McGahee, Steven Jackson and one of the top RBs with my 7th overall pick (there are 8 studs going back into the draft pool.

So, going into R3 I would have 3 stud RBs and a top 3 pick in R3, where I could grab a guy like Joe Horn or better as my #1 WR. Then go QB in R4.

This would give the other guy Manning, A Johnson and then 2 RBs in R2 with the 12th and 14th overall picks.

He may not go for it and I'm taking a huge risk of missing major points if Manning has a season like last year. However, I just don't know if he can reproduce that magic again. He could come very close, but I'm interested in finding out the interest.

Hell, I may not even pull the trigger if he's interested, but I'm tempted to take a risk.

Fire away...

Mile High Mania
08-02-2005, 10:26 AM
Side note...

The stud RBs going back into the pool and of this group, 1 should be there at 7th overall are:

Dillon
McAllister and/or K Jones
Dom Davis
J Jones
Portis
A Green
Holmes and/or Rudi
Edgerrin James
Jamal Lewis and/or Tiki

The "and/or" designations indicate an owner that has to make a tough call in keeping just 1 of the RBs.

Then, when mid R2 and R3 comes around... you're looking at the rookie RBs, guys like Bell, Jordan, Martin, etc.

I think this guy has a great shot at a solid 1-2 punch in R2 if he bites on the deal.

And, if I could get McGahee, Jackson and then one of those listed above... I'd be very content (I believe) with giving up Manning and getting a QB early in R4 after I have my 3 RBs and top WR.

ct
08-02-2005, 10:30 AM
So in effect you're giving up 9(via Manning) and 12 for #7 and McGahee. You're loading up on RBs, downgrading your QB. He's getting the #1 QB, for a lesser top RB, but he could still get 2 quality RBs at 12 and 14, just not studs; maybe a Westbrook/Dunn kinda range?

Personally, I like the idea. It's a fair deal both ways, just different strategies. I side with your strategy any day, load up on top RBs, take the 2nd tier range around #4-7 of QB. And I do agree with you that Peyton likely does not match 2004 #s.

Here's my only concern: McGahee and Jackson both have some bust potential. WM in the area of his QB, and lack of running room due to stacked defense, and SJ in the RBBC split role. I'm not convinced you're really getting the RB value you should for Manning. Who are these 8 studs going back in the pool, and that might help me decide?

ct
08-02-2005, 10:31 AM
Side note...

The stud RBs going back into the pool and of this group, 1 should be there at 7th overall are:

Dillon
McAllister and/or K Jones
Dom Davis
J Jones
Portis
A Green
Holmes and/or Rudi
Edgerrin James
Jamal Lewis and/or Tiki

The "and/or" designations indicate an owner that has to make a tough call in keeping just 1 of the RBs.

Then, when mid R2 and R3 comes around... you're looking at the rookie RBs, guys like Bell, Jordan, Martin, etc.

I think this guy has a great shot at a solid 1-2 punch in R2 if he bites on the deal.

And, if I could get McGahee, Jackson and then one of those listed above... I'd be very content (I believe) with giving up Manning and getting a QB early in R4 after I have my 3 RBs and top WR.

Ok, that's what I needed. You could be looking at either of the Jones' or maybe Ahman Green, plus McGahee and Jackson. I say HELL YEAH!!

ct
08-02-2005, 10:34 AM
BTW, one of these days, I wanna match up with you in a league. Really think you'd be a tough SOB to play!! I love a challenge!

Mile High Mania
08-02-2005, 10:47 AM
Ha! Thanks... I seriously doubt the guy agrees to any trade with me. I took Manning from him via trade last year when his team was in dire straits and it was before Manning busted loose. So, he's bitter and gunshy about dealing with me again. Especially, since that trade was one of my 6 trades that didn't fail... giving me the league title.

I'm just trying to get a feel for what other owners are thinking. I know there are 2-3 that will salivate at the notion of getting Manning... and those are the weaker kinda guys I'm targeting.

The guy in my trade scenario is pretty savvy, so I'll use his feedback on what it "would take" to make such a deal and then leverage that against one of the guys that doesn't do as much homework.

Now is the time to start being the evil minded owner and prey on those that are less informed.

ct
08-02-2005, 10:58 AM
Ha! Thanks... I seriously doubt the guy agrees to any trade with me. I took Manning from him via trade last year when his team was in dire straits and it was before Manning busted loose. So, he's bitter and gunshy about dealing with me again. Especially, since that trade was one of my 6 trades that didn't fail... giving me the league title.

I'm just trying to get a feel for what other owners are thinking. I know there are 2-3 that will salivate at the notion of getting Manning... and those are the weaker kinda guys I'm targeting.

The guy in my trade scenario is pretty savvy, so I'll use his feedback on what it "would take" to make such a deal and then leverage that against one of the guys that doesn't do as much homework.

Now is the time to start being the evil minded owner and prey on those that are less informed.

Damn right!! No mercy!

I had some week1 injuries at WR last year, lost Steve Smith and Joey Galloway right out of the gate, leaving Plaxico as a (gulp) no-choice starter. Some other owner was loaded at WR, but weak at RB, so I start offering a 2-1 Dayne and Wheatley(leaving me LdT, Thomas Jones, Foster, and McGahee) for Jimmy Smith, which he didn't like, so he counters with Dayne for Mason straight up! ROFL Riding Marvin and Mason at WR all the way to the crown should have made me feel at least a little guilty, but it didn't. Not a bit! :) I bet he won't talk to me all year this time around...

Mile High Mania
08-02-2005, 11:08 AM
Similar deal... I forget all of the players involved, but I know that he lost 2 RBs and had McGahee as a backup at the time. Also, he had issues with 2-3 WRs.

So, thinking I had NO SHOT... I offered A Brooks, T Henry (starting at the time) and L Coles for Manning. I had T Brady also, as well as 2 decent RBs and some solid WRs.

He shockingly said yes.

Then, I had 5 other trades and some massive FA pickups. My draft didn't suck, but I had the mad scientist bug last year and couldn't stop offering trades and people were saying yes.

I know that I took M Pittman, T Brady and another WR and traded him for F Taylor, Delhomme and the guy threw in Muhsin (who was not doing well). I questioned this trade until Delhomee took off (even with all the injuries on that team) and then Muhsin rocked. This was week 5.

I had Tory Holt and Fred Taylor and sent him to a guy that already had Alexander and Edge for Curtis Martin and Derek Mason in week 5.

Then, I pulled off a deal that sent another RB and top receiver (I'm forgetting) for Joe Horn and Steven Jackson. This deal was top heavy in what I gave up, but I really wanted Horn and this guy didn't need Jackson.

Ulitmately, 4 of my trades were in a 10 day player... along with 4-5 decent waiver wire picks. It was to the point that I was almost trading to trade.

However, I took a QB group from the draft that was Brady, Pennington and Maddox and turned it into Manning, Delhomme.

Then, my RBs which were Faulk, the Denver duo at one point, the Carolina duo early on, Pittman, Taylor and a few others and ended with C Martin, R Droughns, Faulk, Jackson and L Jordan. So, while they were not stellar all year as a group, Martin and Droughns carried midway to late in the season. Faulk and a mix of the guys traded away helped me early.

My WRs were average after the draft, with Holt being my stud and 2-3 other somewhat solid picks. I turned them into Horn, Mason, Muhammad and Burleson (draft pick) as my top 4.

So, overall ... it worked out well and from about week 8 and through the playoffs I only lost 1 game in week 10 or 11. It was silly to the point of I literally could have plugged in any player, even Delhomme over Manning most weeks and still would have won.

I doubt that ever happens again, but the stars were aligned last year.

ct
08-02-2005, 11:24 AM
Similar deal... I forget all of the players involved, but I know that he lost 2 RBs and had McGahee as a backup at the time. Also, he had issues with 2-3 WRs.

So, thinking I had NO SHOT... I offered A Brooks, T Henry (starting at the time) and L Coles for Manning. I had T Brady also, as well as 2 decent RBs and some solid WRs.

He shockingly said yes.

Then, I had 5 other trades and some massive FA pickups. My draft didn't suck, but I had the mad scientist bug last year and couldn't stop offering trades and people were saying yes.

I know that I took M Pittman, T Brady and another WR and traded him for F Taylor, Delhomme and the guy threw in Muhsin (who was not doing well). I questioned this trade until Delhomee took off (even with all the injuries on that team) and then Muhsin rocked. This was week 5.

I had Tory Holt and Fred Taylor and sent him to a guy that already had Alexander and Edge for Curtis Martin and Derek Mason in week 5.

Then, I pulled off a deal that sent another RB and top receiver (I'm forgetting) for Joe Horn and Steven Jackson. This deal was top heavy in what I gave up, but I really wanted Horn and this guy didn't need Jackson.

Ulitmately, 4 of my trades were in a 10 day player... along with 4-5 decent waiver wire picks. It was to the point that I was almost trading to trade.

However, I took a QB group from the draft that was Brady, Pennington and Maddox and turned it into Manning, Delhomme.

Then, my RBs which were Faulk, the Denver duo at one point, the Carolina duo early on, Pittman, Taylor and a few others and ended with C Martin, R Droughns, Faulk, Jackson and L Jordan. So, while they were not stellar all year as a group, Martin and Droughns carried midway to late in the season. Faulk and a mix of the guys traded away helped me early.

My WRs were average after the draft, with Holt being my stud and 2-3 other somewhat solid picks. I turned them into Horn, Mason, Muhammad and Burleson (draft pick) as my top 4.

So, overall ... it worked out well and from about week 8 and through the playoffs I only lost 1 game in week 10 or 11. It was silly to the point of I literally could have plugged in any player, even Delhomme over Manning most weeks and still would have won.

I doubt that ever happens again, but the stars were aligned last year.

Geesh, mad scientist is right! Must have been a hella fun year though!

Somebody should setup up a FFA(Fantasy Football Addicts) support group for guys like you and me.

Mile High Mania
08-02-2005, 11:38 AM
Geesh, mad scientist is right! Must have been a hella fun year though!

Somebody should setup up a FFA(Fantasy Football Addicts) support group for guys like you and me.

I did... www.pigskinsanity.com :p

patteeu
08-02-2005, 11:47 AM
If you can get him to make that deal, I think it's a good one for you. If I were him though, I'd pass on it and take an RB with the 7th overall to pair with McGahee and plan on getting a decent/good QB later like you want to do.

Mile High Mania
08-02-2005, 11:58 AM
If you can get him to make that deal, I think it's a good one for you. If I were him though, I'd pass on it and take an RB with the 7th overall to pair with McGahee and plan on getting a decent/good QB later like you want to do.

This will likely be his plan. If I were him, I wouldn't do this deal, but like I said... there are a few owners that will likely fall in love with the idea of having Manning. I'm using this guy to help me craft the deal.

Worst case... I'm stuck with Peyton Manning and that's not a bad thing.

patteeu
08-02-2005, 12:00 PM
This will likely be his plan. If I were him, I wouldn't do this deal, but like I said... there are a few owners that will likely fall in love with the idea of having Manning. I'm using this guy to help me craft the deal.

Worst case... I'm stuck with Peyton Manning and that's not a bad thing.

Yep, I agree with everything you've said here.