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SNR
08-06-2005, 04:35 PM
It's early to say. Anything can happen. But he seems to have defeated it. He has a great future with the team and has already proved that he can be the starting RB of this team.

What do you guys think?

nascher
08-06-2005, 04:50 PM
yes only injuries could "stop" him.

Mr. Laz
08-06-2005, 05:20 PM
early yet, but he's got a shot

Kraut
08-06-2005, 06:41 PM
Yeah I feel he is the real deal. I went to PSU and watched him play and I have to say he is the best running back I have seen come out of Happy Valley. I agree with you guys on the point of injuries. If he stays healthy he will play out big for the Chiefs. Let's keep our fingers crossed!!!

Skip Towne
08-06-2005, 06:54 PM
I heard on a radio sports talk show that LJ averaged more than 8 yards per carry during his career at PSU. Let's see, isn't that against Big 10 competition? From what I've seen, LJ could take over the position right now. I don't think he's a fluke at all.

Rain Man
08-06-2005, 07:11 PM
"Hey, Fate! Yeah, you! I'm talking to you!"

http://pages.prodigy.net/kirkfarrell1/profile%20%20kill.jpg

DJay23
08-06-2005, 07:54 PM
I heard on a radio sports talk show that LJ averaged more than 8 yards per carry during his career at PSU. Let's see, isn't that against Big 10 competition? From what I've seen, LJ could take over the position right now. I don't think he's a fluke at all.
That number is inflated when you consider that he was platooned for most of his career there.

penchief
08-07-2005, 07:38 AM
That number is inflated when you consider that he was platooned for most of his career there.

That's true. LJ had to fight for playing time at college, too. But look at what he did when he got the chance in his senior year. He rushed for over 2100 yards and averaged about 7.9 yards per carry. That's pretty dang close to his platooned 8 yard per carry average. It would be safe to say that is what he averaged in college.

How can his average be inflated if it is what it is....even as a starter?

DJay23
08-07-2005, 08:06 AM
That's true. LJ had to fight for playing time at college, too. But look at what he did when he got the chance in his senior year. He rushed for over 2100 yards and averaged about 7.9 yards per carry. That's pretty dang close to his platooned 8 yard per carry average. It would be safe to say that is what he averaged in college.

How can his average be inflated if it is what it is....even as a starter?
well, i'm just saying that if he had some good attempts here and there his first 3 years, that would inflate his average since he didn't play regularly. You know, put him in for 3 plays a game, gain 24 yards, then go sit on the bench. Instant 8 yard average.

Most young kids take a year or two to grow in a system and have growing pains as a result. Johnson for some reason was skipped over every year but his senior year. I respect JoePa for what he has accomplished and his longevity, but he seemed to have dropped the ball on LJ. He was a great college runner.

In fact, LJ was the first Penn State player I pulled for. I was pretty much anti Penn State before that.

Skip Towne
08-07-2005, 10:32 AM
I really haven't seen enough of him to be sure about him. But he seems to have a knack for getting loose and the speed to break it once he does.

Ari Chi3fs
08-07-2005, 10:39 AM
It's early to say. Anything can happen. But he seems to have defeated it. He has a great future with the team and has already proved that he can be the starting RB of this team.

What do you guys think?

thanks for trying to jinx him, fugger.

redhed
08-07-2005, 11:32 AM
From what I've seen, he's a genuine talent. He could be a star in this league. The injury thingy is true for every player in the league. LJ has not been prone to injury (did somebody imply that?dunno). I think LJ needs to work on his pass-catching abilities a little more, but he's a great runner. He's also improved his blocking skills, but needs to keep improving in that area. Solid, strong NFL back. I'm glad he's a Chief.

WebGem
08-07-2005, 11:52 AM
ROFL

Are you kidding? He had a good half season.

DJay23
08-07-2005, 11:54 AM
From what I've seen, he's a genuine talent. He could be a star in this league. The injury thingy is true for every player in the league. LJ has not been prone to injury (did somebody imply that?dunno). I think LJ needs to work on his pass-catching abilities a little more, but he's a great runner. He's also improved his blocking skills, but needs to keep improving in that area. Solid, strong NFL back. I'm glad he's a Chief.
He'll take longer to develop his receiving and blocking skills because of the archaic offensive system at Penn State. Running backs run, and that's about it.

Don't get me wrong, he did it REALLY well his senior season.

beer bacon
08-07-2005, 12:12 PM
12.6 yards per catch is pretty poor for a RB.

jspchief
08-07-2005, 12:38 PM
12.6 yards per catch is pretty poor for a RB.What? Is that post missing a sarcasm smiley?

Only two RBs (with significant attempts) averaged higher than LJ last year (Tatume Bell and Stephen Davis).

penchief
08-07-2005, 02:11 PM
ROFL

Are you kidding? He had a good half season.

True, but given a chance he's never done poorly. He's always done what he continues to do. He proved last season that what he did at Penn State was no fluke. From all reports coming out of training camp it seems like people are bracing for him to do even better than he did last year. Maybe it's just me but I think he can duplicate his senior season at Penn State in the pros. I don't think a 2000 yard season is out of the question for a back with LJ's attributes. He's deceptively elusive and fast in the open field. Plus, he likes to dish out punishment.

penchief
08-07-2005, 02:15 PM
He'll take longer to develop his receiving and blocking skills because of the archaic offensive system at Penn State. Running backs run, and that's about it.

Don't get me wrong, he did it REALLY well his senior season.

I won't argue with anyone that says he needs to keep working on his blocking but I believe his receiving skills are good enough already. Anybody who has seen him catch the swing pass in college can testify to that. Anytime you get him somewhat isolated with the ball (even in the flats) he's a threat to break a long one.

JMO.

Bowser
08-07-2005, 03:10 PM
Who was the last Penn State running back that wouldn't be considered a bust (pre-LJ)? Curt Warner of the Seahawks?

SNR
08-07-2005, 03:16 PM
Who was the last Penn State running back that wouldn't be considered a bust (pre-LJ)? Curt Warner of the Seahawks?Curt Enis of the Bears had the talent. The Bears sorely misused him and eventually his career dwindled to the nothing it started from.

KCChiefsMan
08-07-2005, 03:31 PM
I can only think of 2 RBs that were "cursed" from Penn State: Ki-Jana Carter and Curtis Enis, I wouldn't really call that a curse

Rudy lost the toss
08-07-2005, 04:15 PM
I can only think of 2 RBs that were "cursed" from Penn State: Ki-Jana Carter and Curtis Enis, I wouldn't really call that a curse
add Blair Thomas and John Cappelletti. am I missing anybody else?

penchief
08-08-2005, 07:10 AM
add Blair Thomas and John Cappelletti. am I missing anybody else?

When people talk about Penn State running backs they tend to forget about the success stories. Lydell Mitchell, Franco Harris, and Curt Warner were all great pros.

Saulbadguy
08-08-2005, 07:14 AM
I heard on a radio sports talk show that LJ averaged more than 8 yards per carry during his career at PSU. Let's see, isn't that against Big 10 competition? From what I've seen, LJ could take over the position right now. I don't think he's a fluke at all.
In his senior campaign, he always ran wild under the St Marys school for the blind (2002 vs Lousiana Tech, NEBRASKA, Northwestern,etc..), but when he faced tough competition he was always stuffed (2002 vs Iowa, Michigan, Ohio State). Thats what I remember people knocking him for on draft day, at least.

DJay23
08-08-2005, 07:15 AM
I won't argue with anyone that says he needs to keep working on his blocking but I believe his receiving skills are good enough already. Anybody who has seen him catch the swing pass in college can testify to that. Anytime you get him somewhat isolated with the ball (even in the flats) he's a threat to break a long one.

JMO.
I remember that senior season watching them throw him that big wide sweep play. You knew it was coming, they knew it was coming, but still no one could stop him from taking it 60 yards to pay dirt.

I honestly don't recall him catching a lot of passes, but those sweeps were a thing of beauty. In fact, the game against MSU where he was trying to break 2000 (didn't he have some ungodly number by halftime, like 200 plus yards?) that seemed like every play. His O line really put up for him that day.

htismaqe
08-08-2005, 07:37 AM
I remember that senior season watching them throw him that big wide sweep play. You knew it was coming, they knew it was coming, but still no one could stop him from taking it 60 yards to pay dirt.

I honestly don't recall him catching a lot of passes, but those sweeps were a thing of beauty. In fact, the game against MSU where he was trying to break 2000 (didn't he have some ungodly number by halftime, like 200 plus yards?) that seemed like every play. His O line really put up for him that day.

I distinctly remember his senior game against Iowa. Iowa was very stout against the run that year and he couldn't do anything against them. But they kept hitting him with short passes out of the backfield and he was effective.

DJay23
08-08-2005, 07:41 AM
I distinctly remember his senior game against Iowa. Iowa was very stout against the run that year and he couldn't do anything against them. But they kept hitting him with short passes out of the backfield and he was effective.
ok, i'm convinced. i don't watch a lot of penn state football games, but i watched quite a few toward the end of that season to see if he would reach 2000.

htismaqe
08-08-2005, 08:04 AM
ok, i'm convinced. i don't watch a lot of penn state football games, but i watched quite a few toward the end of that season to see if he would reach 2000.

http://www.gopsusports.com/docs/football02/stats/psuiowa.htm

18 carries for 68 yards, 6 receptions for 93 yards

Rukdafaidas
08-08-2005, 08:10 AM
http://www.kcchiefs.com/news/2005/08/08/gretz_the_star_of_camp/GRETZ: The Star of Camp
Aug 08, 2005, 8:12:25 AM by Bob Gretz - FAQ


RIVER FALLS, WI – The Chiefs will have their 20th training camp practice Monday morning. They are more than halfway through with this year’s summer sojourn to the northwoods.

Without question, the most impressive player in this camp so far has been a Johnson, and his name is not Derrick. The most impressive player has been a running back and his name is not Priest Holmes.

No, the star of this camp so far has been Larry Johnson.

Maybe it’s the increased opportunities, since Holmes gets the morning practice off each day. Maybe it’s the maturity of being in the league for year No. three. Maybe it’s theljcamp confidence he gained with his play at the end of last season. Maybe it’s all those things and several more.

What matters is that Johnson has been sensational in this camp. He has run with speed, but most impressively he’s run with great toughness. In goal line and red zone situations, he’s exploding after the handoff, like he’s been shot off the deck of an aircraft carrier by some giant catapult.

During the Chiefs Saturday night practice, he ran through LB Keyaron Fox to get into the end zone. Several nights earlier, his first short yardage run ended up with his helmet being ripped off. From that point on, he was a missile, running over people and dragging them on his back.

He’s catching the ball as well. The other night, he made a catch in space, grabbing the ball as it came in over his head without breaking stride. Johnson ended up in the end zone.

We saw all of these traits during the last six weeks of the 2004 season, when injuries to Holmes and Derrick Blaylock made Johnson the featured runner. What we are seeing here in River Falls is this: that performance was no mirage, no flash in the pan.

And on top of this, Johnson is doing this with a smile on his face. For a man who seemed to wear a perpetual frown during his first two seasons with the team, L.J. is enjoying himself. Again, part of that is maturity. He’s quick to admit that he didn’t always handle himself in the best manner possible and that he learned a lot from those two years.

The biggest part of that smile comes from his knowing there’s more of a role for him in this offense. Blaylock is gone, so there’s no doubt who the backup running back is behind Holmes. Plus, there’s a personnel package that has both Holmes and Johnson on the field together.

“The picture is a lot clearer now,” said Johnson. “I think I showed everyone last year what I can do. I’m ready to do that again.”

Now the question becomes: how much time is Johnson going to get on the field when the regular season starts in September? When given a chance, Dick Vermeil says he’s a guy who believes in one primary running back. There’s no committee when it comes to his running game.

He’s shown that over the last four years with Holmes. In the 54 games that Holmes has been available to the Chiefs in 2001-04, he’s had 73 percent of the team’s running plays. No one in franchise history has so dominated the running game. In the 1989 season when he led the league in rushing, Christian Okoye had 66.2 percent of the running plays. In 1967, Mike Garrett had 51.1 percent of the team’s carries. No other backs have been over 50 percent. Hank Stram and Marty Schottenheimer both liked the “running back by committee’’ approach.

Holmes’ age and recent injuries (hip, knee) that cost him 10 games in the last three seasons has everyone talking about lightening his load. Everyone that is, but Holmes, who doesn’t see the need for fewer carries.

Right now, there’s another reason not to ride the Holmes horse into the ground: Larry Johnson. With the kind of performances he’s putting on twice-a-day in this training camp, he must become a bigger part of this offense than the 27 percent of the running plays that do not go to Holmes.

The opinions offered in this column do not necessarily reflect those of the Kansas City Chiefs.

A former beat reporter who covered the Pittsburgh Steelers during their glory years, Gretz covered the Chiefs for the Kansas City Star for nine years before heading up KCFX-FM's sports department. He is a member of the Pro Football Hall of Fame's Board of Selectors. His column appears three times a week during the season.

htismaqe
08-08-2005, 08:12 AM
Gretz' comments echo those of just about everybody else at camp.

penchief
08-08-2005, 05:39 PM
In his senior campaign, he always ran wild under the St Marys school for the blind (2002 vs Lousiana Tech, NEBRASKA, Northwestern,etc..), but when he faced tough competition he was always stuffed (2002 vs Iowa, Michigan, Ohio State). Thats what I remember people knocking him for on draft day, at least.

He's had good games against big schools. In fact, if you take a closer look at those games that some say he got stuffed, you'll see that he had a lot of yards receiving. If I remember correctly, against Michigan State he rushed for over 250 yards in the first half alone!

penchief
08-08-2005, 05:41 PM
I remember that senior season watching them throw him that big wide sweep play. You knew it was coming, they knew it was coming, but still no one could stop him from taking it 60 yards to pay dirt.

I honestly don't recall him catching a lot of passes, but those sweeps were a thing of beauty. In fact, the game against MSU where he was trying to break 2000 (didn't he have some ungodly number by halftime, like 200 plus yards?) that seemed like every play. His O line really put up for him that day.

Yeah, I should have finished reading the thread before I responded to any posts. It looks like you guys already covered the ground I attempted to.