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jAZ
08-17-2005, 01:13 AM
Isreal exiting Gaza? Maybe I missed one, but this is pretty historic stuff going on (and a somewhat promising atmosphere of concession).

Why is this off the radar in DC?

DenverChief
08-17-2005, 02:38 AM
:shrug: no bleeding

Simplex3
08-17-2005, 03:34 AM
Isreal exiting Gaza? Maybe I missed one, but this is pretty historic stuff going on (and a somewhat promising atmosphere of concession).

Why is this off the radar in DC?
...because it won't actually mean jack squat? Israel leaving some small piece of the ME doesn't give the Arabs their stated goal of "killing al the Jews".

I'm not sure why anyone thinks we should negotiate with religious zealots.

You're a lib, do you think you should concede ground on abortion rights to the religious right? Hell no you don't. Why? You know full well that they won't stop until they make abortion illegal. Since they're totally unreasonable you might as well not bow to them at all.

Same with these nuts in the ME. They've stated that their goal is a world under Islamic law and that anything less displeases their god. You can't negotiate with that, you can only kill it or ignore it.

trndobrd
08-17-2005, 04:20 AM
Neither the Moonbats nor Nutjobs can use the events in Gaza to score 'points' against Bush or Dean.

Brock
08-17-2005, 06:50 AM
It will be interesting to see what the Palestinians do with it. I predict that the land the Israelis left behind will look like most any other turd world country within a month. Transformed from suburbs to tent cities complete with raw sewage running through the streets.

memyselfI
08-17-2005, 06:53 AM
I was wondering the same thing yesterday...

I suspect it's due to the lack of blood and upset (save for Fox News attempts this morning) and because it's the right thing to do.

mlyonsd
08-17-2005, 07:04 AM
Probably because no one can argue this is not a good step.

Every US administration since the 6 day war has warned Israel not to build on the Gaza strip. Then one of the biggest warhawks in Israel that had a hand in building settlements goes against that thought process and forces his own people out?

I think it's one of those few times we all agree it's a good thing. At least for now. Now it's time for the Palestineans to step up.

Taco John
08-17-2005, 09:08 AM
Ladies and Gentlemen... We have blood:

CNN Breaking News:
-- Three reported dead, two wounded after Jewish settler opens fire on Palestinians in West Bank, Israeli police say.

Uatu
08-17-2005, 09:22 AM
Wow. I am so surprised that there was some violence. I just cannot believe that this happened.

I think Americans have a hard time caring about Israel vs. Islamic extremist violence. It's not really new, it's always been this way. People have become desensitized to it. Are you shocked and outraged when some terrorist nutjob blows up a busload of women and children? Sure, somewhere deep down inside you are, but most of you has seen that news story a million times before so it doesn't register as anything out of the ordinary.

I guess it doesn't seem like a ton of people here feel they have much of a connection to what is going on, and news of bloodshed out of there isn't really anything uncommon so people are desensitized.

Adept Havelock
08-17-2005, 09:41 AM
Neither the Moonbats nor Nutjobs can use the events in Gaza to score 'points' against Bush or Dean.

Ding Ding Ding! We Have a winner!

Give that poster a kewpie doll!

Chief Henry
08-17-2005, 09:53 AM
What if PEACE does break out between the Jews and Palestians ?

DanT
08-17-2005, 09:54 AM
Ladies and Gentlemen... We have blood:

CNN Breaking News:
-- Three reported dead, two wounded after Jewish settler opens fire on Palestinians in West Bank, Israeli police say.

There's already been blood spilled. Here's a BBC news story from August 5.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4746591.stm

Israeli gunman kills four on bus

An Israeli soldier has shot dead four Israeli Arabs on a bus, and was then killed by an angry crowd.
The 19-year-old gunman, believed to have deserted in protest against the Gaza pullout this month, opened fire as the bus passed through Shfaram.

Prime Minister Ariel Sharon called the incident a reprehensible act by a "bloodthirsty terrorist".

The gunman was beaten to death by a crowd of people who stormed the bus after his weapon ran out of bullets.

Israel is preparing to pull its settlers and soldiers out of the Gaza Strip and correspondents say there have been fears of attacks by Jewish settlers opposed to the pullout.

'Deserter'

The gunman, Eden Nathan Zaada from the Jewish settlement of Tapuah in the West Bank, wore his army uniform and a skullcap.

According to one eyewitness, the soldier opened fire while talking to the bus driver, who is thought to be one of those killed.


The 19-year-old is said to have deserted his army unit with his gun

At least 12 people were wounded in the shooting, some seriously.

Mohammed Barakeh, an Israeli Arab member of parliament, said at the scene that the dead were Israeli Arabs and all residents of Shfaram.

Israel media are reporting that the army said Mr Zaada had a "problematic background". He was believed to be a member of the outlawed extremist Kach party.

He is said to have deserted his unit a few weeks ago, after refusing to take part in the evacuation of Jewish settlements.

The father of the gunman, Yitzhak Nathan Zaada, said he had asked the army to find his son.

"I wasn't afraid he would do something," he told the Associated Press news agency, adding that his son had told him he would find the time to return his gun.

Protest fear

Israel's chief of police has dispatched an extra 2,000 officers and urged all Israelis to remain calm.

Moshe Karadi asked people to await an official inquiry into the incident.



Mr Sharon condemned the attack.

"This terror incident is a deliberate attempt to harm the relations between the citizens of Israel," he said.

"Terror between civilians is the most dangerous thing for the future of Israel and its democratic stability," he added.

Settler groups have also denounced the violence.

"Murder is murder is murder, and there can be no other response but to denounce it completely and express revulsion," Bentsi Lieberman, the head of a settlers' council, told AP.

The bloodiest single attack on Palestinians by a Jewish extremist dates back to 1994 when US-born Jewish Baruch Goldstein shot dead 29 Muslims at a mosque in the West Bank city of Hebron.

beavis
08-17-2005, 01:28 PM
I suspect it's due to the lack of blood and upset (save for Fox News attempts this morning) and because it's the right thing to do.
Define irony.

memyselfI
08-17-2005, 01:33 PM
Define irony.

Yeah, it might be ironic if there weren't 1800+ Americans who aren't bleeding any more...


because they are DEAD. :rolleyes:

Area 51
08-17-2005, 01:37 PM
Yeah, it might be ironic if there weren't 1800+ Americans who aren't bleeding any more...


because they are DEAD.

You are one sick individual!!!

memyselfI
08-17-2005, 01:42 PM
You are one sick individual!!!

Correction, the truth and reality of the situation is sick.

Stating the obvious about the truth is not.

Area 51
08-17-2005, 01:45 PM
Correction, the truth and reality of the situation is sick.

Stating the obvious about the truth is not.

There can be no correction when it comes to your attitude!!

I was talking about your penchant for always attacking anything to do with American government, especially if the party in question isn't the one you believe in. You remain a sick individual.

memyselfI
08-17-2005, 01:50 PM
There can be no correction when it comes to your attitude!!

I was talking about your penchant for always attacking anything to do with American government, especially if the party in question isn't the one you believe in. You remain a sick individual.

No, what is sick is having a President distort and deceive the truth he told to the American people in order for them to support his war and aid his buddies in profiteering off of deaths of American people...both those who died in 9/11 and those who have died in his 'WOT' in Iraq.

THAT is sick. Those, like you, who have bought into or continue to shill for this man are not sick...just fools.

Area 51
08-17-2005, 01:56 PM
No, what is sick is having a President distort and deceive the truth he told to the American people in order for them to support his war and aid his buddies in profiteering off of deaths of American people...both those who died in 9/11 and those who have died in his 'WOT' in Iraq.

THAT is sick. Those, like you, who have bought into or continue to shill for this man are not sick...just fools.

What is truly sick is that you don't consider what the truth of the matter is before you determine that someone is wrong. Your outlook on the Global War on Terrorism is a little skewed, I would guess that your background or family ties have led you to present the anti-American persona that you do.

What you are saying is that anyone that supports the government of the U.S. (the current administration) are fools. You say that without knowing if those same people supported the administration of his predicessor. It's not an us against them war with most Americans, only those that are party specific and cannot learn to walk on both sides of the street. When a democrat is president we ALL walk on one side of the street and when it is a republican president we ALL walk on the other side. The bottom line is that we are all supposed to be Americans. You do not show that to me.

stevieray
08-17-2005, 01:57 PM
No, what is sick is having a President distort and deceive the truth he told to the American people in order for them to support his war and aid his buddies in profiteering off of deaths of American people...both those who died in 9/11 and those who have died in his 'WOT' in Iraq.

THAT is sick. Those, like you, who have bought into or continue to shill for this man are not sick...just fools.

ROFL

Uatu
08-17-2005, 02:23 PM
Bush is the devil. Bush lied people died. Bush started the war just to help out his rich buddies. Bush eats babies. Bush let 9/11 happen. No more blood for oil. If your opinion is different than mine you are sick. By the way, Bush is still the devil. You are a shill and a fool. And Bush is to blame for everything bad and stuff. You're stupid if you disagree with me.

Glad we could clear that up.

memyselfI
08-17-2005, 02:36 PM
What is truly sick is that you don't consider what the truth of the matter is before you determine that someone is wrong. Your outlook on the Global War on Terrorism is a little skewed, I would guess that your background or family ties have led you to present the anti-American persona that you do.

What you are saying is that anyone that supports the government of the U.S. (the current administration) are fools. You say that without knowing if those same people supported the administration of his predicessor. It's not an us against them war with most Americans, only those that are party specific and cannot learn to walk on both sides of the street. When a democrat is president we ALL walk on one side of the street and when it is a republican president we ALL walk on the other side. The bottom line is that we are all supposed to be Americans. You do not show that to me.

My view on this issue is was formulated because I looked at facts and history and the culture of the region...as had some of DUHbya's own advisors when they recommended to him NOT to pursue this course. I'm guessing that their background or family issues were not blamed for their view. :rolleyes:

Fact is that many people supported the President WITHOUT QUESTION. That was presented as the 'patriotic' way to 'support' America and the troops. It was bull shit. It gave the Administration carte blanche to do whatever it wanted to do without sufficient oversight or explanation to the American people. Instead, at every turn the WH has acted that questioning the President was akin to supporting the terrorists...

remember the 'you are with us or against us?' Remember when it was Ari Fleicher who said something to the effect of dissent should be discouraged or stopped at a time of war.

MOF, I was actually heartened to see DUHbya SUPPORTING Cindy Sheehan's right to protest, right to question and doubt, right to express herself AS AN AMERICAN. Unfortunately, while he was speaking these words his RWNJ machine was doing it's best to undermine Ms. Sheehan and portray her as some psycho hippy Mom who's prostituted herself to leftwing moonbats. :rolleyes:

Bottom line, the people who supported the POTUS without question ARE FOOLS. They are not more American or more patriotic but rather more willing to suspend their good judgement when told they should...fools.

memyselfI
08-17-2005, 02:38 PM
Glad we could clear that up.

Glad that as a newbie you figured out how to make a quote that is a fraud and untrue because it was never spoken. You should be so proud. :clap:

Radar Chief
08-17-2005, 02:51 PM
No, what is sick is having a President distort and deceive the truth he told to the American people in order for them to support his war and aid his buddies in profiteering off of deaths of American people...both those who died in 9/11 and those who have died in his 'WOT' in Iraq.

THAT is sick. Those, like you, who have bought into or continue to shill for this man are not sick...just fools.

The Algerian Connection
Why did Saddam financially support an al Qaeda affiliate in Algeria?
by Thomas Joscelyn
08/03/2005 12:00:00 AM
LATE LAST MONTH an Algerian-born terrorist named Ahmed Ressam received a commuted sentence of 22 years (prosecutors had recommended 35 years) in prison for his role in planning to blow up the Los Angeles airport. His sentence infuriated many since his involvement in the plot against LAX was immediately transparent. After all, he was captured in December 1999 after driving off a ferry from British Columbia in a vehicle laden with bomb-making explosives.
Ressam received a commuted sentence after providing investigators with good intelligence about the al Qaeda network which spawned the plot. (Ressam has since stopped cooperating.) Indeed, Ressam's failed attempt against LAX was part of a series of al Qaeda-related attacks against targets around the world (in Jordan, Australia, and elsewhere) at the turn of the new millennium. There is still much about these planned attacks we do not know.
Ressam's story, like that of so many other al Qaeda-affiliated terrorists, contains an endless list of murky connections to a host of nefarious people and groups. The most troubling of these ties is to al Qaeda's Algerian affiliates, the Armed Islamic Group (aka the "GIA") and its descendant, the Salafi Group for Preaching and Combat (the "GSPC"). The history of the GIA is an especially violent one and Ressam is just one of many terrorists to have operated under its auspices. Indeed, the Algerian tentacle of the vast terror network executed scores of lethal attacks spanning more than a decade.
IT IS A CURIOUS FACT, then, that Saddam Hussein provided financial
assistance to the GIA when it was in its earliest stages of germination. There is still much we do not know about Saddam's relationship with al Qaeda's Algerian affiliate. But, Iraq's relationship with the GIA warrants further investigation given its tortuous history.
THE ROOTS OF SADDAM'S RELATIONSHIP with the GIA trace back to the 1991 Gulf War. The group's early history is particularly useful in understanding why Saddam would offer the GIA his support.
As the war approached, Saddam sought and received support from a conspicuous group of Islamist radicals. Among them was the Sudanese leader Hassan al-Turabi and an Algerian Islamist named Abbas Madani, both of whom traveled to Baghdad in the months prior to the war and declared their support for Saddam.
Madani was then the leader of Algeria's Islamic Salvation Front (the "FIS"), which was a consortium of four Islamist parties formed to obtain democratically-elected political power. Madani was somewhat more tempered in his support for Saddam than his cohort, Ali Benhadj, because he feared (correctly) that support for Saddam would end Saudi financial support for the FIS. Benhadj overcame Madani's reticence, however, and moved the FIS firmly into Saddam's camp. According to Gilles Keppel (Jihad, The Trail of Political Islam), Benhadj--who was accompanied by "a detachment of Afghan-garbed jihadists fresh from Peshawar"--took to the streets and "delivered a harangue in front of the [Algerian] Ministry of Defense in which he demanded the formation of a corps of volunteers to join the forces of Saddam Hussein."
Writing in Al Qaeda's Armies, Middle East expert Jonathan Schanzer explains that as the Gulf War neared the "FIS became increasingly pro-Iraq and anti-U.S., as seen through their slogans, protests, and even training camps for volunteers to fight for Saddam Hussein's Iraq. The U.S. conflict with Iraq was a powerful symbol of FIS's soaring popularity."

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/919kltpp.asp

Uatu
08-17-2005, 02:55 PM
Glad that as a newbie you figured out how to make a quote that is a fraud and untrue because it was never spoken. You should be so proud. :clap:

When you were neutered they must have lopped off your sense of humor too.

|Zach|
08-17-2005, 03:16 PM
To be fair Area 51, you also think people who don't like political parties hate America. Anyone you want to add to the "hating america" list.

Saulbadguy
08-17-2005, 03:18 PM
Ladies and Gentlemen... We have blood:

CNN Breaking News:
-- Three reported dead, two wounded after Jewish settler opens fire on Palestinians in West Bank, Israeli police say.
I'm no geography expert, but the west bank isn't the gaza strip.

Area 51
08-17-2005, 03:18 PM
My view on this issue is was formulated because I looked at facts and history and the culture of the region...as had some of DUHbya's own advisors when they recommended to him NOT to pursue this course. I'm guessing that their background or family issues were not blamed for their view. :rolleyes:

Fact is that many people supported the President WITHOUT QUESTION. That was presented as the 'patriotic' way to 'support' America and the troops. It was bull shit. It gave the Administration carte blanche to do whatever it wanted to do without sufficient oversight or explanation to the American people. Instead, at every turn the WH has acted that questioning the President was akin to supporting the terrorists...

remember the 'you are with us or against us?' Remember when it was Ari Fleicher who said something to the effect of dissent should be discouraged or stopped at a time of war.

MOF, I was actually heartened to see DUHbya SUPPORTING Cindy Sheehan's right to protest, right to question and doubt, right to express herself AS AN AMERICAN. Unfortunately, while he was speaking these words his RWNJ machine was doing it's best to undermine Ms. Sheehan and portray her as some psycho hippy Mom who's prostituted herself to leftwing moonbats. :rolleyes:

Bottom line, the people who supported the POTUS without question ARE FOOLS. They are not more American or more patriotic but rather more willing to suspend their good judgement when told they should...fools.

Bottom line, you are a fool because you supported Clinton blindly during his tenure as president, just like you will be a fool if Hilary is elected to office because she is a democrat first. Your arguments are only that arguments because you have no firm ground to stand on. You Charlie Brown on issues only to suit your need to show disdain for the U.S.

Area 51
08-17-2005, 03:19 PM
To be fair Area 51, you also think people who don't like political parties hate America. Anyone you want to add to the "hating america" list.

Let's just add you because you fall into the idiots list.

memyselfI
08-17-2005, 03:19 PM
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/919kltpp.asp

From the article:

'Ressam's story, like that of so many other al Qaeda-affiliated terrorists, contains an endless list of murky connections to a host of nefarious people and groups...'

'We traced considerable sums of money going from bin Laden to the GIA in Algeria. We believed some of the money came from Iraq'...




So 1800+ Americans and tens of thousands of Iraqi's have died not because of 'WMD' and not to secure 'democracy' in Iraq but because of 'murky connections' and beliefs? :hmmm:

Yeah, that's a definite improvement.

|Zach|
08-17-2005, 03:20 PM
Let's just add you because you fall into the idiots list.I am just repeating what you have told me before....did I misquote you?

memyselfI
08-17-2005, 03:25 PM
Bottom line, you are a fool because you supported Clinton blindly during his tenure as president, just like you will be a fool if Hilary is elected to office because she is a democrat first. Your arguments are only that arguments because you have no firm ground to stand on. You Charlie Brown on issues only to suit your need to show disdain for the U.S.

Actually, I did not support Clinton without question. I will not support ANY political party/candidate, let alone the President, without question.

And if there is no one with firm ground to stand on it would you and your ilk, from quoting the president's biased and altered intelligence, to quoting military press releases, to doing your best Baghdad Bob impersonations...

show me some good news from Iraq (arbitrary US created deadlines and political goals aside) and then we'll talk. FTR, the last person who was challanged to do this could not find anything not military press released.

Radar Chief
08-17-2005, 03:28 PM
From the article:

'Ressam's story, like that of so many other al Qaeda-affiliated terrorists, contains an endless list of murky connections to a host of nefarious people and groups...'

'We traced considerable sums of money going from bin Laden to the GIA in Algeria. We believed some of the money came from Iraq'...




So 1800+ Americans and tens of thousands of Iraqi's have died not because of 'WMD' and not to secure 'democracy' in Iraq but because of 'murky connections' and beliefs? :hmmm:

Yeah, that's a definite improvement.

Please quote where that has been posted, or provide a link.

memyselfI
08-17-2005, 03:29 PM
Please quote where that has been posted, or provide a link.

Did ya not read your own linked article?

Here is the link to your link:

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/919kltpp.asp

Radar Chief
08-17-2005, 03:31 PM
http://www.comics.com/editoons/chappatte/archive/images/chappatte2915670050815.gif

Radar Chief
08-17-2005, 03:33 PM
Did ya not read your own linked article?

Here is the link to your link:

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/919kltpp.asp

Yes, in fact I did read the entire story and unfortunately for your mental stability it doesn’t say anything ‘bout the war in Iraq “not being about WMD’s or securing democracy”. Maybe you got that from the voices in your head? ROFL

memyselfI
08-17-2005, 03:36 PM
Yes, in fact I did read the entire story and unfortunately for your mental stability it doesn’t say anything ‘bout the war in Iraq “not being about WMD’s or securing democracy”. Maybe you got that from the voices in your head? ROFL

No, you were posting that article as some kind of proof of a link in response to my assertion that the president distorted and deceived. My question was posed based on your article.



Today, 03:51 PM
Post #24
Radar Chief
Definition: Power Steering
Radar Chief's Avatar
Joined: Mar 2001
Location: Chanute, KS

Quote:
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by memyselfI
No, what is sick is having a President distort and deceive the truth he told to the American people in order for them to support his war and aid his buddies in profiteering off of deaths of American people...both those who died in 9/11 and those who have died in his 'WOT' in Iraq.

THAT is sick. Those, like you, who have bought into or continue to shill for this man are not sick...just fools.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Algerian Connection
Why did Saddam financially support an al Qaeda affiliate in Algeria?
by Thomas Joscelyn
08/03/2005 12:00:00 AM
LATE LAST MONTH an Algerian-born terrorist named Ahmed Ressam received a commuted sentence of 22 years (prosecutors had recommended 35 years) in prison for his role in planning to blow up the Los Angeles airport. His sentence infuriated many since his involvement in the plot against LAX was immediately transparent. After all, he was captured in December 1999 after driving off a ferry from British Columbia in a vehicle laden with bomb-making explosives.
Ressam received a commuted sentence after providing investigators with good intelligence about the al Qaeda network which spawned the plot. (Ressam has since stopped cooperating.) Indeed, Ressam's failed attempt against LAX was part of a series of al Qaeda-related attacks against targets around the world (in Jordan, Australia, and elsewhere) at the turn of the new millennium. There is still much about these planned attacks we do not know.
Ressam's story, like that of so many other al Qaeda-affiliated terrorists, contains an endless list of murky connections to a host of nefarious people and groups. The most troubling of these ties is to al Qaeda's Algerian affiliates, the Armed Islamic Group (aka the "GIA") and its descendant, the Salafi Group for Preaching and Combat (the "GSPC"). The history of the GIA is an especially violent one and Ressam is just one of many terrorists to have operated under its auspices. Indeed, the Algerian tentacle of the vast terror network executed scores of lethal attacks spanning more than a decade.
IT IS A CURIOUS FACT, then, that Saddam Hussein provided financial
assistance to the GIA when it was in its earliest stages of germination. There is still much we do not know about Saddam's relationship with al Qaeda's Algerian affiliate. But, Iraq's relationship with the GIA warrants further investigation given its tortuous history.
THE ROOTS OF SADDAM'S RELATIONSHIP with the GIA trace back to the 1991 Gulf War. The group's early history is particularly useful in understanding why Saddam would offer the GIA his support.
As the war approached, Saddam sought and received support from a conspicuous group of Islamist radicals. Among them was the Sudanese leader Hassan al-Turabi and an Algerian Islamist named Abbas Madani, both of whom traveled to Baghdad in the months prior to the war and declared their support for Saddam.
Madani was then the leader of Algeria's Islamic Salvation Front (the "FIS"), which was a consortium of four Islamist parties formed to obtain democratically-elected political power. Madani was somewhat more tempered in his support for Saddam than his cohort, Ali Benhadj, because he feared (correctly) that support for Saddam would end Saudi financial support for the FIS. Benhadj overcame Madani's reticence, however, and moved the FIS firmly into Saddam's camp. According to Gilles Keppel (Jihad, The Trail of Political Islam), Benhadj--who was accompanied by "a detachment of Afghan-garbed jihadists fresh from Peshawar"--took to the streets and "delivered a harangue in front of the [Algerian] Ministry of Defense in which he demanded the formation of a corps of volunteers to join the forces of Saddam Hussein."
Writing in Al Qaeda's Armies, Middle East expert Jonathan Schanzer explains that as the Gulf War neared the "FIS became increasingly pro-Iraq and anti-U.S., as seen through their slogans, protests, and even training camps for volunteers to fight for Saddam Hussein's Iraq. The U.S. conflict with Iraq was a powerful symbol of FIS's soaring popularity."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Conte...05/919kltpp.asp

Phobia
08-17-2005, 03:43 PM
I have a former employee who is over there right now as part of his college studies. I don't know why I'm sharing that information. I think he's crazy.

|Zach|
08-17-2005, 03:53 PM
I am just repeating what you have told me before....did I misquote you?I guess not.

Chief Henry
08-17-2005, 03:57 PM
No, what is sick is having a President distort and deceive the truth he told to the American people in order for them to support his war and aid his buddies in profiteering off of deaths of American people...both those who died in 9/11 and those who have died in his 'WOT' in Iraq.

THAT is sick. Those, like you, who have bought into or continue to shill for this man are not sick...just fools.



:hmmm: Opinions are like AZZ HOLES

beavis
08-17-2005, 04:15 PM
When you were neutered they must have lopped off your sense of humor too.
What a shame I can't rep you two times in a row. Props to the new guy. ROFL

Logical
08-17-2005, 05:11 PM
Ladies and Gentlemen... We have blood:

CNN Breaking News:
-- Three reported dead, two wounded after Jewish settler opens fire on Palestinians in West Bank, Israeli police say.I thought the West Bank and Gaza were different areas.

Logical
08-17-2005, 05:18 PM
No, what is sick is having a President distort and deceive the truth he told to the American people in order for them to support his war and aid his buddies in profiteering off of deaths of American people...both those who died in 9/11 and those who have died in his 'WOT' in Iraq.

THAT is sick. Those, like you, who have bought into or continue to shill for this man are not sick...just fools.Sorry DEnise but just how did Bush and his Buddies profiteer off of 9/11. You want to say that about Iraq and I do not think I will disagree anymore. However I do not see them profiteering from 9/11, and I certainly don't think they caused 9/11 so they could profiteer.

Phobia
08-17-2005, 05:28 PM
Additionally, why does a President need to profit off anything? Anybody who makes the PotUS office is setup for life even if they shit the bed. They'll have appearance fees and everything paid for by the taxpayers from now until forever, essentially.

Taco John
08-17-2005, 07:15 PM
Violence Elsewhere Mars Pullout

(CBS/AP) Israeli troops dragged sobbing Jewish settlers out of Gaza homes, synagogues and even a nursery school Wednesday in a massive evacuation, fulfilling Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's promise to end Israel's 38-year occupation of the Gaza Strip.

But violence marred the evacuations: A right-wing West Bank settler opposed to Israel's pullout from the Gaza Strip set herself on fire Wednesday in Netivot, in another part of Israel, suffering life-threatening burns on 70 percent of her body. The 54-year-old woman had been carrying an anti-Gaza pullout sign.

According to reports, an Israeli resident of a West Bank settlement who worked as a driver for Palestinian industrial zone workers opened fire on his own passengers and other Palestinians, killing three and wounding two. Asher Weisgan allegedly took the gun from a security guard.

Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon on Wednesday condemned the shooting as an act of "Jewish terror" aimed at stopping the Gaza pullout.

Sharon said the shooting was "aimed against innocent Palestinians, out of twisted thinking, aimed at stopping the disengagement."

In Gaza, Hamas spokesman Mushir al-Masri vowed that "this crime is not going to pass without tough punishment. The enemy is opening the gate of revenge."

However, he also indicated the group might not want to disrupt the Gaza pullout by inviting Israeli retaliation.

"No one of us wants the occupation to stay or to obstruct their pulling out, but in the face of this series of crimes ... all options are open," he said.

For months, Israeli security officials have warned that Israeli extremists might try to sabotage the Gaza pullout by attacking Arabs in a bid to raise tensions and divert forces carrying out the withdrawal.

In the Gaza settlements, there was little actual violence, just resistance. Soldiers entered Gaza's largest synagogue in Neve Dekalim Wednesday to remove hundreds of worshippers, who had formed long lines and swayed in prayer. First, though, in an emotional show of unity, troops wearing flak jackets joined the ranks of the worshippers.

Nearly all the settlers taken out of the synagogue were in tears, and CBS News Correspondent Robert Berger reports seeing a squad of women soldiers hugging each other and weeping.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
CBS News Correspondent Robert Berger reports from the Neve Dekalim settlement.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Some 14,000 troops had entered five Jewish settlements — Morag, Neve Dekalim, Bedolah, Ganei Tal and Tel Katifa. Security officials said the goal was to clear out the 21 Gaza settlements in just a few days, far more quickly than originally planned.

Some teenage activists showed fierce resistance. Troops dragged flailing protesters, some as young as 12, onto the buses. "I want to die," screamed one youth as he was hauled away. Several soldiers were hit by white paint bombs, and protesters smashed the window of the bus.

Veteran residents repeatedly doused the flames raging in garbage containers and complained that the young die-hards had no right to cause trouble.

Most of the demonstrators weren't even from the settlements, reports CBS News Correspondent David Hawkins. They're hardliners from inside Israel or settlers from the West Bank who illegally snuck into the Gaza Strip to disrupt the disengagement.

"I'm sure that the activists from the outside will do as much as they can to stop police and government from doing their evil acts," said one as the evacuations began.

Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas urged restraint, telling Islamic preachers in his Gaza office: "We should let them go peacefully in order not to give them any reason to delay the evacuation."

The Palestinians have deployed thousands of troops to prevent any attacks on settlers or Israeli soldiers during the withdrawal. Palestinians have welcomed the evacuation but also fear that Israel is trying to draw borders without negotiations.

Abbas said the Palestinians will build a sea port at Netzarim and a new city at Morag. The Israelis will leave behind 152 public buildings inside the settlements that can be used by the Palestinians, he said. The army said it arrested 52 Israelis headed Wednesday to Homesh, one of the settlements slated for evacuation.

Once Gaza is cleared of civilians, it will take troops about a month to dismantle military installations and relinquish the coastal strip to Palestinian control.

Under Israel's plan to leave Gaza and four West Bank settlements, residents were given until midnight Tuesday to leave their homes or face forcible removal and the loss of up to one-third of government compensation. Officials said about half of Gaza's 8,500 settlers left before the deadline.

Stinger
08-17-2005, 07:50 PM
Glad that as a newbie you figured out how to make a quote that is a fraud and untrue because it was never spoken. You should be so proud. :clap:

Yes you should be proud you just opened up new doors to your future, you are now qualified to work for CBS or democratic underground.


ROFL ROFL ROFL

Oh the irony

Logical
08-17-2005, 08:17 PM
According to reports, an Israeli resident of a West Bank settlement who worked as a driver for Palestinian industrial zone workers opened fire on his own passengers and other Palestinians, killing three and wounding two. Asher Weisgan allegedly took the gun from a security guard.

Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon on Wednesday condemned the shooting as an act of "Jewish terror" aimed at stopping the Gaza pullout.

Sharon said the shooting was "aimed against innocent Palestinians, out of twisted thinking, aimed at stopping the disengagement."
That whole region is f*cked up in the way they think and organized religion is the primary cause.

Radar Chief
08-18-2005, 07:46 AM
No, you were posting that article as some kind of proof of a link in response to my assertion that the president distorted and deceived. My question was posed based on your article.

So let me get this straight, you post that the POTUS “distorted and deceived”. I post an article showing that a portion of what you’re claiming is false. You then attempt to build this straw man with false claims from the article I posted. Then when I burn your little straw man to the ground you continue to act indignant as if your ignorance is my fault? ROFL
Two words Denise, seek help. :shake:

Brock
08-18-2005, 09:19 AM
This only happened to draw attention away from huge mega-issues like Valerie Plame.

mlyonsd
08-18-2005, 09:21 AM
That whole region is f*cked up in the way they think and organized religion is the primary cause.

Compunded exponentially with the fact they're sitting on a crap load of oil.

memyselfI
08-18-2005, 01:23 PM
Sorry DEnise but just how did Bush and his Buddies profiteer off of 9/11. You want to say that about Iraq and I do not think I will disagree anymore. However I do not see them profiteering from 9/11, and I certainly don't think they caused 9/11 so they could profiteer.

Here are a few links to get you started:

http://www.hereinreality.com/carlyle.html

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,6903,953563,00.html
http://www.bushnews.com/bushcarlyle.htm

memyselfI
08-18-2005, 01:44 PM
So let me get this straight, you post that the POTUS “distorted and deceived”. I post an article showing that a portion of what you’re claiming is false. You then attempt to build this straw man with false claims from the article I posted. Then when I burn your little straw man to the ground you continue to act indignant as if your ignorance is my fault? ROFL
Two words Denise, seek help. :shake:

You are claiming my assertion is false due to an article that identified and described their own source with 'murky' connections and thei connection they detailed to be a 'belief.'

Yeah, that seems like proof enough to send 1800+ people to their deaths...Keep trying. If anyone needs help it's you and your pathetic psychotic denial. :thumb:

Radar Chief
08-18-2005, 01:57 PM
You are claiming my assertion is false due to an article that identified it's own source as 'murky' connections and the connection to be a 'belief.'

Yeah, that seems like proof enough to send 1800+ people to their deaths...Keep trying. If anyone needs help it's you and your pathetic psychotic denial. :thumb:

So now we move from your interpretation of the article claiming that the war in Iraq “wasn’t ‘bout WMD or securing democracy” to just making “murky connections”? I suppose that’s at least one step towards comprehension, though you’re the only one try’n to claim “that seems like proof enough”.
And just to help your reading comprehension classes along, this is what I actually posted.

So let me get this straight, you post that the POTUS “distorted and deceived”. I post an article showing that a portion of what you’re claiming is false. You then attempt to build this straw man with false claims from the article I posted. Then when I burn your little straw man to the ground you continue to act indignant as if your ignorance is my fault? ROFL
Two words Denise, seek help. :shake:

Why go so far out of you way to lie Denise, it’s not like anyone can’t look back and see what was actually posted.
How’s ‘bout you stop try’n to project meaning into my posts that they don’t contain, then seek help. :thumb:

Area 51
08-18-2005, 02:06 PM
So now we move from your interpretation of the article claiming that the war in Iraq “wasn’t ‘bout WMD or securing democracy” to just making “murky connections”? I suppose that’s at least one step towards comprehension, though you’re the only one try’n to claim “that seems like proof enough”.
And just to help your reading comprehension classes along, this is what I actually posted.



Why go so far out of you way to lie Denise, it’s not like anyone can’t look back and see what was actually posted.
How’s ‘bout you stop try’n to project meaning into my posts that they don’t contain, then seek help. :thumb:

Do not feed the wicked witch of the west!!!

memyselfI
08-18-2005, 02:08 PM
So now we move from your interpretation of the article claiming that the war in Iraq “wasn’t ‘bout WMD or securing democracy” to just making “murky connections”? I suppose that’s at least one step towards comprehension, though you’re the only one try’n to claim “that seems like proof enough”.
And just to help your reading comprehension classes along, this is what I actually posted.



Why go so far out of you way to lie Denise, it’s not like anyone can’t look back and see what was actually posted.
How’s ‘bout you stop try’n to project meaning into my posts that they don’t contain, then seek help. :thumb:

I wish they would go back. They'd see that you posted an article that included the descriptions that shed more doubt than they do light...OOOps. ROFL

You offered it as 'proof' to discredit my assertion of the administration distorting and deceiving. You are clinging to it like it's a life preserver and simultaneously trying to paint me out to be misunderstanding and miscontruing the intent of your post...

seems like DUHbya's lambs have truly personified their leader. Distort and deceive. He'd be so proud. :clap:

Radar Chief
08-18-2005, 02:24 PM
I wish they would go back. They'd see that you posted an article that included the descriptions that shed more doubt than they do light...OOOps. ROFL

You offered it as 'proof' to discredit my assertion of the administration distorting and deceiving. You are clinging to it like it's a life preserver and simultaneously trying to paint me out to be misunderstanding and miscontruing the intent of your post...

seems like DUHbya's lambs have truly personified their leader. Distort and deceive. He'd be so proud. :clap:

http://67.18.68.69/BB/showthread.php?t=120408

Gee Denise, you had ample opportunity to post on this topic when it was created with multiple links, not just the one I posted to you, showing how desperately you’re “clinging” to false accusations “like it’s a life preserver”. Why didn’t you post then? :hmmm:
I don’t need to “paint you as misunderstanding and misconstruing”, you’re doing a pretty good job of displaying you psychosis on you own. All I’ve done is point and laugh. ROFL Ooops.

memyselfI
08-18-2005, 03:25 PM
http://67.18.68.69/BB/showthread.php?t=120408

Gee Denise, you had ample opportunity to post on this topic when it was created with multiple links, not just the one I posted to you, showing how desperately you’re “clinging” to false accusations “like it’s a life preserver”. Why didn’t you post then? :hmmm:
I don’t need to “paint you as misunderstanding and misconstruing”, you’re doing a pretty good job of displaying you psychosis on you own. All I’ve done is point and laugh. ROFL Ooops.

Now trying deflection? ROFL ROFL :clap:

Radar Chief
08-18-2005, 03:29 PM
Now trying deflection? ROFL ROFL :clap:

:LOL: Call’n your shot? I agree, you were, glad you can now come to terms with it. :clap: :thumb:

memyselfI
08-18-2005, 03:36 PM
:LOL: Call’n your shot? I agree, you were, glad you can now come to terms with it. :clap: :thumb:

Keep goin, you might get there! ROFL
http://www.darwinvets.plus.com/images/topical/hamsters/hamster2.jpg

MOhillbilly
08-18-2005, 03:46 PM
SINCE MANY FAILED TO CHECK THIS OUT---------

This thread is mostly dedicated for those who still compair the IDF to the German army in the WW2. Living in Israel for the past 13 I have learned a lot on the rights and many wrongs of this country, but war crimes and excessive cruelty is deffinitly not one of them. I'll try to better explain the situation here, from my rather objective point of view on things because I'm too tired of foul accusations and meaningless ranting. Most of you don't know about this place more than you hear on the news, and frankly I don't blame you even if you reach your conclusions from only reading the headline in your daily paper at rush of day, I suppouse I would do the same if I were you.

No, I won't waste my time and yours by making Palestinians look like scum of the earth, as a matter of fact, I'll show you where Israel becomes scum of the earht, it's just not what most of you might think.

I started to write something last night, did it twice and the goddamn explorer died (I knew I should have used firefox!) so here I'll give it another try. Brace yourself, this is going to be a long one.


It is hard to ignore another news report telling a 12 y/o child was shot by an armed troop, but indeed easy to to ignore the sircumstances, which the media is often doing to get higher ratings. Like I mentioned before - the IDF doesn't target small children for fun like many heartbleeding hippies might think. The IDF is targeting activists of terroristic organizations such as the Hammas, Hisballah (mostly active in Lebanon/Syria) and the Islamic Jihad whom decided that murdering civilians inside Israel's territory is "kosher". The problem begins when these activists use a crowd of children and civilians as live shields or "mules" to smuggle warfare. Many of you probably asked yourself why in the hell this child was shot? How many of you asked yourself why wasn't this child at home or at school instead of a violent demonstration?
It is very common for terrorist activists to move arround densed streets crowded with people, knowing that the IDF might not target them there fearing of hurting civilians and even if so - they don't care, they want civilians to get killed to use that as an excuse to commit more acts of gore towards our civilians.


And now let's move to something more up to date. You probably all heard that we're finaly clearing out the settlements out of Gaza. You heard right, what you didn't hear is why are we only doing this now and who the hell are these settlers anyway.
Some of the settlements, the biggest ones, been there for over 30 years and that inspite the fact that we given up Gaza... wow, so long ago even I can't remember. We don't want/need Gaza just like we don't want/need the area of the Palestinian authority, unlike many of you may think. Why in the hell would we want a dense peice of land with 1.5 million Palestinians on it? To turn into a demographic problem? To collaps our welfare system (they all have 20 kids and they're dirt poor, we would need to support them)? Some people don't give a damn. And those are the people I want to discuss today.

The Settlers. Settlers is a weak word, here we use another word for them, a word that has no translation to other languages because of its encient biblical origin. What's so unique about them that we need to refer to them by this word? The fact that like the term they too cling on 3000 year old idea that they must have the Biblical Israel that stretches from Tzor (a city in Lebanon) to Gaza and from the Medeterenien Sea to the Prat and Achidekel rivers (today's Iraq). You and I, and everyone else in Israel, clearly understands that their ideals are irrational and insane and we're no longer living in 1340BC, but they don't see it that way. Like in every country, here too exists a single group of radical fanatics who makes less sense than my senile 87 year old neurotic grandma. These are our fanatics. They're only a small fracture of Israel's society yet their influence is greater than their size, and is thanks to our deeply rotten goverment.

Just to give you a better picture, unlike you guys, wherever you are, we don't have friendly trading relationships with our neighours but moreover - we do not have defined and fenced borders with them which makes it hard for us to controll the entrance of Illegals as well as terrorists, and both the terrorists and the settlers know it well. The settlers exploit this situation to start and "settle" in random locations inside or out the green line, against Israel's or International law. Of course we send our boys in olive green to kick them out but it's often harder than it seems. You clear one trailer from that hill, the next morning you discover another 10 on that same hill and arround it (yes, they're our version to hillbillies). It makes it even harder on us to rid of them when the goverment sides with them. Don't mention this situation is also confusing - we must obey our and international laws and keep them from starting illegal settlements yet on the other hand the goverment supports them.

So why in the hell a goverment would support an irrational group of fanatics that spits on the law? Same reason all politicans support shady people and organizations - votes. The votes in this country are more or less equaly divided between major parties and you can forsee about every goddamn election (that's why nobody gambles on it). The Easterners (Jews from the middle east and north Africa) will always vote for the rightwing (and perhaps most corrupted party) Likud "Because this is how it's been done since the 1970's and it shouldn't change now", while Ashkenazi (Eurojews) will most likely vote for a leftwing party like the Avoda or Meretz. That's where those stupid fanatics ge into the picture. Their votes could always go to some party as ****ed up and neurotic as they are that would never make the cut to join the parlament, but why? Their votes cost these parties the elections, therefore every goverment so far was supporting them, this way or another, so their votes are basicaly being sold and none of the sides has a problem with that.

To be honest, I, like many people in this country belive that those settlers are the root to ALL of our problems (if not the 2nd reason, after Palestinian extrimists) and here is why. If it's not enough that they spit on the law, but they spit on everything and everyone else. They're famous for their intolerance for Arabs (and everyone else for that matter) and they will often sabotage their daily life by setting their olive plantations on fire or just beating them up for no appearant reason... Don't get me wrong, they're not only hostile towards outsiders (and leftwingers) but also towards the men who watch their backs day at night, in cold wind and rain and scoarching sun - that's right, the IDF itself. Not once soldiers were forced to guard those dickweeds and instead of thanks they got holes in their tiers, sabotage in water supply and even some beatings. Why in the hell then? Are they insane? Well, yes but that's not why they do it. These settlers, just like your hillbillies, they too settle in remote areas, far from civilization. Why? Anarchy, that's why. With the nearest police station being 40 miles away, they can do whatever the **** they want and if soldiers come over, this means that they will try to stop them from setting up more trailer parks on these hills. Charming.

Just so that you know, none of us soldiers or reservers wants to babysit those assholes. If it weren't for them, these soldiers could be at home ****ing their girlfriends or perhaps fighting a real war - hunting Hammas activists. But no, they got to play the nanny. It's quite a confusing job, I must say. On the one hand, the law tells us to kick them the **** out. On the other hand the goverment tells us to sit there and guard them. Trust me, if we could we'd probably get up and go home and let those assholes watch their own back and we wouldn't care less if Arabs or wolves would eat them alive in this wilderness, but apperantly our politicans care - it's their votes we're talking about, don't forget... Votes come first to soldiers and civilians!

So, here I given you a quite accurate picture of the Settlers that mostly settle in the west bank, but let us now go back to Gaza. Like I said before, Gaza was returned... Hell knows when, but for the past 30 years people are living there and like they already said - they have no intention to leave. Yes, we too understand this is highly unacceptable that a small group of fanatics will settle in the heart of a population of 1.5 million Arabs, dense them up, disrupt their movement and be ****tards in general but hey - they're our goverment's rotten fruits - they're votes! Unlike the settlers in the west bank, those in Gaza are not all there because of ideology. They're not all religious fanatics. Almost half of them are there because they wanted a 2-3 story cottage with a view to the beach (like they can't get in Israel 'cause it's expensive and you're not allowed to build 100m from the beach). You all seen the pretty peach-beige houses with the red chip roofs. Cute, huh? Yeah, a house like that could easily summ up to roughly 2 million dollars. Where in the hell would those dickweeds come up with such money? I point my finger at the goverment again. They're buying votes, from money/bennifits, not bananas. They actualy sold them this land for 2 cents a hektar which left them plenty of cash to build a castle if they wanted to. The goverment also subsidized paving of roads, many of which are created to go arround Arab villages and cost us up to billiards. But the cause sacrifices the means, doesn't it?
__________________

(part 2)

If it isn't enough that those settlers were left there for the past 30 years then the goverment had to add oil to this fire and put out soldiers to guard them. I have a friend (who's a Skinhead who immigrated from Serbia) that serves in Gaza and comes home once in two weeks, tired angry, and like him many other soldiers too. Nobody wants to do this filthy job but that's the order of the day and our army is not voluntary, it's compulsory, due to the fact we can't hire mercenries and because we don't have enough sufficient manpower we got to use all means nessesary to have an army.

Tell you another thing - while those bastards enjoy prevleges and constant funding, the rest of Israel is sinking in dirt. Those dickweeds ruined our suburbs and all developing towns inside the borders. How so? Since a large peice of the budget cake goes to them, there's nothing left for the rest and developing towns who seemed to prosper in the 60's and 70's had now become ghost towns with declining birth rate and population and over 60% unemployment.

If killing the suburbs isn't enough then they're also the reason our healthcare system is in deep shit and same goes for welfare, education, sports and culture. Thousands of patients perish each year because vital treatments and medicines are being cut out the health-basket and patients who cannot aford their costs are being dumped to the mercy of faith. Patients in hospitals being stacked up in the hallways and there aren't enough beds and if a disaster happends this may take many casualties since we don't have enough beds in hospitals. We don't have enough doctors either. How so? Our education system collapsed. With only 40% each year elligible for a highschool diploma, and less than a precent of that qualitifed for a med-school, we're in deep shit. Another problem occours when students cannot aford high education. Surprizingly, very few here actualy have a degree since it takes A LOT of money. Unlike in civilized countries, we pay our colleges before we start studying, not when we start earning from the profession we studied for. Why? Because the goverment has no money to pay scholarships. Imagine studying in a class with about 50 other kids in a building that's on the verge of collapsing on its content with no AC in scoarching heat of 85°f or heating in cold winters. School caffeteria? Sport teams? What the hell is that? See, our schools are basicaly not more than a bunch of barracks where we sit and try to listen to some frustrated old teacher that would gladly kill us all for a sum a little higher than her puny paycheck.
Sports is a wasteland too. If you want to become an athlete and dream of bringing a gold medal from the olympics - you're on your own, buddy. Unless you're filthy rich or your dad was a trainer in Russia, you're screwed and your talent goes down the toilet because there's simply no funding to sports in this country, except for Football and Basketball of course, but the legue is private property of businessmen so it has nothing to do with the generousity of our ministry of finances. Community centers? Oh yeah, we had those once. The one near me turned into a crackhouse 6 years ago. Imagine that.

If you ask me then there isn't realy an Israel. There's just some dense building along the shoreline (70% of all populatin) while the rest is wasteland because all the budget went down the drain to fund fancy villas outside Israel's borders when it could use to improve education, sports, build plants and provide working places (we got a high unemployment rate), build new cities and so on. If not these goddamn settlers, our army and police force would finaly start concentrating on doing their job instead of babysitting those blasted idiots and Israel would be a much safer place to live in.

Ok, these were my 2 cents on what's realy wrong with Israel. I hope I have enlightened ya'll.

http://www.skinheads.net/forums/showthread.php?t=7277

Radar Chief
08-19-2005, 06:35 AM
Keep goin, you might get there! ROFL
http://www.darwinvets.plus.com/images/topical/hamsters/hamster2.jpg

Ah, digressed to attempted flaming with pictures.
Well in that case, maybe this could help you out.

http://www.midol.com/images/homepage/roll_a_2.gif

Then again, I doubt that’s strong enough for your advanced condition. You might combine it with this.

http://a1468.g.akamai.net/f/1468/580/1d/pics.drugstore.com/prodimg/81172/200.jpg

ROFL

Boozer
08-19-2005, 02:12 PM
I think the Israeli soldiers and police involved with the evacuation deserve commendation. It must be very difficult for the individual men and women to pull families from their homes, but they're doing it with an emphasis on safety and efficiency. For their part, most of the settlers seem to be going peacefully, and that deserves note, as well. It's a shame that their country's domestic policy encouraged them to put down roots in an untenable area.