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jAZ
08-27-2005, 11:55 AM
(We'll see if we can do this without getting bannished to the DC.)

I guess this is kinda of hot topic of late. HBO's "Real Sports w/ Bryant Gumble" had a segment on that topic.

I guess many home-schooled families are asking that their kids be allowed to participate in the athletic programs at the very schools they refuse to allow their kids to attend.

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 11:56 AM
Not at all.

Iowanian
08-27-2005, 12:00 PM
Not at all.

Its one of the things that piss me off.

Henry's town has some controversy because some top shelf wrestlers are "home schooled"....including one that was shipped in from out of state.

You're IN public School or Not.

I also don't think they should walk through graduation with the public school....They're not part of that class.

Tinlar
08-27-2005, 12:00 PM
Well,
My knee jerk reaction is to tell them to keep their hippie kids at home. Then I stop and think about the reason I don't like home schooling (the lack of social interaction) and I try to keep in mind that the child isn't the one making this decision, it is his hippie parrents.

So in doing what is best for the kids I'd say sure, let 'em play.

They would have to agree to academic testing to make sure they are staying up to par on the learning curve for any area that enforces a "pass or don't play" policy. Moms word that he is learning fine shouldn't cut it.

Katipan
08-27-2005, 12:01 PM
If the parents are willing to pay. And there is no interruption or distraction to the programs.

I'd like to say no, not at all. But I feel really bad for those kids who don't get a choice in the matter.

Fairplay
08-27-2005, 12:03 PM
I think the answer is obvious and to debate the issue the other way seems pointless.
If the kid doesn't attend the school then he should not be a part of the school's athletic program as well. Thats opening the door for pick and choose what class/program a parent could allow their child to attend if home schooled.

You're in our you're out.

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 12:05 PM
This seems like it would create a messy messy situation as far as trying to sidestep rules to funnel gets into a program, as if thats not a big problem already. I know nobody that was homseschooled could have made it happen in my old high school...you couldn't work around all that would be demanded of you if you were not there.

stevieray
08-27-2005, 12:08 PM
Pretty ironic. I've always thought that parents homeschooled because the emphasis in school had shifted from Academic to Athletic.

luv
08-27-2005, 12:08 PM
Do catholic/private schools have their own athletic programs? I would definitely consider home school to be private.

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 12:11 PM
Do catholic/private schools have their own athletic programs? I would definitely consider home school to be private.
Yes they do...

Its not really a private school I mean...its a house. And they are teaching their kids in it.

luv
08-27-2005, 12:13 PM
Yes they do...

Its not really a private school I mean...its a house. And they are teaching their kids in it.
Exactly. They are teaching kids in the "privacy" of their home.

No, I don't think they should participate in public school athletics.

Otter
08-27-2005, 12:15 PM
Get invited to many parties Jaz?

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 12:20 PM
If there were no restrictions it would really create a cluster**** in regards to recruiting top players from this place and that place to get them into programs. The type of parents that are trying to get their kid to be the next Montana and think that only elite programs are the key are going to be falling over themselves to get kids in at places like De La Salle, Jenks, Mater Dei etc. Not good for education IMO.

Zebedee DuBois
08-27-2005, 12:39 PM
If the family can pop out enough kids to field a team.
Basketball might be doable.
Probably only mormon like bigamists could field a football team.
Their home games would be in the backyard.

unlurking
08-27-2005, 12:42 PM
If a kid is homeschooled, I assume that means his/her local public school loses money. Money that pays for those athletic programs?

If the kids can pay their "fair share" of the cost of those programs rather put the burden on the school that already lost money, fine. Otherwise, I feel they are taking away from the other kids.

Then again, I really have no understanding of funds pay-outs between home-schoolers and public-schoolers. I would need to no more about that before I could build an informed opinion.

alanm
08-27-2005, 12:42 PM
No

Phobia
08-27-2005, 01:21 PM
Pretty ironic. I've always thought that parents homeschooled because the emphasis in school had shifted from Academic to Athletic.

Children are homeschooled for a variety of reasons. Most of the reasons I've heard are religious in nature. Parents think they can shelter their children from the devil if they lock them in their homes. I have 2 sets of cousins who are/were homeschooled. One is a well adjusted young lady who has fairly well developed social skills. So fairly well developed, she was recently the subject of a media nightmare in her hometown. "Minor Pastor's daughter has affair with Youth Pastor since 13". The fallout caused my uncle to resign in embarrassment and the young man to go to jail. The other homeschooled cousins are still pretty young. Zero social skills. I can't stand to even see them for a moment.

My personal experience with home schooled individuals is fairly limited, but all negative in nature.

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 01:23 PM
My personal experience with home schooled individuals is fairly limited, but all negative in nature.
I have had the same experience. It seems like most homeschooling decisions come from a complete disdain for the schooling system from top to bottom. I think its a shame Those kids miss alot of great experience that high school offers IMO. It is a parents right to do for their kid what they feel is best...but wow.

Darkwolfe
08-27-2005, 01:25 PM
I'd say they can participate, but they have to organize their own teams, practices, and coaching. Those teams would have to be up to the state standards in order to play in the same divisions.

stevieray
08-27-2005, 01:25 PM
social skills should come from your parents first, school second.

The school/parent relationship has detertiorated.

Darkwolfe
08-27-2005, 01:26 PM
social skills should come from your parents first, school second.

The school/parent relationship has detertiorated.


Ain't that the truth...

ThaChop
08-27-2005, 01:28 PM
Hippie? Funny, I never thought of myself as that...I guess I'd better go get some weed and smoke it, throw a little free love my way. Thanks for turning on the lights. I guess my kids will just have to be anti-social and grow up just fine. That's terrible, I should just feel awful about that. I mean, planned parenthood, they do such a good job with the 8,9 and 10 year olds. A much better job than I, and the governement always knows what's best. Man am I wrong! Talk about misinformed. But I'm a hippie in my hippie mini-van. Peace!

Chop

Braincase
08-27-2005, 01:30 PM
How do you judge if a kid makes grades or not?

Phobia
08-27-2005, 01:31 PM
Hippie? Funny, I never thought of myself as that...I guess I'd better go get some weed and smoke it, throw a little free love my way. Thanks for turning on the lights. I guess my kids will just have to be anti-social and grow up just fine. That's terrible, I should just feel awful about that. I mean, planned parenthood, they do such a good job with the 8,9 and 10 year olds. A much better job than I, and the governement always knows what's best. Man am I wrong! Talk about misinformed. But I'm a hippie in my hippie mini-van. Peace!

Chop

Why are you taking it personally? This is a perception your fellow homeschoolers have spread. If you have a success story, I think we'd all love to hear it. I have limited exposure.

luv
08-27-2005, 01:39 PM
I used to go to church with a couple of families who homeschooled their children. I tought one of them in Preschool sunday school. She was a tad shy. I believe she is in third grade now. In seeing her react with both other children as well as adults, I would have to say she is very well rounded. Adults are either sir or ma'am. She is quite outgoing and VERY smart. Her mom is the same way though. Outgoing and pleasant. I think parents have a lot to do with how social their children may or may not become.

luv
08-27-2005, 01:43 PM
As far as athletics go, though, I think if they are looking for others to play against, then they should go with the private school sector first. I believe there's some kind of home school association around here. I used to listen to some contemporary christian music stations, and they would advertise some home school games in their list of cancellations in the winter. Are they wanting them to play with public schools so they might be more recognizable to scouts? Most home school kids I know either get academic scholarships or come from families who are wealthy enough to put them through college.

ThaChop
08-27-2005, 01:47 PM
Are you asking because you want to know? The kids still have to pass state tests and be at a certain level, they're not totally on there own. Home schooling works very well...but if you're doing it to pull your kids out of school and can't dedicate your time you shouldn't. Public school is better than no school. People who home school do it for various reasons...not because they're all religious nuts who dislike public school. Teachers who work in public schools are hard working and get paid very little for what they do, and they can't play the parent to.

A person who home schools must be dedicated and have the time, otherwise it doesn't work. When it works well then home schoolers usually outperform. My daughter who's going to the third grade was doing certain work last year that six graders in public school would be doing. They do get together with other home schoolers for field trips, recess and things like that. Music and art. Home schoolers aren't in some littel bubble, but with this poll the thing that is lacking is the sports.

The quick thing to say is they don't go to school so why give them access, but everyone pays taxes. That's the catch, but honestly, if the coach doesn't know the kid their chances are real slim. Unless he or she is just a dynamite athlete.

Chop

Saulbadguy
08-27-2005, 01:49 PM
No.

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 01:51 PM
I doubt dont the academic upside to homeschooling. But I also think a kid that does well for themselves can still excel at a public school. I know my district had a great advancment programs for kids that were the real deal scholastically more so than the average to above average students like myself.

memyselfI
08-27-2005, 01:51 PM
Absolutely not.

The home school crowd wants to cocoon their children from the 'evils' of the public school system...

why then should that same crowd expect to be able to participate in the public school system athletics and the benefits that such participation might bestow? They can't have it both ways.

Part of athletics in the school experience is being a peer in your school that others rally around and sometimes look up to. A home school child cannot experience this in their cocoon.

ThaChop
08-27-2005, 01:54 PM
"Why are you taking it personally? This is a perception your fellow homeschoolers have spread. If you have a success story, I think we'd all love to hear it. I have limited exposure."

I was just havin fun, believe me...nothing personal. By now you're used to it when people ask. It's just one of those things you inform people about, because sometimes people think you're some hermit family that lives in a cave. THere are lots of families looking for an alternative for their kids. Let's face it, whether you go to church or not, you want what's best for your kids. It's natural. If you give them what they need at home, I'm a firm believer they'll make most decisions right on their own. But nothing replaces "live and learn".

Didn't take it personal...

Chop

Phobia
08-27-2005, 01:54 PM
Why else would I ask? I admitted ignorance. Nobody is attaching you about it. I don't understand the defensiveness. Thanks for sharing your story.

FWIW, I actually voted that home-schoolers should be allowed access to the public school sport teams with restrictions. That means, when you live in a city that couldn't support a home school team, the home schoolers should be included in the sports programs so long as the parents are willing to pay a subsidy to balance the lost revenues the schools experience.

Fairplay
08-27-2005, 01:55 PM
Chop





Bop-cop-hop-kop-lop-mop-pop-top-wop

Phobia
08-27-2005, 01:56 PM
I doubt doubt the academic upside to homeschooling.

I'm thinking perhaps it would have even been helpful for you you.

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 01:58 PM
I doubt dont the academic upside to homeschooling. But I also think a kid that does well for themselves can still excel at a public school. I know my district had a great advancment programs for kids that were the real deal scholastically more so than the average to above average students like myself.
I missed the word dont the first time...leaving it out kind of messed up the whole post. ha.

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 01:58 PM
I'm thinking perhaps it would have even been helpful for you you.
You got me. I was trying to change it.

I GOT MY FANCY BOOK LEARNIN!

ThaChop
08-27-2005, 01:58 PM
"But I also think a kid that does well for themselves can still excel at a public school. I know my district had a great advancment programs for kids that were the real deal scholastically more so than the average to above average students like myself."

I agree, not saying that at all. There are choices, but for some, home schooling works...for others they simply don't have the time or the confidence to do something like that. Doesn't make anybody better than anyone else...it's an alternative to public school. But again, you better be in it for the long haul or you're just hurting your kid.

Chop

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 01:59 PM
"But I also think a kid that does well for themselves can still excel at a public school. I know my district had a great advancment programs for kids that were the real deal scholastically more so than the average to above average students like myself."

I agree, not saying that at all. There are choices, but for some, home schooling works...for others they simply don't have the time or the confidence to do something like that. Doesn't make anybody better than anyone else...it's an alternative to public school. But again, you better be in it for the long haul or you're just hurting your kid.

Chop
Indeed.

luv
08-27-2005, 02:02 PM
Absolutely not.

The home school crowd wants to cocoon their children from the evils of the public school system...

why then should that same crowd expect to be able to participate in the public school system athletics and the benefits that such participation might bestow? They can't have it both ways.

Part of athletics in the school experience is being a peer in your school that others rally around and sometimes look up to. A home school child cannot experience this in their cocoon.
I agree with some of this. Although I disagree that homeschoolers are in a cocoon, I do agree that they do get rallied behind by their peers. Although there is more to high school athletics than popularity, part of the athletic experience is usually tied to school functions, dances, etc.

Wait, are we talking about a single homeschool kid playing on a public school team, or a homeschool team playing against a public school team?

I would say definitely no on the kid playing on a public school team. You need to be a student at that school. I might be more inclined to let a team play against a public school team though. Parents of homeschoolers may not have their children in public schools, but they pay the school tax along with everyone else. I still think it makes more sense if they play a private school team though. I don't know why, but I do.

Phobia
08-27-2005, 02:02 PM
I doubt dont the academic upside to homeschooling.

Yeah, that helped it. ROFL

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 02:04 PM
Yeah, that helped it. ROFL
Ok I am typing to fast. This is getting crazy. I am just going to back away...put my kcnut hat on and sit in the corner.

http://images.allposters.com/images/pm/421996_p.jpg

luv
08-27-2005, 02:05 PM
I doubt dont the academic upside to homeschooling.
Nobody is attaching you about it.

I think you could BOTH use it! :p

1. don't doubt
2. attacking

Phobia
08-27-2005, 02:06 PM
I think if I ever move to Blue Springs, home schooling is a serious option.

Stinger
08-27-2005, 02:06 PM
I'd say they can participate, but they have to organize their own teams, practices, and coaching. Those teams would have to be up to the state standards in order to play in the same divisions.

Actually there are Sports Organization for Home schoolers. We have 2 in Springfield the Knights, and the Falcons I believe. The Knights have Football (8 on 8) and play in a Oklahoma Kansas League. Varsity, Jr. Varsity, and Jr. High Boys and Girls Basketball, Boys baseball, and girls volleyball and cheerleading.

Phobia
08-27-2005, 02:07 PM
I think you could BOTH use it! :p

1. don't doubt
2. attacking

No, I very well meant attaching. Jeesh. Public school for you, too?

memyselfI
08-27-2005, 02:08 PM
I agree with some of this. Although I disagree that homeschoolers are in a cocoon, I do agree that they do get rallied behind by their peers. Although there is more to high school athletics than popularity, part of the athletic experience is usually tied to school functions, dances, etc.

Wait, are we talking about a single homeschool kid playing on a public school team, or a homeschool team playing against a public school team?

I would say definitely no on the kid playing on a public school team. You need to be a student at that school. I might be more inclined to let a team play against a public school team though. Parents of homeschoolers may not have their children in public schools, but they pay the school tax along with everyone else. I still think it makes more sense if they play a private school team though. I don't know why, but I do.

My sister home schools my 9 year old neice. The reasons in no particular order:

-the school system sucks in FL (some lottery choice hoop jumping)
-she hopes to keep her child isolated from evil things that happen in public school
-it's the Jones' thing to do in her area (see previous two reasons)

luv
08-27-2005, 02:08 PM
No, I very well meant attaching. Jeesh. Public school for you, too?
Uh-huh. :shake:

ThaChop
08-27-2005, 02:08 PM
"the home schoolers should be included in the sports programs so long as the parents are willing to pay a subsidy to balance the lost revenues the schools experience."

Sounds fair to me...

Honestly, I'm not hot under the collar about this. We can agree or disagree it's all good.

Chop

luv
08-27-2005, 02:09 PM
My sister home schools my 9 year old neice. The reasons in no particular order:

-the school system sucks in FL (some lottery choice hoop jumping)
-she hopes to keep her child isolated from evil things that happen in public school
-it's the Jones' thing to do in her area (see previous two reasons)
And, of course, EVERYONE homeschools their kids for those exact same reasons. :rolleyes:

ThaChop
08-27-2005, 02:10 PM
"My sister home schools my 9 year old neice. The reasons in no particular order:

-the school system sucks in FL (some lottery choice hoop jumping)
-she hopes to keep her child isolated from evil things that happen in public school
-it's the Jones' thing to do in her area (see previous two reasons)"

Well, it could be that simple for her, but it doesn't roll that away for everyone.

Chop

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 02:12 PM
And, of course, EVERYONE homeschools their kids for those exact same reasons. :rolleyes:
She wasn't acting like everyone did...

:spock:

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 02:13 PM
I think if I ever move to Blue Springs, home schooling is a serious option.
Hey hey, one of the better school systems around. Damn intraweb message board. I think this is all because of JOhn's return. I inherited his "typing with a hoof instead of a hand" keyboarding style.

Stinger
08-27-2005, 02:13 PM
My sister home schools my 9 year old neice. The reasons in no particular order:

-the school system sucks in FL (some lottery choice hoop jumping)
-she hopes to keep her child isolated from evil things that happen in public school
-it's the Jones' thing to do in her area (see previous two reasons)

My kids are not homeschooled, but a lot of the people we know do or have. The first reason your sister has been the #1 reason talking to people, they believe they can do a better job teaching their kids instead of the state. You know if you look at preformance scores and test levels for homeschooler vs. public education in the SAT and ACT they are correct.

luv
08-27-2005, 02:14 PM
She wasn't acting like everyone did...

:spock:
She stated before that homeschool kids are in a cocoon. I was assuming that was her reason for thinking so. I was simply disagreeing with her. Is that alright? Geez, no offense meant.

mlyonsd
08-27-2005, 02:15 PM
Team sports can teach certain things to kids they would never get when being home schooled. Er, it is about the kids right?

To not allow them to participate is just being petty.

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 02:16 PM
She stated before that homeschool kids are in a cocoon. I was assuming that was her reason for thinking so. I was simply disagreeing with her. Is that alright? Geez, no offense meant.
No you can have your opinion...the way you posted though made it seem like she was projecting thats why everyone homeschooled their children. When all she did is say why someone she knew did it.

ThaChop
08-27-2005, 02:16 PM
"You know if you look at preformance scores and test levels for homeschooler vs. public education in the SAT and ACT they are correct."

Right on, right on...

LUV, it's all good bro

Phobia
08-27-2005, 02:17 PM
She stated before that homeschool kids are in a cocoon. I was assuming that was her reason for thinking so. I was simply disagreeing with her. Is that alright? Geez, no offense meant.

There's very little you can say that would offend Zach. He has skin almost as thick as his head.

jynni
08-27-2005, 02:17 PM
I attended a private school but also knew many kids who were home schooled. I saw both the good and the bad.

I didn't know a single kid who lacked "social skills". People tend to forget that while the kid may not get the social interaction at school, they do get it from other places. Many home school families are very active within their churches and in various homeschool groups.

There was one family in our church that had nine boys - exactly eighteen months apart and all homeschooled. All of them were polite, smart, well behaved - overall just really good kids. The oldest recently went to college on a partial music/academic scholarship. I think the factor here was that the parents (mom stayed home) took an active involvement in making sure their kids were learning. Each kid was responsible to look out for the next youngest sibling. Overall, probably the "perfect model" for homeschooling.

On the other hand there was another family that homeschooled but rather than really teaching, the mom basically just left the kids to their own devices with only the assistance of the videos. The result the polar opposit of the first family I mentioned. The kids eventually transferred to public schools were most of them could barely pass their classes.

It all depends on the how the parents approach things.

As for participating in public/private school sports. I would have to say that it shouldn't be expected. When one makes a conscience decision to remove their child from the public school system they may have to sacrifice things like sports.

If the kids really wants to participate, many cities have little league baseball, football & soccer teams.

Once the kid is older, it would really be his decision if he really wants to pursue, say a football career, he may need to decide if he would rather have the public school sports programs than say, the potential academic (and possible religious) benefits of homeschooling.

Phobia
08-27-2005, 02:18 PM
Team sports can teach certain things to kids they would never get when being home schooled. Er, it is about the kids right?

To not allow them to participate is just being petty.

Nice. It's not an "us vs. them" issue. It's about the kids. Keep it about kids.

luv
08-27-2005, 02:18 PM
LUV, it's all good bro
sis, if ya don't mind. :)

Katipan
08-27-2005, 02:21 PM
"You know if you look at preformance scores and test levels for homeschooler vs. public education in the SAT and ACT they are correct."

Right on, right on...

LUV, it's all good bro

Personally, I'd work 3 jobs to pay for a prep school before I home schooled. I wouldn't be the best teacher.

But there are tons of schools that if my kids were forced to attend it due to... I dunno. Residence maybe. I'd seriously consider home schooling over public school.

I went to LAUSD (los angeles) which has to be one of the worst school districts in the country. My high school was cool and relatively small, but that was why I picked it. There were some schools you couldn't have paid me to attend for fear of being shot or raped.

So to the anti home schoolers...

Home school with standardized testing, with no athletics.
or
Piss poor education, horrible environment, but with college scouts attending every game

?

JOhn
08-27-2005, 02:23 PM
Hey hey, one of the better school systems around. Damn intraweb message board. I think this is all because of JOhn's return. I inherited his "typing with a hoof instead of a hand" keyboarding style.
4321

You can thank the Liberty public school system.

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 02:24 PM
4321

You can thank the Liberty public school system.
Liberty has great schools.

I don't plan on any little Zach's running around right now but if I was going raise I family in the KC area and they were going to public school's I would go with Blue Springs, Lee's Summit, or Liberty.

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 02:27 PM
There's very little you can say that would offend Zach. He has skin almost as thick as his head.
I make things happen.

Count Alex's Losses
08-27-2005, 02:34 PM
Zach's a poophead!

|Zach|
08-27-2005, 02:39 PM
Zach's a poophead!
The doctor says that will go away in a few days.

Tinlar
08-27-2005, 02:39 PM
sis, if ya don't mind. :)
I'll believe there are girls on the internet when I see a webcam with boobs. Until then I assume everyone is some fat ass named Russel.

Katipan
08-27-2005, 02:43 PM
boobs on a webcam in no way negates the risk that it's still a fat ass named russell

Phobia
08-27-2005, 02:48 PM
I'll believe there are girls on the internet when I see a webcam with boobs. Until then I assume everyone is some fat ass named Russel.

Damn, so this whole "Phil" cover isn't working?

Skip Towne
08-27-2005, 03:16 PM
I'll believe there are girls on the internet when I see a webcam with boobs. Until then I assume everyone is some fat ass named Russel.
Would Wolfman agree with that?

Mr. Laz
08-27-2005, 03:20 PM
hell no they shouldn't

the little bastards can go to school and get abused by bullies like the rest of us did if they want to play sports.


if the pansy ass little fugger can't take it, then they can't play







~Laz~
don't know what that came from, must be channeling Russ~

chiefs4me
08-27-2005, 04:11 PM
Didn't feel like reading the whole thread...but hell no they shouldn't be allowed. In Texas, if you mess up in school, then the coach is the one who sets you straight... not the principal......and he can even keep you off the team that night. So Joey got into trouble at school and can't play football tonight. Sammy got into trouble at home, being home schooled, but since the coach has no say over Sammy at home, Sammy gets to play in the game....Not fair at all. So I vote no, if the school is not good enough to attend for classes, then it's not good enough to have the home schooled kid on the team.

Zebedee DuBois
08-27-2005, 04:26 PM
Here is my "vast" exposure to homeschoolers.

I have a cousin who homeschooled her kids. My cousin and her husband were B+ to A students in the public schools and college they attended. She was an education major and he was a computer science major. I would have to say they did a pretty good job teaching their kids. The oldest ones are now enrolled in small colleges and reportedly doing well.

I have another cousin who homeschooled her kids. She and her husbands were also B+ to A students in the public schools and college they attended. They were both music majors. I would say their kids are fairly bright but a little odd. The oldest one is doing OK in college, but the younger ones are behind the curve.

I had a coworker that homeschooled his kids (or his wife did). He and his wife were both C to B students in high school. No college. I think sex education in public schools prompted them to home school. Their son got a girl pregnant before he was 19, and currently employed as a dishwasher. Their daughter got pregnant before she was 19, got married, got separated, and is now living with the parents.

Based on this small smattering of exposure, I would say homeschooling CAN work, but is not guarranteed to work.

You know...just like public school.

KChiefsQT
08-27-2005, 04:27 PM
If it's the parents making their children be home-schooled then hell yes. I don't believe in depriving and children of sports, regardless of where their parents choose their schooling. But...I am a coach and probably have a bias in this area. I see troubled kids get straightened out by being on a team, learning the values of teamwork and all that good stuff. Yes, let the kids play, after all...they're KIDS!!!!!!!!

Rain Man
08-27-2005, 04:41 PM
While I'm not a fan of private schools or home schooling from a societal perspective, it seems reasonable to me to let home-schooled kids participate in public school sports. Their parents are still paying property taxes to the school district.

However, if a place has a stupid voucher system that makes the school district pay twice so the kid can avoid going to public school, then the kid shouldn't be allowed to play.

Iowanian
08-27-2005, 05:50 PM
Team sports can teach certain things to kids they would never get when being home schooled. Er, it is about the kids right?

To not allow them to participate is just being petty.

I'd like to preface my further comment that I DO know some people who were homeschooled and some children who are being home schooled.

I've never met a "home schooler" who didn't have some social interaction issues.....Odd ducks, almost all of them.

I graduated from a small HS....38 in my class(attending)....On graduation day, 4-5 kids, we'd never seen, including a couple of special needs kids "graduated" with our class.....They walked through like one of us, they were in the class Rank list and bumped many of us down(yes...even the special needs kids graduated with a 3.5 knocking many of us down the list....affecting scholarships etc).

I think that sucks, when they worked on a different schedule, different work, different pace than "we" did.

Athletics.
I do have a problem with it, and My HS did have a couple of homeschool kids that played football when I was in School. How would you feel, if a person who didn't attend your school, got your varsity spot?

Lets face it, there are also cheating issues with some of the homeschool kids.........If Joe Kid decides he wants to attend another school, while not living in that district, he has to miss time...a year of sports in Iowa.

Home School Kids can Move, and CHOOSE which district they participate in school....It works alot the same as Recruiting. Lets say the "Coach" home schools....He's got a special building for his kids to work out, lift and wrestle during the day......Lets say, his kids are very, very good at that sport.........Lets say, the Champ's toughest training partner graduates..........Now, Dad brings in a champion from another state, who might or might not be eligable and now, all of the sudden is on the team of the local HS?

What if YOUR kid participates in a sport...He gets up, lifts weights with the team in the morning, attends school, takes tests, plays dodgeball in gym class and has the daily grind and stress of school..gets on a bus and drives an hour to compete.

He/she is competing against a home schooler, who had their school work done at noon, and takes a 3hr nap in the afternoon before the competition. Fair?


I have no doubt, and facts prove every year at the spelling bee, that home schoolers have academic success.........but to me, the fact remains, that they aren't subjected to many of the other social pressures, interaction that make a more well rounded person.

Home School is fine IMO if you choose it..........but I sure don't think Billy Homeschool deserves to be on a graduation list for a school he never stepped a foot in prior to graduation, and shouldn't be on that districts athletic teams if he doesn't attend.

WilliamTheIrish
08-27-2005, 06:31 PM
**** yes they can. If the parents pay the outragous mil levy to support a bloated district (and they do) then you have to let them in.

mlyonsd
08-27-2005, 06:48 PM
I'd like to preface my further comment that I DO know some people who were homeschooled and some children who are being home schooled.

I've never met a "home schooler" who didn't have some social interaction issues.....Odd ducks, almost all of them.

I graduated from a small HS....38 in my class(attending)....On graduation day, 4-5 kids, we'd never seen, including a couple of special needs kids "graduated" with our class.....They walked through like one of us, they were in the class Rank list and bumped many of us down(yes...even the special needs kids graduated with a 3.5 knocking many of us down the list....affecting scholarships etc).

I think that sucks, when they worked on a different schedule, different work, different pace than "we" did.

Athletics.
I do have a problem with it, and My HS did have a couple of homeschool kids that played football when I was in School. How would you feel, if a person who didn't attend your school, got your varsity spot?

Lets face it, there are also cheating issues with some of the homeschool kids.........If Joe Kid decides he wants to attend another school, while not living in that district, he has to miss time...a year of sports in Iowa.

Home School Kids can Move, and CHOOSE which district they participate in school....It works alot the same as Recruiting. Lets say the "Coach" home schools....He's got a special building for his kids to work out, lift and wrestle during the day......Lets say, his kids are very, very good at that sport.........Lets say, the Champ's toughest training partner graduates..........Now, Dad brings in a champion from another state, who might or might not be eligable and now, all of the sudden is on the team of the local HS?

What if YOUR kid participates in a sport...He gets up, lifts weights with the team in the morning, attends school, takes tests, plays dodgeball in gym class and has the daily grind and stress of school..gets on a bus and drives an hour to compete.

He/she is competing against a home schooler, who had their school work done at noon, and takes a 3hr nap in the afternoon before the competition. Fair?


I have no doubt, and facts prove every year at the spelling bee, that home schoolers have academic success.........but to me, the fact remains, that they aren't subjected to many of the other social pressures, interaction that make a more well rounded person.

Home School is fine IMO if you choose it..........but I sure don't think Billy Homeschool deserves to be on a graduation list for a school he never stepped a foot in prior to graduation, and shouldn't be on that districts athletic teams if he doesn't attend.

Valid points but I still don't agree with it. Look at it this way, for every kid that is home schooled, his/her school room if they were there is that much less crowded. That while home school parents are still paying taxes to support regular schools.

I also think a home school kid is behind the 8 ball when trying to make any varsity high school team. Which I don't really have a problem with.

I still say it's about the kids. The parents are making the decision to home school them, not the kids. No reason to punish them.

Katipan
08-27-2005, 06:57 PM
In california it wasn't uncommon for football players to take summer school... Even when running 2 a days. Because then they could finish some mandatory subjects early and be able to take 5th and 6th periods off during their junior and senior years.

HC_Chief
08-27-2005, 06:58 PM
**** yes they can. If the parents pay the outragous mil levy to support a bloated district (and they do) then you have to let them in.

I agree.

Chief Henry
08-29-2005, 09:34 AM
Home School Kids can Move, and CHOOSE which district they participate in school....It works alot the same as Recruiting. Lets say the "Coach" home schools....He's got a special building for his kids to work out, lift and wrestle during the day......Lets say, his kids are very, very good at that sport.........Lets say, the Champ's toughest training partner graduates..........Now, Dad brings in a champion from another state, who might or might not be eligable and now, all of the sudden is on the team of the local HS?

What if YOUR kid participates in a sport...He gets up, lifts weights with the team in the morning, attends school, takes tests, plays dodgeball in gym class and has the daily grind and stress of school..gets on a bus and drives an hour to compete.
Fair?




This sounds earily falmiliar... :)

joesomebody
08-29-2005, 11:28 AM
Are you asking because you want to know? The kids still have to pass state tests and be at a certain level, they're not totally on there own. Home schooling works very well...but if you're doing it to pull your kids out of school and can't dedicate your time you shouldn't. Public school is better than no school. People who home school do it for various reasons...not because they're all religious nuts who dislike public school. Teachers who work in public schools are hard working and get paid very little for what they do, and they can't play the parent to.

A person who home schools must be dedicated and have the time, otherwise it doesn't work. When it works well then home schoolers usually outperform. My daughter who's going to the third grade was doing certain work last year that six graders in public school would be doing. They do get together with other home schoolers for field trips, recess and things like that. Music and art. Home schoolers aren't in some littel bubble, but with this poll the thing that is lacking is the sports.

The quick thing to say is they don't go to school so why give them access, but everyone pays taxes. That's the catch, but honestly, if the coach doesn't know the kid their chances are real slim. Unless he or she is just a dynamite athlete.

Chop
Chop, yes you would still pay taxes to a school district, however schools get tax money and grants based on how many students ATTEND their school. In most districts there is more than one school, and the local tax base is devided amongst the schools districts based on students attending.

While you still in a way pay taxes to the school your child would play sports for, the school is without doubt losing state and national funding based on the fact your student does not attend.

I am not really against home schooling, however I think one of the most important things for a child is learning to interact with children their own age in a school setting. Even if home schooled children meet for field trips with other homeschooled kids, it would seem to me that the student to teacher ratio would be insane. This amount of supervision would most certainly lead to the whole "Preacher's Son" syndrome. By raising children that have been SURROUNDED by their parents for 24/7 a day it seems to me you are begging for disaster upon finally cutting the poor kids loose into the world.

It sounds like you are one of the better home schooling parents because you do pursue that they get interaction with other students. As to public school sports programs for homeschooled students, it seems home schooling parents want to pick and choose the curriculim, while nothing is wrong with that, may I reccomend that you run for the school board instead... It would seem you have the time.

Also, aren't there still YMCA and other youth programs that have sports programs? Public school sports are for public school students. These mandatory tests that students must pass when they are home schooled don't prove the dedication required to complete homework assignements during the grueling amount of practices and games during the typical sports season. Home schooled children and their parents could simply study for one test, while at the same time allowing the student to not have to worry about homework and typical day to day classwork in preparation for a game. The GED is a test that grants basically the same thing as a high school diploma... people can study for and pass a GED test in a matter of weeks, a highschool diploma is more than just academic.

chagrin
08-29-2005, 11:32 AM
I don't know if this has been posted already, but isn't there Pop Warner leagues that home-schooled children can play in?

jidar
08-29-2005, 11:48 AM
A schools budget is based on attendance, so the budget should only be used for the kids actually in attendance. They have a dollar figure that each child should receive and if you have kids partaking of the cash who don't attend, it's bringing down the budget of all of the kids.

As for home schooling. Well you can't home-school a college degree, so you're gonna have to let them go into the wild sometime, better sooner rather than later.

Katipan
08-29-2005, 11:53 AM
As for home schooling. Well you can't home-school a college degree, so you're gonna have to let them go into the wild sometime, better sooner rather than later.

Sure you can.
University of Phoenix online

keg in kc
08-29-2005, 12:04 PM
I was going to reply, but then I realized I don't really give a shit. I'd probably say "let them play".

FWIW, home schooling probably doesn't mean "antisocial" any more than public schooling means "social butterfly". I don't know that I've ever met anyone with less in the way of social skills than I have, and I was public schooled, albeit a small school, and I played nearly every sport available. Yet, as an adult, I'm totally incapable of any kind of social interaction. I don't know a soul in Kansas City, and I've lived here since 1998.

Warrior5
08-29-2005, 12:40 PM
Since homeschooling parents pay taxes, their kids should be allowed to participate in public school sports IF:

- the parents reimburse the school for any lost funds.
- the parents allow the schools to inspect the child's curriculum and academic performance to verify the kid is meeting the academic requirements all athletes have to meet.

If the parents made a choice to homeschool, they should have no issues with these additional requirements.

ZepSinger
08-29-2005, 02:35 PM
Our daughters are homeschooled, yet I don't see why we'd insist on them doing anything with the public school system, including sports. I suppose if I had boys I may feel differently, but that isn't the case.

At least one poster said that that should extend to the homeschooled kid not taking part in a public school graduation, and again I agree. The MPE(Midwest Parent Educators) in KC has a great graduation ceremony for homeschooled kids that we will be glad to be a part of.

I do think it sucks BIG TIME that homeschool parents still have to pay that portion of taxes that goes to the public school system that we never use.

I'm not even gonna get into the 'lack of socialization' knock again...

Z

Katipan
08-29-2005, 02:46 PM
I do think it sucks BIG TIME that homeschool parents still have to pay that portion of taxes that goes to the public school system that we never use.


aiiiiii just because you don't use the public school system?

tons of people don't use services that we all help pay for.

you know. the whole point of being in this civilized society.

Iowanian
08-29-2005, 02:55 PM
I do think it sucks BIG TIME that homeschool parents still have to pay that portion of taxes that goes to the public school system that we never use.

Z

I'll only comment that Every land/home owner without children attending the school district pays the same as the home school parent, and doens't have a kid in the district. That includes the elderly, people who don't have kids yet, have young children or grown kids......If we all didn't contribute, it would be an overwhelming expense.

I own 3 properties that I pay taxes on and have no school aged children....

Its part of our responsibility as taxpayers to help educate the children of our communities. The only people who don't are renters and welfare bums who don't work.

Its the RIGHT of every child to attend public schools, its the CHOICE of the parent to home school.

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 03:20 PM
If the parents are willing to pay. And there is no interruption or distraction to the programs.

I'd like to say no, not at all. But I feel really bad for those kids who don't get a choice in the matter.
They already f**king pay for it with their tax dollars you fools. If there are extra equipment fees or whatever that the other parents pay then the homeschool kid should also.

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 03:24 PM
That means, when you live in a city that couldn't support a home school team, the home schoolers should be included in the sports programs so long as the parents are willing to pay a subsidy to balance the lost revenues the schools experience.
What lost revenues? What money is the school not getting? Schools get their funding primarily through property taxes. You guys really think home schooled kids don't live in a home? You think they somehow skirt paying taxes? Give me a break, you guys are smarter than this. The govt. education systems makes MORE money on a home schooled kid because they don't actualy have to teach them.

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 03:28 PM
Team sports can teach certain things to kids they would never get when being home schooled. Er, it is about the kids right?

To not allow them to participate is just being petty.
IMO some of these people are just pissed because home schooling parents are proving that it's possible to care about your kid's future. It's making them look bad and their excuses look dumb.

Katipan
08-29-2005, 03:29 PM
They already f**king pay for it with their tax dollars you fools. If there are extra equipment fees or whatever that the other parents pay then the homeschool kid should also.

you should agree with me with a smile and save the angst for when we argue

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 03:36 PM
A schools budget is based on attendance, so the budget should only be used for the kids actually in attendance. They have a dollar figure that each child should receive and if you have kids partaking of the cash who don't attend, it's bringing down the budget of all of the kids.

As for home schooling. Well you can't home-school a college degree, so you're gonna have to let them go into the wild sometime, better sooner rather than later.
While it may be the case that some people home school to shelter their kids more of them simply want their kids to learn at school instead of spend their days chasing tail. I learned jack s**t at a public school because I was so f**king bored I'd fall asleep in damn near every class. Worked out Ok because I was rested enough to spend my nights learning computer programming on my own pace and now I make a nice living doing it.

Mr. Laz
08-29-2005, 03:36 PM
FWIW, home schooling probably doesn't mean "antisocial" .
says the antisocial bastige of the century








:p

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 03:38 PM
you should agree with me with a smile and save the angst for when we argue
That was directed at about a dozen people in this thread, you maybe the least of them but I was too lazy to quote them all. :)

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 03:39 PM
aiiiiii just because you don't use the public school system?

tons of people don't use services that we all help pay for.

you know. the whole point of being in this socialist society.
Fixed that for you. ;)

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 03:42 PM
Its the RIGHT of every child to attend public schools, its the CHOICE of the parent to home school.
Show me that one in the US Constitution, being that a huge percentage of the school dollars get sent to Washington, burned up, then the remainder sent back to the states (as long as the states do what Washington wants).

Some states do have an education clause in their Constitutions. I'm pretty sure KS is one of them.

Phobia
08-29-2005, 03:42 PM
What lost revenues? What money is the school not getting? Schools get their funding primarily through property taxes. You guys really think home schooled kids don't live in a home? You think they somehow skirt paying taxes? Give me a break, you guys are smarter than this. The govt. education systems makes MORE money on a home schooled kid because they don't actualy have to teach them.

Schools also get state revenue based on their enrollment. For every student in their school district enrolled in school, they get "X" dollars. So, if that student lives in their district but is not enrolled, they're "losing" revenue.

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 03:48 PM
Schools also get state revenue based on their enrollment. For every student in their school district enrolled in school, they get "X" dollars. So, if that student lives in their district but is not enrolled, they're "losing" revenue.
Let's say the state's pot is $1M this year. For the sake of simplicity we'll say there are 10 schools with equal enrollment of 100 students each. That's $100k each or $1k/student. Say 100 kids in the district decide to home school. It can be expected that the distribution will be fairly equal unless one school is f**king up particularly bad, right? So, if each school loses 10 kids what do you think happens to that extra $10k/school? You know they won't give that money back to the taxpayers, they'll just up the per student alotment because it's the govt, it has to be spent or you lose it.

Let's readdress that one school f**king up scenario. Is it a BAD thing that a s**tty school is losing money?

Jenny Gump
08-29-2005, 03:49 PM
Tax issues aside...if the parents believe the public school system isn't good enough to teach their kids, then why should it be good enough for them to participate in sporting events. I would think it would be difficult for the child to integrate into the team, if they are an "outsider" per se.

I don't have any real strong feelings either way. It is an interesting question however.

Mr. Laz
08-29-2005, 03:50 PM
Schools also get state revenue based on their enrollment. For every student in their school district enrolled in school, they get "X" dollars. So, if that student lives in their district but is not enrolled, they're "losing" revenue.
kids who play sports but don't attend that school need to pay an "out of state" equivalent level of cost to make up for that as well.


they also need to receive the appropriate number of swirlies to make up for the lost school experience. :D

Jenny Gump
08-29-2005, 03:50 PM
Schools also get state revenue based on their enrollment. For every student in their school district enrolled in school, they get "X" dollars. So, if that student lives in their district but is not enrolled, they're "losing" revenue.

This is what I always thought, but then where is my property tax money going? My kid goes to private school, and I still pay district school taxes.

Iowanian
08-29-2005, 03:53 PM
who didn't know the home school contingent would show up with a case of redass, after getting some turpentine rubbed on their fanny?

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 03:55 PM
Tax issues aside...if the parents believe the public school system isn't good enough to teach their kids, then why should it be good enough for them to participate in sporting events.
I would let lots of people coach my kid's baseball team that I wouldn't trust to teach them chemistry or history. More than likely my kid won't need to make a living off of baseball.

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 03:56 PM
This is what I always thought, but then where is my property tax money going? My kid goes to private school, and I still pay district school taxes.
Don't try and confuse him with a fact that he's managed to ignore for 100 + replies.

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 04:01 PM
who didn't know the home school contingent would show up with a case of redass, after getting some turpentine rubbed on their fanny?

You're IN public School or Not.

I'd like to say no, not at all.

You're in our you're out.

This seems like it would create a messy messy situation as far as trying to sidestep rules to funnel gets into a program, as if thats not a big problem already.

If the family can pop out enough kids to field a team.
Basketball might be doable.
Probably only mormon like bigamists could field a football team.
Their home games would be in the backyard.

Absolutely not.
The home school crowd wants to cocoon their children from the 'evils' of the public school system...
why then should that same crowd expect to be able to participate in the public school system athletics and the benefits that such participation might bestow? They can't have it both ways.

And that's just from the first two pages. Who has the case of readass?

All these people are asking for is to participate in PART of what they're already paying ALL of. They're not the ones being irrational.

Iowanian
08-29-2005, 04:04 PM
I'm not sure, but I'm getting the idea someone put a wire brush, bristle side up in your chair.....

Home schooling is fine if you choose it for your children.......I just don't think homeschool kids should be able to "graduate" with the local HS, I don't think their class rank based on their average earned at home should count on a school class list, and I don't think they should be able to CHOOSE to have their kid play for Team A because they are better than Team B.....which happens.

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 04:11 PM
I'm not sure, but I'm getting the idea someone put a wire brush, bristle side up in your chair.....

Home schooling is fine if you choose it for your children.......I just don't think homeschool kids should be able to "graduate" with the local HS, I don't think their class rank based on their average earned at home should count on a school class list, and I don't think they should be able to CHOOSE to have their kid play for Team A because they are better than Team B.....which happens.
I don't think they should be listed or class ranked either. I also think they should be forced to play for the school they would go to based on district lines unless that district already has rules in place for allowing traditional students to switch, in which case the home school kid should get the exact same treatment. I haven't heard anyone, anywhere, talking about kids being pulled out of a public school to be home schooled so that they can play for a different school. That's a hell of a lot of effort just to play for a different team. If your kid is really that good they're showing off in summer leagues, etc., not the HS team.

Jenny Gump
08-29-2005, 04:22 PM
I'm not sure, but I'm getting the idea someone put a wire brush, bristle side up in your chair.....

Home schooling is fine if you choose it for your children.......I just don't think homeschool kids should be able to "graduate" with the local HS, I don't think their class rank based on their average earned at home should count on a school class list, and I don't think they should be able to CHOOSE to have their kid play for Team A because they are better than Team B.....which happens.

I didn't even think about that. Damn...I better get back in the kitchen.

BIG_DADDY
08-29-2005, 04:23 PM
Yea I think we should pass another stupid law to restrict peoples freedom to choose. Good god if the student is home schooled they are saving us money, why would I reward them by restricting where they can play sports at? Why should anyone who has a kid that is particulary talented be forced to go to a school with a shitty coach/athletic program? This is just beyond ridiculous to me. As far as graduation goes anyone should be allowed to graduate who can pass a graduation exam which we should have anyways as half the little retards our shitty school system is pumping couldn't pass it.

Jenny Gump
08-29-2005, 04:38 PM
Don't try and confuse him with a fact that he's managed to ignore for 100 + replies.

No, I was being serious. I think he's right, because I have always understood that enrollment and attendance are part of the formula. So, maybe the fact is, that in some states, (and I'm just guessing here), that there is some formula for what trickles down to the schools. In other words, maybe he's right...and the actual school doesn't ever see the money, but the district or state does??? I don't know.

Rain Man
08-29-2005, 04:43 PM
I don't know how every state works, but here in Colorado your property taxes go directly to your own school district (though not necessarily your neighborhood school). The state then takes some proportion of the money and then redivides that portion according to an "equalization formula" that pushes money toward the more poorly funded districts and away from the highest-funded districts. I did a study about this and other taxes several years back to determine the net outflow and inflow of tax money to specific communities with regard to the state.

Jenny Gump
08-29-2005, 04:44 PM
I don't know how every state works, but here in Colorado your property taxes go directly to your own school district (though not necessarily your neighborhood school). The state then takes some proportion of the money and then redivides that portion according to an "equalization formula" that pushes money toward the more poorly funded districts and away from the highest-funded districts. I did a study about this and other taxes several years back to determine the net outflow and inflow of tax money to specific communities with regard to the state.

God. You are such a show off.

Rain Man
08-29-2005, 04:45 PM
God. You are such a show off.

You wouldn't believe the quadriceps I have.

Jenny Gump
08-29-2005, 04:47 PM
You wouldn't believe the quadriceps I have.

Well, I've noted how developed your scalp muscles are. I bet the quadriceps are spectacular.

stevieray
08-29-2005, 04:47 PM
God. You are such a show off.

you must be high.

Jenny Gump
08-29-2005, 04:48 PM
you must be high.

How did you know? OMG, can you see me through this monitor thingy? Cool.

Count Alex's Losses
08-29-2005, 04:48 PM
Hey, stevieray, did you ever see Bubba Ho-Tep?

stevieray
08-29-2005, 04:49 PM
How did you know? OMG, can you see me through this monitor thingy? Cool.

:)

Rain Man
08-29-2005, 04:49 PM
Well, I've noted how developed your scalp muscles are. I bet the quadriceps are spectacular.

My scalp muscles are so strong that they protrude from my hair. True story.

stevieray
08-29-2005, 04:49 PM
Hey, stevieray, did you ever see Bubba Ho-Tep?

yup.

keg in kc
08-29-2005, 04:55 PM
says the antisocial bastige of the centuryI believe that was precisely the point I was making.

Although it's more about being poor and fat than it is being antisocial. Fat people are worthless. Poor people are worthless. I wouldn't want to associate with anyone like me. I know what I am, so I keep to my place.

stevieray
08-29-2005, 04:57 PM
I believe that was precisely the point I was making.

Although it's more about being poor and fat than it is being antisocial. Fat people are worthless. Poor people are worthless. I wouldn't want to associate with anyone like me. I know what I am, so I keep to my place.


bring on the euthinization of undesirables, let's start with certain dogs.

Mr. Laz
08-29-2005, 05:00 PM
I believe that was precisely the point I was making.

Although it's more about being poor and fat than it is being antisocial. Fat people are worthless. Poor people are worthless. I wouldn't want to associate with anyone like me. I know what I am, so I keep to my place.
u funny


ROFL

keg in kc
08-29-2005, 05:00 PM
bring on the euthinization of undesirables, let's start with certain dogs.Well, I'm not suicidal; I'd like to live. Because maybe someday I'll have some intrinsic value. But I certainly won't date or breed before that time. That's about the most responsible thing I can do at this point.

keg in kc
08-29-2005, 05:02 PM
u funnyThe ladies dig my self-effacing humor. They say it gives me this air of mystery. But I think that's just because I missed my shower this morning.

Kyle401
08-29-2005, 05:04 PM
Home schooling is fine if you choose it for your children.......I just don't think homeschool kids should be able to "graduate" with the local HS, I don't think their class rank based on their average earned at home should count on a school class list, and I don't think they should be able to CHOOSE to have their kid play for Team A because they are better than Team B.....which happens.Re: your first point

Home schooled children should not be allowed to "graduate" with the class of the local high school. Their results should be compared to a state or national class of home schoolers and that should be used for their scholarship applications. All accredited home schooling curriculum programs should be required to keep said class data and furnish it on demand to graduating students and colleges alike. Having said that, standardized testing results will always be much more important for the home schooler than the public schooler because of the risk of nepotistic grading (although any reputable home schooling program should require parents to furnish copies of completed/graded assignments).

Re: your second point

Home schooled children should be allowed to participate in organized sports in the school district that they live in. Anyone can choose to have their kid play for Team A or Team B. All they have to do is move into that school district. I have known parents who have moved up to 50 miles (and commuted) just so their kids can have "a shot at going pro" or playing on the varsity. I'm sure others know of more extreme examples.


FTR, I was home schooled through the 6th grade. I tested in the 99th percentile in every subject when I transferred to public school. I didn't learn anything new until I was a freshman in high school.

hbkeay
08-29-2005, 05:12 PM
it's not really about the tax money. kid's don't have a right to play in EXTRAcurricular sports, they must meet certain school requirements (days in class, OSS, grades, etc.). i'm against letting home-schoolers play sports, but if they can meet the school requirements then we should let them play.

hbkeay
08-29-2005, 05:20 PM
I tested in the 99th percentile in every subject when I transferred to public school. I didn't learn anything new until I was a freshman in high school.

i tested in the 99th percentile and i went to public school, and i didn't learn anything at all in high school. this issue is not about whether home school or public school is better--i'm sure they both have benefits and drawbacks. besides, anyone with a basic understanding of scientific method would see that achievement levels of homeschoolers vs. public school is going to be skewed because parents who choose homeschooling (and probably their kids too) are not representative of the general population.

chiefs4me
08-29-2005, 05:41 PM
I like the rule in Texas, if little Johnny can't attend the school like the rest of the children, then little Johnny can't try out for the teams.....

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 05:49 PM
I like the rule in Texas, if little Johnny can't attend the school like the rest of the children, then little Johnny can't try out for the teams.....
Yes, and we should all strive to be like you.

So the fact that Little Johnny's parents are paying taxes like every other parent means nothing to you. Let me not pay for the school or let me use the school the way I see fit, you can't have it both ways unless you just want to be an unreasonable bitch.

Katipan
08-29-2005, 05:59 PM
Thats the state where they start training cheerleaders at 5, right?

awesome.

BIG_DADDY
08-29-2005, 05:59 PM
I like the rule in Texas, if little Johnny can't attend the school like the rest of the children, then little Johnny can't try out for the teams.....

That's lame.

chiefs4me
08-29-2005, 06:27 PM
Yes, and we should all strive to be like you.

So the fact that Little Johnny's parents are paying taxes like every other parent means nothing to you. Let me not pay for the school or let me use the school the way I see fit, you can't have it both ways unless you just want to be an unreasonable bitch.




hey, I will be the first to tell you I am a bitch...and a good one at that.

Little Johnny's parents choose not to send him to school....so now you want it your way...I don't like your school, but would you teach my son football 4 hours a day.....:rolleyes: I don't even feel like fighting this point with you, I am just gald for the rules down here.

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 06:31 PM
Thats the state where they start training cheerleaders at 5, right?

awesome.
I believe in TX it's cheerHOOKERS, but you can only join if you are at school to whore all day.

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 06:33 PM
Little Johnny's parents choose not to send him to school
So let Little Johnny's parents choose not to pay school taxes. I'm good with that route, too.

chiefs4me
08-29-2005, 06:35 PM
That's lame.



What is unfair about it....let's say for example. Little johnny is an
A student and starting qb for the football team....but he gets caught out in the hallway during class without a pass, if you play sports down here the coach is the one who handles you, so the coach benches you for the game. So little Sammy at home, didn't feel like doing any work that day, and he was outside all day shooting baskets...well it's game time, and even though Johnny was at shcool all day and was just late getting to the next class, he is being punished, like he should be, but Sammy the goof off all day long will play in the game, because school had NO IDEA what he did that day....call me stupid, dumb whatever...I am doing the happy dance for the school that gives my kid a chance if he puts in his time and effort all day long.....PBJ




ps, I am sure the spelling or grammar police will be along shortly to correct me.....ROFL

Rain Man
08-29-2005, 06:39 PM
I believe in TX it's cheerHOOKERS, but you can only join if you are at school to whore all day.

I think I sense simplex3 being stood up by a Texas cheerleader on prom night back in high school.

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 06:41 PM
What is unfair about it....let's say for example. Little johnny is an
A student and starting qb for the football team....but he gets caught out in the hallway during class without a pass, if you play sports down here the coach is the one who handles you, so the coach benches you for the game. So little Sammy at home, didn't feel like doing any work that day, and he was outside all day shooting baskets...well it's game time, and even though Johnny was at shcool all day and was just late getting to the next class, he is being punished, like he should be, but Sammy the goof off all day long will play in the game, because school had NO IDEA what he did that day....call me stupid, dumb whatever...I am doing the happy dance for the school that gives my kid a chance if he puts in his time and effort all day long.....PBJ
I'm sure you don't see how Little Johnny is responsible for his inability to play in your scenario.

Also, as long as Sammy is making his grades and passing the standardized tests that he has to take what do you care what he did all day? How does that affect your life?

chiefs4me
08-29-2005, 06:41 PM
I believe in TX it's cheerHOOKERS, but you can only join if you are at school to whore all day.



Why would you talk about your sister that way...ROFL


hell this isn't even fun....:banghead: where's Donger or Skip or Delt....:rolleyes:

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 06:43 PM
I think I sense simplex3 being stood up by a Texas cheerleader on prom night back in high school.
ROFL No, I spent a wad of cash on my long time girlfriend. And yes, she put out. I got hosed my Junior Prom by a sophmore that just wanted to go to prom and needed an upper-classman to go with, I wasn't having that happen again. So instead I hooked up long term with a psycho. What can I say, I got out without her getting pregnant, it was all good.

Valiant
08-29-2005, 07:40 PM
I agree with some of this. Although I disagree that homeschoolers are in a cocoon, I do agree that they do get rallied behind by their peers. Although there is more to high school athletics than popularity, part of the athletic experience is usually tied to school functions, dances, etc.

Wait, are we talking about a single homeschool kid playing on a public school team, or a homeschool team playing against a public school team?

I would say definitely no on the kid playing on a public school team. You need to be a student at that school. I might be more inclined to let a team play against a public school team though. Parents of homeschoolers may not have their children in public schools, but they pay the school tax along with everyone else. I still think it makes more sense if they play a private school team though. I don't know why, but I do.


Should a homeschool student get to play on a public school team, thats a big no... You are not homeschooled to play sports, you are homeschooled to keep you away from public school systems...

Now, imo I have met four homeschool people at college and they are f'ing weird... Granted it has been only four so far, but they are batting a 1000...

As for a entire homeschool team would be fine as long as those parents funded the uniforms, coaches, practice facilities... From my understanding the school districts do not get extra money for homeschool kids.. That is why attendence has always been important the more people you have at your school showing up daily the more money that is funded to you...(Well as long as you are not a inner city school) But the negative side of a all-homeschooled team, they should get their asses kicked the majority of the time by the public and/or private schools...

As for people that would not have an option to be on a all-homeschool team because of the population size.... tough shit...

WilliamTheIrish
08-29-2005, 08:39 PM
What is unfair about it....let's say for example. Little johnny is an
A student and starting qb for the football team....but he gets caught out in the hallway during class without a pass, if you play sports down here the coach is the one who handles you, so the coach benches you for the game. So little Sammy at home, didn't feel like doing any work that day, and he was outside all day shooting baskets...well it's game time, and even though Johnny was at shcool all day and was just late getting to the next class, he is being punished, like he should be, but Sammy the goof off all day long will play in the game, because school had NO IDEA what he did that day....call me stupid, dumb whatever...I am doing the happy dance for the school that gives my kid a chance if he puts in his time and effort all day long.....PBJ




ps, I am sure the spelling or grammar police will be along shortly to correct me.....ROFL

I don't know about the grammar police,but the analogy police think your story is weak.

keg in kc
08-29-2005, 08:40 PM
I don't know about the grammar police,but the analogy police think your story is weak.The common sense police have filed a warrant in your name for reading one of her posts.

go bowe
08-29-2005, 09:04 PM
So let Little Johnny's parents choose not to pay school taxes. I'm good with that route, too.good heavens, somebody call jaz...

i'm gonna agree with simplex about something... :eek: :eek: :eek:

if the parents pay school taxes or if they rent in the school district, the kids have as much right to participate in school sponsored extracurricular activities just like the other kids...

in the civilized world, that is... ;)

go bowe
08-29-2005, 09:17 PM
Hippie? Funny, I never thought of myself as that...I guess I'd better go get some weed and smoke it, throw a little free love my way. Thanks for turning on the lights. I guess my kids will just have to be anti-social and grow up just fine. That's terrible, I should just feel awful about that. I mean, planned parenthood, they do such a good job with the 8,9 and 10 year olds. A much better job than I, and the governement always knows what's best. Man am I wrong! Talk about misinformed. But I'm a hippie in my hippie mini-van. Peace!

Chopthe word hippie has been abused by all these youngsters...

an actual hippie, circa 1969, was also known as a flower child...

totally nonviolent, laid back, easy going stoners...

they sometimes lived in the "wilds" of the countryside and wore tye- dyed clothes and let their hair grow long, really long...

real hippies were not revolutionaries or cokeheads or crankheads...

they just dropped out...

and dropped a lot of acid... :D :D :D

whooo-eee... them were the days!!!! :) :) :) :bong: :D

Iowanian
08-29-2005, 09:20 PM
Simplex....most school funds come from Property taxes. The assumption that all homeschool parents are paying for the public school, goes along with the assumption that they are home owners.

Think any home school families Rent?

I say that School Sports and extra chariculars(would Band, chorus, theater be the same? they're actually classes....which I think a homeschool kid Should be able to attend if they choose, but that goes against the entire parents arguement about not letting them get corrupted by those devil Public school kids).....sorry.......I think there is alot more to sports than just playing them.....Its about a Team, and I don't see how that works if you're on your Own "team" during the day.


If you want to play football and play trumpet in the Band at Roy D Mercer Jr High......I'll see you in class at 8:15.

go bowe
08-29-2005, 09:25 PM
Simplex....most school funds come from Property taxes. The assumption that all homeschool parents are paying for the public school, goes along with the assumption that they are home owners.

Think any home school families Rent?

I say that School Sports and extra chariculars(would Band, chorus, theater be the same? they're actually classes....which I think a homeschool kid Should be able to attend if they choose, but that goes against the entire parents arguement about not letting them get corrupted by those devil Public school kids).....sorry.......I think there is alot more to sports than just playing them.....Its about a Team, and I don't see how that works if you're on your Own "team" during the day.


If you want to play football and play trumpet in the Band at Roy D Mercer Jr High......I'll see you in class at 8:15.renters pay property taxes, too...

part of the rent goes to pay the property taxes on the building...

go bowe
08-29-2005, 09:32 PM
I believe that was precisely the point I was making.

Although it's more about being poor and fat than it is being antisocial. Fat people are worthless. Poor people are worthless. I wouldn't want to associate with anyone like me. I know what I am, so I keep to my place.hey there...

you're not fat, you're just a little pudgy...

besides, i am probably much fatter than you (and several other people combined), and probably much poorer too...

but i sure ain't worthless...

shit, pound for pound, i know i'm worth at least $1,000 (cleaned and butchered)...

ZepSinger
08-29-2005, 09:36 PM
I'll only comment that Every land/home owner without children attending the school district pays the same as the home school parent, and doens't have a kid in the district. That includes the elderly, people who don't have kids yet, have young children or grown kids......If we all didn't contribute, it would be an overwhelming expense.

Touche'.

Iowanian
08-29-2005, 09:56 PM
renters pay property taxes, too...

part of the rent goes to pay the property taxes on the building...

Only an attorney could make that leap of logic.

Mosbonian
08-29-2005, 10:48 PM
It's good to see that none of that irrational thinking and posting that goes on at DC has made it's way to the Lounge

Where to start....my answer is going to require two posts.

First let's look at it from the perspective of a person forced to "homeschool" their child because the school system fails them miserably in suporting their "special needs" child. (And BTW, Iowanian, I do not agree that "special needs" children should be part of the ranking when it comes to the overall class. But neither should you penalize them....why not allow for special recognition for those that have overcome obstacles placed in their way?)

So far it seems everyone acts as if our educational system is without it's flaws....and treats everyone correctly. Sorry, but they don't....when we looked to our local school system to assist us in receiving the resources that were supposed to be available to us for our "special needs" child, we met with delays and resistance. When we finally indicated that our next communication would be with the local school board, we finally got the meeting we wanted. But it brought little or no results, except to give excuses about being under-staffed and over worked. So...what was recommended to us by one of the Counselors from the school system and another professional we paid for? Homeschool would probably be the best solution for us considering that our Autistic child probably wouldn't be able to survive in a Middle School environment!!!

So...let me ask you.....would you tell me that it's not OK to let my child participate in extra-curricular activites because he's not attending the public school?

mmaddog
*******

Iowanian
08-29-2005, 10:54 PM
Mm...

In no way, do I think a Special Needs kid should be penalized.......

What I have a problem with, is 10 kids who are in those classes full time getting a higher GPA than A studen with college potential, but not top 30%.....as it can cost them alot more in scholarships etc.....

Thats my only issue with that.....

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 11:18 PM
Simplex....most school funds come from Property taxes. The assumption that all homeschool parents are paying for the public school, goes along with the assumption that they are home owners.

Think any home school families Rent?
I'm sure some do. And I'll bet the guy that owns the property they're renting is paying property taxes, which, in turn, are being covered by the rent money that family is paying.

Or are you saying that any person that rents shouldn't be allowed to send their kids to public schools because they aren't paying into the system?

Mosbonian
08-29-2005, 11:22 PM
In the case of our other child, we chose to allow her to make her choice and she decided she wanted to stay in school...so we let her. But quite frankly I believe she would get a better education at home. The material that she studied in 2nd Grade here in Columbia was a repeat of what she learned in the 1st Grade in North Carolina...(North Carolina...for god's sake...one of the poorest rated educational systems in the US).

When we asked that she be considered for the "accelerated program" she was tested. We were told by the school that her test scores were more than sufficient to qualify for the program, but that it was decided by the "evaluators" (the Principal, the Counselor, and a teacher) that she "failed" her social interview because she was too shy in the interview. (Later we were told confidentially that she was a victim of a "quota"...that the school wanted to take the best of all minorities to place in the program to ensure equality).

We again considered "home-schooling" her, but decided to do additional studies to accelerate her learning along with what she learned in Public school.

So...while we all play the "if you don't go, you can't play" card, sometimes it just isn't that easy! Sometimes choices are made based upon needs....

mmaddog
*******

Mosbonian
08-29-2005, 11:26 PM
Mm...

In no way, do I think a Special Needs kid should be penalized.......

What I have a problem with, is 10 kids who are in those classes full time getting a higher GPA than A studen with college potential, but not top 30%.....as it can cost them alot more in scholarships etc.....

Thats my only issue with that.....

I full agree with that....if you are grading "special needs" children on a different level, then their scores should not be main-streamed.

mmaddog
*******

Chiefs Pantalones
08-29-2005, 11:36 PM
I think they should.

I know a bunch of homeschooled kids, and the only thing that is wrong with them is they are 20 going on 14 socially. I have nothing against homeschooling, but from my experience, it effects a kid socially. Maybe them participating in public school sports could be a way for them to open up more, break out of their shell.

When I get married and have kids, I'm not going to homeschool them. I don't want them to be like that. I want them to go through the teasing, etc. The real life stuff. As a parent, I'd want to protect them, but I wouldn't want to protect them from the real world. All I can do is support them and help them stay strong and grow through the tough experiene of a public school (and yes, it better be a dang good district, great teachers, etc, which is hard to find these days). Who knows, though, my opinions may change between now and then, but that's the way it is right now anyway.

Simplex3
08-29-2005, 11:41 PM
When I get married and have kids, I'm not going to homeschool them. I don't want them to be like that. I want them to go through the teasing, etc. The real life stuff. As a parent, I'd want to protect them, but I wouldn't want to protect them from the real world. All I can do is support them and help them stay strong and grow through the tough experiene of a public school (and yes, it better be a dang good district, great teachers, etc, which is hard to find these days). Who knows, though, my opinions may change between now and then, but that's the way it is right now anyway.
You can provide all of that for your kids. When my 4 year old makes a bone-head mistake I point it out, sometimes using a little ridicule. We provide social interaction by sending her and my 1 1/2 year old son to play groups, taking them to the play area in the mall, etc. Now, I will admit we are sending my daughter to a private preschool, but we interviewed no fewer than a dozen of them and their educational process was a major deciding factor.

Will I send my daughter outside of the home for schooling? Yes. Will it be public shool? I doubt it, but when the time comes I will go and check the place out. Either way I can assure you the toughest work she will get will come from me, not the school.

Logical
08-29-2005, 11:57 PM
Those parents are paying the same property taxes whether they homeschool their kids or not. Therefore the kids should have the right to participate in the sports at the pubic school.

Mosbonian
08-30-2005, 12:09 AM
I think they should.

I know a bunch of homeschooled kids, and the only thing that is wrong with them is they are 20 going on 14 socially. I have nothing against homeschooling, but from my experience, it effects a kid socially. Maybe them participating in public school sports could be a way for them to open up more, break out of their shell.

When I get married and have kids, I'm not going to homeschool them. I don't want them to be like that. I want them to go through the teasing, etc. The real life stuff. As a parent, I'd want to protect them, but I wouldn't want to protect them from the real world. All I can do is support them and help them stay strong and grow through the tough experiene of a public school (and yes, it better be a dang good district, great teachers, etc, which is hard to find these days). Who knows, though, my opinions may change between now and then, but that's the way it is right now anyway.

Sorry, but I'm not buying into the "loss of social skills" argument from anyone.....where are most of the social contacts actually made? Most certainly not in the school....quite frankly most of the social contacts are within the neighborhood you live in, the afterschool activities that the kids participate in, and church for those that attend.

mmaddog
*******

duncan_idaho
08-30-2005, 12:10 AM
As a product of homeschooling, I can say that giving those kids extracurricular options is the most critical thing possible.

We decided to homeschool because of the terrible state of the class I was in (this was in 7th grade). But we had a good group of other homeschoolers around to do field trips and activities and such with, and I was involved in baseball, 4-H and several leadership activities. (The local high school's baseball coach actually wanted me to play,too, and I was going to do it until he left for another school. But junior legion/summer leagues kept me busy). I ended up OK—I'm one of the most outgoing people I know. ANd the education I received was definitely better than what I would have gotten at that high school.I graduated cum laude from Mizzou in May, so something worked.

My little sister (she's 15) has been homeschooled since first grade... and dance class, softball and volleyball have been her outlets. She gave up softball and volleyball recently to focus on dance (she's a part-time teacher at her studio). She's also outgoing, and she has so many friends, I can't keep track of it. I think I'm going to end up in prison keeping the boys away from her...

I think my point is, since the tax money goes in regardless, and since it is so crucial to the social development, homeschoolers should be allowed to play sports if they want (or be in band or whatever). It's cruel not to...

And don't fall into the stereotype trap that all homeschoolers are being shielded from the world for religious purposes. While a good portion of it is due to that, there is also a good portion that simply want to offer their children better educational opportunities than the local school district.

Simplex3
08-30-2005, 12:15 AM
And don't fall into the stereotype trap that all homeschoolers are being shielded from the world for religious purposes. While a good portion of it is due to that, there is also a good portion that simply want to offer their children better educational opportunities than the local school district.
Bulls**t. Your parents are religious zealots who wanted to shield you from the evils of public school. Admit it! Come on, you can't hide it from terroristme and chiefs4me! They can smell your kind a mile away.



:) j/k of course.

Mosbonian
08-30-2005, 01:42 AM
We decided to homeschool because of the terrible state of the class I was in (this was in 7th grade). But we had a good group of other homeschoolers around to do field trips and activities and such with, and I was involved in baseball, 4-H and several leadership activities. (The local high school's baseball coach actually wanted me to play,too, and I was going to do it until he left for another school. But junior legion/summer leagues kept me busy). I ended up OK—I'm one of the most outgoing people I know. ANd the education I received was definitely better than what I would have gotten at that high school.I graduated cum laude from Mizzou in May, so something worked.


If you went to school in Columbia...not much has changed since. Even in what is considered the "best" schools in town, the state of the class is sometimes in question.

mmaddog
*******

Simplex3
08-30-2005, 03:06 AM
It's amazing to me that 53% of you are either totally blinded by the govt. line of s**t or so jealous that these homeschooled kids are learning more than yours that you'd vote that way.

Oh well, kind of proves the point that half of society is dumber than the average person.

BigMeatballDave
08-30-2005, 03:11 AM
Homeschooling is a HORRIBLE idea...

Simplex3
08-30-2005, 03:33 AM
Homeschooling is a HORRIBLE idea...
Well, after a convincing argument like that I have to agree with you.

Saggysack
08-30-2005, 03:37 AM
No.

Saggysack
08-30-2005, 03:47 AM
where are most of the social contacts actually made? Most certainly not in the school....

The word 'social contacts' really kinda has me buggered lately. BTK called his family social contacts during his acceptance speech at his sentencing. I was thinking at the time, aren't they more important than just considering them 'social contacts'. Those words, atleast to me seems alittle more drawn away from the norm. They are your loved ones. Whatever happened to the words 'friends and family'?

Saggysack
08-30-2005, 04:07 AM
Homeschooling is a HORRIBLE idea...

I don't think homeschooling is a horrible idea. I personally think most of the parents that homeschool don't have one clue how to be an educator. Very, very few of those parents homeschooling their children have teaching certificates. Hell, in Kansas they don't even have to have a high school diploma themselves to homeschool their children. What makes them qualified to be an educator? Just because they are a parent of the child? Bull, I say. And that is what I see as the problem with homeschooling. No specific regulations and guidelines for these self-proclaimed educators.

duncan_idaho
08-30-2005, 07:45 AM
saggysack,

I won't argue with you that there are several people that shouldn't homeschool their kids. God knows there were some of them in our homeschool group. But consider this: one big problem a lot of teachers have is understanding how to communicate with their kids, how to get a lesson accross to them. That's one advantage parents should have; they should be able to explain things to their children more easily (when it comes to grasping concepts).

Of course, I had the benefit of learning from two college-educated parents. And it's not like I was a dummy—I was No. 2 in my class when I stopped going to the public school and had never received anything lower than an A- on a report card, while always scoring in the top 3% in standardized testing.

And once I got to 15, my parents pretty much turned me loose schoolwise. I still had to have algebra lessons with my dad from time to time, but for the most part all I had to do was read the material and do the work. I didn't need a masters-educated teacher to repeat a lecture from the book. My mom simply said, "Have this book done by this date," and I made it so.

And if anyone is wondering about the transition to college... I had a 3.89 through two years and graduated with a 3.51.

Iowanian
08-30-2005, 10:21 AM
It's amazing to me that 53% of you are either totally blinded by the govt. line of s**t or so jealous that these homeschooled kids are learning more than yours that you'd vote that way.

Oh well, kind of proves the point that half of society is dumber than the average person.

Eat a turd.

I just don't happen to think homeschool kids should come to the local public school for Desert, if they don't eat their dinner there.

If you want your homeschool kids to participate in the extra activities in public school....send them there, and then suppliment their "education" at home during the summer to give them a Boost.

I'm sure there are some definite success stories to home school........but most of the homeschool kids I know, have the social skills of GoChiefs at the 7th grade dance....

duncan_idaho
08-30-2005, 10:34 AM
Iowanian,

What about kids that are taking all of their classes (with the exception of home ec, PE, etc) at a local college during their senior year? Should they be allowed to get their "desert" at the high school?

It's not as if it's an extra financial drain on the school district... in fact, having kids home school actually makes it money, since they still get the same property tax revenue without having to pay for educating the child.

Iowanian
08-30-2005, 10:43 AM
If they attend the school for classes, and leave for advanced classes at a local CC or something?.......they're still part of the Public School.

Money doesn't really have anything to do with my concerns or arguement.

If you don't attend the public school, you're not part of the school. I don't think its fair to the kids who attend every day, to have to compete with kids who don't even attend public school for spots on teams.



Home schoolers...........Please give an example of your average School day. I'm curious.

duncan_idaho
08-30-2005, 11:04 AM
Well, life isn't fair. I guarantee you most coaches would rather have the best players. Just because kids are homeschooled doesn't mean they don't have friends on the team and aren't a part of the community. IN fact, if they're good enough to make the school team, odds are they're already playing with those kids in rec/traveling leagues. That was my case...

My average day...

I got up at 8, ate breakfast. Began work around 9. Since I didn't have to sit through drawn out explanations of concepts I already understood or picked up quickly, I usually was done by 1:30 or so, when I'd eat lunch. Then, in the afternoon, it was "me" time... I spent a lot of time reading books, and a lot of time shooting hoops/slinging a baseball around in our backyard. I also had music lessons and basketball practice in the afternoons, though I don't remember the exact dates there.

Iowanian
08-30-2005, 12:23 PM
so, in short........while Billy Public School is taking a math test at 3pm....you could have been napping for 2hrs, resting up for your game against him....

Its pretty obvious is "agree to disagree" time.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 12:26 PM
I'm sure this has been brought up before, but when a homeschool child steps on the field to play football, he isn't represnting the school. He has no connection to that school what-so-ever, but he is allowed to play football there.

That doesn't sound like what a football team SHOULD be.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 12:29 PM
It's amazing to me that 53% of you are either totally blinded by the govt. line of s**t or so jealous that these homeschooled kids are learning more than yours that you'd vote that way.

Oh well, kind of proves the point that half of society is dumber than the average person.
Holy shit! Someone that disagrees with me! They must be ****ing RETARDED.

I'm sure homeschooling is great. If and when I have children, i'd love to have them homeschooled, but most families can't get by on a single income. I just don't think they should have the opportunity to represent a school they have no affiliation with on a field.

HOWEVER, I wouldn't be opposed to them playing against other schools. Perhaps an all-Homeschool football team? :hmmm: Or just in singles competitions in other sports, ie tennis, golf, etc...

Chiefnj
08-30-2005, 12:36 PM
If homeschooled, do you get to list anything you want on your college application?

Can you say President of Chess Club, President of Future Leaders of America, President of Drama Club, graduated top of class, Voted Most Likely To Succeed, etc?

Rain Man
08-30-2005, 12:45 PM
If homeschooled, do you get to list anything you want on your college application?

Can you say President of Chess Club, President of Future Leaders of America, President of Drama Club, graduated top of class, Voted Most Likely To Succeed, etc?


You can be valedictorian if you don't have a smart twin.

duncan_idaho
08-30-2005, 12:47 PM
I suppose you can lie on your college transcript about all of the stuff you were suggesting, but typically when college admittance graders see a homeschooled students' application, they pay more attention to national test scores than anything else. They want to see some form of extracurricular, just as they would with any applicant..

Brock
08-30-2005, 12:50 PM
If homeschooled, do you get to list anything you want on your college application?

Can you say President of Chess Club, President of Future Leaders of America, President of Drama Club, graduated top of class, Voted Most Likely To Succeed, etc?

Out of all of those, I'd say only graduated top of class is of any importance.

go bowe
08-30-2005, 01:42 PM
Only an attorney could make that leap of logic.uh, where do you think the property owner gets the money to pay the property taxes (including school taxes)?

it comes from the rent money...

so the renters are indeed paying it, if only indirectly...

i must be really stoned, i don't see the leap... :bong:

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 01:54 PM
It seems to me that if the kid qualifies to be IN the school (can establish residency, age, etc.), then there's no reason why he/she couldn't/shouldn't be allowed to participate in the sporting events. After all, home schooling obviously can't provide the kid with any kind of athletic program.

I'm answering this without reading the other posts in this thread, and I'll be interested to see whyt his is even controversial. Home schooling is, to my knowledge, pretty rare here in Mass.

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:00 PM
Sadly, I don't have time to go through this many contentious posts. Here's my logic, take it or leave it:

1. Parents may have MANY reasons for wanting to home school their kid. In any event, as long as the law allows it, they're doing nothing remotely wrong in doing it that way.

2. Parents cannot offer their kid an athletic program. The school which their child COULD go to, if they wanted, can offer them that important youthful experience.

3. The parents are presumably paying no more, and no less, than they would be if they sent their kid to school full time, by home schooling. IF THIS ASSUMPTION IS WRONG, then the parents should pay the costs for the kid being part of the athletic program.

4. It does not harm the school, the other students, the parents or anyone else, to let them participate in any way that I can see.

5. It probably will help the child to be involved in athletic activities, for reasons we all know.

So I say no harm, no foul, let the kid play. If home schoolers get some kind of break on property taxes or other taxes (seems unlikely to me, but I know nothing about it), then they shoudl pay the freight for their kid to be in the program. Otherwise, they're not draining the system any more or less than any other kids' parents, so what difference does it make.

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:03 PM
I'm sure this has been brought up before, but when a homeschool child steps on the field to play football, he isn't represnting the school. He has no connection to that school what-so-ever, but he is allowed to play football there.

That doesn't sound like what a football team SHOULD be.

Is scholastic athletics about giving kids in the community an opportunity to learn how to be members of a team, how to work together, to be physical active, etc., or is it about letting kids represent school colors, and winning?

IMHO it's the former, not the latter.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:06 PM
Is scholastic athletics about giving kids in the community an opportunity to learn how to be members of a team, how to work together, to be physical active, etc., or is it about letting kids represent school colors, and winning?

IMHO it's the former, not the latter.
It's both.

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:06 PM
Those parents are paying the same property taxes whether they homeschool their kids or not. Therefore the kids should have the right to participate in the sports at the pubic school.


Ding! Or, as Simplex and Go Bo note, paying rent to a person who pays property tax, which is indirectly the same thing.

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:12 PM
Hypothetical -- you are a brilliant doctor and your wife is a brilliant lawyer, but you have both dedicated yourselves to working with the impoverished. You therefore work with the poor through agencies that simply do not pay very well. Because you don't make big bucks, you also happen to live (own a small house) in a community that doesn't have what anyone would call "good" public schools. Private schools are too expensive.

Little Johnny can go to school, be physically threatened, and learn how to be a bad student with bad habits, or he can be homeschooled and be, potentially, as brilliant as his parents (or so his parents believe, anyway). The law permits this.

Little Johnny also isn't so little. He's got all the makings of being the stud linebacker his uncle was (made it to the pros but was cut after 3 years). He can possibly get athletic scholarships, in case academic scholarships aren't available.

And some here are suggesting that Johnny be prohibited from playing high school sports. :spock:

That makes NO sense to me.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:13 PM
If he has the potential to be brilliant like his parents, why can't he live up to that potential in a public school?

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:15 PM
Holy shit! Someone that disagrees with me! They must be ****ing RETARDED.

I'm sure homeschooling is great. If and when I have children, i'd love to have them homeschooled, but most families can't get by on a single income. I just don't think they should have the opportunity to represent a school they have no affiliation with on a field.

HOWEVER, I wouldn't be opposed to them playing against other schools. Perhaps an all-Homeschool football team? :hmmm: Or just in singles competitions in other sports, ie tennis, golf, etc...

Their parents pay taxes like everyone else they shouldn't be punished for wanting to actually learn something through home schooling. Bottom line is they are saving us money by teaching their own kids and I am not for punishing the parents and child for that by not allowing them to play sports. There are WAY too many rules in this world if you want a pass a good one for once pass a rule that states you can't have your rights to the use of a school sponsored program contingent on stupid shit. What right does anyone have to force you into a bad education and make your physical activities depend on it? To me that absolutely ridiculous.

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:19 PM
Hypothetical -- you are a brilliant doctor and your wife is a brilliant lawyer, but you have both dedicated yourselves to working with the impoverished. You therefore work with the poor through agencies that simply do not pay very well. Because you don't make big bucks, you also happen to live (own a small house) in a community that doesn't have what anyone would call "good" public schools. Private schools are too expensive.

Little Johnny can go to school, be physically threatened, and learn how to be a bad student with bad habits, or he can be homeschooled and be, potentially, as brilliant as his parents (or so his parents believe, anyway). The law permits this.

Little Johnny also isn't so little. He's got all the makings of being the stud linebacker his uncle was (made it to the pros but was cut after 3 years). He can possibly get athletic scholarships, in case academic scholarships aren't available.

And some here are suggesting that Johnny be prohibited from playing high school sports. :spock:

That makes NO sense to me.

Amen brother. Seems like everyone knows what's best for everyone else these days to the point that they would deny you the use of your own funds you paid through taxation if you don't see things their way. It's just not right.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:20 PM
Their parents pay taxes like everyone else they shouldn't be punished for wanting to actually learn something through home schooling. Bottom line is they are saving us money by teaching their own kids and I am not for punishing the parents and child for that by not allowing them to play sports. There are WAY too many rules in this world if you want a pass a good one for once pass a rule that states you can't have your rights to the use of a school sponsored program contingent on stupid shit. What right does anyone have to force you into a bad education and make your physical activities depend on it? To me that absolutely ridiculous.
:rolleyes:

Bad education. I wonder what percentages of the college graduates in the workforce today are sliding by on a "bad education" since they went to public school.

If you are so worried about your child competing in high school athletics, send them to public school, and address any other academic shortcomings YOU may think the public school has at home.

If they allow home school students to participate, they should allow students who are failing all their classes to participate as well. No difference, they are both not academically elligible at that particular school.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:22 PM
Amen brother. Seems like everyone knows what's best for everyone else these days to the point that they would deny you the use of your own funds you paid through taxation if you don't see things their way. It's just not right.
Uh..isn't that how things work? I don't agree with quite a few of the government entities my tax dollars go to. Should I get them back?

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:22 PM
:rolleyes:

Bad education. I wonder what percentages of the college graduates in the workforce today are sliding by on a "bad education" since they went to public school.

If you are so worried about your child competing in high school athletics, send them to public school, and address any other academic shortcomings YOU may think the public school has at home.

If they allow home school students to participate, they should allow students who are failing all their classes to participate as well. No difference, they are both not academically elligible at that particular school.

People with controlling opinions like yours are one more good reason to privatize schools. What right do you have to deny me access to the school I have already helped pay for through taxation?

Iowanian
08-30-2005, 02:25 PM
I don't see anyone being "punished". Their kids have the EXACT same oportunity to attend the public school and participate in every activity that is available, as long as they meet requirements.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:28 PM
People with controlling opinions like yours are one more good reason to privatize schools. What right do you have to deny me access to the school I have already helped pay for through taxation?
You aren't denied access to the school. You are denied access to the schools services as your child is not enrolled there. Whats next? Do you think if you homeschool your child, you should be able to get them free & reduced lunch at the school? Textbooks lended to them? A library card? Hell, how about the bus system? It's foolish to think you can take advantage of such resources when your child is not a student at the school.

That being said, I wouldn't disagree with those who homeschool to get a tax break. Not an exemption though. Whether you have a child or not, by being part of the community, you ARE benefiting from the public school system.

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:33 PM
I don't see anyone being "punished". Their kids have the EXACT same oportunity to attend the public school and participate in every activity that is available, as long as they meet requirements.

Unfriggenbelievable. I guess I have to wear the goggles you have on in order to look at it that way. Can't say it surprises me coming from Mr. Rules. I am not even going to go down this road with you as we have already been down it many times on different subjects and we both know it goes absolutely nowhere. You should be a politician already you seem to know what is best for everyone all the time and you seem to love the micromanagement of society.

Iowanian
08-30-2005, 02:33 PM
Why Would or SHOULD homeschool parents get a tax break?

As I stated yesterday....EVERY property owner pays state taxes, which fund schools(at least in Iowa...at a rate near 70%)....single people, old people, people with kids out of school, in school, not old enough for school...........

I agree with Sauldo...When a kid steps onto the field of competition, they represent that school...it they don't attend...that spot should be taken by a kid who does.


Riddle me this......Lets say I send my kid to a private Christian school....that only offers 8 man football........I want Billy to play for the State Champion Public school. Can he play? Is it any different?...after all...I'm paying taxes.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:35 PM
What if your kid was competing for a spot on the varsity squad, only to lose out to a homeschool kid, who doesn't have to meet the same requirements as your child?

That would enrage me.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:36 PM
Why Would or SHOULD homeschool parents get a tax break?

As I stated yesterday....EVERY property owner pays state taxes, which fund schools(at least in Iowa...at a rate near 70%)....single people, old people, people with kids out of school, in school, not old enough for school...........

Only because they have CHOSEN not to use the services when they had children. I think it would be a small one. I'm kind of torn on it anyways.

People, old, young, single, childless or no, DO benefit from the public school system.

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:37 PM
You aren't denied access to the school. You are denied access to the schools services as your child is not enrolled there. Whats next? Do you think if you homeschool your child, you should be able to get them free & reduced lunch at the school? Textbooks lended to them? A library card? Hell, how about the bus system? It's foolish to think you can take advantage of such resources when your child is not a student at the school.

That being said, I wouldn't disagree with those who homeschool to get a tax break. Not an exemption though. Whether you have a child or not, by being part of the community, you ARE benefiting from the public school system.

Two words, privatize schools.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:38 PM
Two words, privatize schools.
So they can lose money and go bankrupt?

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:39 PM
What if your kid was competing for a spot on the varsity squad, only to lose out to a homeschool kid, who doesn't have to meet the same requirements as your child?

That would enrage me.

Then he should have been better, real simple.

Brock
08-30-2005, 02:40 PM
Then he should have been better, real simple.

The homeschooled kid doesn't have to meet grade requirements. No, I don't think that's a fair competition.

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:41 PM
So they can lose money and go bankrupt?

I have always been for the voucher program. Too many people want to control what and how things are being taught and I am not even talking about math or science. This subject is just one more great example.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:41 PM
Then he should have been better, real simple.
The homeschool kid has all day to work on his football skills. Unfair advantage.

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:43 PM
The homeschooled kid doesn't have to meet grade requirements. No, I don't think that's a fair competition.

Then have an exam he has to pass in order to prove he is at an adequate education level in order to play. Hell make it harder than what the kids are doing in school you know he will pass it.

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:44 PM
The homeschool kid has all day to work on his football skills. Unfair advantage.

Please, he had to study in order pass the exam to get in.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:44 PM
Too many people want to control what and how things are being taught and I am not even talking about math or science. This subject is just one more great example.
I've always felt strongly it is up to the parents if they want to teach their child something that the school doesn't cover, or the school doesn't teach the way the parents like it. Where are you going to find a school where all your beliefs and morals line up exactly with yours?

And why do parents these days expect the school to do everything for them?

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:45 PM
Personally if I had a kid on the varsity squad and we couldn't have the best player at the position you son is taking up because we were denied having somebody better I would be outraged.

Iowanian
08-30-2005, 02:45 PM
jimmy homeschool was able to take off at noon for his daily weight training at the Y with his personal trainer before his afternoon nap, while Billy Public School was taking his 2:30 math test....

Billy would like to win the wrestleoff for the varsity spot, but he was fullfilling his public school home ec requirement while jimmy was resting before practice.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:45 PM
Please, he had to study in order pass the exam to get in.
Do you know how much of a joke those entrance exams are?

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:46 PM
If he has the potential to be brilliant like his parents, why can't he live up to that potential in a public school?


What difference does it make? They have the right, under law, to teach him at home.

But for your purposes, assume that (1) the school is full of students who could care less about school, and (2) the teachers are ineffective due to low pay, poor conditions, etc. Also, state testing has shown that the schools in this district perform very poorly. Bottom line -- the parents have a good, reasonable belief that Johnny will be better educated if his parents do it, then he will if he goes to school.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:46 PM
Personally if I had a kid on the varsity squad and we couldn't have the best player at the position you son is taking up because we were denied having somebody better I would be outraged.
What if it was your sons spot he was competing for?

Brock
08-30-2005, 02:47 PM
Then have an exam he has to pass in order to prove he is at an adequate education level in order to play. Hell make it harder than what the kids are doing in school you know he will pass it.

So we're going to spend more tax dollars coming up with an exam that everyone can agree is fair, and the courtroom battles that would take place over that? I don't think it's a good idea.

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:48 PM
Uh..isn't that how things work? I don't agree with quite a few of the government entities my tax dollars go to. Should I get them back?


It's really completely unrelated to this topic.

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:49 PM
I've always felt strongly it is up to the parents if they want to teach their child something that the school doesn't cover, or the school doesn't teach the way the parents like it. Where are you going to find a school where all your beliefs and morals line up exactly with yours?

And why do parents these days expect the school to do everything for them?

No it's not that it's shit like butt pirate and transexual pride week like they have in my godsons school. What a bunch of BS I didn't send him to school in order to learn that crap.

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:49 PM
I don't see anyone being "punished". Their kids have the EXACT same oportunity to attend the public school and participate in every activity that is available, as long as they meet requirements.

Right, they meet all requirements for residency and otherwise to attend local school. They elect to be home schooled, but an athletic program is obviously unavailable through homeschooling.

Why shoudl they not participate in the local athletic program?

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:50 PM
What if it was your sons spot he was competing for?

Then he should have been better that's the way life works and he better get used to it because he isn't a female minority.

Brock
08-30-2005, 02:50 PM
Right, they meet all requirements for residency and otherwise to attend local school. They elect to be home schooled, but an athletic program is obviously unavailable through homeschooling.

Why shoudl they not participate in the local athletic program?

How do you determine whether they are academically eligible?

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 02:51 PM
So we're going to spend more tax dollars coming up with an exam that everyone can agree is fair, and the courtroom battles that would take place over that? I don't think it's a good idea.

You could easily use the SAT.

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:52 PM
Why Would or SHOULD homeschool parents get a tax break?

IMHO they should not. If you are speaking to me, then I raised the issue because I didn't know if they did. IMHO, again, they should not. Just as people without children don't get one.

I agree with Sauldo...When a kid steps onto the field of competition, they represent that school...it they don't attend...that spot should be taken by a kid who does.

You're putting the importance of "representing the school" (whatever the heck that means) above the development of children and young adults in the community. I can't even begin to wrap my brains around that.

Riddle me this......Lets say I send my kid to a private Christian school....that only offers 8 man football........I want Billy to play for the State Champion Public school. Can he play? Is it any different?...after all...I'm paying taxes.

No different. IMHO athletics are an OPTIONAL part of the cirriculum at any local school. EVERY local student-age individual should be permitted to participate in the public school programs. In this case, proof of residency in the school district should be made, as well as satisfactory academic achievement (i.e. that he is passing his private school classes).

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:52 PM
No it's not that it's shit like butt pirate and transexual pride week like they have in my godsons school. What a bunch of BS I didn't send him to school in order to learn that crap.
ROFL

I'm sure the private school will offer up some things you do not agree with either.

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:53 PM
What if your kid was competing for a spot on the varsity squad, only to lose out to a homeschool kid, who doesn't have to meet the same requirements as your child?

That would enrage me.

What "requirements" are you referring to?

Simplex3
08-30-2005, 02:54 PM
I don't think homeschooling is a horrible idea. I personally think most of the parents that homeschool don't have one clue how to be an educator. Very, very few of those parents homeschooling their children have teaching certificates.
Fewer than half of all certified, employed, NEA teachers can pass the portion of their state skills test for the section they teach. Yeah, govt. teachers are SOOOOOooo much better.

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:54 PM
The homeschool kid has all day to work on his football skills. Unfair advantage.


:spock:

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:54 PM
They elect to be home schooled, but an athletic program is obviously unavailable through homeschooling.


This really isn't true, either. You as a parent can furnish your own athletic training, for any sport.

duncan_idaho
08-30-2005, 02:56 PM
Um, it's flat-out wrong to think that home school kids don't have to meet grading requirements.

To be eligible, not only do the parents have to provide documentation of the kids doing their work (at least quarterly grade cards, copies of tests, etc), the kids also usually have to participate in standardized testiing.

And Iowanian, I should state that I'm not the typical home school kid. I was able to progress through my day like that, but I don't think that is typical of every homeschooler. One of my best friend's was also homeschooled, and I know his school day typically was pretty much normal. My sister definitely takes longer than I did. So for whatever reason, I was an unusual case.

And what's the difference if your kid loses his spot to a homeschooler or another member of the school? Either way, he's losing his spot.

Next you're going to say homeschoolers shouldn't be able to compete for scholarships, either.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:56 PM
:spock:
Out of all the children who do homeschool, what percentage would you say spend the equal amount of time in their "classroom" as compared to a traditional student?

Simplex3
08-30-2005, 02:56 PM
Eat a turd.

I just don't happen to think homeschool kids should come to the local public school for Desert, if they don't eat their dinner there.
So the fact that they already paid for dinner and dessert is of no issue to you. Tell you what, if you aren't going to drive on ALL of the roads then don't drive on ANY of the roads. That's how it works, it's all or nothing in your world.

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:57 PM
jimmy homeschool was able to take off at noon for his daily weight training at the Y with his personal trainer before his afternoon nap, while Billy Public School was taking his 2:30 math test....

Billy would like to win the wrestleoff for the varsity spot, but he was fullfilling his public school home ec requirement while jimmy was resting before practice.

Jimmy Homeschool will have moronic parents if they aren't teaching him like they should be. Even if he is going to a personal trainer, etc., then he should be getting basic schooling at home.

You're assuming some kind of odd scenario where homeschooling is used not to teach the kid anything academic, but to prepare him for life as a professional athlete or something. I find that to be very, very weird and hard to imagine.

I think it would be beyond rare for Jimmy Homeschool to have his academics ignored by his parents in order to pursue athletics.

Simplex3
08-30-2005, 02:58 PM
If they attend the school for classes, and leave for advanced classes at a local CC or something?.......they're still part of the Public School.

Money doesn't really have anything to do with my concerns or arguement.

If you don't attend the public school, you're not part of the school. I don't think its fair to the kids who attend every day, to have to compete with kids who don't even attend public school for spots on teams.
So then, if they don't do sports or something they shouldn't be allowed to atttend classes, right? All or nothing baby.

Saulbadguy
08-30-2005, 02:58 PM
I wonder what percentage of children in this state do homeschool. Out of that percentage, I wonder what percentage of them are involved in a sport that would require them to join a high school team.

Probably small enough to be a non-issue.

Iowanian
08-30-2005, 02:58 PM
Amno.....see the example I cited on the first page.

That happend.....and is happening at a school in Southern Iowa.

duncan_idaho
08-30-2005, 02:58 PM
On the standardized testing front, the Iowa Basic Test is the one most commonly used by homeschoolers.

Everyone accepts that test. And it's pretty easy to have the homeschool kids come in to the school, where the proctor would be somone other than their parents.

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 02:59 PM
What if it was your sons spot he was competing for?

Then my son better be better than Johnny Homeschool at that position.

What difference does it make if Johnny is homeschooled or a classmate? He's the same age and lives in the same community. WTF else matters, really?

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 03:00 PM
So the fact that they already paid for dinner and dessert is of no issue to you. Tell you what, if you aren't going to drive on ALL of the roads then don't drive on ANY of the roads. That's how it works, it's all or nothing in your world.

He wants to micromanage the world dude he knows what's best for everyone. There isn't a rule, law or restriction he doesn't like. I guess I just don't understand that mentality at all.

Simplex3
08-30-2005, 03:01 PM
Holy shit! Someone that disagrees with me! They must be ****ing RETARDED.
I'm not saying they're retarded. HOWEVER, find one place in this thread where they make an argument that isn't destroyed by facts and isn't "because it's all or nothing damnit".

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 03:01 PM
How do you determine whether they are academically eligible?

I don't know if homeschooled kids need to be tested, annually, to determine if they are progressing as they should. If not, then there should be such a program anyway, which is completely unrelated to the athetics matter we are discussing, but could also be used for this purpose.

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 03:02 PM
Then my son better be better than Johnny Homeschool at that position.

What difference does it make if Johnny is homeschooled or a classmate? He's the same age and lives in the same community. WTF else matters, really?

He got fuzz on his balls earlier and sleeps on a better mattress it is an unfair advantage.

Iowanian
08-30-2005, 03:02 PM
So then, if they don't do sports or something they shouldn't be allowed to atttend classes, right? All or nothing baby.

Where in the hell do you make that assumption?

The School is there for the education, and a student has to be academically eligable to participate in any of the Extra curricular activities....>that eligability includes attending classes a certain number of days, not being late for school or class and staying out ot trouble.

Not the same thing at all.

I don't blame the homeschool parents for being defensive in a thread like this...but it doesn't make anyone who disagrees a special needs student either.

You want Jimmy Homeschool to play the tuba, but not attend the school with band? fine....Hire him a music teacher if you don't know how....There is always the Free option, already funded by your local taxpayers.

No one is excluding the Homeschool child from anything, except the Parent who CHOOSES to homeschool. period. A free education is available just down the street....with bonus' of band, chior, football etc....

duncan_idaho
08-30-2005, 03:02 PM
Amen!

"Then my son better be better than Johnny Homeschool at that position.

What difference does it make if Johnny is homeschooled or a classmate? He's the same age and lives in the same community. WTF else matters, really?"

I had friends in high school that I played ball with during the summer begging me to come play for the high school team. Why? Because they wanted to win. They didn't care if Joe Blow, who barely made the roster and didn't play anyway, was deprived of a spot. They'd rather have someone who can contribute.

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 03:03 PM
I don't know if homeschooled kids need to be tested, annually, to determine if they are progressing as they should. If not, then there should be such a program anyway, which is completely unrelated to the athetics matter we are discussing, but could also be used for this purpose.

SATs are already the standard.

BIG_DADDY
08-30-2005, 03:04 PM
Where in the hell do you make that assumption?

The School is there for the education, and a student has to be academically eligable to participate in any of the Extra curricular activities....>that eligability includes attending classes a certain number of days, not being late for school or class and staying out ot trouble.

Not the same thing at all.

I don't blame the homeschool parents for being defensive in a thread like this...but it doesn't make anyone who disagrees a special needs student either.

You want Jimmy Homeschool to play the tuba, but not attend the school with band? fine....Hire him a music teacher if you don't know how....There is always the Free option, already funded by your local taxpayers.

No one is excluding the Homeschool child from anything, except the Parent who CHOOSES to homeschool. period. A free education is available just down the street....with bonus' of band, chior, football etc....

One shoe fits all. :shake:

Amnorix
08-30-2005, 03:04 PM
This really isn't true, either. You as a parent can furnish your own athletic training, for any sport.

:spock:

First, I'm not sure how many high school age sports programs there are that don't actually involve, you know, the high school.

Second, you're talking about prohibitively high costs, unless you're referring to the uber-wealthy.

Third, I don't see how this is in any way fair. You're basically punishing the home schooler for being home schooled. I have no idea why this is desireable, necessary or who is benefitted by this strict rule. You're basically taking a "you don't want to be schooled here, you can't use ANY facility or have ANY relationship with the local schools whatsoever." Why?

Brock
08-30-2005, 03:04 PM
I don't know if homeschooled kids need to be tested, annually, to determine if they are progressing as they should. If not, then there should be such a program anyway, which is completely unrelated to the athetics matter we are discussing, but could also be used for this purpose.

It's not completely unrelated. I don't know how you could unlink the school athletic program from academics, unless you're just being willfully obtuse. I don't know if you played sports in school, but in my school, if you didn't carry a C average, you didn't play.

Iowanian
08-30-2005, 03:05 PM
Duncan....I still say its wrong, because you, yourself said you were at the batting cages while they were just starting classes after lunch.