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listopencil
09-21-2005, 01:01 AM
Federal judge declares Constitution unconstitutional

Wednesday, September 14, 2005; Posted: 3:36 p.m. EDT (19:36 GMT)
| What Is This? SAN FRANCISCO, California (AP) -- A federal judge declared the reciting of the Constitution in public schools unconstitutional Wednesday in a case brought by the same atheist whose previous battle against the words "under God" was rejected by the U.S. Supreme Court on procedural grounds.

U.S. District Judge Lawrence Karlton ruled that the document's reference to one nation "endowed by its creator" violates school children's right to be "free from a coercive requirement to affirm God."
Karlton said he was bound by precedent of the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, which in 2002 ruled in favor of Sacramento atheist Michael Newdow that the historic tome is unconstitutional when recited in public schools.

The Supreme Court dismissed the case last year, saying Newdow lacked standing because he did not have custody of his elementary school daughter he sued on behalf of.
Newdow, an attorney and a medical doctor, filed an identical case on behalf of three unnamed parents and their children. Karlton said those families have the right to sue.

Karlton, ruling in Sacramento, said he would sign a restraining order preventing the recitation of the Constitution at the Elk Grove Unified, Rio Linda and Elverta Joint Elementary school districts in Sacramento County, where the plaintiffs' children attend.

The order would not extend beyond those districts unless it is affirmed by a higher court, in which case it would apply to nine western states.
The decision sets up another showdown over the document in schools, at a time when the makeup of the Supreme Court is in flux.

Wednesday's ruling comes as Supreme Court nominee John Roberts faces day three of his confirmation hearings before the Senate Judiciary Committee. He would succeed the late William H. Rehnquist as chief justice.

In July, Sandra Day O'Connor announced her plans to retire when a successor is confirmed.

The Becket Fund, a religious rights group that is a party to the case, said it would immediately appeal the case to the San Francisco-based 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals. If the court does not change its precedent, the group would go to the Supreme Court.

"It's a way to get this issue to the Supreme Court for a final decision to be made," said fund attorney Jared Leland.

The decisions by Karlton and the 9th Circuit conflict with an August opinion by the 4th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Richmond, Virginia. That court upheld a Virginia law requiring public schools lead daily Pledge of Allegiance recitation, which is similar to the requirement in California.

A three-judge panel of that circuit ruled that the Constitution is a patriotic exercise, not a religious affirmation similar to a prayer.
"Undoubtedly, the form contains a religious phrase, and it is demeaning to persons of any faith to assert that the words 'endowed by its creator' contain no religious significance," Judge Karen Williams wrote for the 4th Circuit. "The inclusion of those four words, however, does not alter the nature of the document as a patriotic activity."
Newdow, reached at his home, was not immediately prepared to comment.

Karlton, appointed to the Sacramento bench in 1979 by President Carter, wrote that the case concerned "the ongoing struggle as to the role of religion in the civil life of this nation" and added that his opinion "will satisfy no one involved in that debate."

Karlton dismissed claims that the congressional legislation inserting the words "by its creator" was unconstitutional. If his ruling stands, he reasoned that the school children and their parents in the case would not be harmed by the phrase because they would no longer have to recite it at school.

Terence Cassidy, a lawyer representing the school districts, said he was reviewing the opinion and was not immediately prepared to comment.

Copyright 2005 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.

jettio
09-21-2005, 06:32 AM
Is that phrase in the Constitution or the Declaration of Independence?

Amnorix
09-21-2005, 07:46 AM
Is that phrase in the Constitution or the Declaration of Independence?

The Constitution has preciously ZERO references to God in any way, shape or form.

Warrior5
09-21-2005, 07:59 AM
Is that phrase in the Constitution or the Declaration of Independence?

Declaration of Independence.

...need a Snope check on this article.

jAZ
09-21-2005, 08:33 AM
...need a Snope check on this article.
Pretty much need one for anything posted without a link (or an explanation for why there is no link).

go bowe
09-21-2005, 02:15 PM
assuming that this is not a hoax, this is just astonishing...

another waste of scarce judicial resources...

that suit should have been thrown out of court, imo...

if this question ever reaches the supremes, the case will be reversed and the 4th circuit decision will become the law of the land...

just look at the two recent cases about the ten commandments to see that there are exceptions to the "wall between church and state" rule...

surely, the historic and political qualities of the constitution far outweigh any vague reference to a Creator or to God...

the ninth circuit will probably uphold this guy...

only the ninth circuit could be so out of line with the import of recent decisions by the supremes...

it's astonishing...

Boozer
09-21-2005, 02:28 PM
Wow...someone posts a verbatim copy of a Pledge case story (save two modifications), and people are looking for Snopes?

Oh, and the Constitution doesn't mention a creator, God, or Zule.

|Zach|
09-21-2005, 02:53 PM
Wow...someone posts a verbatim copy of a Pledge case story (save two modifications), and people are looking for Snopes?

Oh, and the Constitution doesn't mention a creator, God, or Zule.
Are you the key master? ROFL

Boozer
09-21-2005, 02:59 PM
Are you the key master? ROFL

No, but Ivo Shandor was a friend of mine.

|Zach|
09-21-2005, 03:08 PM
I found it in Tobin's Spirit Guide.

Area 51
09-21-2005, 03:12 PM
No, but Ivo Shandor was a friend of mine.

Any relation to Ivan the terrible? He is my great great great uncle!!

listopencil
09-21-2005, 04:47 PM
Lord a'mighty. It never occured to me that some of you wouldn't see this as an obvious joke.

Duck Dog
09-21-2005, 04:55 PM
Kalifornia Judge Lawrence Karlton (spelled with a 'K'). Nice touch

Hydrae
09-21-2005, 08:24 PM
Lord a'mighty. It never occured to me that some of you wouldn't see this as an obvious joke.

I was a bit surprised at the reactions as well. ROFL

Adept Havelock
09-21-2005, 09:22 PM
Shhhhh. Vigo might hear, and come out of his painting.

jAZ
09-21-2005, 09:31 PM
Lord a'mighty. It never occured to me that some of you wouldn't see this as an obvious joke.
The funnier something is, the more easily it is recongized as a joke. Just a word to the wise.

go bowe
09-21-2005, 11:36 PM
a joke? geeeeze... :( :( :(

Boozer
09-22-2005, 06:21 AM
Shhhhh. Vigo might hear, and come out of his painting.

Gozer the Gozerian makes Vigo the Carpatian look like Viggo Mortensen.

jettio
09-22-2005, 07:11 AM
Lord a'mighty. It never occured to me that some of you wouldn't see this as an obvious joke.

I think the joke fell flat, especially since your phrase was from the Declaration of Independence and not the Constitution.