View Full Version : Kellen Winslow Jr. recruiting saga redux?

Ultra Peanut
10-17-2005, 12:49 AM
I hope not.

By Gary Parrish and Jim Masilak
October 17, 2005

One week before he is to announce his college destination, Thaddeus Young told The Commercial Appeal late Sunday that the University of Memphis remains an option, despite his father proclaiming otherwise

"Right now, it's Memphis, Kentucky, Georgia Tech and Arkansas," Young said. "I've cut it down to four."

Young's clarification came only minutes after his father, Felton Young, told The Commercial Appeal in a separate interview that the Mitchell High star had eliminated Memphis from consideration. Asked why, Felton Young answered, "He would like to go out of town. That's the discussion with me."

So to recap:

Felton Young insisted the UofM is no longer an option. Thaddeus said it is.

The confusion?

According to Thaddeus, it's racially motivated.

"My Dad, he kind of wants me to play for a black coach," Thaddeus said. "But that doesn't really matter to me."

Kentucky, Arkansas and Georgia Tech -- the only three schools Felton Young said his son is still considering -- are all led by black coaches, namely Tubby Smith, Stan Heath and Paul Hewitt. Memphis is coached by John Calipari, who, of course, is white.

"But I don't think that's gonna be a big deal," Thaddeus said. "This is my decision, and whatever I pick (my father) is going to be happy."

If nothing else, Sunday's developments offered further proof that Young's recruitment is going to go down as one of the strangest this city has ever seen. On some level, it's fitting considering the 6-8 wing -- ranked by Rivals.com as the third-best prospect in the nation -- is also one of the greatest talents this city has ever produced.

Since early summer, Young has gone from "wide open" to "down to seven schools" to "down to four," with the latest casualty being North Carolina, thanks to the Tar Heels gaining a commitment Sunday from highly regarded forward Brandan Wright. That apparently means Young will ultimately choose from a group consisting of two SEC schools, one ACC institution and Conference USA's flagship program.

Either way, a final decision is set to be announced next Monday. The press conference is scheduled for 10 a.m. at Mitchell.

"We are ready to get this over with," Felton Young said. "Next Monday, it'll be done."

10-17-2005, 09:03 AM
you mean kwII wanted to play for memphis??


Ultra Peanut
10-17-2005, 09:09 AM
you mean kwII wanted to play for memphis??


10-17-2005, 09:29 AM

so my brilliant attempt at dry humor got knocked outta the park... brilliant!!!


Ultra Peanut
10-17-2005, 09:39 AM

so my brilliant attempt at dry humor got knocked outta the park... brilliant!!!

-EB-...:spock:You could be the third part of Rausch and I's as-yet-untitled sketch comedy project. We can shoot a pilot for Comedy Central and see what happens.

Spicy McHaggis
10-17-2005, 10:57 AM
I knew Mangino being white hurt recruiting!!! Damn you and your heritage fatman!!!

Ultra Peanut
10-19-2005, 11:20 AM
This comes from a Memphis forum. The first response to it was, "Bullseye," from a legitimately clued-in individual who has a wealth of connections that come from being an AAU coach (he's coached pretty much all of the top recruits to come out of Memphis at some point or another, is very close to a lot of people, and has had a "crystal ball" that has been 100% right so far) and a big part of the city of Memphis' youth basketball scene:

1. Felton Young took money from a vendor for his son to go to Georgia Tech.
2. TY wants to go to Memphis.
3. His second choice is Arkansas.
4. Felton Young is going to return the money to the shoe company with the connection to Georgia Tech.
5. Felton Young is going to accept more money from a shoe company to go to Arkansas.
6. TY does not know about the shoe money as of yet.
7. Sometime this weekend, Felton has to tell TY about the money and the school - because TY is wanting to announce for Memphis.
8. Dad has put son in an awkard position.
9. Race was not an issue at any time, Felton used the smoke screen to eliminate Memphis because of the money he was taking.
10. Chances are greater that he will not be at Memphis.

Ah, the lovely world of recruiting...

Ultra Peanut
10-19-2005, 11:25 AM
From a while back:

Calkins: Why do those least in need get most help?
By Geoff Calkins
May 15, 2005

For the last two years, Darryl Fletcher has worked as manager for the Mitchell High School basketball team. He does the laundry, fills up water bottles, the usual stuff.

Fletcher is a sweet kid, as sweet as they come. He doesn't have a lot of money. He takes special needs classes. Mitchell coach Jerry Johnson says he's "a step or two behind the other kids."

So people look out for him, starting with the principal at Mitchell, John Ware. Ware asked Johnson to find something for Fletcher to do.

That's how he became manager of the basketball team. Johnson gives him basketball shoes, and warmup outfits, and sometimes money for a haircut.

"Everyone knows and loves him at Mitchell," Johnson said. "You might say we look out for him."

I tell you this story because it is pure and simple and clean. The people who help Darryl Fletcher expect nothing in return.

Call them Team Darryl.

I like Team Darryl.

Team Thaddeus?

I'm less sure.

Thaddeus Young is the best high school player in Memphis, certainly one of the 10 best rising seniors in the land. He's tall (6-8) and gifted (North Carolina coach Roy Williams has practically taken up residence) and the subject of a remarkable series of stories in today's Commercial Appeal.

The stories are about Team Thaddeus, the half a dozen people who are shaping Young's life this summer and beyond.

One thing you'll notice about the stories: There's not much about the kid in there.

There's a story on his father, and a lawyer, and the twins who manage his AAU team. There's a story on the big hitters from adidas who see Young as a human billboard.

But Thaddeus himself?

At 16, he's become almost a bit player in his own tale.

Team Thaddeus. What a concept. Once, that was the kid and his mom.

Lula Hall bore her son on June 21, 1988. She never married the father but raised an urban miracle.

Young isn't just a great basketball player, he's an inspiration. He has a 4.3 grade point average. He's in the National Honor Society.

"As good as he is at basketball," said Johnson, "he's a better human being."

Johnson once asked Hall what she did that was so different, how she succeeded where so many had failed.

"She said she didn't use Similac," he said. "She used regular pasteurized milk."

Whatever, it worked until Young hit ninth grade, until he showed signs of becoming a star. Then Team Thaddeus grew beyond the mom.

"She doesn't know anything about basketball," Johnson said. "She only comes to see her son."

Only comes to see her son.

How wonderfully innocent is that?

The rest come because they see his gifts, see that he's going to hit it big. To help him? Or to help themselves? You decide.

But if someone wanted to make a movie about the seamy world of high school basketball, they could come to Memphis and find all the stock characters they need.

The biological father, suddenly playing a larger role in his son's life.

According to Johnson, the Mitchell coach, Felton Young didn't come to his son's games before the ninth grade. Now the elder Young is not only the kid's biggest supporter, he's also his AAU coach. Felton Young hadn't coached in 15 years. But when adidas agreed to underwrite a new team called Pump'N'Run, he got the coaching bug again. Young insists he isn't paid for the job, but that would be a departure from the norm. It's a perfectly legal way for shoe companies to funnel money to the parents of a star.

The questionable characters from the hometown.

Jerry and Terry Durham are twins who manage the new Pump'N'Run team. Between them, they were arrested 19 times from 1989-2002 on charges ranging from reckless driving to attempted murder to possession of drugs with intent to distribute. They've never been convicted of a felony. That much is true. But why are these two even involved?

The fancy lawyer from New Orleans.

Ken Carter is Felton Young's cousin, and a highly respected lawyer from New Orleans. He is deeply involved in all things Thaddeus. Carter says he has no interest in being Young's agent. He's made plenty of money on his own. But is the power appealing? The glamour, the juice? How could it not be? When Roy Williams left an AAU tournament the other day, he waved to Carter on the way out.

The shoe company representatives, wooing the next star.

David and Dana Pump are the adidas executives who decided to underwrite the Pump'N'Run team. They want Young to wear their shoes and figured this was the best way. Before this summer, Young played for a Nike team that wasn't coached by his father. Now there's a new team, built around the Youngs, one as the star, one as the coach.

Oh, and David and Dana Pump are also twins. Just like the Durhams. Because, really, what's a circus without two pairs?

"They're twins, we're twins," said David Pump. "I'm just trying to help the twins."

So the Pumps are trying to help the Durhams, who are trying to help the father, who is trying to help the son, who must feel overwhelmed at times.

Team Thaddeus is supposed to help protect the kid. But how is a kid supposed to know if the people there to protect him are the ones he should be protected from?

Henry Baskin is the athletic director at Mitchell High School. He's been known to go to Internet message boards and post alarming messages about drug dealers getting too close to Young.

Baskin said Young is now in good hands. He's a firm believer in the sincerity of Felton Young.

So is Johnson, the Mitchell coach, who said he called Thaddeus's father three years ago and asked him to get more involved.

"People bash him," he said, "but he is still the boy's dad."

Johnson concedes that some of Thaddeus's family on his mother's side resent Felton Young's prominent role.

"They do," he said. "But they don't understand that he got involved because I called him to help."

As for the Durham brothers and the Pump brothers, what of them?

"We're just trying to help kids," said Jerry Durham.

Of course they are.

But why this kid? Why the one kid in Memphis who might be least in need of help?

There are second-graders who need help. Infants who need help. Musicians and math students and high school basketball managers who need help.

Of course, Darryl Fletcher isn't going to make anyone rich.

Thaddeus Young just might.

Team Darryl.

I like Team Darryl.

I like the uncomplicated selflessness in a complicated time.

10-19-2005, 12:07 PM
You could be the third part of Rausch and I's as-yet-untitled sketch comedy project. We can shoot a pilot for Comedy Central and see what happens.

only if I get my own trailor and...well, f*ck--can't come up with any good demands

alright, some booze would be nice


10-19-2005, 12:40 PM
Winslow got what he deserved..... the guy has a serious problem

10-19-2005, 02:15 PM
chieftan, you're an idiot--this thread isn't about KWII... it's about memphis

-EB-...damned n00bs

10-19-2005, 02:44 PM
chieftan, you're an idiot--this thread isn't about KWII... it's about memphis

-EB-...damned n00bs

Lets see, When did you join and when did I, Your the Idiot! Friggin Noob!

10-19-2005, 02:58 PM
Your the Idiot!


10-19-2005, 03:11 PM
KCLEE heya how you been! Gone to any games lately!


10-19-2005, 03:53 PM
KCLEE heya how you been! Gone to any games lately!


Good. I haven't been a TRUE fan yet this year. By the looks of the party, I should have gone to the game last week. But I did just hang a loss on you on the other boards FFL. (you're the K.C. CHEFS, right?) Sorry. :shrug:

Ultra Peanut
10-19-2005, 11:54 PM
chieftan, you're an idiot--this thread isn't about KWII... it's about memphis

-EB-...damned n00bsActually, it's not so much about Memphis as a very bright, nice young kid who happens to be great at basketball and is going through God knows how much emotional trauma because of it right now. This is such a ****ed-up situation. His thoughts and feelings have apparently been trumped by his deadbeat dad's greed.

Regardless of who he announces for on Monday (and that's looking far less likely to be Memphis (http://commercialappeal.com/mca/prep_sports/article/0,1426,MCA_480_4172056,00.html), at this point, even if it is second-hand information from the ever-trustworthy Mr. Felton Young), I'll feel horrible for him and what he's gone through. He's done nothing to bring this on himself. I just hope he manages to truly pick the school that's right for him, not the school that bests suits his dad's interests after being worn down and giving in.

Ultra Peanut
10-20-2005, 11:52 AM
And a tad more insight:

I'll do the best I can with this one.

In 1992, after coaching younger age teams for 10 or more years I moved up in ages to a 16-under team, 8 of the 10 went on to play college ball, Kurtis Murry TSU, Damon Fuller Memphis, Detric Golden, etc. At an event in Nashville a guy who is now an asst. at Bama gets my phone number and tells me a man named Sonny Vaccaro would be calling. He does, he wants me to get him info on players, which I had, he talked of camps, tourneys, traveling the country and working with/for a shoe co. forever (adidas), forever only lasts as long as you have good players.
Next thing I know boxes of shoes are showing up at my house, $120 shoes, at one time I had over 500 pair in my garage in various styles, colors and sizes, warm-ups, bags, socks. It scared me, I finally asked him what he wanted me to do with all this, he tells me to pick the best from 3 classes, Jr., So. and Fr. and load them up with gear, get them to play on my teams and go to his camp, the ABCD in NJ.
Sonny's theory is that trends start in the inner-city, which they do, he theorized that on Tues. and Fri. if the best HS players were wearing his shoes the general student body would aspire to be like them and go and buy the shoes at retail, it worked, from 1993 to now adidas sales have increased 100%, the company went public and alot of people got rich. (Not me) In 92 adidas sold shoes to 2 HS teams here, in 1996 I had 450 teams buying.
So now I've got gear, clout with players and coaches throughout the south.
I was having fun being like Johnny Appleseed, only with shoes, giving shoes away everywhere. Getting to know almost every D1 coach in america, Dick Vitale, Magic.

Why? Hell if I know, other than control. Nike/Reebok/adidas are giving away over $1 million dollars a year each in product just on the basketball side. It still makes no sense other than how dogs like to have their scent to be the last scent, it's very important to these exec's to have the best players in their product and at their events.
Normally a shoe co. will align itself with someone who historically has had a relationship with players. Ocasionally they will sponsor a team for a few years to get involved with a good player. That's more or less what happened with Thad. You can't blame his dad, his kid is getting noticed, phone is ringing from people wanting to send him stuff, fly him places, telling him great things. He choose a route most don't, he started a team, different from a program.

Why offer a parent a contract? Control. Many famous college and or NBA stars parents have or do work for shoe cos., they get hired as a consultant , every relative LeBron had worked for a shoe co., no cash, these cos. need accountability, contracts spelling out each others responsibilties. It doesn't happen for everyone, supply and demand, both parties have to be willing participants. Rarely is it discussed that the player go to a certain school, although I've seen it happen the last few years, 1 player went, the other balked when there was a coaching change. Nobody can say anything, it's chalked up as a loss, most likely the parent won't ever deal with a shoe co. again.

Did a shoe co. offer a deal for a local player to go to a particular school? If so some people in the community did a good job pointing it out to people, enough so that one of the parties reneged on the deal. Just a theory.

Has a school had a prominent booster(s) attempt to match the deal? Some think so. So much so as to point it out also to the right people. Another theory.

Sonny taught me something years ago, ultimately a persons greed will win out, unless the love for their family balances their decision making process out. I've seen it go both ways.

What's happening here has been reserved for NY, Chicago, L.A., it's ugly, it's also not to late for it to be corrected, hopefully it will.Sad for Thad, sad for all involved...

Well, aside from those cashing checks off of his talent. Woo pig sooie. :rolleyes:

10-20-2005, 11:57 AM
Lets see, When did you join and when did I, Your the Idiot! Friggin Noob!


<img src="http://home.swiftdsl.com.au/~raza/ball_licker.jpg">

I'm sorry to inform you that you are indeed teh ball licker... n00b is an 'idiot' related word... nEWb is a 'new person' related word... thus, I called you a n00b--which you are--kellen winslow deus is only related to the thread as in, fathers who steer sons to certain universities--you're an idiot still--it has nothing to do with when one joined--


Ultra Peanut
10-21-2005, 01:30 AM
Whoa... the following was stated by Easterwood (the guy who posted the above about his background with Adidas) on the radio this afternoon:

1. about a year ago, team thad started inviting college coaches to observe private team thad workouts. cal was never contacted about these workouts, but heard about them and would just show up. (my speculation: team thad did not believe cal would shell out any $$$ for thad, so that was why he was left off the invitation list.)

2. during the arkansas visit, a meeting involving a wal mart rep, a tyson rep, and team thad occured. the wal mart rep is believed to have been an actual walton. thadeus young is said to have been present at these meetings, which is an ncaa no no. (my speculation: if money was discussed or if any money changed hands during this meeting, young's college career is more than likely over.)

3. miaa and ncaa investigations are in the beginning stages.

4. players who have already committed to the u of m are said to have been approached by reps of team thad in efforts of turning them away from memphis...(my speculation: team thad doing so because of the belief that certain players committing to memphis would make steering thad away from memphis more difficult.)


I just got out of the car, heard the interview and "wow" doesn't even begin to explain it. I was glued to the radio driving around so I could hear the whole thing. Wolo's NBDL comment at the end was exactly what I was thinking while listening to Keith. The whole thing is just sickening to hear spelled out what is being speculated be coaches and experts around the country. As he mentioned, there is has been more infomation at times on the west coast about this situation than is available here in town, that's a bad sign for the kid's college future because people are looking into it already. JMO

Easterwood is the freakin man! This was transcribed by a poster on a Memphis site, and I'll leave the speculation because I would tend to agree with it. The next post I quoted was sort of corroboration that it was, indeed, what was said.

From the way things look, it appears that Arkansas and GT have been trying to buy him through his father and "Team Thad." Naturally, this would put Memphis (his #1 choice throughout the process, according to Mitchell High School's AD, who is Thad's pastor and a frequent poster on message boards to clarify his situation) and Kentucky at a slight disadvantage, given the pressure that's surely being applied to him by those who are "looking out for him," and could also put his college eligibility in jeopardy.

All along, we've heard how what Thad truly wants is the college experience, at least for a year or two. He was recruited by Princeton for his academics, and he was apparently really taking things like Memphis' business school strongly into account. And now, it appears that none of what he wants really matters.

Ultra Peanut
10-21-2005, 01:39 AM
From an Arkansas forum:

user profile
Hog Heaven
Post #866 Well, to be completely honest... Reply

In the past I've heard some pretty eye-opening stories from an extremely credible person about how we got some former Memphis basketball players. I'm not gonna go in details, but sometimes you gotta understand that when there's smoke, you can bet there is usually gonna be fire.

At the same time, none of us should be so naive in our thinking to believe that Nolan always played a clean hand. Hell, not many top-notch coaches do. All that Albert Means mess should remind us that.

Anyway, having said all that, I don't care what it takes to get Thad to come here. As long as we don't get caught, it's all good in my book. Cause you can bet your momma's house that someone, somewhere at another school, has made a few promises to Thad or even his father that they shouldn't have.

That might sound bad, but it's how the recruiting game is played. It aint illegal if you don't get caught.HawgAdvocate, giving college sports fans everywhere a good name. ROFL

user profile
Little Rock
Post #208 Re: so is there really a press conf scheduled for monday? Edit | Reply

What worries me is that it's not fans on a message board reporting this. This was a respected AAU coach being interviewed on the radio. It would be like Randy Rainwater getting a scoop from Ron Crawford on Drive Time. You just don't say things like this without there being something of substance there.

Ultra Peanut
10-24-2005, 11:35 AM
In the end, Thad selects... Georgia Tech.

Supposedly, he seemed very happy with his announcement, so it seems he got through it all okay. I hope he has a great year there, and I wish him nothing but the best.

I'm glad it's over. The Tigers' 2006 recruiting class is still going to be mind-blowing, and most likely even better than 2005.