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View Full Version : Don't blame Elvis for the TD INT !!!


Luzap
09-24-2000, 10:45 PM
I posted this on another thread, but I thought it was important enough to have it's own topic since the Grbashers will be grasping at what few straws they can find to ridicule his performance:

"I need to point something out, even though there will be those that argue before they go check...

The INT Elvis threw that was returned for a TD was not his fault.

He was scrambling to the right, and threw a rope to Alexander on a crossing pattern. After Elvis lets go, Derrick pulls up on his pattern. If he doesn't, it's a perfect pass and worst case for us is pass interferrence against Denver.

You can clearly see this only from the endzone replay angle. I don't know what was going through DA's head, but that, along with the drop on the first play of the game and one other had me calling for his head until he redeemed himself with the winning TD reception.

Luz
incedently, it was also alexander on the other interception... "<P>

morphius
09-24-2000, 10:48 PM
They said the same thing on Metro Sports in KC on TV tonight.

They also showed on the second int that Grbac was not able to step up into the pass because Cloud totally blew his block.

Luzap
09-24-2000, 10:51 PM
Give Moreau the ball.

Frank (in what few plays I saw him) pass blocked well, and for the second week, had an awesome blitz pick up that just leveled the blitzer.

Luz
give moreau the ball...

Luzap
09-24-2000, 10:57 PM
I think Elvis had another great game.

I know there is a lot of history behind this subject (and he, like all QBs, will have at least one poor performance this season), but what does this guy have to do before he is a star in KC?

Everybody is so against him that he'd have to lead us in a come from behind last minute victory over the Broncos in their own back yard on the power of his arm alone because we don't have a running game before anyone would give him any credit.

Luz
we could be looking at a pro bowl year...

morphius
09-24-2000, 10:59 PM
Luz - He will have to win a playoff game, plain and simple. People's expectations are that high.

AZChief
09-24-2000, 11:01 PM
He's really showed the ability to shake off a bad pass and put it behind him. Today, he really showed that he can have poise and make the plays. All his picks seem to go the other way for TDs. I think I've seen that enough for the year. I'm behind him and I think the city will be too if he can get us to the playoffs.


AZ

Luzap
09-24-2000, 11:01 PM
morphius,

This is the first time since Montana that I've felt like we've got a QB that can do that.

Luz
it's going to be great to watch the rest of the season unfold...

DaWolf
09-24-2000, 11:31 PM
Maybe as Whitlock said (and I can't believe I'm quoting Whitlock here) it's time to give the ball back to Kimble?

DaWolf
09-24-2000, 11:35 PM
BTW Luz, according to the story in the KC Star, Elvis' game winning TD pass was a play he wanted to run (which also should silence some of the critics who say he should be making more on the field decisions):

"Grbac used a timeout with 2:27 left. He wanted to throw the post to Alexander but had to make sure he had the right people in their places. With Morris double-covered, Alexander easily beat Ray Crockett for his third touchdown of the season."


Yeah folks, this isn't preseason. He's not going to spike the ball like everyone kept ripping him for...

Luzap
09-25-2000, 06:23 AM
DaWolf,

Even better, my understanding is that Elvis calls ALL the plays in the two minute offense!

How did we go from our ultra conservative, Gun controlled, no imagination, 3 and out, run up the middle offence... all the way to Elvis having total controll during crucial parts of the game?

I don't think Elvis asked for this controll, I think he took it. I've heard rumors that he started changing A LOT of plays in the huddle for San Diego and I think this is a big part of why the offense respects him.

Luz
long live elvis (and give moreau the ball)...

Cormac
09-25-2000, 06:51 AM
That TD pass to Gonzales was a sight to behold.

Red Till Dead
09-25-2000, 07:00 AM
Luz,

You are absolutely correct. It looks like Alexander lost sight of Grbac for a second when he rolled out, slowed up on his pattern just as Grbac released a bullet, then he tries to restart for the ball, but was to late. The INT for a touchdown was not Grbacs fault.

Thank goodness Alexander had the opportunity to make up for it with a great catch in the endzone.

The other INT was certainly in Grbacs hands, threw into double coverage. Even so a GREAT game by Grbac.

ChiTown
09-25-2000, 07:01 AM
To start with, I thought Elvis rebounded nicely after the first half miscues, and played a terrific 2nd half. His focus and leadership really showed up.

Luz/All -

I have to disagree on the INT for the TD. I clearly lay that one on EG. I do what I usually do when I watch the Chiefs: Turn off the TV sound and turn up the radio. Lenny jumped all over EG on that pass play. He talked about the same things that I had been seeing from EG: Telegraphing the ****ing pass.

If you go back and watch the tape, like I have, you'll see what I mean. He locks in on the receiver, never takes his eyes off him, and floats the ball right to the defender. I don't care if Alexander stopped or not, that ball would have been picked off either way by Crockett.

If he honestly wants to earn the respect of all Chiefs fans, he has got to stop with the telegraphing. That cost us a chance of winning the Colts game, and we are fortunate it did not cost us in Denver.

[This message has been edited by ChiTown (edited 09-25-2000).]

Clint in Wichita
09-25-2000, 07:21 AM
Personally, I blame the weather.

Red Till Dead
09-25-2000, 07:28 AM
CHitown,

Have to disagree, no matter what Lenny said. Watch the tape. Have several times, and Alexander clearly stopped (hesitated) right before Grbac released the ball. If he would have continued his crossing route would have been a PERFECT pass, telegraphed or not. Defender would have interfered or would have been a completion to Alexander.

Clint in Wichita
09-25-2000, 07:30 AM
What about the other point-costing INT?

58Forever
09-25-2000, 07:40 AM
I never thought I'd live to see the day when people defended EG....

It does my heart good... http://www.ChiefsPlanet.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

The most impressive thing about Elvis the last two games is that he's not let the bad plays bother him...in the Indy game it seems the TD that DA dropped rattled EG and he couldn't hit a wide open Lockett on the next two plays...not last week or yesterday...

A very impressive comeback win...a team effort...the Defense stopped the Broncs and the offense did their job and scored the points...everyone should respect everyone now...

Did you see the look on Crockett's face after DA caught the TD?...I loved it....to the Broncos and their Mile High Salute I give you.... http://www.ChiefsPlanet.com/ubb/tongue.gif

------------------
joe

"The word "genius" isn't applicable in football. A genius is a guy like Norman Einstein."
-Joe Theisman, NFL football quarterback and sports analyst

Luzap
09-25-2000, 07:42 AM
ChiTown,

When you're on the run and everybody is in motion, I really don't think the 'he locked onto a receiver' line works anymore.

If Alexander doesn't let up, Crockett would have had to go over his back to get the INT.

IMO, Elvis placed a PERFECT pass, while scrambling.

You can still make a good argument that he shouldn't have thrown it just based on general principals, but the real problem is that his receivers are not used to having a QB make great plays like that and they don't respond the way Favres receivers used to when he pulled out a scrambling completion.

Luz
elvis is very good...

kcred
09-25-2000, 07:45 AM
Luz is right, last night I posted that I though DA quit on the ball, don't know about pass interference, but he should have been close enough to break up the INT, if nothing else. EG has shown me enough, to at least think we can come from behind if needed. I haven't had that feeling since Joe left. And not necessarily because of EG, just the pathetic play calling. A QB has to be able to call his own game, look at Manning in KC, he must have called 80% of the plays. I am still not sold on the coaching staff, but will relish in the victory.

KCTitus
09-25-2000, 07:45 AM
In all fairness, he did force the pass. He was running backwards and was flushed from the pocket. A pass out of bounds would have received criticism from his critics as well, but would have sustained our drive.

I'd say he more than redeemed himself in the 4th quarter with that beautiful seam pass.

Enough about EG, what in the hell are we going to do about our running game?

morphius
09-25-2000, 07:52 AM
Titus - What running game?

KCTitus
09-25-2000, 07:56 AM
Morph: Touchee...actually come to think of it, Donnell Bennett was out, and Im thinking that's the reason for the poor showing http://www.ChiefsPlanet.com/ubb/wink.gif

morphius
09-25-2000, 07:58 AM
Titus - Yeah, I really missed the pitch play for a 2 yard loss, I think that is what they were missing to get motivated.

ChiTown
09-25-2000, 08:00 AM
Luz - If you have the tape, go back and watch it. He is locked in. He was rolling to his right looking at Alexander the whole time (I'm assuming he can do 2 things at once).

This is actually pretty funny. EG has throw 4 int's. 3 have been returned for TD's, and most of you have tried to blame everyone but EG for his INT's. I have given him his credit for sticking in there and playing some of the best ball of his career, but I think the guy has to overcome this hurdle (telegraphing)if he wants his just due.

He has a tendency to throw most of his errant balls on the flat. Those, without a doubt, are the most dangerous passing mistakes one can make. Defenders get such a huge jump, that they can be run back for a TD or huge return yards. I see it for what it is, and not for what I want it to be. I can't say the same for some of you. I want EG and the Chiefs to succeed as much as anyone, I just won't be an EG apologist every time he makes a costly mistake.

kcred
09-25-2000, 08:03 AM
You think Gunther might be getting the idea, you can't have a running game without a runner. Right now, I am for giving the ball to Kimble, at least let's see if he can't handle it. We can't do any worse, than exhibited yesterday. Did anyone watch Garner of the 49ers yesterday? He looked like he was going 60mph, when he hit the line.

Red Till Dead
09-25-2000, 08:06 AM
Clint #15,

The other point costing INT was clearly a bad decision by Grbac. Alexander was covered short and long, and he tried to force it in.

How about those two touchdown drives. Without a running game, in a hostile enviornment. How about the go ahead throw when the game was on the line!

How about that when teams start setting schemes to stop our passing game, the running game should start to open back up.

How about are special teams still needing brain surgery. Did Dante Hall look like he was holding on to the ball like his future career depended on it. Looks like he could hardly run, because carrying ball like it was his first new born child.

Red Till Dead
09-25-2000, 08:10 AM
Chitown #23,

How many QBs don't look at one receiver when running right and backwards, with a defender right in his face. Elvis made a perfect pass in this situation. He only had two options throw to the closest receiver to him,
(Alexander) or throw it away. If Alexander would have continued his route, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Not a Grbac appologist, just a realist.

ChiTown
09-25-2000, 08:11 AM
RTD -

Great points on special teams. I wanted to jump through my TV and strangle Dante Hall everytime he touched the ball. He looked like he had no clue as to what he was supposed to do (No surprise when you think of who the ST's coach is). Returned 2 balls 4 yds deep in the endzone (both had holding penalties). He never hit a hole or seam convincingly and danced when the opposition got close. This guy showed me zip on Sunday. Where's Dar Dar when you need him.

ChiTown
09-25-2000, 08:14 AM
RTD - we'll just leave the INT-TD as a difference in interpretation on the play. I'm convinced he was at fault and your convinced the other way. Either way, those pass routes on the flat have to be corrected btw receiver and QB.<P>

58Forever
09-25-2000, 08:34 AM
This little blurb from NFL.com says it all...

Kansas City has won three in a row over the Broncos, the second time the Chiefs have done it in the Shanahan era. No other team in the league has done it even once

------------------
joe

"The word "genius" isn't applicable in football. A genius is a guy like Norman Einstein."
-Joe Theisman, NFL football quarterback and sports analyst