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View Full Version : Ronnie Brown vs. Chiefs


Nasty
10-22-2005, 11:00 AM
What do you guys think about Ronnie Brown? Do you like his style? Were you impressed with him or no? Do you think he will be a great and successful back in the future or just be average? If you have negative thoughts, thats ok too. I just want your guys opinion...

I ask this question to every team's board after we play them. I am a big fan of Ronnie and have loved this kid for a while way before the combine. So what did you guys think?

Nasty

Ultra Peanut
10-22-2005, 11:02 AM
WASTED PICK!!!!!!!


Not that I saw the game, or anything...

morphius
10-22-2005, 11:04 AM
I thought he looked okay, other then the long TD I don't remember being overly impressed. But other then two long runs this year our run D has slowed everyone up a bit. Plus Wesley is great at missing tackles, both the long TD's last night were because he can't seem to finish his tackles.

It normally take a RB a while to prove that he is going to be a long term stud. But he did mae some good runs on tough yards.

Woodrow Call
10-22-2005, 11:08 AM
I think he is a solid back. He is big and fast and I thought he was better than Cadillac at Auburn.

Nasty
10-22-2005, 11:15 AM
I thought he looked okay, other then the long TD I don't remember being overly impressed. But other then two long runs this year our run D has slowed everyone up a bit. Plus Wesley is great at missing tackles, both the long TD's last night were because he can't seem to finish his tackles.

It normally take a RB a while to prove that he is going to be a long term stud. But he did mae some good runs on tough yards.

Well, it sucked he only had 8 FREAKIN CARRIES!! I dont understand why we dont give him the rock more. 95 yards on only 8 carries is pretty freakin sweet. :)

Nasty

Cave Johnson
10-22-2005, 11:21 AM
I'm watching the game right now on nfl.com (listened to it last night). He looks strong and decisive in his cuts. And he was running at about a 5 YPC clip if you take out the long TD. Much better than Sticky Ricky, IMO. It looked like he was unsure about his cuts and danced too much in the backfield.

morphius
10-22-2005, 11:22 AM
Well, it sucked he only had 8 FREAKIN CARRIES!! I dont understand why we dont give him the rock more. 95 yards on only 8 carries is pretty freakin sweet. :)

Nasty
Well, you can't give the ball to the RB more when you can't get first down's. Still the 4 yards an average on the other 7 carries is decent.

Fairplay
10-22-2005, 11:25 AM
Excellent draft pick no question about that.

Nasty
10-22-2005, 11:28 AM
Excellent draft pick no question about that.

Do you think he was worth the #2 overall? or do you think there was a better player we should have picked?

Coach
10-22-2005, 11:35 AM
Do you think he was worth the #2 overall? or do you think there was a better player we should have picked?

No. Brown was the best position for Miami, since Miami didn't have any solid RB's to begin with, while Ricky was out, smoking some weed.

I honestly don't think Alex Smith is really worthy of a top pick IMHO. Was thinking C. Williams or Brown could had a better choice there.

At least you didn't draft C. Benson. The Bears can't even get the guy signed on time, and Benson is just messed up in the head.

redbrian
10-22-2005, 11:40 AM
Far better than the pothead, thats for sure.
Will be a solid rb with a little more work.

Fairplay
10-22-2005, 11:44 AM
Do you think he was worth the #2 overall? or do you think there was a better player we should have picked?



In Miami's position it was the best pick for them.

Now dump Ricky.

B_Ambuehl
10-22-2005, 11:46 AM
Ronnie Brown is a good tailback. He was the best available in the draft. People expect too much from running backs when 80% of their success is dependent on their offense lines which the Dolphins do not have. Nothing pisses me off more then hearing crap like "what's wrong with _____....why isn't he running ?" Nevermind the defense is 5 yards in the backfield every play. I can understand that when you're talking about a guy like Ron Dayne who obviously doesn't have what it takes...but we do know Ricky Williams has what it takes he's led the NFL in rushing....he's not running any better then Ronnie right now so that oughta tell you something......Cadillac is not any better then Ronnie Brown despite his better stats.

Do you think he was worth the #2 overall? or do you think there was a better player we should have picked?

No. He was the best RB available but IMO no tailback is worth a #2 pick simply because, due to the short shelf life and injury rate at the tailback position, the position itself isn't worth the money of a #2 pick. Better to go the Shanahan route and build an offensive "system" then just plug and play with minimum wage runners. You could also have easily picked up an Edgerrin James and several others for less then half that price tag. Spend your money on positions that call for it.

tiptap
10-22-2005, 12:24 PM
The money spent on unproven rookies is out of line with their worth in the first round. This will probable be addressed in the next collective bargaining. But 'stuck' with the 2nd pick and an inflated value Ronnie Brown was a solid pick. I didn't get to see if he had recieving skills. That would help in evaluating his talent.

HolmeZz
10-22-2005, 12:27 PM
Ronnie was the clear-cut #2 pick IMO. He'll be a very good, if not great, one.

RedThat
10-22-2005, 12:29 PM
Definately an upgrade over Ricky Williams. At the very least we can say that?

HolmeZz
10-22-2005, 12:36 PM
Definately an upgrade over Ricky Williams. At the very least we can say that?

Ricky's gained 4 yards on 14 carries so far. I'd be an upgrade.

Nasty
10-22-2005, 01:06 PM
Ronnie Brown is a good tailback. He was the best available in the draft. People expect too much from running backs when 80% of their success is dependent on their offense lines which the Dolphins do not have. Nothing pisses me off more then hearing crap like "what's wrong with _____....why isn't he running ?" Nevermind the defense is 5 yards in the backfield every play. I can understand that when you're talking about a guy like Ron Dayne who obviously doesn't have what it takes...but we do know Ricky Williams has what it takes he's led the NFL in rushing....he's not running any better then Ronnie right now so that oughta tell you something......Cadillac is not any better then Ronnie Brown despite his better stats.



No. He was the best RB available but IMO no tailback is worth a #2 pick simply because, due to the short shelf life and injury rate at the tailback position, the position itself isn't worth the money of a #2 pick. Better to go the Shanahan route and build an offensive "system" then just plug and play with minimum wage runners. You could also have easily picked up an Edgerrin James and several others for less then half that price tag. Spend your money on positions that call for it.

So who do you think we should have taken then if you dont think Ronnie was worth the #2?

Nasty

DaKCMan AP
10-22-2005, 01:08 PM
I thought Ronnie Brown was the best RB coming out of college this year. I still think he's the best rookie RB, although Cadillac has been impressive as well. Ronnie runs hard, is a big guy, has speed, and has good hands. You guys should utilize him more on some screens cause he was very successful at that at Auburn.

However, as it has for the last many years, your offensive line is pretty bad. The quickest way to improve Ronnie is to improve the O-line.

Nasty
10-22-2005, 01:21 PM
I thought Ronnie Brown was the best RB coming out of college this year. I still think he's the best rookie RB, although Cadillac has been impressive as well. Ronnie runs hard, is a big guy, has speed, and has good hands. You guys should utilize him more on some screens cause he was very successful at that at Auburn.

However, as it has for the last many years, your offensive line is pretty bad. The quickest way to improve Ronnie is to improve the O-line.

So you think he is better than Caddy? Not many people seem to think so (I do) Caddy just seems to get more attention. (Maybe because of his nickname?)

I wish we used Ronnie more in our passing game this week so you guys could see that aspect of his game. He has been our leading receiver a couple of weeks. Also, he has had 2 one-handed catches this seasons so far...

Nasty

DaKCMan AP
10-22-2005, 01:35 PM
So you think he is better than Caddy? Not many people seem to think so (I do) Caddy just seems to get more attention. (Maybe because of his nickname?)

I wish we used Ronnie more in our passing game this week so you guys could see that aspect of his game. He has been our leading receiver a couple of weeks. Also, he has had 2 one-handed catches this seasons so far...

Nasty

Cadillac is faster and is a slasher-style back. He's good, but he's not the type of back that can take a pounding week after week after week and hold up (see his injury troubles the last couple of weeks). I watched both at Auburn, and I always said Ronnie Brown would be a better pro. He's bigger so he can take the pounding. He's not as fast, but he has some wheels, but he is a much better receiver than Cadillac. Ronnie would often be split wide at Auburn and make great catches down the field. As I mentioned before, he would do excellent with a properly executed screen pass that has blockers out in front and him running down hill.

patteeu
10-22-2005, 01:40 PM
No. He was the best RB available but IMO no tailback is worth a #2 pick simply because, due to the short shelf life and injury rate at the tailback position, the position itself isn't worth the money of a #2 pick. Better to go the Shanahan route and build an offensive "system" then just plug and play with minimum wage runners. You could also have easily picked up an Edgerrin James and several others for less then half that price tag. Spend your money on positions that call for it.


I agree completely. 2005 was a bad year to get the #2 pick overall IMO.

HolmeZz
10-22-2005, 01:45 PM
Ronnie is a better back than Carnell.

Sure-Oz
10-22-2005, 01:47 PM
he did way more than pothead williams

Nasty
10-22-2005, 01:58 PM
I agree completely. 2005 was a bad year to get the #2 pick overall IMO.

I agree that this draft was weak at the top. But considering the players that were available in this draft, do you think that Ronnie was the best pick at #2 or no?

Nasty

B_Ambuehl
10-22-2005, 02:05 PM
So who do you think we should have taken then if you dont think Ronnie was worth the #2?

In this day and age I probably wouldn't use that pick at all. For that #2 pick you could've traded down for a late round first rounder and a 2nd/3rd rounder and picked up a couple of good offensive lineman that would most likely still be starting on your football team 10 years from now something that any back is most likely not gonna do.

Or hell you could've traded for a couple and used one on your O-lineman and traded another for Edgerrin James and saved 10 million in bonus money over the same period of time. Or you could've picked up a Travis Henry. There isn't a shortage of running backs in this league.

At the very worst you'd have Ricky Williams running behind an improved offensive line. As it is you have 2 pro bowl caliber tailbacks with nowhere to run.

It seems to be a common theme in the NFL. Millions of dollars spent at QB, WR and RB but nothing up front.

JBucc
10-22-2005, 02:07 PM
I'm just glad him and Cadillac are out of the SEC

RINGLEADER
10-22-2005, 02:26 PM
Well, it sucked he only had 8 FREAKIN CARRIES!! I dont understand why we dont give him the rock more. 95 yards on only 8 carries is pretty freakin sweet. :)

Nasty

Yep. But 60 yards of that was due more to terrible tackling then anything Ronnie Brown did. He was actually contained but give the kid credit - he didn't give up.

Still, you take away that one run and you've got a back that still averaged 5.0 yards per carry. Unless you throw Ricky's carries in there in which case your backfield averaged a less-than-stellar 2.6 ypc.

Nasty
10-22-2005, 02:34 PM
Yep. But 60 yards of that was due more to terrible tackling then anything Ronnie Brown did. He was actually contained but give the kid credit - he didn't give up.

Still, you take away that one run and you've got a back that still averaged 5.0 yards per carry. Unless you throw Ricky's carries in there in which case your backfield averaged a less-than-stellar 2.6 ypc.

While I can see how you would blame poor tackling on the 65-yard run, You have to give Ronnie some credit on that run too. He put a serious hit "Truck Stick" style on that DB and then had a nice stiff arm on the last guy back there. It wasnt like he just ran straight ahead and there was just some huge hole for him the whole way, he had to create it.

Nasty

Nasty
10-22-2005, 02:42 PM
In this day and age I probably wouldn't use that pick at all. For that #2 pick you could've traded down for a late round first rounder and a 2nd/3rd rounder and picked up a couple of good offensive lineman that would most likely still be starting on your football team 10 years from now something that any back is most likely not gonna do.

Or hell you could've traded for a couple and used one on your O-lineman and traded another for Edgerrin James and saved 10 million in bonus money over the same period of time. Or you could've picked up a Travis Henry. There isn't a shortage of running backs in this league.

At the very worst you'd have Ricky Williams running behind an improved offensive line. As it is you have 2 pro bowl caliber tailbacks with nowhere to run.

It seems to be a common theme in the NFL. Millions of dollars spent at QB, WR and RB but nothing up front.

Dont get me wrong... I would have LOVED to have traded down. Especially since seeing what Saban can do with draft picks. However, since the draft was weak at the top, no one was willing to give much to trade up and I would have been very angry if we passed up on a back like Ronnie if we didnt get some fair value for the #2 pick in return...

Travis Henry is not that great. Plus, he has durability issues and off the field issues (drug suspentions). The other backs like Shawn Alexander and Edge (while great backs) are nearing the downside of their carreer. I would have loved to have grabbed a Robert Gallery type of lineman at #2, but there wasnt one in this draft. I agree that it all starts on the lines, both offensively and defensively. Thats what makes offenses great (ala - the Chiefs).

Priest is made by that line of yours. Dont misunderstand me, Priest is a great back, but that line puts him on a whole-nother level. What I would do for Roaf...

Nasty

Phobia
10-22-2005, 02:46 PM
Dude - you've been a cool addition to the board. Please feel free to stick around.

And now I'll answer your questions.

Brown looks good. Please come back in 5 years so that I may comment on his value as the 2nd pick in this year's draft.

Nasty
10-22-2005, 03:19 PM
Dude - you've been a cool addition to the board. Please feel free to stick around.

And now I'll answer your questions.

Brown looks good. Please come back in 5 years so that I may comment on his value as the 2nd pick in this year's draft.

haha thanks bro... I will prob be droppin by a few times this season... especially when you guys play the other AFC East teams (damn bills, jets and pats!!)

Now, when asking if he was worth the #2 pick, I was more asking if you thought we should have taken someone else like Braylon, Benson, Caddy... etc...

Nasty

RINGLEADER
10-22-2005, 04:01 PM
While I can see how you would blame poor tackling on the 65-yard run, You have to give Ronnie some credit on that run too. He put a serious hit "Truck Stick" style on that DB and then had a nice stiff arm on the last guy back there. It wasnt like he just ran straight ahead and there was just some huge hole for him the whole way, he had to create it.

Nasty


Yep. I think I said that the guy deserved credit for not giving up on the run. I did screw up though: that run was 65 yards, so he was averaging a little more than four yards per carry outside of that run.

But I still couldn't understand why Saban didn't run him more. Especially after he had that one 9-yard run and you had a second-and-one. Going long on third down wasn't necessarily a bad thing to do if you were planning to go for it on fourth and short, but then you punt. What was up with that?

DaWolf
10-22-2005, 04:02 PM
Only time will tell if he was worth the pick. To me, in order to be worth that pick as a RB, you have to be an awfully special tailback, like LaDanian Tomlinson or Marshall Faulk. If Brown doesn't reach that level, then I dunno. I think it is key to get your offensive line in place first, and IMO a pick that high should be used on a QB, a left tackle, or a defensive gamechanger. Running back, unless they're real special, can be found lower in the draft or elsewhere if you have good scouts.

Of course if you have bad scouts, you could wind up with a decade worth of Harvey Williams, Donnell Bennetts, and Mike Couds...

Nasty
10-22-2005, 04:39 PM
Yep. I think I said that the guy deserved credit for not giving up on the run. I did screw up though: that run was 65 yards, so he was averaging a little more than four yards per carry outside of that run.

But I still couldn't understand why Saban didn't run him more. Especially after he had that one 9-yard run and you had a second-and-one. Going long on third down wasn't necessarily a bad thing to do if you were planning to go for it on fourth and short, but then you punt. What was up with that?

I have no idea why the hell we dont run with this kid more... in the past 4 games, he has rushed for 346 yards on only 57 carries. Thats averaging 6+ a carry. He has also had3 TDs in those 4 games...

Phobia
10-22-2005, 04:45 PM
now, when asking if he was worth the #2 pick, I was more asking if you thought we should have taken someone else like Braylon, Benson, Caddy... etc...


I think there are very few players worthy of the #1 and #2 selections in the draft. Those guys seldom live up to the hype and expectations. It's an intense amount of pressure. I'll go with the trade down option until I have more data.

Nasty
10-22-2005, 05:17 PM
I think there are very few players worthy of the #1 and #2 selections in the draft. Those guys seldom live up to the hype and expectations. It's an intense amount of pressure. I'll go with the trade down option until I have more data.

I woulda loved to have traded down, but we couldnt. No one wanted to trade up...

unlurking
10-22-2005, 05:47 PM
As has already been stated, this was a very weak draft, in terms of top-tier players. I don't think Brown would have been worth a top five or ten in most drafts, but I do think he was the best bet at #2. I do think he will be a great RB for you, but again, as others (and you yourself) have stated, it all starts with the O-Line.

Honestly, I think he is will be pretty comparable to our own Larry Johnson in terms of talent. In other words, a late first round draft pick. Too me, that means an average to better than average starting player in the NFL.

If he is going to be a top-tier starter, which, like LJ he he has the ability to be, it will ONLY be because of the line in front of him. I love both Priest and Larry, but there "star power" starts with the line in front of them, just like Ronnie's will. Saban HAS to address this issue in the next off-season to validate the money being paid to the #2 overall. (I'm not slamming Nick, DV left Larry inactive or on the bench the first 2+ years of his career.)

Since I am not privy to the underworkings of the NFL draft rooms, I can't say whether there might have been a "worthy" offer for that #2 pick from another team, but there is one way factor I don't think you are appreciating. Even if the fins didn't get the correct "worthy" trade value (sometimes you really need to see the value of the stock property, not just the paper it is written on and sell), they would have saved themselves quite a bit in cap space and probably gotten two serviceable players instead of one.

Barry Sanders was awesome, but can you imagine what he would have been like behind an O-Line like the Chiefs have had the past few years, or with a simply average cast of players and coaches around him? As it was, he (IMO) was wasted in Detroit. Brown is not Sanders, but he is paid like that and in a similar situation with a poor supporting cast.

So, from my slightly inebriated ramblings (just got off an 18 hour a day working road trip), no, he was not worth the #2 pick. Then again, nobody in that draft was worth the first 3 to 5. He will be good, but I still think the best move would have been to trade down, even if it meant getting less than would have been normally considered acceptable.

After all, the top 5 were considered worse than normally acceptable. It's not like you would have been trading the right to draft a John Elway or Dan Marino.


*This post brought to you by the number one tasting rum in the world, otherwise known as 151. Sorry for the rambling incoherency.*

Fishpicker
10-22-2005, 05:54 PM
brown is better than williams at this point. He'll be much better after he develops a bit.

Nasty
10-22-2005, 06:11 PM
brown is better than williams at this point. He'll be much better after he develops a bit.

I do too... Do you think he has a shot at Rookie of the Year?

B_Ambuehl
10-22-2005, 07:41 PM
Nasty do you have any idea what kind've deals the Dolphins were being offered to trade down out of that pick??

Nasty
10-22-2005, 07:46 PM
Nasty do you have any idea what kind've deals the Dolphins were being offered to trade down out of that pick??

I dont think that they were ever fully disclosed to the public, but I know that they were definatly not worth the pick because no one was seriously interested in trading up...

Nasty

Logical
10-22-2005, 09:03 PM
I have him as a backup on my FF team and I was thinking about starting him because he was facing the Chiefs. Boy do I regret not doing so. Now I got hope Ahmen Green is really recovered from his injury.:banghead:

Nasty
10-22-2005, 09:14 PM
I have him as a backup on my FF team and I was thinking about starting him because he was facing the Chiefs. Boy do I regret not doing so. Now I got hope Ahmen Green is really recovered from his injury.:banghead:

hahaha... that sucks...

redhed
10-22-2005, 09:30 PM
You're asking us (Chiefs fans) to evaluate a player when he's played 5 games in the league. That's just not a good enough sample. It's too early to tell if he was worth the pick. As has been stated, very few backs are worth that kind of pick, but he sure looked good on that one run against the Chiefs (missed tackle or not, that was a major league collision).

kregger
10-22-2005, 09:42 PM
Of course if you have bad scouts, you could wind up with a decade worth of Harvey Williams, Donnell Bennetts, and Mike Couds...

Don't forget Paul Palmer, Ethan Horton, and the "real deal" Greg Hill. :deevee:

Mark M
10-22-2005, 10:10 PM
I do too... Do you think he has a shot at Rookie of the Year?

Nope. A certain rookie RB in Tampa has the best shot of that so far.

But there is a lot of season left, so if Saban realizes that Ricky is pretty much done and starts Brown more often, he'd at least have a shot.

MM
~~:)

Nasty
10-23-2005, 04:51 PM
Nope. A certain rookie RB in Tampa has the best shot of that so far.

But there is a lot of season left, so if Saban realizes that Ricky is pretty much done and starts Brown more often, he'd at least have a shot.

MM
~~:)

Thats what I think... He has a shot at getting it, but right now Caddy is winning. If Caddy cant get back on the field, Ronnie should move ahead of him...

Nasty

Cochise
10-23-2005, 04:54 PM
Brown, the few times I saw him when he was still in college, reminded me of Holmes.

Pitt Gorilla
10-23-2005, 05:44 PM
I don't think he's worth the #2 pick. I might have considered a move down to 5-10 for minimal in return, just to save against the cap.