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View Full Version : Will Gunther give the Bolts a different defensive look?


siberian khatru
10-24-2005, 11:13 AM
With DV saying that Warfield will start, will Gun finally play a lot more man press at the corners and blitz Bell and/or DJ more?

It seems that this would be a good time to put a few wrinkles in: extra day of practice (thanks, Tags!), Warfield back, huge game on the road vs. division rival to spring a surprise on.

Thoughts?

Bowser
10-24-2005, 11:17 AM
It would be a good idea. I think Kendrell Bell and DJ need to used in rushing the passer much more often.

Against Miami, we seemed to be a much more aggressive defense. Hopefully, that's a sign of what's to come with our D.

jspchief
10-24-2005, 11:17 AM
We played a lot of press against Miami. probably at least 75% of the time we had at least Warfield pressing.

As for blitzing, that's a scary thing to do vs a team with a great pass catching TE and RB. If we don't get there, LT2 and Gates could shred us.

I thought the D-line got good push against Miami, but the Dolphins O-line is pretty bad.

This defense seems to be trying to find an identity. We're running 4-3, 3-4 and even 4-4-3 right now.

htismaqe
10-24-2005, 11:29 AM
I'd like to see us mix it up and blitz LESS...

Bowser
10-24-2005, 11:30 AM
I'd like to see us mix it up and blitz LESS...

I have no problem with that, as long as our front four keep getting the pressure they have......

Kclee
10-24-2005, 11:35 AM
I didn't see the Philly/SD game. What did Philly do? Alot of run blitz or what. Because they shut LT down and Gates didn't do much 'til the end.

chiefqueen
10-24-2005, 11:38 AM
When you have a passer with Ferrotte's accuracy (or, should I say, lack of accuracy) one can afford to take chances on D.

Chieftain58
10-24-2005, 11:40 AM
I would like to see Johnson and Holmes in the backfield at the same time!

Fire Me Boy!
10-24-2005, 11:44 AM
The Chiefs blitzed Miami more because Frerotte isn't good, their receivers are about like ours, and the oline isn't great. We could afford to.

That said, I think we will seem DJ and Bell blitzing more with Surtain and Warfield manned up.

ExtremeChief
10-24-2005, 12:19 PM
I didn't see the Philly/SD game. What did Philly do? Alot of run blitz or what. Because they shut LT down and Gates didn't do much 'til the end.

Philly blitzed alot.. I couldn't tell you if they were run blitzes or not, but it seemed like they were sending someone on every play.

Reaper16
10-24-2005, 12:21 PM
Philly blitzed, alot. It worked, alot.

Calcountry
10-24-2005, 12:41 PM
Philly blitzed, alot. It worked, alot.a lot is two words, not one as in "alot".

sedated
10-24-2005, 12:47 PM
DJ can take Gates 1 on 1.
With our secondary now intact we can take away their receivers.
Bell is a useless fat-@ss unless he blitzes (and even then he's still a fat-@ss).
We will blitz and we will win. 34-17

KChiefsQT
10-24-2005, 12:52 PM
hopeful. Blitz more and blitz often. I wanna knock bree's socks off next week. And as for a LT, keeping him under 50 yards rushing would be ideal.

Hoover
10-24-2005, 01:03 PM
I would like to see us come out in the 3-4

PastorMikH
10-24-2005, 01:17 PM
I'd like to see Gunther taking a lot of looks at that Philly/Chargers game tape. They COMPLETELY shut LT down. Seems like a good place to start in preparation.

Straight, No Chaser
10-24-2005, 01:20 PM
Philly blitzed alot.. I couldn't tell you if they were run blitzes or not, but it seemed like they were sending someone on every play.

Are you sure about that?
From what I saw, Philly just fought through blocks and stayed home... nowhere or no time for LT to get started. Philly has a awesome run defense... should keep them in games (like next week vs. Donx)


--->

KChiefs1
10-24-2005, 01:54 PM
I'd like to see Gunther taking a lot of looks at that Philly/Chargers game tape. They COMPLETELY shut LT down. Seems like a good place to start in preparation.

I'm hoping he brings the house early in the game just to get Brees thinking back there...

cookster50
10-24-2005, 01:55 PM
It seems that this would be a good time to put a few wrinkles in: extra day of practice (thanks, Tags!)

I thought I read in the paper this morning that the players aren't coming back until Tuesday, which is the normal schedule. Therefore, no extra practice.

Wa-Z
10-24-2005, 02:01 PM
I thought I read in the paper this morning that the players aren't coming back until Tuesday, which is the normal schedule. Therefore, no extra practice.

Yea, but the coaches are at work and the players can rest...2 games in 6 days is tough i bet...especially the redskins game, and since we had to travel to and from Miami in one day.

I think that Philly used their safety's all day long to spy LT

Bob Dole
10-24-2005, 02:03 PM
a lot is two words, not one as in "alot".

Spelling and grammar is over rated.

chiefqueen
10-24-2005, 04:09 PM
Spelling and grammar is over rated.

Bob Dole's grammar teacher is rolling over in her grave.

tk13
10-24-2005, 04:21 PM
Philly blitzed, alot. It worked, alot.
That's how they always play. I only got to see most of the 4th quarter but how they played that quarter is how they play when they're really clicking on D. They were bringing the house. I'm not sure we can do that... well we tried to play like that last year, haven't done it a lot this year. They're a lot more effective with it, obviously...

Chiefs Pantalones
10-24-2005, 05:35 PM
I thought I read in the paper this morning that the players aren't coming back until Tuesday, which is the normal schedule. Therefore, no extra practice.

Listening to the DV Show now...

DV originally planned to have them in on Saturday for film and weights, but told them to stay home so they could rest up. They are treating tomorrow like a Wednesday (game plan), Wednesday like a Thursday, Thursday like a Friday, and Friday they have a walk through. Saturday they have a 20 minute walk through, then they get on the plane to San Diego.

KCWolfman
10-24-2005, 05:38 PM
Spelling and grammar is over rated.
When did you have Grammar? And does Grandper know?

|Zach|
10-24-2005, 05:39 PM
When did you have Grammar? And does Grandper know?
Ha, you have been holding on to that for a while haven't you.

PastorMikH
10-24-2005, 05:41 PM
I'm also hoping Allen will watch some tapes and see some little flinch, twitch, or other indicator of the coming snap like he did with Washington.

Chiefs Pantalones
10-24-2005, 05:41 PM
That's how they always play. I only got to see most of the 4th quarter but how they played that quarter is how they play when they're really clicking on D. They were bringing the house. I'm not sure we can do that... well we tried to play like that last year, haven't done it a lot this year. They're a lot more effective with it, obviously...

Yep. There is nothing wrong with bringing it, it's just that you have to get there and/or account for sending a lot of people by not getting beat (secondary).

KCWolfman
10-24-2005, 05:44 PM
Ha, you have been holding on to that for a while haven't you.
Aged to perfection.

How's school?

tk13
10-24-2005, 05:49 PM
When did you have Grammar? And does Grandper know?
I wish you could punch people through the internet for bad puns.

|Zach|
10-24-2005, 05:59 PM
Aged to perfection.

How's school?
Good in the fact that I am only taking classes of things I am really into...a bit pointless in the fact that I am joining the Air Force.

In the end the government will fit the bill to a photograhpy school I have my heart set on.

I bet you didn't see that coming.

Kclee
10-24-2005, 06:06 PM
In the end the government will fit the bill to a photograhpy school I have my heart set on.




Animal Mother: You a photographer?
Private Joker: I'm a combat correspondent.
Animal Mother: Well you seen much combat?
Private Joker: I've seen a little on TV.
Animal Mother: You're a real comedian.
Private Joker: Well they call me the Joker.
Animal Mother: Well I got a joke for you. I'm gonna tear you a new asshole.
Private Joker: Well pilgrim, only after you eat the peanuts out of my shit.
Animal Mother: You talk the talk. Do you walk the walk?



Let me see your war face Joker.

|Zach|
10-24-2005, 06:08 PM
Animal Mother: You a photographer?
Private Joker: I'm a combat correspondent.
Animal Mother: Well you seen much combat?
Private Joker: I've seen a little on TV.
Animal Mother: You're a real comedian.
Private Joker: Well they call me the Joker.
Animal Mother: Well I got a joke for you. I'm gonna tear you a new asshole.
Private Joker: Well pilgrim, only after you eat the peanuts out of my shit.
Animal Mother: You talk the talk. Do you walk the walk?



Let me see your war face Joker.
ROFL

Mr. Kotter
10-24-2005, 06:10 PM
Good in the fact that I am only taking classes of things I am really into...a bit pointless in the fact that I am joining the Air Force.

In the end the government will fit the bill to a photograhpy school I have my heart set on.

I bet you didn't see that coming.

If you are going that route, finishing college and applying to ROTC shoulda been a thought....not that your recruiter ever woulda mentioned it. :hmmm:

KCWolfman
10-24-2005, 06:12 PM
I wish you could punch people through the internet for bad puns.
Touche'

Count Zarth
10-24-2005, 06:14 PM
Private Joker: Well pilgrim, only after you eat the peanuts out of my shit.

I swear, I did not rip off this quote for my new catchphrase.

Mr. Kotter
10-24-2005, 06:15 PM
ROFL

It's a great movie, if you haven't seen it.

Kclee
10-24-2005, 06:21 PM
ROFL


Bullshit, you didn't convince me, let me see your REAL war face!
:#

|Zach|
10-24-2005, 06:28 PM
Bullshit, you didn't convince me, let me see your REAL war face!
:#
http://www.rantmorgan.com/advice/2004/02/0229/face.jpg

Wallcrawler
10-24-2005, 08:09 PM
The Chiefs defense is going to need those extra days. After most likely the WORST performance in his career against the Eagles (17 rushes for 7 yards, 0TD), Ladainian Tomlinson is going to be wanting to get back on track in front of his home crowd there in SD, against a Chiefs defense that is still succeptible to a big play or two.


They have to get on him, and STAY on him. The Chiefs have been burnt this year with passes to the backs out of the backfield, as well as counter/cutback runs and LT is one of the very best in the league at doing all of those things very well.

Jared Allen, as much as I like the guy's pass rushing tenacity, has GOT to stay disciplined on the edge. The big run that Ronnie Brown busted off went right to his side, with him getting sucked in and then getting caught totally out of position to make the play. Granted, Greg Wesley put a massive shot on him that didnt take him down, but Jared Allen could have been in position to make a play had he stayed disciplined.

The Chiefs cannot afford to give up the big play touchdowns against division rivals, with as close as those games generally are. They did a good job against Miami for much of the game, but they still surrendered 142 yards and 14 points on just 2 plays. Cant have that stuff happen in the division games. Theyre usually just too close to survive that type of stuff.

brent102fire
10-24-2005, 10:34 PM
I didn't see the Philly/SD game. What did Philly do? Alot of run blitz or what. Because they shut LT down and Gates didn't do much 'til the end.

I think injuries to the O-line played a significant part...

ChiefFan31
10-25-2005, 12:30 AM
Jared Allen, as much as I like the guy's pass rushing tenacity, has GOT to stay disciplined on the edge. The big run that Ronnie Brown busted off went right to his side, with him getting sucked in and then getting caught totally out of position to make the play. Granted, Greg Wesley put a massive shot on him that didnt take him down, but Jared Allen could have been in position to make a play had he stayed disciplined.

The Chiefs cannot afford to give up the big play touchdowns against division rivals, with as close as those games generally are. They did a good job against Miami for much of the game, but they still surrendered 142 yards and 14 points on just 2 plays. Cant have that stuff happen in the division games. Theyre usually just too close to survive that type of stuff.

Good Call Man. I have that game on my Tivo and absolutely noticed it was Jared Allen not maintaining discipline that led to Ronnie Brown's 65 yard TD run. Yes Wesley made the hit and slid off of him, which everyone knows about.

I watched it several times, I have no idea what Jared was looking at. He followed right down the line and was not looking at the running back who received a pitch. He was running to a spot where he thought the RB would be. Big Mistake.

I am very excited about the improvment of the D, and do look for them to play a lot (two words) better as the season progresses, but Dangit, the DE's have got to maintain discipline, which has lead directly to the problems with the damned bootlegs.

Anyong Bluth
10-25-2005, 01:54 AM
Rep Walcrawler -

I also Tivo'd the game and saw Jared overcommitting to the pass rush on the play Brown busted. The tackle did a great job of coaxing him into the pass play by instead of firing out and trying to seal 1st, but hinging back in pass protection stance. JA took the bait and got over eager- which can happen to MANY players- let alone young guys that start to get a taste for constantly rushing the passer and forgetting their main assignment. The Redskins are trying to break LaVar of this very habit. Freelancing can show you flashes of great play- but leave you open to getting gashed.

Even I know the importance of the DE's job, and the last I played was in HS- for a nationally recognized program until my knees got jacked. We were always taught - and I quickly learned when I got pulled that, when playing DE on base downs, 2 yards of penetration max before locating the if its Pass or Run and to which side.

While a DE can be vital in disrupting plays- they can sink a defense by letting a RB turn it up outside or letting a QB slide free with an open look downfield. That really hangs your LB's and 2ndary out to dry. Denver loves to do this and basically just runs left or right misdirection while sending WR's on reverses or fakes and QB rollouts to keep the D from overcommitting on the run or leaving their guys freed upon the outside.

Allan will learn hopefully, sadly- Hicks doesn't seem to be following suit in his push- though he's been stellar in keeping contain as far as I can tell in the run.

Dr. Chief
10-25-2005, 07:06 AM
The best D will be using our O sustaining long drives, therefore keeping the D fresh. Tired D = giving up big plays.

htismaqe
10-25-2005, 07:29 AM
We were all talking about it in pre-season. His recent pass rushing performances have masked the fact that Jared Allen is still quite possibly THE weak link in our run defense.

Mr. Kotter
10-25-2005, 07:37 AM
We were all talking about it in pre-season. His recent pass rushing performances have masked the fact that Jared Allen is still quite possibly THE weak link in our run defense.

Many said the same about DT, back in the day....

Whenever you have a player pin his ears back like that, he's givin' up something to get something. The converse is Eric Hicks who, generally, covers his primary responsibility well enough (containment), but it comes at the expense of his secondary responsibility (pressure.) There is always gonna be a tradeoff. Ideally, you put players like Allen and Hicks on the SAME side when you can....so you can get both going.

Did I really just acknowledge that Eric Hicks does something okay, or even pretty well? :spock:

WTF? :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

sedated
10-25-2005, 07:39 AM
After most likely the WORST performance in his career against the Eagles (17 rushes for 7 yards, 0TD), Ladainian Tomlinson is going to be wanting to get back on track in front of his home crowd there in SD, against a Chiefs defense that is still succeptible to a big play or two.



Tomlinson only averages around 80 total yards a game against us for his career. We've stopped him in the past, we'll do it again.

I think Priest will have to bust out his own championship belt.

ExtremeChief
10-25-2005, 07:44 AM
If you are going to have your DE be agressive and crash down, your linebackers have to hold outside contain.

Warrior5
10-25-2005, 07:50 AM
Good Call Man. I have that game on my Tivo and absolutely noticed it was Jared Allen not maintaining discipline that led to Ronnie Brown's 65 yard TD run. Yes Wesley made the hit and slid off of him, which everyone knows about.

I watched it several times, I have no idea what Jared was looking at. He followed right down the line and was not looking at the running back who received a pitch. He was running to a spot where he thought the RB would be. Big Mistake.

Agree on the discipline; perhaps Allen was hunting for a sack. But Wesley got run over, plain and simple. Inexcusable.

The question I have: where was Bell? It was a run play to his side from the very start, so he didn't bite on any play-action stuff. Was he blocked out of the play? Any observations?

Chiefnj
10-25-2005, 08:03 AM
Agree on the discipline; perhaps Allen was hunting for a sack. But Wesley got run over, plain and simple. Inexcusable.

The question I have: where was Bell? It was a run play to his side from the very start, so he didn't bite on any play-action stuff. Was he blocked out of the play? Any observations?

I watched it last night. Allen headed toward the QB and let the back get around him. Warfield was getting blocked on right side by the receiver. Wesley comes in and makes a hit and it looks like all the other LB's and linemen (Siavii is actually close to Brown but never attempts to hit him) assume he is down and seem to let up for a moment. By then Brown was headed downfield and shrugs off Surtain's attempted shove.

jspchief
10-25-2005, 08:03 AM
Tomlinson only averages around 80 total yards a game against us for his career. Actually, he averages 115 total yards against us for his career.

He does only average about 82 yards rushing though.

jspchief
10-25-2005, 08:05 AM
If you are going to have your DE be agressive and crash down, your linebackers have to hold outside contain.When you have the LB on that side drop 15 yards into coverage like we've been doing with Bell, it's hard for him to contain a run.

Chiefnj
10-25-2005, 08:07 AM
We were all talking about it in pre-season. His recent pass rushing performances have masked the fact that Jared Allen is still quite possibly THE weak link in our run defense.

I don't think that is true. Allen is leading the DL in tackles and I am fairly certain without looking it up that he has more tackles behind the LOS than any other lineman.

htismaqe
10-25-2005, 08:25 AM
I don't think that is true. Allen is leading the DL in tackles and I am fairly certain without looking it up that he has more tackles behind the LOS than any other lineman.

He makes big plays at the expense of consistency. He's high motor/low discipline.

ExtremeChief
10-25-2005, 08:45 AM
When you have the LB on that side drop 15 yards into coverage like we've been doing with Bell, it's hard for him to contain a run.

yep

Phobia
10-25-2005, 08:51 AM
When you have the LB on that side drop 15 yards into coverage like we've been doing with Bell, it's hard for him to contain a run.

Especially since Bell moves like a lineman. He's not great in space. Has anybody seen him run? He looks like hell.

htismaqe
10-25-2005, 08:53 AM
Especially since Bell moves like a lineman. He's not great in space. Has anybody seen him run? He looks like hell.

I think that's mental vs. physical -- he looks tentative.

I blame Gunther for having him trying to cover passes instead of having him do what he does best.

Phobia
10-25-2005, 08:54 AM
yep

What in the hell are you doing making football posts?

sedated
10-25-2005, 08:55 AM
Bell moves like a lineman. He's not great in space. Has anybody seen him run? He looks like hell.

He looked awesome when Jake the Fake was outrunning him to the end-zone.

What a f*cking disgrace.

He's a fat-@ss waste of money.

RINGLEADER
10-25-2005, 08:57 AM
I'd like to see us mix it up and blitz LESS...


Having watched every Chargers game this year I don't know that I agree with this...Denver blitzed Brees endlessly in their second half and Brees didn't do crap.

Then again I think Philly had the right idea of keying in on LT because the Chargers had little luck converting on anything other than 3rd and 3 or less.

RINGLEADER
10-25-2005, 09:01 AM
He looked awesome when Jake the Fake was outrunning him to the end-zone.

What a f*cking disgrace.

He's a fat-@ss waste of money.

I've seen Bell make a couple of great plays. Unfortunately, he's played in six games...

Phobia
10-25-2005, 09:15 AM
I've seen Bell make a couple of great plays. Unfortunately, he's played in six games...
He needs to either drop 20 lbs, move to DE, or move to the middle in a 4-3. We can't have him downfield covering TE's and RB's. He moves like Chester McGlockton.

htismaqe
10-25-2005, 09:22 AM
He needs to either drop 20 lbs, move to DE, or move to the middle in a 4-3. We can't have him downfield covering TE's and RB's. He moves like Chester McGlockton.

He didn't move like that in Pittsburgh. He's not slow. He's playing tentatively.

It's Gunther's fault. Bell's biggest asset is his first step, he should be rushing the passer.

Chief Henry
10-25-2005, 09:42 AM
I'd like to see us mix it up and blitz LESS...



No doubt about that. Blitz a team like Sandy Eggo with those weapons and were asking for trouble. I'll be praying for our D-Line to get pressure up the middle........I might as well pray for the winning lotto numbers while I'm at it.



IMO this game can be the stepping stone to GREAT things for the rest of the season.

sedated
10-25-2005, 09:46 AM
He looked like a beast in Pitt.

I don't know if it's the white pants or what, but he just looks fat.

jspchief
10-25-2005, 03:43 PM
Having watched every Chargers game this year I don't know that I agree with this...Denver blitzed Brees endlessly in their second half and Brees didn't do crap.

Then again I think Philly had the right idea of keying in on LT because the Chargers had little luck converting on anything other than 3rd and 3 or less.Denver got a lot of pressure solely from their D-line in that game. They did blitz more in the second half, but the biggest key was a great push from the DTs. Something we shouldn't expect out of our guys.

Count Zarth
10-25-2005, 03:45 PM
I think that's mental vs. physical -- he looks tentative.

I blame Gunther for having him trying to cover passes instead of having him do what he does best.

Looked to me like he was rushing the passer more against Miami.