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View Full Version : BCS is Big 12 biased? Snyders Revenge?


BigRedChief
10-25-2005, 12:46 PM
The country is in quite a tizzy over the latest BCS rankings. Though USC sits comfortably atop both the coaches' and Harris polls, Texas leads in five of the BCS's six computer rankings, and is the top team overall in the BCS rankings.

The rest of the article here:

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=jones/051025

Another ESPN writer says no big deal:
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=2202636

Saulbadguy
10-25-2005, 12:49 PM
All about money. The BCS would love a Texas USC matchup.

htismaqe
10-25-2005, 01:04 PM
This is one time I think the BCS is right.

USC is not nearly as dominant as in year's past and Texas is the best team in the country from the games I've watched.

carlos3652
10-25-2005, 01:10 PM
Hmmm... AP and Coaches poll does not include SOS which the BCS does, Also the BCS is not human... and does not take into consideration that USC has not lost in what 29 games... It only factors this season.

Lets compare this year, which team has beat more top 25 teams:

Texas: 3

@ OSU #4
Colorado #24
Texas Tech #10

USC: 3

@ Oregon #24
@ ASU #14
@ ND #9

But, where are they now? The BCS ranked team USC played are ranked 11, 15 (2 - Oregon, ND)

Texas has all 3 ranked in the top 25: 13, 16, 24

I think by the end of the year USC will be number 1 if they win out... they have 3 more ranked opp compared to Texas 0

kepp
10-25-2005, 01:16 PM
If they're going to be sympathetic to the Big XII, can't they be REALLY sympathetic and sneak Mizzou in there? :rolleyes:

htismaqe
10-25-2005, 01:19 PM
Hmmm... AP and Coaches poll does not include SOS which the BCS does, Also the BCS is not human... and does not take into consideration that USC has not lost in what 29 games... It only factors this season.

Lets compare this year, which team has beat more top 25 teams:

Texas: 3

@ OSU #4
Colorado #24
Texas Tech #10

USC: 3

@ Oregon #24
@ ASU #14
@ ND #9

But, where are they now? The BCS ranked team USC played are ranked 11, 15 (2 - Oregon, ND)

Texas has all 3 ranked in the top 25: 13, 16, 24

I think by the end of the year USC will be number 1 if they win out... they have 3 more ranked opp compared to Texas 0

Excellent analysis. This is exactly why I consider Texas to be the current #1 team -- they deserve it. At the end of the season, that may change.

Garcia Bronco
10-25-2005, 01:42 PM
Texas is good....but their SOS is weak with Big 12 play....same with USC and PAC-10 play. Which brings me to Texas Tech. You look at the box scores and say "wow..."Texas killed the number 10 ranked team....but TT had no business being ranked in the top 15 at all. In fact...IMO the only way these two teams have been tested is their respective games against OSU and ND....but that's it.

htismaqe
10-25-2005, 01:54 PM
Texas is good....but their SOS is weak with Big 12 play....same with USC and PAC-10 play. Which brings me to Texas Tech. You look at the box scores and say "wow..."Texas killed the number 10 ranked team....but TT had no business being ranked in the top 15 at all. In fact...IMO the only way these two teams have been tested is their respective games against OSU and ND....but that's it.

Texas' current SoS is actually very good. It will, however, get worse because they don't have any decent team left on their schedule.

The team to watch out for is Va Tech. Their remaining schedule is pretty strong. If they run the table they better get in...

Ultra Peanut
10-25-2005, 02:10 PM
No playoff, no closure. Regardless of who comes out "on top," it's just another story of another year and another MNC.

By this point, I can't be arsed to care who the "real" national champion is.

tk13
10-25-2005, 02:24 PM
Texas has been more dominant, but I don't care, USC hasn't lost a game in forever and is 2 time defending champ.... there's no way shape or form they should not be #1 in everything. If style points were all that mattered the Patriots wouldn't be NFL champs 3 of the last 4 times, but the object is to win football games. The fact that Texas is ahead of them shows how much of a joke the whole thing is.

Garcia Bronco
10-25-2005, 02:35 PM
Texas' current SoS is actually very good. It will, however, get worse because they don't have any decent team left on their schedule.

The team to watch out for is Va Tech. Their remaining schedule is pretty strong. If they run the table they better get in...

Being a Virginia Tech Alum...I hope you're right. I would expect that Virginia Tech would leap frog both USC and UT in the BCS should they win out and beat FSU in an ACC Championship game.

BC
Miami
and
FSU*

All are top 15 BCS at this time and remain on the Hokies schedule

*possible ACCC Game matchup.


But none of that is going to be easy.

Garcia Bronco
10-25-2005, 02:37 PM
Texas has been more dominant, but I don't care, USC hasn't lost a game in forever and is 2 time defending champ.... there's no way shape or form they should not be #1 in everything. If style points were all that mattered the Patriots wouldn't be NFL champs 3 of the last 4 times, but the object is to win football games. The fact that Texas is ahead of them shows how much of a joke the whole thing is.

They've only won one National championship...unless you're counting the AP NC...which is like being named the Pepsi all rookie of the year.

LSU won it...then USC won it...there is no two in-a-row.

Uatu
10-25-2005, 02:42 PM
If they aren't going to have a playoff system, they ought to go right back to voting for who was the best.

At least if some human decision were in the process they could give people the game they want to see.

Simplex3
10-25-2005, 02:44 PM
No playoff, no closure. Regardless of who comes out "on top," it's just another story of another year and another MNC.

By this point, I can't be arsed to care who the "real" national champion is.
Damn straight. Untill there's a playoff there IS no national champion. There's some team crowned with a BS title.

tk13
10-25-2005, 02:44 PM
They've only won one National championship...unless you're counting the AP NC...which is like being named the Pepsi all rookie of the year.

LSU won it...then USC won it...there is no two in-a-row.
It's not any better or worse than the coaches poll... actually it might be better, last year the Big 12 coaches all conspired to get Texas voted up into a better bowl, like that's real honest. USC was co-national champion in my mind. Just can't take it away.

htismaqe
10-25-2005, 04:29 PM
What USC did last year or the year before has ZERO BEARING on this year. Period.

jspchief
10-25-2005, 04:30 PM
Texas will likely drop to #2 after this week's games.

Keep in mind the Texas just got done beating an undefeated team, while USC played a total cupcake. With only seven games on the schedule, that can have a big impact. USC will go on to play some tough games, and Texas enters the cupcake part of their schedule.

Anyone up in arms over this just doesn't understand the system.

Virgina Tech is the team that will get screwed. If Texas keeps winning with big enough margins to dominate the #2 ballots in the polls, VA Tech won't overtake them.

ChiefsCountry
10-25-2005, 04:36 PM
If Mizzou and Colorado can keep winning, that will help out Texas. Same with Texas Tech.

tk13
10-25-2005, 04:37 PM
Oh I don't think it matters as long as USC gets in the championship game if they go undefeated. As long as that happens it's really not a big deal. It does speak to the flaws of the system though. I agree with Garcia that TT being ranked that high was a total joke, they played a total creme puff schedule, and Texas waxing TT really helps them edge USC out in the numbers I think. USC is still the best team in the country.

Garcia Bronco
10-25-2005, 06:04 PM
I agree TK....the polls are subjective...coachs' or AP....I'm talking about the BCS....which is the offical NC...the AP means nothing.

Ultra Peanut
10-25-2005, 06:08 PM
I'm talking about the BCS....which is the offical NCThere is no such thing as an official national championship. The NCAA holds the BCS "national championship" in no higher regard than the AP's "national championship," or any other rating system's "national championship," for that matter. The only national championships you'll see as officially recognized by the NCAA are from Division I-AA and lower, which come from playoffs.

The only thing that makes the BCS seem any more legitimate to the masses is the huge amount of money and marketing that is poured into it and produced as a result of it. In the end, it's still a mythical national championship.

Garcia Bronco
10-25-2005, 06:12 PM
So technicall SC is the repeat NC....but the 2 time Pepsi NC....:)

Garcia Bronco
10-25-2005, 06:17 PM
I disagree to a point PSI....while the NC is mythical....who cares what the NCAA says...what makes the BCS offical is the 6 major conferences and ND all agree to it....they also agree to allow the NCAA to govern. So the real power is held by the schools....which is the way it should be....which is also why there is no playoff system.

Saulbadguy
10-25-2005, 06:18 PM
They get the ADT National Championship trophy. Woo hoo. What a bastardization.

andoman
10-25-2005, 06:46 PM
'Bama baby!

WilliamTheIrish
10-25-2005, 07:08 PM
I think Garcia's Tech squad could win out and take a yard of penis in the process.

There ain't enough tv sets in the area to make the leap over Texas or USC no matter the record.

When all issaid and done, USC D will make Vince Young look mortal.

Saulbadguy
10-25-2005, 07:19 PM
Next week is November, the month all Chokie fans fear the most.

Garcia Bronco
10-25-2005, 07:27 PM
Lol....what does my 3 foot dick with it?

WilliamTheIrish
10-25-2005, 07:47 PM
Lol....what does my 3 foot dick with it?

Clearly you misunderstood. You backwoods, burlap condom wearing no tooth, hapless inbred. :)

I was opining that Tech could win and actually be the better team yet not make it into the BCS CG by virtue of TV revenue.

Of course that's just my opinion.

Garcia Bronco
10-25-2005, 08:22 PM
That's why the only thing that matters to me is the ACCC...to beat Miami and FSU in the same year would be insanely good. Will Texas or SC beat two teams that good? Only if they play each other.

Saulbadguy
10-25-2005, 09:09 PM
I'd be surprised if VT doesn't choke somewhere down the line. @UVA is a rivalry game, don't count that out, even though UVA sucks. (Beats F$U and then loses to UNC, wtf)

Ultra Peanut
10-25-2005, 09:19 PM
So the real power is held by the schoolsBy a cartel of SOME schools, yes...

How joyous and glorious for them.

Saulbadguy
10-25-2005, 09:21 PM
Don't worry. We still laugh at the Big East, with or without Memphis.

Skip Towne
10-25-2005, 09:29 PM
By a cartel of SOME schools, yes...

How joyous and glorious for them.
I thought Memphis should be in the hunt for the NC. But then they lost to TULSA. Hahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!

Ultra Peanut
10-25-2005, 10:31 PM
I thought Memphis should be in the hunt for the NC. But then they lost to TULSA. Hahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!Yes, I'm sure we would have been in the hunt for a mythical national title [/sarcasm] if we hadn't lost our 4-year starting QB and 26 other seniors to graduation, our top two QBs to broken legs (the guy who may very well be the best QB on the team transferred in this year, and as such, wasn't eligible to play), one of our top two receivers to a torn ACL (our top receiver has since become the starting QB over the true freshman who helped lead us to a win over 5-1 UTEP), and around six other starters to long-term or season-ending injuries.

By the way, you're getting a hell of a lot of mileage out of an overtime loss at Tulsa. You'd think the 38-17 drubbing at UCF would have made for a better attempt at smack, but yet again, Skip's ignorance of college football prevails.

Seriously, the fact that this team is standing at 4-3 with two possibly winnable home games (the two road games were going to be damn tough even without the whole "a third of the team is injured" stuff) is unbelievable. We are playing with TWO DOWN LINEMEN because our defensive line has been hit so hard. If they somehow scrape out a bowl this year, it will be a testament to every single player who's still standing.

Reaper16
10-25-2005, 10:47 PM
There is no such thing as an official national championship. The NCAA holds the BCS "national championship" in no higher regard than the AP's "national championship," or any other rating system's "national championship," for that matter. The only national championships you'll see as officially recognized by the NCAA are from Division I-AA and lower, which come from playoffs.

The only thing that makes the BCS seem any more legitimate to the masses is the huge amount of money and marketing that is poured into it and produced as a result of it. In the end, it's still a mythical national championship.
Crazy. That means that Auburn are defending National Champions, having won the Golf Digest National Championship award last year.

Ultra Peanut
10-25-2005, 10:54 PM
Crazy. That means that Auburn are defending National Champions, having won the Golf Digest National Championship award last year.Indeed they are.

USC is actually on a quest for its fourth national championship in a row, according to the Matthews Grid Ratings, which are no more and no less legitimate than the BCS in the eyes of the NCAA.

The NCAA does not conduct a national championship in Division I-A football and is not involved in the selection process.

Boardin Bronco
10-26-2005, 02:56 AM
Great posts, Psicosis.

If I played on 04 Auburn, 94 Penn State or 66 Alabama, I would have no regrets about how those seasons ended. Those teams did everything they could against top flight competition and won their respective conference championships. I will still remember them as great, championship caliber teams despite them not receiving the ultimate love in the polls.

Even though there's not an "official NC", I still hold the AP poll in high regard. They have historically done a fine job of voting. Unlike the coaches poll, where regional biases and personal favors have been reflected in the voting results more often.

Mecca
10-26-2005, 05:36 AM
As Frostee Rucker, defensive end from USC, said "what do we have to do, win by 100 points?"

This should work itself out but to me, it seems really stupid that a team that hasn't lost a game in almost 3 years, isn't ranked 1st in everything.

To be the man, you have to beat the man. USC is the man, no one has beat the man.

kepp
10-26-2005, 08:20 AM
Being a Virginia Tech Alum...I hope you're right. I would expect that Virginia Tech would leap frog both USC and UT in the BCS should they win out and beat FSU in an ACC Championship game.

BC
Miami
and
FSU*

All are top 15 BCS at this time and remain on the Hokies schedule

*possible ACCC Game matchup.


But none of that is going to be easy.
I read in an SI article (no, I don't have the link) that, if USC, Texas and VT all ran the table, it would be very difficult for VT to jump to #2. Personally, I'd like to see Texas and VT play. I don't think either of them would beat USC, but a game between them would be great.

Skip Towne
10-26-2005, 08:30 AM
Yes, I'm sure we would have been in the hunt for a mythical national title [/sarcasm] if we hadn't lost our 4-year starting QB and 26 other seniors to graduation, our top two QBs to broken legs (the guy who may very well be the best QB on the team transferred in this year, and as such, wasn't eligible to play), one of our top two receivers to a torn ACL (our top receiver has since become the starting QB over the true freshman who helped lead us to a win over 5-1 UTEP), and around six other starters to long-term or season-ending injuries.

By the way, you're getting a hell of a lot of mileage out of an overtime loss at Tulsa. You'd think the 38-17 drubbing at UCF would have made for a better attempt at smack, but yet again, Skip's ignorance of college football prevails.

Seriously, the fact that this team is standing at 4-3 with two possibly winnable home games (the two road games were going to be damn tough even without the whole "a third of the team is injured" stuff) is unbelievable. We are playing with TWO DOWN LINEMEN because our defensive line has been hit so hard. If they somehow scrape out a bowl this year, it will be a testament to every single player who's still standing.
You're right. I don't pay attention to the minor leagues. But losing to TULSA is hilarious.

htismaqe
10-26-2005, 08:51 AM
As Frostee Rucker, defensive end from USC, said "what do we have to do, win by 100 points?"

This should work itself out but to me, it seems really stupid that a team that hasn't lost a game in almost 3 years, isn't ranked 1st in everything.

To be the man, you have to beat the man. USC is the man, no one has beat the man.

It seems really stupid that a team's 2003 and 2004 records should factor AT ALL into the 2005 National Championship.

The fact that USC hasn't lost a game in almost 3 years is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT. All that matters is this year.

Ultra Peanut
10-26-2005, 10:38 AM
You're right. I don't pay attention to the minor leagues. But losing to TULSA is hilarious.I don't really pay attention to the minor leagues, either, but I'm not sure what the likes of Georgia Southern and Delaware have to do with anything.

As for Tulsa, they're 5-3, their losses coming to Minnesota, @Oklahoma, and Houston. They're having a solid year that includes a beat down over Southern Miss at The Rock in Hattiesburg. An OT loss in their house after our second QB of the season went down to a broken fibula in that game is hardly something I'm going to weep over.

In fact, the only loss I'm embarrassed about is the Mississippi game. Even if we lost our QB for the year on the first series of the game and were within spitting distance of the end zone with under thirty seconds to go, losing to Mississippi is like losing to Kansas. Yuck.

Actually, the amazing thing is that our schedule to date actually features four teams with winning records, two with losing records, and one I-AA team. Overall, excluding Chattanooga and the games we played in, our opponents are 21-15.

Despite the injuries, despite the fact that we're playing the three best teams in C-USA West and none of the bottom three, despite the fact that we've got games @USM and @Tennescared filling half of our remaining schedule... we're still at 4-3 and in the running for a bowl. Amazing.

Jim Jones
10-26-2005, 02:48 PM
It seems really stupid that a team's 2003 and 2004 records should factor AT ALL into the 2005 National Championship.

The fact that USC hasn't lost a game in almost 3 years is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT. All that matters is this year.

You have to add a little human element to it. You can have your OPINION on who is better, but they are the 2-time defending champions and haven't lost a game in 2 years, plus they have as good a record this year as any other team. They deserve the chance to defend their title until someone beats them.

htismaqe
10-26-2005, 03:04 PM
You have to add a little human element to it. You can have your OPINION on who is better, but they are the 2-time defending champions and haven't lost a game in 2 years, plus they have as good a record this year as any other team. They deserve the chance to defend their title until someone beats them.

The human element is precisely what's wrong with it. Whether it's coaches voting on teams they've never seen play, to writers voting against teams that beat their alma mater, the human element is fatally flawed.

Strength of schedule and strength of victory have to be considered at some point. That's where the computers come in, and of course, computers calculate, they don't consider.

Of course, the only way to solve it all is to have a playoff, which will never happen.

Boardin Bronco
10-26-2005, 05:04 PM
I read in an SI article (no, I don't have the link) that, if USC, Texas and VT all ran the table, it would be very difficult for VT to jump to #2. Personally, I'd like to see Texas and VT play. I don't think either of them would beat USC, but a game between them would be great.

I think Virginia Tech's strength of schedule is going to swing in their favor. They play Boston College tomorrow and still have Miami, archrival Virginia (would help if they didn't lose to UNC) and a potential showdown with Florida State in the ACC Championship.

Texas doesn't play another top 25 team unless Texas A&M or Big 12 North favorite Colorado goes on a strong run.

Saulbadguy
10-26-2005, 05:28 PM
You have to add a little human element to it.
Exactly what they were trying to get away from with the BCS.