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View Full Version : Offensive play-calling help for Al Saunders


shaneo69
11-08-2005, 03:58 PM
The Chiefs offense has been sputtering a bit this year, so I wanted to offer my assistance to Al. I want to list the plays that always work, and the plays that never work, for his reference. Please help me by listing any plays in the above two categories that I've forgotten.

Plays that always work:

1) First, I would run on 1st down on at least the 1st three offensive series. Even if you only get two yards, 2nd and 8 is a lot better than 2nd and 10. Once you've ran on 1st down several times, it opens up the play-action passes on subsequent 1st downs.

2) With Kennison on the left side, the 15 yard out pattern to Eddie. This used to be our bread-and-butter, but I guess Kennison has been moved to the right side this year. Trent can throw this pass in his sleep, but he doesn't throw the deep out to the right side nearly as well.

3) The pitch back to LJ or Priest going to the left side. We used it once on Sunday and it worked great. When they tried a straight hand-off going left, they always got stuffed. The pitch back going left was the play that LJ took to the house on the first drive of the season. Even without Roaf, it still works. I would use this play on any 2nd down situation, as well as 3rd down and 3 yards-or-less.

4) A fake hand-off going towards the right, and then a pass to the wide-open FB. T-Rich scored on this play Sunday. Bill Jones used to score on this play all the time back around 1990. Shanahan runs this play a lot as well. The FB is always open, and it usually gets you about 10 yards.

5) The draw play. But this should be used mainly on 2nd down and 5-8 yards to go. It shouldn't be used on obvious passing or running downs.

6) The screen pass where one RB goes left and the other goes right. Trent fakes to one side and goes to the other. Usually good for some nice yardage.

7) Straight hand-offs to LJ up the middle with Dante running a fake reverse behind Trent. I would use this play on almost all 1st downs. Then actually give the ball to Dante at least twice a game on the reverse.

8) Four yard slant patterns to Chris Horn on 1st or 2nd down. Saunders only calls this on 3rd down in crucial situations, and it always makes me nervous as hell. Do it on 1st or 2nd down for crissakes.

9) A pick play to Gonzo, where he starts inside next to the OT, then runs a pattern towards the sideline while the outside WR runs a crossing pattern to pick off the defender covering TG. This would be used when the defense is playing man coverage, at least in the first 10 yards.

10) If all else fails, and the offense is still sputtering, go no huddle and let Trent call his own plays.

Plays that never work to follow...

Warrior5
11-08-2005, 04:06 PM
1. Rush through LG/LT (when Roaf is out)

2. Sweeps.

keg in kc
11-08-2005, 04:08 PM
Then when these plays don't work, who do we complain about, you or him?

htismaqe
11-08-2005, 04:12 PM
Then when these plays don't work, who do we complain about, you or him?

ROFL

htismaqe
11-08-2005, 04:13 PM
Seriously, Saunders would never listen to shane or any of us for that matter.

He's a genious in his own mind.

chagrin
11-08-2005, 04:14 PM
We need more cowbell!

shaneo69
11-08-2005, 04:21 PM
Plays that never work...

1) Empty backfield, Trent under center. For god's sake, if you empty the backfield, at least put Trent in the shotgun and give him a chance.

2) Horizontal passes to the RB, TE, or Dante.* When caught, they gain 1 yard. When thrown to LJ, they get dropped.

* Disclaimer - this play can be used when we are leading by 14 or more points late in the 4th quarter and TG needs to catch a pass to extend his consecutive game pass-catching streak.

3) Any sweep play when LJ is the RB. LJ can't get wide like Priest.

4) The designed roll-out where Trent rolls out to the right, fakes the handoff, then tries to hit either the FB three yards downfield or Gonzalez eight yards downfield. This play almost always seems to be covered and there is always a guy in Trent's face right away.

Having trouble thinking of others right now. I'm sure I'll come up with some more though.

shaneo69
11-08-2005, 04:25 PM
Another short yardage play they run that almost always seems to work, is from the I-formation when they fake the handoff to T-Rich going between the C-LG hole and then give to the RB going through the C-RG hole.

htismaqe
11-08-2005, 04:27 PM
Where would you put the fake reverse/PA pass that they run? It works SOMETIMES, but I fuggin hate it...it takes like 45 seconds to setup.

shaneo69
11-08-2005, 04:30 PM
Where would you put the fake reverse/PA pass that they run? It works SOMETIMES, but I fuggin hate it...it takes like 45 seconds to setup.

I agree, I hate that play as well, and would definitely scrap it.

sedated
11-08-2005, 04:32 PM
Stop this sweep crap with LJ in the game.

sedated
11-08-2005, 04:39 PM
With how concerned other Defenses are with the sweep run, we should pull out the 'ol HB Pass.

Even if it gets thrown away, one every game would make their defense think about it, and the sweep could be more effective.

htismaqe
11-08-2005, 04:43 PM
With how concerned other Defenses are with the sweep run, we should pull out the 'ol HB Pass.

Even if it gets thrown away, one every game would make their defense think about it, and the sweep could be more effective.

Not a bad idea.

Mr. Laz
11-08-2005, 05:12 PM
i think we need some new running plays.


seem like we use like 3 .. maybe 4


1. toss sweep (left/right)
2. draw
3. dive (only shortage or when LJ is in)


defenses are jumping all over our sweeps ... we need to add some variety. (counters,traps etc)

MichaelH
11-08-2005, 05:34 PM
1. fleaflicker
2. statue of liberty play

Bowser
11-08-2005, 05:37 PM
Where would you put the fake reverse/PA pass that they run? It works SOMETIMES, but I fuggin hate it...it takes like 45 seconds to setup.

On that last fake reverse we ran against the Fade, Trent should have handed the ball to Kennison. There was NO-ONE on that side of the field.

I'm a big fan of the flea-flicker. Then again, my last name isn't Theismann, either.

ChiefsFan1965
11-08-2005, 08:29 PM
1. fleaflicker
2. statue of liberty play

What is the statue of liberty play? I feel like I know quite a bit but have never heard of this one....

Skip Towne
11-08-2005, 08:44 PM
I've seen LJ break several long runs around both ends. But it's hard to do the way the O line has been playing. I'd also like to see a shovel pass to LJ. It would give him the space he needs to break it. I don't ever remember seeing the Chiefs use it. I even wrote them about it when Okoye couldn't get loose. He had terrific speed that we never saw.

jidar
11-08-2005, 09:11 PM
Plays that never work...

1) Empty backfield, Trent under center. For god's sake, if you empty the backfield, at least put Trent in the shotgun and give him a chance.



That one has worked at least a couple of times every week this year. I keep thinking about posting about it, then it gets a big gain a few times and I shut up.
I've looked stupid a few times in my living room in front of friends when I said "empty backfield? Dont pull that shit." followed by "oh.. well I guess it worked." a bit later.

jidar
11-08-2005, 09:13 PM
1. fleaflicker
2. statue of liberty play

What is the statue of liberty play? I feel like I know quite a bit but have never heard of this one....

LOL. It's where the QB will fake pass as a back takes the ball out of his hand from behind him. The key is the exchange happens when the passer has the ball cocked up behind his head for the throw, then the passer makes the throwing motion with an empty hand.
It's the kind of thing that would make your dog run across the yard looking for the ball.

siberian khatru
11-08-2005, 09:17 PM
4) A fake hand-off going towards the right, and then a pass to the wide-open FB. T-Rich scored on this play Sunday. Bill Jones used to score on this play all the time back around 1990.

Ha, I made that reference on the game thread after T-Rich scored and got no love for it. Good to see someone else remembers that. :)

Chief Henry
11-08-2005, 09:30 PM
Just no passes to the back up tight end into the endzone. It gives me a headache every time I think of that dam play against Seattle.

philfree
11-09-2005, 12:07 AM
I'm not gonna try call plays but IMO we aren't going down field enough stretching the D. I know that part of that is a product of our pass protection and how much time Trent has to read the D, set and then throw but if we start stretching the field deep the Ds we face will have to respect that and it should open up things under the D for the rest of our O. I luv Dante but IMO we need more Bo.

PhilFree:arrow:

Count Alex's Wins
11-09-2005, 01:41 AM
I just want to know what happened to the slant and the fade in the redzone.

They ran that damn fade to Boerigter for the 2-point conversion and then shelved it.

:cuss:

Extra Point
11-09-2005, 07:27 AM
Stop this sweep crap with LJ in the game.
Absolutely! Right up their 2 hole!

htismaqe
11-09-2005, 09:04 AM
I just want to know what happened to the slant and the fade in the redzone.

They ran that damn fade to Boerigter for the 2-point conversion and then shelved it.

:cuss:

Like the slant, hate the fade.

Count Alex's Wins
11-09-2005, 09:07 AM
Like the slant, hate the fade.

Why? How can you hate something we never run?

siberian khatru
11-09-2005, 09:07 AM
Like the slant, hate the fade.

Thank God I'm not the only one. I hate, hate, hate fades in the end zone. Marty (well, probably Hackett) used to run that a lot, I swear it never worked.

The Colts scored on one Monday night, and I was explaining to my wife how much I hate that play -- difficult throw, difficult catch. It probably helps a bit if you Peyton Manning and Marvin Harrison at each end. I still don't like it.

htismaqe
11-09-2005, 09:27 AM
Why? How can you hate something we never run?

I hate it when other teams use it. I hate it period. It's the football equivalent of throwing up a granny shot from half-court...

Count Alex's Wins
11-09-2005, 09:44 AM
I hate it when other teams use it. I hate it period. It's the football equivalent of throwing up a granny shot from half-court...

Seems to me it's using your mismatches to your advantage with Boerigter and Gonzalez. Of course we've NEVER split Gonzo out wide and even tried it. :banghead:

It'd be a way to use Kris Wilson's 6-2 frame to our advantage, too.