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View Full Version : Uh-oh, Coalition of the Willing starting to high tail it out of Iraq


memyselfI
12-01-2005, 04:04 PM
Guess those rose colored glasses at the Pentagon and WH aren't being worn any longer by our COTW partners. :hmmm:

Two U.S. Allies Leaving Iraq, More May Go By WILLIAM J. KOLE, Associated Press Writer
1 hour, 27 minutes ago



VIENNA, Austria - Two of America's allies in Iraq are withdrawing forces this month and a half-dozen others are debating possible pullouts or reductions, increasing pressure on Washington as calls mount to bring home U.S. troops.

Bulgaria and Ukraine will begin withdrawing their combined 1,250 troops by mid-December. If Australia, Britain, Italy, Japan, Poland and South Korea reduce or recall their personnel, more than half of the non-American forces in Iraq could be gone by next summer.

Japan and South Korea help with reconstruction, but Britain and Australia provide substantial support forces and Italy and Poland train Iraqi troops and police. Their exodus would deal a blow to American efforts to prepare Iraqis to take over the most dangerous peacekeeping tasks and craft an eventual U.S. exit strategy.

"The vibrations of unease from within the United States clearly have an impact on public opinion elsewhere," said Terence Taylor of the International Institute for Strategic Studies in Washington. "Public opinion in many of these countries is heavily divided."

Although the nearly 160,000-member U.S. force in Iraq dwarfs the second-largest contingent — Britain's 8,000 in Iraq and 2,000 elsewhere in the Gulf region — its support has shrunk substantially.

In the months after the March 2003 invasion, the multinational force numbered about 300,000 soldiers from 38 countries. That figure is now just under 24,000 mostly non-combat personnel from 27 countries. The coalition has steadily unraveled as the death toll rises and angry publics clamor for troops to leave.
In the spring, the Netherlands had 1,400 troops in Iraq. Today, there are 19, including a lone Dutch soldier in Baghdad.

Ukraine's remaining 876 troops in Iraq are due home by Dec. 31, fulfilling a campaign pledge by President Viktor Yushchenko. Bulgaria is pulling out its 380 troops after Dec. 15 parliamentary elections, Defense Minister Veselin Bliznakov said.

In his strategy for Iraq, announced Wednesday, President Bush said expanding international support was one of his goals. He also seemed to address the issue of more allies withdrawing.

"As our posture changes over time, so too will the posture of our coalition partners," the document says. "We and the Iraqis must work with them to coordinate our efforts, helping Iraq to consolidate and secure its gains on many different fronts."

Struggling to shore up the coalition, Bush stopped in Mongolia on his recent Asia trip and praised its force of about 120 soldiers in Iraq as "fearless warriors."

At least 2,109 U.S. service personnel have died since the beginning of the Iraq war, according to an Associated Press count. At least 200 troops from other countries also have died, including 98 from Britain. Other tolls: Italy, 27; Ukraine, 18; Poland, 17; Bulgaria, 13; Spain, 11; Slovakia, three; Denmark, El Salvador, Estonia, Netherlands, Thailand, two each; Hungary, Kazakhstan, Latvia, one each.

Underscoring mounting opposition in nearly all coalition countries, a poll published in Japan's Asahi newspaper this week showed 69 percent of respondents opposed extending the mission, up from 55 percent in January. No margin of error was given.

Japan's Kyodo News service reported Wednesday that Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi's Cabinet would decide Dec. 8 to allow its 600 troops to stay for another year, but it could decide later to withdraw troops around May.

A British drawdown would be the most dramatic.

Although Prime Minister Tony Blair's government insists there is no timetable and British forces will leave only when Iraqi troops can take over, Defense Secretary John Reid suggested last month that a pullout could begin "in the course of the next year."

South Korea, the second-largest coalition partner after Britain, is expected to withdraw about 1,000 of its 3,200 troops in the first half of 2006. The National Assembly is likely to vote on the matter this month.

Italy's military reportedly is preparing to give parliament a timetable for a proposed withdrawal of its 2,800 troops. Premier Silvio Berlusconi's government has said it plans to withdraw forces in groups of 300, but in accordance with the Iraqi government and coalition allies.

Poland's former leftist government, which lost Sept. 25 elections, had planned to withdraw its 1,400 troops in January. The new defense minister, Radek Sikorski, visits Washington this weekend for talks on Poland's coalition plans, and the new government is expected to decide by mid-December whether to extend its mission beyond Dec. 31.

"Some formula of advisory-stabilizing mission could remain on a smaller scale, of course, and our commanders are prepared for several variants," Col. Zdzislaw Gnatowski of the Polish army's general staff told The Associated Press.

Air Chief Marshal Angus Houston, head of the Australian Defense Force, has said about 450 troops in the southern province of Muthanna could leave by May. Australia has about 900 troops and support staff across Iraq.

Many coalition members have pledged to stay in Iraq for all of 2006; at least one, Lithuania, has committed to the end of 2007. And the coalition is still drawing new members, most recently Bosnia, which sent 36 bomb-disposal experts in June.

"We are getting letters of gratitude from the U.S. commanders for our peacekeepers' excellent service," said Ilgar Verdiyev, a Defense Ministry spokesman in Azerbaijan, which has 150 troops in Iraq and is one of the few mostly Muslim countries to contribute.

___

Eye Patch
12-01-2005, 04:10 PM
Maybe they're leaving because the U.S. military said Thursday that suicide bombings fell in November to their lowest level in seven months after joint U.S.-Iraqi operations west of the capital.

memyselfI
12-01-2005, 04:16 PM
Maybe they're leaving because the U.S. military said Thursday that suicide bombings fell in November to their lowest level in seven months after joint U.S.-Iraqi operations west of the capital.

Or maybe they are leaving because three of the last four months have been one of the deadliest periods for US troops since the start of the war.

recxjake
12-01-2005, 04:27 PM
Or maybe they are leaving because three of the last four months have been one of the deadliest periods for US troops since the start of the war.


These have been planned for awhile, its no surprise... they aren't stationed in the peaceful areas of Iraq that don't need a military around... this is a good thing, not a bad thing.... their job is done, so they can go home!

memyselfI
12-01-2005, 04:31 PM
These have been planned for awhile, its no surprise... they aren't stationed in the peaceful areas of Iraq that don't need a military around... this is a good thing, not a bad thing.... their job is done, so they can go home!


Maybe you want to let DUHbya know...seems he's a tad out of the loop with what you are saying.

In his strategy for Iraq, announced Wednesday, President Bush said expanding international support was one of his goals. He also seemed to address the issue of more allies withdrawing.

"As our posture changes over time, so too will the posture of our coalition partners," the document says. "We and the Iraqis must work with them to coordinate our efforts, helping Iraq to consolidate and secure its gains on many different fronts."

Struggling to shore up the coalition, Bush stopped in Mongolia on his recent Asia trip and praised its force of about 120 soldiers in Iraq as "fearless warriors."

recxjake
12-01-2005, 04:45 PM
Bulgaria and Ukraine will begin withdrawing their combined 1,250 troops by mid-December

I think we will do just fine w/ out these troops in Iraq.... not that big of a loss..... these troops werent even allowed to shoot i believe

memyselfI
12-01-2005, 04:47 PM
Bulgaria and Ukraine will begin withdrawing their combined 1,250 troops by mid-December

I think we will do just fine w/ out these troops in Iraq.... not that big of a loss..... these troops werent even allowed to shoot i believe

Any loss of support hurts because it means more US forces will be needed to pick up the slack...

nice spin though. :thumb:

recxjake
12-01-2005, 04:49 PM
Any loss of support hurts because it means more US forces will be needed to pick up the slack...

nice spin though. :thumb:

they don't do anything, how many of those troops have been killed? any??? more than 5 i doubt it..... they were just their for looks, they have done the job they needed to do... when you finish a job, you go home

Adept Havelock
12-01-2005, 04:49 PM
Heck, if W. was even one-quarter the coalition builder his Father was we'd be in a much better position now.

That's the trouble with the "my way or the highway" mindset. It Tends to alienate people....and nations.

recxjake
12-01-2005, 04:54 PM
Heck, if W. was even one-quarter the coalition builder his Father was we'd be in a much better position now.

That's the trouble with the "my way or the highway" mindset. It Tends to alienate people....and nations.

we are talking about France and Germany and Russia.....we all know they had $$$ in the Saddam regime, it's pretty clear why they didn't want to topple him

memyselfI
12-01-2005, 04:58 PM
they don't do anything, how many of those troops have been killed? any??? more than 5 i doubt it..... they were just their for looks, they have done the job they needed to do... when you finish a job, you go home

Well, since you talk a big game but don't seem to know the answers to some of your own points...

UK 103
Australia 1
Bulgaria 13
Denmark 2
El Salvador 2
Estonia 2
Hungary 1
Italy 27
Kazakhstan 1
Latvia 1
Netherlands 2
Poland 17
Slovakia 3
Spain 11
Thailand 2
Ukraine 18

http://icasualties.org/oif/

recxjake
12-01-2005, 05:00 PM
Well, since you talk a big game but don't seem to know the answers to some of your own points...

UK 103
Australia 1
Bulgaria 13
Denmark 2
El Salvador 2
Estonia 2
Hungary 1
Italy 27
Kazakhstan 1
Latvia 1
Netherlands 2
Poland 17
Slovakia 3
Spain 11
Thailand 2
Ukraine 18

http://icasualties.org/oif/

Thanks for getting these figures, and if you think about how many troops they have in Iraq vs. the number dead thats a high percentage...... still I'm not surprised at all they are leaving... the job is done for them and they should be thanked for helping build a democracy in the middle east

Adept Havelock
12-01-2005, 05:09 PM
we are talking about France and Germany and Russia.....we all know they had $$$ in the Saddam regime, it's pretty clear why they didn't want to topple him

Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of Egypt, Turkey, and Syria who contributed substantial Ground Forces to Desert Shield/Storm. More Arab/ME involvement in this coalition would have gone a long way towards easing our path. A more diplomatic administration might have been able to convince them toppling Saddam was in their own self interest.

Bush and his diplomats didn't. IMO, they barely tried.

memyselfI
12-01-2005, 05:10 PM
Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of Egypt, Turkey, and Syria who contributed substantial Ground Forces to Desert Shield/Storm. More Arab/ME involvement in this coaliton would have gone a long way towards easing our path. A more diplomatic administration might have been able to convince them toppling Saddam was in their own self interest.

Bush and his diplomats didn't. IMO, they barely tried.

And if any proof is needed one just can compare father and son's efforts.

Fox River
12-01-2005, 08:09 PM
I do not know if that is a good idea to compare the son and the father. I think that in trying not to make the same mistakes W has put himself in uneasy situations. His dad was a good President. Only time will tell how W stacks up. I think that if the Dems can take back the House and the Senate it could save his Presidency overall. It worked wonders for Clinton. I doubt that those of us who could barely stand him when he was in office would be able to miss him now that he is out of it.

penchief
12-01-2005, 08:32 PM
they don't do anything, how many of those troops have been killed? any??? more than 5 i doubt it..... they were just their for looks, they have done the job they needed to do... when you finish a job, you go home

Well isn't that what we've said all along?

The coalition of the willing..........heh.