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View Full Version : Williamson - Denver players bemoan two key calls


Guru
12-05-2005, 04:28 AM
http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_3279317

Sounds like more whining to me.

the Talking Can
12-05-2005, 04:29 AM
Broncos whining about the refs?

I'm shocked

chiefsfaninNC
12-05-2005, 04:57 AM
Now we know what ammo Vailpass and the other Donk's fans will use if they show up.

Tuckdaddy
12-05-2005, 05:10 AM
Whining bitch.

Bob Dole
12-05-2005, 05:44 AM
If anyone wants to whine about the officiating, they only need to look at the first Denver offensive series that culminated in a 66 yards screen pass aided by Warfield getting pushed down from behind.

Fairplay
12-05-2005, 05:54 AM
If the donk's aren't cheatin then they are crying about something.

Give them a pacifier and diapers then give em a swift kick back to Denver.

Mile High Mania
12-05-2005, 06:04 AM
Broncos whining about the refs?

I'm shocked

Uh, did you read some of the posts from KC fans about the refs yesterday? Anway..

I'm fine with what happned only from the aspect that it was not a 45-17 whipping. The game had a number of different leads and ties, so it was exciting and Denver played well enough to win at KC ... it just didn't happen.

KC doesn't lose many games at home. So, I was expecting it. I just wanted Denver to show they could do well on the road and they were in position to win. So, I'm fine.

They still lead the division and they have 3 of 5 nice matchups remaining.

KC has Dallas and NY coming up on the road and while their offenses aren't doing much now, the potential is there and they have two very tough defenses.

morphius
12-05-2005, 06:09 AM
The first one was a second down, we still had third down to get forward. The call on Andersons run was obvious to EVERYONE in front of a TV, when they watch it they will know.

MHM - Its sad, we go there and we get blown out recently, and every game here is close.

the Talking Can
12-05-2005, 06:09 AM
Uh, did you read some of the posts from KC fans about the refs yesterday? Anway..

I'm fine with what happned only from the aspect that it was not a 45-17 whipping. The game had a number of different leads and ties, so it was exciting and Denver played well enough to win at KC ... it just didn't happen.

KC doesn't lose many games at home. So, I was expecting it. I just wanted Denver to show they could do well on the road and they were in position to win. So, I'm fine.

They still lead the division and they have 3 of 5 nice matchups remaining.

KC has Dallas and NY coming up on the road and while their offenses aren't doing much now, the potential is there and they have two very tough defenses.

right..the articles coming our of Denver aren't about how they were "cheated" (scroll down the front page).....if you wanted to win all you had to do was convert on 4th and 1....that was all about "want-to" (to quote Roy Williams)

anyways, the Cleveland Brown DL doesn't looks so hot when our OL is healthy...that was enlightening...

KC-Chef
12-05-2005, 06:10 AM
Grats to the Chiefs though. We got out played by your Recievers plain and simple. I think Williams was scared to get physical with Jethro Gonzales and it cost us on that one T.D. because Champ had to come from behind to late. Then all day your guys were open late in the routes.

It cost us.

Was a great game though. I loved it right up to the end and I was online with the game day fans and nobody was saying that last call was bad. It was obvious we didn't get to the 48. Nice stop and again, grats on keeping your streak for home games in December going.


That said..

I turn to next week and the march to the playoffs.

GO BRONCOS!!!

Chiefs_Fan_n_64081
12-05-2005, 06:21 AM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v357/hellrazorradio/chiefs/BooHoo.jpg

Mile High Mania
12-05-2005, 07:04 AM
Converting on 4th and 1 wouldn't have resulted in a "lock" for scoring. Plummer threw the one red zone INT that was costly and the defense let LJ run all over them in the 4th quarter, they were just dismantled. The secondary had 4 or 5 plays when it looked like keystone cops out there... that sucked.

The 12th man obviously affected the defense. I think the offense had moments to take over and as much as people want to bash Jake for the 2 INTS... he had some clutch passes to Rod and Putzier when plays looked dead.

Again, it is what most should expect from a good team at home. I'm just glad that Denver (for the most part) played like a good team on the road.

Take care of business the rest of the way and they have at least 12 wins which should be good enough to win the division.

KC Jones
12-05-2005, 07:14 AM
I think the offense had moments to take over and as much as people want to bash Jake for the 2 INTS... he had some clutch passes to Rod and Putzier when plays looked dead.



Plummer really pulled a couple of gems out of his hat yesterday. If anything he kept the Broncos in the game with key plays when things were breaking down for his offense. After the DJ hit I was really hoping he'd be rattled and start lobbing the ball up for grabs, but it didn't happen. He kept his composure.

It was a classic game down to the wire. Maybe we'll see you guys again in the playoffs.

acasas4
12-05-2005, 07:18 AM
Anytime the donks and their fans are crying I'm happy. This thread brightened my monday.ROFL

jettio
12-05-2005, 07:35 AM
The call against Lynch was appropriate for the rule now in place. There is no doubt at all that there was helmet to helmet contact.

There maybe ought to be a change in the rule, but Lynch could have hit Kennison lower to still break up the pass and avoid the penalty.

Lynch learned the game under the old rules and it is understandable that it would be an adjustment for him, but the helmets clearly hit.

Demonpenz
12-05-2005, 07:39 AM
you know what would stop most of the head on head hits. If they stopped using helmets

Gaz
12-05-2005, 07:43 AM
you know what would stop most of the head on head hits. If they stopped using helmets

A fine use of Occam’s Razor, sir.

xoxo~
Gaz
Likes to see someone cut to the heart of the problem.

Cochise
12-05-2005, 07:46 AM
After what Lynch did to get the second penalty, they shouldn't be complaining about anything. He's supposed to be a veteran player - inexcusable for him to break off a bonehead move like that, still crying to the officials 2 plays later.

Lynch has built a helmet to helmet reputation for himself. It's his own damn fault. I don't know if other teams see it, but he gets one almost every time he plays KC it seems. It's not playing tough. It's not being hard-hitting. It's stupid. If he can't adjust his play to fit within the rules of the game, then it's hard to feel sorry for him. That's the rule.

Is Lynch a rookie and hasn't figured this rule out yet?


"It was almost like they looked up, saw 47, then threw the flag," Broncos cornerback Champ Bailey said. "How can you be so late on a call like that?"


Nooo... they're not crying...

Kyle401
12-05-2005, 07:54 AM
If I were a Donk fan, I would be pissed about the helmet to helmet call. That hit may have been helmet to helmet under the strictest interpretation of the rule but Kennison ducked his head in preparation for the hit he knew was coming. If he hadn't Lynch would have hit him right in the chest, where the ball would have been if Kennison had caught it, and likely caused a fumble. It was a textbook hit and even Kennison acknowledged it. On the other hand if Lynch did not have a reputation for cheap shots to the head maybe the call would have gone his way.

As to the first down reversal, donko fans should be pissed at their OL and MA, not at the refs. They got owned on that play.

Cochise
12-05-2005, 07:56 AM
Lynch could have hit him lower. He left himself open to getting a call he has a reputation for. He should know better by now.

htismaqe
12-05-2005, 09:21 AM
Lynch EARNED his rep as a helmet-to-helmet hitter. And he's too seasoned to melt down like that and tack on another 15. Fug him.

If they want to whine about refs, maybe they should whine about the block in the back on Anderson's first TD...

the Talking Can
12-05-2005, 09:27 AM
Lynch EARNED his rep as a helmet-to-helmet hitter. And he's too seasoned to melt down like that and tack on another 15. Fug him.

If they want to whine about refs, maybe they should whine about the block in the back on Anderson's first TD...

or the phantom holding call on the Green to Kennison TD pass

fan4ever
12-05-2005, 09:40 AM
I suppose I can understand whining about the helmet to helmet call; crucial part of the field to make a mistake. But to bitch about whether they made that first down or not is amazing. Even the most die-hard Donko fan would to full of crap to believe they made that first down. It was obvious to everyone, including the announcers, they were short. You got owned; deal with it.

htismaqe
12-05-2005, 09:48 AM
You mean Denver fans actually THINK they made that 1st down?

It wasn't even close. It was obvious?

morphius
12-05-2005, 09:50 AM
Lynch EARNED his rep as a helmet-to-helmet hitter. And he's too seasoned to melt down like that and tack on another 15. Fug him.

If they want to whine about refs, maybe they should whine about the block in the back on Anderson's first TD...
Or the Anderson (I think it was him) bear hug on DJ on the Plummer boot leg and slide before the goal line.

morphius
12-05-2005, 09:51 AM
Or the no-call on O PI on Rod Smith that kept warfield from catching the pass that hit him right in the numbers because Rod grabbed his arm an pulled it out of the way.

Radar Chief
12-05-2005, 09:52 AM
or the phantom holding call on the Green to Kennison TD pass

Is that the one where Dunn was actually being held by the DE that was try'n to keep him from get’n into his route, but the ref calls holding on Dunn? :spock:
Yea, Bronco’s fans have lots of room to gripe ‘bout refs. :rolleyes:

Mile High Mania
12-05-2005, 09:57 AM
There were non-calls across the board... I can live with the Lynch penalty, but his dumbassery on the next play cost them 15 yards on the following drive. That was stupid.

And, yes... I agree they didn't get the first down. It's over in my mind, I'm just glad they played well. The defense fell apart in the 4th allowing LJ to bury them. That's it in a nutshell.

the Talking Can
12-05-2005, 10:01 AM
Is that the one where Dunn was actually being held by the DE that was try'n to keep him from get’n into his route, but the ref calls holding on Dunn? :spock:
Yea, Bronco’s fans have lots of room to gripe ‘bout refs. :rolleyes:

yes, they showed a slo-mo replay of the DE's hand full of Dunn's jersey...I'm surprised Denver fans aren't upset about it, seeing how principled they are in their complaints...I expected articles to be written about it...really

AlWilsonizKING
12-05-2005, 10:16 AM
If I were a Donk fan, I would be pissed about the helmet to helmet call. That hit may have been helmet to helmet under the strictest interpretation of the rule but Kennison ducked his head in preparation for the hit he knew was coming. If he hadn't Lynch would have hit him right in the chest, where the ball would have been if Kennison had caught it, and likely caused a fumble. It was a textbook hit and even Kennison acknowledged it.


I would have to agree. Lynch was penalized and fined for the same type of hit last year....Lynch was going for the receiver's chest and since the receiver had jumped he came down and THEY hit helmet 2 helmet. I have a feeling that someday soon the NFL will start to treat receivers like they do QB's....you wont be able to hit them until they have 2 feet down and make a football move. :rolleyes:

As far as the 4th n 1 call....well yeah M.A. looked as if he didn't make it but where was the ball in all of that? When the ref came back and stated "the player never made it to the 48" I was a bit confused.....I thought it was where the ball was at bot the player.....I never saw a clear look at where the ball was at...The ref that came running in from the top of the screen looked as if he knew right where to spot it but whatever....

Either way it was a close fought game by both sides and either team had a chance to win the game......IT JUST SUCKS THAT IT HAD TO BE THE CHEFS!!!!!! Dammit!!!

And about all the whining you say we are doing.....just look at the past few post's by Chefs fans....you say we are whining, but if we would have won the game, you all would be saying "M.A. did not make the first down...blah blah this play that play.....but since you won the game it doesn't come across as whining....Just a thought.....

The march to the playoff has begun!!!!


PEACE!!!

ChiefsfaninPA
12-05-2005, 10:20 AM
Even if they would've gotten the first down, our D would've shut them down like they did the rest of the 2nd half. You Donkey fans talked a lot of spit this week and now you want to act like the refs gave us the game. We demoralized you suckers, plain and simple. Go back to your barn and lick you wounds idiot Donkey fans.

ct
12-05-2005, 10:29 AM
Well played game Bronco fans! Very pleased with our 2nd half defense holding you out of the end zone, and our offense was pretty solid, for the most part. There were plenty of mistakes on both sides though.

Somebody enlighten me, who is KC Chef?

dtebbe
12-05-2005, 10:31 AM
The helmet to helmet was a judgement call, and given Lynch's history, he's not going to get the benefit of the doubt. Earlier in the game he tried to spear LJ when he was already down on the ground, but missed. IMHO you have to sleep in the bed you make, and if you take those borderline shots, you are not going to be the benefit of the doubt when there's a history there.

On the first down, anyone who argues that call is a hopeless Bronco homer. It wasn't even close.

As far as the holding non-calls those were going both ways. There were a few times denver's o-line was playing ring-around-the-rosey with our rushers and never got a flag.

DT

FringeNC
12-05-2005, 10:32 AM
or the phantom holding call on the Green to Kennison TD pass

Yeah, that one really pissed me off.

htismaqe
12-05-2005, 10:48 AM
I would have to agree. Lynch was penalized and fined for the same type of hit last year....Lynch was going for the receiver's chest and since the receiver had jumped he came down and THEY hit helmet 2 helmet. I have a feeling that someday soon the NFL will start to treat receivers like they do QB's....you wont be able to hit them until they have 2 feet down and make a football move. :rolleyes:

As far as the 4th n 1 call....well yeah M.A. looked as if he didn't make it but where was the ball in all of that? When the ref came back and stated "the player never made it to the 48" I was a bit confused.....I thought it was where the ball was at bot the player.....I never saw a clear look at where the ball was at...The ref that came running in from the top of the screen looked as if he knew right where to spot it but whatever....

Either way it was a close fought game by both sides and either team had a chance to win the game......IT JUST SUCKS THAT IT HAD TO BE THE CHEFS!!!!!! Dammit!!!

And about all the whining you say we are doing.....just look at the past few post's by Chefs fans....you say we are whining, but if we would have won the game, you all would be saying "M.A. did not make the first down...blah blah this play that play.....but since you won the game it doesn't come across as whining....Just a thought.....

The march to the playoff has begun!!!!

PEACE!!!

The ball was cradled in his chest when he went down. The ball was BEHIND his helmet, which landed on the 48. It was pretty clear when you saw it from the near-side camera. Anderson reached from the bottom of the pile, after he was down, and that's where the ref initially spotted the ball.

ct
12-05-2005, 10:49 AM
Or the no-call on O PI on Rod Smith that kept warfield from catching the pass that hit him right in the numbers because Rod grabbed his arm an pulled it out of the way.

Or the no-call on D PI on Warfield on the same play. Those 2 negated each other IMO.

The helmet to helmet was a penalty according to the rules, but even I questioned that call at the time. It's not so much the rule definition, as it showed on replay that it was in fact h2h, but the complete inconsistency with which the refs call or don't call this penalty that irritates me.

I saw several blown calls, the block in the back of Warfield on Anderson's TD, the Warfield PI and Rod Smith PI, non-call or phantom holding calls both ways. It sure seemed to go both ways, though.

vailpass
12-05-2005, 10:51 AM
If I were a Donk fan, I would be pissed about the helmet to helmet call. That hit may have been helmet to helmet under the strictest interpretation of the rule but Kennison ducked his head in preparation for the hit he knew was coming. If he hadn't Lynch would have hit him right in the chest, where the ball would have been if Kennison had caught it, and likely caused a fumble. It was a textbook hit and even Kennison acknowledged it. On the other hand if Lynch did not have a reputation for cheap shots to the head maybe the call would have gone his way.

Absolutely.

As to the first down reversal, donko fans should be pissed at their OL and MA, not at the refs. They got owned on that play.
No Doubt.




:clap: I second every word you just said here.

AlWilsonizKING
12-06-2005, 07:44 AM
The helmet to helmet was a penalty according to the rules, but even I questioned that call at the time. It's not so much the rule definition, as it showed on replay that it was in fact h2h, but the complete inconsistency with which the refs call or don't call this penalty that irritates me.



Mike Shannahan played a video of the hit to reporters yesterday that CLEARLY SHOWED John Lynch LEADING WITH and HITTING Kennision with HIS SHOULDER!!!! WITH HIS SHOULDER!!! IT WAS NOT A HELMET 2 HELMET HIT!!! Though I totally agree with you about the inconsistency of the refs calls.....a few games throught the league have been decided this year over blown calls....uncalled for.



PEACE!!!

KCTitus
12-06-2005, 07:45 AM
Mike Shannahan played a video of the hit to reporters yesterday that CLEARLY SHOWED John Lynch LEADING WITH and HITTING Kennision with HIS SHOULDER!!!! WITH HIS SHOULDER!!! IT WAS NOT A HELMET 2 HELMET HIT!!! Though I totally agree with you about the inconsistency of the refs calls.....a few games throught the league have been decided this year over blown calls....uncalled for.



PEACE!!!

Want any more cheese with that whine?

Douche Baggins
12-06-2005, 07:47 AM
Helmet to helmet or not, Kennison was a defenseless player...that was my issue with it.

AlWilsonizKING
12-06-2005, 07:48 AM
Helmet to helmet or not, Kennison was a defenseless player...that was my issue with it.


Is that why he tapped John on the helmet and told him NICE HIT?!?!?!?



PEACE!!!

King_Chief_Fan
12-06-2005, 08:01 AM
Is that why he tapped John on the helmet and told him NICE HIT?!?!?!?



PEACE!!!

nope, he tapped him on the helmet and said.....you did it again dumb ass, here comes the flag and the fine

Gaz
12-06-2005, 08:03 AM
nope, he tapped him on the helmet and said.....you did it again dumb ass, here comes the flag and the fine

Heh.

xoxo~
Gaz
Enjoying Broncos whining more than is decent.

philfree
12-06-2005, 08:08 AM
They had plenty of time to come back and win the game after that but the Chiefs D shut them down. Besides the blatant holding on a second down play where the donks got a 1st down and later scored was just as huge. It all came out in the wash and the Chiefs won. Nuff said!

PhilFree:arrow: