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tk13
12-12-2005, 02:16 AM
http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/sports/football/nfl/kansas_city_chiefs/13386337.htm

Blame rests with L.J.’s olé
JASON WHITLOCK
Kansas City Star

IRVING, Texas — If Sunday’s heartbreaking 31-28 loss to Dallas prevents the Chiefs from making the playoffs, it’s Larry Johnson’s fault.

Maybe you spent Sunday night cussing kicker Lawrence Tynes and long snapper Ed Perry for botching a would-be game-tying 41-yard field goal. Or maybe you’re mad at the officiating crew that properly flagged Derrick Johnson for holding (and mistakenly identified Greg Wesley as the culprit) on a critical fourth-down play in the game’s final minute. Or maybe you spent the evening lamenting KC’s bad luck, wondering how Patrick Surtain dropped an easy pick-6 interception.

Your angst and sorrow are misguided.

The Chiefs didn’t blow Sunday’s game in the fourth quarter. They lost the game, and perhaps ruined their season, just before halftime when Larry Johnson declined an opportunity to block Dallas linebacker Scott Fujita.

On second and goal at the Dallas 9, Fujita, the former Chief, sashayed right past Johnson as he flopped on the ground like a fish out of water. Fujita then barreled into quarterback Trent Green, separating KC’s QB from the football. Dallas’ Marcus Spears scooped up the ball and ran 59 yards, setting up the Cowboys at the KC 26 with 1 minute, 2 seconds left in the half. Drew Bledsoe hit tight end Jason Witten with a 26-yard TD pass, completing the good-old-fashioned game-turning 14-point swing.

When L.J. whiffed, the Chiefs were up 14-10 and about to tack on a touchdown, or at least a field goal. Instead, the Cowboys went into the halftime locker room ahead 17-14.

On the road, against a good team, when you’re in a tight playoff race, when your remaining schedule consists of playoff-caliber opponents, it’s criminal for a player to give an effort that weak on such an important play.

It’s selfish. It’s immature. It’s classic Randy Moss.

The play perfectly crystallizes (justifies) why Dick Vermeil and Al Saunders were reluctant to put their trust in Larry Johnson. And let me be clear: I have no problem with Saunders choosing to throw the ball in that situation. Saunders called a beautiful game and did an excellent job of keeping the Cowboys’ defense off balance.

Nope. The only problem was Johnson’s flop.

“When they don’t block you real well, you should get to the quarterback,” Fujita said of his big play.

Johnson is a marvelous talent. But it’s perfectly fair to question whether Johnson is a winner. Johnson is great when you hand him the football, when it’s time for him to pile up yards and improve his leverage for a reworked contract. Johnson rushed for 143 yards and three touchdowns on Sunday. He set a Chiefs record for consecutive 100-yard games, cracking triple digits for the sixth straight game.

But Johnson’s half-hearted and soft pass-blocking effort undermined Kansas City’s offensive attack. It wasn’t just that one critical play. The Cowboys ran over and around Johnson every time he was asked to block.

“We were looking for opportunities to go one on one with their backs,” Fujita said diplomatically.

Kansas City fullback Tony Richardson might be the best blocking back in football. It’s difficult to believe that Dallas’ linebackers were looking for opportunities to go one-on-one with Richardson. By the fourth quarter, the Chiefs’ coaching staff acknowledged Johnson’s lack of toughness and put him on the sideline in obvious passing situations.

Embarrassing. Johnson has whined and rebelled and complained for three years. I thought some of his complaints were legitimate. Sunday, he looked like a running back who needed to take his diapers off. By refusing to cowboy-up and take on Fujita or any rusher, Johnson sold out his teammates. The Chiefs were reduced to playing training-camp-cut casualty Dee Brown in passing situations.

Of course, after the game Johnson declined to talk.

Vermeil wouldn’t elaborate on the sack and fumble, saying he’d like to look at game film.

“We’d like to block that guy,” Vermeil said.

Running-backs coach James Saxon declined to comment.

Yeah, the Chiefs have to handle Johnson with kid gloves now. The Chiefs have no idea whether their other special-needs running back, Priest Holmes, will choose to play again. Johnson has all the power. Like his predecessor, he can do whatever he wants.

Priest didn’t like to practice, communicate or honor a contract he deemed unfair. But when Priest was on the field, you could never question his courage, effort or willingness to sacrifice for his teammates.

Johnson’s play Sunday raised all sorts of questions.

Guru
12-12-2005, 02:18 AM
Gee, I seem to remember whitlock singing LJs praises in the past. Here is your bandwagoner.

BigMeatballDave
12-12-2005, 02:21 AM
Big Sexy is a big dipshit. WTF would we be doing for a RB if we had no LJ? ****ing retard!

beer bacon
12-12-2005, 02:21 AM
Johnson does not have a "lack of toughness." You want to call him a shitty blocker? Fine. He is a downright horrible blocker at times, but a guy that runs with his power and intensity does not have a lack of toughness.

Mecca
12-12-2005, 02:23 AM
That's awesome, our whole team did things to lose this game. He calls out LJ........sometimes I wish Whitlock would just get the **** out of here. This column is so offbase.

Maybe he should write an article about how Surtain is why we lost since he dropped the INT. Oh yea he's not gonna call out Surtain because he hasn't had an odd relationship with the fans,

Whitlock is just trying to stir up the LJ haters to come out again because he wants a good media story more than anything.

Demonpenz
12-12-2005, 02:24 AM
Johnson does not have a "lack of toughness." You want to call him a shitty blocker? Fine. He is a downright horrible blocker at times, but a guy that runs with his power and intensity does not have a lack of toughness.


I don't think we have seen how tough he is. He still has fresh legs and hardly gets touched before he is in full stride.

tk13
12-12-2005, 02:26 AM
Yeah, I don't know about all this Randy Moss stuff. I think LJ actually wants to be a good pass blocker, I don't know why he wouldn't want to be, really he to be good at it if he wants big money someday. He's still obviously got work to do in that area though, he got abused a couple times. I'd agree that was definitely the momentum swinging play, but hopefully all this will help him focus on his blocking and get better at it.

Count Alex's Losses
12-12-2005, 02:27 AM
Whatever. That one play hurt but didn't decide the game.

Priest wouldn't have cracked 100 against a lethal D like the Cowboys have.

tk13
12-12-2005, 02:29 AM
Whatever. That one play hurt but didn't decide the game.

Priest wouldn't have cracked 100 against a lethal D like the Cowboys have.
I don't think it decided the game, but it could've. Going into halftime up 21-10 would've been huge. Heckuva lot better than being down 3. That was the only play that was a direct 14 point swing.

Guru
12-12-2005, 02:29 AM
FatlockFatlockdumbass

BigMeatballDave
12-12-2005, 02:29 AM
How is it LJs fault that the D couldn't hold the lead in crunchtime?

Mecca
12-12-2005, 02:31 AM
It's Johnsons fault cause he thinks he can stir up some drama with it. Because of how Johnson is percieved by some fans in this town. This is just like 810 trying to stir the shit pot. The media in this town is going to continue to try to do things like this.

chefsos
12-12-2005, 02:33 AM
All you KC Star writers: Stop doing this to me! Gawd!

*sigh*

OK, I'll entertain myself.

[BigSexy] Hey, LJ, I always knew you were the shit. How about that interview now? You know you're my boy.

[LJ] Hm. Security? Clear my path of this.

Taco John
12-12-2005, 02:35 AM
This article is pretty transparent... Whitlock simply wants to rub your noses in the fact that Dallas is getting more out of Fujita and Spears than KC was able to. The LJ bit is just the diversion for that point.

Count Alex's Losses
12-12-2005, 02:37 AM
Christ almighty, he just piled up 171 total yards and 3 touchdowns.

Yeah, he lost the game. :rolleyes:

Count Alex's Losses
12-12-2005, 02:38 AM
This article is pretty transparent... Whitlock simply wants to rub your noses in the fact that Dallas is getting more out of Fujita and Spears than KC was able to. The LJ bit is just the diversion for that point.

Spears is a rookie. He's not our spears.

And Fujita hasn't really done shit in Dallas. That sack was the first notable thing he did all year.

Mecca
12-12-2005, 02:38 AM
This article is pretty transparent... Whitlock simply wants to rub your noses in the fact that Dallas is getting more out of Fujita and Spears than KC was able to. The LJ bit is just the diversion for that point.

That's a diferent Marcus Spears than the one that once played for the Chiefs......so what you said is sorta flawed.

Taco John
12-12-2005, 02:42 AM
ah... ok, my bad. I just saw those two names and thought I saw an ulterior motive.

Even the Amazing Taco Kreskin can get it wrong...

BigRock
12-12-2005, 02:48 AM
We can talk about LJ's yards all day, but I don't think Whitlock's point can be entirely written off. For everything you can say about his motives in writing this, he didn't make up that quote from Fujita. And that means other teams have noticed something there.

Count Alex's Losses
12-12-2005, 02:50 AM
Sorry...you don't blame ANYONE on the offense when it racks up 500 yards and 28 points ON THE ROAD against one of the toughest defenses in the league.

Count Alex's Losses
12-12-2005, 02:53 AM
BTW Taco, you need to recant on your "The Chiefs are weak at tight end" bullshit. Gonzalez had 94 yards against one of the top TE-defending defenses today.

tk13
12-12-2005, 02:54 AM
Sorry...you don't blame ANYONE on the offense when it racks up 500 yards and 28 points ON THE ROAD against one of the toughest defenses in the league.
That was a 14 point swing, gochiefs. 14 points. We lost by 3. That is not rocket science math. Could we have done other things to help make up for it? Heck yeah. But that doesn't mean we should just turn our head and ignore some of the things we did wrong. Specifically something like that, because it wasn't a freak play, it's something that other teams are looking to exploit and MUST be fixed. We gotta be able to put LJ on the field on 3rd down. He's our most dangerous weapon.

chefsos
12-12-2005, 02:56 AM
Gretz was talking about that play on the radio broadcast, and I swear I could hear him hopping up and down while blaming the coaches for the fact that T-Rich wasn't in there.

Count Alex's Losses
12-12-2005, 02:57 AM
That was a 14 point swing, gochiefs. 14 points. We lost by 3. That is not rocket science math. Could we have done other things to help make up for it? Heck yeah. But that doesn't mean we should just turn our head and ignore some of the things we did wrong. Specifically something like that, because it wasn't a freak play, it's something that other teams are looking to exploit and MUST be fixed. We gotta be able to put LJ on the field on 3rd down. He's our most dangerous weapon.

I'm not ignoring it. It contributed to the loss.

But it wasn't the sole reason for it, and that is what Whitlock is saying.

Not everyone can be as perfect as Priest Holmes. :rolleyes:

None of this would matter if we had a defense worth a poop.

Mecca
12-12-2005, 02:57 AM
That was a 14 point swing, gochiefs. 14 points. We lost by 3. That is not rocket science math. Could we have done other things to help make up for it? Heck yeah. But that doesn't mean we should just turn our head and ignore some of the things we did wrong. Specifically something like that, because it wasn't a freak play, it's something that other teams are looking to exploit and MUST be fixed. We gotta be able to put LJ on the field on 3rd down. He's our most dangerous weapon.

Well in that case, I guess we should jump all over Surtain. His play was also a 14 point swing.

Demonpenz
12-12-2005, 02:57 AM
you figured in a big situation johnson would ask for a breather

Fruit Ninja
12-12-2005, 02:59 AM
This whole game was filled with if's. We lost this game on a few different plays.

LJ 1. Surtain. 2. Dj'holding 3. Tynes missed field Goal 4. All that added up to the loss.

Taco John
12-12-2005, 03:02 AM
BTW Taco, you need to recant on your "The Chiefs are weak at tight end" bullshit. Gonzalez had 94 yards against one of the top TE-defending defenses today.



Eh... Not so much. Tony might have had a good game today, but he's not even a top ten tight end any more... Antonio Gates, Jeremy Shockey, Heath Miller, Alge Crumpler, Randy McMichael, Mike Sellers, Todd Heap, Chris Cooley, LJ Smith and Jason Witten have all been more effective than Tony Gonzalez this year... So Tony is 11th then right? Again, not so much... Dallas Clark, Ben Watson, Ben Troupe, Courtney Anderson Daniel Graham... They've all been more effective too.

Tony Gonzalez enjoys company with names like Erron Kinney, Jarramy Stevens, Marcus Pollard, and Steve Heiden. He's definitely a top 20 TE still. Potentially top 15 by the time the season is done.

tk13
12-12-2005, 03:04 AM
Well in that case, I guess we should jump all over Surtain. His play was also a 14 point swing.
You wouldn't find any disagreement with me. We could've put the game away with either play. I think the LJ play was the biggest momentum swing though, because we'd totally dominated them up to that point. From that point in the game on we played pretty evenly.

Count Alex's Losses
12-12-2005, 03:05 AM
Eh... Not so much. Tony might have had a good game today, but he's not even a top ten tight end any more... Antonio Gates, Jeremy Shockey, Heath Miller, Alge Crumpler, Randy McMichael, Mike Sellers, Todd Heap, Chris Cooley, LJ Smith and Jason Witten have all been more effective than Tony Gonzalez this year... So Tony is 11th then right? Again, not so much... Dallas Clark, Ben Watson, Ben Troupe, Courtney Anderson Daniel Graham... They've all been more effective too.

Tony Gonzalez enjoys company with names like Erron Kinney, Jarramy Stevens, Marcus Pollard, and Steve Heiden. He's definitely a top 20 TE still. Potentially top 15 by the time the season is done.

Mike Sellers? ROFL

Now you are just trying to get my goat.

The fact is, Gonzalez is having a fine season, and he'd be #1 or #2 in yards if our offensive line hadn't been so shaky in midseason.

Count Alex's Losses
12-12-2005, 03:06 AM
Dallas Clark has 29 catches. ROFL

Why did you leave off Jeb?

Taco John
12-12-2005, 03:06 AM
Mike Sellers? ROFL

Now you are just trying to get my goat.

The fact is, Gonzalez is having a fine season, and he'd be #1 or #2 in yards if our offensive line hadn't been so shaky in midseason.



Mike Sellars has 5 TDs this season. Tony has 2?

Count Alex's Losses
12-12-2005, 03:07 AM
Mike Sellars has 5 TDs this season. Tony has 2?

I'm sure Mike Sellers is drawing massive attention in the redzone, too.

KChiefsQT
12-12-2005, 03:25 AM
Yes... Whitlock once again proves his stupidity. Riiiiight, It's LJ's fault. Maybe we should bench him and let Dee Brown start. ****ing moron.

the Talking Can
12-12-2005, 05:33 AM
hezeus christ...Blame LJ for Gun and the defense laying down...brilliant...

the only person in the NFL who can stop LJ is AS...run the ball, you dipshit...

TOUCHDOWN!!! KC
12-12-2005, 06:36 AM
Personally I believe it was a team effort to lose this game. The D did lay down... where where the blitzes on a classic pocket passer? If Gretz is jumping up and down that T-rich should of been in there, and LJ was then bye all means a running back making milleeens of dollars should be able to block a linebacker. Surtain should of had 6 points. DJ's holding was a linebacker doing what a rookie linebacker does under pressure. Tynes missed fg... yeah he's one of the best in the league.

Like I say this was a team effort in losing this game. You could even blame Gun for being skeered to blitz the crap outta Drew.

All I know is thanx too the Fins and Indy, Jax and SD lost so that keeps things close for our chances to make the playoffs....

Lets not try and blame individuals cuz this was a team effert to lose this game....

siberian khatru
12-12-2005, 07:08 AM
This is all about Whitlock salivating at:

1. The prospects of a LJ vs. Priest controversy next year;

2. The prospects of an LJ vs. King Carl contract squabble in the near future;

3. The prospects of gobbling a plate of Gates.

Whitlock thinks LJ's volatile, so he's tossing around lit matches hoping something will ignite.

Inspector
12-12-2005, 07:08 AM
Many get a piece of the blame for this one. It was a team loss.

Braincase
12-12-2005, 07:13 AM
Eh... Not so much. Tony might have had a good game today, but he's not even a top ten tight end any more... Antonio Gates, Jeremy Shockey, Heath Miller, Alge Crumpler, Randy McMichael, Mike Sellers, Todd Heap, Chris Cooley, LJ Smith and Jason Witten have all been more effective than Tony Gonzalez this year... So Tony is 11th then right? Again, not so much... Dallas Clark, Ben Watson, Ben Troupe, Courtney Anderson Daniel Graham... They've all been more effective too.

Tony Gonzalez enjoys company with names like Erron Kinney, Jarramy Stevens, Marcus Pollard, and Steve Heiden. He's definitely a top 20 TE still. Potentially top 15 by the time the season is done.

Taco, sometimes you're just plain-old, unadulterated stupid.

mlyonsd
12-12-2005, 07:37 AM
Whitlock is a complete POS. Those of you in KC should case his favorite BBQ joint and tar and feather him when he shows up. You won't have to wait long.

Arrowhead Nation
12-12-2005, 08:03 AM
I agree with Whitlock here.......I said teh same thing last night. Its a different game if we are up 10 or more @ 1/2.

Its not the SOLE reason, but its the BIGGEST reason, as it changed momentum. That point is obvious.

Otter
12-12-2005, 08:07 AM
Let's take a look at the respones to Whitlocks Articles on this board when he writes up somthing like his "Top 10 Truths" as compared to when he ruffles some feathers and writes somthing he knows will be controversial.



http://www.nmm.ac.uk/upload/img/104351-JC-NT.jpg

Duck Dog
12-12-2005, 08:16 AM
Whitlocks an idiot. That one play was no more important than Surtains dropped INT, or DJ's hold in the end zone, or what's his **** who can't long snap.

chagrin
12-12-2005, 08:20 AM
Fatlock Fatlock Fatlock

I'm just glad I didn't see his deer in the headlights hazed over face on The Sports Reporters Sunday

Duck Dog
12-12-2005, 08:21 AM
Eh... Not so much. Tony might have had a good game today, but he's not even a top ten tight end any more... Antonio Gates, Jeremy Shockey, Heath Miller, Alge Crumpler, Randy McMichael, Mike Sellers, Todd Heap, Chris Cooley, LJ Smith and Jason Witten have all been more effective than Tony Gonzalez this year... So Tony is 11th then right? Again, not so much... Dallas Clark, Ben Watson, Ben Troupe, Courtney Anderson Daniel Graham... They've all been more effective too.

Tony Gonzalez enjoys company with names like Erron Kinney, Jarramy Stevens, Marcus Pollard, and Steve Heiden. He's definitely a top 20 TE still. Potentially top 15 by the time the season is done.

Don't be 'that' guy. You should have at least looked at some stats. TG is only second to Gates in catches, and 4th in yardage. And only one other TE in the league, Gates, has D's game planning him as often as they do TG.

You're smarter than this drunkin' drivel, dude.

htismaqe
12-12-2005, 08:24 AM
Anybody that thinks any ONE play in the 2nd quarter is what lost a game is just plain stupid.

It's like Bronco fans bitching about blocks in the back when they had multiple opportunities to score AFTER that return.

It's quite simple. Dallas was PERFECT on 3rd down in the 4th quarter. Go ahead and blame LJ, and we'll continue to ignore the real problem, just like we have for the last 5 years.

Lonewolf Ed
12-12-2005, 08:35 AM
Whatever. That one play hurt but didn't decide the game.

Priest wouldn't have cracked 100 against a lethal D like the Cowboys have.

Very true. I was listening to the radio and had the TV volume on zero, so I heard Len Dawson praise Larry Johnson on some plays where he did block a defender, and once it was crucial in giving Trent time to complete a pass on 3rd down. How can Whitlock compare Larry's blocking ability to T-Rich's? Has Tony been an excellent blocker since his first training camp or did he develop into what he is today after he became a starter? Surtain has twice as many career INTs as Johnson has TDs, so I put the missed INT that should have gone for a TD on the top of the list of reasons why KC lost. I don't see a Whitlock tirade over that.

mlyonsd
12-12-2005, 08:35 AM
It's fine if Whitlock wants to point out LJ missed a block. It goes over the line when he blames the entire loss on it.

Like others have already said, Whitlock's a dumbass.

htismaqe
12-12-2005, 08:39 AM
The TV announcers praised Larry several times for the way he blocked Demarcus Ware 1-on-1.

The play in question was a BLITZ. I don't have it on DVR, but I'm guessing that what we're seeing here is the same thing we saw in the Buffalo game -- people want to blame LJ, but in reality the Cowboys had more guys coming than we had blockers...

wutamess
12-12-2005, 08:43 AM
Am I the only one that agree with Witlock?

I've been THE #1 LJ endorser this entire year but LJ swung the shit out of this game. Game Dallas the momentum and everything. LJ just looked plaine horrbile in pass blocking (doesn't get low enough) all freaking game.

Of course Warfields pick 6 would've opened the game last week and it wouldn't have nearly been as close last week and Surtain did the same exact thing yesterday. But to not place the blame on LJ that's just dumb.

LJ does everything he wants to do and goes all out for himself to, "break it" for the long runs. Why not do it for the entire team and get better at pass blocking too? I know I'm going to get flamed for this but that play was just fuccing rediculous.

My dad called me and asked me why in the hell is AS calling a passing play anyways... Can't blame AS on that one... I thought he called an excellent game also. That one totally fell on LJ's whiff.

Now I see what DV was saying as to why Priest was the starter and not LJ... LJ apperantly still has a lot to learn.

Before you flame away.... I've been saying LJ should be the starter over Priest since training camp and was pissed as hell about the 2-1 rotation when obviously LJ was the better back.

Anyhow, I'm ready to eat my crow on that one.

And if you still doubt that LJ lost the game... think if we were Denver and DJ got pass Mike Anderon & hit Plummer for a fumble to swing the game like that. Then think about this isn't the first time Mike Anderson has let that happen.

Think objectively here folks... It's LJ's fault.

MOhillbilly
12-12-2005, 08:45 AM
LJ did get crushed one time i seen - but why were KC throwing the ball in the red?:mad:

Reminds me of why kevin gilbride isnt an OC.


they showed o pic of dude longsnapper on the sidelines and thats when abit of doubt set in.

bottomline KC has more talent that Dallas - KC just got out coached.

htismaqe
12-12-2005, 08:54 AM
Am I the only one that agree with Witlock?

I've been THE #1 LJ endorser this entire year but LJ swung the shit out of this game. Game Dallas the momentum and everything. LJ just looked plaine horrbile in pass blocking (doesn't get low enough) all freaking game.

Of course Warfields pick 6 would've opened the game last week and it wouldn't have nearly been as close last week and Surtain did the same exact thing yesterday. But to not place the blame on LJ that's just dumb.

LJ does everything he wants to do and goes all out for himself to, "break it" for the long runs. Why not do it for the entire team and get better at pass blocking too? I know I'm going to get flamed for this but that play was just fuccing rediculous.

My dad called me and asked me why in the hell is AS calling a passing play anyways... Can't blame AS on that one... I thought he called an excellent game also. That one totally fell on LJ's whiff.

Now I see what DV was saying as to why Priest was the starter and not LJ... LJ apperantly still has a lot to learn.

Before you flame away.... I've been saying LJ should be the starter over Priest since training camp and was pissed as hell about the 2-1 rotation when obviously LJ was the better back.

Anyhow, I'm ready to eat my crow on that one.

And if you still doubt that LJ lost the game... think if we were Denver and DJ got pass Mike Anderon & hit Plummer for a fumble to swing the game like that. Then think about this isn't the first time Mike Anderson has let that happen.

Think objectively here folks... It's LJ's fault.

We are thining objectively. There were more than THIRTY minutes left in the game after that play.

Blaming it on LJ is pure bush...

Wile_E_Coyote
12-12-2005, 09:01 AM
speaking of Gonzo, blocking was something he had to learn. Hopefully LJ will grow into it as well

the Talking Can
12-12-2005, 09:06 AM
the first sentence by Whitlock is unexcusable...seriously...it's as dumb as baby lee blaming the game on Green...and that is reaaaaaalllly freaking stupid...

CoMoChief
12-12-2005, 09:08 AM
Whitlock saying that he is "OK" with Al Saunders calling that passing play while we are on the 9 yard line with 1:20 to go after calling a TO clearly makes me believe that he doesn't know shit. I dunno of anyone who agreed with DV calling that TO at the end of the first half to stop the clock. Call a timeout is fine after you have milked the clock a little bit, but not the way DV did it.

ChiTown
12-12-2005, 09:22 AM
It's fine if Whitlock wants to point out LJ missed a block. It goes over the line when he blames the entire loss on it.

Like others have already said, Whitlock's a dumbass.

This loss has a lot of blame.

1. Offense wasn't nearly as effective as it could have been. The play calling during parts of the game was fn mystifying.

2. The defense leaked like a sieve when they HAD to make stops, especially in the 4th qtr.

3. ST's we're marginal at best. The missed kick obviously hurt (no $hit)

4. At least 3 Drops by Kennison. Two on the opening drive.

5. The OL looked tired at times. The pocket seemed to crumble quite a bit yesterday.

6. Knight doesn't turn his GD:cuss: head around on the TD right before Halftime. The fn ball whizzed right above his earhole.

7. MAKE A GD CRITICAL 3RD DOWN STOP DEFENSE!!!!!!! Seemed like the Dallas O made every big 3rd conversion yesterday. Very frustrating to watch.

8. LJ's blocking, or lack thereof didn't go unnoticed. But there was other whiffing as well. We whiffed big-time, especially in the first half against their running up the middle and short dump passes. DJ and Kawicka looked stupid at times. Whitten made us look silly at times (That was his best gane of the year).

There was plenty of blame to go around yesterday.

FringeNC
12-12-2005, 09:34 AM
Well, if LJ really is a terrible blocker, Saunders and Solari have done a great job minimizing his damage. 500 yards and 28 points. 350 yards passing.

Rain Man
12-12-2005, 09:35 AM
Larry Johnson is one a top-notch running back, but until he learns to block he's not going to be in the top tier of the league.

I agree that you can't blame the whole loss on him, but nonetheless his overtly lame effort to support his teammates led to a 14-point swing. If he was running the ball himself, he would've been putting in more effort on that play.

MOhillbilly
12-12-2005, 09:53 AM
ROFL

thebrad84
12-12-2005, 10:26 AM
Larry Johnson is one a top-notch running back, but until he learns to block he's not going to be in the top tier of the league.

I agree that you can't blame the whole loss on him, but nonetheless his overtly lame effort to support his teammates led to a 14-point swing. If he was running the ball himself, he would've been putting in more effort on that play.

That is EXACTLY what Whitlock is trying to point out here. That's why he is comparing LJ with Randy Moss. Randy Moss plays at about 50% when he knows the play isnt going to him. He jogs, he blocks half-a$$. That is what LJ did ALL DAY YESTERDAY. 3 different times (that I saw) when he was trying to block his man, he met him and got absolutely bulldosed...well, one time the o-so-elusive scott fujita went right around him...so 2 times he got bulldosed, another he didn't even touch his man. Why? Is it because he doesn't know how to block? BS! You can't tell me that a guy who played 4 years at Penn State didn't learn how to block. You can't tell me a guy who's played 3 years in the NFL hasn't learned how to block a rusher yet. No, the problem is that he Randy Mossed us. He knows the play isn't going to him, so he simply doesn't care what happens. The effort he put in at trying to block fujita on that play was horiffic. Infact, I'm not even sure its fair to say the word "effort" when describing that play, unless you say "lack of" or "no" right before using the word.

The point whitlock is trying to make is this. Yes, there were many other things that went wrong in the game that could have given us a victory. But there was only ONE THING in this game where a lack of effort was the reason the big play went against us. Our defense has played with amazing effort all year. So to say they gave up those 3rd down plays because of a lack of effort would be ridiculous. Surtain's dropped INT was not because of a lack of effort either. The ball was tipped and it threw him off that split second causing him to misread the ball. Catchable, yes...but he didn't drop it because of a lack of effort. Lawrence Tines missed a crucial field goal late. Was it his fault, a bad snap...who knows. But no one can say our snapper nor Tines had a lack of effort on that play. I'm sure Tines wanted to make that kick more than any one in the world at that moment.

So where are we at? Ohh yeah, the ol' crucial missed block on fujita late in the 2nd quarter. We were looking to go up 21 to 10 right before half. We'd have control of the football game. Instead, we all know what happened. But its why it happened that some of us are failing to see. The play wasn't going to LJ, so what did he do? Nothing. He let his man go right around him with no effort at all. It was his lack of effort that led to that play unfolding the way it did and leading to a 14 point swing. AND that's what seperates that play from the rest of those crucial plays that "cost" us the game. AND that's why that play is "bigger" than any of those other ones. AND that's why Whitlock is singling out LJ.

htismaqe
12-12-2005, 10:30 AM
He jogs, he blocks half-a$$. That is what LJ did ALL DAY YESTERDAY.

Complete and utter bullshit.

Cochise
12-12-2005, 10:31 AM
This is the dumbest Whitlock column ever. And that's saying something.

Rain Man
12-12-2005, 10:44 AM
So where are we at? Ohh yeah, the ol' crucial missed block on fujita late in the 2nd quarter. We were looking to go up 21 to 10 right before half. We'd have control of the football game. Instead, we all know what happened. But its why it happened that some of us are failing to see. The play wasn't going to LJ, so what did he do? Nothing. He let his man go right around him with no effort at all. It was his lack of effort that led to that play unfolding the way it did and leading to a 14 point swing. AND that's what seperates that play from the rest of those crucial plays that "cost" us the game. AND that's why that play is "bigger" than any of those other ones. AND that's why Whitlock is singling out LJ.

I think this is very valid. The key question is whether LJ has the heart to play when he isn't the center of attention, or whether he's just been the ball carrier for so long that he's never had to learn how to block. Either way, the problem is solvable. The guy weighs 230 pounds - it's not like he's a 170-lb. scatback who can't stop a linebacker.

htismaqe
12-12-2005, 10:47 AM
I think this is very valid. The key question is whether LJ has the heart to play when he isn't the center of attention, or whether he's just been the ball carrier for so long that he's never had to learn how to block. Either way, the problem is solvable. The guy weighs 230 pounds - it's not like he's a 170-lb. scatback who can't stop a linebacker.

It's not valid. Every coach he's ever had, including ones that were critical (Vermeil), have said that the guy has the heart and desire. He wasn't asked to block often at Penn State. He ran the ball alot, and when he wasn't running the ball, he was catching it. Here, he's trying to learn a complex scheme that has THOUSANDS of plays, despite the fact that he was inactive for a year and a half.

Alot of criticisms of LJ are very valid. The idea that he has no heart, or doesn't give 100% when he isn't the center of attention, is pure bunk.

MOhillbilly
12-12-2005, 10:49 AM
If he can learn to be patient and wait for blocks.
LJ can learn to set his feet and lower his pads.



I still think LJ will be the best RB KC has ever fielded.


And those who think he has no heart are FOS.....If you wanna blame someone blame DV for deactivating him..

MOhillbilly
12-12-2005, 10:50 AM
It's not valid. Every coach he's ever had, including ones that were critical (Vermeil), have said that the guy has the heart and desire. He wasn't asked to block often at Penn State. He ran the ball alot, and when he wasn't running the ball, he was catching it. Here, he's trying to learn a complex scheme that has THOUSANDS of plays, despite the fact that he was inactive for a year and a half.

Alot of criticisms of LJ are very valid. The idea that he has no heart, or doesn't give 100% when he isn't the center of attention, is pure bunk.


:)what he said...:p

Rain Man
12-12-2005, 10:51 AM
It's not valid. Every coach he's ever had, including ones that were critical (Vermeil), have said that the guy has the heart and desire. He wasn't asked to block often at Penn State. He ran the ball alot, and when he wasn't running the ball, he was catching it. Here, he's trying to learn a complex scheme that has THOUSANDS of plays, despite the fact that he was inactive for a year and a half.

Alot of criticisms of LJ are very valid. The idea that he has no heart, or doesn't give 100% when he isn't the center of attention, is pure bunk.

So you're in the "never learned blocking" camp then. That's fine. It'd sure be nice if he learned soon, though. Here's hoping that they move him into Tony Richardson's house in the offseason.

You'd think that being pulled off the field in passing downs would be a good incentive to hit the blocking sled a lot this offseason.

htismaqe
12-12-2005, 10:56 AM
So you're in the "never learned blocking" camp then. That's fine. It'd sure be nice if he learned soon, though. Here's hoping that they move him into Tony Richardson's house in the offseason.

You'd think that being pulled off the field in passing downs would be a good incentive to hit the blocking sled a lot this offseason.

I think he's struggled with it, yes. I also think he's come a LONG way during his SHORT time as a starter. A couple of times he was knocked down yesterday, he DID manage to keep his man off the QB, even if he was knocked down. And bear in mind, the guys that he's been blocking when we're bitching are guys like Demarcus Ware and Jevon Kearse.

And I agree, I hope he works more on it in the offseason. He spent all of last season working on it, so he is trying. And it's interesting you bring up TRich. Did TRich come into the league as an all-world blocker? Anybody want to venture a guess as to how long it took him to "arrive"? Exactly.

Mr. Kotter
12-12-2005, 10:59 AM
So you're in the "never learned blocking" camp then. That's fine. It'd sure be nice if he learned soon, though. Here's hoping that they move him into Tony Richardson's house in the offseason.

You'd think that being pulled off the field in passing downs would be a good incentive to hit the blocking sled a lot this offseason.

A running back at this level that can't block cosistently is a two-down back in this league. If Larry Johnson wants to be the man, he better learn to block....and soon. Otherwise, we will NEED to add a reliable third down back to be used as in days of old. Priest spoiled us.

Boyceofsummer
12-12-2005, 11:07 AM
We can talk about LJ's yards all day, but I don't think Whitlock's point can be entirely written off. For everything you can say about his motives in writing this, he didn't make up that quote from Fujita. And that means other teams have noticed something there.

Larry David was classic last week. Sorry I'm off the subject.

thebrad84
12-12-2005, 11:24 AM
Complete and utter bullshit.

So then what would you say caused LJ to not block a mediocre LB like Scott Fujita? Did Scott get the better of him that play just because he was so determined to get to the QB? No. You watch that play again and again on the replay and LJ gives very little effort at best at trying to block him. Fujita does nothing fancy what-so-ever...its just a straight corner blitz and he went right threw LJ almost completely untouched.

And for those of you who say he just hasn't learned how to block, or hasn't learned how to block well...that is ridiculous. You can not sit there and say no where along the line did he learn how to block. Whether it be high school, college, or his THREE YEARS IN THE PROS!!! Don't you think some coach along the line was like...huh, I wonder if we should teach the kid how to block....Fugg it, he won't need to know how to do that later on in his life. That boys a runner, he doesn't need to know how to block. I mean come on. You learn how to block in middle school football and you sure at $hit learn in high school and again in college. To say that he was running too much at Penn State, and when he wasnt running he was catching, and thats why he never learned how to block is ridiculous. I simply will not buy the argument that he doesnt know how to block well or doesnt know how to at all. The guy has played football his entire life. Somewhere, some coach taught him how to block.

No, he missed his block because he gave a half-a$$ed attempt at blocking him and Fujita took advantage of it. Plain and simple.

htismaqe
12-12-2005, 11:30 AM
So then what would you say caused LJ to not block a mediocre LB like Scott Fujita? Did Scott get the better of him that play just because he was so determined to get to the QB? No. You watch that play again and again on the replay and LJ gives very little effort at best at trying to block him. Fujita does nothing fancy what-so-ever...its just a straight corner blitz and he went right threw LJ almost completely untouched.

And for those of you who say he just hasn't learned how to block, or hasn't learned how to block well...that is ridiculous. You can not sit there and say no where along the line did he learn how to block. Whether it be high school, college, or his THREE YEARS IN THE PROS!!! Don't you think some coach along the line was like...huh, I wonder if we should teach the kid how to block....Fugg it, he won't need to know how to do that later on in his life. That boys a runner, he doesn't need to know how to block. I mean come on. You learn how to block in middle school football and you sure at $hit learn in high school and again in college. To say that he was running too much at Penn State, and when he wasnt running he was catching, and thats why he never learned how to block is ridiculous. I simply will not buy the argument that he doesnt know how to block well or doesnt know how to at all. The guy has played football his entire life. Somewhere, some coach taught him how to block.

No, he missed his block because he gave a half-a$$ed attempt at blocking him and Fujita took advantage of it. Plain and simple.

Of course you won't buy that argument. You've made up your mind about LJ and no amount of objective or subjective evidence will sway your opinion.

So which is it? Did he miss just the block on Fujita because he gave a half-assed attempt? Or was it that he wasn't giving 100% "ALL DAY YESTERDAY"? He may or may not have been dogging it on the play, I don't know yet because I don't have it on DVR. But making that one playing into a microcosm of his entire career -- hell, his entire BEING -- is bullshit.

We already get that you don't like him, so maybe you can spare us the rest of this garbage...

Extra Point
12-12-2005, 11:46 AM
Fatlock stirring the pot of Mumbo Gumbo. I knew we were done with the missed block & fumble return. LJ whiffed, we gave up too many yards and points. Bledsoe had lots of time and good throws. Our run-stopping defense, didn't.

Need next three games as winners, or we're whiners.

Have a good day.

sedated
12-12-2005, 11:48 AM
Shitlock is just trying to keep that chip firmly on LJ's shoulder.

thebrad84
12-12-2005, 11:59 AM
Of course you won't buy that argument. You've made up your mind about LJ and no amount of objective or subjective evidence will sway your opinion.

So did he miss the block on Fujita because he gave a half-assed attempt? Or was it that he wasn't giving 100% "ALL DAY YESTERDAY"?

We already get that you don't like him, so maybe you can spare us the rest of this garbage...

First off, the "he missed the block on Fujita because he gave a half-assed attempt" and "he wasn't giving 100% ALL DAY YESTERDAY" go hand and hand. If, at any point in the game, a player chooses to "take off that play" while he's still in, for whatever reason, he isn't giving 100% the entire game, now is he? If he is tired, then its his job to tell the coaches that and they need to send in a replacement. At any rate, it is that players responsibility to give it their all on every single down. That's why they get payed the big bucks.

Secondly, it's not that I don't like LJ at all. I didn't like the over-all performance he gave us yesterday. Yes, you can sit there and be stupid and say, "but he had 170 total yards and 3 tds..thats a great over-all performance" (not saying you, but others on this board). Well, I don't look at only one thing he did or even two things he did. I look at what he did through-out the entire game, not just when he had the rock in his hands. The guy is a great runner, nobody denies that fact, but its his effort he gives when he doesnt have the ball that worries me.

And to say that no amount of objective or subjective evidence will sway my opinion is wrong too. The fact is, you haven't given any valid evidence to disclaim my point. The only evidence you've offered is that he didn't have time at Penn St. to learn how to block because he was either running or catching the ball. I will not accept that evidence because football players are always practicing all aspects of their game and it's not optional at the college level, and it sure as $hit isn't optional in the Pro level. He knows how to block, he just chooses to do it half-a$$ed, or atleast he chose yesterday to do it that way.

htismaqe
12-12-2005, 12:04 PM
First off, the "he missed the block on Fujita because he gave a half-assed attempt" and "he wasn't giving 100% ALL DAY YESTERDAY" go hand and hand. If, at any point in the game, a player chooses to "take off that play" while he's still in, for whatever reason, he isn't giving 100% the entire game, now is he? If he is tired, then its his job to tell the coaches that and they need to send in a replacement. At any rate, it is that players responsibility to give it their all on every single down. That's why they get payed the big bucks.

Secondly, it's not that I don't like LJ at all. I didn't like the over-all performance he gave us yesterday. Yes, you can sit there and be stupid and say, "but he had 170 total yards and 3 tds..thats a great over-all performance" (not saying you, but others on this board). Well, I don't look at only one thing he did or even two things he did. I look at what he did through-out the entire game, not just when he had the rock in his hands. The guy is a great runner, nobody denies that fact, but its his effort he gives when he doesnt have the ball that worries me.

And to say that no amount of objective or subjective evidence will sway my opinion is wrong too. The fact is, you haven't given any valid evidence to disclaim my point. The only evidence you've offered is that he didn't have time at Penn St. to learn how to block because he was either running or catching the ball. I will not accept that evidence because football players are always practicing all aspects of their game and it's not optional at the college level, and it sure as $hit isn't optional in the Pro level. He knows how to block, he just chooses to do it half-a$$ed, or atleast he chose yesterday to do it that way.

It's quite obvious what's going on here, which is why you've now chosen to argue semantics of speech instead of the merits of your argument. What you said earlier was that he was dogging it "ALL DAY" which means "on every play". Now you're trying to say that he only took one play off, but because he did, that taints the fact that he gave it his all the rest of the game. So which is it? I don't expect we'll get an answer other than the garbage you've already posted thrice.

Both you and Whitlock want to paint LJ as a career loafer. You want us to think "This is what you get with LJ."

You're trying to paint the entire game, and even his career, with one play. You want everyone to believe he's Randy Moss.

It's garbage. Plain and simple.

thebrad84
12-12-2005, 12:20 PM
Randy Moss plays at about 50% when he knows the play isnt going to him. He jogs, he blocks half-a$$. That is what LJ did ALL DAY YESTERDAY. 3 different times (that I saw) when he was trying to block his man

Those were my exact words. I saw him 3 different times yesterday give a half-a$$ed job at trying to block his man. So, yes, from what I saw he was "dogging it all day" on his blocks..not "all day" period.

Now...I'm arguing the Fujita block mostly because that was the worst one of them all, because it led to a 14pt swing.

And I never once said he was a career loafer. I'm just saying what I saw yesterday scared me a little bit, because he seemed to show a lack of effort on his blocks like Randy Moss does. That's all I'm saying.

chiefqueen
12-12-2005, 12:24 PM
Spears is a rookie. He's not our spears.

And Fujita hasn't really done shit in Dallas. That sack was the first notable thing he did all year.

It may be his only notable play all year but it will go down as the play that swung momentum around and kept us out of the playoffs.

htismaqe
12-12-2005, 12:28 PM
Those were my exact words. I saw him 3 different times yesterday give a half-a$$ed job at trying to block his man. So, yes, from what I saw he was "dogging it all day" on his blocks..not "all day" period.

Now...I'm arguing the Fujita block mostly because that was the worst one of them all, because it led to a 14pt swing.

And I never once said he was a career loafer. I'm just saying what I saw yesterday scarred me a little bit, because he seemed to show a lack of effort on his blocks like Randy Moss does. That's all I'm saying.

And that right there is why I called you out -- a hyperbolic statement. A misunderstanding.

It's basic logic for most of us:

Larry Johnson = Randy Moss
Randy Moss = career loafer

thus

Larry Johnson = career loafer

See how that connection gets made? It turns out, that wasn't what you were intending to say AT ALL, was it?

I see what you're saying. If LJ was dogging it on the Fujita play, he should be criticized for it. But he blocked Demarcus Ware, SUCCESSFULLY, 3 or 4 times yesterday 1-on-1. Should he not also be commended for that?

And finally, laying the blame for the LOSS on LJ is absolutely ridiculous. ONE PLAY in the 2nd quarter can NEVER be the cause for a win or loss. NEVER, especially for a team that fancies themselves a contender. There 2 quarters left and the team (specifically the defense) couldn't get it done. THAT is why we lost.

chiefqueen
12-12-2005, 12:28 PM
Fatlock Fatlock Fatlock

I'm just glad I didn't see his deer in the headlights hazed over face on The Sports Reporters Sunday

I'm sure he'll be on there this Sundy with the Chiefs playing in NJ on Saturday.

thebrad84
12-12-2005, 12:41 PM
And that right there is why I called you out -- a hyperbolic statement. A misunderstanding.

It's basic logic for most of us:

Larry Johnson = Randy Moss
Randy Moss = career loafer

thus

Larry Johnson = career loafer

See how that connection gets made? It turns out, that wasn't what you were intending to say AT ALL, was it?

I see what you're saying. If LJ was dogging it on the Fujita play, he should be criticized for it. But he blocked Demarcus Ware, SUCCESSFULLY, 3 or 4 times yesterday 1-on-1. Should he not also be commended for that?

And finally, laying the blame for the LOSS on LJ is absolutely ridiculous. ONE PLAY in the 2nd quarter can NEVER be the cause for a win or loss. NEVER, especially for a team that fancies themselves a contender. There 2 quarters left and the team (specifically the defense) couldn't get it done. THAT is why we lost.

And I agree with you that it wasn't the ONLY REASON WE LOST. I'm arguing, and have been arguing this entire time, that this missed block was worse than all the other things that went wrong in the game. If, (and I believe its pretty apparent on replays), LJ gave a half-a$$ed effort on trying to block fujita, then his missed block was worse than all the other miscues because the other miscues didn't involve half-a$$ed efforts. That's all I'm trying to argue here.

htismaqe
12-12-2005, 12:52 PM
And I agree with you that it wasn't the ONLY REASON WE LOST. I'm arguing, and have been arguing this entire time, that this missed block was worse than all the other things that went wrong in the game. If, (and I believe its pretty apparent on replays), LJ gave a half-a$$ed effort on trying to block fujita, then his missed block was worse than all the other miscues because the other miscues didn't involve half-a$$ed efforts. That's all I'm trying to argue here.

So you're saying that it's not the outcome that's important, it's the intent? Sorry, but that makes little sense. If LJ had given half-assed effort on that play but there was no fumble, does he still get chastised for not giving it his all? Sorry, but your premise is pretty crazy.

Second, watch here:

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=2890226

If you're able to discern a lack of effort from that, I have to deduce that your specifically looking for reasons to call out LJ.

chief118
12-12-2005, 01:01 PM
OK TAKE OUT LJ AND PUT IN DEE BROWN TO BLOCK. LJ GAVE US A CHANCE TO WIN.

Halfcan
12-12-2005, 01:19 PM
Sorry but that was a HUGE play, I would like to see the play again before I blame LJ solely. But it did look like he just gave up.

FringeNC
12-12-2005, 01:22 PM
Two comments on the Whitlock article:

1.) The D cost us the game, plain and simple

2.) Whitlock just performed a huge service to the Chiefs. After being called out in public, I have a feeling LJ's concentration will improve on passing downs. I think calling it a lack of effort is way too strong. I don't think LJ concentrates as hard when the play is not directed at him. I think this will change. It's way to early to compare LJ to Randy Moss.

Being shown up in public like that by Whitlock has to be more effective than be shown up while going over the films with the team.

Fishpicker
12-12-2005, 01:26 PM
just a few weeks ago, JW was swinging from LJ's nuts like he wanted a banana.

this is getting ridiculous

DRU
12-12-2005, 01:43 PM
I'm probably not going to be well liked for this, but I agree with the basic point this article is stating. LJ has some serious work to do with pass blocking and it's obvious this has MUCH to do with our coaching staff so easily dis-regarding all the "start LJ" talk before Priest went down.

Have you guys watched that play any more than the live action? He really did flop like a fish out of water. It was pathetic. Absolutely pathetic. Forget about the fact that it was a 10 or 14 point turnaround...can we afford to let our QB get killed like that even if he doesn't drop the ball? What happens if Green goes down? Now LJ is nothing because teams will smuther him and force us to pass, utilizing the same weakness we have now...backs who can't block...as well as the benefit of a back-up QB.

I like LJ a lot. It's fun to watch him run and it's exciting to have a young guy like that to help this team in the future. But this really needs to be fixed. He flopped on that play and I can specifically remember a couple of others where he just got pushed out of the way like a rag-doll.

Quite simlply, this discussion wasn't possible when Priest was in the game. That's the difference between the 2. LJ fixes this and he's the best back in the league. If he doesn't fix it his numbers will do nothing but drop. If we can't put him on the field in passing situations then defenses can target him when he is on the field. Bad deal there.

mlyonsd
12-12-2005, 01:47 PM
Nobody has stated the obvious....it's Trent Green's fault for fumbling when Fujita hit him.

Lord knows Fujita never hit anyone hard enough to cause a fumble when he played for us.

morphius
12-12-2005, 01:49 PM
Gammon getting injured is the reason we lost the game.

Surtain dropping the easy Int cost us the game.

Green not even looking at the blitzer cost us the game.

LJ missing a block cost us the game.

Our 3rd down defense cost us the game.

Piss poor time management cost us the game.

Covering Keyshawn with Bell cost us the game.

We could go on and on, and around in circles till we fall over and puke. We found just about every way in the book to lose this damn game.

DaneMcCloud
12-12-2005, 02:40 PM
I think Whitlock shouldn't have put the blame soley on LJ . The blame, IMO, rests one DV, AS and the entire offensive staff, not to mention Lynn Stiles and CP.

Mecca
12-12-2005, 02:47 PM
Whitlock got what he wanted, some of the Larry Johnson haters are back out in full force today. It's quite obvious some of you won't be happy till you ride this guy out of town........you know who you are.

Mr. Kotter
12-12-2005, 02:48 PM
I think Whitlock shouldn't have put the blame soley on LJ . The blame, IMO, rests one DV, AS and the entire offensive staff, not to mention Lynn Stiles and CP.

You forgot George W. Bush. Bush is da debil! :cuss:

DaneMcCloud
12-12-2005, 02:49 PM
I think Whitlock shouldn't have put the blame soley on LJ. The blame, IMO, rests one DV, AS and the entire offensive staff, not to mention Lynn Stiles and CP.

Why? Why not put the blame on the defense? Not because of defensive acquistions. The Chiefs did their best to acquire players for Gunther through the draft and free agency. Not because of Tynes or Ed Perry (though Perry's been very shaky). So why do you think the blame lies with the those I mentioned. Two words: Samkon Gado!

How in the hell can this offensive coaching staff keep Jeremy Parquet, Will Svitek and Ronnie Cruz on the squad, but let Gado go to the practice squad and eventually, Green Bay? Could you imagine the one-two punch of LJ and Gado, especially on 3rd down situations? They made the same mistake last year with Ryan Diem, who became an instant starter with the Colts. They're friggin' idiots. I hate to say it, but I can't wait until they're all fired.

And why didn't the Chiefs call time outs during the final two minutes in order to preserve time on the clock, just in case Dallas scored? What am I missing?

Dane
~This was a more painful loss than Buffalo

tk13
12-12-2005, 02:56 PM
This is why fans could never be coaches, it's the little things like pass blocking that'll get you killed. As long as they see 500 yards and 28 points, they'll think that's all we need to do. That is an extremely Martz-ian attitude to have, I don't really agree with it. I realize there was a whole other half of football to play, but if LJ throws that block we are in total command going into the 2nd half. Instead we end up trailing and momentum has swung the other way because we gave a struggling team the confidence that they could hang with us. Exact same thing as the Philly game.

I think LJ's gotten better at pass blocking, and I don't think it's a heart issue at all, it's technique. Everything he does is so upright and vertical. He doesn't really bend his knees or move laterally very well. He got abused a couple times yesterday though. One was on that fumble... another time at the beginning of the 4th quarter he put us in 3rd and long when Leroi Glover planted him on his ass then got pressure on Green... I'm pretty sure after that play was when Al started taking him out on passing downs. He's gotta get better... we need him out on the field.

kc rush
12-12-2005, 03:50 PM
Whitlock just performed a huge service to the Chiefs. After being called out in public, I have a feeling LJ's concentration will improve on passing downs. I think calling it a lack of effort is way too strong. I don't think LJ concentrates as hard when the play is not directed at him. I think this will change. It's way to early to compare LJ to Randy Moss.

Being shown up in public like that by Whitlock has to be more effective than be shown up while going over the films with the team.

JW will be more than happy to take all of the credit if LJ's blocking improves.

Mecca
12-12-2005, 03:52 PM
I think Whitlock shouldn't have put the blame soley on LJ. The blame, IMO, rests one DV, AS and the entire offensive staff, not to mention Lynn Stiles and CP.

Why? Why not put the blame on the defense? Not because of defensive acquistions. The Chiefs did their best to acquire players for Gunther through the draft and free agency. Not because of Tynes or Ed Perry (though Perry's been very shaky). So why do you think the blame lies with the those I mentioned. Two words: Samkon Gado!

How in the hell can this offensive coaching staff keep Jeremy Parquet, Will Svitek and Ronnie Cruz on the squad, but let Gado go to the practice squad and eventually, Green Bay? Could you imagine the one-two punch of LJ and Gado, especially on 3rd down situations? They made the same mistake last year with Ryan Diem, who became an instant starter with the Colts. They're friggin' idiots. I hate to say it, but I can't wait until they're all fired.

And why didn't the Chiefs call time outs during the final two minutes in order to preserve time on the clock, just in case Dallas scored? What am I missing?

Dane
~This was a more painful loss than Buffalo

Lilja not Diem........but I get your point. 2 years in a row we've cut someone who went on to be productive for another team when we could be using them.

DaneMcCloud
12-12-2005, 04:22 PM
Oops! Ryan Lilja. Where did I get Ryan Diem?

Mr. Laz
12-12-2005, 04:29 PM
Whitlock got what he wanted, some of the Larry Johnson haters are back out in full force today. It's quite obvious some of you won't be happy till you ride this guy out of town........you know who you are.
larry johnson made a big mistake on a key play that resulted in at least a 10 pts swing in a game we ended up losing by 3 pts.




what .... you expect people to be happy?




haters/basher ........... waah,waah,waah it's such complete BS

Mecca
12-12-2005, 04:31 PM
larry johnson made a big mistake on a key play that resulted in at least a 10 pts swing in a game we ended up losing by 3 pts.




what .... you expect people to be happy?




haters/basher ........... waah,waah,waah it's such complete BS

Numerous people screwed up........Surtain screwed up and caused a 14 point swing. I don't seen entire thread devoted to how he doesn't give a crap.

Mr. Laz
12-12-2005, 04:45 PM
Numerous people screwed up........Surtain screwed up and caused a 14 point swing. I don't seen entire thread devoted to how he doesn't give a crap.

Raiderhader
12-12-2005, 05:13 PM
Whitless is a moron, but we already knew that.

LJ may have missed a block, and while bad, it was not the deciding factor in that play. What actually caused that play was Al Saunders using LJ as a pass blocker instead of a f#cking running back. Why the f#ck did he decide to pass AGAIN after the attempt on first down almost ended as badly? I had this same complaint when Priest was in the back field, you have a lethal running back, USE HIM, especially in the redzone.

I blame the defense, AS, and the long snapper for yesterday's loss. You can place blame with some others (dropped passes by EK for example), but those three were the focal points of what went wrong yesterday. One of the people least deserving of blame is LJ. One missed pass block, yeah it turned out to be a crucial one, but there was so much more game left at that point that it shouldn't have mattered.

Johnson&Johnson
12-12-2005, 05:18 PM
Whitlock must be making an extra attempt to make LJ angrier looking at the upcoming Giants game.

He needs to pound the shit out of that over-achieved NYG defense.

If anyone is to blame, Whitlock mentioned it, Pat Surtain (the high-profile CB) not making that sure TD pick-6 that could have sealed DAL faith on any attempt for a comeback!!!! :mad:

KCChiefsFan88
12-12-2005, 05:24 PM
Whitlock is a fat piece of garbage who thinks like a 10 year old.

Yes, blame LJ the guy who had 3 TDs and has arguably been one of the main reasons for the Chiefs offensive surge these past few games.

And Whitlock of all people to question someone's commitment. This coming from a fat FRAUD who has ZERO commitment to:

1) His health/weight

2) His career (how many radio shows has fatass quit now? And judging from his miserable newspaper columns, it doesn't look like he has much commitment towards writing respectable, well-thought out columns).

NFL16
12-12-2005, 05:28 PM
LJ is extremely tough. Yes he did miss his block. That is one of the many things that cost us the game.

Calcountry
12-12-2005, 05:37 PM
We can talk about LJ's yards all day, but I don't think Whitlock's point can be entirely written off. For everything you can say about his motives in writing this, he didn't make up that quote from Fujita. And that means other teams have noticed something there.Like the Buffalo Bills.

Calcountry
12-12-2005, 05:38 PM
Sorry...you don't blame ANYONE on the offense when it racks up 500 yards and 28 points ON THE ROAD against one of the toughest defenses in the league.Because they never FINISH people off.

Not once this year, has our offense finished off a quality opponent.

Deberg_1990
12-12-2005, 05:50 PM
This is why fans could never be coaches, it's the little things like pass blocking that'll get you killed. .

OK, but without LJ's 145 yards rushing and 3TD's, we would have never even been in position to win the game at all. You take the good with the bad, just like I do with Trent Green. It was unfair of Whitlock to single out LJ in his column like that.


I think LJ's gotten better at pass blocking, and I don't think it's a heart issue at all, it's technique. Everything he does is so upright and vertical. He doesn't really bend his knees or move laterally very well.

Very much agree with you here. Its not heart, he just sucks as a pass blocker, hopefully he will get better at it in time but who knows?? Dumb for Whitlock to question his heart. Does he know LJ?? Its not like they hang out together at Gates on the weekends. Man, what a stupid way off base column, and i normally agree with Whitlock.

Johnson&Johnson
12-12-2005, 06:13 PM
OK, but without LJ's 145 yards rushing and 3TD's, would would have never even been in position to win the game at all. You take the good with the bad, just like I do with Trent Green. It was unfair of Whitlock to single out LJ in his column like that.




Very much agree with you here. Its not heart, he just sucks as a pass blocker, hopefully he will get better at it in time but who knows?? Dumb for Whitlock to question his heart. Does he know LJ?? Its not like they hang out together at Gates on the weekends. Man, what a stupid way off base column, and i normally agree with Whitlock.

I've always agree with your take Deberg! Including this one.

It's technique, not heart. If he was a natural at pass-blocking, LJ would've started in the backfield long time ago. DV finally came out and said he and the staff knew how talented LJ was .. now we know why it took so long and only now we see the greatness of this young and coming stud!

As for Whitlock, i think he's been reading our post too much and finally sank in for him to go along with us and piss-off LJ. Since none of our post here gets out to the players, Whitlock did us a favor. It also makes sense now why DV called out LJ in his rookie season "take-off diapers". LJ is the kind of kid that strives on proving others wrong. the angrier he gets the better becomes and the more he will strive and work harder in becoming the punishing runner he's already shown.

Keep it up.

Here's my wishful thinking...

LJ to take it all out on those over-achieved Giants - GET REALLY PISSED LJ. 200yds down their throat, and I don't mean all-purpose yards. :mad:

tk13
12-12-2005, 06:44 PM
Michael Irvin just did a tease for later on during Monday Night Countdown... "How do you run for 100+ yards and 3 TD's and not make my playmakers club? Stay tuned to find out" with a picture Larry Johnson behind him. I imagine this subject is going to come up soon... just a heads up.

htismaqe
12-12-2005, 06:50 PM
OK, but without LJ's 145 yards rushing and 3TD's, we would have never even been in position to win the game at all. You take the good with the bad, just like I do with Trent Green. It was unfair of Whitlock to single out LJ in his column like that.

Very much agree with you here. Its not heart, he just sucks as a pass blocker, hopefully he will get better at it in time but who knows?? Dumb for Whitlock to question his heart. Does he know LJ?? Its not like they hang out together at Gates on the weekends. Man, what a stupid way off base column, and i normally agree with Whitlock.

Exactly.

I don't have a problem with calling out LJ for missing that block. He screwed up -- BAD.

But parlaying that into "he has no heart" is...well, there's about 25 good words to describe it and they're all synonyms of "stupid".

Simplex3
12-12-2005, 07:09 PM
Christ almighty, he just piled up 171 total yards and 3 touchdowns.

Yeah, he lost the game. :rolleyes:
A CB has 3 picks in a game, one for a TD. Great game, right? However, he is also burned for 4 long TD passes. You can have a nice stat line ans still play a s**tty game.

Mr. Laz
12-12-2005, 07:16 PM
But parlaying that into "he has no heart" is...well, there's about 25 good words to describe it and they're all synonyms of "stupid".
ah ... there it is again.

Deberg_1990
12-12-2005, 07:18 PM
A CB has 3 picks in a game, one for a TD. Great game, right? However, he is also burned for 4 long TD passes. You can have a nice stat line ans still play a s**tty game.


So can we all call out Trent Green as well? Ive said for the past few years that alot of his stats are "garbage time" stats. IM not going to call Green out, but hes made his share of mistakes to lose games over the past 4 years or so. Dont even get me started on his lack of pocket awareness and his penchant for turnovers in the red zone at key times in the game. but like i mentined earlier "Good with the bad". Its just flat out wrong to pin a loss like yesterday on 1 guy like Whitlock did.

Simplex3
12-12-2005, 07:27 PM
It's not valid. Every coach he's ever had, including ones that were critical (Vermeil), have said that the guy has the heart and desire. He wasn't asked to block often at Penn State. He ran the ball alot, and when he wasn't running the ball, he was catching it. Here, he's trying to learn a complex scheme that has THOUSANDS of plays, despite the fact that he was inactive for a year and a half.

Alot of criticisms of LJ are very valid. The idea that he has no heart, or doesn't give 100% when he isn't the center of attention, is pure bunk.
He's had four years to figure out that really complex offense. Inactive or not he had a playbook and was at practice. Four years in one offense is damn near unheard of in today's NFL. If he hasn't gotten it yet he's either lazy or stupid, take your pick.

shaneo69
12-12-2005, 07:56 PM
I think the blame on the fumble goes 50% to LJ and 50% to Trent. Like I said in another thread, Plummer got hit in a similar fashion last week by DJ but didn't cough it up.

Put Trent behind Arizona's O-line, and he'd look worse than Warner does.

Johnson&Johnson
12-12-2005, 08:37 PM
I think the blame on the fumble goes 50% to LJ and 50% to Trent. Like I said in another thread, Plummer got hit in a similar fashion last week by DJ but didn't cough it up.

Put Trent behind Arizona's O-line, and he'd look worse than Warner does.

AMEN!

At some point, the Trent Green supporters must acknowledged their favorite QB, has zero pocket presence (can't feel the heat) and he's way too greedy and holding the ball longer than he should cuz he's always looking for the deep WR.

Without LJ's presence, Trent would've been blitz all day long cuz there's nothing else to fear.

Rain Man
12-12-2005, 08:58 PM
At some point, the Trent Green supporters must acknowledged their favorite QB, has zero pocket presence (can't feel the heat) and he's way too greedy and holding the ball longer than he should cuz he's always looking for the deep WR.


Zero pocket presence? Do you live on that alternate earth that's always on the other side of the sun?

Extra Point
12-12-2005, 09:26 PM
Gammon getting injured is the reason we lost the game.

Surtain dropping the easy Int cost us the game.

Green not even looking at the blitzer cost us the game.

LJ missing a block cost us the game.

Our 3rd down defense cost us the game.

Piss poor time management cost us the game.

Covering Keyshawn with Bell cost us the game.

We could go on and on, and around in circles till we fall over and puke. We found just about every way in the book to lose this damn game.

Soundest assessment of the game, so far.

siberian khatru
12-12-2005, 09:28 PM
Zero pocket presence? Do you live on that alternate earth that's always on the other side of the sun?

You know, that's one of my all-time favorite movies.

http://www.videoflicks.com/images/1011/V1011260.jpg

philfree
12-12-2005, 09:51 PM
AMEN!

At some point, the Trent Green supporters must acknowledged their favorite QB, has zero pocket presence (can't feel the heat) and he's way too greedy and holding the ball longer than he should cuz he's always looking for the deep WR.
Without LJ's presence, Trent would've been blitz all day long cuz there's nothing else to fear.


That's called having balls when a QB keeps his eyes down field instead of looking for the pass rushers. It's also trusting your teammates. As far as looking for the deep WR I think it's more going through the whole progression of reads. That's what makes our offense #1 in the league for 4 years running.

Seems I remember Green being accused of checking down to Holmes to much in the past :) LOL Chiefs Fans are a fickle ****ing bunch.

PhilFree:arrow:

milkman
12-12-2005, 11:18 PM
That missed block was a momentum changer.
I'll agree to that.

But to call LJ selfish because of that missed block, and to say he doesn't want to block is BS.

LJ needs to work on it, but there was another play where he made a nice block in that I commented on during the game.

milkman
12-12-2005, 11:20 PM
AMEN!

At some point, the Trent Green supporters must acknowledged their favorite QB, has zero pocket presence (can't feel the heat) and he's way too greedy and holding the ball longer than he should cuz he's always looking for the deep WR.

Without LJ's presence, Trent would've been blitz all day long cuz there's nothing else to fear.

Oh, let guess.

David Carr has exceptional pocket presence.

philfree
12-12-2005, 11:29 PM
That missed block was a momentum changer.
I'll agree to that.

But to call LJ selfish because of that missed block, and to say he doesn't want to block is BS.

LJ needs to work on it, but there was another play where he made a nice block in that I commented on during the game.


LJ has picked up many a blitz but it's the ones he don't that gets noticed. I think Trent should have left Gonzo on that side and Fujita would have never gotten close to him with a Gonzo chip which would have given LJ a better chance to make his block. I would realy like for this to be a addressed in Trent's press conference this week. Did Gonzo line up wrong or did Trent move him after he saw the D. It looked like to me from Trent's body language that Gonzo lined up wrong but I don't know it.

PhilFree:arrow:

greg63
12-12-2005, 11:41 PM
Again, my reaction to this article is as follows:

KCChiefsFan88
12-13-2005, 12:03 AM
That missed block was a momentum changer.
I'll agree to that.

But to call LJ selfish because of that missed block, and to say he doesn't want to block is BS.

LJ needs to work on it, but there was another play where he made a nice block in that I commented on during the game.


Yep, I'm not defending LJ for missing the block, I'm sure he would be the first to admit he made a mistake on that play, but to take a shot at his character and commitment to his team based on that play is baseless. And to pin the entire loss on that one play is also baseless.

Again, it is just more proof that Fatlock, the self-proclaimed football expert is nothing but a fat FRAUD who has zero credibility when it comes to questioning others commitment, considering Fatlock has quit TWO radio jobs and admitted in his newspaper column that he quit his first radio job because he didn't like getting up early every morning and needed more sleep.

BigLefty05
12-13-2005, 12:16 AM
Haha things that he will say to get attention...and it sure does work for him...you have to realize that while Whitlock pisses us off and appears to miss the point sometimes he is a genius if you really think about it.

Guru
12-13-2005, 12:25 AM
Yep, I'm not defending LJ for missing the block, I'm sure he would be the first to admit he made a mistake on that play, but to take a shot at his character and commitment to his team based on that play is baseless. And to pin the entire loss on that one play is also baseless.

Again, it is just more proof that Fatlock, the self-proclaimed football expert is nothing but a fat FRAUD who has zero credibility when it comes to questioning others commitment, considering Fatlock has quit TWO radio jobs and admitted in his newspaper column that he quit his first radio job because he didn't like getting up early every morning and needed more sleep.

And to think, he and Keitzman couldn't get along? Hell, they both like pickin on LJ.

penchief
12-13-2005, 07:01 AM
This is a little off topic but I was watching Open Mike on ESPN News and they were talking about Reggie Bush. Both Irvin and Ditka were asked to name one running back currently in the NFL that they would take over Reggie Bush. Irvin said LT. Ditka said LJ.

keg in kc
12-13-2005, 08:09 AM
He's exactly right. Well, I don't know about the tone of the article, all the shots at LJ's heart, but the core of it is correct: that missed block was the turning point in the game. When you do that on the road, when you make a huge mistake and allow a 14-point turnaround, you lose. End of story. You might escape something like that at Arrowhead, if you're lucky. That's the kind of play that separates winners from losers, playoff teams from 'also-ran's; good teams make those plays, bad ones are the victim, and for the umpteenth time since I started following the Chiefs ('99), we were the ones on the wrong side of it. If we're ever going to get the monkey off our back, we have to turn that around.

Count Alex's Losses
12-13-2005, 08:13 AM
He's exactly right. Well, I don't know about the tone of the article, all the shots at LJ's heart, but the core of it is correct: that missed block was the turning point in the game. When you do that on the road, when you make a huge mistake and allow a 14-point turnaround, you lose. End of story. You might escape something like that at Arrowhead, if you're lucky. That's the kind of play that separates winners from losers, playoff teams from 'also-ran's; good teams make those plays, bad ones are the victim, and for the umpteenth time since I started following the Chiefs ('99), we were the ones on the wrong side of it. If we're ever going to get the monkey off our back, we have to turn that around.

You're right, to a certain extent. If the refs don't flag DJ on 4th and goal, everyone is talking about the Chiefs awesome road win today.

That was a pretty awesome play by Wesley to knock that ball out. DAMMIT! :(

Deberg_1990
12-13-2005, 01:07 PM
but the core of it is correct: that missed block was the turning point in the game. When you do that on the road, when you make a huge mistake and allow a 14-point turnaround, you lose.

What about all the points and big plays the defense allowed?? The point is: it was a total team loss.

Baby Lee
12-13-2005, 01:10 PM
And finally, laying the blame for the LOSS on LJ is absolutely ridiculous. ONE PLAY in the 2nd quarter can NEVER be the cause for a win or loss. NEVER, especially for a team that fancies themselves a contender. There 2 quarters left and the team (specifically the defense) couldn't get it done. THAT is why we lost.
Not blaming LJ, but I wonder what the W/L record is league-wide when you have a 14 point swing of this nature at ANY point in the game.

siberian khatru
12-13-2005, 01:18 PM
You're right, to a certain extent. If the refs don't flag DJ on 4th and goal, everyone is talking about the Chiefs awesome road win today.


Yes, but ... again, the sack/fumble was THE turning point. After that, all the other plays -- the dropped INT, the penalty, the missed kick -- became important. But if we get points there instead of a turnover (which led to Dallas points), the other stuff in all likelihood is moot.

Not blaming it all on LJ or even that play. Just saying that play made everything else relevant.

Otter
12-13-2005, 01:25 PM
I fart in all your general directions and no doubt your sister smells of elderberries.

LJ hasn't even started a full season. He missed a ****!ng block, shit happens.

Maybe Donnell Bennet would have caught that one.

Inspector
12-13-2005, 01:46 PM
It's Lamar Hunt's fault.

If he hadn't built this team, we wouldn't have to have this conversation.

Dammit Lamar!!!

Coogs
12-13-2005, 01:58 PM
Yes, but ... again, the sack/fumble was THE turning point. After that, all the other plays -- the dropped INT, the penalty, the missed kick -- became important. But if we get points there instead of a turnover (which led to Dallas points), the other stuff in all likelihood is moot.

Not blaming it all on LJ or even that play. Just saying that play made everything else relevant.


To me, this was all on AS. The score was 14-10. 1:21 to go in the half. Dallas has 1 TO. Here are the plays...

1-9-DAL9 (1:21) T.Green pass incomplete to L.Johnson (S.Shanle). Pass incomplete middle of the field at the 5.
2-9-DAL9 (1:16) T.Green sacked at DAL 18 for -9 yards (S.Fujita). FUMBLES (S.Fujita), RECOVERED by DAL-M.Spears at DAL 15. M.Spears to KC 26 for 59 yards (W.Shields). This is Dallas's longest fumble return since Greg Ellis returned one 98 yards for a TD vs. Arizona on Oct. 3, 1999. Play Challenged by Review Assistant and Upheld.


...If we run the ball 3 times, we go into the half with at least a 17-10 lead, maybe 21-10. If we throw the ball three times, and don't make the TD we are up 17-10 with still a minute ten or so on the clock. If we make the TD we are up 21-10, and still have that same minute ten or so on the clock.

Plenty of time for Dallas to move down the field and cancel out our score. Bad clock time management IMO.

And speaking of which, WTF was up with the TO taken by us with 12 seconds to go in the half. That could have bit us in the fanny too. Horrible clock management is to blame in my bood, not a missed block by LJ.

jspchief
12-13-2005, 01:58 PM
Larry Johnson is Randy Moss, Terrell Owens, and Rae Carruth all rolled into one.