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View Full Version : Donnie Henderson sux


B_Ambuehl
01-05-2006, 09:35 AM
If he's named DC I won't be able to do a whole lot of anything next year besides laugh.

One only needs to go back to the first game of the 2005 season to note the ineffectiveness of Henderson as DC. Having all offseason to prepare his football team to face an offensive football team that runs 70% to the left, they go out and allow 3 consecutive runs of 8, 35 and 35 yards.

You think Gun's bad at least Gun gets his guys to line up properly.

nascher
01-05-2006, 09:36 AM
Will Svitek - future pro bowl OT

yes thx you :)))))

FringeNC
01-05-2006, 09:42 AM
The Jets were 6th in the NFL in yards allowed per play, I believe. We were 28th. And 32nd last year.

nascher
01-05-2006, 09:43 AM
even this season with next to zero offense.

B_Ambuehl
01-05-2006, 11:50 AM
With 6 games against a pathetic AFC west and 4 out of those 6 games against Buffalo and Miami that ain't saying a whole lot. Hell, even the Chiefs defense looked spectacular against those 2 football teams.

Having zero offense help their (Jets) defensive statistics as opposing offenses played conservatively and shut it down a lot sooner.


We'll see who's bitching next year.

FringeNC
01-05-2006, 11:54 AM
With 6 games against a pathetic AFC west and 4 out of those 6 games against Buffalo and Miami that ain't saying a whole lot. Hell, even the Chiefs defense looked spectacular against those 2 football teams.

Having zero offense help their (Jets) defensive statistics as opposing offenses played conservatively and shut it down a lot sooner.


We'll see who's bitching next year.

To tell you the truth, I know nothing about Donnie Henderson, but I find it hard to believe it could get worse than Gunther.

nascher
01-05-2006, 12:03 PM
now DV and his staff is gone everybody is bitching about the possible new coaches regardless who they are. And the Defense only can get better we have almost nothing to loose.

B_Ambuehl
01-05-2006, 12:07 PM
Henderson is a poor man's Gun. He coordinates on emotion....has good gameplans drawn up but then gets pissed off and starts street coaching not using his head.
At least Gun is wise and has a relationship with the current players.

I was worried since the very beginning of the season when we first heard those "herm to KC" rumors that this defensive football team would end up falling in the hands of Henderson.

An offense founded upon the "Marty" principles is bad enough and reason for concern but this just makes thigns even worse.

ChiefsCountry
01-05-2006, 03:10 PM
If Henderson isn't DC, then DB's coach his old job with the Ravens would be pretty good. They need the most help coaching wise.

Count Zarth
01-05-2006, 03:12 PM
I'm pretty uneducated on this issue, but the Jets dumped their initial offensive coordinator under Edwards and hired Henderson.

The defense immediately became top 10.

:shrug:

Mecca
01-05-2006, 03:13 PM
Don't worry guys, Ambuehl hates everyone. He would find a way to tell us Vince Lombardi was a shit coach if he was coaching now.

Lzen
01-05-2006, 03:15 PM
I don't see how you can say he sucks. His Jets defense was ranked 12th in total yards this year. Besides, our offense does that to every defense (good or bad). That is, when the linemen are healthy, especially Roaf.

Lzen
01-05-2006, 03:16 PM
With 6 games against a pathetic AFC west and 4 out of those 6 games against Buffalo and Miami that ain't saying a whole lot. Hell, even the Chiefs defense looked spectacular against those 2 football teams.

Having zero offense help their (Jets) defensive statistics as opposing offenses played conservatively and shut it down a lot sooner.


We'll see who's bitching next year.

Didn't the Dolphins finish with a winning record?

Mecca
01-05-2006, 03:16 PM
Judging an defense facing the Chiefs is grading on an obscene curve. The Chiefs do stuff like that to basically everyone. To say he sucks because of that game, is just frankly dumb.

ChiefsCountry
01-05-2006, 03:17 PM
One only needs to go back to the first game of the 2005 season to note the ineffectiveness of Henderson as DC. Having all offseason to prepare his football team to face an offensive football team that runs 70% to the left, they go out and allow 3 consecutive runs of 8, 35 and 35 yards.

How many teams stopped LJ and Priest? Really just think about that. Dumbass.

the Talking Can
01-05-2006, 03:17 PM
I'm too lazy to look it up, but I heard a radio guy say that Henderson had fielded 2 top 10 defenses and that one year they were 4th in points allowed....I may have that wrong, but it sounded like he had done some good things, I really don't know much about him..

tk13
01-05-2006, 03:18 PM
Marvin Lewis knew we were going to run Larry Johnson, and his defense still let him run for 200 yards. He sucks! ROFL

tk13
01-05-2006, 03:24 PM
I'm too lazy to look it up, but I heard a radio guy say that Henderson had fielded 2 top 10 defenses and that one year they were 4th in points allowed....I may have that wrong, but it sounded like he had done some good things, I really don't know much about him..
He's been their DC the last two years. In 2004, last year, they were ranked 4th in the NFL in points allowed. This year their numbers weren't quite as good, but some of that had to do with their depleted offense putting them in tough positions. They still finished 2nd in the league against the pass, and allowed less yards per carry than the Chiefs despite facing the most rushing attempts in the NFL.

Before that, he was secondary coach for the Ravens for 5 years. He was the secondary coach on their 2000 championship D under Marvin Lewis, and developed some pretty good guys like McAlister and Ed Reed.

Lzen
01-05-2006, 03:25 PM
He's been their DC the last two years. In 2004, last year, they were ranked 4th in the NFL in points allowed. This year their numbers weren't quite as good, but some of that had to do with their depleted offense. They still finished 2nd in the league against the pass, and allowed less yards per carry than the Chiefs.

Before that, he was secondary coach for the Ravens for 4-5 years. He was the secondary coach on their championship D under Marvin Lewis, and developed some pretty good guys like McAlister and Ed Reed.

Wow, thanks tk. That's some good info. So, looks like B_Ambuhli is talking out of his ass again. Moron.

Mecca
01-05-2006, 03:26 PM
Wow, thanks tk. That's some good info. So, looks like B_Ambuhli is talking out of his ass again. Moron.

Were you expecting anything diferent?

the Talking Can
01-05-2006, 03:27 PM
He's been their DC the last two years. In 2004, last year, they were ranked 4th in the NFL in points allowed. This year their numbers weren't quite as good, but some of that had to do with their depleted offense. They still finished 2nd in the league against the pass, and allowed less yards per carry than the Chiefs.

Before that, he was secondary coach for the Ravens for 4-5 years. He was the secondary coach on their championship D under Marvin Lewis, and developed some pretty good guys like McAlister and Ed Reed.

so I was close...he sounds interesting...I think we need some new blood...and we could use his secondary expertise

B_Ambuehl
01-06-2006, 11:53 PM
Look how his defense ranks against other coaches running the same scheme. Pay particular attention to the number of big plays given up by his defense vs the others and 1st down yards allowed.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/9148834

Then compare the stats of his defense vs Gunthers defense. There is very little difference despite him having a much more talented roster. In fact Gun's 1st down defense has been up near the very top of the league the last 2 years.

Count Zarth
01-07-2006, 12:03 AM
What the hell. Honestly.

They fired Cottrell, brought in Henderson and voila! Jets ranked 8th and 4th in scoring defense.

WTF is wrong with Henderson?

B_Ambuehl
01-07-2006, 12:18 AM
What's wrong with Henderson is the stats and my observation on his game management don't indicate that he's much of an upgrade whatsoever. His positive scoring defense you mentioned can largely be attributed to the Martyball approach employed by the entire team. Not only does his defense give up big plays down the field but they don't stop the run on first down. Guns defense has given up big plays but at least they stop the run on early downs. His (Henderson's) defense was among the worst on stopping 4th down opportunities largely because they seemed to play with poor awareness and often couldn't get lined up properly (see NE vs NYJ 2 weeks ago).

Additionally, every KC Chief fan had a firsthand look at how the Chiefs offense totally dismantled his defensive attack in week 1. And that was a highly touted playoff defensive attack with pro bowlers at DL, LB, and CB. KC running for 4 or 5 yards per carry or piling up yards when playing against a defense lacking talent is one thing (such as Marvin Lewis's defense), but running for 10 + yards per carry for an entire half of football and piling up 400 yards of offense without Willie Roaf against a football team that had 9 months to prepare for that game is something else.

Additionally, Donnie Henderson seems to promote a lax attitude and lack of discipline amongst his players. In a preseason scrimmage they were involved in a brawl with the Giants and in the KC game a fight broke out between 2 linebackers.

Take all that for what it's worth but I guess we'll see if/when he gets here.

Count Zarth
01-07-2006, 01:09 AM
Are you basing all of this on THIS YEAR'S NYJ defense?

In 2004 they only gave up 3.62 yards per carry. That's pretty f*cking good.

Tribal Warfare
01-07-2006, 01:19 AM
Are you basing all of this on THIS YEAR'S NYJ defense?

In 2004 they only gave up 3.62 yards per carry. That's pretty f*cking good.


gochiefs don't worry about it. He seems like those type of guys as kid whined and cried when he didn't get his way or that toy he thought he had comming for Christmas, but it never appeared. So he just takes all that frustration all on us when his favorite coach doesn't get the job. So everyone sucks except his choices.









.

Count Zarth
01-07-2006, 01:25 AM
gochiefs don't worry about it. He seems like those type of guys as kid whined and cried when he didn't get his way or that toy he thought he had comming for Christmas, but it never appeared. So he just takes all that frustration all on us when his favorite coach doesn't get the job. So everyone sucks except his choices.



Uh...what?

We're talking about Donnie Henderson.

I think he's a good DC, and he has skins on the wall.

Tribal Warfare
01-07-2006, 01:31 AM
Uh...what?

We're talking about Donnie Henderson.

I think he's a good DC, and he has skins on the wall.


Yeah, and I was I'm implying that........... AAAh Hell

Donnie Henderson is a badass DC, and Gun should be kicked to the curb

Count Zarth
01-07-2006, 01:35 AM
Yeah, and I was I'm implying that........... AAAh Hell

Donnie Henderson is a badass DC, and Gun should be kicked to the curb

Pretty much.

B_Ambuehl
01-07-2006, 07:51 AM
Gochiefs in this leage the most important predictor of immediate success is "what have you done for me lately".

gochiefs don't worry about it. He seems like those type of guys as kid whined and cried when he didn't get his way or that toy he thought he had comming for Christmas, but it never appeared. So he just takes all that frustration all on us when his favorite coach doesn't get the job. So everyone sucks except his choices.

Oh is that right? Name one other poster out of the hundreds or thousands on this forum who uses as much supporting statistical and background information to support their statements as I do?

You are right about one thing. And that is for the most part I think everyone does suck except for my choices, :), but that's generally because I think I've done a pretty good job on my homework when it comes to available choices. The Herm hiring has been a concern of mine ever since September 11 for this exact reason....and I paid attention throughout the year and that only built more cause for concern. I wasn't originally for Greg Williams and said as much, but after digging through the stats and reviewing some of the games I wasn't afraid to say I was wrong about him.

ChiefsCountry
01-07-2006, 08:09 AM
If you are basing any defense by what our offense did to them, you are stupid as hell. And the game was at Arrowhead to boot.

Count Zarth
01-07-2006, 08:17 AM
Gochiefs in this leage the most important predictor of immediate success is "what have you done for me lately".

So...is that why you're supporting Herm Edwards coming off a 4-12 season?

ROFL

B_Ambuehl
01-07-2006, 08:19 AM
ohhhhh.....Ok. So defensive coordinators get a free pass when they go against Kansas City's offense do they? I see how things work.

I bet Greg Williams and Jim Johnson didn't see things the same way. (Both of who's defenses forced KCs offense to really work)

B_Ambuehl
01-07-2006, 08:21 AM
who said I was "supporting" Herm Edwards? I was supporting Saunders. I'm somewhat "tolerant" of Herm, given the right conditions, - and he can "earn" my support by future performance. But jumping up and down for joy? Hell no.

Count Zarth
01-07-2006, 08:22 AM
who said I was "supporting" Herm Edwards? I was supporting Saunders. I'm somewhat "tolerant" of Herm, given the right conditions, - and he can "earn" my support by future performance. But jumping up and down for joy? Hell no.

Okay, fair enough.

So you think Donnie Henderson sucks because he had one bad season preceded by two good ones?

RedThat
01-07-2006, 08:27 AM
I think B_Ambuehl sucks. Very dumb posts, and observations.

B_Ambuehl
01-07-2006, 08:36 AM
GoChiefs you could say I think he sux period. 10 good seasons and one back one.....9 bad ones and 1 good on......Play with the words any way you want. I already listed why I think Donnie Henderson sux. You don't have to believe it if you don't want to.

Count Zarth
01-07-2006, 08:38 AM
GoChiefs you could say I think he sux period. 10 good seasons and one back one.....9 bad ones and 1 good on......Play with the words any way you want. I already listed why I think Donnie Henderson sux. You don't have to believe it if you don't want to.

OK, I am just trying to understand your logic.

Surely you railed against Trent Green after 2001?

B_Ambuehl
01-07-2006, 08:43 AM
No, I never railed against Trent Green. I've already given you my reasoning I don't know what else I can say. Part of my job involves scouting football players. Fortunately I get to do my job and have fun at the same time. I've watched film on this defense, have watched film on a bunch of other defenses...tons and tons of film....and am not impressed with Henderson's defense. It has nothing to do with last year, 10 years ago, or whenever. It is right now as one supporting the KC chiefs defense I thik Henderson is a mistake as coach of that defense.