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View Full Version : I think herm will do pretty well in KC


LesterLyles
01-18-2006, 01:10 PM
I am a Jets fan who has posted here the last few days just to see what you guys think of the Herm hire. I supported Herm for most if his time here but actually it was two seasons ago i.e. a 10-6 campaign that I began to think he was more fluff than stuff. That being said Herm has such a strong ability to get guys to play hard that I think the Chiefs will stay competitive even as your player age and the the roster replenishes. As for advancing in the playoffs, who knows. In all 3 yrs the Jets made th playoffs, the Jets lost on the road to the superior team so its hard to totally blame Herm for that. His faults are certainly well documented i.e. clock mgt, throwing guys under the bus, uting too much on his coordinators but whe will still be able to win. Good luck and its been nioce checking in here the last few days.

DaWolf
01-18-2006, 01:15 PM
Thanks for adding your input to the board bro. My hope is that Herm was able to grow as a coach the last 5 years and will be able to carry whatever lessons he learned here in his second stint. Considering the guy was a rookie head coach with no coordinators experience, he was bound to have problems.

Good luck with Mangini, Hope that turns out to be a good hire for you guys, although I suspect he'll probably have to go through similar growing pains...

milkman
01-18-2006, 01:18 PM
I haven't jumped on Hermie's bandwagon, but I'm curious what you mean when you say that he puts too much on the coordinators?

If he had hired a competent DC, then it wouldn't have bothered me in the least if he just let that DC do his job.

If he hires a competent OC, then I want him to stay the hell away from the offense and let the OC run the offensive side of things.

LesterLyles
01-18-2006, 01:33 PM
I haven't jumped on Hermie's bandwagon, but I'm curious what you mean when you say that he puts too much on the coordinators?

If he had hired a competent DC, then it wouldn't have bothered me in the least if he just let that DC do his job.

If he hires a competent OC, then I want him to stay the hell away from the offense and let the OC run the offensive side of things.

As far as football acumen goes, Herm is limited. This isn't a disgruntled Jets fan speaking, trust me. You will see. He hires coordinators to essentially entirely run each unit. Now that doesn't sound so bad on the surface but when units struggle the HC should ultimately be accountable and he was either unable or unwilling to get anything done. Our respective units were plagued by the same problems year in and year out. He would say things like "We gotta throw the ball deep" about the offense and "we gotta get to the ball" about the defense and nothing would happen. It created bad work environments (remember the fight on the sideline last year in the playoffs) and the NY press accentuated it (You won't have that roblem as much). Eventually both original coordinators got canned and he kept his
job. One huge criticsm was that according to Herm, it was never his fault.

Now one of you guys made a point about Herm leraning from his mistakes and I think that will happen (one of the reasons why I think he will do well). I still don't think he'll ever be the sharpest tool in the shed (this will hurt you in big games) but for example his first couple of years here he told the media everything and allowed assistants to openly talk to the media. This completyely backfired and he was able to change that in last few years he kept everything in-house. He was able to learn and adjust. I think he will also lean and adjust for the better in terms of dealing with coordinators

htismaqe
01-18-2006, 01:40 PM
So, in essence, Herm's problem is that he hires bad coordinators and then doesn't get rid of them when they fail?

I think we probably knew that already, considering he's keeping Gunther.

:D

LesterLyles
01-18-2006, 01:41 PM
I haven't jumped on Hermie's bandwagon, but I'm curious what you mean when you say that he puts too much on the coordinators?

If he had hired a competent DC, then it wouldn't have bothered me in the least if he just let that DC do his job.

If he hires a competent OC, then I want him to stay the hell away from the offense and let the OC run the offensive side of things.

As far as football acumen goes, Herm is limited. This isn't a disgruntled Jets fan speaking, trust me. You will see. He hires coordinators to essentially entirely run each unit. Now that doesn't sound so bad on the surface but when units struggle the HC should ultimately be accountable and he was either unable or unwilling to get anything done. Our respective units were plagued by the same problems year in and year out. He would say things like "We gotta throw the ball deep" about the offense and "we gotta get to the ball" about the defense and nothing would happen. It created bad work environments (remember the fight on the sideline last year in the playoffs) and the NY press accentuated it (You won't have that roblem as much). Eventually both original coordinators got canned and he kept his
job. One huge criticsm was that according to Herm, it was never his fault.

Now one of you guys made a point about Herm lerning rom his mistakes and I think that will happen (one of the reasons why i think he will do well). I still don't think he'll ever be the sharpest tool in the shed (this will hurt you in big games) but for exampel his first couple of years here he told the media everything and allowed assistants to openly talk to the media. Tjis completyely backfired and in last few years he kept everything in-house. He was able to learn and adjust. I think he will also lean and adjust for the better in terms of dealing with coordinators

Baby Lee
01-18-2006, 01:43 PM
As far as football acumen goes, Herm is limited. This isn't a disgruntled Jets fan speaking, trust me. You will see. He hires coordinators to essentially entirely run each unit. Now that doesn't sound so bad on the surface but when units struggle the HC should ultimately be accountable and he was either unable or unwilling to get anything done.
After DV helming our D for 5 years, I think we'll survive. ;)

J Diddy
01-18-2006, 01:45 PM
So, in essence, Herm's problem is that he hires bad coordinators and then doesn't get rid of them when they fail?

I think we probably knew that already, considering he's keeping Gunther.

:D



All this hate for gunther is gonna leave you old, lonely, and bitter.

htismaqe
01-18-2006, 01:50 PM
All this hate for gunther is gonna leave you old, lonely, and bitter.

It might.

If it weren't justifiably TRUE.

:D

OldNo7
01-18-2006, 01:50 PM
So long as he has quality coordinators, Herm can be an effective leader. Unlike his old boss in Indy, he'll actually take charge of a team. I guarantee Herm wouldn't let Peyton call off his punt team or change all the running plays in the losses to SD and Pitt.

That being said, I don't think Herm is the most intellectual coach in the league. I think he kind of folds in tough spots when he needs to make a decision. Is he the best hire of this offseason? Probably. But I really don't know if he's what I'd call a Super Bowl coach.

LesterLyles
01-18-2006, 01:58 PM
So long as he has quality coordinators, Herm can be an effective leader. Unlike his old boss in Indy, he'll actually take charge of a team. I guarantee Herm wouldn't let Peyton call off his punt team or change all the running plays in the losses to SD and Pitt.

That being said, I don't think Herm is the most intellectual coach in the league. I think he kind of folds in tough spots when he needs to make a decision. Is he the best hire of this offseason? Probably. But I really don't know if he's what I'd call a Super Bowl coach.

oldno7, get used to confused looks from herm. On basic things like that he will ask his coordinators and his clock boy, Dick Curl what to do. I actually shouldn't say that. For simpler decisions like whether to go for it, he will be assertive and in that regard, he is better than Dungy. but wait until there are 2 penalties or your under 2 minutes. Man, you are going to scratch your head.

LesterLyles
01-18-2006, 02:12 PM
I also forgot to menion that you will be one of the LEAST penalized teams in the leagu. This may not seem like a big deal but you guys know as well as I do that there is such a fine line b/w winning and losing. I think that contributed to SEVERAL of our wins (we won a lot of close games).

OldNo7
01-18-2006, 02:22 PM
oldno7, get used to confused looks from herm. On basic things like that he will ask his coordinators and his clock boy, Dick Curl what to do. I actually shouldn't say that. For simpler decisions like whether to go for it, he will be assertive and in that regard, he is better than Dungy. but wait until there are 2 penalties or your under 2 minutes. Man, you are going to scratch your head.

I know that Al Saunders was the people's choice to take over, but other than him who would have been better than Herm? I don't see a guy like Nick Saban in this year's crop, a coach with no previous NFL HC experience coming in and succeeding. Maybe Man-Gina's going to be that buy, but these Chiefs are old with a small window and they need someone who can relate to them.

LesterLyles
01-18-2006, 02:26 PM
Mana-gina is a risk. I'm willing to take it but nobody including Bellicheck has an idea whether he can succeed as a HC.

One other thing is that Herm has experience taking over a good team. If you remeber the Jets were similar to the CHiefs at the end of 2000 i.e. not a rebuilding project. That will serve him well.

Are you guys keeping Saunders?

OldNo7
01-18-2006, 02:39 PM
[QUOTE=LesterLyles]Mana-gina is a risk. I'm willing to take it but nobody including Bellicheck has an idea whether he can succeed as a HC. [QUOTE]

Did you see how nervous he was at the press conference? When he was saying that no one is ready for their first HC job just like no one's ready to be a parent?

For the record, I think he'll do well. Jets need to stock the backfield for the future, but the defense will continue to put them in the position to win games.

So the guy who replaced Man-gina is named Pees?

DaWolf
01-18-2006, 02:43 PM
Mana-gina is a risk. I'm willing to take it but nobody including Bellicheck has an idea whether he can succeed as a HC.

One other thing is that Herm has experience taking over a good team. If you remeber the Jets were similar to the CHiefs at the end of 2000 i.e. not a rebuilding project. That will serve him well.

Are you guys keeping Saunders?

Probably not. Depends on if the Raiders hire him or not...