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C-Mac
03-23-2006, 09:23 AM
http://www.news-leader.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060216/BREAKING01/60216004
Rural firefighters take pass on battling flames at nonpaying residence
:eek:
Associated Press

Monett, Mo.
Rural firefighters stood by and watched a fire destroy a garage and a vehicle because the property owner, who was injured battling the flames, had not paid membership dues.
Monett Rural Fire Department Chief Ronnie Myers defended the policy, saying the membership-based organization could not survive if people thought the department would respond for free. The department said it will fight a fire without question if a life is believed to be in danger.
Myers said he would make an effort to explain the membership policy to the area's new Hispanic residents after the property's owner, Bibaldo Rueda, said he had never been told of the dues policy since moving there 1 1/2 years ago.
According to Barry County Sheriff's Detective Robert Evenson, the fire broke out Monday on four acres owned by Rueda south of Monett, about 50 miles southwest of Springfield.
Four mobile homes and a number of vehicles were on the property. Rueda managed to get one mobile home out of the way, using a garden hose and buckets, but was burned in the process, Evenson said.
Monett Rural Fire Department responded to the scene but did not fight the fire. Firefighters stood by from the road as the fire burned itself out, watching in case the flames spread to neighboring properties owned by members.
"People need to realize you've got to become a member. If you live outside the city limits, you need to join one of the rural fire departments", Myers said.
Rueda offered to pay, Evenson said, but the Monett department does not have a policy for on-the-spot billing.
Nearby Cassville and Mt. Vernon have gone to tax-supported rural fire districts, following a public vote, wherein all fires are fought.
Rural Monett members have not been asked to choose between memberships and tax support, though they came out strongly against a proposed Aurora Rural Bi-County Fire Protection District, which was voted down in 2001.

Rain Man
03-23-2006, 09:26 AM
It sounds harsh, but the idea of a rural fire department is that everyone chips in to pay for the equipment and maintenance and stuff. If everybody could pay only when they needed the service, the service wouldn't exist in the first place.

Either pay the dues or keep a bunch of buckets handy.

Pitt Gorilla
03-23-2006, 09:27 AM
Unreal. I understand the policy, but I can't imagine having that much disregard for others.

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 09:27 AM
Hmmm,victim was of Hispanic background.
Doubt that would had any bearing on the matter.

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 09:28 AM
It sounds harsh, but the idea of a rural fire department is that everyone chips in to pay for the equipment and maintenance and stuff. If everybody could pay only when they needed the service, the service wouldn't exist in the first place.

Either pay the dues or keep a bunch of buckets handy.

He did offer to pay once he knew he was supposed to.

Sully
03-23-2006, 09:30 AM
Compassion at work again...
damn tree huggers.

jspchief
03-23-2006, 09:31 AM
They drove out there, and just watched?

I'm pretty mixed on this. I understand the fiscal side of it, but at the same time I would hope that human compassion would play a role in all of this. Seems kind of cold to just let a man's shit burn to the ground.

There was a time in this country when neighbors would have been hauling buckets without a thought of money or the effort they were putting forth.

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 09:38 AM
They drove out there, and just watched?

I'm pretty mixed on this. I understand the fiscal side of it, but at the same time I would hope that human compassion would play a role in all of this. Seems kind of cold to just let a man's shit burn to the ground.

There was a time in this country when neighbors would have been hauling buckets without a thought of money or the effort they were putting forth.

You are correct, its a sad state of affairs. Reminds me of the old days in the south.

ROYC75
03-23-2006, 09:38 AM
:eek: I wasn't aware there were still rual residents paying for fire services. I was on a volunteer fire dept. growing upin Kansas in the late 70's. We switched from a resident volunteer pay to a county wide tax that covered this.

Matter of fact , I was under the understanding that all county residents were to be taxed in the country by the year 1980 if I recall.

WOW, Just WOW.

Rain Man
03-23-2006, 09:40 AM
He did offer to pay once he knew he was supposed to.

Well, yeah, once he needed the service. But fire protection by definition isn't a pay-as-you-need-it kind of deal.

The only other option on this would be for the fire department to have a form that gives them a lien on the property if the guy doesn't pay them some penalty amount. You could either charge the guy for this fire "and the next one's free" as long as he pays his dues, or you can offer "pay on the spot" for a price of twenty times the amount of paying up front.

Fire trucks aren't free.

Cochise
03-23-2006, 09:43 AM
It sounds harsh, but the idea of a rural fire department is that everyone chips in to pay for the equipment and maintenance and stuff. If everybody could pay only when they needed the service, the service wouldn't exist in the first place.

Either pay the dues or keep a bunch of buckets handy.

Yeah, I agree. If there's no danger to a person or to it spreading anyway. You can't have a membership fire department when people know that if they don't pay the fire department will still show up.

Cave Johnson
03-23-2006, 09:44 AM
Four mobile homes and a number of vehicles were on the property. Rueda managed to get one mobile home out of the way, using a garden hose and buckets, but was burned in the process, Evenson said.

Ok, let me get this straight. So this guys is, what, a landlord for Hispanics who probably work at a chicken processing plant. It's certainly questionable whether he's fluent in English enough to understand the fire dept dues.

So the guy tries to save 4 mobile homes, get burned in the process, and the firefighters sit around and watch. Enjoy church next Sunday, you hypocrite f****.

e_train69
03-23-2006, 09:45 AM
In the town where I live (Oklahoma) we have $35 fire dues every year. If you don't pay those fire dues and you have to make a call to the Volunteer Fire Dept. it costs you $500. They will put out the fire, but you are charged a lot more. I can't imagine them just watching it burn. :(

jspchief
03-23-2006, 09:47 AM
Enjoy church next Sunday, you hypocrite f****. :thumb:

MOhillbilly
03-23-2006, 09:51 AM
Ok, let me get this straight. So this guys is, what, a landlord for Hispanics who probably work at a chicken processing plant. It's certainly questionable whether he's fluent in English enough to understand the fire dept dues.

So the guy tries to save 4 mobile homes, get burned in the process, and the firefighters sit around and watch. Enjoy church next Sunday, you hypocrite f****.


he didnt get burned bad and he spoke fluent english.

Lawerance county has had some nice methlab fires where firefighters have gotten hurt and equipment destroyed.

Cave Johnson
03-23-2006, 09:52 AM
In the town where I live (Oklahoma) we have $35 fire dues every year. If you don't pay those fire dues and you have to make a call to the Volunteer Fire Dept. it costs you $500. They will put out the fire, but you are charged a lot more. I can't imagine them just watching it burn. :(

I can't believe they didn't have some sort of policy like this in place. Another possibility is that they did but were skeptical about his ability to pay.

JBucc
03-23-2006, 09:52 AM
I know this is sad, but the picture in my head of firefighters just sitting around drinking beers while watching some hispanic guy run around with a hose is pretty damn funny.

morphius
03-23-2006, 09:55 AM
In the town where I live (Oklahoma) we have $35 fire dues every year. If you don't pay those fire dues and you have to make a call to the Volunteer Fire Dept. it costs you $500. They will put out the fire, but you are charged a lot more. I can't imagine them just watching it burn. :(
Now that I could see and seems fair.

Cormac
03-23-2006, 09:56 AM
Ok, let me get this straight. So this guys is, what, a landlord for Hispanics who probably work at a chicken processing plant. It's certainly questionable whether he's fluent in English enough to understand the fire dept dues.

So the guy tries to save 4 mobile homes, get burned in the process, and the firefighters sit around and watch. Enjoy church next Sunday, you hypocrite f****.

:clap:

Thank you.

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 09:56 AM
God forbid if your dues check gets lost in the mail.

SLAG
03-23-2006, 09:56 AM
I know this is sad, but the picture in my head of firefighters just sitting around drinking beers while watching some hispanic guy run around with a hose is pretty damn funny.

Funny Yet Sad,
And they call mexican's Lazy... Those Firefighters were just local Yokles who happen to be Pyros so they joined the FD to watch shit burn not really help

Wichita Lineman
03-23-2006, 09:58 AM
I can see both sides of this argument and all I can say is I'm glad I wasn't the one who had to decide to let this man lose his home. It would make for some uneasy nights I would think.

OnTheWarpath58
03-23-2006, 09:59 AM
Anyone else besides me think that had this "non paying resident" been the Fire Chief's family, friend or neighbor, they would have just stood around?

Doubt it.

Skip Towne
03-23-2006, 09:59 AM
Those firemen need a good suing. Don't laugh. I've seen crazier ideas pay off.

Lzen
03-23-2006, 10:02 AM
Enjoy church next Sunday, you hypocrite f****.

I'm must've missed the part where it said anything about whether he even goes to church.

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 10:02 AM
Anyone else besides me think that had this "non paying resident" been the Fire Chief's family, friend or neighbor, they would have just stood around?

Doubt it.

...only if he was Hispanic.

ChiefsfaninPA
03-23-2006, 10:04 AM
I thought firemen took some kind of oath. I have never been a big advocate of suing someone, but if ever a situation fit the bill. Dues or no dues, you can not as a HUMAN BEING stand by as a firefighter and watch someones stuff burn down because they didn't pay there dues. I am sure there would be a way for the department to recoupe some money from this man at a later point for there help.

Lzen
03-23-2006, 10:04 AM
They should've put out the fire and billed them. That was a pretty crappy thing to do.

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 10:05 AM
I'm must've missed the part where it said anything about whether he even goes to church.

I think he was playing the odds.

Cave Johnson
03-23-2006, 10:07 AM
I'm must've missed the part where it said anything about whether he even goes to church.

That's f**** plural, with a s on the end. Meaning the firefighters, not the Hispanic guy.

OnTheWarpath58
03-23-2006, 10:10 AM
They should've put out the fire and billed them. That was a pretty crappy thing to do.

Isn't that what happens when an ambulance is called?

Or maybe in Monett it's like this:

Operator: 911 Emergency response, what is your emergency?

Non-paying resident: I'm having a heart attack! Please send help!

Operator: Sorry sir, looks like your dues are unpaid. We'll send someone out to determine if your condition is "life threatening." Are you by any chance hispanic....?

jvan05
03-23-2006, 10:12 AM
Our rural fire department collects $35/year for dues. If they fight fire where the owner hasn't paid his dues, it's $500 to open the door and $200/truck. It's happened before, they fought the fire and collected over $1000 after putting the fire out.

Seems pretty simple to me. Monett's rules are f*cked.

OnTheWarpath58
03-23-2006, 10:13 AM
Our rural fire department collects $35/year for dues. If they fight fire where the owner hasn't paid his dues, it's $500 to open the door and $200/truck. It's happened before, they fought the fire and collected over $1000 after putting the fire out.

Seems pretty simple to me. Monett's rules are f*cked.

:clap:

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 10:14 AM
Our rural fire department collects $35/year for dues. If they fight fire where the owner hasn't paid his dues, it's $500 to open the door and $200/truck. It's happened before, they fought the fire and collected over $1000 after putting the fire out.

Seems pretty simple to me. Monett's rules are f*cked.

....rules? :spock:

jspchief
03-23-2006, 10:16 AM
If you were a firefighter, would you have stood back and watched?

I don't think I would have. I'm not widely considered to be a compassionate human, but even with the ice that runs in my veins, I don't think I could have actually stood there and watched this go down.

jvan05
03-23-2006, 10:17 AM
....rules? :spock:


Ok... policies.

Poster Nutbag
03-23-2006, 10:18 AM
"Did you know there was a time when firemen used to put out fires?"

Ray Bradbury
Fahrenheit 451

OnTheWarpath58
03-23-2006, 10:18 AM
If you were a firefighter, would you have stood back and watched?

I don't think I would have. I'm not widely considered to be a compassionate human, but even with the ice that runs in my veins, I don't think I could have actually stood there and watched this go down.

But he was hispanic! :rolleyes:

JBucc
03-23-2006, 10:18 AM
If you were a firefighter, would you have stood back and watched?

I don't think I would have. I'm not widely considered to be a compassionate human, but even with the ice that runs in my veins, I don't think I could have actually stood there and watched this go down.I would have put it out just so I could have an excuse to play with my hose...

ROYC75
03-23-2006, 10:20 AM
That's why a county wide tax per year is the right plan. All is covered this way.

OnTheWarpath58
03-23-2006, 10:20 AM
I would have put it out just so I could have an excuse to play with my hose...

You need an excuse?

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 10:21 AM
Ok... policies.

I was just poking at the thought them not having an ethical set of policies or rules.

JBucc
03-23-2006, 10:24 AM
You need an excuse?for my conscience

Lzen
03-23-2006, 10:24 AM
That's f**** plural, with a s on the end. Meaning the firefighters, not the Hispanic guy.

I knew that. But that's okay, you can continue to be full of crap if you want.

OnTheWarpath58
03-23-2006, 10:25 AM
for my consciousn

For your conscience?

Oh-for two, man.

:)

Lzen
03-23-2006, 10:26 AM
If you were a firefighter, would you have stood back and watched?

I don't think I would have. I'm not widely considered to be a compassionate human, but even with the ice that runs in my veins, I don't think I could have actually stood there and watched this go down.


Yeah, I know I couldn't just watch. That's the part that baffles me about this story.

JBucc
03-23-2006, 10:27 AM
However the **** it's spelled

OnTheWarpath58
03-23-2006, 10:30 AM
Yeah, I know I couldn't just watch. That's the part that baffles me about this story.

Some places still haven't lost the 1960's attitude towards minorities.

Pathetic, but true.

Iowanian
03-23-2006, 10:36 AM
The Blue Lighter complex.....

So many of those guys are complete douchebags. The area where my folks have a cabin, has a blue light fire brigade with dues etc...The "fire Chief" is a 400lb lardass, with 1 leg who told my dad when he offered to help when there "I don't know if you're physically qualified".

If they were standing there...it was bullshit they didn't put it out. Hell....they got to run the siren and had a chance to put their shiney helmets on and everything.

If he hadn't paid...put the damn fire out, and charge him a service fee.

jspchief
03-23-2006, 10:39 AM
I can't help but think of the firefighters on 9/11 and the sacrifice they made, in comparison to what these guys did.

OnTheWarpath58
03-23-2006, 10:41 AM
I can't help but think of the firefighters on 9/11 and the sacrifice they made, in comparison to what these guys did.

Standing Ovation

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

morphius
03-23-2006, 10:42 AM
I have an awful urge to say that they were just beating the tornado to the punch...

but that would probably be wrong.

KC Kings
03-23-2006, 10:49 AM
"Monett Rural Fire Department Chief Ronnie Myers defended the policy, saying the membership-based organization could not survive if people thought the department would respond for free. The department said it will fight a fire without question if a life is believed to be in danger."

You are telling me that they saw a Mexican that close to an open flame, and didn't believe that his life was in danger??? You know how greasy those Mexicans are, one little spark could have made the poor fella explode.

Frazod
03-23-2006, 10:59 AM
Some thoughts on this:

1. If the "victim" in question was white, this story wouldn't even be newsworthy.

2. Maybe I should cancel my auto insurance, and then AFTER I get in accident, I'll offer to pay a premium. I'm sure the insurance company would be receptive to that idea.

3. I urge everybody who thinks the VOLUNTEER firemen were wrong to calculate how much money you'll earn at work today and write a check to your employer for that amount, since you're obviously a big supporter of working for free.

:shake:

wazu
03-23-2006, 11:03 AM
He did offer to pay once he knew he was supposed to.

I'll be he offered to pay for insurance, too.

Iowanian
03-23-2006, 11:05 AM
Not even close to the same thing Fraz.

Volunteer firemen "volunteer" to provide public service. Its also the definition of "good ole boys" club in most small towns, only in some, its a bunch of dorks with blue lights and a power trip.

I'm sure its different elsewhere, but fire depts in Iowa are tax payer funded. I've already more than worked enough to have paid for a fire to get put out.

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 11:07 AM
.

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 11:10 AM
Not even close to the same thing Fraz.

Volunteer firemen "volunteer" to provide public service. Its also the definition of "good ole boys" club in most small towns, only in some, its a bunch of dorks with blue lights and a power trip.

I'm sure its different elsewhere, but fire depts in Iowa are tax payer funded. I've already more than worked enough to have paid for a fire to get put out.

:thumb:

Frazod
03-23-2006, 11:12 AM
The guy had a year and a half to figure out what was going on. He didn't. Now, if there was some vast conspiracy to keep him in the dark about the way the department operated, that would be a different story. I didn't see that mentioned, however.

If the department was publicly funded, and they stood by and did nothing, that would be a different story. It clearly wasn't.

If the department stood by and watched the guy burn to death, that would be a different story. They didn't.

The paying residents should have no responsibility to subsidize the non-paying residents. Free rides come when the government takes over.

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 11:14 AM
I'll be he offered to pay for insurance, too.

I wouldnt offer to buy them a new car or buy them a new house, but I would have helped save it from total destruction.

ChiefsfaninPA
03-23-2006, 11:14 AM
3. I urge everybody who thinks the VOLUNTEER firemen were wrong to calculate how much money you'll earn at work today and write a check to your employer for that amount, since you're obviously a big supporter of working for free.:shake:

Here is an idea...Don't volunteer to be a firemen if you don't want to fight a fire no matter whether the guy paid his dues or not. No one made them volunteer. They volunteered because they supposebly like HELPING society. Most of the volunteer firefighters in my area volunteer with the idea of one day maybe getting into a paid department. It is sort of like an internship. That and they get a blue light and the authority to direct traffic and act all important.

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 11:15 AM
The guy had a year and a half to figure out what was going on. He didn't. Now, if there was some vast conspiracy to keep him in the dark about the way the department operated, that would be a different story. I didn't see that mentioned, however.

If the department was publicly funded, and they stood by and did nothing, that would be a different story. It clearly wasn't.

If the department stood by and watched the guy burn to death, that would be a different story. They didn't.

The paying residents should have no responsibility to subsidize the non-paying residents. Free rides come when the government takes over.

Like I mentioned before, God forbid if your dues check gets lost in the mail.

SLAG
03-23-2006, 11:18 AM
Since they would have put out the fire if there was going to be harm to a Life,,, and the Dude Got Burned by trying to put it out himself..

he should have ran inside the buildings until they put out the fire...Imagine this story if he would have died doing this if they still wouldnt have put it out

MOhillbilly
03-23-2006, 11:24 AM
pffff. i dont give a shit eitherway cause its a moot point. anyone ever heard of a home that wasnt a total loss even if the rural fire dept. showed up?


on a side note for you hippies monett had a sign at the edge of town for years warning non whites not to be in and around town after dark- thats a fact.

ROYC75
03-23-2006, 11:28 AM
I have an awful urge to say that they were just beating the tornado to the punch...

but that would probably be wrong.


Ouch !
ROFL

go bowe
03-23-2006, 11:33 AM
where's pastor mike?

he served as a volunteer fireman for years...

SLAG
03-23-2006, 11:35 AM
pffff. i dont give a shit eitherway cause its a moot point. anyone ever heard of a home that wasnt a total loss even if the rural fire dept. showed up?


on a side note for you hippies monett had a sign at the edge of town for years warning non whites not to be in and around town after dark- thats a fact.

I understood PEKIN IL, Had a sign that said all N***ERS OUT BY 7PM or something

Pitt Gorilla
03-23-2006, 11:35 AM
Here is an idea...Don't volunteer to be a firemen if you don't want to fight a fire no matter whether the guy paid his dues or not. No one made them volunteer. They volunteered because they supposebly like HELPING society. Most of the volunteer firefighters in my area volunteer with the idea of one day maybe getting into a paid department. It is sort of like an internship. That and they get a blue light and the authority to direct traffic and act all important.Dang, we didn't get any of those things. Our volunteer department simply showed up when the "fire phone" rang at home. It was sort of like a party line where everyone in the department would get the special ring. We had 3 trucks and put out anyone's fire. We may have had a small, publicly financed budget, but it wasn't much. Most of the money for maintenance came from BBQs and such, where the food was donated by the volunteers.

MOhillbilly
03-23-2006, 11:38 AM
I understood PEKIN IL, Had a sign that said all N***ERS OUT BY 7PM or something


if i remember correctly this one said something to the effect of " if your skin is black, dont let our sun set on your back "

Hydrae
03-23-2006, 11:55 AM
They drove out there, and just watched?

I'm pretty mixed on this. I understand the fiscal side of it, but at the same time I would hope that human compassion would play a role in all of this. Seems kind of cold to just let a man's shit burn to the ground.

There was a time in this country when neighbors would have been hauling buckets without a thought of money or the effort they were putting forth.


Now you see the downside of capitalism and the "Me me me" mindset in which this country seems to be mired. We have gotten to be a country that worries about money above all else. Unfortunately this kind of thing is the result.

C-Mac
03-23-2006, 03:59 PM
Now you see the downside of capitalism and the "Me me me" mindset in which this country seems to be mired. We have gotten to be a country that worries about money above all else. Unfortunately this kind of thing is the result.

I dont know if capitalism is to blame but there is no doubt that many people in many lands have had too much Vitamin I.