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View Full Version : For those of you concerned about the government's involvement in the Internet...


htismaqe
04-06-2006, 08:17 AM
This is FAR scarier than the FCC putting a rubber stamp on performance-based networking and the threat to net neutrality...

http://www.linuxelectrons.com/article.php/20060406031301790

SLAG
04-06-2006, 08:25 AM
:eek: Im glad I didnt switch to ATT DSL now

Lzen
04-06-2006, 08:33 AM
Hmmm, I guess I don't really see the scary part. You know, since I'm NOT A FREAKIN' TERRORIST!!

htismaqe
04-06-2006, 08:35 AM
The very fact that they're wholesale forwarding internet traffic to the NSA to be "filtered" is scary. I sincerely hope my company isn't doing it.

The reason it's scary?

Because it's the EXACT thing the ISP's in CHINA do...

Simplex3
04-06-2006, 08:51 AM
Hmmm, I guess I don't really see the scary part. You know, since I'm NOT A FREAKIN' TERRORIST!!
I guess you're positive that a cousin of your biggest competitor won't ever wind up in the govt. You must also be sure that nobody will ever get into the govt. and use that access to steal your financial info, credit cards numbers, etc. Good thing you're also sure that no hacker will get on your Internet connection and do s**t.

Man, it must be nice to be so sure.

Kerberos
04-06-2006, 08:59 AM
The very fact that they're wholesale forwarding internet traffic to the NSA to be "filtered" is scary. I sincerely hope my company isn't doing it.

The reason it's scary?

Because it's the EXACT thing the ISP's in CHINA do...


If everyone thinks about it this is something that was going to come about sooner or later.

NSA, Homland Security, etc. are all going to want to monitor communications for terrorist activity as well as looking for people that are doing dishonest deals or violating the govenment or citizens of the USA as a whole.

As I find it disturbing that they can see everything I type or any site I may visit, I can also see the need for somekind of filtering to keep my homeland as safe as possible from terrorist activity.

Maybe I am interpreting this the wrong way but if I am reading correctly it is really a catch 22. :banghead:


Dammit George :cuss:


.

Lzen
04-06-2006, 09:07 AM
Guys, you make good points. But don't you think this kind of thing could happen anyway? I don't know, perhaps these things will happen, perhaps not. I suppose if this was done against the law, it needs to be investigated for sure.

chagrin
04-06-2006, 09:14 AM
Guys, you make good points. But don't you think this kind of thing could happen anyway? I don't know, perhaps these things will happen, perhaps not. I suppose if this was done against the law, it needs to be investigated for sure.


I have to agree with you here. People are going to do what they do, steal your shit if it's diggin through your trash or whatever else they do.

People STILL throw away their credit card bills, phone bills, electric bills, magazine subscription invoices, bank statements, IRS notices, etc with regularity where anyone can find them, but they get all bent out of shape when they find out that what they do on the net could be discovered...whatever

I am not finger pointing here, but "generally speaking"

chagrin
04-06-2006, 09:15 AM
htismaqe, that av is very cool btw

Braincase
04-06-2006, 09:21 AM
I wonder if I can get a bootleg copy of Photoshop from the NSA... think they have a BitTorrent Server?

Inspector
04-06-2006, 09:31 AM
I hear the head of the NSA is trying hard to protect our kids from internet predators.

Did some undercover work, if I recall...

Bowser
04-06-2006, 09:38 AM
I really need to buy Orwell's "1984".

htismaqe
04-06-2006, 09:51 AM
The thing is, this is NOT wiretapping.

I've been served on wiretaps before. Look at it this way:

In a wiretap, the cops come to your door, give you a piece of paper, and look through your trash.

What AT&T is doing is essentially this:

Your garbage company comes and picks up your trash. Instead of taking it to the dump, they take it to a holding facility where thousands of cops looks through it.

The secondary issue of this is performance. Several of you were worried about how fast Google would be if ISP's started charging for usage. Well, how fast is Google gonna be if everything has to be filtered through the government's security architecture first?

I can tell you this, the Chinese government's mechanism for policing the internet adds between 50 and 250ms of latency...

djplanb
04-06-2006, 10:47 AM
but, hey, the innocent have nothing to hide (http://www.workingforchange.com/comic.cfm?itemid=20323). right, George?

Saulbadguy
04-06-2006, 10:53 AM
What a crock of shit.

Garcia Bronco
04-06-2006, 10:53 AM
The thing is, this is NOT wiretapping.

I've been served on wiretaps before. Look at it this way:

In a wiretap, the cops come to your door, give you a piece of paper, and look through your trash.

What AT&T is doing is essentially this:

Your garbage company comes and picks up your trash. Instead of taking it to the dump, they take it to a holding facility where thousands of cops looks through it.

The secondary issue of this is performance. Several of you were worried about how fast Google would be if ISP's started charging for usage. Well, how fast is Google gonna be if everything has to be filtered through the government's security architecture first?

I can tell you this, the Chinese government's mechanism for policing the internet adds between 50 and 250ms of latency...

250 ms is significant

htismaqe
04-06-2006, 10:57 AM
250 ms is significant

Yep. Customers that do business there complain all the time. There's nothing that can be done, short of putting in expensive, private network connections.

The Chinese government wants complete control.

BIG_DADDY
04-06-2006, 11:01 AM
I'm sooooooooooo sick of this crap.

Taco John
04-06-2006, 11:27 AM
Hmmm, I guess I don't really see the scary part. You know, since I'm NOT A FREAKIN' TERRORIST!!



I'm not a terrorist. It's ok if they take away my rights.


Stupid argument.

picasso
04-06-2006, 11:42 AM
If everyone thinks about it this is something that was going to come about sooner or later.

NSA, Homland Security, etc. are all going to want to monitor communications for terrorist activity as well as looking for people that are doing dishonest deals or violating the govenment or citizens of the USA as a whole.

As I find it disturbing that they can see everything I type or any site I may visit, I can also see the need for somekind of filtering to keep my homeland as safe as possible from terrorist activity.

Maybe I am interpreting this the wrong way but if I am reading correctly it is really a catch 22. :banghead:


Dammit George :cuss:


.


What terrorist activity is my question!!!! Hijacked airplanes with box cutters during bad airport security? If this is as advanced as terrorists are, I'll take my chances.
I think in trying to protect yourself from the enemy you can end up just like them if you're not careful and find out some things about your own culture that you don't want to know and that you should leave well enough alone. Then again if every American is charged and fined with what they did or said on the internet maybe it will pay off this war for peace in the middle east (yeah right) or at least keep Homeland Security from hiring a pervert. (At least Monica was of age)
Some of you people get so paranoid about this terrorist crap though it's ridiculous that you still believe in this mass hysteria that this administration has pushed so far up your ass you can't see the obvious.
So far up you would die for it.

Simplex3
04-06-2006, 11:45 AM
Guys, you make good points. But don't you think this kind of thing could happen anyway? I don't know, perhaps these things will happen, perhaps not. I suppose if this was done against the law, it needs to be investigated for sure.
That's what warrants are for. That's why the judicial process is in place. Hell, it's not like it would be hard for them to get a warrant to tap my Internet connection. I just prefert that there is SOME light of day exposed to the tapping. At least then any malfeasance is going to involve more people, making it harder to keep it under wraps.