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'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:05 AM
Just a thought...now flame away SUV whores.

Otter
04-21-2006, 12:06 AM
f#ck you hippie

listopencil
04-21-2006, 12:06 AM
Will this include Greyhound, school buses and semi's?

ROYC75
04-21-2006, 12:06 AM
You buying me a new car ?

Phobia
04-21-2006, 12:08 AM
$8000 tax on stupid. How 'bout that?

Demonpenz
04-21-2006, 12:09 AM
$8000 tax on stupid. How 'bout that?


i better come up with 16000 then

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:09 AM
Any new vehicle purchases should have an 8k luxury tax put on them, and all those who own SUVs that get under 20 MPG should have to pay property tax as though the car originally cost 8k more. It would then be depreciated accordingly.

Bugeater
04-21-2006, 12:09 AM
I'm not sure my Dodge Caravan even does that good.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:10 AM
I'm not sure my Dodge Caravan even does that good.

Perhaps that might actually put an impetus on people to start organizing and lobbying for real change instead of bitching about gas prices while driving vehicles that drain the balls out of a 50 gallon drum to go on a day-long trip.

RedDread
04-21-2006, 12:12 AM
28 is a bit steep. A lot of sedans don't even get that.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:13 AM
Will this include Greyhound, school buses and semi's?

Large passenger vehicles (buses) would be exempt, since they are actually efficient given the number of people they transport. Semi's could be excluded since they run on diesel.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:14 AM
28 is a bit steep. A lot of sedans don't even get that.

That's the point...imagine if it was grandfathered in after a set number of years. The auto industry would start researching alternative fuels as though their lives depended on it.

Rausch
04-21-2006, 12:14 AM
Large passenger vehicles (buses) would be exempt, since they are actually efficient given the number of people they transport. Semi's could be excluded since they run on diesel.

BTW, WTF is up with the "Hamas" part?...

Bugeater
04-21-2006, 12:14 AM
Perhaps that might actually put an impetus on people to start organizing and lobbying for real change instead of bitching about gas prices while driving vehicles that drain the balls out of a 50 gallon drum to go on a day-long trip.
Sorry, but the equipment I need to do my job won't fit in a Ford Escort. Most people who do the type of work I do drive full-size vans & pick-ups.

listopencil
04-21-2006, 12:15 AM
Sorry, but the equipment I need to do my job won't fit in a Ford Escort. Most people who do the type of work I do drive full-size vans & pick-ups.


I think he is just referring to personal use vehicles.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:16 AM
BTW, WTF is up with the "Hamas" part?...

My argumentative style once had someone else on another board brand me as 'hamas'-like. Hence the scare quotes.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:18 AM
Yes, I am referring primarily to personal use vehicles. I'm just tired of listening to everyone bitch about gas prices. The best thing that could happen would be for prices to skyrocket, b/c then it might actually promote change in the energy field. The cabal of big oil has held influence for far too long. Renewable and clean energy sources will allow for a much more prosperous society with less wealth concentrated among those who already have 50 times more than they could spend in a lifetime.

Rausch
04-21-2006, 12:21 AM
My argumentative style once had someone else on another board brand me as 'hamas'-like. Hence the scare quotes.

JMO, but I'd adopt a different moniker for a "**** you" approach to posting.

Then again, I still have people assume I hate Jews so WTF do I know...

Guru
04-21-2006, 12:22 AM
Yes, I am referring primarily to personal use vehicles. I'm just tired of listening to everyone bitch about gas prices. The best thing that could happen would be for prices to skyrocket, b/c then it might actually promote change in the energy field. The cabal of big oil has held influence for far too long. Renewable and clean energy sources will allow for a much more prosperous society with less wealth concentrated among those who already have 50 times more than they could spend in a lifetime.


Hey, Greg!!! Hows your headache now? :hmmm:

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:23 AM
JMO, but I'd adopt a different moniker for a "**** you" approach to posting.

Then again, I still have people assume I hate Jews so WTF do I know...

This could be an interesting story...

Bugeater
04-21-2006, 12:26 AM
IMO it would be difficult to keep track of who's buying them for business or personal use. It's a moot point anyway because the oil & auto industries are too powerful to let this happen.

Guru
04-21-2006, 12:34 AM
What is it with the server problems after 1am?

RedDread
04-21-2006, 12:38 AM
That's the point...imagine if it was grandfathered in after a set number of years. The auto industry would start researching alternative fuels as though their lives depended on it.


Yeah, it would have been nice if you posted that little asterisk in your thread topic. As of right now it just sounds effing wee-tod-id.

listopencil
04-21-2006, 12:39 AM
IMO it would be difficult to keep track of who's buying them for business or personal use. It's a moot point anyway because the oil & auto industries are too powerful to let this happen.



Require a business license at registration that the vehicle is to be used for to enact an exemption from the luxury tax. I'm not supporting the idea, mind you. I'm just saying that it would be easy to do.

Rausch
04-21-2006, 12:41 AM
This could be an interesting story...

If you throw in beer/hookers/vegas/falttening raider fans/sober...driver...

Bugeater
04-21-2006, 12:41 AM
What is it with the server problems after 1am?
Actually that provided me the opportunity to write up one of the 4 proposals I sat down to do 4 hrs ago.

BigMeatballDave
04-21-2006, 12:41 AM
Any new vehicle purchases should have an 8k luxury tax put on them, and all those who own SUVs that get under 20 MPG should have to pay property tax as though the car originally cost 8k more. It would then be depreciated accordingly.And a Mod should change your username to Douchebag...

BigMeatballDave
04-21-2006, 12:43 AM
Perhaps that might actually put an impetus on people to start organizing and lobbying for real change instead of bitching about gas prices while driving vehicles that drain the balls out of a 50 gallon drum to go on a day-long trip.Re. Tar. Did.

Rausch
04-21-2006, 12:46 AM
And a Mod should change your username to Douchebag...

If we did that for every person that deserved it we'd have handles that ended up Douchebag14857...

Rausch
04-21-2006, 12:54 AM
Just to stay on topic.

I remember going to Disney World when I was five. I collected everything. Brochures, stickers, mickey money.

I still have one from the "World of Tommorow" section that claims that ford (at that time, TWENTY FIVE ****ING YEARS AGO) could power an electric car for 80 miles on the electricity used to power one televison for 24 hours.

This is when the Incredible Hulk was considered amazing cinamatography.

25 years later we understand the physics to ****ing bend time (not that we can fulfill the energy requirements to do so, but we know how it works) but we can't make a battery that lasts 5 times as long?

Let that $#at percolate for a minute...

RedDread
04-21-2006, 01:28 AM
Kind of OT here but: If we did eventually switch to hydrogen fuel cells and started having water vapor as exhaust would there be more rainfall worldwide?

Enquiring minds want to know.... :hmmm:

Rausch
04-21-2006, 01:37 AM
Kind of OT here but: If we did eventually switch to hydrogen fuel cells and started having water vapor as exhaust would there be more rainfall worldwide?

Enquiring minds want to know.... :hmmm:

No, but we'd all explode like ****ing madness if the fuel cell was breached...

Chiefs_Fan_n_64081
04-21-2006, 01:46 AM
Kind of OT here but: If we did eventually switch to hydrogen fuel cells and started having water vapor as exhaust would there be more rainfall worldwide?

Enquiring minds want to know.... :hmmm:
Unless I am mistaken, and I don't think I am, water exhaust is the end product of the old hydrogen fuel cell technology, but not for the "brown gas" model.
With the newer technology the end product is oxygen.

This would mean a complete turn around in eniviromental repercussions in areas typically thought of as exceedingly despairing.



EDIT/UPDATE
Despite the assertion that I am wrong in the following post (below), here is a paragraph from an article about the "brown gas" method of hydrogen feul cells (titled "New Alchemy --- Water Into Fire" by Paul White) that shows that I am correct.

"Yull Brown is the man responsible for that popular urban myth of the car that runs on water. When he first developed his new water electrolysis process in the mid-70s he found a safe, non-explosive method of separating water into oxygen and hydrogen. He built a device that converted his car to run on the hydrogen from water, with oxygen as the only exhaust emission. He was shown on television at the time actually filling his car with an ordinary garden hose!"

- So please ignore the erroneous detraction below.

Rausch
04-21-2006, 01:53 AM
Unless I am mistaken, and I don't think I am, water exhaust is the end product of the old hydrogen fuel cell technology, but not for the "brown gas" model.
With the newer technology the end product is oxygen.

This would mean a complete turn around in eniviromental repercussions in areas typically thought of as exceedingly despairing.

You are mistaken, but even with added water vapor there would be no ill effect to the enviornment...

RedDread
04-21-2006, 02:08 AM
No, but we'd all explode like ****ing madness if the fuel cell was breached...


A small price to pay for cleaner air, amiright? And plus it would make Police Videos a whoooole lot more interesting to watch.

Miles
04-21-2006, 02:31 AM
I don't see the problem with letting the market work things out. The last thing I would think of is a huge tax.

Rausch
04-21-2006, 02:42 AM
A small price to pay for cleaner air, amiright? And plus it would make Police Videos a whoooole lot more interesting to watch.

Most people don't understand the minimal requirements necessary to turn a hydrogen-powered car into a ****ing nuclear weapon.

Once you've acquired a centrifuge and and enriched nuclear materails (these days, not hard to come by) you're a go.

The hydrogen is like the fuse on the m-80.

And forget that, and just consider the $#it just really likes to ****ing explode...

Cochise
04-21-2006, 06:19 AM
Maybe this is a decent idea on some level.

Vehicles that get under 20MPG highway are taxed like $2,000. That money is used to offset the lowering of fuel taxes. Why not?

Saulbadguy
04-21-2006, 06:25 AM
$8,000 is kind of steep. I'd say around $4-5,000, the difference between a regular vehicle and a hybrid.

Dartgod
04-21-2006, 06:40 AM
This is a dumb idea.

jspchief
04-21-2006, 06:43 AM
Yea, people that drive SUVs have no right to bitch about gas prices. Surely when they bought those vehicles 3 years ago, they should have known that the cost of gas was going to double. :rolleyes:

patteeu
04-21-2006, 06:50 AM
Maybe this is a decent idea on some level.

Vehicles that get under 20MPG highway are taxed like $2,000. That money is used to offset the lowering of fuel taxes. Why not?

Because a low mpg luxury car that isn't used for anything but going to church on Sundays doesn't do any damage to the roads and doesn't contribute to the demand for gasoline. OTOH, a high mpg minicar that is used by some workaholic teenaged pizza delivery guy does. Why should the low usage person pay taxes for the high usage person.

If the purpose is to discourage low mpg cars, then why not just get serious about it and outlaw them for anything but commercial use? (BTW, I'd be against this too).

chagrin
04-21-2006, 06:55 AM
What is it with the server problems after 1am?

no shit, and you had better get your posting in now because we are rapidly approaching the "witching hour" of 11 am.

Cochise
04-21-2006, 06:55 AM
Because a low mpg luxury car that isn't used for anything but going to church on Sundays doesn't do any damage to the roads and doesn't contribute to the demand for gasoline. OTOH, a high mpg minicar that is used by some workaholic teenaged pizza delivery guy does. Why should the low usage person pay taxes for the high usage person.

If the purpose is to discourage low mpg cars, then why not just get serious about it and outlaw them for anything but commercial use? (BTW, I'd be against this too).

I agree, I was just presenting a better idea, however flawed, than the one initially presented.

Dartgod
04-21-2006, 06:55 AM
Because a low mpg luxury car that isn't used for anything but going to church on Sundays doesn't do any damage to the roads and doesn't contribute to the demand for gasoline. OTOH, a high mpg minicar that is used by some workaholic teenaged pizza delivery guy does. Why should the low usage person pay taxes for the high usage person.

If the purpose is to discourage low mpg cars, then why not just get serious about it and outlaw them for anything but commercial use? (BTW, I'd be against this too).Exactly. I have a 3/4 ton truck that I pull my camper with and when pulling it, I get no better than 9 mpg. Otherwise I avg about 12 mpg. BUT, I only put about 7,000 miles per year on it. So how is that worse than a 28 mpg car than racks up 15 - 20,000 miles a year?

MahiMike
04-21-2006, 07:06 AM
Now we've finally made it to European law. I remember living there 15 years ago when they charged you for your tags based on horsepower. Now I understand why...

stevieray
04-21-2006, 07:10 AM
again, i'll believe that people care about the cost of gas when they aren't racing from stop light to stop light, or going eighty miles an hour on the highway.

Braincase
04-21-2006, 07:13 AM
Penalizing families for having more than 3 kids, eh? Sorry, but there are 0 vehicles out there that get 28 mpg that can seat 2 adults and 4 kids.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 07:18 AM
Back to the DC with your Tree Hugging ass douche bag. :shake:

Warrior5
04-21-2006, 07:19 AM
No, but we'd all explode like ****ing madness if the fuel cell was breached...

ROFL

bkkcoh
04-21-2006, 07:22 AM
$8000 tax on stupid. How 'bout that?

That would solve the national debt issue also. :toast:

htismaqe
04-21-2006, 07:27 AM
Large passenger vehicles (buses) would be exempt, since they are actually efficient given the number of people they transport. Semi's could be excluded since they run on diesel.

By your standards, his Dodge Caravan would also be exempt...

Duck Dog
04-21-2006, 07:28 AM
Back to the DC with your Tree Hugging ass douche bag. :shake:

Awesome. Best post on this otherwise assnine thread.

htismaqe
04-21-2006, 07:30 AM
You are mistaken, but even with added water vapor there would be no ill effect to the enviornment...

We don't know that for sure. That many vehicles producing oxygen may disrupt the natural balance...

bkkcoh
04-21-2006, 07:32 AM
Penalizing families for having more than 3 kids, eh? Sorry, but there are 0 vehicles out there that get 28 mpg that can seat 2 adults and 4 kids.


Isn't is irresponsible to have more than 2 kids anyway?? Man, you aren't helping out the environment....





:p

Chiefs Express
04-21-2006, 07:34 AM
We don't know that for sure. That many vehicles producing oxygen may disrupt the natural balance...

We can rebalance nature by cutting down the trees in the rain forrest.

Chiefs Express
04-21-2006, 07:36 AM
Only if we get an $8000 tax credit for those that get over 28 per gallon. That puts me on a +$16,000 tax credit threshold.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 07:39 AM
We can rebalance nature by cutting down the trees in the rain forrest.

ROFL

That should draw 'Hamas' right back out of the DC to this thread.

Chiefs Express
04-21-2006, 07:46 AM
ROFL

That should draw 'Hamas' right back out of the DC to this thread.;)

Dr. Facebook Fever
04-21-2006, 07:50 AM
Just a thought...now flame away SUV whores.
Blow me. I drive a pick-up that gets 21 mpg.

Skip Towne
04-21-2006, 07:57 AM
I kinda like this "Hamas" dude. He is an up and coming n00b. He can narrate a golf match like nobody's business and T O M C A S H hates him. That's good enough for me.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 07:59 AM
I kinda like this "Hamas" dude. He is an up and coming n00b. He can narrate a golf match like nobody's business and T O M C A S H hates him. That's good enough for me.

Does your van get 28 MPG?

Skip Towne
04-21-2006, 08:01 AM
Does your van get 28 MPG?
It does if I lie about it. I'm slick that way.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 08:07 AM
It does if I lie about it. I'm slick that way.

Heh! That's what I thought. :) Neither does my jeep that I pull my ATV's with. I don't think a 28 MPG Honda Accord is going to pull my trailer and ATV's up to my mountain get a ways.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 08:48 AM
A small price to pay for cleaner air, amiright? And plus it would make Police Videos a whoooole lot more interesting to watch.

There is nothing inherently dangerous about a hydrogen fuel cell that make the risks of implementation outweigh the gains. Yes, hydrogen is highly flammable, but it's not going to be like a nuclear bomb going off should one get breached.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 08:57 AM
Back to the DC with your Tree Hugging ass douche bag. :shake:


ROFL , sorry, I felt the need to get flamed. This proposal was the result of me hitting the 'random' key in my brain. However, I do think that some people should have to pay extra for burning assloads of gas when they don't have to.

If you are a family of 4, you don't need an Excursion. Suzy Homemaker doesn't need an f'in H2 to get from A-B. So how's about this...the tax is implemented on all new, non-work vehicles for individuals and families who have less than 4 children. Old vehicles are grandfathered in (no tax), but those who have vehicles that do conform should get added tax incentives. Once these old vehicles crap out, people would have to buy the more efficient vehicles, unless they are willing to pay said tax.

morphius
04-21-2006, 08:59 AM
ROFL , sorry, I felt the need to get flamed. This proposal was the result of me hitting the 'random' key in my brain. However, I do think that some people should have to pay extra for burning assloads of gas when they don't have to.

If you are a family of 4, you don't need an Excursion. Suzy Homemaker doesn't need an f'in H2 to get from A-B. So how's about this...the tax is implemented on all new, non-work vehicles for individuals and families who have less than 4 children. Old vehicles are grandfathered in (no tax), but those who have vehicles that do conform should get added tax incentives. Once these old vehicles crap out, people would have to buy the more efficient vehicles, unless they are willing to pay said tax.

Are we going to put the same restrictions on minivan's, because their gas millage is within 1-2 mpg of most mid sized SUV's?

Nzoner
04-21-2006, 09:01 AM
I bet King Carl would help out here,from now on if you show up at Arrowhead in an SUV with no more than two people you have to pay an additional $5 to park.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:02 AM
Are we going to put the same restrictions on minivan's, because their gas millage is within 1-2 mpg of most mid sized SUV's?

The motivation behind such a plan wouldn't be to actually tax the shit out of people, but rather to have them push for more economical vehicles. It's not physically impossible to mass produce a tow-capable vehicle that gets 30 mpg as opposed to 15, it's just that big oil and the car manufacturers have people by the balls and enjoy the grip.

BigMeatballDave
04-21-2006, 09:03 AM
ROFL , sorry, I felt the need to get flamed. This proposal was the result of me hitting the 'random' key in my brain. However, I do think that some people should have to pay extra for burning assloads of gas when they don't have to.

If you are a family of 4, you don't need an Excursion. Suzy Homemaker doesn't need an f'in H2 to get from A-B. So how's about this...the tax is implemented on all new, non-work vehicles for individuals and families who have less than 4 children. Old vehicles are grandfathered in (no tax), but those who have vehicles that do conform should get added tax incentives. Once these old vehicles crap out, people would have to buy the more efficient vehicles, unless they are willing to pay said tax.Spoken like a true Communist. I drive a 2000 Ranger 4x4. I had a '98 Buick Century. It got great gas milege. I wanted a truck, so I got one.

Boozer
04-21-2006, 09:05 AM
ROFL , sorry, I felt the need to get flamed. This proposal was the result of me hitting the 'random' key in my brain. However, I do think that some people should have to pay extra for burning assloads of gas when they don't have to.

If you are a family of 4, you don't need an Excursion. Suzy Homemaker doesn't need an f'in H2 to get from A-B. So how's about this...the tax is implemented on all new, non-work vehicles for individuals and families who have less than 4 children. Old vehicles are grandfathered in (no tax), but those who have vehicles that do conform should get added tax incentives. Once these old vehicles crap out, people would have to buy the more efficient vehicles, unless they are willing to pay said tax.

Why can't your same ends be achieved through the use/expansion of the current cents per gallon tax? Coupled with the continually escalating price of gas, it seems that "gas hogs" already pay a steeper price.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:06 AM
Spoken like a true Communist. I drive a 2000 Ranger 4x4. I had a '98 Buick Century. It got great gas milege. I wanted a truck, so I got one.

it's not taking away your right to get the truck, only making you pay more to get a truck for impractical purposes that drive up the price of gas for everyone else. I don't see why your personal desires should make everyone else pay more for gas.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:07 AM
Why can't your same ends be achieved through the use/expansion of the current cents per gallon tax? Coupled with the continually escalating price of gas, it seems that "gas hogs" already pay a steeper price.


I wouldn't have a problem with this, except I think a luxury tax would be a preemptive strike against these gas hogs. Just a thought...

Dartgod
04-21-2006, 09:12 AM
The motivation behind such a plan wouldn't be to actually tax the shit out of people, but rather to have them push for more economical vehicles. It's not physically impossible to mass produce a tow-capable vehicle that gets 30 mpg as opposed to 15, it's just that big oil and the car manufacturers have people by the balls and enjoy the grip.There's no way in hell that you can produce a vehicle that will get anywhere near 30 mpg pulling my 8,000 lb camper.

Before you spout more nonsense about me driving up the cost of gas for everyone else, I probably spend less on gas on this vehicle than someone who drives their 28 mpg vehicle every day. Yet you want to tax me $8,000 for this "luxury" vehicle. :rolleyes:

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:14 AM
This isn't an entirely foreign idea:

from Gore's 2000 platform:

Give consumers a tax credit up to $6,000 for the purchase of more fuel-efficient cars or SUVs
Provide a tax credit up to $5,000 for the purchase of fuel efficient pick-ups or other trucks, and up to $15,000 for more fuel-efficient 18-wheelers

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:15 AM
There's no way in hell that you can produce a vehicle that will get anywhere near 30 mpg pulling my 8,000 lb camper.

VW made a prototype diesel-electric hybrid car that achieved 118 mpg US fuel economy (2 liters per 100 km), but has yet to sell a hybrid vehicle.

Clearly, it could be done. If a passenger vehicle can get almost 120 mpg, a truck with 4 ton hauling capability should be able to get 1/4 of that.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 09:15 AM
ROFL , sorry, I felt the need to get flamed. This proposal was the result of me hitting the 'random' key in my brain. However, I do think that some people should have to pay extra for burning assloads of gas when they don't have to.

If you are a family of 4, you don't need an Excursion. Suzy Homemaker doesn't need an f'in H2 to get from A-B. So how's about this...the tax is implemented on all new, non-work vehicles for individuals and families who have less than 4 children. Old vehicles are grandfathered in (no tax), but those who have vehicles that do conform should get added tax incentives. Once these old vehicles crap out, people would have to buy the more efficient vehicles, unless they are willing to pay said tax.
I have four total people in my family. I have two ATV's that I enjoy riding. In order to get them from my shop to the mountains, I need to load said ATV's onto a trailer. Once on a trailer, a Honda Accord is not going to cut it when it comes to pulling the trailer and ATV's. (not enough power / would blow up dinker engine) I have a Jeep with V-8 that I use for that. The jeep is big enough to get the job done and I don't need a 1 ton truck or an Excursion (which BTW they no longer make) to tow the load. If on the other hand, I decide to go get a mid size boat, the Jeep is not going to have the nads to pull something like that, so I would have to go out and get, dare I say it, a larger vehicle to get the job done. :eek: I know if that were the case, it would upset people like yourself and the SUV burning members of E.L.F. (Earth Liberation Front) but I can live with that. I work hard for my money and if I want to go out and buy a big ass truck to pull my boat that sucks more gas (that I'm paying for) so be it.

Dartgod
04-21-2006, 09:18 AM
VW made a prototype diesel-electric hybrid car that achieved 118 mpg US fuel economy (2 liters per 100 km), but has yet to sell a hybrid vehicle.

Clearly, it could be done. If a passenger vehicle can get almost 120 mpg, a truck with 4 ton hauling capability should be able to get 1/4 of that.
How many horse power did this vehicle have? How many foot-lbs of torque? I have a hard time believing such a vehicle could pull a load like that up a long grade.

BigMeatballDave
04-21-2006, 09:20 AM
it's not taking away your right to get the truck, only making you pay more to get a truck for impractical purposes that drive up the price of gas for everyone else. I don't see why your personal desires should make everyone else pay more for gas.Complete and utter BS! I can recall in December of '03 I paid $1.30/gal. SUVs and trucks made that much of an impact on fuel prices? You're a tool. I'd bet if we all drove Hondas, we'd still see gasoline at over $2/gal. I should also mention that I live 6 miles from work and only drive 12,000-14,000 miles a year. What do you drive, and how much do you drive a year?

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:20 AM
I have four total people in my family. I have two ATV's that I enjoy riding. In order to get them from my shop to the mountains, I need to load said ATV's onto a trailer. Once on a trailer, a Honda Accord is not going to cut it when it comes to pulling the trailer and ATV's. (nto enough power / would blow up dinker engine) I have a Jeep with V-8 that I use for that. The jeep is big enough to get the job done and I don't need a 1 ton truck or an Excursion (which BTW they no longer make) to tow the load. If on the other hand, I decide to go get a mid size boat, the Jeep is not going to have the nads to pull something like that, so I would have to go out and get, dare I say it, a larger vehicle to get the job done. :eek: I know if that were the case, it would upset people like yourself and the SUV burning members of E.L.F. (Earth Liberation Front) but I can live with that. I work hard for my money and if I want to go out and buy a big ass truck to pull my boat that sucks more gas (that I'm paying for) so be it.

But don't you think it is possible for car companies to manufacture a vehicle that could actually get decent mileage while doing all of these things?? I do, I just think they are too f*cking lazy to do it. Hell, I'd say we should start cutting out breaks we give these companies, but then they'd just ship more jobs overseas to cut costs. I'd rather a grassroots campaign be made to give people the vehicles they want with performance they desire, that are still environmentally friendly.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:24 AM
Complete and utter BS! I can recall in December of '03 I paid $1.30/gal. SUVs and trucks made that much of an impact on fuel prices? You're a tool. I'd bet if we all drove Hondas, we'd still see gasoline at over $2/gal. I should also mention that I live 6 miles from work and only drive 12,000-14,000 miles a year. What do you drive, and how much do you drive a year?

I live w/in walking distance of work (maybe that makes me myopic, but my fiancee drives 20 miles each way) She drives a Corolla, I drive a Taurus, which gets 26 mpg, which would make me subject to the tax as well. I only drive about 5,000 miles per year, though.

I can recall in 99 paying 74.9 cents/gallon....I paid 2.88 in Ohio this week to fill up. You think that China and India have quadrupled the world's demand for oil since then?

Your entire argument seems to be based upon the Cartman premise:

Screw you guys, I'll do what I want.

patteeu
04-21-2006, 09:24 AM
ROFL , sorry, I felt the need to get flamed. This proposal was the result of me hitting the 'random' key in my brain. However, I do think that some people should have to pay extra for burning assloads of gas when they don't have to.

If you are a family of 4, you don't need an Excursion. Suzy Homemaker doesn't need an f'in H2 to get from A-B. So how's about this...the tax is implemented on all new, non-work vehicles for individuals and families who have less than 4 children. Old vehicles are grandfathered in (no tax), but those who have vehicles that do conform should get added tax incentives. Once these old vehicles crap out, people would have to buy the more efficient vehicles, unless they are willing to pay said tax.

Why not just have a government man come out and stick a probe up your ass too so he can find out whether you've been eating according to the new nutrition pyramid and tax you if you've been slacking off on the vegetables?

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:25 AM
Why not just have a government man come out and stick a probe up your ass too so he can find out whether you've been eating according to the new nutrition pyramid and tax you if you've been slacking off on the vegetables?

Because such a program would cause serious problems as you tried to make it through airport metal detectors with all the lead in your ass and shit in your brains.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 09:26 AM
But don't you think it is possible for car companies to manufacture a vehicle that could actually get decent mileage while doing all of these things?? I do, I just think they are too f*cking lazy to do it. Hell, I'd say we should start cutting out breaks we give these companies, but then they'd just ship more jobs overseas to cut costs. I'd rather a grassroots campaign be made to give people the vehicles they want with performance they desire, that are still environmentally friendly.

I have no Idea if it is possible Jenkins. If something like that were to come out, I would take a serious looks at it, but as Dartgod stated, there sure isn't anyting like that out now. I also would call B.S. on something like the engine you talked about earlier having the balls to pull a heavy load up a mountain road. Can something like that be made, I have no idea, I hope that is the case.

BIG_DADDY
04-21-2006, 09:29 AM
We would be fine with our wheels right now but there is no way in hell I would back something like this. NO MORE TAXES.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:30 AM
How many horse power did this vehicle have? How many foot-lbs of torque? I have a hard time believing such a vehicle could pull a load like that up a long grade.

They alread have entire fleets of hybrid buses, among other vehicles:

In 2003 GM introduced a diesel hybrid military (light) truck, equipped with a diesel electric and a fuel cell auxiliary power unit. Hybrid light trucks were introduced 2004 by Mercedes (Hybrid Sprinter) and Micro-Vett SPA (Daily Bimodale). International Truck and Engine Corp. and Eaton Corp. have been selected to manufacture diesel-electric hybrid trucks for a US pilot program serving the utility industry in 2004. In mid 2005 Isuzu introduced the Elf Diesel Hybrid Truck on the Japanese Market. They claim that approximately 300 vehicles, mostly route buses are using Hinos HIMR (Hybrid Inverter Controlled Motor & Retarder) system.

htismaqe
04-21-2006, 09:30 AM
Your entire argument seems to be based upon the Cartman premise:

Screw you guys, I'll do what I want.

ROFL

patteeu
04-21-2006, 09:31 AM
But don't you think it is possible for car companies to manufacture a vehicle that could actually get decent mileage while doing all of these things?? I do, I just think they are too f*cking lazy to do it. Hell, I'd say we should start cutting out breaks we give these companies, but then they'd just ship more jobs overseas to cut costs. I'd rather a grassroots campaign be made to give people the vehicles they want with performance they desire, that are still environmentally friendly.

I can see why big oil wouldn't want automobiles to get dramatically better gas mileage, but what would be the auto maker's incentive to hold back on this technology? I can only assume that it would lead to a more costly or less attractive/capable/comfortable/safe vehicle that they don't think would sell well next to their current products. If they could build an otherwise equivalent car for the same price that got better gas mileage, they would because it would give them an advantage in the marketplace (over competitors who didn't follow suit).

Chiefs Express
04-21-2006, 09:31 AM
it's not taking away your right to get the truck, only making you pay more to get a truck for impractical purposes that drive up the price of gas for everyone else. I don't see why your personal desires should make everyone else pay more for gas.

I'm not sure where you get that the big gas guzzlers are the sole reason for the gas prices. There are quite a few more factors that impact the price of gas. Federal regulations, greed......GREED, and I'm sure there are quite a few more. Greed being the #1 issue at the present time.

Check out the profits by major oil companies over the past 10 years and see if you can determine where greed comes into play.

Higher prices would be more acceptable if there were some new refineries being built in the U.S. to take care of the supply. It might also be a little less expensive if we were tapping the resourses that we know exist on our own contenent.

BigMeatballDave
04-21-2006, 09:32 AM
You think that China and India have quadrupled the world's demand for oil since then?
Not all, but a large portion. Remember, trucks have been around for decades. Remember all the gas guzzeling cars from the 70's? Even still, gas was CHEAP in the mid-to late 80's. The problem is not the vehicles we drive, it is simply supply and demand. Plus, simple-minded tree-huggers like you that has not allowed a new refinery built in 20 years.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:36 AM
Not all, but a large portion. Remember, trucks have been around for decades. Remember all the gas guzzeling cars from the 70's? Even still, gas was CHEAP in the mid-to late 80's. The problem is not the vehicles we drive, it is simply supply and demand. Plus, simple-minded tree-huggers like you that has not allowed a new refinery built in 20 years.

It's not as though our demand for gas is outpacing the supply. I don't see how buidling additional refineries would help the matter. Remember those gas guzzling cars?? They were the reason why the compact became a genre of car--because people got tired of forking over assloads of coin for fuel, so they began to argue for change. This is already in place. Toyota has said they will be all hybrid by 2012. The American car companies are waaaay behind on this, and will lose share just as they did with the implement of compact cars.

Chiefs Express
04-21-2006, 09:45 AM
It's not as though our demand for gas is outpacing the supply. I don't see how buidling additional refineries would help the matter. Remember those gas guzzling cars?? They were the reason why the compact became a genre of car--because people got tired of forking over assloads of coin for fuel, so they began to argue for change. This is already in place. Toyota has said they will be all hybrid by 2012. The American car companies are waaaay behind on this, and will lose share just as they did with the implement of compact cars.

The US Auto manufacturers are behind the 8ball due to choices they made 30 years ago. Toyota, for one, learned that people would buy a car that would last, GM's agenda was for the average automobile customer to replace their car every 3-4 years.

Hybirds will be obsolete if the hydrogen cell technology is advanced to the point that vehicles can be mass produced with that technology. I'd put money on the fact that Toyota, or some other foreign manufacturer, will put the first production vehicles on the road with that technology. The big 3 are married to oil and will never concede. They will remain in that mindset until they have to declare bankrupcy and close all of their plants.

Even now there is an effort to build Camaro's much like the Corvettes went a few years ago. Building a Camaro with a 400HP mill will do very little to gain market share for GM.

Duck Dog
04-21-2006, 09:48 AM
ROFL , sorry, I felt the need to get flamed. This proposal was the result of me hitting the 'random' key in my brain. However, I do think that some people should have to pay extra for burning assloads of gas when they don't have to.

If you are a family of 4, you don't need an Excursion. Suzy Homemaker doesn't need an f'in H2 to get from A-B. So how's about this...the tax is implemented on all new, non-work vehicles for individuals and families who have less than 4 children. Old vehicles are grandfathered in (no tax), but those who have vehicles that do conform should get added tax incentives. Once these old vehicles crap out, people would have to buy the more efficient vehicles, unless they are willing to pay said tax.


Those of us with gas hogging trucks and toys already do pay more. We buy more gas, we pay more taxes. You don't want to see my credit card receipts.

Besides, who are you to say Suzy doesn't need an H2? Do you want to live in society where the government dictates what vehicle you'll drive?

Lzen
04-21-2006, 09:51 AM
f#ck you hippie

Took the words right out of my mouth.

patteeu
04-21-2006, 09:56 AM
Do you want to live in society where the government dictates what vehicle you'll drive?

Isn't that obvious?

bkkcoh
04-21-2006, 10:04 AM
Why not just have a government man come out and stick a probe up your ass too so he can find out whether you've been eating according to the new nutrition pyramid and tax you if you've been slacking off on the vegetables?


Dammit, don't give them any ideas.. They already sent a dirty old man to Florida for breast exams......



:p :hmmm:

Duck Dog
04-21-2006, 10:08 AM
f#ck you hippie


I'm not a bumper sticker kind of guy but this would make a great one.

BigMeatballDave
04-21-2006, 10:12 AM
It's not as though our demand for gas is outpacing the supply. I don't see how buidling additional refineries would help the matter. Someone with more knowledge on this subject wanna chime in?

Bwana
04-21-2006, 10:14 AM
Took the words right out of my mouth.

Indeed ROFL

Leave it to Joe to set the tone of the thread with a first post like that.

Lzen
04-21-2006, 10:17 AM
Do you want to live in society where the government dictates what vehicle you'll drive?

HELL NO!!!

BigMeatballDave
04-21-2006, 10:18 AM
I think everyone should post a pic of their gas guzzelers just to piss off the hippy.

ChiefsCountry
04-21-2006, 10:18 AM
Big deal. If people want a big a$$ SUV let them get one. If they want to blow money on gas, go ahead. Its freaking America. I would rather drive my truck any day over a little crappy car that gets good gas mileage.

Bugeater
04-21-2006, 10:21 AM
While it's easy to point the finger at SUV and truck owners, Lord knows I get caught up in it myself, the reality is that even extreme measures like Hamas is proposing will probably do little to affect gas prices.

Someone mentioned in an earlier thread that anything we do to try to lessen demand will just make oil marginally cheaper for the whole world and that's probably true. IMO all we can do is re-evaluate our own driving habits and reduce our consumption on a personal level if we want gas to take less of a bite out of our budgets, instead of trying to find someone else to blame.

Lzen
04-21-2006, 10:21 AM
ROFL , sorry, I felt the need to get flamed. This proposal was the result of me hitting the 'random' key in my brain. However, I do think that some people should have to pay extra for burning assloads of gas when they don't have to.

If you are a family of 4, you don't need an Excursion. Suzy Homemaker doesn't need an f'in H2 to get from A-B. So how's about this...the tax is implemented on all new, non-work vehicles for individuals and families who have less than 4 children. Old vehicles are grandfathered in (no tax), but those who have vehicles that do conform should get added tax incentives. Once these old vehicles crap out, people would have to buy the more efficient vehicles, unless they are willing to pay said tax.

I think that would kind of screw the automakers who have already built vehicles and are sending them to the market for sale. Seriously, what about all the vehicles that are already made and have yet to be sold to a consumer? All of a sudden, these vehicles are worth a ton less. That's not really fair to those automakers. And most of those would be American companies. What would that do to our economy?

Dartgod
04-21-2006, 10:22 AM
I think everyone should post a pic of their gas guzzelers just to piss off the hippy.
Good idea.

I don't have a picture of my gas-guzzling, 6.0 litre, 3/4 ton, 4WD truck, but when I'm haulin' this bad boy, It's sucking down the fuel to the tune of 8-9 MPG! :thumb:

http://www.ramdarts.org/images/IM000475small.jpg

BIG_DADDY
04-21-2006, 10:26 AM
I think everyone should post a pic of their gas guzzelers just to piss off the hippy.

"Pacifist" Jenkins.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 10:35 AM
I think everyone should post a pic of their gas guzzelers just to piss off the hippy.

Hell yes, "Fishing Jeep" sucking gas in the great outdoors.

Chiefs Express
04-21-2006, 10:36 AM
Someone with more knowledge on this subject wanna chime in?

It wouldn't matter, he thinks he is on a roll and facts shouldn't be injected into the conversation.:)

Bwana
04-21-2006, 10:45 AM
The truck I had before the gas sucking Jeep. Ford ,Super Duty, 1 Ton, Turbo D, crew cab, 4x4, Toyota eating truck from hell. To be honest, I am getting tired of the Jeep and am thinking about getting another truck in the near future.

Dave Lane
04-21-2006, 10:54 AM
Will this include Greyhound, school buses and semi's?


Does $8,000 cover a tire on these?

Dave

Chiefs Express
04-21-2006, 11:17 AM
1970 Malibu

Duck Dog
04-21-2006, 11:56 AM
I'll up the ante and include dead animals.

Outside of truck. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/duckdog/Mikegeesetruckanddecoys.jpg

Inside.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/duckdog/CajunandDixieTruckEdit.jpg

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:03 PM
I'll up the ante and include dead animals.

Outside of truck. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/duckdog/Mikegeesetruckanddecoys.jpg

Inside.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/duckdog/CajunandDixieTruckEdit.jpg


Those + your apparent reasoning skills =



With all those dead fowls at least you could have the roast duck w/ the mango salsa :D

Duck Dog
04-21-2006, 12:07 PM
Those + your apparent reasoning skills =



With all those dead fowls at least you could have the roast duck w/ the mango salsa :D


You want duck? Take your pic.

BIG_DADDY
04-21-2006, 12:07 PM
One for the Hamas family

redbrian
04-21-2006, 12:08 PM
Mpg does not equate to reduced fuel consumption.

I drive a F150 with a big block V-8 yet the commute to my office I burn only calories (my office is located in my house).

You should look at the thought of taxing suburbanites who commute farther than 10 miles round trip to their place of employment.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:11 PM
One for the Hamas family

How many times must I tell you, I just get the others to do it for me :shake:

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:12 PM
Mpg does not equate to reduced fuel consumption.

I drive a F150 with a big block V-8 yet the commute to my office I burn only calories (my office is located in my house).

You should look at the thought of taxing suburbanites who commute farther than 10 miles round trip to their place of employment.

An excellent point. A tad more sophisticated than "I do what I want!!"

Bwana
04-21-2006, 12:15 PM
I'll up the ante and include dead animals.


I'll see your dead fowl and raise you three ATV's.

Donger
04-21-2006, 12:31 PM
It's not as though our demand for gas is outpacing the supply. I don't see how buidling additional refineries would help the matter.

Our refineries are operating at near 100% 24/7. What do you think would happen if some of them were knocked out (for any reason)?

Demand is increasing and our refining capacity is not.

This isn't rocket science.

Chiefs Express
04-21-2006, 12:40 PM
Our refineries are operating at near 100% 24/7. What do you think would happen if some of them were knocked out (for any reason)?

Demand is increasing and our refining capacity is not.

This isn't rocket science.

You might have to consider who you are referring to with this comment. Hamas doesn't seem to understand facts.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:40 PM
Our refineries are operating at near 100% 24/7. What do you think would happen if some of them were knocked out (for any reason)?

Demand is increasing and our refining capacity is not.

This isn't rocket science.

And yet you remain an oil whore rather than promoting other energy alternatives :spock:

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:41 PM
You might have to consider who you are referring to with this comment. Hamas doesn't seem to understand facts.

Facts like you working as a covert agent for the United States government??

Donger
04-21-2006, 12:41 PM
And yet you remain an oil whore rather than promoting other energy alternatives :spock:

What?

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:43 PM
What?

It's clear that the underlying warrant behind your previous statement is that we should build more refineries. You will deny it now, but it is patently obvious.

RaiderH8r
04-21-2006, 12:43 PM
Hippies piss me off...

Let's take a steaming dump on America while 1.3 billion chinese tote around at 15mpg w/out any sort of catalytic converter....You too India.

I know, "But H8r, the Chinese ride mopeds and bicycles. They care about the air." Up yours hippie, they'll be hockng their Schwinn knock off w/in 5 years to hook up the latest and greatest in cheap automobility. While they're at it, no clean air standards for their power generation. Yup, the US sucks the big hang down.

Donger
04-21-2006, 12:45 PM
It's clear that the underlying warrant behind your previous statement is that we should build more refineries. You will deny it now, but it is patently obvious.

Yes, I think we should. And if you drive an automobile, you should, too.

What do you drive, if anything?

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 12:57 PM
Yes, I think we should. And if you drive an automobile, you should, too.

What do you drive, if anything?

Here's a novel idea...if we spent money on alternative fuel technology that could cut our demand for oil by 1/3 we wouldn't need to build additional refineries and we'd have a cleaner environment. Sounds awful...doesn't it?

Donger
04-21-2006, 01:01 PM
Here's a novel idea...if we spent money on alternative fuel technology that could cut our demand for oil by 1/3 we wouldn't need to build additional refineries and we'd have a cleaner environment. Sounds awful...doesn't it?

What alternative energy source would cut our demand for oil by 1/3? What would be the time frame? What would we do in the interim?

No, it sounds great, but in practice it's rather difficult and takes time.

And, what do you drive?

Chiefs Express
04-21-2006, 01:04 PM
Facts like you working as a covert agent for the United States government??

My occupation has nothing to do with the fact that you make up crap as you go and expect everyone to believe that it is fact.

You have never let facts get in the way of your continued disdain for America.

Chiefs Express
04-21-2006, 01:05 PM
What alternative energy source would cut our demand for oil by 1/3? What would be the time frame? What would we do in the interim?

No, it sounds great, but in practice it's rather difficult and takes time.

And, what do you drive?

I hear it is a Cadillac SUV.

Lzen
04-21-2006, 02:15 PM
I see that he completely ignored my counter argument. :shake:

Chiefs Express
04-21-2006, 02:16 PM
I see that he completely ignored my counter argument. :shake:

There is a reason for that, he does not deal in reality.:)

Duck Dog
04-21-2006, 02:30 PM
I'll see your dead fowl and raise you three ATV's.


Can I call your 3 ATVs with 1 ATV and dead fowl?


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/duckdog/Image015.jpg

The Bad Guy
04-21-2006, 02:43 PM
ROFL , sorry, I felt the need to get flamed. This proposal was the result of me hitting the 'random' key in my brain. However, I do think that some people should have to pay extra for burning assloads of gas when they don't have to.

If you are a family of 4, you don't need an Excursion. Suzy Homemaker doesn't need an f'in H2 to get from A-B. So how's about this...the tax is implemented on all new, non-work vehicles for individuals and families who have less than 4 children. Old vehicles are grandfathered in (no tax), but those who have vehicles that do conform should get added tax incentives. Once these old vehicles crap out, people would have to buy the more efficient vehicles, unless they are willing to pay said tax.

And the more efficient vehicles would increase in price so the automakers could capitalize on the demand.

Who the **** are you to tell people what they need and don't need?

Bwana
04-21-2006, 02:58 PM
Can I call your 3 ATVs with 1 ATV and dead fowl?


ROFL I don't know why the hell not.

Oh and Jenkins, the more I think about this the more it gravels my ass that that you think you have the right to tell people what they can or can't drive. You obviously don't own a boat, ATV's, wave runners, a camp trailer or other power toys that require a bigger vehicle to pull. I'm sure you can use your Toyota Primus, Yugo, or whatever the hell you drive to haul your arrogant ass down to the local tree hugger convention. Once you're there you can sit around singing Kum-ba-ya, browning marsh mellows and reminiscing about the: (dare I say it?!) Evil SUV drivers with your fellow tree hugging, granola crunching pals.

I'll tell you what Ace, the day you drop off the SUV that gets "28 miles per gallon" we can talk. Until then, I’m going to have to respectably have to tell you to hang your 8k where the sun doesn’t shine and go Fu*k yourself.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 06:34 PM
ROFL I don't know why the hell not.

Oh and Jenkins, the more I think about this the more it gravels my ass that that you think you have the right to tell people what they can or can't drive. You obviously don't own a boat, ATV's, wave runners, a camp trailer or other power toys that require a bigger vehicle to pull. I'm sure you can use your Toyota Primus, Yugo, or whatever the hell you drive to haul your arrogant ass down to the local tree hugger convention. Once you're there you can sit around singing Kum-ba-ya, browning marsh mellows and reminiscing about the: (dare I say it?!) Evil SUV drivers with your fellow tree hugging, granola crunching pals.

I'll tell you what Ace, the day you drop off the SUV that gets "28 miles per gallon" we can talk. Until then, I’m going to have to respectably have to tell you to hang your 8k where the sun doesn’t shine and go Fu*k yourself.

2005 Honda CRV gets 29, prick.
2006 Ford Escape Hybrid gets 36 MPG

http://cars.ign.com/articles/691/691022p1.html

Keep in mind that you are talking about vehicles to "pull your toys"---they aren't necessities. I just find it ridiculous that people like you can be so shortsighted and selfish that you care more about pulling your toys than you do the air that everyone else breathes. And I'm the arrogant one?? Talk about f*cking selfish.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 06:37 PM
I see that he completely ignored my counter argument. :shake:

Which was what? f*ck you, hippie?

stevieray
04-21-2006, 06:42 PM
I'm getting ready to put a classic van on the road that gets 10/12 miles to the gallon.

I'm going to drive a classic vehicle for as long as I can. Why? Becuase I fear the day when we can't, and our entitlement mantra has overtaken the freedom to drive whatever kind of car you like.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 06:43 PM
Am I telling you what you absolutely must drive? No. I am saying that if you want to drive those vehicles to 'pull your toys' you should have pay a luxury for that because that is a luxury that most other people don't have. It's not a cut and dry reality, just a proposal to help wean people off of this oil addiction that they have no desire to shake whatsoever. It seems to me from reading the tone of this thread that most of you really don't care how much you pay for gas or what the net results of this foreign dependency on oil will be. You just sit idly by blind to the realities of the world and make up all forms of excuses to justify your own apathetic intertia.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 06:47 PM
I'm getting ready to put a classic van on the road that gets 10/12 miles to the gallon.

I'm going to drive a classic vehicle for as long as I can. Why? Becuase I fear the day when we can't, and our entitlement mantra has overtaken the freedom to drive whatever kind of car you like.

You have every right to drive that van, but I think that with that right should come a price, especially given the deep shit that we are in regarding our energy situation right now.

stevieray
04-21-2006, 06:52 PM
You have every right to drive that van, but I think that with that right should come a price, especially given the deep shit that we are in regarding our energy situation right now.

I should be penalized for restoring an old vehicle? why?

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 06:55 PM
I should be penalized for restoring an old vehicle? why?

It's not penalizing you--it's making you pay more money for an unneeded luxury. Supply and Demand style economics, the fact that oil is a finite resource. What ever happened to the notion of sacrifice in this country?

Donger
04-21-2006, 06:58 PM
Hamas, what do you drive?

stevieray
04-21-2006, 06:59 PM
It's not penalizing you--it's making you pay more money for an unneeded luxury. Supply and Demand style economics, the fact that oil is a finite resource. What ever happened to the notion of sacrifice in this country?

Uneeded luxury? I'm using it for work.

What am I supposed to be sacrificing?

Donger
04-21-2006, 07:07 PM
It's not penalizing you--it's making you pay more money for an unneeded luxury. Supply and Demand style economics, the fact that oil is a finite resource. What ever happened to the notion of sacrifice in this country?

Someone needs to order Hamas his 'Chairman Mao' uniform. I hear they're coming back in style.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:18 PM
Hamas, what do you drive?

I drive a 1995 Taurus, which only gets about 26 MPG. Since I'm still in school, I don't yet have the cash to buy a newer vehicle. But I can afford to pay a prorated property tax based on the price of the car since it only gets 26 MPG highway. The one nice thing is that I put less than 5k on my car per year. I live close to school and generally walk or ride a bike to campus. It tends to piss my shit off when I see people stay in their car in 75 degree weather waiting 15 minutes for a parking spot to open up b/c they are too f*cking lazy to get out and walk.

Donger
04-21-2006, 07:20 PM
I drive a 1995 Taurus, which only gets about 26 MPG. Since I'm still in school, I don't yet have the cash to buy a newer vehicle. But I can afford to pay a prorated property tax based on the price of the car since it only gets 26 MPG highway. The one nice thing is that I put less than 5k on my car per year. I live close to school and generally walk or ride a bike to campus. It tends to piss my shit off when I see people stay in their car in 75 degree weather waiting 15 minutes for a parking spot to open up b/c they are too f*cking lazy to get out and walk.

Why do you own a car at all?

Bwana
04-21-2006, 07:22 PM
2005 Honda CRV gets 29, prick.
2006 Ford Escape Hybrid gets 36 MPG

http://cars.ign.com/articles/691/691022p1.html

Keep in mind that you are talking about vehicles to "pull your toys"---they aren't necessities. I just find it ridiculous that people like you can be so shortsighted and selfish that you care more about pulling your toys than you do the air that everyone else breathes. And I'm the arrogant one?? Talk about f*cking selfish.

Fu*k you meatwad. It's my money, if I want to buy some motor toys and some big balzie truck to pull them with tough shit dickweed. I could give two hoots about what some pin dick little fly by night tree hugging hippy ass hole like yourself think about that. Now crawl back to the scum hole DC where someone might give a rats ass what you have to say regarding the issue of the SUV. Oh, and you can take your 1000 pound 13 hours power civic and shove it up your starfish Nancy Boy. :loser:

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:22 PM
Why do you own a car at all?

I use it to drive back home, which is in MO. I also use it for shorter trips requiring a trunk (a la to the golf course). I'm not anti-car, I just think that we should start thinking about alternatives to the internal combustion engine, but no one seems to give a shit

Check out post 17 and post 30.

Donger
04-21-2006, 07:23 PM
I use it to drive back home, which is in MO. I also use it for shorter trips requiring a trunk (a la to the golf course). I'm not anti-car, I just think that we should start thinking about alternatives to the internal combustion engine, but no one seems to give a shit

Check out post 17 and post 30.

You could take the bus, yes? You could take public transportation home?

So, if so, is your car an "unneeded luxury"?

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:25 PM
Fu*k you meatwad. It's my money, if I want to buy some motor toys and some big balzie truck to pull them with tough shit dickweed. I could give two hoots about what some pin dick little fly by night tree hugging hippy ass hole like yourself think about that. Now crawl back to the scum hole DC where someone might give a rats ass what you have to say regarding the issue of the SUV. Oh, and you can take your 1000 pound 13 hours power civic and shove it up your starfish Nancy Boy. :loser:

Spoken like a true aristocrat. I never said you couldn't buy one or use it, you can't seem to get that through your thick skull ; I only said that you should pay a luxury tax for it, because it isn't something you need. George Steinbrenner spends millions of extra $$ on players he doesn't even need for his roster, and I'm sure you have no problem with him paying extra for the luxury of this expenditure...yet when you want to pay extra for a luxury it is a grave personal injustice upon your soul....:spock:

Skip Towne
04-21-2006, 07:26 PM
You could take the bus, yes? You could take public transportation home?

So, if so, is your car an "unneeded luxury"?
You don't play golf do you?

Donger
04-21-2006, 07:26 PM
You don't play golf do you?

No. It's an "unneeded luxury" and I can't afford the punishment tax.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:28 PM
You could take the bus, yes? You could take public transportation home?

So, if so, is your car an "unneeded luxury"?


Check out my earlier post, in which I said that my car would apply and that I should pay the tax as well. It's an unneeded luxury, and I'd be willing to pay for it, no one else seems to want to. Furthermore, I wouldn't be able to carry my golf clubs on a bus, they wouldn't allow me on there; which is the point of Skip's post

Donger
04-21-2006, 07:28 PM
Oh, BTW Hamas, since you're choice of locomotion doesn't fall within your listed parameters (less than 28 mpg), you're going to be kicking in your $8K when?

Donger
04-21-2006, 07:29 PM
Check out my earlier post, in which I said that my car would apply and that I should pay the tax as well. It's an unneeded luxury, and I'd be willing to pay for it, no one else seems to want to. Furthermore, I wouldn't be able to carry my golf clubs on a bus, they wouldn't allow me on there; which is the point of Skip's post

Golf is a necessity for you, or a want?

Yes, you should pay your tax, but will you? Or will you give up your evil auto?

ENDelt260
04-21-2006, 07:30 PM
I wouldn't be able to carry my golf clubs on a bus, they wouldn't allow me on there;

Have you tried and been denied?

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:36 PM
My Car is worth like 1,000 bucks...If I had to pay the luxury tax on it it's property tax value would be 9,000 (which I discuss in an earlier post--it's not making you pay 8k out of pocket if you already have a vehicle, only 8k of property tax; I'd also be willing to say that this $$ figure should decrease proportionally with the value of the vehicle)

If I lived in Overland Park here is what the property tax that I would pay on this car would be:

251.63

If I didn't have that tax, it would be

27.96

It's a difference of about 200 bucks. If you took that extra money from the hypothetical 8k and applied it to alternative fuel cell and hybrid enginge research, and then did that across the board for people in the country who are above the poverty line, imagine the amount of extra $$ we'd have to develop such a technology. Think of how much better people would be off financially a few years into the program...

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:38 PM
Have you tried and been denied?

They told me to sit in the back...actually, my g/f's brother had to take his clubs to school once when he didn't have a vehicle available and they wouldn't let him on with it. I figure that it would be a fairly standard objection on the part of public trans, but I may be incorrect.

Donger
04-21-2006, 07:39 PM
My Car is worth like 1,000 bucks...If I had to pay the luxury tax on it it's property tax value would be 9,000 (which I discuss in an earlier post--it's not making you pay 8k out of pocket if you already have a vehicle, only 8k of property tax; I'd also be willing to say that this $$ figure should decrease proportionally with the value of the vehicle)

If I lived in Overland Park here is what the property tax that I would pay on this car would be:

251.63

If I didn't have that tax, it would be

27.96

It's a difference of about 200 bucks. If you took that extra money from the hypothetical 8k and applied it to alternative fuel cell and hybrid enginge research, and then did that across the board for people in the country who are above the poverty line, imagine the amount of extra $$ we'd have to develop such a technology. Think of how much better people would be off financially a few years into the program...

Ah, I see. It's a 'progressive tax' more than caring about what the actual MPG is.

Nice.

Donger
04-21-2006, 07:40 PM
They told me to sit in the back...actually, my g/f's brother had to take his clubs to school once when he didn't have a vehicle available and they wouldn't let him on with it. I figure that it would be a fairly standard objection on the part of public trans, but I may be incorrect.

Again, is golf a necessity?

ENDelt260
04-21-2006, 07:42 PM
They told me to sit in the back...actually, my g/f's brother had to take his clubs to school once when he didn't have a vehicle available and they wouldn't let him on with it. I figure that it would be a fairly standard objection on the part of public trans, but I may be incorrect.
A school bus, or a city bus? If I tried to get on a city bus with a golf bag and they told me I couldn't I'd laugh at them.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:42 PM
Again, is golf a necessity?

Post 155, genius. For the third time.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:43 PM
A school bus, or a city bus? If I tried to get on a city bus with a golf bag and they told me I couldn't I'd laugh at them.

Dude, that's why I said I should pay the tax and why I'd be perfectly willing to do so.

Skip Towne
04-21-2006, 07:44 PM
They told me to sit in the back...actually, my g/f's brother had to take his clubs to school once when he didn't have a vehicle available and they wouldn't let him on with it. I figure that it would be a fairly standard objection on the part of public trans, but I may be incorrect.
Many of the courses are far off bus routes as well. They are usually built out of the city and the city grows up around it. Only old courses would have an access to a bus.

ENDelt260
04-21-2006, 07:45 PM
Dude, that's why I said I should pay the tax and why I'd be perfectly willing to do so.
What the **** does that statement have to do with my post?

PastorMikH
04-21-2006, 07:48 PM
This is a stupid idea.

Do the math, the mini-van I drive is needed to carry the family. We do not have room in our 4 cylinder compact car (Which btw tops out at 27mpg so it doesn't qualify either). My Chevy Astro van gets right at 20. Now, I could get 2 cars that get 35 mpg, but we would need to take both cars to get the family to the chosen destination. Seems like 1 vehicle @ 20 mph is better than 2 @ 35 mpg.


While we are at it, why not just shut down the American auto manufacturers? I would assume that the majority of their sales are for autos that get less than 28 mpg by the average driver. An $8,000 tax raises the price of the new auto, thus driving down the number of sales of companies that are already struggling. Plants will be shut down, others will be downsized. A lot of people will be out of jobs as a result. Yeah, the economy can handle that.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:48 PM
What the **** does that statement have to do with my post?

Everything, actually. me taking my clubs to the course via a car is a luxury, a luxury combined with other luxuries that my car gives me. Since my car only gets 26 mpg, I should have to pay the aforementioned luxury tax.

Dartgod
04-21-2006, 07:49 PM
and then did that across the board for people in the country who are above the poverty line...
So I would be paying a luxury tax on my gas-guzzling truck, which I have already stated gets driven around 7,000 miles a year, yet Suzy welfare mom, who drives a piece of shit 1989 Taurus that only gets 17 miles a gallon because she can't afford to maintain it properly (and btw pollutes the air much more than my 2003 Silverado) skates? Yeah, that makes sense. :shake: :rolleyes:

ENDelt260
04-21-2006, 07:51 PM
Everything, actually.

Um... it has nothing to do with my post. You didn't even answer my question. You just started spouting off about a tax.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 07:52 PM
I only said that you should pay a luxury tax for it, because it isn't something you need.
Oh horse shit Jenkins. Do you really need a car yourself? Seriously, You could walk, buy a moped, or take the bus, but NO, you drive a car like the rest of us. When you do the heal and toe express to school and work you can run your mouth about the evils of various vehicles, until then you really need to shut the Fu*k up.

Dartgod
04-21-2006, 07:52 PM
While we are at it, why not just shut down the American auto manufacturers? I would assume that the majority of their sales are for autos that get less than 28 mpg by the average driver. An $8,000 tax raises the price of the new auto, thus driving down the number of sales of companies that are already struggling. Plants will be shut down, others will be downsized. A lot of people will be out of jobs as a result. Yeah, the economy can handle that.
Don't forget the RV industry. You better believe they'd take a huge hit if this asnine idea were implemented.

PastorMikH
04-21-2006, 07:52 PM
So I would be paying a luxury tax on my gas-guzzling truck, which I have already stated gets driven around 7,000 miles a year, yet Suzy welfare mom, who drives a piece of shit 1989 Taurus that only gets 17 miles a gallon because she can't afford to maintain it properly (and btw pollutes the air much more than my 2003 Silverado) skates? Yeah, that makes sense. :shake: :rolleyes:


Actually, Suzy Welfare would probably have her tax paid by us.


But that is also another arguement. Those that are poor will have a much harder time buying a car with the better fuel economy. Thus, they will be even more financially stricken when the car they can afford is taxed at a rate 4-10 times it's worth.

Skip Towne
04-21-2006, 07:53 PM
Everything, actually. me taking my clubs to the course via a car is a luxury, a luxury combined with other luxuries that my car gives me. Since my car only gets 26 mpg, I should have to pay the aforementioned luxury tax.
Why not just change the thread header to 26 to avoid the tax. :skip: is always thinking

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:54 PM
The motivation behind such a plan wouldn't be to actually tax the shit out of people, but rather to have them push for more economical vehicles. It's not physically impossible to mass produce a tow-capable vehicle that gets 30 mpg as opposed to 15, it's just that big oil and the car manufacturers have people by the balls and enjoy the grip.

PastorMik, here is my reply to your query.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:57 PM
Um... it has nothing to do with my post. You didn't even answer my question. You just started spouting off about a tax.

I once tried to take my clubs on a bus when in need of transport, but was told they'd take up someone else's spot. They told me I could pay an extra fare, so I did so. I drive my car there b/c it is a luxury, a luxury which I am willing to pay for. Read between the lines man, I've already said this like 10 times.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 07:57 PM
Oh horse shit Jenkins. Do you really need a car yourself? Seriously, You could walk, buy a moped, or take the bus, but NO, you drive a car like the rest of us. When you do the heal and toe express to school and work you can run your mouth about the evils of various vehicles, until then you really need to shut the Fu*k up.

Do you need a car?? I already said I walk to campus you dumb sonofabitch. Maybe instead of spouting off your cro-magnon mouth you should go back and sharpen up your reading skills by sawing through some earlier posts. Until then, go to the mirror in your bathroom and admire your bleach-blonde Hulk Hogan skullet and eat a dick, you low forehead motherf*cker.

PastorMikH
04-21-2006, 07:59 PM
PastorMik, here is my reply to your query.


I'm all for more economical vehicles. However, passing the costs on to the consumer who really can't do much in the way of devoping a new fuel source doesn't seem fair. How about taxing the auto manufacturers for a lack of fuel efficient cars and oil companies for not producing more efficient and renewable resource fuels? They have the ability to come up with better options, we don't.

rad
04-21-2006, 07:59 PM
So you basically want the Gov't to "squeeze" us into buying hybrids and mopeds? You can't think that will work.

People that can afford it will not be deprived of their toys

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 08:00 PM
I'm all for more economical vehicles. However, passing the costs on to the consumer who really can't do much in the way of devoping a new fuel source doesn't seem fair. How about taxing the auto manufacturers for a lack of fuel efficient cars and oil companies for not producing more efficient and renewable resource fuels? They have the ability to come up with better options, we don't.

Read the thread before you post. I already covered this. the point isn't to tax the shit out of people, it's to piss them off into then coercing auto manufactorers to actually make env. friendly and efficient vehicles.

ENDelt260
04-21-2006, 08:02 PM
I once tried to take my clubs on a bus when in need of transport, but was told they'd take up someone else's spot. They told me I could pay an extra fare, so I did so. I drive my car there b/c it is a luxury, a luxury which I am willing to pay for. Read between the lines man, I've already said this like 10 times.
I asked if your brother was denied on a city bus or a school bus. Now the brother story is gone, and you paid an extra fare to ride on a city bus once? Are you just making these stories up as you go along?

Screw reading between the lines... try to keep up with what's actually being said.

PastorMikH
04-21-2006, 08:02 PM
Actually, if something like this were passed, each of my autos would be needed for the facilitation of my job in a non-for-profit organization. I am pretty sure that the executive officer of the Church would verify this.:)

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 08:04 PM
I asked if your brother was denied on a city bus or a school bus. Now the brother story is gone, and you paid an extra fare to ride on a city bus once? Are you just making these stories up as you go along?

Screw reading between the lines... try to keep up with what's actually being said.

It wasn't my brother, it was my g/f's brother on a school bus, who was flatly denied entry on grounds that the bus was too full...I've tried it on a city bus before and been told to pay 2X the fare.

WilliamTheIrish
04-21-2006, 08:08 PM
Check out my earlier post, in which I said that my car would apply and that I should pay the tax as well. It's an unneeded luxury, and I'd be willing to pay for it, no one else seems to want to. Furthermore, I wouldn't be able to carry my golf clubs on a bus, they wouldn't allow me on there; which is the point of Skip's post

Just FYI: The do allow clubs on the buses in Las Vegas. I played several courses and took the bus to 3 different courses. Beat paying the cabbies 40$ each way. Kind of fun to ride with the locals too.

PastorMikH
04-21-2006, 08:11 PM
Read the thread before you post.



Perhaps if it weren't such a bad idea in the first place I might.

Donger
04-21-2006, 08:15 PM
Post 155, genius. For the third time.

Again, why is golf a necessity? I understand the bus won't allow them on, but why do you have to play golf in the first place?

Bwana
04-21-2006, 08:18 PM
Do you need a car?? I already said I walk to campus you dumb sonofabitch. Maybe instead of spouting off your cro-magnon mouth you should go back and sharpen up your reading skills by sawing through some earlier posts. Until then, go to the mirror in your bathroom and admire your bleach-blonde Hulk Hogan skullet and eat a dick, you low forehead motherf*cker.

No No you little tree hugging Nancy boy candy ass, that's not good enough. I could give a rats ass if you "walk to campus" limp nipple. What about getting around town the rest of the time, the bus, more walking, car pool.................yeah, that's what I thought you low test bag of wind. As far as polishing knob, I'll leave that up to you and the rest of your Gaylord anti SUV pals.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 08:18 PM
Again, why is golf a necessity? I understand the bus won't allow them on, but why do you have to play golf in the first place?

I don't HAVE to, but I am willing to PAY EXTRA for said luxury, which most of the other bastards here seem to have no desire to do so. I'm not denying people the right to do certain things, I only think that if they want to do things that are luxurious they should have to pay a little extra for them. I fail to see where the grave injustice in this is.

rad
04-21-2006, 08:19 PM
Again, why is golf a necessity? I understand the bus won't allow them on, but why do you have to play golf in the first place?

He doesn't , he's a hockey player. He's just playing for the $20,000 prize money so he can buy back his grandma's hou- Oh nevermind.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 08:20 PM
No No you little tree hugging Nancy boy candy ass, that's not good enough. I could give a rats ass if you "walk to campus" limp nipple. What about getting around town the rest of the time, the bus, more walking, car pool.................yeah, that's what I thought you low test bag of wind. As far as polishing knob, I'll leave that up to you and the rest of your Gaylord anti SUV pals.

I drive, which is a luxury I would be willing to pay for since my car doesn't meet said requirements. I'm willing to sacrifice, your only respite is

http://www.cicia.it/images/southpark/cartman_3.jpg

screw you, I do what I want!!

PastorMikH
04-21-2006, 08:22 PM
Again, I'm too lazy/thread's too boring to read, but why 8K? Why not 1K, 5K, 10K, 20K?


And anyone that is happy to pay the tax can pay the 24K I'll need for my autos.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 08:24 PM
Again, I'm too lazy/thread's too boring to read, but why 8K? Why not 1K, 5K, 10K, 20K?


And anyone that is happy to pay the tax can pay the 24K I'll need for my autos.

I'm not married to 8k or 28 mpg. In the spirit of politics, I'd be flexible. It wouldnt' be the end of the world if it was lowered to 24 or 22, or even if the tax was lowered to 3k.

WilliamTheIrish
04-21-2006, 08:25 PM
Again, why is golf a necessity? I understand the bus won't allow them on, but why do you have to play golf in the first place?

If you don't play, it's not a necessity. If you do play, well, it's a necessity.

I suck at the game, but if for some reason if I couldn't play, it'd kill me.

BTW, I shot my best ever back 9 last Wednesday. Carded a 40 on pretty difficult course.

It really helped offset the 54 on the front. :)

****ing game. Front nine I was hitting houses and spraying shots into the woods.

Made the turn and on 10 hit the green in 2 on 387 yard par 4. (+1) and then just started hitting every club well. Followed that with 4 consecutive pars, then a +2 (four putted) a bogey, then finished with 3 pars.

Love this game. Hate it too.

Bearcat
04-21-2006, 08:25 PM
Read the thread before you post. I already covered this. the point isn't to tax the shit out of people, it's to piss them off into then coercing auto manufactorers to actually make env. friendly and efficient vehicles.

I'm not reading 8 pages of crap... then why don't they put stricter regulation on the car companies... It's something stupid right now... they have to increase mpg by 3 in 10 years or whatever.

You're taking a mass of stupid people and telling them they're going to get the car companies without actually doing something about it... wow, that's like all the "buy this much gas on this day from this company, and without actually doing something about the problem, you'll end up solving it!"

And FWIW, my car gets 22 mpg (it was advertised at 28 highway since it kicks down to 4 cylinders on the highway, but GM lied), and I don't give a crap that I pay $40 a tank. If you care so much, carpool, take the bus, pay more for a hybrid... just quit bitching about it.

stevieray
04-21-2006, 08:26 PM
If you don't play, it's not a necessity. If you do play, well, it's a necessity.

I suck at the game, but if for some reason if I couldn't play, it'd kill me.

BTW, I shot my best ever back 9 last Wednesday. Carded a 40 on pretty difficult course.

It really helped offset the 54 on the front. :)

****ing game. Front nine I was hitting houses and spraying shots into the woods.

Made the turn and on 10 hit the green in 2 on 387 yard par 4. (+1) and then just started hitting every club well. Followed that with 4 consecutive pars, then a +2 (four putted) a bogey, then finished with 3 pars.

Love this game. Hate it too.

no oil was used in this adventure.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 08:26 PM
I drive, which is a luxury I would be willing to pay for since my car doesn't meet said requirements.
Do you have any idea how far out of the main stream you are Jenkins........seriously. Try to put your 8k idea to a vote and see what happens to it. While you're waiting for the results, be sure to put a shine on that nice tin foil hat of yours.

Donger
04-21-2006, 08:26 PM
I don't HAVE to, but I am willing to PAY EXTRA for said luxury, which most of the other bastards here seem to have no desire to do so. I'm not denying people the right to do certain things, I only think that if they want to do things that are luxurious they should have to pay a little extra for them. I fail to see where the grave injustice in this is.

Great. I don't like your non-willingness to not play a rich, white man's sport.

Please make out your check to me.

They ALREADY pay more, by having shitty mileage. If they chose to do that, fine. If you chose to own a car that gets less than your decreed MPG simply because you like to play golf, fine.

Stay the f*ck out of people's business, and don't attempt to condescend when you're just as f*cking guilty.

Skip Towne
04-21-2006, 08:27 PM
Just FYI: The do allow clubs on the buses in Las Vegas. I played several courses and took the bus to 3 different courses. Beat paying the cabbies 40$ each way. Kind of fun to ride with the locals too.
Why didn't you just ride with one of your 11 brothers?

WilliamTheIrish
04-21-2006, 08:31 PM
Why didn't you just ride with one of your 11 brothers?

It's 6 brothers. And 5 sisters.

I didn't ride with them cause they didn't go. Just me and a buddy from high school.

My brothers and myself are trying to plan a trip to coincide with the 07 British Open. That will be a good time.

PastorMikH
04-21-2006, 08:31 PM
If you don't play, it's not a necessity. If you do play, well, it's a necessity.

I suck at the game, but if for some reason if I couldn't play, it'd kill me.

BTW, I shot my best ever back 9 last Wednesday. Carded a 40 on pretty difficult course.

It really helped offset the 54 on the front. :)





I went out today too. (Played in a gas cart BTW, there's another 8K:))

Is there some law of golf that stipulates you cannot have all aspects of your game working at the same time? I was driving the ball great today - best I've done in years. Couldn't putt to save my life. I had to 2 put several 5 footers. Usually my drive ends up about 150 yards off the tee, then about 150 yards to the left with a tree (or trees) in the way. The wedge and putter save the round. Exact opposite today.

Bearcat
04-21-2006, 08:32 PM
I don't HAVE to, but I am willing to PAY EXTRA for said luxury, which most of the other bastards here seem to have no desire to do so. I'm not denying people the right to do certain things, I only think that if they want to do things that are luxurious they should have to pay a little extra for them. I fail to see where the grave injustice in this is.

I'm not sure you know what the word "luxury" means.... There are a lot of people that, without a car to go from home to the babysitter to work to the babysitter, home, etc.... they would be far worse off. That's a necessity, and you can't tax those people what could easily be a quarter of their income to drive. That's insane.

Dartgod
04-21-2006, 08:33 PM
no oil was used in this adventure.
Well, that depends. Did he ride a cart or walk?

And what about the golf equipment? I think petroleum products are used to make golf balls and other accessories. And let's not even get into golf course maintenance equipment. All those lawn mowers and tractors? It's mind-boggling when you think about it.

Yep, I firmly believe all golfers should have to pay a luxury tax for all the petroleum products they are consuming.

WilliamTheIrish
04-21-2006, 08:33 PM
no oil was used in this adventure.

Ha! ROFL

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 08:34 PM
I went out today too. (Played in a gas cart BTW, there's another 8K:))

Is there some law of golf that stipulates you cannot have all aspects of your game working at the same time? I was driving the ball great today - best I've done in years. Couldn't putt to save my life. I had to 2 put several 5 footers. Usually my drive ends up about 150 yards off the tee, then about 150 yards to the left with a tree (or trees) in the way. The wedge and putter save the round. Exact opposite today.

It's kind of the unspoken law of the way that the swing plane operates. Most people have one specific swing style which suits a particular style of club, whether they be woods, mid irons, short irons, etc....

If you have a flat swing, you'll hit the crap out of your long clubs, but hit your wedges and short irons like crap b/c your swing is too rounded. If your swing is steeper, you'll tend to cut the piss out of your longer clubs.

stevieray
04-21-2006, 08:35 PM
My brothers and myself are trying to plan a trip to coincide with the 07 British Open. That will be a good time.

That's a lot of oil.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 08:38 PM
Well, that depends. Did he ride a cart or walk?

And what about the golf equipment? I think petroleum products are used to make golf balls and other accessories. And let's not even get into golf course maintenance equipment. All those lawn mowers and tractors? It's mind-boggling when you think about it.

Yep, I firmly believe all golfers should have to pay a luxury tax for all the petroleum products they are consuming.

Oh without question! Dirty bastages are causing the polar ice caps to melt and because of them, global warming is running amuck!! Burn in hell Jenkins! Errrr, or crap 8k for your part of the game.

stevieray
04-21-2006, 08:38 PM
Well, that depends. Did he ride a cart or walk?

And what about the golf equipment? I think petroleum products are used to make golf balls and other accessories. And let's not even get into golf course maintenance equipment. All those lawn mowers and tractors? It's mind-boggling when you think about it.

Yep, I firmly believe all golfers should have to pay a luxury tax for all the petroleum products they are consuming.

:hmmm: and the sewing machines that make the leather golf shoes, and the bag, and the clothes...not to mention the trucks that ship them.

when you golf, the terrorists win.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 08:39 PM
when you golf, the terrorists win.

ROFLROFL

Dartgod
04-21-2006, 08:42 PM
when you golf, the terrorists win.
ROFL Haha!

Rep...

WilliamTheIrish
04-21-2006, 08:42 PM
:hm
when you golf, the terrorists win.

Hilarious.

Donger
04-21-2006, 08:49 PM
I'm sure that Hamas applauds the illegal, Mexican crew for having too many unreplaced divots out on the course after berating them for putting too much wax on his golf shoes.

The Bad Guy
04-21-2006, 09:01 PM
I drive a 1995 Taurus, which only gets about 26 MPG. Since I'm still in school, I don't yet have the cash to buy a newer vehicle. But I can afford to pay a prorated property tax based on the price of the car since it only gets 26 MPG highway. The one nice thing is that I put less than 5k on my car per year. I live close to school and generally walk or ride a bike to campus. It tends to piss my shit off when I see people stay in their car in 75 degree weather waiting 15 minutes for a parking spot to open up b/c they are too f*cking lazy to get out and walk.

You need to get laid or something.

It seems like you have some complex that you feel you should tell everyone what is necessary and what isn't.

WilliamTheIrish
04-21-2006, 09:02 PM
You need to get laid or something.

It seems like you have some complex that you feel you should tell everyone what is necessary and what isn't.

Latex is an oil based product. That'll be 1k.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 09:05 PM
Jenkins? It looks like the tree fondling nature freak hit the road on us. Perhaps he went to park his car out along the road with a FOR SALE on it to put his money where his mouth is..................yeah, that's the ticket.

Dartgod
04-21-2006, 09:08 PM
Latex is an oil based product. That'll be 1k.
Hehe.

Skip Towne
04-21-2006, 09:09 PM
It's 6 brothers. And 5 sisters.

I didn't ride with them cause they didn't go. Just me and a buddy from high school.

My brothers and myself are trying to plan a trip to coincide with the 07 British Open. That will be a good time.
Man, I'd like to do that. Where will that be played? You would do well on a links style course. You can hit the ball straight right (or left in your case) and still find it. They have killer rough and impossible sand traps but are otherwise wide open.

Donger
04-21-2006, 09:14 PM
I'm disturbed by all this apparent acceptance of golf.

Golf courses are grotesque wastes of land that would be better suited as parks for non-privileged youth. Think how many poor children are playing in disease-infested playgrounds the next time you complain about losing one of your precious balls in a creek, you cold-hearted bastards.

You should all pay a "cold-hearted bastard" tax every time to you play.

Bwana
04-21-2006, 09:19 PM
I'm disturbed by all this apparent acceptance of golf.

Golf courses are grotesque wastes of land that would be better suited as parks for non-privileged youth. Think how many poor children are playing in disease-infested playgrounds the next time you complain about losing one of your precious balls in a creek, you cold-hearted bastards.

You should all pay a "cold-hearted bastard" tax every time to you play.
All true Donger, a very sad story indeed. Don't forget all the trees that have to be cut down to make most golf courses as well! Why, we need every one of them to suck up the smoke from all those evil nasty SUVs. :shake:

Donger
04-21-2006, 09:22 PM
All true Donger, a very sad story indeed. Don't forget all the trees that have to be cut down to make most golf courses as well! Why, we need every one of them to suck up the smoke from all the SUVs. :shake:

No. I'm serious. I think I'm going to take up this line of reasoning. It made me feel REALLY good to look down on you golf-playing scumbags, even though I like to play golf myself.

I just play it with a higher sense of consciousness. That's all.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:37 PM
I'm sure that Hamas applauds the illegal, Mexican crew for having too many unreplaced divots out on the course after berating them for putting too much wax on his golf shoes.

On the muni that has a $230 yearly membership rate...yup.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 09:40 PM
Oh without question! Dirty bastages are causing the polar ice caps to melt and because of them, global warming is running amuck!! Burn in hell Jenkins! Errrr, or crap 8k for your part of the game.

Nice attempt at deflection, all of you :clap: It's admirable, yet pathetic. It defies the laws of physics as it is able to both suck and blow at the same time. I guess we'll just adopt your proposals and keep things the way they have been for the last 80 years. Sounds like a fantastic idea...why have any kind of societal improvement when we can just sit on our lazy asses and continue to do nothing.

Donger
04-21-2006, 09:40 PM
On the muni that has a $230 yearly membership rate...yup.

That would feed a family of five in Mexico for years, you bastard.

Donger
04-21-2006, 09:42 PM
why have any kind of societal improvement when we can just sit on our lazy asses and continue to do nothing.

Let's discuss it over a round of golf? I'll bring Bwana's truck so we can all bring our bags and neglect fuel-efficient public transportation. Then, you can all come over and mow my lawn. Hmmmm! Hmmmm!

Bwana
04-21-2006, 09:47 PM
Nice attempt at deflection, all of you :clap: It's admirable, yet pathetic. It defies the laws of physics as it is able to both suck and blow at the same time. I guess we'll just adopt your proposals and keep things the way they have been for the last 80 years. Sounds like a fantastic idea...why have any kind of societal improvement when we can just sit on our lazy asses and continue to do nothing.

Did you eat a lot of paint chips as a kid?
As I said before tin foil hat boy, put your 8k a year idea up for a vote and see what the results turn out to be. Better yet Jenkins, make yourself a little sign with the idea and go picket city hall. Call the TV news crews and i'm sure they will flock in, your idea will take hold people all over the country will be scratching out checks for 8k! Yeah, that's the ticket!! :thumb::thumb:

Iowanian
04-21-2006, 10:52 PM
$8000 tax on stupid. How 'bout that?

He's going to have an overloaded axl, and no permit for that stupid. Double the fine.

Taco John
04-21-2006, 11:15 PM
Tax all of our problems away... Yeee haw!

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 11:31 PM
Did you eat a lot of paint chips as a kid?
As I said before tin foil hat boy, put your 8k a year idea up for a vote and see what the results turn out to be. :

That quote wasn't funny in tommy boy, and it's not funny (even the second time around tonight) from the mouth of someone who feels the need to constantly assert their own faux masculinity on a BB in order to ensure themselves of the fact that they are in fact, really a man. So spare me the 'might equals right' discussion, and enjoy your homoerotic camping and hunting escapades with your drinking 'buddies'. A group of people once elected your good buddy Adolf to a democratic position and that didn't turn out so well in the end now did it? Sometimes people need to have radical ideas put out there because they are so complacent, apathethic and stupid that they actually think the status quo serves their best interest. You are yet another moronic example.

Good night, and go f*ck yourself motherf*cker.

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 11:31 PM
He's going to have an overloaded axl, and no permit for that stupid. Double the fine.

I wish I could put a price of irony on you misspelling a four letter word in a post meant to call me stupid. ROFL

cdcox
04-21-2006, 11:34 PM
That quote wasn't funny in tommy boy, and it's not funny (even the second time around tonight) from the mouth of someone who feels the need to constantly assert their own faux masculinity on a BB in order to ensure themselves of the fact that they are in fact, really a man. So spare me the 'might equals right' discussion, and enjoy your homoerotic camping and hunting escapades with your drinking 'buddies'. A group of people once elected your good buddy Adolf to a democratic position and that didn't turn out so well in the end now did it? Sometimes people need to have radical ideas put out there because they are so complacent, apathethic and stupid that they actually think the status quo serves their best interest. You are yet another moronic example.

Good night, and go f*ck yourself motherf*cker.

I love it when someone associates a debating opponent with Hitler.

stevieray
04-21-2006, 11:37 PM
I love it when someone associates a debating opponent with Hitler.


Isn't there a term for that?

Godwin's beer muscles?

cdcox
04-21-2006, 11:41 PM
Isn't there a term for that?

Godwin's beer muscles?

Goodwin's law

'Hamas' Jenkins
04-21-2006, 11:44 PM
Goodwin's law

It's called Godwin's law, but it only applies when someone calls their opponent a Nazi. Reminding them of past injustices by said party does not apply.

BigMeatballDave
04-22-2006, 01:37 AM
Did you eat a lot of paint chips as a kid?
As I said before tin foil hat boy, put your 8k a year idea up for a vote and see what the results turn out to be. Better yet Jenkins, make yourself a little sign with the idea and go picket city hall. Call the TV news crews and i'm sure they will flock in, your idea will take hold people all over the country will be scratching out checks for 8k! Yeah, that's the ticket!! :thumb::thumb:ROFL Could you imagine the looks on lawmakers faces if they saw something like this? Seriously, I wonder if Hamas even considered, for one second, about all the members in Congress? Does he/she think any of them drive a Honda Civic?

I nominate this thread to the Hall of Classics!
ROFL

Bwana
04-22-2006, 04:57 AM
That quote wasn't funny in tommy boy, and it's not funny (even the second time around tonight) from the mouth of someone who feels the need to constantly assert their own faux masculinity on a BB in order to ensure themselves of the fact that they are in fact, really a man. So spare me the 'might equals right' discussion, and enjoy your homoerotic camping and hunting escapades with your drinking 'buddies'. A group of people once elected your good buddy Adolf to a democratic position and that didn't turn out so well in the end now did it? Sometimes people need to have radical ideas put out there because they are so complacent, apathethic and stupid that they actually think the status quo serves their best interest. You are yet another moronic example.

Good night, and go f*ck yourself motherf*cker.:deevee: Nice RANT there Nancy Boy have a Kleneex "little Howard". My goodness did you blow a gasket or what. My good buddy Adolf? :hmmm: I think you are a crack pot for wanting to tax people 8K for owning an SUV so I must be HITLER! ROFL I'm glad to see all that school is paying off for you. Unless they have a degree in Tree Hugging, (which pays well LOL) you are going to be in a world of hurt when you get out and hit the "real world." LMAO I guess my post about you walking around with your little sign and putting your idea up for a vote must have really got to you huh Jenkins? Jeez sport, I'm sorry. I figured if you had the balls to back what was coming out of your mouth, that really wouldn't be that big of an issue, but I guess I was wrong.

Oh well, perhaps when the mother ship lands and the rest of "your people" step out, they will be able to give you a hand with yet another great idea or two and while they are here, perhaps they can beam up all the evil SUV's, Big Rigs and Pickups and replace them with Civics, Yugos and magic vehicles that all get super duper gas mileage! (28+ MPG wasn't it) :thumb: There's always that chance scooter. Oh, and next time you're in contact with the mother ship, please be sure to have them send you down a date, you need to get a little! You hang in there and be sure to keep us all up to date on the rest of your ideas. At least you are good for a laugh. ROFL

jspchief
04-22-2006, 05:30 AM
The thing is, SUV owners are in essence already paying extra for their "luxury" by having to spend more on gas. When you buy a vehicle that gets poor mileage, you are accepting that it will cost you more to have the vehicle you want.

Your suggestion isn't about punishing SUV owners as much as it is about trying to get cheaper gas for you.

IMO, if we are going to adress the oil dependency issue with legislation, it should be aimed at the auto manufacturers. Either through incentives to come up with alternatives, or flat out forcing them to do it. If the government can justify forcing HDTV on televisions stations, why the f*ck can't they take a hard line with auto manufacturers?

Or even better yet, take a few years off the ridiculous tax drain that is the space program, and make those smart bastards come up with viable alternative fuel sources.

rocks
04-22-2006, 07:52 AM
Find me something that gets over 28 MPG and that will pull my 24' boat and I would be more than happy!

Simplex3
04-22-2006, 07:52 AM
SUV owners already pay more. The price of the vehicle is higher, thus the sales tax is higher. They (generally) suck up more gas so they use more in gas. A large part of the price of gas is taxes. Over the lifespan of the vehicle I'd guess they pay somewhere near your $8k in extra $$$ to the feds.

Everyone please note I said nothing about "their fair share" or any other such nonsense. Americans are turning into a bunch of bleeding pu**ies with all of this "fairness" tripe. Wake me up when our collective period is over and someone peels the Kotex off.

blueballs
04-22-2006, 08:56 AM
fine them for empty seats
every SUV must be
a rolling party

Lzen
04-22-2006, 09:03 AM
Which was what? f*ck you, hippie?

ROFL No, I posted a serious question/argument later in this thread.


I think that would kind of screw the automakers who have already built vehicles and are sending them to the market for sale. Seriously, what about all the vehicles that are already made and have yet to be sold to a consumer? All of a sudden, these vehicles are worth a ton less. That's not really fair to those automakers. And most of those would be American companies. What would that do to our economy?

patteeu
04-22-2006, 09:13 AM
It's called Godwin's law, but it only applies when someone calls their opponent a Nazi. Reminding them of past injustices by said party does not apply.

Godwin's law applies when you use a comparison to Hitler or the Nazi's in an argument. It's not just when you call your opponent a Nazi.

Your Hitler reference was used to suggest that voting sometimes leads to bad results as it did in Nazi Germany. That's clearly an invocation of Godwin's law.

BigMeatballDave
04-22-2006, 09:32 AM
Find me something that gets over 28 MPG and that will pull my 24' boat and I would be more than happy!I'm sorry, but you really don't need that boat...


:)

Mosbonian
04-22-2006, 09:41 AM
Just for fun and a little levity to a stoopid (yes I spelled it wrong on perpoose) thread....it's hydrogen related. We here at the company known for the George Foreman Grill now bring you:

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/060406/20060406005895.html?.v=1

Salton(R) Signs Agreement with Omachron Science Inc. and Cropley Holdings Ltd. to License Revolutionary New Grilling Technology
Thursday April 6, 4:33 pm ET


LAKE FOREST, Ill.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--April 6, 2006--Salton, Inc. (NYSE:SFP - News) announced today that it has entered into an agreement with Omachron Science Inc. and Cropley Holdings Ltd. by which it has acquired exclusive rights to proprietary technology enabling Salton to manufacture and market a line of indoor and / or outdoor portable grills which utilize a hydrogen flame in combination with electric heat to provide a new dimension to barbequing. The grills plug into a regular household outlet and utilize water and a novel electrolysis process to make a small but intense clean-burning hydrogen flame inexpensively and safely. The result is a great-tasting barbeque experience without the harmful emissions associated with charcoal or propane, thus making it ideal for use indoors, such as in apartments and condominiums, as well as homes.

The product was demonstrated under non-disclosure agreements at the recent International Housewares Show and received resounding accolades from retailers. "Two Foreman grills using this revolutionary technology are targeted to be released in early 2007," said Leon Dreimann, CEO of Salton. "Satisfied owners of almost 80 million George Foreman grills sold to date will be happy to upgrade to these sensational grills that provide incredible results with all types of food."

Wayne Conrad, inventor and Chief Scientist at Omachron Science Inc., commented "Our new technology efficiently and reliably generates hydrogen on demand. I am pleased that it allows Salton to introduce an exciting line of hydrogen-flame grills which bring the flavor and experience of outdoor barbequing indoors."

Salton, Inc. is a leading designer, marketer and distributor of branded, high-quality small appliances, home decor and personal care products. Our product mix includes a broad range of small kitchen and home appliances, tabletop products, time products, lighting products, picture frames and personal care and wellness products. We sell our products under our portfolio of well recognized brand names such as Salton®, George Foreman®, Westinghouse(TM), Toastmaster®, Melitta®, Russell Hobbs®, Farberware®, Ingraham® and Stiffel®. The Company believes its strong market position results from well-known brand names, high quality and innovative products, strong relationships with its customer base and a focused outsourcing strategy.

mmaddog
*******

Lzen
04-22-2006, 10:24 AM
BTW, here's a pic of my gas guzzler. I bought it last Summer. And no, I didn't buy it just because. I needed a truck. I'm always doing some projects around the home and get tired of having to borrow my father-in-law's Toyota Tacoma. Besides, that little truck doesn't cut it sometimes. For instance, last year I re-roofed my house, re-roofed my garage, and built a privacy fence. And there are a ton of other great uses for it.

I feel like I got a pretty deal on this ride. Using your logic, I would've had to pay an extra 32% (I'm just using the 8k number since you didn't really expand on the depreciation scale). That's crazy ridiculous. As others have pointed out, we are already paying more because we are getting less mpg and consuming more of the gas. This idea, while it may sound like a great plan to you, has a ton of holes in it. Not to mention that you would never get support for this from the US voters.

BigMeatballDave
04-22-2006, 11:35 AM
I think Hamas should pay a luxury tax on all the oxygen that is wasted on him...

Simplex3
04-22-2006, 11:49 AM
I think Hamas should pay a luxury tax on all the oxygen that is wasted on him...
Don't forget all the water and carbon he's hoarding in his body.

Chiefs Express
04-22-2006, 11:53 AM
I think Hamas should pay a luxury tax on all the oxygen that is wasted on him...

Too bad you can't get more than one rep per post!

Bearcat
04-22-2006, 11:56 AM
Sometimes people need to have radical ideas put out there because they are so complacent, apathethic and stupid that they actually think the status quo serves their best interest.

Yet, others want to implement change at the expense of rational thought.


Weird world we live in.

Bwana
04-22-2006, 07:44 PM
BTW, here's a pic of my gas guzzler. I bought it last Summer. And no, I didn't buy it just because. I needed a truck. I'm always doing some projects around the home and get tired of having to borrow my father-in-law's Toyota Tacoma. Besides, that little truck doesn't cut it sometimes. For instance, last year I re-roofed my house, re-roofed my garage, and built a privacy fence. And there are a ton of other great uses for it.

I feel like I got a pretty deal on this ride. Using your logic, I would've had to pay an extra 32% (I'm just using the 8k number since you didn't really expand on the depreciation scale). That's crazy ridiculous. As others have pointed out, we are already paying more because we are getting less mpg and consuming more of the gas. This idea, while it may sound like a great plan to you, has a ton of holes in it. Not to mention that you would never get support for this from the US voters.
Very nice ride Lzen. :toast: Just don't let Jenkins know where you live or Nancy will likely come burn it to the ground.

Iowanian
04-22-2006, 09:57 PM
Hamas, is such a hypocrit. He doesn't want the govt to have anything to say about the doobie in his mouth or the dick in his ass....but anyone not driving a Ford Fiesta is the debil.

Feel free to lecture me with your cerebral meanderings when you've actually paid taxes, held a full time job, or understand the complexities of difficult things like comprehending why you're a dumbfug and are responsible for the location of your dogshit.

You don't have a clue.

BTW...you're still a pussy Matrix.