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View Full Version : Just watched Hali and Croyle in the Senior Bowl.


Coogs
04-30-2006, 07:45 PM
I have to admit, the last two days were not very exciting. I really had hope for a draft that would leave me pumped. And being the Homer that I am, I didn't think that would be all that hard to do. But the last two days did nothing for me. So, I thought I would watch the Senior Bowl! Thought that might pump me up a bit. And, Croyle I do like. But...

I was very unimpressed with Hali. I know he was given the defensive MVP for the game, but I don't have a clue how that happened. I think it was because he happend to make a play everytime they were focused on him..... which was three times and three times only. The first happened to be right when they drew a circle on him and said let's focus on Hali. Up to that point (in the 2nd quarter) he had done nothing. And I mean nothing! The O-linemen he was going aginst were stoning him on every play. On this particular play, he happened to get a bit of a push, broke inside the RT, and flushed the QB out of the pocket and into an incompletion.

The second play he made, again after a long stretch of doing absolutely nothing, he sacked the QB on a straight line rush to the QB where he was left totally unblocked. Missed assignment big time by the O-line.

And the last came late in the game against Croyle. The only real good play he made the whole game IMO. He pushed the RT back, split the guard, and sacked Croyle with one hand.

All-in-all, Hali's play reminded me a whole lot of a current KC Chiefs DE. No, not Allen. The other one. The one we all want ran out of town. Not real confident we have upgraded that spot right now.

So, after watching the game, I'm still as disappointed in the draft as I was before I watched the game. Like the Croyle pick. That is about it for now.

shaneo69
04-30-2006, 07:53 PM
I have that tape as well, and we popped it in yesterday after the 1st round, and I thought the same thing about Hali. Wasn't impressed.

I also just mentioned in another thread that Hali reminds me of Hicks.

CoMoChief
04-30-2006, 07:54 PM
BUT HE HAS GOOD CHARACTER!!!

Coogs
04-30-2006, 07:58 PM
BUT HE HAS GOOD CHARACTER!!!

Yeah, well there is that. Not sure how much pressure on the QB that is going to help with, but there is that.

Count Zarth
04-30-2006, 07:59 PM
He can handle being 1-4.

jiveturkey
04-30-2006, 07:59 PM
How many big plays are DE supposed to make in a game?

shaneo69
04-30-2006, 08:00 PM
Yeah, well there is that. Not sure how much pressure on the QB that is going to help with, but there is that.

When we're 1-4 next year, there won't be anyone you'd rather have in your locker room than Tamba Hali.

shaneo69
04-30-2006, 08:00 PM
When we're 1-4 next year, there won't be anyone you'd rather have in your locker room than Tamba Hali.


Wow I'm slow.

Sure-Oz
04-30-2006, 08:01 PM
Larry Johnsons sucked too, and he is from Penn State, who has a history of shitty RB's.

Count Zarth
04-30-2006, 08:02 PM
Wow I'm slow.

owned

Coogs
04-30-2006, 08:05 PM
How many big plays are DE supposed to make in a game?

:shrug: I was just expecting to see a DE that was a force to be reckoned with on every play. Instead, I saw a DE that was stood up at the point of attack damn near every single play. I don't know about you, but that just does not excite me very much.

Dunit35
04-30-2006, 08:08 PM
Maybe his good character can work to an advantage for us. He could maybe talk the tackle into going easy for a few plays or something.

shaneo69
04-30-2006, 08:08 PM
:shrug: I was just expecting to see a DE that was a force to be reconed with on every play. Instead, I saw a DE that was stood up at the point of attack damn near every single play. I don't know about you, but that just does not excite me very much.

On a couple of the plays I saw, the OT just rode him into the middle of the line while DeAngelo Williams walked around the end. Then one passing play he got a little pressure going inside, but the announcer even said he dropped containment and the QB could've ran for an easy 1st down.

dirk digler
04-30-2006, 08:11 PM
:shrug: I was just expecting to see a DE that was a force to be reckoned with on every play. Instead, I saw a DE that was stood up at the point of attack damn near every single play. I don't know about you, but that just does not excite me very much.

Didn't he have 11 sacks this season in 12 games this season? I would take that.

Plus he had the game deciding sack and turnover against the almighty Ohio State who had like 20 players drafted.

I call that impressive but that is just me.

CoMoChief
04-30-2006, 08:13 PM
On a couple of the plays I saw, the OT just rode him into the middle of the line while DeAngelo Williams walked around the end. Then one passing play he got a little pressure going inside, but the announcer even said he dropped containment and the QB could've ran for an easy 1st down.

ALRIGHT!!! Another Eric Hicks.

Coogs
04-30-2006, 08:13 PM
On a couple of the plays I saw, the OT just rode him into the middle of the line while DeAngelo Williams walked around the end. Then one passing play he got a little pressure going inside, but the announcer even said he dropped containment and the QB could've ran for an easy 1st down.

Yep!

That passing play scares me when thinking about the ol' Denver bootleg play.

the Talking Can
04-30-2006, 08:16 PM
Let's see...you watch one game in which he has 2 sacks and is named MVP...and you conclude from this sample that he is a disappointment.

I've learned two things about Hali tonight.

1. The fact that he improved - by a factor of 300% - his production as a DE in his second year is evidence of his lack of talent.

2. Being named MVP and recording 2 sacks in a Senior Bowl is proof he is over rated and destined to be Hicks waterboy.

dirk digler
04-30-2006, 08:17 PM
Let's see...you watch one game in which he has 2 sacks and is named MVP...and you conclude from this sample that he is a disappointment.

I've learned two things about Hali tonight.

1. The fact that he improved - by a factor of 300% - his production as a DE in his second year is evidence of his lack of talent.

2. Being named MVP and recording 2 sacks in a Senior Bowl is proof he is over rated and destined to be Hicks waterboy.

ROFL

Great post TC!

the Talking Can
04-30-2006, 08:18 PM
Didn't he have 11 sacks this season in 12 games this season? I would take that.

Plus he had the game deciding sack and turnover against the almighty Ohio State who had like 20 players drafted.

I call that impressive but that is just me.


poor fella...everyone knows that is proof he sucks

the Talking Can
04-30-2006, 08:20 PM
I've watched Freeney get his ass handed to him by Tackles in the NFL. I've seen teams run at and over him like he was a stunt ramp.

Does he suck? No.

No one makes plays every play.

suds79
04-30-2006, 08:21 PM
Okay well I didn't see the Senior Bowl but I did see Penn State's bowl game and Hali dominated that game.

Opinions vary but IMO to compare Hali to Hicks is laughable. Tamba Hali is twice the athlete Eric Hicks is at this stage in his career. When you compare their speed and epically quickness, it's not even close.

Granted Tamba isn't near as heavy as Eric so I'll give you that he probably isn't as good against the run right now but for me, I want a DE to rush the passer and for the DTs to supply run support.

4 sacks for Eric Hicks last year. Need I say more?

dirk digler
04-30-2006, 08:22 PM
I've watched Freeney get his ass handed to him by Tackles in the NFL. I've seen teams run at and over him like he was a stunt ramp.

Does he suck? No.

No one makes plays every play.

Yep. Roaf flat out OWNS Freeney every time we play them. Freeney is only good on the fast Indy carpet. When he plays on grass he sucks balls.

Coogs
04-30-2006, 08:24 PM
Let's see...you watch one game in which he has 2 sacks and is named MVP...and you conclude from this sample that he is a disappointment.

Not at all. I just expected to see more. I saw no push at all from Hali nearly the entire game. For winning the MVP, I expected to see so much more. I expected to se a DE who dominated a game. He was virtually non-existant.

You can yell at me all you want. That is what I saw, and apparently shaneo69 saw the same thing.

dirk digler
04-30-2006, 08:30 PM
Not at all. I just expected to see more. I saw no push at all from Hali nearly the entire game. For winning the MVP, I expected to see so much more. I expected to se a DE who dominated a game. He was virtually non-existant.

You can yell at me all you want. That is what I saw, and apparently shaneo69 saw the same thing.


I am curious how many plays did he actually play?

Coogs
04-30-2006, 08:32 PM
I am curious how many plays did he actually play?

Just a guess here, but I would say about 40-45.

dirk digler
04-30-2006, 08:36 PM
Just a guess here, but I would say about 40-45.

Thanks. I was thinking since it was an all-star game that he didn't play much or it was sporadic.

Coogs
04-30-2006, 08:39 PM
Thanks. I was thinking since it was an all-star game that he didn't play much or it was sporadic.


I had it on TiVo, and I erased it after I was done watching it tonight. Croyle did not play much at all. The first two series, then a bit of mop up at the end.

But both teams only had 3 or 4 DE's, so they were on the field a whole bunch.

Coogs
04-30-2006, 09:12 PM
One play that Hali did make that impressed me was a screen play late in the game. Croyle completed it (to the RB from Memphis I think), and Hali was in on the tackle some 30-35 yards down field. Not sure if any of our current linemen could do that.

Halfcan
04-30-2006, 09:45 PM
Hali is gonna rock da house!

penchief
04-30-2006, 09:58 PM
I wasn't impressed with his Senior Bowl performance, either. As someone who had touted Hali, I was a little disappointed. However, as someone who has also watched most of Penn State's games last year, I have never been unimpressed with him until the Senior Bowl. For whatever that's worth.

I like him. I think he will be tons better than Hicks. I think that he and Allen will create real headaches for offensive coordinators. He may be raw when it comes to experience but he has shown a propensity for the game. And he brings a relentless attitude to our defense that has been sorely missing. Hali's passion will be a needed spark for a Chiefs' defense destined for vast improvement.

Messier
04-30-2006, 10:18 PM
You know who totally dominated at the senior bowl play after play? Ryan Sims.

Ultra Peanut
05-01-2006, 03:24 AM
One play that Hali did make that impressed me was a screen play late in the game. Croyle completed it (to the RB from Memphis I think), and Hali was in on the tackle some 30-35 yards down field. Not sure if any of our current linemen could do that.I remember that one... it was definitely DeAngelo, and I remember being amazed that Hali was able to get downfield like that.

Guru
05-01-2006, 03:43 AM
I have to admit, the last two days were not very exciting. I really had hope for a draft that would leave me pumped. And being the Homer that I am, I didn't think that would be all that hard to do. But the last two days did nothing for me. So, I thought I would watch the Senior Bowl! Thought that might pump me up a bit. And, Croyle I do like. But...

I was very unimpressed with Hali. I know he was given the defensive MVP for the game, but I don't have a clue how that happened. I think it was because he happend to make a play everytime they were focused on him..... which was three times and three times only. The first happened to be right when they drew a circle on him and said let's focus on Hali. Up to that point (in the 2nd quarter) he had done nothing. And I mean nothing! The O-linemen he was going aginst were stoning him on every play. On this particular play, he happened to get a bit of a push, broke inside the RT, and flushed the QB out of the pocket and into an incompletion.

The second play he made, again after a long stretch of doing absolutely nothing, he sacked the QB on a straight line rush to the QB where he was left totally unblocked. Missed assignment big time by the O-line.

And the last came late in the game against Croyle. The only real good play he made the whole game IMO. He pushed the RT back, split the guard, and sacked Croyle with one hand.

All-in-all, Hali's play reminded me a whole lot of a current KC Chiefs DE. No, not Allen. The other one. The one we all want ran out of town. Not real confident we have upgraded that spot right now.

So, after watching the game, I'm still as disappointed in the draft as I was before I watched the game. Like the Croyle pick. That is about it for now.

Looks like he may be a master of the quarter or half sack. Most of the highlights I saw were of him disrupting the play for someone else to clean house. Not that that is a bad thing though.

greg63
05-01-2006, 04:26 AM
Looks like he may be a master of the quarter or half sack. Most of the highlights I saw were of him disrupting the play for someone else to clean house. Not that that is a bad thing though.


Exactly; it's called team work. :thumb:

Coogs
05-01-2006, 06:11 AM
I wasn't impressed with his Senior Bowl performance, either. As someone who had touted Hali, I was a little disappointed. However, as someone who has also watched most of Penn State's games last year, I have never been unimpressed with him until the Senior Bowl. For whatever that's worth.

I like him. I think he will be tons better than Hicks. I think that he and Allen will create real headaches for offensive coordinators. He may be raw when it comes to experience but he has shown a propensity for the game. And he brings a relentless attitude to our defense that has been sorely missing. Hali's passion will be a needed spark for a Chiefs' defense destined for vast improvement.

That sounds better. I just don't watch Penn State games, and Hali was such a non-factor in the Senior Bowl. No pass rush, no factor vs the run, nothing. Stoned at the point of first contact on nearly every play.

I was expecting to see something more like Jared Allen, where Hali would at least be pressuring the QB nearly everytime. Instead he looked like one of our many DT's. No push, no nothing.

Frankie
05-01-2006, 06:20 AM
How many big plays are DE supposed to make in a game?
Three!. And only when the cameras are focusing on you. You can lie down and grab a glass of wine and enjoy a blissful nap while the cameras aren't showing you. Which is what Hali did in the Senior Bowl according to our resident talent experts.

Lzen
05-01-2006, 07:40 AM
You know who totally dominated at the senior bowl play after play? Ryan Sims.


ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!
ROFL

CupidStunt
05-01-2006, 08:02 AM
One play that Hali did make that impressed me was a screen play late in the game. Croyle completed it (to the RB from Memphis I think), and Hali was in on the tackle some 30-35 yards down field. Not sure if any of our current linemen could do that.

So in a short space of time, you've gone from saying he made only 3 plays (and 2 were the opponent's fault) to now saying that he made 4 plays.

Maybe tommorow, he'll have made 7 plays?

CupidStunt
05-01-2006, 08:03 AM
You know who totally dominated at the senior bowl play after play? Ryan Sims.

:clap:

You know who also SUCKED at the Senior Bowl?

Brodrick Bunkley - #14 overall

Kamerion Wimbley - #13 overall

Chiefnj
05-01-2006, 08:09 AM
Was there any defensive lineman who really stood out during the senior bowl? Did Lawson and Wimbley make more plays for the South?

I'm not sure there is much to tell from a game where both sides of the ball are limited in what they can do. IIRC, defenses have to line up in a 4-3 and there is no blitzing or other movement allowed.

Whosurdaddy
05-01-2006, 08:10 AM
all star games are not much of a judge of talent. They have a watered down playbook on offense, and most all star games the Defense is limited on what they can throw at the offense. Especially on defense, they have problems because all of the 'all stars' don't work as a team. They are thrown together and told to show off. He may have been trying to do too much.

Radar Chief
05-01-2006, 08:40 AM
So in a short space of time, you've gone from saying he made only 3 plays (and 2 were the opponent's fault) to now saying that he made 4 plays.

Maybe tommorow, he'll have made 7 plays?

Even if it’s just three, that sounds like three more plays than we’re currently get’n from the “other” starting DE. :shrug:

KCTitus
05-01-2006, 08:53 AM
LOL...did I just read that he had to be in on every play to be a 'good' draft pick?

That's setting the bar a bit high, IMO, but it's made for a classic thread.

dirk digler
05-01-2006, 09:18 AM
I found this interesting especially with all of the bashing of the Chiefs picking Tamba.

The tackle and sack totals of new Houston defensive end Mario Williams against the three Division I-AA opponents he faced while at North Carolina State .

Three low-level foes, zero sacks.

Coogs
05-01-2006, 09:22 AM
LOL...did I just read that he had to be in on every play to be a 'good' draft pick?

Nope. What you just read was that Hali did not stand out at all in the Senior Bowl. Nothing more, nothing less. He could not move/push the O-linemen on nearly every single play in the game. Looked a whole lot like the D-linemen we already have... in this one game.

I was just hoping to see more. That is all.

Like I said, (possibly in another thread) maybe after the first pre-season game I will be touting him for the HOF. That is my riight as a Chiefs fan you know. We are going to the Super Bowl after every win, we suck after every loss type of thing.