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thepascalblaze
06-14-2006, 11:45 PM
An aquaintence turned me on to this site, seems like a good one for the board, I dunno... Move it if need be... it seemed like it may be of interest to each of us indivdually... it was to me...

Ari Chi3fs
06-14-2006, 11:58 PM
this questionnaire takes forever... heh

thepascalblaze
06-14-2006, 11:59 PM
politicalcompass.org ...hope this works.

Ari Chi3fs
06-15-2006, 12:03 AM
http://politicalcompass.jpagel.net/images/middle_cross.gif

Pitt Gorilla
06-15-2006, 12:03 AM
Wow, I'm almost exactly at the origin.

Basileus777
06-15-2006, 12:07 AM
I took this a few years ago, and I think I got about the same.

Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: -7.75
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.21

J Diddy
06-15-2006, 12:12 AM
I'm about in the middle

on the other side of GW

TG

Reaper16
06-15-2006, 12:34 AM
Economic Left/Right: -2.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.56

Pretty solidly into the libertarian left catagory, which is accurate.

alnorth
06-15-2006, 12:37 AM
This site is old.

The theory of the political compass is fine, but this particular implementation of it is a huge steaming pile of crap. They dont even bother to adequately disguise the biases of the creator for this particular test.

Some examples:

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If economic globalisation is inevitable, it should primarily serve humanity rather than the interests of trans-national corporations.

Well, golly that sounds like a nice noble statement! Just who wouldnt agree with this? This question is flawed because it assumes that "serve humanity" and "serve the interests of trans-national corporations" are mutually exclusive goals. When a corporation creates and provides jobs to disadvantaged countries, as well as a way for them to survive and make a living where they would otherwise starve, couldnt you argue that the corporation is serving humanity AND serving themselves?

This question subtlely makes people think that walking and chewing gum at the same time isnt possible here, and so people vote for what sounds nice and noble without thinking about it. This gets scored as Liberal.

----------------------------------------------------------

I'd always support my country, whether it was right or wrong.

Well gosh this sounds enlightened doesnt it? If you believe your country is "wrong", then by definition you should not support it. Morally and ethically, everyone should be voting No to this question, however this answer is scored as Liberal for some reason thats not defensible.

A Conservative, Centrist, or Libertarian who decides to vote no on this question is doing so under the assumption that the country is doing something thats wrong. This question is flawed because it uses a flawed assumption. Who is to say that the country is doing something wrong? This question belongs in a non-political ethics/moral quiz, it does not belong in a political quiz, because Conservatives and Liberals are not necessarily agreeing that the country is doing something wrong. If you force them to make that assumption, then morally they must answer no, and they then get incorrectly labled.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Our race has many superior qualities, compared to other races.

EVERYONE is going to say no to this. It gets scored liberal. (incorrectly)

-------------------------------------------------------------------

The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

This question is playing games with us. This question is salvagable if you get into specifics. If you want to ask whether we are willing to support a lesser evil such as China(human rights abuses), in support of going against a greater evil (North Korea's even worse human rights abuses, and possible security dangers) then come right out and say so. Even then, I'm not sure how the question should be scored. It strikes me as a non-partisan issue and should probably be tossed out.

This question is not biased towards Liberal or conservative, it is simply irrelevant and confusing in its current form. Its effect is a random unpredictable variable skewing the result in a random way.

-------------------------------------------------------------

The growing fusion between information and entertainment is a worrying contribution to the public's shrinking attention span.

This question is going to be answered yes by most people. A Liberal is going to have Fox News or the radio in mind. A Conservative is probably going to be thinking of MTV or pop culture. Both will mostly answer yes, but itll get scored as Liberal for both. This question is salvagable with specifics. If you want to talk about Fox News and the radio vs CNN and the networks, then come right out and say so.

The other questions on page 1 are fine. I'm not going to spell out ALL the problems with the other pages, or this will be a book instead of a post, just the worst ones in the next pages:

-----------------------------------------------------------

Page 2 is horrible, only 3 good neutral questions, I'll only pick the 2 worst IMO

People are ultimately divided more by class than by nationality.

Way too vague. Most people will look around, realize the stark difference between rich and poor, and say yes. They arent passing judgement, they are simply affirming reality. This gets scored Liberal.

What they MEANT to say, was something like "Success in life depends on winning life's lottery or being born to a wealthy family, rather than hard work and determination"

My re-wording is probably biased towards conservative, most people will answer my question no and get scored conservative, but you get the idea. This question could be very difficult to word neutrally.

------------------------------------------------------------

The only social responsibility of a company should be to deliver a profit to its shareholders.

EVERYONE should be answering no to this question. If you dont answer no, you either didnt think about it, or I worry for your morality and ethics. Unfortunately, answering no will score you Liberal.

Corporations have a very high obligation to their shareholders. A Liberal will probably be thinking of something like the poor or the environment when they answer no, and thats fine. However, Conservatives will be thinking about the law and business ethics when they answer no. Corporations dont have ONLY a responsibility to shareholders and no one else, that question is retarded. They have a responsibility AT LEAST to their government and the law as well.

This question is salvagable if you spell out what the Liberal and the conservative is thinking, something like which is more important, responsibility to shareholders, or to the environment, etc.

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Page 3 is actually not that bad. This one focuses on social issues, and since most people are socially liberal, they did not have to monkey around with these questions to get the result they wanted.

I dont like "What's good for the most successful corporations is always, ultimately, good for all of us." or "Everyone has their rights, but it is better for all of us that different sorts of people should keep to their own kind.", but I wont be nit-picky.

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Page 4 isnt bad since its also social issues, only 3 problems on first glance.

"A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system."

This question is just plain retarded, and I dont have to go too far to explain why, it should be obvious to everyone. A Liberal will be imagining the horrors of a US with only republicans, and a conservative will be imagining the horrors of a country with only democrats. Both will answer no, both are scored liberal.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

I honestly have no clue how this question is scored. Its random, some people will say yes, some will say no, and I have no clue how you could say either is conservative or liberal, or what the test creators are thinking about either. So, this will add randomness skewing the final result in a random direction.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers

This question is salvagable with re-wording. The intention is obvious, but "homemakers" now has an obvious negative connotation. I would re-state this as "A good family should have either a mom or a dad staying at home to raise the kids through earlier childhood, while the other works as the family wage-earner."

I have heard of a conservative family where the dad stayed at home because the mom was a successful attorney who could earn far more money. This made sence for that family.

The Liberal would vote no and perhaps state that they should both be able to work and advance their professional career, relying on outside child-care, while the conservative would say yes to this question, it doesnt matter which one stays home. For a centrist, the negative connotation of "homemaker" is now gone and you can now neutrally evaluate it.

-------------------------------------------------------------

Page 5 and 6 isnt bad, but it does have this:

Astrology accurately explains many things.

ROFL

What the hell does being stupid and gullible have to do with politics? It should be tossed out of this quiz, and inserted into a "how freaking retarded are you?" test. This question probably backfires on the creators and skews the results towards being conservative.

---------------------------------------------------------------

There were other nitpicks but I got tired of detailing them after page 1, just looked at the worst.

greg63
06-15-2006, 12:43 AM
Economic Left/Right: -2.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.10

Whatever any of this means. :shrug:

thepascalblaze
06-15-2006, 12:54 AM
alnorth, I also saw many problems as I was responding. I looked in the FAQs, and there, some of your critique is addressed. Their basic answer is this. They are not questions. They are statements, and acccording to tests creators, they are designed to evoke responses, even emotional ones. My big problem with the thing is that they won't describe the mechanism for scoring. They mention evoking responses on different levels; but do they then apply psychology in the scoring of the responses?

What I like about it is the attempt to separate social and economic spectrums. While the test on this site is flawed, the quadrants idea is interesting to me. I've been careful for a long time to avoid left/right and conservative/liberal distinctions, but wanted a simplifiable framework to discuss political leanings. Even without relying on their analysis, I came away with a convenient model, albeit a likely oversimplified one. It still beats a single spectrum.

J Diddy
06-15-2006, 12:57 AM
Economic Left/Right: -2.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.10

Whatever any of this means. :shrug:

This is just like mine.

Weird, greg are you my father, if so you owe me about oh 18 years of child support and personal checks will not be accepted.

greg63
06-15-2006, 12:59 AM
This is just like mine.

Weird, greg are you my father, if so you owe me about oh 18 years of child support and personal checks will not be accepted.
LOL! If you are my son, where's your mom; I wanna ask her where all the letters I sent ya went.ROFL

J Diddy
06-15-2006, 01:02 AM
LOL! If you are my son, where's your mom; I wanna ask her where all the letters I sent ya went.ROFL


You know her, she never did learn how to read. Probably thought they were bills or something.

NJ Chief Fan
06-15-2006, 01:09 AM
Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: -2.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 0.05
Authorita

Fish
06-15-2006, 01:14 AM
Hmmmm.... my dot was right beside Gandhi, and very near Nelson Mandela. I don't know what to think about that....

Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: -3.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -1.59

J Diddy
06-15-2006, 01:18 AM
Hmmmm.... my dot was right beside Gandhi, and very near Nelson Mandela. I don't know what to think about that....

Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: -3.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -1.59

Me neither, but nothing violent I presume.

Fish
06-15-2006, 01:23 AM
Me neither, but nothing violent I presume.

F*ck you! I'll stab you in the face...... you don't know me! Where the f*ck do you get off judging me over some damn internet quiz....

Geez......

:p

J Diddy
06-15-2006, 01:27 AM
F*ck you! I'll stab you in the face...... you don't know me! Where the f*ck do you get off judging me over some damn internet quiz....

Geez......

:p

Is this a quote from the national spelling bee.

Miles
06-15-2006, 01:30 AM
Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: 3.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.46

Fish
06-15-2006, 01:31 AM
Is this a quote from the national spelling bee.

This bottle of bargain scotch makes me crazy...... I do apologize....

greg63
06-15-2006, 01:32 AM
You know her, she never did learn how to read. Probably thought they were bills or something.


ROFLROFLROFL


I tried my son.

J Diddy
06-15-2006, 01:33 AM
This bottle of bargain scotch makes me crazy...... I do apologize....


Kinda like wearing whitie tighties in the hot month of June.


I understand.

Fish
06-15-2006, 01:37 AM
Kinda like wearing whitie tighties in the hot month of June.


I understand.

Thank you.... now pull up a chair and we'll talk zen over drinks....

thepascalblaze
06-15-2006, 01:39 AM
...and zen what?..

Moooo
06-15-2006, 01:45 AM
Economic Left/Right: -6.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.69

I am almost exactly where Ghandi was, except he was for more government than I am (which I would be too, if I was ever actually leader of an office) !!! Good company, imo...

Moooo

J Diddy
06-15-2006, 01:47 AM
Thank you.... now pull up a chair and we'll talk zen over drinks....

bring the cheap scotch

Basileus777
06-15-2006, 02:04 AM
For some perspective:

J Diddy
06-15-2006, 02:22 AM
For some perspective:

Perspective is overrated.

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-15-2006, 06:30 AM
I took this a few years ago. I was to the left of Gandhi at the time, -9.xx, and -7.xx if I recall. Basically I was an anarcho-socialist.

BucEyedPea
06-15-2006, 07:05 AM
I took this a few years ago. I was to the left of Gandhi at the time, -9.xx, and -7.xx if I recall. Basically I was an anarcho-socialist.

anarcho-socialist is a communist too

Do you consider yourself a communist?

Bootlegged
06-15-2006, 07:15 AM
politicalcompass.org, brought to you by Socialists for Michael Moore.

ChiefsfaninPA
06-15-2006, 07:49 AM
I am Ecomomic Left/Right -1.88

Social Lib./Auth. 0.26

Now what the hell does this mean? I have no clue.

JBucc
06-15-2006, 07:51 AM
My dot was up there by Hitler. Is that good?

htismaqe
06-15-2006, 09:00 AM
ROFL

oldandslow
06-15-2006, 09:04 AM
I took this a few years ago. I was to the left of Gandhi at the time, -9.xx, and -7.xx if I recall. Basically I was an anarcho-socialist.

There are two of us on this board...

along with Noam Chomsky.

-8.63
-7.34

Rain Man
06-15-2006, 09:15 AM
I'm just barely in the Gandhi quadrant (lower left). Somewhat surprising.

Economic Left/Right: -1.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -1.85

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-15-2006, 09:31 AM
anarcho-socialist is a communist too

Do you consider yourself a communist?

Do you consider yourself a moron?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-socialism#Conflict_with_Marxism

Moooo
06-15-2006, 09:38 AM
Too many people associate communism with all forms of socialist government. However, idealistic communism has absolutely no government and no sanctions or taxes, so...

Moooo

htismaqe
06-15-2006, 10:15 AM
Too many people associate communism with all forms of socialist government. However, idealistic communism has absolutely no government and no sanctions or taxes, so...

Moooo

Idealistic communism doesn't exist. It can't exist. It goes against human nature.

Moooo
06-15-2006, 10:24 AM
Idealistic communism doesn't exist. It can't exist. It goes against human nature.

One could make the argument that no communism has ever existed or could ever exist, cause Marx never said the interim leader in charge of the transformation was in fact, a communist form of government in itself.

What you see in China is not Communism. It is the middle step needed for the transformation to a leaderless system. Marx said the only way for Communism to occur is for a short while to have a supreme leader dish out command till the country becomes self-sustaining without him. Marx never said that the process of transformation which we see is Communism in itself.

Moooo

htismaqe
06-15-2006, 10:37 AM
One could make the argument that no communism has ever existed or could ever exist, cause Marx never said the interim leader in charge of the transformation was in fact, a communist form of government in itself.

What you see in China is not Communism. It is the middle step needed for the transformation to a leaderless system. Marx said the only way for Communism to occur is for a short while to have a supreme leader dish out command till the country becomes self-sustaining without him. Marx never said that the process of transformation which we see is Communism in itself.

Moooo

Marx was banking on that interim leader giving up power after the transformation was complete.

Human nature simply doesn't allow it. Nobody gives up supreme authority.

BucEyedPea
06-15-2006, 01:47 PM
Do you consider yourself a moron?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-socialism#Conflict_with_Marxism
Same thing. Different form. Also is communitarianism.

thepascalblaze
06-15-2006, 09:08 PM
Good stuff... thanks for taking the time...


Hey mods, can we move this to D.C?...


Should I just make a dup there?

For the record, I am in no way associated with the site linked. I am, however, involved in an ongoing socio-politico-econo conversation/ debate with the guy who directed me to the link. He is an economics teacher at the local high school, and we both graduated from the same university. We live in a small town and were both pretty stoked to run into each other and begin a conversation that excercises the brain.