PDA

View Full Version : Do you believe a mother who kills her 5 children could be sane?


Logical
07-26-2006, 09:17 PM
Poll to follow:

I don't believe it is possible for such a circumstance to exist. Now if you want to argue about guilt or penalty that is not my point.

HemiEd
07-26-2006, 09:19 PM
She should be dead, quick and cheap. Use Mohilbillys hammer program.

Al Bundy
07-26-2006, 09:25 PM
Yes I believe she can be sane. She murdered her children in a cold and calculating way. It was to thought out to be done by someone who was insane, at least in my eyes and I am no expert.

Bowser
07-26-2006, 09:27 PM
Define "insane".

KILLER_CLOWN
07-26-2006, 09:30 PM
Sane well that all depends, do you consider demonic possesion sane? Doesn't even need an answer as it shouldn't matter. Committ a murder then you suffer the same fate no ifs ands or butts.

Bowser
07-26-2006, 09:34 PM
When I think of insane, I think of a person who likes to write on the wall with their own feces. I'm sure somebody will show up with a clinical explanation of what "insane" really is.

Chiefs Minor Satellite
07-26-2006, 09:34 PM
Taking a life is not an act that can be called sane. People in a position to take lives become desensitized to the act.

The lady killed 5 people. Sane or insane the punishment should be the same.

An eye for an eye. In this case it would be difficult to put her away 5 times, but it is surely something she is worthy of .

unlurking
07-26-2006, 09:57 PM
Voted no, but at the same point, I don't believe in the insanity plea for reasons of guilt. Sanity should be an issue for the punishment phase, not the verdict.

OldTownChief
07-26-2006, 10:03 PM
Depends on your definition of sane? Did she know right from wrong at the time she killed five defenses children?

go bowe
07-26-2006, 10:04 PM
yeah, the legal theories and justifications for the insanity defense are obtuse and out-dated...

but it's been around for hundreds of years in english and then american common law...

and it'll be around for hundreds more years...

the boiled down version is that if you didn't know/understand what you were doing was wrong, you can't be held responsible for it...

people not guilty by reason of insanity still get locked up, but in a psychiatric hospital instead of a prison...

OldTownChief
07-26-2006, 10:07 PM
still get locked up, but in a psychiatric hospital instead of a prison...

No comparison.

ArrowheadHawk
07-26-2006, 10:26 PM
we should hang the bitch....sane or not

Logical
07-26-2006, 10:29 PM
Voted no, but at the same point, I don't believe in the insanity plea for reasons of guilt. Sanity should be an issue for the punishment phase, not the verdict.

I think it would be an improvement if guilt of the act was first established then if guilt was established, mitigating factors could be introduced at sentencing, such as insanity, retardation etc.

OldTownChief
07-26-2006, 10:30 PM
we should hang the bitch....sane or not

Hangin's too good for her.

ArrowheadHawk
07-26-2006, 10:31 PM
Hangin's too good for her.
draw and quarter and then stone?

Bowser
07-26-2006, 10:35 PM
Hangin's too good for her.

BURNIN'S too good for her!

OldTownChief
07-26-2006, 10:37 PM
draw and quarter and then stone?


Close
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=3326219#post3326219

ArrowheadHawk
07-26-2006, 10:38 PM
Close
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=3326219#post3326219
ok my bad

Rausch
07-26-2006, 10:39 PM
People kill spouses for money all the time so it wouldn't shock me to see a parent sick enough to kill their kids for freedom/lack of give a $#it...

OldTownChief
07-26-2006, 10:40 PM
BURNIN'S too good for her!

Watching her burn would be pretty cool.

ArrowheadHawk
07-26-2006, 10:41 PM
Watching her burn would be pretty cool.
only after this part


http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/show...219#post3326219

SLAG
07-26-2006, 10:51 PM
What story inspired this thread

DomerNKC
07-26-2006, 11:27 PM
Watching her burn would be pretty cool.no, she should be strapped to a chair in a tank of water. as she sits there, water trickles into the tank. a slow drowning should do the trick. sane or insane, it doesn't matter. to kill your own defenceless children proves that you are a monster. monsters should be killed.

burt
07-26-2006, 11:33 PM
As much as I like to kid...I can not on this subject. It is a sad world where there are people like her and I would enjoy the idea of her leaving to the judgement of the after life...leaving this world a much better place.

ENDelt260
07-26-2006, 11:35 PM
When I think of insane, I think of a person who likes to write on the wall with their own feces. I'm sure somebody will show up with a clinical explanation of what "insane" really is.
Heh... this post reminded me of a Ron White bit. He was talking about how murderers who are declared insane should still be given the death penalty. Something to the effect of...

I don't think we should lump all crazy people into one big group. We should further examine things to determine what to do with them.
"What does this crazy person do?"
"Well, he rolls his shit into little balls and eats crayons."
"Ok, and what does this crazy person do?"
"He murders productive members of society."
"Well, he should've rolled his shit into little balls and ate crayons."

DomerNKC
07-26-2006, 11:38 PM
if we are going to leave her judgement to the afterlife, do we not owe her a speedy trial?

Logical
07-26-2006, 11:49 PM
What story inspired this thread

Andrea Yates: NOT GUILTY! (http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=144313)

burt
07-27-2006, 12:02 AM
if we are going to leave her judgement to the afterlife, do we not owe her a speedy trial?

unfortunately, the court system doesn't hold the same belief that I do....unfortunately.

Logical
07-27-2006, 02:02 PM
As much as I like to kid...I can not on this subject. It is a sad world where there are people like her and I would enjoy the idea of her leaving to the judgement of the after life...leaving this world a much better place.

I am conflicted on whether a truly crazy person should get the death penalty. I feel this Yate woman abused the system but not everyone does.

BIG_DADDY
07-27-2006, 02:08 PM
Of course. There are cold people, brutal people and those that only think of themself. Combine any of these with stupid and absolutely.

chagrin
07-27-2006, 02:12 PM
If you are going to sit here and try to be the deciding factor over all this with your little poll there, you are deluding yourself and I will tell you why - because if you believe this, than how can any criminal be sane?

It took over an hour and a half for her to do that, she planned it and then carried it out and then didn't even resist arrest or prosecution, she was quite aware of what she did and how it was wrong.

YES Vlad, even though you don't agree, a person can just be, evil - or mean or cruel or insensitive and still kill someone.

htismaqe
07-27-2006, 02:26 PM
Jeffrey Dahmer ATE HIS VICTIMS. He's OBVIOUSLY insane. Yet, he didn't get off. :hmmm:

This society is going to hell in a handbasket when people FEEL SORRY for someone who KILLED HER CHILDREN because "she's sick".

**** that. She's a ****ing murderer.

Donger
07-27-2006, 02:30 PM
Texas' definition of insanity: that a severe mental illness prevents someone who is committing a crime from knowing that it is wrong.

She waited until her husband left for work to kill her kids, but she didn't know it was wrong.

She put a sheet over the kids after she killed them, but she didn't know it was wrong.

Shortly after killing her kids, she called 911, but she didn't know it was wrong.

Her above actions demonstrate that she knew what she was going to do and that she knew those actions were wrong.

vailpass
07-27-2006, 02:34 PM
yeah, the legal theories and justifications for the insanity defense are obtuse and out-dated...

but it's been around for hundreds of years in english and then american common law...

and it'll be around for hundreds more years...

the boiled down version is that if you didn't know/understand what you were doing was wrong, you can't be held responsible for it...
people not guilty by reason of insanity still get locked up, but in a psychiatric hospital instead of a prison...

Then she was sane. StevieRay said it best in the main thread. She knew full well she was killing those children. They should gather all of the video they have of those poor children when they were living, lock Andrea in a room with plenty of razor blades, and force her to watch those videos on an endless loop until she picks up a blade and does the right thing.

DiaperBoy27
07-27-2006, 02:35 PM
Jeffrey Dahmer ATE HIS VICTIMS. He's OBVIOUSLY insane. Yet, he didn't get off. :hmmm:

He was just hungry.

Can't blame a guy for having unusual taste :shrug:

Iowanian
07-27-2006, 02:35 PM
Of Course I think any bitch who drowns 5 of her own kids as they scream and struggle for life is effing crazy.

She's crazy enough to deserve the Electric Chair as there is no helping someone that effing nuts.


Whack the bidge with Mohillbilly's rusty claw hammer.

FringeNC
07-27-2006, 02:45 PM
Penalties against crimes exist to deter future crime. Her's was such an unusual and bizarre crime, and is one of the few cases where the insanity loophole fits, in my opinion.

Generally, I feel that who cares if the person was sane or not, you have to punish the criminal to deter others....in this case, I hardly think someone is going to be deterred or not be deterred by the punishment of her.

Having written that, I am already having second thoughts. There was that women in South Carolina who killed her kids because she thought that's what prevented her rich lover from marrying her....

So...even though Yates to me is obviously crazy, it's a slippery slope to the case of the women South Carolina who did murder her kids as a crime of opportunity. What to do with Yates is a tough call.

Brock
07-27-2006, 02:47 PM
You may as well ask the question as to whether or not any person can commit cold blooded murder of anyone and still be sane.

htismaqe
07-27-2006, 02:51 PM
You may as well ask the question as to whether or not any person can commit cold blooded murder of anyone and still be sane.

That question SHOULD be asked.

vailpass
07-27-2006, 03:08 PM
Here is a quote from one of the jurors. Does the second one make sense in light of the burden of proof for insanity?

The foreman of the jury said Thursday that the group had “some emotional difficulty” reaching its unanimous verdict and would have had an easier time if they could have found her “guilty but insane.”

And another from juror Todd Frank:
'We understand that she knew it was legally wrong,” he said. “But in her delusional mind, in her severely mentally ill mind, we believe that she thought what she did was right.”

htismaqe
07-27-2006, 03:33 PM
Here is a quote from one of the jurors. Does the second one make sense in light of the burden of proof for insanity?

The foreman of the jury said Thursday that the group had “some emotional difficulty” reaching its unanimous verdict and would have had an easier time if they could have found her “guilty but insane.”

And another from juror Todd Frank:
'We understand that she knew it was legally wrong,” he said. “But in her delusional mind, in her severely mentally ill mind, we believe that she thought what she did was right.”

Sounds like some kind of reform is in order, as has already been discussed earlier in the thread.

Insanity should not affect guilt or innocence, but should come into play during sentencing.

BIG_DADDY
07-27-2006, 03:37 PM
Sounds like some kind of reform is in order, as has already been discussed earlier in the thread.

Insanity should not affect guilt or innocence, but should come into play during sentencing.:thumb:

Calcountry
07-27-2006, 03:52 PM
It's o.k. for women to murder, just not men.

Logical
07-27-2006, 04:09 PM
If you are going to sit here and try to be the deciding factor over all this with your little poll there, you are deluding yourself and I will tell you why - because if you believe this, than how can any criminal be sane?

It took over an hour and a half for her to do that, she planned it and then carried it out and then didn't even resist arrest or prosecution, she was quite aware of what she did and how it was wrong.

YES Vlad, even though you don't agree, a person can just be, evil - or mean or cruel or insensitive and still kill someone.Of course that can be true, that is not equivalent to killing 5 of your own children.

Logical
07-27-2006, 04:11 PM
Of Course I think any bitch who drowns 5 of her own kids as they scream and struggle for life is effing crazy.

She's crazy enough to deserve the Electric Chair as there is no helping someone that effing nuts.


Whack the bidge with Mohillbilly's rusty claw hammer.

I don't disagree with anything in this post despite what Chagrin might think.

StcChief
07-27-2006, 04:20 PM
Yates Sane. Cold, Calculating. Killer.

Someone else might be insane but not her.

Mrs. J. OverHead
07-27-2006, 04:58 PM
I feel the need to qualify my vote of insanity in this case. Actually ANY person who willingly kills another human being in insane. Anyone in their right mind would not look to kill someone. Having said that I DON'T believe there should be an INSANITY defense. You kill someone....you pay the price. VERY FEW EXCEPTIONS.......

This woman deserves to be put away FOR EVER and sterilized so she cannot reproduce ever again. (Take note....a rant from a pregnant woman) :cuss:

OldTownChief
07-27-2006, 05:12 PM
Jeffrey Dahmer ATE HIS VICTIMS. He's OBVIOUSLY insane. Yet, he didn't get off. :hmmm:


Perfect example.