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Count Alex's Losses
08-03-2006, 12:28 AM
http://orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=44660

Like most of you, I've been sitting here listen to the Chief blowhards claim that Larry Johnson is going to run wild this season, run for 2000 yards and all that jazz. I can't speak for the rest of you, but I just have never been that impressed with Larry Johnson. Sure he's a good running back, just something about him doesn't make me afraid of him. I thought I'd take a little initative and breakdown his 2005 performance by studying his performances and the opponets rush defense rankings. Please note that all rush defense rankings are based off of yards surrendered per game.

*snip stats*

Now I'm not saying he's not a good running back, and I'm not saying he won't have a good season, but I think the numbers show for themselves that Larry Johnson's numbers are skewed by games against poor rush defenses.

Moooo
08-03-2006, 12:29 AM
This is what Skip Bayless thinks.

Coincidence, I think not...

Moooo

KCChiefsFan88
08-03-2006, 12:30 AM
I think most Denver fans are "special"

Mecca
08-03-2006, 12:31 AM
HAHA, now you have to register to read their board, they apparently want to keep the dumbassery in house.

Guru
08-03-2006, 12:32 AM
And just what merit did his "stats" have?

SNR
08-03-2006, 12:33 AM
Well, LJ is no Ron Dayne, but I'm pretty sure he's gonna kick some ass this year

Mecca
08-03-2006, 12:34 AM
That's the same board that before last season they all thought Tatum Bell was better than Larry Johnson.....

Moooo
08-03-2006, 12:36 AM
Well, LJ is no Ron Dayne, but I'm pretty sure he's gonna kick some ass this year

Somewhere, in both Denver and Madison, Wisconsin, someone is cursing your name...

Moooo

Rausch
08-03-2006, 12:37 AM
Note that he includes Denver, Miami, New England, Dallas, and the Giants as "poor rush defenses."

While they all had bad games they still mostly had respectable numbers.

The fact is LJ post 100+ yard games vs. 5 playoff teams.

luv
08-03-2006, 12:38 AM
I think most Denver fans are "special"
That's what I was thinking.

Moooo
08-03-2006, 12:43 AM
That's what I was thinking.

I think the altitude and consequent lower percentage of oxygen inhibits brain development at young ages.

Not to mention the skiing accidents.

Moooo

Rausch
08-03-2006, 12:48 AM
I think the altitude and consequent lower percentage of oxygen inhibits brain development at young ages.

Not to mention the skiing accidents.

Moooo

The cold also slows down the metabolism leading to longer reaction time and less bloodflow to the brain.

Combined with less oxygen, and again, lowered resources to the brain.

Combined with hippi culture and some very high quality micro-brews.

Yeah. They-........Yeah.

SNR
08-03-2006, 12:49 AM
Why do I get such satisfaction from bagging on retarded Donk fans? That's like walking by and seeing a turtle on its back and start spinning it around in circles. Maybe I'm sadistic.

luv
08-03-2006, 12:50 AM
The cold also slows down the metabolism leading to longer reaction time and less bloodflow to the brain.

Combined with less oxygen, and again, lowered resources to the brain.

Combined with hippi culture and some very high quality micro-brews.

Yeah. They-........Yeah.
All excuses for being wusses, too.

Moooo
08-03-2006, 12:52 AM
The cold also slows down the metabolism leading to longer reaction time and less bloodflow to the brain.

Combined with less oxygen, and again, lowered resources to the brain.

Combined with hippi culture and some very high quality micro-brews.

Yeah. They-........Yeah.

And they had to look at horseface for too long!!! That would mess with Albert Einstein.

Moooo

Moooo
08-03-2006, 12:53 AM
Why do I get such satisfaction from bagging on retarded Donk fans? That's like walking by and seeing a turtle on its back and start spinning it around in circles. Maybe I'm sadistic.

It's only like that if the turtle keeps trying to snap at you on its way around each rotation

turrrrrrrrrrSNAPrrrrrrrrrrrSNAPrrrrn

ChiefsfaninPA
08-03-2006, 05:08 AM
This is a whole new level of dumbassery. Tell me Gochiefs, what was the consensus on the post, did they agree with this retards statement or disagree.

MichaelH
08-03-2006, 05:53 AM
Most opponents will declare any player that burns them "not special". I would bet that if Larry was a donkey, he'd be the next Terrell Davis.

Count Alex's Losses
08-03-2006, 05:53 AM
Thankfully, most of them have come to terms with LJ's status as a dominant running back.

There are a few stragglers that refuse to see the light.

StcChief
08-03-2006, 05:57 AM
I'm just glad LJ isn't a Ron Dayne or Tatem Bell....

KCTitus
08-03-2006, 07:29 AM
There's Homerism, Idiocy, Dumbassery, Dipshittery, Actual Retardation, Bronco Homerism, then OrangeMane Homerism.

I swear, I realize I can be homerish at times, but damn that's just outright embarrassing. It ranks right up there with 'Brister will be just as good as Elway' and 'Clarett is a bargain 3rd round pick'.

It never ceases to amaze me...

King_Chief_Fan
08-03-2006, 07:33 AM
http://orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=44660

trying to justify the denile

The Donks are very concerned about LJ. (with or without Roaf)

Chan93lx50
08-03-2006, 07:38 AM
I luv it how the guy feels the need to subtract the the 46 yard carry! WTF

Brock
08-03-2006, 07:44 AM
Most opponents will declare any player that burns them "not special". I would bet that if Larry was a donkey, he'd be the next Terrell Davis.

They have to bring up Terrell Davis, because you have to go back to freaking Floyd Little to find another Bronco RB who was good.

Chan93lx50
08-03-2006, 07:55 AM
He is a good running back not a special running back, WTF kind of argument is that. This guy is creating his own strawman and knocking it down.

Anybody with common sense would be able to see this and any body that follows his argument must have no brain.

morphius
08-03-2006, 07:57 AM
I guess if they could show one team that stopped him they might have something.

Bwana
08-03-2006, 08:04 AM
I think most Denver fans are "special"

Exactly

ZepSinger
08-03-2006, 08:10 AM
Now I'm not saying he's not a good running back, and I'm not saying he won't have a good season, but I think the numbers show for themselves that Larry Johnson's numbers are skewed by games against poor rush defenses.

Brought to you by the Department of Redundancy Department.

CoMoChief
08-03-2006, 08:11 AM
There isn't one smart person over on that damn website, and whenever someone wants to talk football over there and talk about straight simple facts, they ban you. I'm really suprised Bob's Your Information Minister or (GoChiefs) hasn't been banned from that site.

KCFalcon59
08-03-2006, 08:50 AM
Brought to you by the Department of Redundancy Department.

ROFLROFL

That's great.

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 08:56 AM
Well, LJ is no Ron Dayne, but I'm pretty sure he's gonna kick some ass this year

Especially when Roaf gets back...and he will come back.

ChiefsfaninPA
08-03-2006, 08:59 AM
Especially when Roaf gets back...and he will come back.

With or without Roaf he will have a great year. Especially when he his running over the Clevland Br...I mean Donkeys defense.

chagrin
08-03-2006, 09:00 AM
Funny little bit on NFL Live yesterday, Trey Wingo was introducing the next segment and it was a short one about Javon Walker in Camp for Denver, he rushed through it really fast and then said, "John Elway is still retired" and moved on, spending about 15 seconds on them - I laughed my ass off at that!

Hound333
08-03-2006, 09:01 AM
Whatever makes this donk fan sleep better at night... for the moment. He's just trying to hold off the nightmares he knows will come once the season starts.

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 09:02 AM
With or without Roaf he will have a great year. Especially when he his running over the Clevland Br...I mean Donkeys defense.

I agree....he will have a great year.

jidar
08-03-2006, 09:03 AM
hahahha what a big giant moran

http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/n/U/moran.jpg

I'll bet he used the rushing ranks of the teams at the end of the season too, completely overlooking the fact that several off them were top 5 before LJ put a ton of yards on their asses.

ChiefsfaninPA
08-03-2006, 09:04 AM
I agree....he will have a great year.

Hey man, you can't do this agreeing with me stuff. It kind of takes the life out of my fight. :harumph:

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 09:05 AM
hahahha what a big giant moran

http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/n/U/moran.jpg

I'll bet he used the rushing ranks of the teams at the end of the season too, completely overlooking the fact that several off them were top 5 before LJ put a ton of yards on their asses.

and how did that work out for the Chiefs? How about the time Holmes gained 304 all purpose yards in game?

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 09:07 AM
Hey man, you can't do this agreeing with me stuff. It kind of takes the life out of my fight. :harumph:

Seriously...the guy is a good runner...he's got the moves...power...and speed. I think the only thing that woud be a concern would be running him too much and maybe the absence of TRich, with added depth...i.e Bennett..who is a good runner in his own right...the chance of Herm running LJ into the ground are greatly reduced.

dj56dt58
08-03-2006, 09:11 AM
hahahha what a big giant moran

http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/n/U/moran.jpg

I'll bet he used the rushing ranks of the teams at the end of the season too, completely overlooking the fact that several off them were top 5 before LJ put a ton of yards on their asses.
It seems like there were two teams (SD was one of them), that had the #1 rushing defense in the nfl until LJ lit their asses up

ChiTown
08-03-2006, 09:14 AM
Exactly

So, in the case of your picture, does he punch a Donkey instead of a Horse?

htismaqe
08-03-2006, 09:31 AM
It seems like there were two teams (SD was one of them), that had the #1 rushing defense in the nfl until LJ lit their asses up

Bingo. Larry "the Humbler" Johnson.

ROYC75
08-03-2006, 09:32 AM
Most opponents will declare any player that burns them "not special". I would bet that if Larry was a donkey, he'd be the next Terrell Davis.


Nope, LJ isn't gay and carries a boner for Ray Ray ............. That's priority material to be a Donkey.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 11:16 AM
LJ has the potential to be special. It takes a whole season or two to realize that potential and LJ simply has not done that yet. He MIGHT get 2000, he MIGHT lead the league, he MIGHT perform in the playoffs but he has done none of these things to date.

Chiefs fans are understandably willing to look beyond this reality and you can't blame them for it.
Nor can you blame non-Chiefs fans who are more objective for taking a wait and see, especially if LJ does not have a couple of road graders plowing the lanes for him this year.

htismaqe
08-03-2006, 11:35 AM
LJ has the potential to be special. It takes a whole season or two to realize that potential and LJ simply has not done that yet. He MIGHT get 2000, he MIGHT lead the league, he MIGHT perform in the playoffs but he has done none of these things to date.

Chiefs fans are understandably willing to look beyond this reality and you can't blame them for it.
Nor can you blame non-Chiefs fans who are more objective for taking a wait and see, especially if LJ does not have a couple of road graders plowing the lanes for him this year.

You continue to cling to the things he hasn't done, as if they somehow overshadow what he HAS done.

No, he hasn't rushed for 2000 yards, nor has he lead the league in rushing. He finished THIRD last year, after starting only NINE GAMES. By the way, that 9-game stretch was the best EVER, in the entire HISTORY OF THE NFL.

Iowanian
08-03-2006, 11:36 AM
Seems to me that Carlos Mencia has a sound he makes for posters like that threadstarter...who does post here.

KCTitus
08-03-2006, 11:37 AM
Seems to me that Carlos Mencia has a sound he makes for posters like that threadstarter...who does post here.

Dunt-de-duh

vailpass
08-03-2006, 11:38 AM
You continue to cling to the things he hasn't done, as if they somehow overshadow what he HAS done.

No, he hasn't rushed for 2000 yards, nor has he lead the league in rushing. He finished THIRD last year, after starting only NINE GAMES. By the way, that 9-game stretch was the best EVER, in the entire HISTORY OF THE NFL.

Clinging? Me? For wanting to see a complete season or two before I annoint an NFL RB as special?
I thought you were more objective than this.

htismaqe
08-03-2006, 11:45 AM
Clinging? Me? For wanting to see a complete season or two before I annoint an NFL RB as special?
I thought you were more objective than this.

Look at what he did.

He needs to demonstrate longevity, both over a full season and over multiple seasons, before you can crown him. Absolutely.

But to say he's not special is just Donkey homerism.

Doing something NOBODY has ever done before in the NFL is the very definition of "special".

Bearcat
08-03-2006, 11:53 AM
Larry Johnson's numbers are skewed by games against poor rush defenses.

All of his excuses aside (except there's none for Week 12 vs. Denver: 30 carries for 140 yards 2 touchdowns ...interesting), what RB goes up against the top half in the league in rushing every week and ends up with his kinds of numbers? Of course about half of his yard are against the bottom half of the league (I know he said 20+, but there's only one team between 15-20).... it sounds pretty logical to me. Heck, that's actually an argument for LJ being really good, because if you play half your games vs the top half & half vs the bottom half, a decent-bad RB would have a considerably higher percentage than 48% vs the bad defenses.

Bearcat
08-03-2006, 12:00 PM
Bottom half...

Week 1 vs NY Jets: 9 carries 110 yards 2 touchdowns.
Defensive rank: 29th (137 yards per game.)
Week 2 vs. Raiders: 9 carries for 41 yards 1 touchdown.
Defensive rank: 25th (128 yards per game.)
Week 4 vs. Eagles: 7 carries for 34 yards and 1 fumble
Defensive rank: 21st (118 yards per game)
Week 6 vs. Miami: 23 carries for 93 yards 1 touchdown
Defensive rank: 17th (111 yards per game)
Week 8 vs. Raiders: 22 carries for 107 yards 2 touchdowns
Defensive rank: 25th (128 yards per game.)
Week 9 vs. Buffalo: 27 carries for 132 yards
Defensive rank: 31st (137 yards per game)
Week 10 vs. Texans: 36 carries for 211 yards 2 touchdowns
Defensive rank: 32nd (144 yards per game)
Week 16 vs. Bengals: 26 carries for 201 yards 3 touchdowns and 1 fumble
Defensive Rank: 20th (116 yards per game) Note: A throwaway game for the Bengals, with KC fighting for it's playoff lives.

929/159 = 5.8 ypc



Top Half
Week 3 vs. Broncos: 8 carries for 13 yards and 1 fumble
Defensive rank: 2nd (85 yards per game.) Note: Larry Johnson cost his team a touchdown when he fumbled inside the Chiefs 20 yard line. Denver scored on the next play.
Week 7 vs. Chargers: 6 carries for 55 yards
Defensive rank: 1st (84 yards per game) Note: 46 yards came on a single run
Week 5 vs. Redskins: 13 carries for 53 yards
Defensive rank: 13th (105 yards per game)
Week 11 vs. Patriots: 31 carries for 119 yards 1 touchdown and a fumble
Defensive rank: 8th (99 yards per game) Note: Only averaged 3.8 yards per carry.
Week 12 vs. Denver: 30 carries for 140 yards 2 touchdowns
Defensive rank: 2nd (85 yards per game.)
Week 13 vs. Dallas: 26 carries for 143 yards 3 touchdowns
Defensive rank: 15th (108 yards per game)
Week 14 vs. Giants: 31 carries for 167 yards 2 touchdowns
Defensive Rank: 12th (104 yards per game)
Week 15 vs. Chargers: 32 carries for 131 yards 1 touchdown and 1 fumble
Defensive rank: 1st (84 yards per game)

820/177 = 4.6 ypc


So, what's the problem?

sedated
08-03-2006, 12:00 PM
I don't agree with those dumbf*cks, but even Derrick Blaylock looked good running behind our offensive line.

It will be interesting this year, not only to see him for a whole season, but without the greatest O-Line in the NFL (assuming Roaf stays retired)

King_Chief_Fan
08-03-2006, 12:03 PM
Clinging? Me? For wanting to see a complete season or two before I annoint an NFL RB as special?
I thought you were more objective than this.
compare him to Dayne and tell us how special he isn't
Dayne is the answer to the donks rb woes isn't he?

vailpass
08-03-2006, 12:03 PM
Look at what he did.

He needs to demonstrate longevity, both over a full season and over multiple seasons, before you can crown him. Absolutely.

But to say he's not special is just Donkey homerism.

Doing something NOBODY has ever done before in the NFL is the very definition of "special".
Cool, that's your view. My view is that annointing someone as special who has never started a full season and had the benefit of running behind the KC line is homerism.
After this season this discussion will have been settled on the field, which is the fitting and ultimate way to settle any football debate.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 12:04 PM
compare him to Dayne and tell us how special he isn't
Dayne is the answer to the donks rb woes isn't he?

Do you know QueefsFanXXVII?

Iowanian
08-03-2006, 12:05 PM
But to say he's not special is just Donkey homerism.
".

I think you accidently spelled "WISHFUL THINKING", donkey homer i s m.

htismaqe
08-03-2006, 12:05 PM
Bottom half...

Week 1 vs NY Jets: 9 carries 110 yards 2 touchdowns.
Defensive rank: 29th (137 yards per game.)
Week 2 vs. Raiders: 9 carries for 41 yards 1 touchdown.
Defensive rank: 25th (128 yards per game.)
Week 4 vs. Eagles: 7 carries for 34 yards and 1 fumble
Defensive rank: 21st (118 yards per game)
Week 6 vs. Miami: 23 carries for 93 yards 1 touchdown
Defensive rank: 17th (111 yards per game)
Week 8 vs. Raiders: 22 carries for 107 yards 2 touchdowns
Defensive rank: 25th (128 yards per game.)
Week 9 vs. Buffalo: 27 carries for 132 yards
Defensive rank: 31st (137 yards per game)
Week 10 vs. Texans: 36 carries for 211 yards 2 touchdowns
Defensive rank: 32nd (144 yards per game)
Week 16 vs. Bengals: 26 carries for 201 yards 3 touchdowns and 1 fumble
Defensive Rank: 20th (116 yards per game) Note: A throwaway game for the Bengals, with KC fighting for it's playoff lives.

929/159 = 5.8 ypc



Top Half
Week 3 vs. Broncos: 8 carries for 13 yards and 1 fumble
Defensive rank: 2nd (85 yards per game.) Note: Larry Johnson cost his team a touchdown when he fumbled inside the Chiefs 20 yard line. Denver scored on the next play.
Week 7 vs. Chargers: 6 carries for 55 yards
Defensive rank: 1st (84 yards per game) Note: 46 yards came on a single run
Week 5 vs. Redskins: 13 carries for 53 yards
Defensive rank: 13th (105 yards per game)
Week 11 vs. Patriots: 31 carries for 119 yards 1 touchdown and a fumble
Defensive rank: 8th (99 yards per game) Note: Only averaged 3.8 yards per carry.
Week 12 vs. Denver: 30 carries for 140 yards 2 touchdowns
Defensive rank: 2nd (85 yards per game.)
Week 13 vs. Dallas: 26 carries for 143 yards 3 touchdowns
Defensive rank: 15th (108 yards per game)
Week 14 vs. Giants: 31 carries for 167 yards 2 touchdowns
Defensive Rank: 12th (104 yards per game)
Week 15 vs. Chargers: 32 carries for 131 yards 1 touchdown and 1 fumble
Defensive rank: 1st (84 yards per game)

820/177 = 4.6 ypc


So, what's the problem?

If I had the time, I'd go through all of those rankings and take LJ's total out of each team's numbers. It would be interesting to see how much he RAISED their yards per game average.

Coach
08-03-2006, 12:06 PM
Well, they'll be mighty suprised come week 2.

King_Chief_Fan
08-03-2006, 12:06 PM
Cool, After this season this discussion will have been settled on the field, which is the fitting and ultimate way to settle any football debate.

He did that against the donks.........won't be a problem for him to do it again

King_Chief_Fan
08-03-2006, 12:07 PM
Do you know QueefsFanXXVII?

Never heard of him.

I have heard of you though Vail Puss.

Still can't understand your need to be here. Your not validating anything but your stupidity

MichaelH
08-03-2006, 12:07 PM
All this doubt is making Larry Johnson even angrier. :cuss::)

vailpass
08-03-2006, 12:08 PM
He did that against the donks.........won't be a problem for him to do it again

He played an entire season in one game last year? You got me, that is special along the lines of Chuck Norris proportions.

StcChief
08-03-2006, 12:09 PM
He did that against the donks.........won't be a problem for him to do it again

LJ run over Chump Bailey and hurt him good.

Turn him into the same pussy Deion Sanders became as D back.
Afraid to tackle become a 'Push out of bounds' player.

King_Chief_Fan
08-03-2006, 12:10 PM
He played an entire season in one game last year? You got me, that is special along the lines of Chuck Norris proportions.

What that means is he will settle it on the field. That is not a problem for him.

Bearcat
08-03-2006, 12:10 PM
Oh.. should probably point out that it's 8 games each (wow, sounds logical, too), and it's 53% of his total yards against the bottom half. I think that's a great split.... obviously I don't know what the split is for good or bad backs, but it looks good to me.

jspchief
08-03-2006, 12:40 PM
What the hell is this "hasn't played a full season" bullshit?

He played in all 16 games last year and was 7th in the league in rushing attempts.

What the f*ck difference does it make if he was the starter or not, he was given a starter's load clearly proved he can handle it.

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 12:57 PM
What the hell is this "hasn't played a full season" bullshit?

He played in all 16 games last year and was 7th in the league in rushing attempts.

What the f*ck difference does it make if he was the starter or not, he was given a starter's load clearly proved he can handle it.

If Roaf doesn't play...it's going to be harder.

jspchief
08-03-2006, 01:00 PM
If Roaf doesn't play...it's going to be harder.It probably will. He still has a stellar middle of the line though. And he was pretty successful without Roaf late last year. Is Shaun Alexander going to suddenly suck now that Hutchinson is gone? Of course not.

And that doesn't have anything to do with the "he hasn't proven himself for a full season" comment.

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 01:11 PM
It probably will. He still has a stellar middle of the line though. And he was pretty successful without Roaf late last year. Is Shaun Alexander going to suddenly suck now that Hutchinson is gone? Of course not.

And that doesn't have anything to do with the "he hasn't proven himself for a full season" comment.

He was steller without Roaf...so was Priest...but at what cost...I believe it was a few wins and the production of Gonzo who had to stay in and block.

Seattle...will he suck...no...does it hurt...absolutely...Jones and Hutch were probably the best left side in the whole NFL last year...and that's saying something.

Count Alex's Losses
08-03-2006, 01:14 PM
He was steller without Roaf...so was Priest...

Priest sucked without Roaf.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 01:14 PM
What the hell is this "hasn't played a full season" bullshit?

He played in all 16 games last year and was 7th in the league in rushing attempts.

What the f*ck difference does it make if he was the starter or not, he was given a starter's load clearly proved he can handle it.

No one said he hadn't played a full season. I said he was not the starter for a full season, and he wasn't. Ever.
This will be the first year LJ is the full-time starter, has opposing Ds scheming for him from day one, and will have to carry the load for a full 16 games.

If you think starting for the second half of a season makes him HOF material have at it. The proof will come after he completes his first full season as a starter.

Fire Me Boy!
08-03-2006, 01:17 PM
Brought to you by the Department of Redundancy Department.
Thank you Robin Williams.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 01:19 PM
Thank you Robin Williams.

Monty Python.

Fire Me Boy!
08-03-2006, 01:21 PM
It's also in Robin Williams, Live at the Met from the early 1980s, IIRC. I've never heard it from Monty Python -- I can't friggin' stand them, so I don't ever watch them.

jspchief
08-03-2006, 01:32 PM
No one said he hadn't played a full season. I said he was not the starter for a full season, and he wasn't. Ever.
This will be the first year LJ is the full-time starter, has opposing Ds scheming for him from day one, and will have to carry the load for a full 16 games.

If you think starting for the second half of a season makes him HOF material have at it. The proof will come after he completes his first full season as a starter.7th most carries in the league is a full load, regardless of how the carries were distributed.

You might have a point if he was breaking down late in the year, but he averaged 30 carries per game over the last 5 weeks, at about 140 yards per game.

As for scheming against him, what exactly are teams going to do this year that they weren't doing the last 9 weeks of last year? Or the last 5 weeks of 2004? San Diego (#1 in run defense in 2005) had 11 games worth of film with Larry as a starter, and another 10 plus games of him in spot duty. he still ran for 130 yards against them.

What exactly is the magic number of games started when a team figures a running back out? He's carried the ball 476 times in the NFL, yet you want to tell me that teams still don't have enough film to scheme against him? The entire premise is completely f*cking ridiculous. Teams were scheming against him ever since he started shredding assholes late in '04.

As for HoF, I never said that, and very few others have either...yet. He's a lot of seasons away from that kind of talk. The subject was "is he special" and I'd say he looks like one of the best RBs in the game at this point, and is certainly on a path to be very special.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 01:39 PM
The subject was "is he special" and I'd say he looks like one of the best RBs in the game at this point, and is certainly on a path to be very special.

My point exactly.

htismaqe
08-03-2006, 02:30 PM
No one said he hadn't played a full season. I said he was not the starter for a full season, and he wasn't. Ever.
This will be the first year LJ is the full-time starter, has opposing Ds scheming for him from day one, and will have to carry the load for a full 16 games.

If you think starting for the second half of a season makes him HOF material have at it. The proof will come after he completes his first full season as a starter.

ROFL

Nobody schemed for him last year. NFL defenses take entire seasons, plus the offseason to adjust. I'll remember that one.

And nobody suggested he was HoF material. Keep making shit up. The donkey shit is waist high now.

Count Alex's Losses
08-03-2006, 02:36 PM
Our offense should take a step back this year. Opposing defensive coordinators now have FIVE seasons of tape, not FOUR!!! FIVE is the magic number! We're doooooooomed!

vailpass
08-03-2006, 02:43 PM
ROFL

Nobody schemed for him last year. NFL defenses take entire seasons, plus the offseason to adjust. I'll remember that one.

And nobody suggested he was HoF material. Keep making shit up. The donkey shit is waist high now.

Live in whatever world you want, I understand why you would choose to be selectviely blind on this one. If LJ isn't the second coming of OJ KCs season is over before it starts.

It's so clear that even an asslicking duct-taped-to-the-goalpost zero like Draven can understand: there is a vast difference between starting half a season and carrying the load for the full 16 in the NFL. I'm not saying LJ can't do it, I'm saying he never has. I'll wait and see. Is that so wrong?

Special does not equal HOF? Wouldn't a better word be "good" or "nice"?

htismaqe
08-03-2006, 03:45 PM
Live in whatever world you want, I understand why you would choose to be selectviely blind on this one. If LJ isn't the second coming of OJ KCs season is over before it starts.

It's so clear that even an asslicking duct-taped-to-the-goalpost zero like Draven can understand: there is a vast difference between starting half a season and carrying the load for the full 16 in the NFL. I'm not saying LJ can't do it, I'm saying he never has. I'll wait and see. Is that so wrong?

Special does not equal HOF? Wouldn't a better word be "good" or "nice"?

Courtesy of www.websters.com:

spe·cial ( P ) Pronunciation Key (spshl)
adj.
Surpassing what is common or usual; exceptional: a special occasion; a special treat.

Distinct among others of a kind: a special type of paint; a special medication for arthritis.
Primary: His special satisfaction comes from volunteer work.
Peculiar to a specific person or thing; particular: my own special chair; the special features of a computer.

Having a limited or specific function, application, or scope: a special role in the mission.
Arranged for a particular occasion or purpose: a special visit from her daughter.
Regarded with particular affection and admiration: a special friend.
Additional; extra: a special holiday flight.


There's no blindness here. Only a stupid donk fan that refuses to acknowledge the definition of the word "special".

OnTheWarpath58
08-03-2006, 03:55 PM
there is a vast difference between starting half a season and carrying the load for the full 16 in the NFL. I'm not saying LJ can't do it, I'm saying he never has. I'll wait and see. Is that so wrong?

No. It's retarded.

LJ finshed 7th in attempts last year. Only 34 behind Alexander.

I'm pretty sure by any definition you choose, he carried the load last year......

vailpass
08-03-2006, 04:19 PM
No. It's retarded.

LJ finshed 7th in attempts last year. Only 34 behind Alexander.

I'm pretty sure by any definition you choose, he carried the load last year......

WTF do you know about football, you have Notre Dame crap in your sig. ROFL

If you don't acknowledge the difference between a 9 game season and a 16 game season in the NFL there is nothing I can do.
There is more to it than # of attempts.
I'll say it again: we will know whether LJ can carry a full load at the end of this season.

StcChief
08-03-2006, 04:21 PM
If you don't understand the difference between a 9 game season and a 16 game season in the NFL there is nothing I can do to help you.
There is more to it than # of attempts.
I'll say it again: we will know whether LJ can carry a full load at the end of this season.

Let the games begin... Not soon enough to stop this banter.

jspchief
08-03-2006, 04:21 PM
There is more to it than # of attempts.
Elaborate?

morphius
08-03-2006, 04:24 PM
Elaborate?
You have to do it for years to impress a donkey fan, while one run against the 32nd rate D was able to earn one RB "Berry Sanders" label...

Lzen
08-03-2006, 04:25 PM
You have to do it for years to impress a donkey fan, while one run against the 32nd rate D was able to earn one RB "Berry Sanders" label...

Ha ha ha.....perfect. :thumb:

buddha
08-03-2006, 04:29 PM
I think it's humorous that a few Donk dumbasses question how good LJ is, but who really cares what they think? The ones who think he is a system back...fine, if that system back gets 2K yards this season, who will complain? Donk fans are so predictable.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 04:34 PM
Elaborate?

*Preparing and playing for 17 weeks straight with only the bye week vs. being able to sit and rest for the first seven weeks.

*Facing more defenses, plus facing defenses that have already seen you once that year vs. facing fewer Ds and none or very few that have seen you already that year.

*16 chances to sustain injury during the course of a game instead of 9.

*16 chances to catch cock-rotting Ron Mexico disease in a post-game threesome instead of 9.

I'm not saying LJ can't do it, I'm saying he hasn't done it yet. As a football fan I can't wait to watch it unfold this season.

keg in kc
08-03-2006, 04:35 PM
He's no maurice clarett, that's for sure.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 04:35 PM
You have to do it for years to impress a donkey fan, while one run against the 32nd rate D was able to earn one RB "Berry Sanders" label...

Not so. 3 or 4 excellent years that contain a 2000 yard season, 2 SB rings, and a SB MVP trophy are all it takes to impress me. ROFL

Mecca
08-03-2006, 04:37 PM
In LJ's 9 starts he faced teams run defenses ranked 29th,31st,32nd, 8th,2nd, 15th, 12th,9th,20th. So 4 bad run defenses and 5 top 15 run defenses.

That's not bad......you play who you play obviously you aren't going to face a great defense every single week.

Count Alex's Losses
08-03-2006, 04:37 PM
*being able to sit and rest for the first seven weeks.

...was not what Larry Johnson did last year. He touched the ball in EVERY game.

cdcox
08-03-2006, 04:40 PM
WTF do you know about football, you have Notre Dame crap in your sig. ROFL

If you don't acknowledge the difference between a 9 game season and a 16 game season in the NFL there is nothing I can do.
There is more to it than # of attempts.
I'll say it again: we will know whether LJ can carry a full load at the end of this season.

You act like he played a 9 game college season. In one of the games he "didn't play" he had 23 carries. In another he had 13. Another week he gained 100 yards. So we are up to 12 games where he carried as much of a load as any back in the league. In the remaining 4 weeks his load was less with 30 carries scattered over those weeks. Still in those 4 weeks he's practicing , he played, he took a fair number of hits. If you want to take solace from those 4 games that some how Larry Johnson is going to fall apart in December, then good luck with that. Its not like he was wearing down toward the end of the year. He had 201 yards and averaged 7.7 yds/carry in his last game. LJ was just getting warmed up. But you go ahead and wait and see.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 04:43 PM
...was not what Larry Johnson did last year. He touched the ball in EVERY game.

Obviously. I didn't think I needed to spell out the difference between carrying the load and giving the lead horse a breather but if you need me to help you out Draven all you have to do is ask.

Picture it as the difference between the nights Nick Athan trains your ass bloody and the nights he lets you off with just having to tickle his pickle.

One is downright exhausting while the other is merely a stretch.

OnTheWarpath58
08-03-2006, 04:45 PM
*Preparing and playing for 17 weeks straight with only the bye week vs. being able to sit and rest for the first seven weeks.

Yep....he rested for 110 yards against the Jets in the opener....

*Facing more defenses, plus facing defenses that have already seen you once that year vs. facing fewer Ds and none or very few that have seen you already that year.

Seeing him that second time at Arrowhead really helped your defense. Al Wilson quit trash talking because he was sucking wind. Nice job giving up 90 in the 4th.......

*16 chances to sustain injury during the course of a game instead of 9.

Ummmm......He played all 16 games last year.

If I were you, I'd be much more worried about your RB situation than ours........

vailpass
08-03-2006, 04:46 PM
You act like he played a 9 game college season. In one of the games he "didn't play" he had 23 carries. In another he had 13. Another week he gained 100 yards. So we are up to 12 games where he carried as much of a load as any back in the league. In the remaining 4 weeks his load was less with 30 carries scattered over those weeks. Still in those 4 weeks he's practicing , he played, he took a fair number of hits. If you want to take solace from those 4 games that some how Larry Johnson is going to fall apart in December, then good luck with that. Its not like he was wearing down toward the end of the year. He had 201 yards and averaged 7.7 yds/carry in his last game. LJ was just getting warmed up. But you go ahead and wait and see.

Funny how you get all butt hurt when I say I am going to wait and see how he carries the load for a whole season. It's like you need and want him to be the second coming so bad that you abandon all objectivity.

We'll see how the season unfolds, rest assured I'll drop in and discuss it either way.

Mecca
08-03-2006, 04:47 PM
Yep....he rested for 110 yards against the Jets in the opener....



Seeing him that second time at Arrowhead really helped your defense. Al Wilson quit trash talking because he was sucking wind. Nice job giving up 90 in the 4th.......



Ummmm......He played all 16 games last year.

If I were you, I'd be much more worried about your RB situation than ours........

The Broncos fan probably think Ron Dayne is better, hell they thought Tatum Bell was going into last year.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 04:48 PM
Yep....he rested for 110 yards against the Jets in the opener....



Seeing him that second time at Arrowhead really helped your defense. Al Wilson quit trash talking because he was sucking wind. Nice job giving up 90 in the 4th.......



Ummmm......He played all 16 games last year.

If I were you, I'd be much more worried about your RB situation than ours........

Go review the Bronco stats on number of wins and running game rank since Shanny took over, then tell me again how worried I need to be.

Of anyone on the Bronco D to try and talk smack on Al Wilson is your very last resort. Al is worth any 3 players on the KC D.

Chiefs Pantalones
08-03-2006, 04:49 PM
Most bronco fans are idiots.

The rest of the league gives us props that we have a great RB, QB, and overall offense, while they sit back and say, "they aren't good."

the Talking Can
08-03-2006, 04:49 PM
Funny how you get all butt hurt when I say I am going to wait and see how he carries the load for a whole season. It's like you need and want him to be the second coming so bad that you abandon all objectivity.

We'll see how the season unfolds, rest assured I'll drop in and discuss it either way.

translation: the facts have proven me wrong

cdcox
08-03-2006, 04:50 PM
Funny how you get all butt hurt when I say I am going to wait and see how he carries the load for a whole season. It's like you need and want him to be the second coming so bad that you abandon all objectivity.

We'll see how the season unfolds, rest assured I'll drop in and discuss it either way.

Objectivity: "9 game season"

JBucc
08-03-2006, 04:50 PM
Go review the Bronco stats on number of wins and running game rank since Shanny took over, then tell me again how worried I need to be.

Of anyone on the Bronco D to try and talk smack on Al Wilson is your very last resort. Al is worth any 3 players on the KC D.And your the guy questioning other's objectivityROFL

vailpass
08-03-2006, 04:51 PM
translation: the facts have proven me wrong

Crawl back to DC Can and take your lame-ass closing lines with you.

jspchief
08-03-2006, 04:51 PM
*Preparing and playing for 17 weeks straight with only the bye week vs. being able to sit and rest for the first seven weeks.

*Facing more defenses, plus facing defenses that have already seen you once that year vs. facing fewer Ds and none or very few that have seen you already that year.

*16 chances to sustain injury during the course of a game instead of 9.

*16 chances to catch cock-rotting Ron Mexico disease in a post-game threesome instead of 9.

I'm not saying LJ can't do it, I'm saying he hasn't done it yet. As a football fan I can't wait to watch it unfold this season.
1. Done it. He played all 16 games.
2. He faced every defense the Chiefs faced in 2005
3. Again, played in all games. But more importantly, I'd say the injury risk comes largely on the plays where he actually touches the ball. Sure there's always the risk of a freak injury or getting injured whiffing on his blocks, but the bulk of the risk comes through carrying the football. To suggest that he dodged a significant amount of risk not carrying the ball as compared to the risk he dodged when carrying the ball is silly.


You act like he sat at home and played playstation through week 8, then in week 9 showed up to start playing football. He played in every game. He ran with the first team in practice every week. He studied film every week.

The reality is, Larry Johnson has already cleared the most significant hurdles of NFL football. He knows what it's like to be the focal point of defenses. He knows what it's like to absorb a season's worth of tackles. He's faced teams that have watched a year and a half worth of film on him.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 04:53 PM
*Preparing and playing for 17 weeks straight with only the bye week vs. being able to sit and rest for the first seven weeks.

*Facing more defenses, plus facing defenses that have already seen you once that year vs. facing fewer Ds and none or very few that have seen you already that year.

*16 chances to sustain injury during the course of a game instead of 9.

*16 chances to catch cock-rotting Ron Mexico disease in a post-game threesome instead of 9.

I'm not saying LJ can't do it, I'm saying he hasn't done it yet. As a football fan I can't wait to watch it unfold this season.

I layed out 3 subjective reasons (and a bonus 4th) why I am waiting to see LJs first full year as a starter. Instead of hurling butt-sore insults does anyone care to address them objectively?

Count Alex's Losses
08-03-2006, 04:53 PM
Mike Anderson is the real deal. He started 15 games!

MOhillbilly
08-03-2006, 04:54 PM
LJ is a momo.
KC would be better off without him.

the Talking Can
08-03-2006, 04:55 PM
Crawl back to DC Can and take your lame-ass closing lines with you.

translation: case closed

OnTheWarpath58
08-03-2006, 04:56 PM
Go review the Bronco stats on number of wins and running game rank since Shanny took over, then tell me again how worried I need to be.

I don't see TD or Mike Anderson on the roster. So unless you mean the Rat is gonna get out there and strap it up, I don't think his history is relevant.

Tell you what. We'll go ahead and worry about LJ getting 1750 again.

You worry about your TWO backs breaking 1200.

Of anyone on the Bronco D to try and talk smack on Al Wilson is your very last resort. Al is worth any 3 players on the KC D.

Apparently not on December 4th, 2005. Straight from USA Today and LJ himself.....

Fueled by Denver Broncos slights, Johnson ran for 140 yards and two touchdowns in a 31-27 win Dec. 4.

"(Linebacker) Al Wilson of the Broncos is the biggest trash talker who gets them going," Johnson says. "But in the fourth quarter, those guys weren't talking anymore. They were breathing heavy. And I was still trash talking."

Mecca
08-03-2006, 04:57 PM
What about the Broncos RB's huh? Ron Dayne has never been a starter and has proven to be a bust. Tatum Bell has never been a starter either and he looks frail......

vailpass
08-03-2006, 04:58 PM
1. Done it. He played all 16 games. Huge difference and you know it.

2. He faced every defense the Chiefs faced in 2005 For much less time. 9 of those Ds schemed for Priest as the starter.

3. Again, played in all games. But more importantly, I'd say the injury risk comes largely on the plays where he actually touches the ball. Sure there's always the risk of a freak injury or getting injured whiffing on his blocks, but the bulk of the risk comes through carrying the football. To suggest that he dodged a significant amount of risk not carrying the ball as compared to the risk he dodged when carrying the ball is silly. So even though he did not start and played much less than Priest through those 9 games he was just as much at risk for an injury? Did you fall off one of your roofs today?

You act like he sat at home and played playstation through week 8, then in week 9 showed up to start playing football. He played in every game. He ran with the first team in practice every week. He studied film every week.

The reality is, Larry Johnson has already cleared the most significant hurdles of NFL football. He knows what it's like to be the focal point of defenses. He knows what it's like to absorb a season's worth of tackles. He's faced teams that have watched a year and a half worth of film on him. I can see there is zero chance for an objective response on this, it is just too scary for a KC fan to think that LJ might be partially a product of his line and an abbreviated season. I'll say it again: the season will tell.

jspchief
08-03-2006, 05:02 PM
So even though he did not start and played much less than Priest through those 9 games he was just as much at risk for an injury? Did you fall off one of your roofs today?
So he faced more risk than any other RB in the league for the last 9 games of the season.

Seriously, you're acting like the majority of risk lies being a blocker in passing plays. It doesn't. The real risk lies in running the ball, and getting tackled while doing it. And he faced that risk more than all but 6 RBs in the league last year.

Terrell Davis hasn't proven that he can carry the load for a long career. He sucks.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:02 PM
I don't see TD or Mike Anderson on the roster. So unless you mean the Rat is gonna get out there and strap it up, I don't think his history is relevant.

Tell you what. We'll go ahead and worry about LJ getting 1750 again.

You worry about your TWO backs breaking 1200. Isn't that cute? The little engine who couldn't is talking smack to the best runing program in the NFL over the past 10 years.


Apparently not on December 4th, 2005. Straight from USA Today and LJ himself.....

Fueled by Denver Broncos slights, Johnson ran for 140 yards and two touchdowns in a 31-27 win Dec. 4.

"(Linebacker) Al Wilson of the Broncos is the biggest trash talker who gets them going," Johnson says. "But in the fourth quarter, those guys weren't talking anymore. They were breathing heavy. And I was still trash talking."
What does that prove? That LJ runs his mouth? I think that has been proven time and again. We'll see what he has to say after KC's annual thrashing at Mile High.

OnTheWarpath58
08-03-2006, 05:03 PM
to think that LJ might be partially a product of his line

NO SHIT!?!

What RB isn't helped by their OL? That is, after all, their job.

I guess TD was just a product of his OL, too......

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:04 PM
So he faced more risk than any other RB in the league for the last 9 games of the season.

Seriously, you're acting like the majority of risk lies being a blocker in passing plays. It doesn't. The real risk lies in running the ball, and getting tackled while doing it. And he faced that risk more than all but 6 RBs in the league last year.

Terrell Davis hasn't proven that he can carry the load for a long career. He sucks.

If you can leave out the 4-5 years as a starter, the 2000 yard season, the 2 SB rings and the SB MVP trophy your analogy would be spot-on.

HemiEd
08-03-2006, 05:04 PM
vailpass your shit is getting real weak lately.

cdcox
08-03-2006, 05:04 PM
jsp addressed your point very well already, but I'll elaborate on the first one.

*Preparing and playing for 17 weeks straight with only the bye week vs. being able to sit and rest for the first seven weeks.

"preparing and playing for 17 weeks" -LJ did that.
"sit and rest for the first 7 weeks" - During the resting period, LJ had three seperate games where he carried as much load as any starter in the league: 23 carry game, a 13 carry game, and a 100 yard game. Alexander and Thominson both had 14 carry games last year. Were they resting too?

jspchief
08-03-2006, 05:05 PM
If you can leave out the 4-5 years as a starter, the 2000 yard season, the 2 SB rings and the SB MVP trophy your analogy would be spot-on.Davis only played 4 or 5 years. We'll never know if he's any good because he didn't have to carry the load for 10 years, and he never had to face teams that had had 6 years to gameplan for him.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:06 PM
NO SHIT!?!

What RB isn't helped by their OL? That is, after all, their job.

I guess TD was just a product of his OL, too......

You are right, I wasn't clear. What I meant was that part of the reason I'm taking a wait-and-see on LJ is that the O-line he will run behind this year could be missing two of the studs that were on it last year (if Roaf retires which seems far from a sure thing at this point).

Again, all I'm sahying is that as a non-Chief, football fan I can see some possible pitfalls to watch for LJ this year. He may very well overcome them and put 2000 in the record book.
I can't wait.

OnTheWarpath58
08-03-2006, 05:09 PM
Isn't that cute? The little engine who couldn't is talking smack to the best runing program in the NFL over the past 10 years.


Wow....and you claim we're homers?

I would make sure to look for your objectivity now, while your head is firmly planted up your ass......

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:10 PM
vailpass your shit is getting real weak lately.

Really? Then why are there multiple posters coming out to refute my statements? Because they hold no water?

What is so "weak" about saying I'm taking a wait-and-see on LJ becasue he is running behind a different line this year and will be the starter from day one for the first time?

Answer: For the objective football fan there is nothing wrong with this approach. For a fan who has their entire hope of seeing a SB within the next decade it is a subject not to be discussed.

cdcox
08-03-2006, 05:10 PM
You are right, I wasn't clear. What I meant was that part of the reason I'm taking a wait-and-see on LJ is that the O-line he will run behind this year could be missing two of the studs that were on it last year (if Roaf retires which seems far from a sure thing at this point).

Again, all I'm sahying is that as a non-Chief, football fan I can see some possible pitfalls to watch for LJ this year. He may very well overcome them and put 2000 in the record book.
I can't wait.

Multiple choice.

Most NFL fans are taking:

a) a wait and see attitude
b) LJ as #1 overall in their fantasy draft

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:10 PM
Wow....and you claim we're homers?

I would make sure to look for your objectivity now, while your head is firmly planted up your ass......

Not a homer statement, a fact based on rushing yards over the last 10 years. Denver is 1st. Look it up.

jspchief
08-03-2006, 05:11 PM
Multiple choice.

Most NFL fans are taking:

a) a wait and see attitude
b) LJ as #1 overall in their fantasy draftThat's just dumb. the rest of the world doesn't know what Vailpass knows.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:12 PM
Multiple choice.

Most NFL fans are taking:

a) a wait and see attitude
b) LJ as #1 overall in their fantasy draft

You have the statistics of every NFL fan and can show us what most are doing? Cool, lets see 'em.

LJ as #1 overall in FF took a big drop the minute Roaf announced his retirement.

JBucc
08-03-2006, 05:12 PM
That's just dumb. the rest of the world doesn't know what Vailpass knows.I wish him and Skip Bayless would let us in on their infinite wisdom

OnTheWarpath58
08-03-2006, 05:13 PM
Multiple choice.

Most NFL fans are taking:

a) a wait and see attitude
b) LJ as #1 overall in their fantasy draft

Yeah....

I've been seeing a lot of Dayne and Bell on all the magazine covers this summer.......

People are really hyped about those two.....

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:14 PM
That's just dumb. the rest of the world doesn't know what Vailpass knows.

Here is what I'm saiying I know:
*LJ has never been the starter from day one. He will be this year
*LJ will be running behind a line that is minus one or two significant players from last year.

Are either of these statements invalid?

Based on that, I am taking a wait-and-see approach on LJ based on his performance this season.

If you can remove your emotion from the equation what the hell is so crazy about this?

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:14 PM
I wish him and Skip Bayless would let us in on their infinite wisdom

That was just plain mean.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:15 PM
Yeah....

I've been seeing a lot of Dayne and Bell on all the magazine covers this summer.......

People are really hyped about those two.....
Is that the criteria? I saw an awful lot of Bosworth and Leaf on pre-season magazine covers too.

HemiEd
08-03-2006, 05:16 PM
Really? Then why are there multiple posters coming out to refute my statements? Because they hold no water?

What is so "weak" about saying I'm taking a wait-and-see on LJ becasue he is running behind a different line this year and will be the starter from day one for the first time?

Answer: For the objective football fan there is nothing wrong with this approach. For a fan who has their entire hope of seeing a SB within the next decade it is a subject not to be discussed.


Your assertion that LJ must start instead of just play all 16 games with the numbers he had is weak. Jsp made a very factual post about the load LJ had for all 16 games last year, 7th. He ended up 3rd in rushing yards.
He did something for a stretch of 9 games that has never been done before in the history of the NFL. He did it against elite run defenses, like Denver. Your statement that he is not "Special" is weak.

JBucc
08-03-2006, 05:17 PM
That was just plain mean.Hey I'm just sayin he thinks LJ is overrated.

SPchief
08-03-2006, 05:17 PM
I am usually impressed with what Vailpass brings to the table, but he is looking alot like Taco right now with all the spinning he is doing

OnTheWarpath58
08-03-2006, 05:18 PM
Not a homer statement, a fact based on rushing yards over the last 10 years. Denver is 1st. Look it up.

There is more to it than # of attempts.

Does that mean that there is more to it than # of yards, also?

Or is living in the past convenient for your argument?

OnTheWarpath58
08-03-2006, 05:20 PM
Is that the criteria? I saw an awful lot of Bosworth and Leaf on pre-season magazine covers too.

I bet you did, as rookies....

Your boys have 9 combined seasons under thier belts with little to show for it......

the Talking Can
08-03-2006, 05:22 PM
can we rename this thread "Beat Down"?

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:23 PM
Your assertion that LJ must start instead of just play all 16 games with the numbers he had is weak. Jsp made a very factual post about the load LJ had for all 16 games last year, 7th. He ended up 3rd in rushing yards.
He did something for a stretch of 9 games that has never been done before in the history of the NFL. He did it against elite run defenses, like Denver. Your statement that he is not "Special" is weak.

I'm not asserting you should believe he needs to start a whole season, I was merely stating that is my personal criteria. Not just for LJ, for any NFL player. The season is a test of time in my book.

LJ had an incredible 9 game run, absolutely. No question. Now let's see if he can sustain that pace for 16 games as a starter.

As for "special", it's clear that different people here have different perceptions of that word. To me OJ, Barry, Walter, JB, were special. If I'm not ready to put LJ in that class I don't feel that makes my "shit weak".

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:23 PM
can we rename this thread "Beat Down"?
Can we rename you"Beat Off"?

jspchief
08-03-2006, 05:23 PM
Here is what I'm saiying I know:
*LJ has never been the starter from day one. He will be this year
*LJ will be running behind a line that is minus one or two significant players from last year.

Are either of these statements invalid?

Based on that, I am taking a wait-and-see approach on LJ based on his performance this season.

If you can remove your emotion from the equation what the hell is so crazy about this?

Both are fact. No one is disputing that.

What is in dispute is the significance, especially of the first statement. I think the first statement has absolutely zero signifigance. None.

As for the loss of linemen, I think there will likely be some drop-off, at least in early games. But I also know that LJ averaged 150 per game starting without Roaf last year. I also know that when we lost Tait, everyone said our running game would suffer and it didn't. So what may be in dispute here is the amount of drop-off we'll actually experience.

The line does matter for LJ. He's not Barry Sanders in that regard. But we still have two pro bowl guards and a center that gets honorable mention for the pro bowl every year. We may have to shuffle the playbook around a little, but it's not like we don't have options, and it's not like LJ hasn't faced adversity on the line before.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:27 PM
Both are fact. No one is disputing that.

What is in dispute is the significance, especially of the first statement. I think the first statement has absolutely zero signifigance. None.

As for the loss of linemen, I think there will likely be some drop-off, at least in early games. But I also know that LJ averaged 150 per game starting without Roaf last year. I also know that when we lost Tait, everyone said our running game would suffer and it didn't. So what may be in dispute here is the amount of drop-off we'll actually experience.

The line does matter for LJ. He's not Barry Sanders in that regard. But we still have two pro bowl guards and a center that gets honorable mention for the pro bowl every year. We may have to shuffle the playbook around a little, but it's not like we don't have options, and it's not like LJ hasn't faced adversity on the line before.

Your facts are sound. I see your point and have from the start. In my opinion a player needs to go through an entire season as a starter in order to fully evaluate them. If this wasn't LJ we were discussing nobody would have a problem with this.
Look at it this way: if LJ had started 9 games last year and struggled I would STILL be saying he needs a full year as the starter before you can fully evaluate him.

jspchief
08-03-2006, 05:30 PM
LJ had an incredible 9 game run, absolutely. No question. Now let's see if he can sustain that pace for 16 games as a starter.
He doesn't have to sustain that pace. If he performs at 75% of that pace, he'll run away with the rushing title.

If he does sustain that pace, it will be the greatest RB season in NFL history. But we won't make him carry the ball that many times.

That's kind of the point. If he sees a 25% drop-off in 2006 (from his '05 performance as a starter), he'll still rush for 1800 yards. That's pretty special.

penguinz
08-03-2006, 05:30 PM
I hate to say this but I agree with valipass. Hell...Even LJ has said what he did last year means nothing if he can't prove he can do it over a full season as the man.

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 05:30 PM
Terrell Davis hasn't proven that he can carry the load for a long career. He sucks.


Exactly,

He, his two Super Bowl Rings, and his League and Super Bowl MVP's are going to have to deal with that fact.

jspchief
08-03-2006, 05:32 PM
Exactly,

He, his two Super Bowl Rings, and his League and Super Bowl MVP's are going to have to deal with that fact.Common sense and facts don't belong in Vailpass' method for evaluating RBs. It's all about abstract benchmarks. Pay attention.

OnTheWarpath58
08-03-2006, 05:32 PM
Dayne and Bell have never been full season starters for Denver, but that's OK because Denver was the top running team for the past 10 years? They only had one start COMBINED last season.

Guess we should thow their stats out the window.....

But in LJ's case, not starting a full season is relevant.......only from a Donks fan.

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 05:34 PM
Common sense and facts don't belong in Vailpass' method for evaluating RBs. It's all about abstract benchmarks. Pay attention.

I forgot to mention his 2000 yard season and his 8 100 yard consecutive games in the playoffs......with all the career marks for TD...It's tough for me to name them all.

Fish
08-03-2006, 05:34 PM
I'm not asserting you should believe he needs to start a whole season, I was merely stating that is my personal criteria. Not just for LJ, for any NFL player. The season is a test of time in my book.

LJ had an incredible 9 game run, absolutely. No question. Now let's see if he can sustain that pace for 16 games as a starter.

As for "special", it's clear that different people here have different perceptions of that word. To me OJ, Barry, Walter, JB, were special. If I'm not ready to put LJ in that class I don't feel that makes my "shit weak".

Your diversion skills are top notch.... have you considered politics?

Big Dick Jones
08-03-2006, 05:35 PM
Really? Then why are there multiple posters coming out to refute my statements? Because they hold no water?

What is so "weak" about saying I'm taking a wait-and-see on LJ becasue he is running behind a different line this year and will be the starter from day one for the first time?

Answer: For the objective football fan there is nothing wrong with this approach. For a fan who has their entire hope of seeing a SB within the next decade it is a subject not to be discussed.
Did a squirrel eat your brains?

Al Bundy
08-03-2006, 05:36 PM
Screw that Donk's fan... He doesnt know his ass from a hole in the ground.

jspchief
08-03-2006, 05:37 PM
I forgot to mention his 2000 yard season and his 8 100 yard consecutive games in the playoffs......with all the career marks for TD...It's tough for me to name them all.Stats don't tell us anything.

It's all about whether the defense had enough chance to scheme for him, and if he carried the load for long enough. Of course, we don't actually have the magic numbers that constitute when enough is enough, so I'm going to declare "starter for 6 years" as the appropriate benchmark.

Terrell Davis falls short, and as such is vastly over-rated.

OnTheWarpath58
08-03-2006, 05:38 PM
Stats don't tell us anything.

It's all about whether the defense had enough chance to scheme for him, and if he carried the load for long enough. Of course, we don't actually have the magic numbers that constitute when enough is enough, so I'm going to declare "starter for 6 years" as the appropriate benchmark.

Terrell Davis falls short, and as such is vastly over-rated.

And don't forget Jsp.......

He's a product of his offensive line.....

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 05:42 PM
Stats don't tell us anything.

It's all about whether the defense had enough chance to scheme for him, and if he carried the load for long enough. Of course, we don't actually have the magic numbers that constitute when enough is enough, so I'm going to declare "starter for 6 years" as the appropriate benchmark.

Terrell Davis falls short, and as such is vastly over-rated.

He was especially overrated when he ran over the Chiefs in the playoffs at Arrowhead...I couldn't believe how much faux credit he got. It was ridiculous.

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 05:46 PM
And don't forget Jsp.......

He's a product of his offensive line.....

Absolutely...It was like he wasn't even needed...I remember one time that the defense just spotted him yards because our o-line was so good.

vailpass
08-03-2006, 05:58 PM
The season will answer all questions. To say I am wrong for having questions seems contrary to what I know about most of you.

Enough talk, bring on the season.
Gotta' get out of here, happy hour starts soon.
Peace.

Count Alex's Losses
08-03-2006, 05:58 PM
He was especially overrated when he ran over the Chiefs in the playoffs at Arrowhead...I couldn't believe how much faux credit he got. It was ridiculous.

He barely averaged 4 yards per carry. According to your buddy Florida Bronco, if you don't average at LEAST 5 yards a carry against good run defenses, you aren't elite.

I personally do not subscribe to that idiotic theory, and I'm guessing you don't, either, so perhaps you can go tell him off.

the Talking Can
08-03-2006, 06:06 PM
The season will answer all questions. To say I am wrong for having questions seems contrary to what I know about most of you.

Enough talk, bring on the season.
Gotta' get out of here, happy hour starts soon.
Peace.

you mean you've been sober this whole time?

LJISDAMAN
08-03-2006, 06:14 PM
If I remember correctly, when LJ faced the Broncos the Broncos were one of the top defenses in the league against the run. I'm referring to the last game between the Broncos and Chiefs. I remember when LJ faced the Chargers, and they were the top rush defense in the league. Of course, those stats changed after facing LJ I'm sure.

Tell me LJ isn't all that special after reading below:
What LJ did last last year was nothing short of legendary. He broke the Kansas City Chiefs franchise single-game rushing record with 211 yards against the Houston Texans in just his 6th career NFL start. Later he popped 201 yards on Cincinnati and was taken out at the Bengals' 32-yard line with 5:00 left in the game. He put up 9 straight 100-yard games, the longest such streak since Deuce McAllister (9) in 2003 and would have challenged the top mark of 14 straight games Priest Holmes not started the first 7 games. Five of Larry's nine 100-yard games went for 140+ yards, not just 100. Amazing! Johnson totaled more yards more total yards (2,093) than any back in the league except Tiki Barber (2,390), more than Shaun Alexander (1,958), Edgerrin James (1,843), and Clinton Portis (1,732). And all those guys had twice the number of touches that Larry had in the first seven games (81) because he shared with Holmes. Further glorifying Johnson's value: he racked up 1,351 rushing yards after Nov. 1, which was the highest mark in NFL history in games played after that date. Project him out over 16 starts (instead of 9) and you really see what kind of damage he was doing: A pace for 464 carries (NFL record), 2,402 rushing yards (NFL record) and 28 rushing TDs (NFL record). New HC Herman Edwards kept 10 of the remaining 14 offensive coaches and assistants intact, including offensive line coach Mike Solari, who he promoted to coordinator. "You don't mess with greatness unless you have to," said Larry Johnson. "Mike Solari knows the offense. We're going to run the same offense we used to run ever since I was here." The "new game plan" calls for 500 rushing attempts this season or at least 35 per game. Larry's bigger, stronger, and especially faster than Priest Holmes (a giant question mark for 2006) ever was, and the proof is in the pudding. Holmes only had one rushing TD from 35+ yards out (it was exactly 35 yards) in 1,275 carries as a Chief. Johnson has run them in from 46, 41, 35, and 49 yards in his last 415 carries alone. And he's scored from 85 and 97 yards out in preseason games. Yes, we have man love for Larry Johnson...who doesn't?

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 06:15 PM
He barely averaged 4 yards per carry. According to your buddy Florida Bronco, if you don't average at LEAST 5 yards a carry against good run defenses, you aren't elite.

I personally do not subscribe to that idiotic theory, and I'm guessing you don't, either, so perhaps you can go tell him off.

I understand your point...the most important thing was the Broncos won..and it wouldn't have mattered if TD average 2 yards per carry

Iowanian
08-03-2006, 08:51 PM
Anyone who knows anything about football, knows that you could line up Jerry Springer at RB behind the Donkey plug-n-play Oline for 2400 yards.


What about the Broncos RB's huh? Ron Dayne has never been a starter and has proven to be a bust. Tatum Bell has never been a starter either and he looks frail......

Garcia Bronco
08-03-2006, 09:03 PM
Anyone who knows anything about football, knows that you could line up Jerry Springer at RB behind the Donkey plug-n-play Oline for 2400 yards.

Jerry Springer would easily get 2500 yards...why you gotta be that way?

Bowser
08-03-2006, 11:59 PM
I guess he needed to rush for 140 yards in the 4th quarter in that game at Arrowhead before Donk fan considered him "special".

CupidStunt
08-04-2006, 01:19 PM
He'd be special if he had 5 tubs of lard up front breaking ankles for him.

Sully
08-04-2006, 01:26 PM
*Preparing and playing for 17 weeks straight with only the bye week vs. being able to sit and rest for the first seven weeks.



[/CREDIBILITY]

boogblaster
08-04-2006, 02:02 PM
DONK FANS HAVE SPECIAL KIDS SPECIAL DOGS SPECIAL WIVES AND SPECIAL THOUGHTS HUH DID I SAY ANYTHING SPECIAL....

htismaqe
08-04-2006, 02:10 PM
Courtesy of www.websters.com:

spe·cial ( P ) Pronunciation Key (spshl)
adj.
Surpassing what is common or usual; exceptional: a special occasion; a special treat.

Distinct among others of a kind: a special type of paint; a special medication for arthritis.
Primary: His special satisfaction comes from volunteer work.
Peculiar to a specific person or thing; particular: my own special chair; the special features of a computer.

Having a limited or specific function, application, or scope: a special role in the mission.
Arranged for a particular occasion or purpose: a special visit from her daughter.
Regarded with particular affection and admiration: a special friend.
Additional; extra: a special holiday flight.


There's no blindness here. Only a stupid donk fan that refuses to acknowledge the definition of the word "special".

:hmmm:

Two whole pages of posts from vailpass and no response to this...

:hmmm:

vailpass
08-04-2006, 02:38 PM
:hmmm:

Two whole pages of posts from vailpass and no response to this...

:hmmm:

Sorry, didn't realize a response was needed as I posted my defintion of 'special' as it relates to an NFL RB earlier in this thread.

When I think of an NFL RB who is special I think of SB MVPs or all time greats like Walter, Barry, JB, OJ. The rare few who have distinguished themselves on the NFL's biggest stage or through HOF careers.
Anything less isn't special, it is great, very good, good, etc.

I have not seen near enough of LJ to put him in that class,or even to call him 'distinct among others of a kind' .
He is on your team so you want to believe he has already achieved that. Fine. I don't.

Count Alex's Losses
08-04-2006, 02:39 PM
So Curtis Martin is special....but LJ isn't.

vailpass
08-04-2006, 02:42 PM
So Curtis Martin is special....but LJ isn't.

Curtis Martin ranks 4th on the all-time NFL rushing list with over 14,000 yards. If you think LJ has accomplished more than CM it again proves you are a career waterboy Draven.

Potential does not equal achievement.

Count Alex's Losses
08-04-2006, 02:43 PM
Right now, LJ is a better running back than Martin. That is undeniable.

jspchief
08-04-2006, 02:45 PM
When I call LJ "special" I mean it in relative terms. I'm talking about special for a guy that's just getting started. Special among RBs in the league right now. I'm not talking about greatest to ever play the game special.

vailpass
08-04-2006, 02:46 PM
I laid out a stupid comment and got slapped in the face. My desire to prove my self-worth to my internet handlers by battling visiting posters as though it were real life has caused me to act in haste and miss the mark completely. That is undeniable.

Fixed.

vailpass
08-04-2006, 02:52 PM
When I call LJ "special" I mean it in relative terms. I'm talking about special for a guy that's just getting started. Special among RBs in the league right now. I'm not talking about greatest to ever play the game special.

I laid out my definition of special a few pages back to be sure we were defining the term the same way.
"Special" to me means one of an elite few. IMO there are a lot of great RBs that have played, even more very good, good, etc.

IMO when you say "special for a guy just getting started" you are terming LJ special in large part on potential, as are all of the other posters who say the same thing in different words. That is completely understandable as he is on your team.

I don't disagree with you when you say LJ has some awesome games last year that indicate he could accomplish some special things. Where I draw your ire is when I take the logical next step and say he has not yet accomplished those things and I am taking a wait-and-see. Not because I don't think he can do it but because I am a fan of the game who needs to see it first.

Count Alex's Losses
08-04-2006, 02:54 PM
Fixed.

You're a dipshit.

ChiefFan31
08-04-2006, 03:14 PM
I aint gonna read 9 pages of Nonsense.

Are donks fans really doubting LJ ??

Good, I hope they do :)

DJJasonp
08-04-2006, 03:21 PM
I think Bronco fans are special - not so much as a "you're kind of a special person - I'd like to do something special for you"....

But more like "you're kind of special - I'm betting you wore a helmet and rode the short bus to school" kind of special.

StcChief
08-04-2006, 03:21 PM
If LJ is 'Not Special' that's fine...Let the number do the talking.

Tatum Bell/Ron Dayne couldn't carry his jock.

Moooo
08-04-2006, 03:23 PM
I aint gonna read 9 pages of Nonsense.

Are donks fans really doubting LJ ??

Good, I hope they do :)

Unfortunately, there's not a doubt in my mind rat is well aware of his ability.

Moooo

htismaqe
08-04-2006, 03:33 PM
Sorry, didn't realize a response was needed as I posted my defintion of 'special' as it relates to an NFL RB earlier in this thread.

When I think of an NFL RB who is special I think of SB MVPs or all time greats like Walter, Barry, JB, OJ. The rare few who have distinguished themselves on the NFL's biggest stage or through HOF careers.
Anything less isn't special, it is great, very good, good, etc.

I have not seen near enough of LJ to put him in that class,or even to call him 'distinct among others of a kind' .
He is on your team so you want to believe he has already achieved that. Fine. I don't.

ROFL

I haven't said he's achieved ANYTHING CLOSE to Walter, Barry, or OJ.

He IS distinct among others of his kind - others of his kind ARE NOT the guys you listed, but rather RB's CURRENTLY PLAYING THE GAME.

His 9-game stretch last year is the ONLY ONE like it in the history of the NFL - it's not opinion, it's FACT.

It has nothing to do with him being on my time. But you can damn bet that your opinion has everything to do with him being a Chief.

vailpass
08-04-2006, 03:57 PM
ROFL

I haven't said he's achieved ANYTHING CLOSE to Walter, Barry, or OJ.
I can see where it appeard that is what I meant, sorry. I meant that if you want to consider him special or distinct after 9 games that is your business.

He IS distinct among others of his kind - others of his kind ARE NOT the guys you listed, but rather RB's CURRENTLY PLAYING THE GAME.
How? This will be news to LT, SA, etc.

His 9-game stretch last year is the ONLY ONE like it in the history of the NFL - it's not opinion, it's FACT.
9 very nice games that showed potential for greatness. What is your point? Are you ready to place him with the game's elite after 9 games?

It has nothing to do with him being on my time. But you can damn bet that your opinion has everything to do with him being a Chief. I would feel the exact same way if he were on my team. If anything I would be even less inclined to assume anything until it was proven. After 35+ years of being involved with football I take the long view. .

htismaqe
08-04-2006, 04:09 PM
You're talking yourself in circles. It's pretty simple really.

Larry Johnson has already distinguished himself from his peers. That takes nothing away from LT or Alexander, because THEY TOO have distinguished themselves from their peers.

Nobody here said Larry Johnson was a hall-of-famer, nor did they say he was GREAT. But your Donk brother said he wasn't "special".

He most certainly IS special, and suggesting otherwise is flatly denying the meaning of the word.

vailpass
08-04-2006, 04:29 PM
You're talking yourself in circles. It's pretty simple really.

Larry Johnson has already distinguished himself from his peers. That takes nothing away from LT or Alexander, because THEY TOO have distinguished themselves from their peers.

Nobody here said Larry Johnson was a hall-of-famer, nor did they say he was GREAT. But your Donk brother said he wasn't "special".

He most certainly IS special, and suggesting otherwise is flatly denying the meaning of the word.

Wrong. LJ is special according to your definition of the word, not mine. This isn't a 5th grade vocabulary test; the meaning of the word special is not strictly defined by a dictionary. IN debate the first order of business is to define terms; I did so several pages back.

This is getting ridiculous; your getting so butt-hurt becasue someone doesn't think your guy is 'special'. I don't and won't until he proves something beyond 9 games of running loose behind an all-decade O-line against mostly sub-par defenses and no amount of whining on your end is going to change that.
Let's drop this stupidity and wait for the season to settle this.

cdcox
08-04-2006, 04:34 PM
9 games

ROFL OK, now you are showing you can't admit you're wrong, even when shown the facts.

vailpass
08-04-2006, 04:47 PM
ROFL OK, now you are showing you can't admit you're wrong, even when shown the facts.

How can my opinion be wrong?
What new fact was I shown?

Are you among the crowd who gets all emotional by my saying I think LJ has potential but has yet to translate that into a full season of 16 games as the starter?

Count Alex's Losses
08-04-2006, 04:47 PM
Curtis Martin: special

Larry Johnson: Not.

JBucc
08-04-2006, 04:56 PM
Wrong. LJ is special according to your definition of the word, not mine. This isn't a 5th grade vocabulary test; the meaning of the word special is not strictly defined by a dictionary.Then those who think LJ is special are not wrong ,since their definition is just different from yours. Or something.

cdcox
08-04-2006, 05:00 PM
How can my opinion be wrong?
What new fact was I shown?

Are you among the crowd who gets all emotional by my saying I think LJ has potential but has yet to translate that into a full season of 16 games as the starter?

Went over this yester day. In addition to the "9 games" he had a 26 carry game, a 13 carry game, and a 110 yard game. We're up to 12 starts as far as work load goes.

StcChief
08-04-2006, 05:03 PM
We will watch as Mr. 'Not Special' Johnson run over your
'Not Special D'.

HemiEd
08-04-2006, 05:10 PM
ROFL OK, now you are showing you can't admit you're wrong, even when shown the facts.

Exactly.

vailpass
08-04-2006, 05:19 PM
Then those who think LJ is special are not wrong ,since their definition is just different from yours. Or something.

Agreed. Been saying that it is a matter of opinion for the last 5 pages.

vailpass
08-04-2006, 05:23 PM
Went over this yester day. In addition to the "9 games" he had a 26 carry game, a 13 carry game, and a 110 yard game. We're up to 12 starts as far as work load goes.

You aren't allowed to change facts to suit your needs.
9 starts=9 starts
7 non-starts=7 non-starts
FTR even if you were allowed to make up facts 12 starts still does not equal 16.


What exactly is it you are trying to prove here? That your opinion is different from mine?

My opinion is that it takes at least one full season as a starter for me to be able to evaluate the overall effectiveness of a RB. Some playoff experience helps too.

Why are you getting emotional over this?

JBucc
08-04-2006, 05:26 PM
Agreed. Been saying that it is a matter of opinion for the last 5 pages.Yeah. I just wanted to use vailass. I thought that was clever.

cdcox
08-04-2006, 05:36 PM
You aren't allowed to change facts to suit your needs.
9 starts=9 starts
7 non-starts=7 non-starts
FTR even if you were allowed to make up facts 12 starts still does not equal 16.

Starter means their name is called when they come out of the tunnel and they play the first play from scrimage. That is it. You think that is a more objective measure of durability and consistency than carries or yards gained?


What exactly is it you are trying to prove here? That your opinion is different from mine?

I respect differences of opinion. I do not respect arguements based on faulty premise. "9 games" is a faulty premise.

My opinion is that it takes at least one full season as a starter for me to be able to evaluate the overall effectiveness of a RB. Some playoff experience helps too.

Why are you getting emotional over this?

What make you think I'm emotional? I'm just in amazement that someone could be so dense in saying "9 games" when they have been shown time and again that that statement is a misrepresentation.

vailpass
08-04-2006, 05:37 PM
Yeah. I just wanted to use vailass. I thought that was clever.
ROFL Sorry I missed that. Points for creativity with extra credit for subtlety.
Have a good weekend all.

Sully
08-06-2006, 10:01 AM
You aren't allowed to change facts to suit your needs.
9 starts=9 starts
7 non-starts=7 non-starts



Are we allowed, then, to still use this fact?

1 yard = 1 yard

If so, the LJ was the most special back in the NFL last season. As I recall, every defense we played, was still allowed to line up 11 guys, whether the "starter" was in the game or not. We still ran the plays with 5 offensive linemen, and a QB handing off, whether it was to number 31 or a guy "who only played 9 games."

StcChief
08-06-2006, 10:15 AM
An NFL record is still that.

Let the games begin in 2006 and settle this BS thread once and for all.
Just run angry LJ.

stevieray
08-06-2006, 10:54 AM
Are we allowed, then, to still use this fact?

1 yard = 1 yard

If so, the LJ was the most special back in the NFL last season. As I recall, every defense we played, was still allowed to line up 11 guys, whether the "starter" was in the game or not. We still ran the plays with 5 offensive linemen, and a QB handing off, whether it was to number 31 or a guy "who only played 9 games."

The fact that anybody would downplay the production in those games tells me they are scared of LJ, as they should be.

If he were an Invesco, I'd be scared too.

cdcox
08-06-2006, 11:28 AM
Any chance this thread gets bumped during the regular season?

Count Alex's Losses
08-06-2006, 11:45 AM
100 percent chance of bumpage.

StcChief
08-06-2006, 11:59 AM
The fact that anybody would downplay the production in those games tells me they are scared of LJ, as they should be.

If he were an Invesco, I'd be scared too.
My gut feeling is we win in Incestco this year.

CHIEF4EVER
08-06-2006, 01:17 PM
Wow. This has to be the most entertaining thread I have read in awhile. I can't wait to see the posts by Donk fans when LJ singlehandedly stretches the sphincters of the Donk defense in week 2. ROFL

JohnnyV13
08-06-2006, 10:34 PM
I think this Denver fan is clearly very "special".


He was so special, his school sent a short bus to his house just for him.

Bowser
08-06-2006, 10:36 PM
Any chance this thread gets bumped during the regular season?

I think this thread may just reach 2,000+ posts by the time the season is over.

PunkinDrublic
08-07-2006, 02:11 AM
Does this really suprise anybody? I mean Donk fans aren't exactly known for their high football IQs. Colorado borders a state that is 70% Mormon so I have to believe that some of that polygamous inbreeding has spilled over into Colorado and effected the average donk fans ability to think logically.

Any idiot would know that you don't judge a back on the mere formality of whether or not he happened to start the game, but the number of carries he got.

This is what it is, donk fan jealousy pure and simple. Seeing LJ rack up big numbers only reminds them of their sad and pathetic RB situation so of course their going to take any opportunity to slight or downplay what he's done.

If you use vailpasse's logic, if Priest Holmes starts the game gets a carry and then sits the rest of the game while LJ takes the rest of the carries then it doesn't tell you anything about his ability because he didn't happen to start.

Mile High Mania
08-07-2006, 08:09 AM
I wish I could say that I was in shock that this thread is over 200 replies. Anyone that knocks LJ is crazy. Yes, he hasn't "done it" for a full year or consistently over time like LT or SA... and yes, a few teams on his schedule last year were bad. But, LJ still blew up the great defenses... he's no fluke.

Every team plays a handful of crappy defenses every year... so the top RBs have nearly equal opportunity to blow up their stats.

Inspector
08-07-2006, 08:17 AM
Note to self:

Bump this thread on Sept 18th.

The season can't start soon enough.

htismaqe
08-07-2006, 08:44 AM
Wrong. LJ is special according to your definition of the word, not mine. This isn't a 5th grade vocabulary test; the meaning of the word special is not strictly defined by a dictionary. IN debate the first order of business is to define terms; I did so several pages back.

This is getting ridiculous; your getting so butt-hurt becasue someone doesn't think your guy is 'special'. I don't and won't until he proves something beyond 9 games of running loose behind an all-decade O-line against mostly sub-par defenses and no amount of whining on your end is going to change that.
Let's drop this stupidity and wait for the season to settle this.

ROFL

LJ is "special" according to the DICTIONARY'S definition of the word.

FYI, formal debate allows you to outline TERMS, not CHANGE the meaning of words to fit your argument.

The only ridiculousness here is you. I'm not "butt-hurt" (whatever the **** that is, I'm assuming it comes from being a Donk fan and liking guys or something), I find this rather amusing.

KCTitus
08-07-2006, 08:48 AM
I too have noticed this term lately, and since we're all about word parsing in this thread, can someone elaborate on 'butt hurt'?

BigChiefFan
08-07-2006, 09:37 AM
I wish I could say that I was in shock that this thread is over 200 replies. Anyone that knocks LJ is crazy. Yes, he hasn't "done it" for a full year or consistently over time like LT or SA... and yes, a few teams on his schedule last year were bad. But, LJ still blew up the great defenses... he's no fluke.

Every team plays a handful of crappy defenses every year... so the top RBs have nearly equal opportunity to blow up their stats.

Once again, MHM shows their is common sense amongst the enemy. Good post.

Lzen
08-07-2006, 10:44 AM
FYI, formal debate allows you to outline TERMS, not CHANGE the meaning of words to fit your argument.

ROFL I was thinking the same exact thing. :thumb:

vailpass
08-07-2006, 12:45 PM
Me thinks you all do protest too much. :)

Bring on the season!