PDA

View Full Version : KC Star - Chiefs booted


Count Zarth
08-13-2006, 01:18 AM
Houston’s bootleg befuddles first-team defense early in preseason opener.

By ELIZABETH MERRILL
The Kansas City Star


HOUSTON - The day, some would say later, was just plain weird. Unnatural, almost. Herm Edwards felt different on the sidelines in Chiefs red. Quarterback Trent Green got a message Saturday morning from Dick Vermeil, the old coach wished him luck, and that, along with the changed pregame rituals, was strange.

The Chiefs getting burned on the bootleg? Now that seemed natural.

The Edwards era started with a vanilla defense, a wobbly backup offense, and a quarterback who burned Kansas City on the bootleg. Had it not been a preseason game, this 24-14 loss to the Texans in front of a half-empty stadium could’ve really raised questions about the millions Kansas City plunked down to resurrect its defense.

Instead, Edwards flashed a fatherly grin and gave the young players high marks for effort. The older ones will need to be better on Sept. 10, when the Chiefs open the season against Cincinnati.

“The boot hurt us,” Edwards said. “There’s no doubt about it. We couldn’t get the end to get back upfield to stop the quarterback, and a couple of those quarterbacks are faster than our ends. I hate to say that, but now they weren’t our starting ends.

“I’m excited about these young guys. I really am. I thought they put a good effort forth in the game. We watched a lot of young players play, and that’s what you’ve got to do. You look at the tape and you’ll be disappointed, but you’ve got to get the good things out of it and then correct the things that are correctable. The great thing about it is we can correct it.”

It should be noted that when the first units left the game after the first quarter, the score was tied 7-7. It should also be noted that the defense gave up 85 yards in two series during that time. Against a Texans team that finished 2-14 last year. And a quarterback that was used as a human tackle dummy.

But David Carr, rejuvenated from the addition of new coach Gary Kubiak, looked like Jake Plummer on Saturday night.

He rolled out, ran and directed a 13-play, 65-yard touchdown drive with 3:36 left in the first quarter. Kubiak, the former offensive coordinator at Denver, obviously took a few pages from his playbook on how to beat his old AFC West rival.

And without rookie end Tamba Hali, the team’s first-round draft pick, the Chiefs struggled. The first play of the Texans’ touchdown drive, Pro Bowl cornerback Patrick Surtain almost picked off a Carr pass. But the Texans clicked off runs of 4 and 5 yards, then lined up the punt team on fourth and 1 at their own 45.

They called timeout, went for it, and Carr bobbled the ball. He picked it up and plunged forward for the first down. Carr had 20 yards rushing in the first quarter, and the Texans piled up 325 total yards for the night.

The Chiefs haven’t won a preseason game since 2004, just before they started their defensive rebuilding project. It started with the acquisition of Pro Bowlers Surtain, Sammy Knight and Kendrell Bell in the 2005 offseason.

Last month, the Chiefs picked up what some considered to be the final piece of the puzzle, five-time Pro Bowl cornerback Ty Law.

The defense was on the field nearly 36 minutes, way too long for Edwards’ taste, but it was mainly the rookies and the backups who logged in most of the work.

“When we went into this game, we didn’t have a lot of defense in,” defensive tackle Lional Dalton said. “There were some things we could’ve done better, I could’ve done better. It’s a preseason game, you want to win all of them, but you have to watch the film and learn.

“Obviously we didn’t do what we came to do because they won the game.”

Edwards came to Kansas City in January vowing a revamped defense and a ball-control offense. At least the offense part of it worked in the meaningful snaps Saturday. Just after the Texans’ first touchdown, the Chiefs No. 1 unit chewed up 7:12 off the clock with a couple of short passes from Trent Green and some tough running from Larry Johnson.

“What I liked about it is that the offense rallied back and got the 7,” Edwards said. “Then my young guys got in there. They played hard, but they didn’t play smart.”

booger
08-13-2006, 01:24 AM
damn, no one interviewed Hicks.

Hopefully someone like Rhonda grills him about the bootleg this week.

The Dude Abides
08-13-2006, 01:25 AM
Well, its only preseason

PastorMikH
08-13-2006, 08:10 AM
“The boot hurt us,” Edwards said. “There’s no doubt about it. We couldn’t get the end to get back upfield to stop the quarterback, and a couple of those quarterbacks are faster than our ends. I hate to say that, but now they weren’t our starting ends.




I am assuming this means Hicks has lost his starting spot.

Coach
08-13-2006, 08:14 AM
I am assuming this means Hicks has lost his starting spot.

He lost it like 4 years ago. Just Vermeil never cared, and I'm sure that he did give him free-passes. There weren't anyone better during those years, which tells how bad our defense was during those years.

I can't wait to see Hali. I want to see what this kid can do.

crispystl420
08-13-2006, 08:19 AM
I am assuming this means Hicks has lost his starting spot.
God I hope so Hicks overpersuing account for about 40 of those first 84 yards.

hypersensitiveZO6
08-13-2006, 09:14 AM
I am assuming this means Hicks has lost his starting spot.

I'd like to think he lost his job, but we really need him for depth.

go bowe
08-13-2006, 11:04 AM
I'd like to think he lost his job, but we really need him for depth.maybe we have depth without him...

one of the scrub de's, i think it was clint mitchell, got upfield and disrupted the bootleg pretty well...

go bowe
08-13-2006, 11:05 AM
I am assuming this means Hicks has lost his starting spot.i think tamba has been running with the first team in camp...

i'm pretty sure what with herm being the coach, that hali will be the starter on opening day...

CoMoChief
08-13-2006, 11:16 AM
Eric Hicks and Ryan Sims are the cancer of this defense.

KCBOSS1
08-13-2006, 11:16 AM
God I hope so Hicks overpersuing account for about 40 of those first 84 yards.

He gets eat up on over-pursuit. It's not like his pursuit has been that effective, so he might as well stay home and come up feel and seal the end. Any right hand quarterback is going to boot to that side. The way that Denver has torn us up with it, every team we play will develop a couple of boot pages of their game plan. Maybe Tamba will make them pay for it.

hypersensitiveZO6
08-13-2006, 11:17 AM
maybe we have depth without him...

one of the scrub de's, i think it was clint mitchell, got upfield and disrupted the bootleg pretty well...


I still believe it would be a bad loss if he was cut.

I'm not giving up on him just because of one preseason game.

Everyday at camp Hali was the starter and Hicks was second team.

And there's no problem with that. :thumb:

You MUST rotate DEs/DT.

Too many reps= injury, bad performance

IMO

CoMoChief
08-13-2006, 11:19 AM
i think tamba has been running with the first team in camp...

i'm pretty sure what with herm being the coach, that hali will be the starter on opening day...


From what I saw from him in college, Tamba hunts down the bootleg pretty darn well.

CoMoChief
08-13-2006, 11:24 AM
Hicks is a good backup DE and should be playing in run situations only because he's actually pretty decent at stopping the run, however his pass rush skills and his ability to get upfield is absolutely horrible.

milkman
08-13-2006, 11:25 AM
I still believe it would be a bad loss if he was cut.

I'm not giving up on him just because of one preseason game.

Everyday at camp Hali was the starter and Hicks was second team.

And there's no problem with that. :thumb:

You MUST rotate DEs/DT.

Too many reps= injury, bad performance

IMO

Move Jimmy Wilkerson back to DE, where he belongs, and cut Hicks.

Depth problem solved.

hypersensitiveZO6
08-13-2006, 11:34 AM
Move Jimmy Wilkerson back to DE, where he belongs, and cut Hicks.

Depth problem solved.


Easier said than done.

I like the idea, but it may be too late.

Hicks has been somewhat injured. Could be part of the reason for his uneffectiveness

Browning is the LE behind him and he is likely to be cut because of his injury.


On the other side, Carlos hall is needed to back up Jared Allen.

Also we have Clint Mitchell, who is pretty raw.

Our depth isn't awesome right now.

58-4ever
08-13-2006, 11:35 AM
Easier said than done.

I like the idea, but it may be too late.

Hicks has been somewhat injured. Could be part of the reason for his uneffectiveness

Browning is the LE behind him and he is likely to be cut because of his injury.


On the other side, Carlos hall is needed to back up Jared Allen.

Also we have Clint Mitchell, who is pretty raw.

Our depth isn't awesome right now.

Clint Mitchell looked a bit undersized, but he did seem like he was in a lot of plays.

greg63
08-13-2006, 11:36 AM
Well, its only preseasonTrue, but it exposed an old weakness that the Chiefs defense, obviously, have yet to address.

PastorMikH
08-13-2006, 11:43 AM
Hicks is a good backup DE and should be playing in run situations only because he's actually pretty decent at stopping the run,

52 of the 65 yards on that first Houston TD drive were to Hick's side and he didn't get even stop (Nor did I even see him close on any of those plays). Hicks hasn't earned a starting spot in 6 years - and he's supposed to have been on of the leaders of our D. I'm to the point I think we'd be better off with 10 guys on the field if Hicks is our only choice.



*Note, ESPN gives Hicks credit for running Carr out of bounds on the bootleg with the 8 yard gain, but it was Allen, not Hicks that ran him out.

hypersensitiveZO6
08-13-2006, 11:46 AM
Clint Mitchell looked a bit undersized, but he did seem like he was in a lot of plays.


*hope.

but still unlikely to make the team.

chief2000
08-13-2006, 11:50 AM
Move Jimmy Wilkerson back to DE, where he belongs, and cut Hicks.

Depth problem solved.


Yes.

Or move Sims to D-END.

BigRedChief
08-14-2006, 07:20 AM
I was listening to 610 this am and they had a quote from Coach Edwards in which he said that they didn't game plan for the bootleg.

I know its preseason and vanilla defenses are the norm but he's killed the Chiefs defense with bootlegs for years. Did the Chief coaches not think Kubiak was going to whack them on the head with it at every oppertunity until they proved they could stop it? Why didn't they game plan for the boot leg? Ideas?

Brock
08-14-2006, 07:22 AM
I was listening to 610 this am and they had a quote from Coach Edwards in which he said that they didn't game plan for the bootleg.

I know its preseason and vanilla defenses are the norm but he's killed the Chiefs defense with bootlegs for years. Did the Chief coaches not think Kubiak was going to whack them on the head with it at every oppertunity until they proved they could stop it? Why didn't they game plan for the boot leg? Ideas?

Because there is no reason to gameplan for exhibition play?

BigRedChief
08-14-2006, 07:27 AM
Because there is no reason to gameplan for exhibition play?

He didn't say they didn't have a game plan. You have a game plan in the NFL. Maybe a vaniolla game plan but a game plan nonetheless.

He specifically said they didn't have a game plan for the bootleg. Then he followed it up with its easy to stop a bootleg we will get that done. another question.....If its easy why couldn't DV and Gun get it done? Players? All we have is Hali that they didn't have....Is it going to be the same result?

Fried Meat Ball!
08-14-2006, 07:28 AM
I was listening to 610 this am and they had a quote from Coach Edwards in which he said that they didn't game plan for the bootleg.

I know its preseason and vanilla defenses are the norm but he's killed the Chiefs defense with bootlegs for years. Did the Chief coaches not think Kubiak was going to whack them on the head with it at every oppertunity until they proved they could stop it? Why didn't they game plan for the boot leg? Ideas?
They said earlier in the week that they didn't gameplan at all for this game... and I don't really disagree. Why waste time gameplanning for a very early preseason. I don't think most teams start gameplanning until the third preseason game.

ct
08-14-2006, 07:32 AM
3 times on the same friggin drive...Tamba had better beat out Hicks...

BigRedChief
08-14-2006, 07:37 AM
They said earlier in the week that they didn't gameplan at all for this game... and I don't really disagree. Why waste time gameplanning for a very early preseason. I don't think most teams start gameplanning until the third preseason game.

Okay. If he said it then its true. No reason to lie about something like that. All of us that played football in elementary school know how to stop the boot leg. I don't see other teams having the trouble we have had the last 4 years stopping the bootleg. It shows a lack of discipline on the defense that we must have to win. Denver is already salivating about week 2.

morphius
08-14-2006, 07:38 AM
They said earlier in the week that they didn't gameplan at all for this game... and I don't really disagree. Why waste time gameplanning for a very early preseason. I don't think most teams start gameplanning until the third preseason game.
Exactly, no team game plans at all for the first preseason game. Well, unless they feel they need to improve a truly bad teams confidence.

htismaqe
08-14-2006, 08:01 AM
Okay. If he said it then its true. No reason to lie about something like that. All of us that played football in elementary school know how to stop the boot leg. I don't see other teams having the trouble we have had the last 4 years stopping the bootleg. It shows a lack of discipline on the defense that we must have to win. Denver is already salivating about week 2.

Too bad for Denver that Eric Hicks will be standing on the sideline while Tamba Hali is running down Jake Plummer.

I watched the game again last night, and this isn't a scheme problem.

6 years. 3 schemes. 2 head coaches. 2 defensive coordinators.

ONE DEFENSIVE END - Eric Hicks.

Get him off the field, the problem is nearly 100% solved at that point.

Fried Meat Ball!
08-14-2006, 08:05 AM
Okay. If he said it then its true. No reason to lie about something like that. All of us that played football in elementary school know how to stop the boot leg. I don't see other teams having the trouble we have had the last 4 years stopping the bootleg. It shows a lack of discipline on the defense that we must have to win. Denver is already salivating about week 2.
Yeah... don't get me wrong, I wasn't trying to make excuses... just saying we didn't gameplan and they said that well-before the actual game.

The problem taking care of your own business... it's Hicks' business to hold backside containment and he FAILED miserably on Saturday. If we don't learn that fundamental, any team with a mobile QB is going to eat us alive.

Lzen
08-14-2006, 08:24 AM
Yes.

Or move Sims to D-END.

ROFL
Sims is on the verge of losing his starting spot at DT. What makes you think he would do better at DE? IMO, he is too slow to play DE.

Lzen
08-14-2006, 08:27 AM
Too bad for Denver that Eric Hicks will be standing on the sideline while Tamba Hali is running down Jake Plummer.

I watched the game again last night, and this isn't a scheme problem.

6 years. 3 schemes. 2 head coaches. 2 defensive coordinators.

ONE DEFENSIVE END - Eric Hicks.

Get him off the field, the problem is nearly 100% solved at that point.


:clap: Hicks has been living off one good year (2000) for the past 5 years.

BigRedChief
08-14-2006, 08:32 AM
The problem taking care of your own business... it's Hicks' business to hold backside containment and he FAILED miserably on Saturday. If we don't learn that fundamental, any team with a mobile QB is going to eat us alive.

That was my point about elementary school football. The DE stays home and the bootleg is not as effective. He may still out run the DE or get by him but the bootleg is called because they think the DE is going to bite inside and containment is easily broken.

And htismages point I hope is valid....Tamba will have better speed to chase to the outside and better discipline to stay home.

Chiefs Pantalones
08-14-2006, 10:23 AM
I can't think of a team that has less depth on the Dline than the Chiefs. And not just Dline, but overall, the Chiefs have hardly any depth at any position. That's POOR drafting. REALLY poor drafting.