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SNR
08-31-2006, 10:50 PM
I'm confident that Croyle needs to be our #2 QB.

Herm says he posseses all of the personality of a starting QB in this league. He's calm in the huddle, the guys in the huddle look up to him, and he's not at all jittery on the field. It's incredible to me that he's cool and calm as a rookie... having only played two games at the NFL level. That's very encouraging.

If Green goes down, we're screwed anyway. Huard can't win games for us. I'm not saying Croyle will either, but he'll make some smart plays and have the opportunity to grow as a QB, which would be more important for the future than that particular lost season.

Guru
08-31-2006, 10:51 PM
I want Huard gone in so many ways.

cdcox
08-31-2006, 10:53 PM
Let's say we make Croyle the #2. Who is the #3? Printers? Eh. Might as well keep Huard.

jspchief
08-31-2006, 10:53 PM
Huard played decent tonight. I certainly wouldn't keep Printers over Huard after watching the two.

I'm fine with Croyle being #2 on the depth chart in terms of practice snaps, then letting the situation dictate who actually fills in for Green.

I'm also fine with dumping Huard if we get a guy that is clearly better.

Count Alex's Wins
08-31-2006, 10:54 PM
Huard was excellent tonight. He will be the No. 2.

Halfcan
08-31-2006, 10:58 PM
Brodie needs to bulk up a little bit. He made some bad throws, but Black was horrendous and Samson Ole'd a few guys and let them go right by him to nail Brodie.

Mr. Laz
08-31-2006, 11:04 PM
Brodie needs to bulk up a little bit. He made some bad throws, but Black was horrendous and Samson Ole'd a few guys and let them go right by him to nail Brodie.
black and sampson almost got Croyle killed tonight.

jspchief
08-31-2006, 11:06 PM
Yea, that one play where Sampson didn't touch anyone, and never even saw that LB that T'd off on Croyle.

I pray that he's not the guy in protecting Green this season.

Count Alex's Wins
08-31-2006, 11:07 PM
Sampson made the right choice there. He can't block them both, so he's supposed to take the inside guy. The quarterback is supposed to step up and get rid of the ball.

Ultra Peanut
08-31-2006, 11:08 PM
I don't mean to repeat myself, but if Croyle stays healthy and beefs up, he's going to be great.

jspchief
08-31-2006, 11:09 PM
Sampson made the right choice there. He can't block them both, so he's supposed to take the inside guy. The quarterback is supposed to step up and get rid of the ball.Sampson didn't even touch anyone on the play I'm talking about. He was watching for a guy coming inside, and I don't think he ever even saw the guy he should have blocked.

Halfcan
08-31-2006, 11:13 PM
Sampson didn't even touch anyone on the play I'm talking about. He was watching for a guy coming inside, and I don't think he ever even saw the guy he should have blocked.

You are exactly right-Turley had the same situation in game 1 and was able to block the inside guy to the ground and then cut the blitzing end off and push him out of the play-saving Green a huge hit.

Black still looks lost out there, for playing in 48 games, he should be better.

Smed1065
08-31-2006, 11:18 PM
turley 275 maybe. black 315....

ChiefFan31
08-31-2006, 11:19 PM
Anyone, how did Svitek look tonight with the starters at RT??

I remember reading there were going to give him the start.

Halfcan
08-31-2006, 11:22 PM
turley 275 maybe. black 315....

Did you see the Turley interview-freakin love this guy, said it is about technique not weight. Said you could find a bunch of 350 pound fatazzes in a bar that weigh more then me-but they can't play the game.

He said FATASS on the air-gotta love it. Could end up being the comeback player of the year.

jspchief
08-31-2006, 11:23 PM
Could end up being the comeback player of the year.They are already engraving "Carson Palmer" on that trophy.

Halfcan
08-31-2006, 11:24 PM
Anyone, how did Svitek look tonight with the starters at RT??

I remember reading there were going to give him the start.

He kind of blended in-jumped on the pile a few times, but :shrug: he might make the club.

Halfcan
08-31-2006, 11:25 PM
They are already engraving "Carson Palmer" on that trophy.

Not after he starts the year with 4 INT's. :)

Deberg_1990
08-31-2006, 11:30 PM
They are already engraving "Carson Palmer" on that trophy.

I honestly domnt think he qualifies. I think te award is meant for a guy who had a bad year prior, injured the whole year, or who has been out of the game awhile like Turley. Obviously, Palmer doesnt match hthat criteria since he got injured during the playoffs.

Halfcan
08-31-2006, 11:32 PM
Somehow they will give it to Pretty Boy Peyton Manning, along with MVP after he chokes his team out of the Playoffs again.

ChiefFan31
08-31-2006, 11:33 PM
He kind of blended in-jumped on the pile a few times, but :shrug: he might make the club.

He will make the club. I believe the thinking is that he is the future at LT but it still raw. its the fact that Sampson has not looked good in Pass Protection that they were going to take a look playing Svitek at RT tonight.

Thanks though, I was curious as to how he looked.

jspchief
08-31-2006, 11:33 PM
I honestly domnt think he qualifies. I think te award is meant for a guy who had a bad year prior, injured the whole year, or who has been out of the game awhile like Turley. Obviously, Palmer doesnt match hthat criteria since he got injured during the playoffs.In that case it will be Culpepper.

If Turley has a good year, he'll certainly be deserving. I guess it depends on who's voting, because I question the media's ability to recognize a lineman over a skill player.

cdcox
08-31-2006, 11:34 PM
From Wikipedia:

The NFL Comeback Player of the Year Award has been given out after every season since 1972, except for 1985 when no winner was selected. The player named Comeback Player of the Year shows perseverance in overcoming adversity, in the form of not being in the NFL the previous year, a severe injury, or simply poor performance.

Ted Bruschi co-won it last year, and he didn't miss the whole season.

PastorMikH
08-31-2006, 11:35 PM
Watching the game right now - halfway through the 2nd quarter. Huard is actually looking decent to me tonight. He's no Trent Green, but for the first time, I think if he has to come in, it's not a quaranteed loss.

boogblaster
08-31-2006, 11:51 PM
Croyle should be #2 hes just going to get better..Green needs to bring him along..Right now hes the only future we have at QB...BOOG>>>>

SNR
08-31-2006, 11:51 PM
I thought Holmes won the award after he "lost his burst" after that Dungver injury

Count Alex's Wins
09-01-2006, 12:16 AM
Watching the game right now - halfway through the 2nd quarter. Huard is actually looking decent to me tonight. He's no Trent Green, but for the first time, I think if he has to come in, it's not a quaranteed loss.

Huard played very well tonight. That pass to Webb was beautiful.

Pitt Gorilla
09-01-2006, 12:18 AM
Smith ran the ball well. Any chance he takes Brown's spot?!?

ChiefFan31
09-01-2006, 12:19 AM
Smith ran the ball well. Any chance he takes Brown's spot?!?

I say no. I would rather he did, but Dee Brown plays ST

jidar
09-01-2006, 12:19 AM
What the hell? You guys watched the game right?
Huard played really well, so well in fact that I'm no longer too worried about our #2 QB.

Croyle showed potential but he made several bad decisions and had some bad throws as well.

As it stands right now, Huard at 2 and Croyle at 3 is exactly where those two should be.

Mr. Laz
09-01-2006, 12:38 AM
Huard played very well tonight. That pass to Webb was beautiful.
just stop ... you're just saying this crap to bug the people that don't like and you know it.


:Poke:

Guru
09-01-2006, 12:44 AM
just stop ... you're just saying this crap to bug the people that don't like and you know it.


:Poke:

Looks like it is working too.

Count Alex's Wins
09-01-2006, 12:48 AM
just stop ... you're just saying this crap to bug the people that don't like and you know it.


:Poke:

No, I'm serious. He showed that he's not the worthless crabapple everyone here thought he was last year.

OnTheWarpath58
09-01-2006, 12:49 AM
I just finished preseason 2007 on Madden. (I sim the PS 'cuz I'm playing a "Superstar" mode....CAR RB)


Guess who's out for the year with a broken collarbone?

Croyle.

Even Madden thinks he's fragile.....



:rolleyes:

Huard plays for Dolphins now. Colquitt is Trent's backup.......

ROFL

SNR
09-01-2006, 12:55 AM
I just finished preseason 2007 on Madden. (I sim the PS 'cuz I'm playing a "Superstar" mode....CAR RB)


Guess who's out for the year with a broken collarbone?

Croyle.

Even Madden thinks he's fragile.....



:rolleyes:

Huard plays for Dolphins now. Colquitt is Trent's backup.......

ROFLMadden thinks you're fragile too

ChiefsCountry
09-01-2006, 01:03 AM
Actually I think if Green goes down Huard could win us some ballgames. Hell with LJ, our OL, and TG it doesnt take that much to operate our offense. Play it cool and don't go all crazy and I think we would be fine.

Mecca
09-01-2006, 01:22 AM
I just finished preseason 2007 on Madden. (I sim the PS 'cuz I'm playing a "Superstar" mode....CAR RB)


Guess who's out for the year with a broken collarbone?

Croyle.

Even Madden thinks he's fragile.....



:rolleyes:

Huard plays for Dolphins now. Colquitt is Trent's backup.......

ROFL

I bet his injury rating is really low considering his history.

greg63
09-01-2006, 01:30 AM
I'm confident that Croyle needs to be our #2 QB.

Herm says he posseses all of the personality of a starting QB in this league. He's calm in the huddle, the guys in the huddle look up to him, and he's not at all jittery on the field. It's incredible to me that he's cool and calm as a rookie... having only played two games at the NFL level. That's very encouraging.

If Green goes down, we're screwed anyway. Huard can't win games for us. I'm not saying Croyle will either, but he'll make some smart plays and have the opportunity to grow as a QB, which would be more important for the future than that particular lost season.


DUDE!!!!! Shut yer mouth! :p



j/k

Warrior5
09-01-2006, 07:38 AM
As it stands right now, Huard at 2 and Croyle at 3 is exactly where those two should be.

Agreed.

Reerun_KC
09-01-2006, 09:07 AM
black and sampson almost got Croyle killed tonight.



You mean the vaunted Jordan "The Screen Door" Black?

You have be kidding right.

Rooster
09-01-2006, 09:31 AM
[QUOTE=cdcox]From Wikipedia:

The NFL Comeback Player of the Year Award has been given out after every season since 1972, except for 1985 when no winner was selected. The player named Comeback Player of the Year shows perseverance in overcoming adversity, in the form of not being in the NFL the previous year, a severe injury, or simply poor performance.

QUOTE]

I guess Sims could win comeback player of the year since he has had many previous years of a 'simply poor performance'.

Warrior5
09-01-2006, 10:00 AM
You mean the vaunted Jordan "The Screen Door" Black?

Jordan Black, a.k.a:

Screen Door
Highway 65
Matador
Turnstile
Express Lane
Green Light

Coogs
09-01-2006, 10:21 AM
What the hell? You guys watched the game right?
Huard played really well, so well in fact that I'm no longer too worried about our #2 QB.

Croyle showed potential but he made several bad decisions and had some bad throws as well.

As it stands right now, Huard at 2 and Croyle at 3 is exactly where those two should be.

Croyle threw the ball real well. The Interception was on the WR. That one should have been caught. The other near int. was due to a holding on the DB to get position. He zipped the ball on tight spirals right to the WR's for the most part. His gun almost reminded me of Favre's gun.

Huard had a short hop into a wide open Hall. I think Croyle zips that pass right into Hall, who in turn makes a play as he had some open space to operate had he been able to stay on his feet.

Huard probably gets the #2 on experience, but I hope Croyle does so he can take more snaps in practice. It has been a long time (as in never) since we groomed our own QB. Now would be a good time to reverse that trend.

jspchief
09-01-2006, 10:24 AM
Croyle threw the ball real well. The Interception was on the WR. That one should have been caught. The other near int. was due to a holding on the DB to get position. He zipped the ball on tight spirals right to the WR's for the most part. His gun almost reminded me of Favre's gun.


As much as I'd like to blame that second INT on the hold, I don't think Croyle ever saw that safety. Hold or not, it was a poor decision.

That being said, he had a solid night overall.

Coogs
09-01-2006, 10:27 AM
As much as I'd like to blame that second INT on the hold, I don't think Croyle ever saw that safety. Hold or not, it was a poor decision.

That being said, he had a solid night overall.


I"ll agree. And it looked like a Favre type decision. Maybe not the greatest, but definately has the gun/confidence to pull that type of play off too.

Chief Faithful
09-01-2006, 10:31 AM
Yea, that one play where Sampson didn't touch anyone, and never even saw that LB that T'd off on Croyle.

I pray that he's not the guy in protecting Green this season.

On that play the center made the wrong call and the OLine slid the wrong direction. Sampson had to decide who to block and correctly chose the inside rusher. I don't think that would happen with Weigman making the line calls.

Chief Faithful
09-01-2006, 10:35 AM
I really like Croyle. He is the first QOTF the Chiefs have drafted since Mike Livingston that I like, but he is not ready for #2. Huard is the only legit #2 at this time.

I hope Printers makes the PS, Croyle takes the #3 spot, and next year Huard gets the boot.

jspchief
09-01-2006, 10:37 AM
On that play the center made the wrong call and the OLine slid the wrong direction. Sampson had to decide who to block and correctly chose the inside rusher. I don't think that would happen with Weigman making the line calls.We're not talking about the same play then.

Sampson never touched anyone. He just stood there waiting for someone to run at him. The guard picked up whoever was coming inside. Sampson did nothing.

And if he wasn't supposed to pick up that blitzer, who was? There was no one else over there. Or are trying to tell me that sometimes the tackles are supposed to give LBs a free run at the QB?

Chief Faithful
09-01-2006, 11:08 AM
Sampson didn't even touch anyone on the play I'm talking about. He was watching for a guy coming inside, and I don't think he ever even saw the guy he should have blocked.

If you are talking about the one where the LB smoked Croyle and got called for a helmet to helmet hit? On that one Sampson one-on-one blocked the inside rusher such that the rusher never got past the line of scrimmage. On that play the whole line slid the wrong direction making it a bad call from Neiswinger (sp?).

Chief Faithful
09-01-2006, 11:10 AM
We're not talking about the same play then.

Sampson never touched anyone. He just stood there waiting for someone to run at him. The guard picked up whoever was coming inside. Sampson did nothing.

And if he wasn't supposed to pick up that blitzer, who was? There was no one else over there. Or are trying to tell me that sometimes the tackles are supposed to give LBs a free run at the QB?

I'm not Sampson's defender and I'm disappointed in his preseason performance. In my mind Svitek should get the RT job.

jspchief
09-01-2006, 12:56 PM
If you are talking about the one where the LB smoked Croyle and got called for a helmet to helmet hit? On that one Sampson one-on-one blocked the inside rusher such that the rusher never got past the line of scrimmage. On that play the whole line slid the wrong direction making it a bad call from Neiswinger (sp?).The reason the line "slid" in the direction it did is because it was a play-action fake to that side. They have to sell the fake every bit as much as the RB and QB do.

I went back and watched to make sure I'm noy crazy. Sampson actually did touch someone. He let the first LB run right past him but did get a hand on the next guy about the time Croyle's head was bouncing off the turf.

I'd like to hear the theory on letting the first guy go. How would it be the right thing to do to let the lead guy go untouched?

Like I said in my previous post, Sampson was the only guy there to stop that first LB. My guess is he thought he had RB/FB help, but considering the play-action to other side, he should have known better.

Coogs
09-01-2006, 01:19 PM
I really like Croyle. He is the first QOTF the Chiefs have drafted since Mike Livingston that I like, but he is not ready for #2. Huard is the only legit #2 at this time.

I hope Printers makes the PS, Croyle takes the #3 spot, and next year Huard gets the boot.

Are you sure? Give Croyle the #1 line, LJ, Gonzo, Kennison, Parker, and either Dunn or Cruz, and I think he is fine. Could probably QB as well as Rothlisberger stat wise his rookie year, but maybe not record wise.

Plus, he would be getting all the back-up snaps in practice, which would speed his development in mastering our offense, instead of running the opponents offense in practice.

Mr. Laz
09-01-2006, 01:28 PM
Are you sure? Give Croyle the #1 line, LJ, Gonzo, Kennison, Parker, and either Dunn or Cruz, and I think he is fine. Could probably QB as well as Rothlisberger stat wise his rookie year, but maybe not record wise.

Plus, he would be getting all the back-up snaps in practice, which would speed his development in mastering our offense, instead of running the opponents offense in practice.

agreed ...

Huard and Croyle had almost exactly the same numbers last night.

Name _ C/A YRD TD INT
D. Huard 6/9 66 00 00
B. Croyle 5/9 55 00 01

the interception wasn't Croyle's fault ... it went right through Webb's hands. If Webbs makes that catch(he should have) then Croyle's numbers are better.


if a rookie and veteran are even close to the same then you go with the rookie because the extra snaps will help them them most.


by mid-season, Croyle is better than Huard.

Chief Faithful
09-01-2006, 01:57 PM
Are you sure? Give Croyle the #1 line, LJ, Gonzo, Kennison, Parker, and either Dunn or Cruz, and I think he is fine. Could probably QB as well as Rothlisberger stat wise his rookie year, but maybe not record wise.

Plus, he would be getting all the back-up snaps in practice, which would speed his development in mastering our offense, instead of running the opponents offense in practice.

Against the Rams he was totally swimming with a vanilla offense against a vanilla defense although he still looked better than Printers. Against New Orleans Croyle looked much more confident, but everything was still vanilla. Every QB in this offense has stated it takes a couple years to evolve into the position. I'm sure he needs more time to get comfortable.

Rothlisberger is unique, that offense in Pittsburgh is much less complicated, and he didn't start until game 4 his rookie year. Plus, I don't think Croyle is physically or mentally as prepared for the NFL as Rothlisberger was his rookie year.

Chief Faithful
09-01-2006, 01:58 PM
agreed ...


by mid-season, Croyle is better than Huard.

That I can agree with, but I don't think he is ready to replace Huard today.

Mr. Laz
09-01-2006, 02:00 PM
That I can agree with, but I don't think he is ready to replace Huard today.
and he won't be ready at any point this year unless we actually commit to the guy.

put him at #2 and get him the reps imo

alpha_omega
09-01-2006, 02:02 PM
... Turley ... Could end up being the comeback player of the year.

I hope so! If you are right, we are in for good things.

Mr. Laz
09-01-2006, 02:02 PM
On that play the center made the wrong call and the OLine slid the wrong direction. Sampson had to decide who to block and correctly chose the inside rusher. I don't think that would happen with Weigman making the line calls.
except for the fact that the outside guy was 2 full steps ahead of the inside guy.

he didn't even seem to notice him ... it's like he thought there was a back or tightend out there.

Chief Faithful
09-01-2006, 02:06 PM
The reason the line "slid" in the direction it did is because it was a play-action fake to that side. They have to sell the fake every bit as much as the RB and QB do.

I went back and watched to make sure I'm noy crazy. Sampson actually did touch someone. He let the first LB run right past him but did get a hand on the next guy about the time Croyle's head was bouncing off the turf.

I'd like to hear the theory on letting the first guy go. How would it be the right thing to do to let the lead guy go untouched?

Like I said in my previous post, Sampson was the only guy there to stop that first LB. My guess is he thought he had RB/FB help, but considering the play-action to other side, he should have known better.

I don't have the benefit of a tape, but I remember two guys rushing and when in that situation you have to take the inside guy. I don't think Sampson gets put in that situation with Wiegman and Shields in the line-up. First Wiegman knows how to call the line plays and Shields will at least recognize the situation and make an adjustment to help. Nieswanger and Black didn't make adjustments to help eventhough the overload rush was obvious.

ChiefsCountry
09-01-2006, 02:08 PM
What impressed me was that hit that Croyle took he went into the pile and got the football. Not the smartest play for a QB but its that same type of no fear toughness that Green shows.

Chief Faithful
09-01-2006, 02:15 PM
except for the fact that the outside guy was 2 full steps ahead of the inside guy.

he didn't even seem to notice him ... it's like he thought there was a back or tightend out there.

That is where Shields helps over Black. Black doesn't even notice the overload where I believe Shields would have adjusted. Sampson could then have slide out to take the outside guy. We have seen Shields do that a hundred times where he has a hand on two guys at once. Film study and game planning also help make correct adjustments, which there was none for this game.

It was a defensive stunt and the whole line did not adjust. If Sampson does take the outside guy then the inside guy has a lane and shorter distance. Take the outside guy and the inside guy burns you, take the inside guy and the outside guy gets you. Sampson was on an island with no help. There are plenty of other plays that show Sampson's weaknesses I just don't think this was one of them.

Coogs
09-01-2006, 02:17 PM
Against the Rams he was totally swimming with a vanilla offense against a vanilla defense although he still looked better than Printers.

I'd hate to say he was totally swimming against the Rams. He looked fine on his first drive. If Webb gets his feet down inbounds on the first drive, who knows.... maybe a TD drive.

After the half, it was nearly all hand offs on first and second down, and the third and long with no pass protection was brutal for Croyle. Still, he laid a couple of balls right in there that could have been caught.

Chief Faithful
09-01-2006, 02:18 PM
What impressed me was that hit that Croyle took he went into the pile and got the football. Not the smartest play for a QB but its that same type of no fear toughness that Green shows.

I see a lot of Green's attributes in Croyle.

Coogs
09-01-2006, 02:21 PM
I see a lot of Green's attributes in Croyle.

Plus, Croyle looks to have a stronger arm.

Chief Faithful
09-01-2006, 02:22 PM
I'd hate to say he was totally swimming against the Rams. He looked fine on his first drive. If Webb gets his feet down inbounds on the first drive, who knows.... maybe a TD drive.

After the half, it was nearly all hand offs on first and second down, and the third and long with no pass protection was brutal for Croyle. Still, he laid a couple of balls right in there that could have been caught.

Even when he was swimming against the Rams I was impressed by his poise. I really believe Croyle is for real. Printers by comparison has maybe more tools, but completely dissolved against the Giants.

Someday Croyle will be a good #1 and Printers may become a solid #2.

Chief Faithful
09-01-2006, 02:25 PM
Plus, Croyle looks to have a stronger arm.

He hasn't displayed it much yet, which I believe is an indication of confidence lacking. A little more time in the offense his confidence will grow and we will see more of that strong arm.

Mr. Laz
09-01-2006, 02:25 PM
Plus, Croyle looks to have a stronger arm.
he does ...


he's younger,faster,stronger arm and LOOKS to have many of the intangibles as Green.


no QB is a sure thing ..... but if Croyle can put on some weight and stay healthy he has great chance to make it imo.

Mecca
09-01-2006, 02:26 PM
Plus, Croyle looks to have a stronger arm.

By quite a bit.....Green doesn't exactly have a rocket back there.

Coogs
09-01-2006, 02:27 PM
He hasn't displayed it much yet, which I believe is an indication of confidence lacking. A little more time in the offense his confidence will grow and we will see more of that strong arm.

I thought he did last night. He zipped some balls out to the receivers. Huard didn't show that at all.