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View Full Version : Guys who should be warming the bench or looking for a new job....


Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 04:08 PM
After taking an hour to kick the dog.....let the wife hit me with a frying pan, and doing a little workout to get out my aggressions, I have the following to submit...

These are the guys who really looked lost or just plain pathetic in the game today:

1) Jordan Black- This guy couldn't block my skinny wife. If she lined up against Black, she'd have 3 sacks and 10 QB hurries.

2) Damon Huard- When he came in to play, he alone was a momentum killer. He looked lost, unprepared, and not at all like a #2 QB should be looking like. I say we jettison this guy, add Volek and let he and Croyle fight it out. Better yet, just go with Croyle until Trent can return safely.

3) Dante Hall- Sorry guys, I have lost all faith in this man. He looks tentative on his Punt and KO returns....does too much juking and jiving. His play is so erratic that you cannot depend on him anymore.

4) Mike Solari- His playcalling today left most observers of the game scratching their heads. If this is what we can expect from him, we need a change in coaches quick.

Let me know your thoughts....

mmaddog
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Count Alex's Wins
09-10-2006, 04:12 PM
Eric Hicks. He was manning the LDE spot on Rudi's long TD.

Dave Lane
09-10-2006, 04:16 PM
Herm Edwards...

Dave

Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 04:17 PM
Eric Hicks. He was manning the LDE spot on Rudi's long TD.

Wow..I missed that...I didn't think that he had gotten on the field all day.

Another guy who shouldn't even be on the team to begin with.

mmaddog
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hawkchief
09-10-2006, 04:17 PM
Eric Hicks. He was manning the LDE spot on Rudi's long TD.

Carl Peterson. Looks like a new low this season.

Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 04:18 PM
Herm Edwards...

Dave

After listening to bits and pieces of his Post game conference I would agree....

mmaddog
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trndobrd
09-10-2006, 04:18 PM
Eric Hicks. He was manning the LDE spot on Rudi's long TD.


Sky is blue, water is wet.


I am not as excited about Dante as a kick returner, but he did a solid job receiving today.

Solari doesn't know that on 3rd down in the red zone the correct call is Green to Gonzales under the right goalpost.

Calcountry
09-10-2006, 04:19 PM
Lamar Hunt.

Its time he fire Carl or sell the team.

Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 04:20 PM
Carl Peterson. Looks like a new low this season.

Sorry...but Carl isn't the guy to blame on this game.

mmaddog
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Otter
09-10-2006, 04:21 PM
2) Damon Huard- When he came in to play, he alone was a momentum killer. He looked lost, unprepared, and not at all like a #2 QB should be looking like. I say we jettison this guy, add Volek and let he and Croyle fight it out. Better yet, just go with Croyle until Trent can return safely.

I actually thought Huard looked OK (notice, OK, not great) once he got settled in. I think he deserves a couple plays to get into the swing of things.

He stepped into a petty racious situation.

Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 04:22 PM
Lamar Hunt.

Its time he fire Carl or sell the team.

I'll disagree with this one also..

mmaddog
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Simplex3
09-10-2006, 04:23 PM
Carl might not be asked back if the stadium quits selling out. If they keep looking like this that could happen this year.

PunkinDrublic
09-10-2006, 04:23 PM
I don't know what you could have expected from Huard, the guy hasn't played a snap since 2000. He pretty much looked like a guy who hasn't been playing with the first team much but that's what happens when a backup comes in more often then not. Sure we all remember the games where someone comes off the bench and plays spectacular but most of the time guys fumble the ball and the overall timing isn't there (not to mention OL protection. I think while Trent's out, once Huard gets used to working with the first team things will get better.

Deberg_1990
09-10-2006, 04:26 PM
I am not as excited about Dante as a kick returner, but he did a solid job receiving today.

.


I actually suggested earlier in te preseaason that they make him a WR full time and have someone else returns kicks. Might not be too bad of an idea now.....

Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 04:26 PM
I actually thought Huard looked OK (notice, OK, not great) once he got settled in. I think he deserves a couple plays to get into the swing of things.

He stepped into a petty racious situation.

I'm more concerned about his inability to protect the ball in tight confines....he fumbled the ball twice at very crucial times of the game. Plus, to me he looked no better that what a rookie like Croyle would look like thrown into the game in the same situation.

mmaddog
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Ugly Duck
09-10-2006, 04:26 PM
Damon Huard He looked lost, unprepared, and not at all like a #2 QB should be looking like. I say we jettison this guyYa know... til Trent gets back.... there are some other QBs out there that might make a better #2....

http://www.deadspin.com/assets/resources/2006/08/jeffgeorgebaby.jpg

ck_IN
09-10-2006, 04:28 PM
Any thoughts on Sims? I saw him twice, both times making big celebrations after plays that he took no part in.

Cochise
09-10-2006, 04:29 PM
I saw Hicks come onto the field right before that TD toward the tunnel. I thought to myself, "self, if I were them I would be running right" and who knew, they ran right and scored.

I thought Wesley looked really bad on several plays.

There was so much pressure it was hard to even tell where it was coming from.

Green needs to stay where he is, resting up somewhere, until we get these godawful offensive line issues ironed out.

No clue why we were so afraid to run the ball, but that might just be me seeing what didn't work and automatically wanting the other thing.

Samie Parker is a complete scrub.

That is all.

Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 04:30 PM
I don't know what you could have expected from Huard, the guy hasn't played a snap since 2000. He pretty much looked like a guy who hasn't been playing with the first team much but that's what happens when a backup comes in more often then not. Sure we all remember the games where someone comes off the bench and plays spectacular but most of the time guys fumble the ball and the overall timing isn't there (not to mention OL protection. I think while Trent's out, once Huard gets used to working with the first team things will get better.

I disagree....the backup QB doesn't always fumble the ball and their timing just takes a few plays to get into sync. The job of the #2 QB is to be ready at a moments notice....and Huard wasn't.

Did I expect him to be as good as Trent? No....but I didn't expect him to look like Printers did during the pre-season.

mmaddog
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Deberg_1990
09-10-2006, 04:31 PM
.

I thought Wesley looked really bad on several plays.



Wesley was out of position once again on RJ's TD run.

Cochise
09-10-2006, 04:34 PM
Wesley was out of position once again on RJ's TD run.

I don't know a ton about the new defense, but he seems really slow to make the exchange between the lower zone and the deeper one where he's working. He has a penchant for getting himself blocked in amazing ways on running plays too.

Count Alex's Wins
09-10-2006, 04:34 PM
Huard looked good when he actually got a pass off.

morphius
09-10-2006, 04:35 PM
Until someone on ST learns to block Dante is going to look iffy and will be jumping back and forth all the time because he has to. The fumble was pathetic though. I have said this 1000 times, if he has to make 3 people miss right off the bat, he isn't going to look good, and neither is anyone else. I said that the year before he took off, and it hasn't changed yet.

Huard should have never been on the team, period.

Black, leave the guy at guard, he is not, and will not be a good tackle, but is a good guard, unlike Bober was.

Hicks makes my list with GoChiefs info.

PunkinDrublic
09-10-2006, 04:37 PM
I disagree....the backup QB doesn't always fumble the ball and their timing just takes a few plays to get into sync. The job of the #2 QB is to be ready at a moments notice....and Huard wasn't.

Did I expect him to be as good as Trent? No....but I didn't expect him to look like Printers did during the pre-season.

mmaddog
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He didn't look as bad as Printers that's a bit of a stretch. I agree he needs to work on holding on to the ball but that's correctable. He had some solid throws and I thought that was an awesome throw to Gonzo on the TD pass. It'll get better once he starts working more with the offense.

Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 04:38 PM
Huard looked good when he actually got a pass off.

That's like saying Hicks looks good when they don't run or pass in his direction.

mmaddog
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Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 04:40 PM
He didn't look as bad as Printers that's a bit of a stretch. I agree he needs to work on holding on to the ball but that's correctable. He had some solid throws and I thought that was an awesome throw to Gonzo on the TD pass. It'll get better once he starts working more with the offense.

OK...the Printers reference might have been a stretch. But so is saying that the throw to Gonzo was awesome....you can chalk that one up to Gonzo's abilities, not Huards.

I don't believe that working with the 1st Unit is going to help him..that's just my opinion.

mmaddog
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Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 04:46 PM
Until someone on ST learns to block Dante is going to look iffy and will be jumping back and forth all the time because he has to. The fumble was pathetic though. I have said this 1000 times, if he has to make 3 people miss right off the bat, he isn't going to look good, and neither is anyone else. I said that the year before he took off, and it hasn't changed yet..

My concern with Dante is 2-fold:

1) He spends too much time going horizontally on the Kick Returns...when he has been successful, it was because he turned on the burners and went vertical.

2) He has looked at his own highlight reels and thinks he has to do it with all the facy moves. That may work on the quick hitters on Offense and in punt returns, but is not the way to do it on Kickoffs.

mmaddog
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Frankie
09-10-2006, 05:01 PM
These are the guys who really looked lost or just plain pathetic in the game today:



1) Jordan Black- This guy couldn't block my skinny wife.
He did. But you were out.
(Sorry mmaddog. Just joking. But you left the door wide open!)


2) Damon Huard- When he came in to play, he alone was a momentum killer. He looked lost, unprepared, and not at all like a #2 QB should be looking like. I say we jettison this guy, add Volek and let he and Croyle fight it out. Better yet, just go with Croyle until Trent can return safely.
I'm no Huard fan. But I have to be fair. He came in in very difficult circumstances (both emotionally and weatherwise). His play did pick up some later. How many snaps do you think he got in practice last week? He'll get most of them this week and if he still stinks next week I'll agree with you.


3) Dante Hall- Sorry guys, I have lost all faith in this man. He looks tentative on his Punt and KO returns....does too much juking and jiving. His play is so erratic that you cannot depend on him anymore.
My bigger question is why he was in the 'O' plans so much? I'm still hoping his returns will improve with a better ST scheme and less participation in the 'O.'


4) Mike Solari- His playcalling today left most observers of the game scratching their heads. If this is what we can expect from him, we need a change in coaches quick.
Even good OCs call a couple of bonehead plays every game. The jury is still out on Solari. Altogether I thought he called an OK game.

htismaqe
09-10-2006, 05:16 PM
Any thoughts on Sims? I saw him twice, both times making big celebrations after plays that he took no part in.

I saw him pounding the ground once in celebration, but he was in on that play. Actually made a nice move to get to the ball carrier.

htismaqe
09-10-2006, 05:16 PM
Mike Solari DID NOT call a bad game.

tk13
09-10-2006, 05:22 PM
Black is terrible. Absolutely horrendous. We could stick a wooden post out there at RT and save the salary cap space.

Huard needs to learn to protect the ball, but otherwise I was actually surprised, he was slinging it around out there. It'll be interesting to see how he looks settled down after a week of practice. We have to protect him though. I'm not sure I want Croyle anywhere near the field while Black is out there. Our protection was embarrassing.

Did Kendrell Bell do anything of note today? He might have and I just missed it.

Count Alex's Wins
09-10-2006, 05:23 PM
Bell was invisible, as usual.

Start Fox.

Frankie
09-10-2006, 05:28 PM
Huard needs to learn to protect the ball, but otherwise I was actually surprised, he was slinging it around out there. It'll be interesting to see how he looks settled down after a week of practice. We have to protect him though.

I agree.

I'm not sure I want Croyle anywhere near the field while Black is out there.
As much as I can't wait for Croyle to develope into our future QB I totally agree with this statement. The boy needs a few more heft on him and a good RT. Otherwise he'll be taken out on a stretcher too.

Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 05:50 PM
Mike Solari DID NOT call a bad game.

We'll agree to disagree.....

1) Running the ball on 3rd & 5.....that should have been a different play.

2) We got away from LJ too early in the game for my taste....

3) Why didn't we run a "no-huddle" offense a couple of series?

These things leave me wondering if Solari was having first game jitters.

mmaddog
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Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 05:55 PM
I'm no Huard fan. But I have to be fair. He came in in very difficult circumstances (both emotionally and weatherwise). His play did pick up some later. How many snaps do you think he got in practice last week? He'll get most of them this week and if he still stinks next week I'll agree with you..

Fair was the grade for his performance....the only reason he doesn't get a failing grade was because of the reasons you note. But honestly those are only excuses....how many times have we seen the #2 QB come into the game against the Chiefs (even before our D sucked) and play an excellent game.

Sorry...I'm not one of those that will cut him some slack. He's paid good money to be ready....and he wasn't.

mmaddog
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dirk digler
09-10-2006, 05:59 PM
We'll agree to disagree.....

1) Running the ball on 3rd & 5.....that should have been a different play.

2) We got away from LJ too early in the game for my taste....

3) Why didn't we run a "no-huddle" offense a couple of series?

These things leave me wondering if Solari was having first game jitters.

mmaddog
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Yep.

If our O-Line is this bad maybe we should go shotgun alot more

htismaqe
09-10-2006, 06:02 PM
We'll agree to disagree.....

1) Running the ball on 3rd & 5.....that should have been a different play.

2) We got away from LJ too early in the game for my taste....

3) Why didn't we run a "no-huddle" offense a couple of series?

These things leave me wondering if Solari was having first game jitters.

mmaddog
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1) Yep, that was a bad call.

2) What were we supposed to do? We were down 17-3 at halftime. You can't run the ball into 9-man fronts...

3) Why didn't Saunders run the no-huddle? I'm guessing that it's not unique to Solari.

Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 06:08 PM
2) What were we supposed to do? We were down 17-3 at halftime. You can't run the ball into 9-man fronts...

3) Why didn't Saunders run the no-huddle? I'm guessing that it's not unique to Solari.

2) If there were truly 9 man fronts then we should have scored on a pass play....the problem was that every play seemed to be a pass play. I just think LJ should have gotten more touches. And 17-3 at halftime is not a time to start panicking...especially at home.

3) I bitched at Saunders last year for not having a "no-huddle" offense a couple of times... I was hoping that Solari would be different.

mmaddog
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Bowser
09-10-2006, 06:20 PM
You're a quality poster mmaddog, but you're drunk if you think we should get rid of Dante.

Dante has suffered on his returns because Derrick Blaylock, Monty Beisel, Marc Boerigter, and Donald Willis were absolute beasts blocking for him. We've got nobody that opens lanes up for him like those guys did.

We have not fielded a decent return unit since 2003.

GoHuge
09-10-2006, 06:55 PM
Mike Solari DID NOT call a bad game.How can you say Solari didn't call a bad game? So what he called a good one? He gave LJ the ball 9 times in the first half. 9! His line was shit and with every pass he called he put his team in a bad position with (7)sacks, fumbles, or wasted downs. This happened because they didn't have to load the box because we weren't running and our line was like running through paper. Their only scoring drive besides the meaningless one in the fourth was when he gave Johnson the ball seven times and mixed in some passes to Gonzalez and Kennison. That was the only balanced drive he called the whole game.

He was calling the game like Cincy was up by 28 the entire time.
KC ran the ball 25 times and passed 35. There would have been over 40 pass attempts had the QB not got sacked or had to take off to keep from getting killed so that upped the rushing numbers. Only 17 where to LJ. That's not balanced offense. The passing game wasn't there and he just kept plugging away!! Mean while LJ who is good for at least a 100 if you give him the ball didn't get the chance, and our QB left the game on a stretcher. The drive that Trent went out Solari called five passes and one run. The run went for 8 yeards. Three of the pass attempts Trent had to take off because the pocket collapsed. Solari watched Trent run for his life on the two previous pass plays he called because the O-line sucked. Maybe Solari just figured hey where moving the ball with Trent running it after the pocket collapses so I'll just call it again! Well sure enough one play later 36 year old Trent Green had to run it again after the pocket collapsed and made positive yards. Good thing his X-Rays where negative. Great play calling!


Here's a link to the play by play if you want to see for yourself. Apparently your eyes decieved you:

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/playbyplay?gameId=20060910012

Cochise
09-10-2006, 07:03 PM
Solari did not call a bad game. We had one play where we were more conservative than normal. Other than that, we were throwing the ball, which most people were have said this morning that they were afraid we wouldn't throw the ball.

Not that it matters, but when the team loses, nobody is going to like the play calling. If the offensive line had executed and we'd won, nobody would be saying anything.

The offensive coordinator is as popular as the weatherman.

dirk digler
09-10-2006, 07:06 PM
Solari did not call a bad game. We had one play where we were more conservative than normal. Other than that, we were throwing the ball, which most people were have said this morning that they were afraid we wouldn't throw the ball.

Not that it matters, but when the team loses, nobody is going to like the play calling. If the offensive line had executed and we'd won, nobody would be saying anything.

The offensive coordinator is as popular as the weatherman.

I think we need to start using alot more play-action to slow the pass rush since our O-Line is sucking.

Cochise
09-10-2006, 07:12 PM
I think we need to start using alot more play-action to slow the pass rush since our O-Line is sucking.

I almost complained that they didn't make seem to make adjustments, but heck... how do you adjust to defenders flying at the quarterback like their blockers are 3 apples high?

GoHuge
09-10-2006, 07:18 PM
I think we need to start using alot more play-action to slow the pass rush since our O-Line is sucking.Yeah that is a great idea but you have to establish the run before you can sell them on playaction. We never tried to establish the run. We just tried to throw it. throw it, throw it.

morphius
09-10-2006, 07:19 PM
I think we need to start using alot more play-action to slow the pass rush since our O-Line is sucking.
they ignored the play action on several plays and went straight for green completely ignoring the fake handoff.

milkman
09-10-2006, 07:21 PM
Solari did not call a bad game. We had one play where we were more conservative than normal. Other than that, we were throwing the ball, which most people were have said this morning that they were afraid we wouldn't throw the ball.

Not that it matters, but when the team loses, nobody is going to like the play calling. If the offensive line had executed and we'd won, nobody would be saying anything.

The offensive coordinator is as popular as the weatherman.

People are complaining about the lack of balance.

No one wants to see the pasing game shelved, but neither do we want to see the ground game shelved, especially with LJ.

After that FG scoring drive, Solari lost that balance.

Mosbonian
09-10-2006, 07:23 PM
You're a quality poster mmaddog, but you're drunk if you think we should get rid of Dante.

Dante has suffered on his returns because Derrick Blaylock, Monty Beisel, Marc Boerigter, and Donald Willis were absolute beasts blocking for him. We've got nobody that opens lanes up for him like those guys did.

We have not fielded a decent return unit since 2003.

While I agree that we no longer have good Special Team blocking, that isn't all the reason for Dante's decline. And I am not advocating releasing him...I think he needs a little time on the bench when it comes to Punt and Kickoff returns.

Dante's problem is that he still thinks he has to be the human highlight reel...what he needs to do is run the f'ing ball to the first hole he finds and keep going as fast as he can. They teach you from HS on that some you will return and some you will not...but it's the yardage you gain that makes you valuable to the Offense.

Once Dante remembers he is only as good as the positive yards that he generates, then he will be the threat he once was. A little time on the bench might help him to see that.

mmaddog
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Frankie
09-11-2006, 09:45 AM
Yep.

If our O-Line is this bad maybe we should go shotgun alot more
Our O-line is bad in a large part because the guy who was brought in to play RT has to play for the LT who f***ed us up by his sudden unexpected retirement. What's there to do, short of overpaying for a RT in a trade and wish we didn't, come draft time.

BigChiefFan
09-11-2006, 09:59 AM
While I agree that we no longer have good Special Team blocking, that isn't all the reason for Dante's decline. And I am not advocating releasing him...I think he needs a little time on the bench when it comes to Punt and Kickoff returns.

Dante's problem is that he still thinks he has to be the human highlight reel...what he needs to do is run the f'ing ball to the first hole he finds and keep going as fast as he can. They teach you from HS on that some you will return and some you will not...but it's the yardage you gain that makes you valuable to the Offense.

Once Dante remembers he is only as good as the positive yards that he generates, then he will be the threat he once was. A little time on the bench might help him to see that.

mmaddog
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I think that is a fair assessment of Dante Hall. His FUMBLE cost us big yesterday.

htismaqe
09-11-2006, 10:02 AM
they ignored the play action on several plays and went straight for green completely ignoring the fake handoff.

EXACTLY.

I don't know what people around here expect.

One minute it's that Herm is going to kill the offense with his conservatism. The next it's that Herm isn't conservative enough.

It's quite simple:

Jordan Black sucks. Go ahead and continue to blame the coaches...

PastorMikH
09-11-2006, 10:05 AM
Speaking of banchwarmers, I thought Hicks did an excellent job yesterday warming the bench - most he's ever helped the team on a Sunday.

ChiTown
09-11-2006, 10:07 AM
This is all about the shabby OL play, especially the OT's. Our error came in the last 4 years by not creating any REAL competition along the OL. Offensively, we have lived heavily off of the great OL play we had. Now, we are dying because we have had no one who can step in and fill the vacancies. It's actually pretty simple - DAMNIT, CARL :cuss:

jidar
09-11-2006, 10:08 AM
Uh.. other than the miffed punt (which is huge) what did Dante do wrong yesterday? He had a pretty good game.
So I ask, why are we debating his running skills? He had some decent returns in there.

Mosbonian
09-11-2006, 11:55 PM
Uh.. other than the miffed punt (which is huge) what did Dante do wrong yesterday? He had a pretty good game.
So I ask, why are we debating his running skills? He had some decent returns in there.

The "muffed" punt was his first and biggest mistake of the game...

He had a couple of good receptions on offense, but his real value to KC is on KR and Punt Returns....and he did nothing there. (4 returns for 87 yards on KO returns....I think he had negative yards on Punt returns)

We are debating his running skills because they have diminished....partly due to having no skilled Special Team blocking, partly due to the fact that he spends too much time running horizontally.

mmaddog
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Mecca
09-11-2006, 11:58 PM
Dante did 3 really stupid things in that game......I know everyone loves him but the fact is most return men don't have long lives in the league and he's smaller than the usual player. I don't know if he's hurt and not wanting to get hit or just not the same guy anymore but frankly he isn't the same guy.

Bottom line if you can't hang onto the ball and be smart about returns you shouldn't be doing it. Even the best return men don't run them back often but doing something on a return can cost you a game...