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View Full Version : I think I'll buy a HDTV tomorrow. Any advice?


runnercyclist
09-15-2006, 06:29 PM
I have Directv because I live in Pittsburgh and must see my Chiefs each week. So I think I just need a monitor.

Smed1065
09-15-2006, 06:33 PM
Depends on quality of pic preferred, size, money and room set-up.

WE need more specifics other than HDTV, If you want decent advice.

IMO

Mr. Laz
09-15-2006, 06:35 PM
I have Directv because I live in Pittsburgh and must see my Chiefs each week. So I think I just need a monitor.
monitor = television i assume...

btw - with Directv you need an HD dish and HD box to go with your HD television.

i think to get local channels in HD you also need an HD antennae.


just fyi - some VCR's etc don't have the right connections for HD so you're gonna have to connect the HD and non HD stuff to the TV by completely different methods.

Frazod
09-15-2006, 06:36 PM
Make sure you find out about getting local channels in HD. If you want a DVR, check to see if they have an HD dish that will pick up your local channels (probably not yet). If not, you'll need to get an indoor UHF antenna to pick up local channels. In this event, you won't be able to pick up low numbered channels like 2 or 3. If your CBS affiliate is on one of these low channels, and a game you want to watch is being broadcast on that channel, the DTV HD channel will be blocked, and you'll be shit out of luck.

And count on the customer service retard to mention NONE OF THIS.

runnercyclist
09-15-2006, 06:39 PM
Depends on quality of pic preferred, size, money and room set-up.

WE need more specifics other than HDTV, If you want decent advice.

IMO

I have a budget of $5K. Not bigger that 40"ish and a semi small tv room.

runnercyclist
09-15-2006, 06:41 PM
monitor = television i assume...

btw - with Directv you need an HD dish and HD box to go with your HD television.

i think to get local channels in HD you also need an HD antennae.


just fyi - some VCR's etc don't have the right connections for HD so you're gonna have to connect the HD and non HD stuff to the TV by completely different methods.


So I assume I'll need to call Directv to get the dish and box. I must continue to have tivo. I assume they have a box that includes Tivo. I don't have/use a VCR or DVD player.

CinciFan
09-15-2006, 06:57 PM
I have a budget of $5K. Not bigger that 40"ish and a semi small tv room.

Maximum size = 40% of viewing distance.

So, for a 10 ft viewing distance (eyeball to screen distance), a 48" screen is IDEAL. Do NOT go bigger.

Pros/Cons:

Tube: best picture, especially dark scenes.
Plasma: brightest picture, fast response time, thin. Brightness fades irrecovably over time.
LCD/Flat panel LCD: great for movies and other 1080i content. Long life/simple. Easy to replace bulb. Too slow response time and wrong resolution for most fast sports (football/tennis . . . ).
DLP: Good picture, best for sports (ideal 720p resolution), fast response. Easy to replace bulb, but does have more complex mechanicals (color wheel, mirrors, and a bulb). Not good for extreme viewing angles - best more-or-less straight on.

I have a Mitsubishi 62" DLP (62725).

chiefscraze
09-15-2006, 07:19 PM
You will need a VHF antenna and may need an outdoor roof antenna or attic antenna to receive ALL local HD channels off air. You might check with Direct TV, but they are broadcasting some local channels in HD over their network. You will need a triple LNB dish to recieve any HD programming and if you want the local channels I was told that you will need the new 5 LNB dish.

FYI I told direct TV I wanted to cancel my service since I was no longer under contract and dish network said they would give me a free HD DVR. The cancellation person caved in and offered me one for free in the end. Otherwise they cost $400.00.

Skip Towne
09-15-2006, 07:22 PM
Make sure you find out about getting local channels in HD. If you want a DVR, check to see if they have an HD dish that will pick up your local channels (probably not yet). If not, you'll need to get an indoor UHF antenna to pick up local channels. In this event, you won't be able to pick up low numbered channels like 2 or 3. If your CBS affiliate is on one of these low channels, and a game you want to watch is being broadcast on that channel, the DTV HD channel will be blocked, and you'll be shit out of luck.

And count on the customer service retard to mention NONE OF THIS.
Did the guy who sold you the TV tell you ANY OF THIS?

Skip Towne
09-15-2006, 07:26 PM
You will need a VHF antenna and may need an outdoor roof antenna or attic antenna to receive ALL local HD channels off air. You might check with Direct TV, but they are broadcasting some local channels in HD over their network. You will need a triple LNB dish to recieve any HD programming and if you want the local channels I was told that you will need the new 5 LNB dish.

FYI I told direct TV I wanted to cancel my service since I was no longer under contract and dish network said they would give me a free HD DVR. The cancellation person caved in and offered me one for free in the end. Otherwise they cost $400.00.
That is funny because a federal judge has ordered Dish Notwork to turn off programming to their DVR's since they are using stolen technology to operate it. Oh, well, I guess you could have looked at it sitting there dead on your shelf.

Bwana
09-15-2006, 07:35 PM
Go BIG

ragedogg69
09-15-2006, 07:41 PM
Mits has a 65" 1080p DLP for about $3500 i saw. The best bang for your buck i have seen.

Your best bet is to get the older HD DirecTivo from D*. They are giving these things away. (literally) The new 5 LNB and new D* HD DVR is useless unless you can receive local HD channels off the satellite. (few can)

Stick with an HD tivo and 3 LNB dish from directv and a UHF antenna and youll be all set for HD. Hell you can even run the antenna signal and the satellite signal ont eh same cable with a diplexer.

ExtremeChief
09-15-2006, 07:45 PM
That is funny because a federal judge has ordered Dish Notwork to turn off programming to their DVR's since they are using stolen technology to operate it. Oh, well, I guess you could have looked at it sitting there dead on your shelf.

not so fast Echostar hater...


A federal appeals court on Friday blocked a lower-court ruling that would have forced satellite television provider EchoStar Communications to stop selling many of its digital video recorders, EchoStar said Friday.



http://news.com.com/Judge+to+EchoStar+Disable+your+DVRs/2100-1030_3-6107123.html

ExtremeChief
09-15-2006, 07:48 PM
On the thread topic, I just bought this:


http://www.plasmahouse.com/mmplasmahouse/Images/HPS4253-L.JPG


http://www.plasmahouse.com/SAMSUNG-HP-S4253-PLASMA-TV/HPS4253.HTML


Niiiiicce picture and lotsa features

Skip Towne
09-15-2006, 07:51 PM
not so fast Echostar hater...


A federal appeals court on Friday blocked a lower-court ruling that would have forced satellite television provider EchoStar Communications to stop selling many of its digital video recorders, EchoStar said Friday.



http://news.com.com/Judge+to+EchoStar+Disable+your+DVRs/2100-1030_3-6107123.html
Yes, they got what amounts to an automatic 30 day stay to review it. But Dish Notwork lost the first round. They need an overturn of an existing order. Would you buy a DVR from them hoping they get a reversal?

ExtremeChief
09-15-2006, 07:53 PM
Yes, they got what amounts to an automatic 30 day stay to review it. But Dish Notwork lost the first round. They need an overturn of an existing order. Would you buy a DVR from them hoping they get a reversal?


Nope, I already own one and am hoping for a reversal. :banghead:


I would think the worst case scenario would be that Charlie has to pay an assload of money to tivo. I really can't see them shutting off over a million receivers.

dtebbe
09-15-2006, 07:53 PM
IMHO there is Sony SXRD and then there is everything else. 50", 55", 60", choose your size.

DT

chiefscraze
09-15-2006, 08:01 PM
That is funny because a federal judge has ordered Dish Notwork to turn off programming to their DVR's since they are using stolen technology to operate it. Oh, well, I guess you could have looked at it sitting there dead on your shelf.

All I know is I received a Direct TV DVR for shipping and handling charges of 19.95. It is capable of 30 hours of HD recording or about 1000 hours of regular programming recording.

Frazod
09-15-2006, 08:12 PM
Did the guy who sold you the TV tell you ANY OF THIS?

Did the guy at Sears tell me that DirecTV would sell me incompatible equipment for viewing basic programming? No, he didn't. But that's awfully big of you to BLAME THE F#CKING TELEVISION.

I don't know what's lamer - their service or your sorry-assed excuses.

:shake:

Fire Me Boy!
09-15-2006, 08:13 PM
Wherever you're going... talk them down. When you're spending $1000 or more EVERYONE will negotiate... even Best Buy and Circuit City. They may not come down in price, but they will always come up in what they'll give you.

dtebbe
09-15-2006, 08:25 PM
All I know is I received a Direct TV DVR for shipping and handling charges of 19.95. It is capable of 30 hours of HD recording or about 1000 hours of regular programming recording.

Best of all they are in the process of rolling out a Tivo software upgrade to the HD boxes, more speed and folders are on thier way! Speed and folders were the only complaints I had about the HD box.

DT

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-15-2006, 08:26 PM
Take notes, cause the professor is in the house:

#1: Never buy a Sony. You are going to pay 40% more for the same quality as other brands. This goes across the board for nearly every electronic device that they manufacture (save their video game systems)

#2: Look forward. Buy an item whose technology wonít be outdated in a few years. By this, I mean whatever television you purchase, it should have multiple HDMI outputs. HDMI is a state of the art A/V interconnect. What makes it all the more advantageous is that current HDTV resolutions only occupy a fraction of the total possible bandwidth that an HDMI cable can carry. Your 360 will never have HDMI outputs, but your upconvert/Hi-def DVD player and PS3 premium definitely will. Make sure that the TV you are looking for has 2 or more component video inputs. This also means that 1080p should be a must for you. You are getting twice the resolution of 1080i, and it will stay secure as the top of the line resolution (for the masses) for a few years. A Must have.

#3 Donít be the douchebag with a TV too big for their room. Circuit City has a rubric for calculating the size of a TV in a given room. You can use it as a helpful tool, but donít look too much into it. A lot of that is based on feel.

#4 Look at the Showroom TVs, but donít sell your soul to how they look there. TVs in the Showroom are set on ďTorchĒ Mode, basically meaning that their brightness is jacked up all the way in order to make them catch the eye of the passer-by. However, if one TV looks significantly better than another head to head, itís a good bet that it is a better television.

#5 Take time to carefully calibrate your TV once you get it home. Itís an art, not a science, and you will often know what looks best.

#6 Look into the drawbacks of each format: Plasmas are nice, but they can suffer from individual gas cell burnout over time, leaving you with dead pixels on your screen. DLPs have the same problem too, although you will see a bright white light instead of a black dot. DLPs will often experience a deterioration in color quality over time if they use a tube and not an LED as the light source. LCDs are pretty damned expensive once you go over 42 inches. Plasmas will dim over time as well, particularly after they are over 2000 hours of age.

#7 Samsung makes balla-ass DLP HDTVs. However, my Hi-Def TV is a Toshiba, and it has the best picture of any rear projection CRT Iíve seen. Itís DLP-quality, without some of the scary aspects of owning a DLP (pixel death).

#8 If you get your TV from BB, get their RewardZone program. It will essentially pay for the cables you need to hook your TV up.

#9 In the words of Chris Jericho, never, eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeever, pay retail for Monster Cables.

#10 My choice for you:

http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-HL-S5087W-1080p-DLP-HDTV/dp/B000F2R5HO/sr=1-8/qid=1157494673/ref=sr_1_8/002-2589500-5299263?ie=UTF8&s=audio-video

Although it might be wise to wait 6 months for the price of 1080 sets to drop, and youíll pay 70 cents on the dollar for what you would now.


ONe more thing, DirecTV just released the H20 DVR which is their NEW high-def DVR that can record hi-def locals (the old H10-250 could not). Combine that with Sunday ticket that you can only get on Direc, and I think you have your choice.

BWillie
09-15-2006, 09:15 PM
Wherever you're going... talk them down. When you're spending $1000 or more EVERYONE will negotiate... even Best Buy and Circuit City. They may not come down in price, but they will always come up in what they'll give you.

I've never understood why people in retail try to sell TV's so much. People at Best Buy don't even get commission..really..why would you care if they buy the most expensive one or not. I've never seen so many people making 8 dollars an hour so motivated to sell TV's in my entire life.

They have a 50'' Plasma Vizio at Sam's for $1899. It is 1080p too I believe. That is what I'm going to buy when I have some money

Skip Towne
09-15-2006, 09:37 PM
Take notes, cause the professor is in the house:

#1: Never buy a Sony. You are going to pay 40% more for the same quality as other brands. This goes across the board for nearly every electronic device that they manufacture (save their video game systems)

#2: Look forward. Buy an item whose technology wonít be outdated in a few years. By this, I mean whatever television you purchase, it should have multiple HDMI outputs. HDMI is a state of the art A/V interconnect. What makes it all the more advantageous is that current HDTV resolutions only occupy a fraction of the total possible bandwidth that an HDMI cable can carry. Your 360 will never have HDMI outputs, but your upconvert/Hi-def DVD player and PS3 premium definitely will. Make sure that the TV you are looking for has 2 or more component video inputs. This also means that 1080p should be a must for you. You are getting twice the resolution of 1080i, and it will stay secure as the top of the line resolution (for the masses) for a few years. A Must have.

#3 Donít be the douchebag with a TV too big for their room. Circuit City has a rubric for calculating the size of a TV in a given room. You can use it as a helpful tool, but donít look too much into it. A lot of that is based on feel.

#4 Look at the Showroom TVs, but donít sell your soul to how they look there. TVs in the Showroom are set on ďTorchĒ Mode, basically meaning that their brightness is jacked up all the way in order to make them catch the eye of the passer-by. However, if one TV looks significantly better than another head to head, itís a good bet that it is a better television.

#5 Take time to carefully calibrate your TV once you get it home. Itís an art, not a science, and you will often know what looks best.

#6 Look into the drawbacks of each format: Plasmas are nice, but they can suffer from individual gas cell burnout over time, leaving you with dead pixels on your screen. DLPs have the same problem too, although you will see a bright white light instead of a black dot. DLPs will often experience a deterioration in color quality over time if they use a tube and not an LED as the light source. LCDs are pretty damned expensive once you go over 42 inches. Plasmas will dim over time as well, particularly after they are over 2000 hours of age.

#7 Samsung makes balla-ass DLP HDTVs. However, my Hi-Def TV is a Toshiba, and it has the best picture of any rear projection CRT Iíve seen. Itís DLP-quality, without some of the scary aspects of owning a DLP (pixel death).

#8 If you get your TV from BB, get their RewardZone program. It will essentially pay for the cables you need to hook your TV up.

#9 In the words of Chris Jericho, never, eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeever, pay retail for Monster Cables.

#10 My choice for you:

http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-HL-S5087W-1080p-DLP-HDTV/dp/B000F2R5HO/sr=1-8/qid=1157494673/ref=sr_1_8/002-2589500-5299263?ie=UTF8&s=audio-video

Although it might be wise to wait 6 months for the price of 1080 sets to drop, and youíll pay 70 cents on the dollar for what you would now.


ONe more thing, DirecTV just released the H20 DVR which is their NEW high-def DVR that can record hi-def locals (the old H10-250 could not). Combine that with Sunday ticket that you can only get on Direc, and I think you have your choice.
I am only going to address #1. I didn't read the rest. Sony makes pretty good stuff but they refuse to adhere to industry standards. They think their way is the only way. Consider Directv and Dish Notwork are mortal enemies yet they both agree that the mounting pole should be 1 and 5/8 inches OD. Sony, brilliantly thought 1 and 1/2 ID would be better. They were wrong. If you owned one of those Sony pukes and your LNB went out you had to change the whole pole, dish, LNB assembly at a cost of about $180. Cost otherwise would be the price of the LNB.......about $30. Another famous Sony f*ck up was the Beta Video Recorder. It used much bigger cartridges that were not compatible with VHS. Lost their ass and all its fixtures with that project.

The Bad Guy
09-15-2006, 10:21 PM
Take notes, cause the professor is in the house:

#1: Never buy a Sony. You are going to pay 40% more for the same quality as other brands. This goes across the board for nearly every electronic device that they manufacture (save their video game systems)

I'm going to have to disagree with this.

I got my Sony 55' LCD last year at about 2200, which was around what Samsung wanted for their DLP. I couldn't be happier with the picture.


ONe more thing, DirecTV just released the H20 DVR which is their NEW high-def DVR that can record hi-def locals (the old H10-250 could not). Combine that with Sunday ticket that you can only get on Direc, and I think you have your choice.

Well, this isn't entirely true.

The high-def DVR has several drawbacks and bugs that haven't been worked out yet. If you are familiar with the Tivo software, this will be a foreign machine. Locals aren't available in most area's yet. To read about the bugs, go to DBStalk.com.

I have an H10-250 and I can record high def locals with an OTA.

runnercyclist
09-15-2006, 10:23 PM
Haha, I'm glad there is one clear consensus to guide me!

Skip Towne
09-15-2006, 10:26 PM
Nope, I already own one and am hoping for a reversal. :banghead:


I would think the worst case scenario would be that Charlie has to pay an assload of money to tivo. I really can't see them shutting off over a million receivers.
Heh. I've got an ongoing thread on this. It seems Dish Notwork is trying to buy Tivo for $80 million to stave off the $90 million the court awarded. Hahahahahaha

Skip Towne
09-15-2006, 10:30 PM
I'm going to have to disagree with this.

I got my Sony 55' LCD last year at about 2200, which was around what Samsung wanted for their DLP. I couldn't be happier with the picture.



Well, this isn't entirely true.

The high-def DVR has several drawbacks and bugs that haven't been worked out yet. If you are familiar with the Tivo software, this will be a foreign machine. Locals aren't available in most area's yet. To read about the bugs, go to DBStalk.com.

I have an H10-250 and I can record high def locals with an OTA.
Yep, I go to DBStalk.com myself. It is mostly customers asking us techs for advice. You may have seen me on there. I go by Skip Towne.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-15-2006, 10:36 PM
I'm going to have to disagree with this.

I got my Sony 55' LCD last year at about 2200, which was around what Samsung wanted for their DLP. I couldn't be happier with the picture.



Well, this isn't entirely true.

The high-def DVR has several drawbacks and bugs that haven't been worked out yet. If you are familiar with the Tivo software, this will be a foreign machine. Locals aren't available in most area's yet. To read about the bugs, go to DBStalk.com.

I have an H10-250 and I can record high def locals with an OTA.

Your H10-250 will be obsolete when they roll out the new high def locals in mpeg 4, thus necessitating the move to the H20. There has been a ton of bitching about this on the DBS forums for a year now, and that's not even mentioning the problems with OTA reception for a good deal of people...

Skip Towne
09-15-2006, 10:42 PM
Your H10-250 will be obsolete when they roll out the new high def locals in mpeg 4, thus necessitating the move to the H20. There has been a ton of bitching about this on the DBS forums for a year now, and that's not even mentioning the problems with OTA reception for a good deal of people...
I read where D* still has an agreement with Tivo to support the H-10. It is Tivo technology. D* didn't lose a lawsuit like Dish Notwork did because they came up with their own DVR technology. When that agreement expires I look for D* to drop its support of the H-10 and end its agreement with Tivo. Just my opinion.

Dallas Chief
09-15-2006, 10:44 PM
I am only going to address #1. I didn't read the rest. Sony makes pretty good stuff but they refuse to adhere to industry standards. They think their way is the only way. Consider Directv and Dish Notwork are mortal enemies yet they both agree that the mounting pole should be 1 and 5/8 inches OD. Sony, brilliantly thought 1 and 1/2 ID would be better. They were wrong. If you owned one of those Sony pukes and your LNB went out you had to change the whole pole, dish, LNB assembly at a cost of about $180. Cost otherwise would be the price of the LNB.......about $30. Another famous Sony f*ck up was the Beta Video Recorder. It used much bigger cartridges that were not compatible with VHS. Lost their ass and all its fixtures with that project.

It's funny that you still bring this point up three years after they got out of the SAT business. FWIW, Hughes was sourcing the hardware for them, including the dishes themselves.

Oh and you do things your own way instead of adhering to someone elses standards so you can avoid having to pay ridiculous royalties a la Microsoft.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-15-2006, 10:48 PM
LG and Sony use the same stuff in the same plants, and rarely do you hear people espouse the quality of LG products.

You'll get more for your money with a Samsung.

Dallas Chief
09-15-2006, 10:50 PM
Take notes, cause the professor is in the house:

#1: Never buy a Sony. You are going to pay 40% more for the same quality as other brands. This goes across the board for nearly every electronic device that they manufacture (save their video game systems)

#2: Look forward. Buy an item whose technology wonít be outdated in a few years. By this, I mean whatever television you purchase, it should have multiple HDMI outputs. HDMI is a state of the art A/V interconnect. What makes it all the more advantageous is that current HDTV resolutions only occupy a fraction of the total possible bandwidth that an HDMI cable can carry. Your 360 will never have HDMI outputs, but your upconvert/Hi-def DVD player and PS3 premium definitely will. Make sure that the TV you are looking for has 2 or more component video inputs. This also means that 1080p should be a must for you. You are getting twice the resolution of 1080i, and it will stay secure as the top of the line resolution (for the masses) for a few years. A Must have.

#3 Donít be the douchebag with a TV too big for their room. Circuit City has a rubric for calculating the size of a TV in a given room. You can use it as a helpful tool, but donít look too much into it. A lot of that is based on feel.

#4 Look at the Showroom TVs, but donít sell your soul to how they look there. TVs in the Showroom are set on ďTorchĒ Mode, basically meaning that their brightness is jacked up all the way in order to make them catch the eye of the passer-by. However, if one TV looks significantly better than another head to head, itís a good bet that it is a better television.

#5 Take time to carefully calibrate your TV once you get it home. Itís an art, not a science, and you will often know what looks best.

#6 Look into the drawbacks of each format: Plasmas are nice, but they can suffer from individual gas cell burnout over time, leaving you with dead pixels on your screen. DLPs have the same problem too, although you will see a bright white light instead of a black dot. DLPs will often experience a deterioration in color quality over time if they use a tube and not an LED as the light source. LCDs are pretty damned expensive once you go over 42 inches. Plasmas will dim over time as well, particularly after they are over 2000 hours of age.

#7 Samsung makes balla-ass DLP HDTVs. However, my Hi-Def TV is a Toshiba, and it has the best picture of any rear projection CRT Iíve seen. Itís DLP-quality, without some of the scary aspects of owning a DLP (pixel death).

#8 If you get your TV from BB, get their RewardZone program. It will essentially pay for the cables you need to hook your TV up.

#9 In the words of Chris Jericho, never, eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeever, pay retail for Monster Cables.

#10 My choice for you:

http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-HL-S5087W-1080p-DLP-HDTV/dp/B000F2R5HO/sr=1-8/qid=1157494673/ref=sr_1_8/002-2589500-5299263?ie=UTF8&s=audio-video

Although it might be wise to wait 6 months for the price of 1080 sets to drop, and youíll pay 70 cents on the dollar for what you would now.


ONe more thing, DirecTV just released the H20 DVR which is their NEW high-def DVR that can record hi-def locals (the old H10-250 could not). Combine that with Sunday ticket that you can only get on Direc, and I think you have your choice.

You must work in an electronics store??? Samsung is the real deal these days...

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-15-2006, 11:00 PM
I did for 3 1/2 years in college. I've only been out of the game for a year and a half, and I do my best to keep abreast of the changes in the industry.

Dallas Chief
09-15-2006, 11:07 PM
Cool. I can't say that agree with your assesments though. Current experiences have taught me that you get what you pay for. But hey, that's my experience...what do I know? right dtebbe???

Phobia
09-15-2006, 11:18 PM
ONe more thing, DirecTV just released the H20 DVR which is their NEW high-def DVR that can record hi-def locals (the old H10-250 could not). Combine that with Sunday ticket that you can only get on Direc, and I think you have your choice.

Yeah, I just got it on Monday. First one in KC, I was told. It rocks.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-15-2006, 11:20 PM
Cool. I can't say that agree with your assesments though. Current experiences have taught me that you get what you pay for. But hey, that's my experience...what do I know? right dtebbe???

That's a bit over an overgeneralization.

You get what you pay for up to an extent. You are always better to opt for technology that isn't bargain basement, but also not so cutting edge that it's price far exceeds its use value. Everyone knows that a Kia is generally going to be shit, but you are also not getting your money's worth with a Bentley, or even an Infiniti for that matter, as the second is just a repackaged Nissan.

That's the problem that I have with Sony. They market their shit as though it is the Lexus or the Infiniti of the mass market brands, but in reality, it's much closer to Toyota or Nissan (which isn't bad, but at the same time, why pay 45,000 for a QX4 when it is just a loaded Highlander that you could get for 80 percent of the price) with the Infiniti/Lexus price.

Certain manufacturers make good products, and others don't. I have a Samsung Laser Printer that I got for 50 bucks after rebates, and it works phenomenally well. Same for their cell phones and their DVD recorders. Their TVs have always gotten extraordinarily good reviews, and an intelligent shopper can always find them for less than the price of a Sony, with comparable, and often superior, features.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-15-2006, 11:22 PM
Yeah, I just got it on Monday. First one in KC, I was told. It rocks.

Everyone always gets the first one ;), but congrats nonetheless. Good investment. I can't see the point of ponying up 800 for a Tivo Series 3, even with the badass features it has.

Phobia
09-15-2006, 11:24 PM
Yeah, I figured the "first one" stuff was BS but the tech was calling all over KC trying to find somebody who had installed one so he could ask some questions of them. The boxes had just landed in the warehouse that morning and he couldn't find one that had been installed so there may have been something to it.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-15-2006, 11:26 PM
Yeah, I figured the "first one" stuff was BS but the tech was calling all over KC trying to find somebody who had installed one so he could ask some questions of them. The boxes had just landed in the warehouse that morning and he couldn't find one that had been installed so there may have been something to it.

They should hurry up and film your episode of cribs before someone else gets one...

as Dave Chappelle said, "That shit is balla!"

ChiefFan31
09-16-2006, 04:23 AM
Fugg :banghead: That problem with Dish and their DVR's.

Finally found out today, that I am SOL for a D* signal at my apt. Looks like I will be able to get Dish, and am researching and planning to purchase their HD DVR. They better not get turned off. Im sure they will pay up to Tivo. Looks like there are going to have to....


Anyways....Hey Action Jackson, question for you.

Im really like the Sony SXRD LCD rear projection HDTV's (the 50" model)

To update your notes on 1080p. The 2005 1080p models do not have a 1080p input (which is bullshit) The new ones do. (this only will apply to Blu-Ray DVD players and specifically PS3) The 06 model just arrived two weeks ago in stores.

The Samsung 1080p DLP you linked caught my eye.

Samsung (http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-HL-S5087W-1080p-DLP-HDTV/dp/B000F2R5HO/sr=1-8/qid=1157494673/ref=sr_1_8/002-2589500-5299263?ie=UTF8&s=audio-video)

Why would you recommend that over Sony?? And are you certain the Samsung you linked has the HDMI's that can accept a 1080p signal?

Link to Sony SXRD (http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Sony-50-SXRD-trade-LCoS-Projection-HDTV-KDS50A2000/sem/rpsm/oid/150945/catOid/-12867/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do)

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-16-2006, 07:00 AM
Fugg :banghead: That problem with Dish and their DVR's.

Finally found out today, that I am SOL for a D* signal at my apt. Looks like I will be able to get Dish, and am researching and planning to purchase their HD DVR. They better not get turned off. Im sure they will pay up to Tivo. Looks like there are going to have to....


Anyways....Hey Action Jackson, question for you.

Im really like the Sony SXRD LCD rear projection HDTV's (the 50" model)

To update your notes on 1080p. The 2005 1080p models do not have a 1080p input (which is bullshit) The new ones do. (this only will apply to Blu-Ray DVD players and specifically PS3) The 06 model just arrived two weeks ago in stores.

The Samsung 1080p DLP you linked caught my eye.

Samsung (http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-HL-S5087W-1080p-DLP-HDTV/dp/B000F2R5HO/sr=1-8/qid=1157494673/ref=sr_1_8/002-2589500-5299263?ie=UTF8&s=audio-video)

Why would you recommend that over Sony?? And are you certain the Samsung you linked has the HDMI's that can accept a 1080p signal?

Link to Sony SXRD (http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Sony-50-SXRD-trade-LCoS-Projection-HDTV-KDS50A2000/sem/rpsm/oid/150945/catOid/-12867/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do)

Connections: 3 composite A/V (1 front), 2 S-Video (1 front), 2 component (Y/Pb/Pr), 2 HDMI, 1 RF, 1 USB

It's ostensibly listed as a 1080p capable television, so for it not to would be false advertising. That sony did that is of no surprise to me (although I'm wondering how they pulled this off, unless they just offered a model with component and an upconverter and no HDMI interface).

Per the product description:

Get the sharpest and clearest images possible from HD and standard TV with with the 50-inch Samsung HL-S5087W DLP television, which features a full progressive HD 1920 x 1080-pixel reslution digital format converter for all inputs (and true 1920 x 1080p picture from via HDMI

Basically, if you use the HDMI, you will get the best of the best with the resolution, but that should be no surprise. It will be upcoverted with the other connections, or *perhaps* shown in native resolution, although I am unsure of the answer on the native res. to be totally honest.

HDMI can support 4-5x the current bandwidth occupied by a normal HD broadcast, so it has more than enough space for the more resource-heavy 1080p. Furthermore, HDMI isn't just an interconnect system, but an interface with certain standards agreed upon by a community.

The Bad Guy
09-16-2006, 07:15 AM
Your H10-250 will be obsolete when they roll out the new high def locals in mpeg 4, thus necessitating the move to the H20. There has been a ton of bitching about this on the DBS forums for a year now, and that's not even mentioning the problems with OTA reception for a good deal of people...

Obsolete?

If I can get the locals via OTA (or waivers thru DTV), why would my unit be obsolete because I can't get the MPEG-4 locals? If I can get them, how is it obsolete?

Until my H10-250 dies, there will be no way I will trade it in for an H20 and deal with DTV's inferior DVR over Tivo.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-16-2006, 07:30 AM
because you have to deal with the inconsistency of a digital OTA signal, that's why.

unlurking
09-16-2006, 09:51 AM
All right since we seem to have several display geeks in here, I thought I'd ask a question I haven't been able to find on avsforum.

I have an RCA (P61310) 61" CRT RP HDTV. We had the guns replaced last year due to burn in (bars on the side from non 16x9 channels). Other than the slight burn-in, mostly noticable with high levels of white like a hockey game, the image was perfect.

After the guns were replaced, we CANNOT get the convergence even close anymore. I have spent HOURS (at least 20 on multiple attempts) in the setup mode with string taped across the screen to guide where each line should be to try and get all 120+ points lined up. We had the service people try to fix it on 5 visits. Finally the tech said it's just not possible to fix, and that's what happens with ALL RP TVs when the guns are replaced.

For this reason I decided I would never buy a RP TV again. Unfortunately, I can no longer stand my TV where only 85% of the screen is perfect (why bother with HD on a shitty screen) and want to replace the RCA now, but cannot afford to replace it with something of comparable size in plasma or LCD flat panel. My rec room ceilings and ambient light just won't work for an HD FP, so it looks like I'm going to be stuck with a RP again, ughh.

Can anyone tell me if the same problem exists for DLP and LCD RPs regarding convergence after gun replacement? I would like to get at least 5 years of perfect working conditions (3 years for $4500 is unacceptable) from my next TV.

I am looking at this Mitsubishi on sale for $3800...

http://www.mitsubishi-tv.com/j/i/18326/TelevisionDetails.html?cid=132

The Bad Guy
09-16-2006, 10:14 AM
because you have to deal with the inconsistency of a digital OTA signal, that's why.

I have Fox, CBS and NBC in digital HD. All I had to do was apply for waivers and they were granted.

I can live with having some inconsistent picture problems on ABC over having to deal with that garbage DVR.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-16-2006, 01:18 PM
All right since we seem to have several display geeks in here, I thought I'd ask a question I haven't been able to find on avsforum.

I have an RCA (P61310) 61" CRT RP HDTV. We had the guns replaced last year due to burn in (bars on the side from non 16x9 channels). Other than the slight burn-in, mostly noticable with high levels of white like a hockey game, the image was perfect.

After the guns were replaced, we CANNOT get the convergence even close anymore. I have spent HOURS (at least 20 on multiple attempts) in the setup mode with string taped across the screen to guide where each line should be to try and get all 120+ points lined up. We had the service people try to fix it on 5 visits. Finally the tech said it's just not possible to fix, and that's what happens with ALL RP TVs when the guns are replaced.

For this reason I decided I would never buy a RP TV again. Unfortunately, I can no longer stand my TV where only 85% of the screen is perfect (why bother with HD on a shitty screen) and want to replace the RCA now, but cannot afford to replace it with something of comparable size in plasma or LCD flat panel. My rec room ceilings and ambient light just won't work for an HD FP, so it looks like I'm going to be stuck with a RP again, ughh.

Can anyone tell me if the same problem exists for DLP and LCD RPs regarding convergence after gun replacement? I would like to get at least 5 years of perfect working conditions (3 years for $4500 is unacceptable) from my next TV.

I am looking at this Mitsubishi on sale for $3800...

http://www.mitsubishi-tv.com/j/i/18326/TelevisionDetails.html?cid=132

Your convergence problem is most likely related to that model of TV.

Here is a review from amazon:

The convergence CONSTANTLY goes out on this set and must be manually reset. This generally takes me 1 hour to complete. RCA, and their technicians, refuse to admit there is a problem and will not exchange the set even though I have an extended warranty. When the convergence is lined up perfectly and in HDTV mode, the set is great. Normal picture quality is fair and when the convergence is off, the picture has a blue tint around the figures.

That particular TV has manual convergence. Almost all HDTVs made since about 2004 now feature auto convergence, so it's not something that you are going to have to deal with. It's also highly possible that the tech was lying to you just to get you to STFU. It sucks, but it happens. You should have no problem with gun convergence if you need to replace it in any model. There is no logical reason why it would happen. The gun is going to be placed in the same physical spot with the same dimensions and characteristics. It is highly possible that you were unfortunate enough to get a lemon of a TV.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-16-2006, 01:21 PM
I have Fox, CBS and NBC in digital HD. All I had to do was apply for waivers and they were granted.

I can live with having some inconsistent picture problems on ABC over having to deal with that garbage DVR.

And where you are in reference to being able to get waivers is geographically specific.

ChiefFan31
09-16-2006, 02:51 PM
Connections: 3 composite A/V (1 front), 2 S-Video (1 front), 2 component (Y/Pb/Pr), 2 HDMI, 1 RF, 1 USB

It's ostensibly listed as a 1080p capable television, so for it not to would be false advertising. That sony did that is of no surprise to me (although I'm wondering how they pulled this off, unless they just offered a model with component and an upconverter and no HDMI interface).

I did some more research on both last night.

Kind of interesting, The Samsung we are talking about (I believe is still the 05 model) Does support full 1080p in both HDMI's inputs. While the Sony's SXRD didnt (the new 06 model that just came out does)

Lame, in that Sony is the one who is touting the 1080p for both the Blu-Ray and PS3. They did switch to it though...

I follow you now in what your saying...All these reviews I keep reading was how the Samsung, met or beat the picture quality of the SXRD. With a price tag of up to 500-800 less. Samsung was around 2,400 while the SXRD was around 3,000.

The reason I was asking you about it was because I was pretty much sold on the Sony SXRD. (I swing by CC to drool over the HD sets sometimes) and that Samsung really caught my eye. Now I have a decision to make here, hopefuly pretty soon. Especially with the new SXRD sets starting at 2,500. They are now both in about the same price range...

Edit - oh yeah, to answer something you werent sure on. The set is Native 1080p on the Samsung, so everthing plugged in does get upconverted.

HemiEd
09-16-2006, 02:55 PM
I have a budget of $5K. Not bigger that 40"ish and a semi small tv room.


Buy the 42" inch Panasonic Plasma. You can not beat it, Plasma is the ultimate if you have the budget. I love my 50" Philips!

Ugly Duck
09-16-2006, 03:04 PM
Plasma is the ultimate if you have the budget.

Is plasma more ultimate than LCD?

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-16-2006, 04:02 PM
Is plasma more ultimate than LCD?

Plasmas experience severe degradation in picture quality after about 2000 hours of use. The individual gas cells can also die out, leaving you with dead spots in the picture. Plasmas are a status rather than an efficiency buy, IMO.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-16-2006, 04:04 PM
I did some more research on both last night.

Kind of interesting, The Samsung we are talking about (I believe is still the 05 model) Does support full 1080p in both HDMI's inputs. While the Sony's SXRD didnt (the new 06 model that just came out does)

Lame, in that Sony is the one who is touting the 1080p for both the Blu-Ray and PS3. They did switch to it though...

I follow you now in what your saying...All these reviews I keep reading was how the Samsung, met or beat the picture quality of the SXRD. With a price tag of up to 500-800 less. Samsung was around 2,400 while the SXRD was around 3,000.

The reason I was asking you about it was because I was pretty much sold on the Sony SXRD. (I swing by CC to drool over the HD sets sometimes) and that Samsung really caught my eye. Now I have a decision to make here, hopefuly pretty soon. Especially with the new SXRD sets starting at 2,500. They are now both in about the same price range...

Edit - oh yeah, to answer something you werent sure on. The set is Native 1080p on the Samsung, so everthing plugged in does get upconverted.

Regardless of what decision you make, it sounds like it will be an *informed* decision, which is of primary importance. Good luck :thumb:

unlurking
09-16-2006, 06:07 PM
Your convergence problem is most likely related to that model of TV.

Here is a review from amazon:

The convergence CONSTANTLY goes out on this set and must be manually reset. This generally takes me 1 hour to complete. RCA, and their technicians, refuse to admit there is a problem and will not exchange the set even though I have an extended warranty. When the convergence is lined up perfectly and in HDTV mode, the set is great. Normal picture quality is fair and when the convergence is off, the picture has a blue tint around the figures.

That particular TV has manual convergence. Almost all HDTVs made since about 2004 now feature auto convergence, so it's not something that you are going to have to deal with. It's also highly possible that the tech was lying to you just to get you to STFU. It sucks, but it happens. You should have no problem with gun convergence if you need to replace it in any model. There is no logical reason why it would happen. The gun is going to be placed in the same physical spot with the same dimensions and characteristics. It is highly possible that you were unfortunate enough to get a lemon of a TV.
Actually, the TV was absolutely PERFECT for 3 years, with ZERO convergence problems (never had to align it in the entire 3 years). The TV also DOES have an auto convergence utility. The problem is the auto convergence only lines up the center point, so all the corners and edges get screwed up (now that the guns have been replaced).

I actually read that review a while back, but it is not the same problem. I have had 2 repair techs (both from authorized RCA shops) and neither could fix it. GRRRRRR!!! They both said the guns were installed on rails by computer, and that when done by hand they couldn't get the exact same positioning.

Thanks for the help though. I'm assuming that not all big screens are like that in regards to installing new guns?

Thanks for trying to help though, I do appreciate it.

Skip Towne
09-16-2006, 06:12 PM
Plasmas experience severe degradation in picture quality after about 2000 hours of use. The individual gas cells can also die out, leaving you with dead spots in the picture. Plasmas are a status rather than an efficiency buy, IMO.
2000 hours? That's only 90 days of 24/7. I wouldn't touch one of those.

morphius
09-16-2006, 06:34 PM
Skip the whole Dish vs Tivo thing is more about what is broken with our patent system, not so much a slam on Dish.

Kind of like Apple having to pay over 100mil for having their songs ordered underneath band, then CD, then song. The same way people have been storing them on their PC's before an external mp3 player was created.

morphius
09-16-2006, 06:35 PM
2000 hours? That's only 90 days of 24/7. I wouldn't touch one of those.
I'm interested in knowing if that is gen 1 plasma, as the newer ones are supposed to have a lot longer life time.

HMc
09-16-2006, 06:53 PM
Plasmas experience severe degradation in picture quality after about 2000 hours of use. The individual gas cells can also die out, leaving you with dead spots in the picture. Plasmas are a status rather than an efficiency buy, IMO.

What a load. Our 50" HD NEC apparantly has 60,000 hours before it loses <b>half</b> its brightness.

We've had Sony 42" HDs running for 12 hours a day for 3 years and they're still wonderfully bright.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-16-2006, 07:24 PM
What a load. Our 50" HD NEC apparantly has 60,000 hours before it loses <b>half</b> its brightness.

We've had Sony 42" HDs running for 12 hours a day for 3 years and they're still wonderfully bright.


Bring in a new plasma against your aged ones, and then compare:

Cons

First 2000 hours is its brightest point. Every hour thereafter, the display gradually dims.
At higher elevations, usually 6000 ft or higher, they exhibit noticeable humming.
Note: While all of these properties generally hold true the advent of advanced LCD technology is quickly closing the gap. While upper limits on such high end technology are still theoretical it could be possible for plasmas to be quickly outpaced by LCDs considering the progress that has been made in the last several years.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-16-2006, 07:34 PM
Per NEC about their plasma life:

60,000 hour panel life is an approximate time for the display panel to reach half of its original brightness. The panel life is based on motion video as the input source and all display settings at factory default. This time may vary if the source varies and monitor settings are not at factory default. The time given does not imply any warranty beyond the products standard warranty

basically, from 2,000-60,000 hours you are going to lose 1% of its brightness for every 1000 hours that it is on. That may not seem like a big difference, but if you are running your tvs 12 hours a day, you are losing about 10% of your brightness every year. That TV is going to age like a $5 whore.

Scorp
09-16-2006, 08:20 PM
Buy this tv:
http://us.lge.com/products/model/detail/tv|audio|video_plasma%20flat%20panel__MW-71PY10.jhtml

ChiefsfaninPA
09-16-2006, 08:25 PM
Buy this tv:
http://us.lge.com/products/model/detail/tv|audio|video_plasma%20flat%20panel__MW-71PY10.jhtml



That monster is 70 large. A little bit out of my budget.

Dallas Chief
09-16-2006, 10:22 PM
LG and Sony use the same stuff in the same plants, and rarely do you hear people espouse the quality of LG products.

You'll get more for your money with a Samsung.
You better check your facts on that one. It is actually Sony and Samsung that are jointly operating production of LCD panels then selling them to everyone else. Both are making tons of cash from the deal...