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Direckshun
11-04-2006, 01:21 PM
Indulge me for a thread. I've been looking over the standings for a few minutes.

Not only has the AFC West been the toughest division in football over the last decade, this year there doesn't seem to be any other division remotely close.

Three serious contenders (Bronks, Bolts, Chiefs), and one flop (Roiduhs). No other division has that kind of line up.

This actually surprises me because this year the NFC was supposed to boast the two strongest divisions in football, the South and the East. The closest I think the league gets to the AFC West is the NFC South, which has two serious contenders (Falcons, Saints), one decent team (Panthers), and the woeful Bucs. And even then, only the Falcons would be able to hold a candle to the best teams in the AFC West.

And the NFC East, which for some reason always gets more attention than the AFC West, only has the Giants doing anything significant. The Cowboys have a lot of potential, especially with Romo emerging, but they're inconsistant now. The Redskins haven't shown up this year and the Eagles are on a convincing three-game slide.

Meanwhile, on the other end of the spectrum the Pats can once again pound the crap out of the weakest division in football (their own AFC East), and there isn't a single serious contender in all of the Seahawks/ Rams' piss poor NFC West.

Short Leash Hootie
11-04-2006, 01:23 PM
the NFC East gets more attention than the AFC West because they have the two most popular teams in the NFL (Dallas, Washington) as well as one that's up there pretty high (Philadelphia) and a big market team (New York)...

Makes sense, doesn't it?

Basileus777
11-04-2006, 01:29 PM
The NFC East has been a disappointment this year. I agree that the NFC South is the next best division, but clearly the AFC West is the strongest.

Short Leash Hootie
11-04-2006, 01:32 PM
NFC South is a fraud...New Orleans isn't going to make the playoffs...unless they squeeze in with 9 wins. I see them winning 8, though.

NFC North is actually a little better this year...Green Bay is coming on, Minnesota isn't bad, and Chicago is the best team in the NFL...and Detroit has been 'competitive' in games thus far.

Que Card QB
11-04-2006, 01:33 PM
Consistently yes, the AFC West has got to be the toughest. I think it's one reason Holmgren jumped at the chance to take the Seabirds to the NFC. But the NFC east looks pretty darn tough right now. Chiefs were 1-3 against them last year and finished 10-6.

Basileus777
11-04-2006, 01:37 PM
NFC South is a fraud...New Orleans isn't going to make the playoffs...unless they squeeze in with 9 wins. I see them winning 8, though.

NFC North is actually a little better this year...Green Bay is coming on, Minnesota isn't bad, and Chicago is the best team in the NFL...and
Detroit has been 'competitive' in games thus far.

The NFC North is not a tough division. The Vikings are an above average team that isn't better than the Saints. Chicago is great. Detroit is terrible and Green Bay is below-average.

The Bears alone don't make the division good. You cannot say that the North is deeper than the South. The Saints and Panthers are far better than the Vikings and Packers. I'd take the Bucs over the Lions too.

KurtCobain
11-04-2006, 01:49 PM
I give it up to the afc west. Just because we have three teams fighting for the title, and any time a team in this division plays one another, you never know who'll win. The worst team in the division has the power to beat the best at home. That's the scary thing about the afc west.

pikesome
11-04-2006, 01:56 PM
I give it up to the afc west. Just because we have three teams fighting for the title, and any time a team in this division plays one another, you never know who'll win. The worst team in the division has the power to beat the best at home. That's the scary thing about the afc west.

Marty has made a career doing this.

cdcox
11-04-2006, 02:28 PM
I lover homerism. You can make an arguement that the AFCW is the toughtest division in football, but you could also make good arguements for the NFC East, the NFC South, and the NFC North.

Take the NFC east. Their record is almost as good as the West's. I would argue that Philadelphia is much better than their record, having lost on a 62 yard FG to the Bucs and in overtime agains the Giants.

Many would argue that the Broncos are not looking so good this year, with their anemic offense. Their defense is going to come back to reality, too. And out side of KC, no one is thinking that the Chiefs are a great team. I'll take the Redskins over the Raiders.

I find it especially ironic busting on the NFC East when they went 3-1 against KC last year.

DaFace
11-04-2006, 02:33 PM
Seedy, you're the stats guy. Do you have some easy way of compiling which divisions have the highest overall win/loss record for the past, say, 10 years or so?

CupidStunt
11-04-2006, 02:33 PM
Take the NFC east. Their record is almost as good as the West's.


IIRC the AFC West's non-division record blows the NFC East's out of the water.

I would argue that Philadelphia is much better than their record, having lost on a 62 yard FG to the Bucs and in overtime agains the Giants.

But I would argue that being in position to lose to a dogsh*t team like Tampa and only having one semi-decent win all year means they're as good as their record (at best). Look at who've they beat... no one, barring a 3-3, Drew Bledsoe-led Dallas side - at home.


Many would argue that the Broncos are not looking so good this year, with their anemic offense. Their defense is going to come back to reality, too. And out side of KC, no one is thinking that the Chiefs are a great team. I'll take the Redskins over the Raiders.

Many would argue that the Broncos are 5-2, beat New England and took the Colts to the wire, which is more than anything anyone in the NFC East has done all season.


I find it especially ironic busting on the NFC East when they went 3-1 against KC last year.

That was last year. Last year the Redskins were actually decent and your unlucky Eagles weren't.

Short Leash Hootie
11-04-2006, 02:34 PM
cdcox is a man of many words

Basileus777
11-04-2006, 02:37 PM
I lover homerism. You can make an arguement that the AFCW is the toughtest division in football, but you could also make good arguements for the NFC East, the NFC South, and the NFC North.

Take the NFC east. Their record is almost as good as the West's. I would argue that Philadelphia is much better than their record, having lost on a 62 yard FG to the Bucs and in overtime agains the Giants.

Many would argue that the Broncos are not looking so good this year, with their anemic offense. Their defense is going to come back to reality, too. And out side of KC, no one is thinking that the Chiefs are a great team. I'll take the Redskins over the Raiders.

I find it especially ironic busting on the NFC East when they went 3-1 against KC last year.

The two divisions split equally in head to head last year. The NFC East was better last year, but so was the AFC West. I believe the NFC has dropped off more from last eyar though. It could go either way as far as which is the better division this year, but I'll take the West because I'm not sold on Dallas and the Eagles are a .500 team right now.

DaFace
11-04-2006, 02:37 PM
I guess you really couldn't compare past 2002, though. Stupid realignment.

Brock
11-04-2006, 03:11 PM
Philly isn't better than their record. You are what your record says you are.

JBucc
11-04-2006, 03:17 PM
Before the season I thought it would be the AFC North but Pittsburgh has bombed, so I'll give it to the AFC West.

DaFace
11-04-2006, 03:24 PM
In case anyone cares this much, I figured up the NON-DIVISONAL records for each team and division from 2002-2005. According to the records, anyway, the AFCW was the toughest division in the NFL, but not by much.

Team W L T Percent
New England 28 12 0 0.700
Miami 22 18 0 0.550
N.Y. Jets 19 21 0 0.475
Buffalo 19 21 0 0.475
AFC East 88 72 0 0.550

Pittsburg 24 15 1 0.600
Baltimore 20 20 0 0.500
Cincinnati 19 21 0 0.475
Cleveland 16 24 0 0.400
AFC North 79 80 1 0.494

Indianapolis 28 12 0 0.700
Jacksonville 23 17 0 0.575
Tennessee 19 21 0 0.475
Houston 12 28 0 0.300
AFC South 82 78 0 0.513

Denver 26 14 0 0.650
Kansas City 24 16 0 0.600
San Diego 21 19 0 0.525
Oakland 18 22 0 0.450
AFC West 89 71 0 0.556

Philadelphia 27 13 0 0.675
Washington 20 20 0 0.500
Dallas 19 21 0 0.475
N.Y. Giants 18 22 0 0.450
NFC East 84 76 0 0.525

Green Bay 21 19 0 0.525
Minnesota 16 24 0 0.400
Chicago 16 24 0 0.400
Detroit 13 27 0 0.325
NFC North 66 94 0 0.413

Carolina 23 17 0 0.575
Tampa Bay 22 18 0 0.550
Atlanta 21 18 1 0.525
New Orleans 18 22 0 0.450
NFC South 84 75 1 0.525

Seattle 23 17 0 0.575
St. Louis 19 21 0 0.475
Arizona 13 27 0 0.325
San Francisco 12 28 0 0.300
NFC West 67 93 0 0.419

DISCLAIMER: I did this by hand. If I messed up the math somewhere, live with it. :p

Bearcat
11-04-2006, 03:33 PM
The SEC.

Valiant
11-04-2006, 04:44 PM
In case anyone cares this much, I figured up the NON-DIVISONAL records for each team and division from 2002-2005. According to the records, anyway, the AFCW was the toughest division in the NFL, but not by much.

Team W L T Percent
New England 28 12 0 0.700
Miami 22 18 0 0.550
N.Y. Jets 19 21 0 0.475
Buffalo 19 21 0 0.475
AFC East 88 72 0 0.550

Pittsburg 24 15 1 0.600
Baltimore 20 20 0 0.500
Cincinnati 19 21 0 0.475
Cleveland 16 24 0 0.400
AFC North 79 80 1 0.494

Indianapolis 28 12 0 0.700
Jacksonville 23 17 0 0.575
Tennessee 19 21 0 0.475
Houston 12 28 0 0.300
AFC South 82 78 0 0.513

Denver 26 14 0 0.650
Kansas City 24 16 0 0.600
San Diego 21 19 0 0.525
Oakland 18 22 0 0.450
AFC West 89 71 0 0.556

Philadelphia 27 13 0 0.675
Washington 20 20 0 0.500
Dallas 19 21 0 0.475
N.Y. Giants 18 22 0 0.450
NFC East 84 76 0 0.525

Green Bay 21 19 0 0.525
Minnesota 16 24 0 0.400
Chicago 16 24 0 0.400
Detroit 13 27 0 0.325
NFC North 66 94 0 0.413

Carolina 23 17 0 0.575
Tampa Bay 22 18 0 0.550
Atlanta 21 18 1 0.525
New Orleans 18 22 0 0.450
NFC South 84 75 1 0.525

Seattle 23 17 0 0.575
St. Louis 19 21 0 0.475
Arizona 13 27 0 0.325
San Francisco 12 28 0 0.300
NFC West 67 93 0 0.419

DISCLAIMER: I did this by hand. If I messed up the math somewhere, live with it. :p


Well the AFC as a whole has 338 wins to 301 vs. the nfc...

DaFace
11-04-2006, 04:47 PM
Well the AFC as a whole has 338 wins to 301 vs. the nfc...

That probably doesn't mean anything for the purposes of this analysis. I took out DIVISONAL games, not conference games. You'd have to completely redo the math to take out the rest of the conference to actually get a good comparison between the two.

DaFace
11-04-2006, 05:16 PM
Since you mentioned it, here are inter-conference records:

Team W L T Percent
New England 13 3 0 0.813
Miami 9 7 0 0.563
N.Y. Jets 10 6 0 0.625
Buffalo 9 7 0 0.563
AFC East 41 23 0 0.641

Pittsburg 11 4 1 0.688
Baltimore 11 5 0 0.688
Cincinnati 8 8 0 0.500
Cleveland 6 10 0 0.375
AFC North 36 27 1 0.563

Indianapolis 12 4 0 0.750
Jacksonville 10 6 0 0.625
Tennessee 9 7 0 0.563
Houston 6 10 0 0.375
AFC South 37 27 0 0.578

Denver 11 5 0 0.688
Kansas City 7 9 0 0.438
San Diego 9 7 0 0.563
Oakland 7 9 0 0.438
AFC West 34 30 0 0.531

Philadelphia 9 7 0 0.563
Washington 5 11 0 0.313
Dallas 7 9 0 0.438
N.Y. Giants 7 9 0 0.438
NFC East 28 36 0 0.438

Green Bay 7 9 0 0.438
Minnesota 7 9 0 0.438
Chicago 6 10 0 0.375
Detroit 4 12 0 0.250
NFC North 24 40 0 0.375

Carolina 9 7 0 0.563
Tampa Bay 7 9 0 0.438
Atlanta 9 6 1 0.563
New Orleans 7 9 0 0.438
NFC South 32 31 1 0.500

Seattle 8 8 0 0.500
St. Louis 10 6 0 0.625
Arizona 3 13 0 0.188
San Francisco 4 12 0 0.250
NFC West 25 39 0 0.391

That puts the total wins to 148 for the AFC and 109 for the NFC. I'm off by two games game in there somewhere, but I don't care enough to try and figure out where. :hmmm:

cdcox
11-04-2006, 05:16 PM
In case anyone cares this much, I figured up the NON-DIVISONAL records for each team and division from 2002-2005. According to the records, anyway, the AFCW was the toughest division in the NFL, but not by much.

Team W L T Percent
New England 28 12 0 0.700
Miami 22 18 0 0.550
N.Y. Jets 19 21 0 0.475
Buffalo 19 21 0 0.475
AFC East 88 72 0 0.550

Pittsburg 24 15 1 0.600
Baltimore 20 20 0 0.500
Cincinnati 19 21 0 0.475
Cleveland 16 24 0 0.400
AFC North 79 80 1 0.494

Indianapolis 28 12 0 0.700
Jacksonville 23 17 0 0.575
Tennessee 19 21 0 0.475
Houston 12 28 0 0.300
AFC South 82 78 0 0.513

Denver 26 14 0 0.650
Kansas City 24 16 0 0.600
San Diego 21 19 0 0.525
Oakland 18 22 0 0.450
AFC West 89 71 0 0.556

Philadelphia 27 13 0 0.675
Washington 20 20 0 0.500
Dallas 19 21 0 0.475
N.Y. Giants 18 22 0 0.450
NFC East 84 76 0 0.525

Green Bay 21 19 0 0.525
Minnesota 16 24 0 0.400
Chicago 16 24 0 0.400
Detroit 13 27 0 0.325
NFC North 66 94 0 0.413

Carolina 23 17 0 0.575
Tampa Bay 22 18 0 0.550
Atlanta 21 18 1 0.525
New Orleans 18 22 0 0.450
NFC South 84 75 1 0.525

Seattle 23 17 0 0.575
St. Louis 19 21 0 0.475
Arizona 13 27 0 0.325
San Francisco 12 28 0 0.300
NFC West 67 93 0 0.419

DISCLAIMER: I did this by hand. If I messed up the math somewhere, live with it. :p

Pretty cool, DeFace.

At first I thought these results were pretty much what you'd expect if every game were determined by a coin flip. But then I started thinking about the level of competition.

The AFC has won 57% of its games against the NFC over that time period. If the games were determined by a coin flip, that kind of dominance has a less than 5% chance of happening. Therefore, we can conclude that the AFC was better than the NFC over that time period from a statistical point of view.

The other interesting thing is that there were 40 games between the two divisions with the best reocord, the AFCE and AFCW, during that time period, compared to only 28 games between those divisions and the weaker AFCS and AFCN and 16 games against each of the weakling NFC divisions. That makes their accomplishment even more impressive, since their strong records were compiled against stronger competition.

You could make a pretty good case that the AFCW and AFCE were the two strongest divisions over that time period. I don't think many people would have thought that about the AFC East.

DaFace
11-04-2006, 05:23 PM
One small tidbit I noticed. The NFC team with the best inter-conference record is St. Louis. Hopefully that won't hold true tomorrow.

Garcia Bronco
11-04-2006, 05:40 PM
AFC West...and the Chiefs are the beat team in that division...so ...the Chiefs are the best team in the league

dtebbe
11-04-2006, 07:04 PM
The SEC.

Super Easy Conference?? :shrug:

DT